Huckabee says no he didn’t, but yes indeedy he did

According to Mike Huckabee, he has never supported a cap-and-trade approach to limiting carbon emissions. As he puts it point-blank on his website:

“In a recent internet post, a contributor makes the claim that I supported cap-and-trade in late 2007 while running for President.

To put it simply, that’s just not true.

If companies chose to participate voluntarily as part of their corporate policy, then fine. But I was clear that we could not force U.S. businesses to do what their Chinese counterparts refused to – and doing so would have been a serious job killer.

I understand this issue well, and I realize the potential damage that would occur if it passes because I was the chair of the 37 state-member Oil and Gas Compact Commission for 2 years. In fact, I led the state or Arkansas through the process of developing the Fayetteville Shale play of natural gas.

This kind of mandatory energy policy would have a horrible impact on this nation’s job market. I never did support and never would support it – period.”

However, there’s overwhelming video evidence to the contrary. On Oct. 13, 2007, at the Global Warming and Energy Solutions Conference in the critical primary state of New Hampshire, Huckabee acknowledged the challenge of climate change. “We all have a responsibility to recognize that climate change is here, it’s real, and that what we have to do is quit pointing fingers as to who’s at fault and who’s responsibility it is to fix it, and recognize that it’s all of our fault and we all have responsibility to fix it.”

At the 2:00 minute mark in the video, Huckabee goes on to make his stance on cap and trade as explicit as possible. He says:

“I also support cap-and-trade of carbon emissions and I was disappointed when the Senate rejected a carbon counting system to measure the sources of emissions because that would have been the first and most important step in implementing true cap-and-trade.”

I know, I know. A politician who flip flops. Yawn. Newt Gingrich has made the same transition, from an ardent advocate of cap and trade — “I think if you have mandatory carbon caps combined with a trading system, much like we did with sulfur, and if you have a tax-incentive program for investing in the solutions, that there’s a package there that’s very, very good. And frankly, it’s something I would strongly support” — to an implacable foe of a proposal that he now considers part of a secular-socialist plot to destroy America.

But Steve Benen at Washington Monthly makes a larger point:

“It wasn’t too long ago — within the last decade — that there was a basic spectrum of policy positions Republicans accepted on a range of national issues. Not every candidate agreed across the board with every position, but the GOP’s general approach was fairly easy to identify.

On health care, for example, the Republican mainstream envisioned a system involving an individual mandate. On arms control, the Republican mainstream embraced policies along the lines of the original START treaty.

And on energy policy, the Republican mainstream loved cap and trade. Indeed, just two years ago, the ticket of John McCain and Sarah Palin vowed to establish “a cap-and-trade system that would reduce greenhouse gas emissions” and pursue “alternatives to carbon-based fuels.”

The point, of course, isn’t just that the Republican mainstream has shifted sharply to the right, it’s that the mainstream has fallen off a right-wing cliff with surprising speed. Positions that were widely accepted by Republicans just a few years ago are now considered communist plots to destroy the American way of life.”

It does make you wonder who’s driving the Republican train, leaving people such as Huckabee and Gingrich scrambling to keep up.

– Jay Bookman

260 comments Add your comment

Normal

December 16th, 2010
2:27 pm

“The point, of course, isn’t just that the Republican mainstream has shifted sharply to the right, it’s that the mainstream has fallen off a right-wing cliff with surprising speed. Positions that were widely accepted by Republicans just a few years ago are now considered communist plots to destroy the American way of life.”

“It does make you wonder who’s driving the Republican train.”

That’s easy, Big Oil….

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
2:31 pm

“It does make you wonder who’s driving the Republican train.”

The same toolbox that drove the train in “Silver Streak”?

Kamchak

December 16th, 2010
2:32 pm

It does make you wonder who’s driving the Republican train.

That would be James Bopp Jr.

(3) We support market-based energy reforms by opposing cap and trade legislation;

jewcowboy

December 16th, 2010
2:34 pm

Doggone/GA,

“he same toolbox that drove the train in “Silver Streak”?”

I loved that movie!

@@

December 16th, 2010
2:35 pm

Nice guy, Huckabee, but if I’ve said it once, I’ve said it a dozen times.

Mike Huckabee is as liberal a Republican as I’ve ever witnessed.

Don’t know when he or Gingrich changed their tune. Could it have been AFTER the climate-gate scandal? Looks like it.

Shawny

December 16th, 2010
2:43 pm

Yep, the GOP have a monopoly on flip-flopping.

NOT!

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
2:46 pm

I dont get to blow the whistle,
I dont get to ring the bell,
but let this train the tracks,
and see who catches hell….

Why, its the republicans, of course….

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
2:47 pm

thats let this train”jump the tracks”

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
2:48 pm

Is cap and trade another one of those things we have to pass to see whats in it?

Union

December 16th, 2010
2:49 pm

you ever wonder if a politician says so dang much that they actually forget what they said?

i like watching the daily show when i get a chance.. and jon stewart and crew drag up videos of folks from years ago.. maybe they need to consult with them before they speak on any position?

Ragnar Danneskjöld

December 16th, 2010
2:49 pm

Good afternoon all. We Republicans believe in redemption. If there are wishy-washy moderate souls who have awakened from their leftist slumber and now use the cognitive gifts God gave them, we welcome them enthusiastically. Those whose brains were dead are now alive again, a point to celebrate.

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
2:49 pm

“I loved that movie!”

Me too! It’s one of the very few that are in my personal collection

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
2:50 pm

“(3) We support market-based energy reforms by opposing cap and trade legislation;”

Not realizing that cap-and-trade IS a market-based system of control

Mick

December 16th, 2010
2:51 pm

ragnar

The only thing you republicans believe in is tax cuts!!! Merry Xmas

Paul

December 16th, 2010
2:51 pm

People can’t evolve in their understanding, revise positions based upon new circumstances or come to understand a new position may be more proper, for if they do, they ‘flip flop.’

So what we hear is deny, deny, deny. Sad.

But the larger story – the ‘who has the influence and how did they exercise it so quickly?’ – is fascinating and troubling. I’ve long thought a few savvy players in a huge organization can be the drivers behind major policy decisions – especially when those players are not the decision makers. Witness Perle, Gaffney, Wolfowitz and the others in the Pres Bush’s first term.

Like I’ve said – I used to think Ludlum novels were fiction…..

Good afternoon, @@

“Mike Huckabee is as liberal a Republican as I’ve ever witnessed.”

Y’know, if it wasn’t for diversity of views within a party and a lack of emphasis what a ‘real’ (insert party name) is, the tax compromise bill would never have passed the Senate and would (prediction, here) not have passed the House, either.

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
2:51 pm

“Is cap and trade another one of those things we have to pass to see whats in it?”

No – a simple answer to a stupid question

Ragnar Danneskjöld

December 16th, 2010
2:51 pm

Cap and tax is a market based system of control in the same sense that social security is an independent insurance program.

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
2:55 pm

doggone….that aint stupid….I dont ask stupid questions. I made a derisive point, as you well know.

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
2:55 pm

“The Cap and Trade Success Story”

http://www.edf.org/page.cfm?tagID=1085

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
2:56 pm

“I dont ask stupid questions”

So, you CAN be wrong after all? yes, you DID ask a stupid question and you got the answer it deserved.

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
2:57 pm

and while we are on the subject, ms doggone…what you like to discuss bills that came out of subcommittee looking NOTHING like what was originally proposed to the public? We would be here the rest of our natural lives…..

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
2:58 pm

Doggone, who are you talking about? You have never seen me act or blog like a know-it-all conservative here even once. And anybody from Bosch to Kam to Granny should be able to attest to that….you got me confused with someone else…

either that or you got a hell of a chip today….

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
2:59 pm

“what you like to discuss bills that came out of subcommittee looking NOTHING like what was originally proposed to the public”

That’s a natural part of the political process. Ever heard of “amendments”? Virtually no bill of any significance gets passed as originally written.

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
3:00 pm

and your style of rudeness is why I post so sparingly….

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
3:00 pm

“either that or you got a hell of a chip today….”

back atcha

Bob

December 16th, 2010
3:00 pm

I actually voted for it, before I voted against it.

thomas

December 16th, 2010
3:01 pm

“either that or you got a hell of a chip today….”

Today? as in only one day?

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
3:01 pm

“Virtually no bill of any significance gets passed as originally written.”

Hence, the derisive question…..

Matti

December 16th, 2010
3:01 pm

C’mon, A GENTLEMAN DENIES IT! and the ladies appreciate that! Oh, wait…. we’re talking about Hucklebee, not Clinton… never mind.

I'm Regular

December 16th, 2010
3:01 pm

Who’s driving the Republicans. Haven’t you heard. Why, it’s none other than Obama himself at the opposition’s wheel. He says up. They say down. He says go. They say stop. He says yes, they say no, no, no.

@@

December 16th, 2010
3:02 pm

Paul:

The tax bill is loaded with pork. Financial rewards for votes in support of? I’m not impressed.

I haven’t changed my mind about Huckabee. I was opposed to his nomination after researching his terms as Governor of Arkansas.

Kamchak

December 16th, 2010
3:03 pm

Virtually no bill of any significance gets passed as originally written.

But the FairTax bill would. It says so right here in both of Boortz’ books.

Paul

December 16th, 2010
3:07 pm

@@

I’m not a fan of the extent Sen Reid had to go to bribe his fellow Democrats for their votes, either. Especially the ethanol subsidies (altho it is ironic how many billions Democrats will funnel to Archer Daniels Midland while at the same time railing against tax cuts for the rich).

But my larger point was, if not for moderate to conservative Democrats and practical Republicans, the bill would not have passed. Heck, hardly anything would pass if the Democratic Party was all farleft ideologues and the Republican Party was all farright ideologues.

Compromise: holding your nose ’cause the cod liver oil’s good for you -

Union

December 16th, 2010
3:08 pm

kamchak.. big ppl talking here.. i think tucker is looking for you?

Randy Davis

December 16th, 2010
3:09 pm

Governor Mike Huckabee DOES NOT and HAS NEVER favored the current Cap and Trade legislation, quite the extreme opposite. In the video here from 2007 he is not referring to “today’s” Cap and Trade legislation. Instead, he was speaking about voluntary cap and trade—supported by Ronald Reagan in fact….it is NOT the same bill as in 2010. He has spoken and written repeatedly about his opposition to Cap and Trade, even on his own Fox television show. It is easy to see however, how people could be confused by this video clip. Thanks and Merry Christmas to everyone.

Citizen of the World

December 16th, 2010
3:12 pm

The reason Republicans are no longer in favor of any of the reasonable steps we might take together to address our problems is because that would not fit into their us-them dichotomy, the one they have worked so hard to cultivate through Fox News and talk radio.

Their base can’t deal with grey areas and they know it, so everything has to be white-black, good-evil, right-wrong, right-left, conservative-liberal with them. Casting themselves, of course, as the white, right and good.

Kamchak

December 16th, 2010
3:12 pm

kamchak.. big ppl talking here..

Whatsamatta, sport?

Did I just gore your ox?

Bosch

December 16th, 2010
3:13 pm

Wasn’t cap and trade a GHW Bush brain child?

@@

December 16th, 2010
3:13 pm

Paul:

The price tag on compromise is too high. You know me….I’m a discount shopper. Cod liver oil at a discount price is bearable. I’ll drink it straight up without the chasers…thank you very much.

Bosch

December 16th, 2010
3:14 pm

“it is NOT the same bill as in 2010″

Yeah, it’s the OTHER Cap and Trade.

Good grief. :roll:

Bosch

December 16th, 2010
3:15 pm

“voluntary cap and trade”

because we all know that when asked to volunteer to do things, people ALWAYS will — like why can’t we just have voluntary taxes?

Del

December 16th, 2010
3:16 pm

It’s kind of early to begin running against Huckabee but I guess the Democrats have good reason to fear anyone who might become Obama’s 012 challenger, so they’ll now shoot wildly in any direction. Jay, I think you’re wasting ammunition because I don’t believe Huckabee will be the Republican nominee.

Bosch

December 16th, 2010
3:17 pm

“Democrats have good reason to fear anyone who might become Obama’s 012 challenger”

OMG, your kidding Del. Huckabee would probably lose against Obama worse than Palin — and as of now, that’s a 55-33% poll number.

Adam

December 16th, 2010
3:19 pm

Um…. raise your hand if you’re surprised?

Granny Godzilla

December 16th, 2010
3:21 pm

Who’s positions change more frequently Mitt’s or Mikes?

Oh the wondrous material available for campaign cmmercials!

@@

December 16th, 2010
3:27 pm

Bosch, in his enthusiasm to be seen, must’ve missed the part where Del said “Jay, I think you’re wasting ammunition because I don’t believe Huckabee will be the Republican nominee.”

OMG, Bosch is such a twit.

Union

December 16th, 2010
3:27 pm

Kamchak
December 16th, 2010
3:12 pm

“Did I just gore your ox?”

nope.. i doubt you could even carry my bags..

stands for decibels

December 16th, 2010
3:28 pm

Wasn’t there a video of Huckabee, earlier?

(I wanted to listen to it to find out if the magic word “voluntary” appeared in it, in the context of his support for cap and trade.)

Matti

December 16th, 2010
3:30 pm

Del: “..but I guess the Democrats have good reason to fear anyone who might ..”

**YAAWWWWWWWN!** If you close your eyes and imagine we’re all afraid, does it get you a little turned on? C’mon, Santa is listening. Tell the truth, and you might actually get what you want for Christmas.

FYI, Sparky: We survived our worst national political fears, namely, pretty much everything Bush & Cheney did. Now we’re surviving the fact that nobody lets us down like our OWN! Ha! (Kinda like how you’ll remember at Christmas that nobody can mess you up like your own family.) It’s the Republican Americans who are in the grips of terror. Look outside your window! See them there, running around in circles, flapping their arms, horrified faces pointed toward the sky screaming, “Obamacare is coming! ACK! Socialists! ACK! The LEFTISTS are here! ACK! ACK!”

The Dems are used to defeat, so much so that they capitulate their own leverage with pointless compromises just to get it over with already. Who’s ready for some egg nog? Easy on the egg, heavy on the nog, please! Fear is for *blanks.* (You know what word goes there.)

Del

December 16th, 2010
3:32 pm

Bosch,

I don’t see Huckabee being a strong contender for the Republican nomination once campaigning gets into gear. I think the Dem’s are fractured at this point and it wouldn’t surprise me to see a Dem challenge to Obama. Obama has a lot of work to do over the next 2 years and he might find himself getting shot at by Republicans on one side and his own party on the other. It would be interesting politics if it weren’t for the fact that we’re in such difficult times.

Tim

December 16th, 2010
3:32 pm

Huckabee is a bald-faced liar just like all Republicans.

Seriously, the Atlanta-Journal Constitution needs to start back doing daily Editorials in the print edition and online. It’s pathetic that the AJC is the state’s largest newspaper, and yet we must go to the Macon Telegraph or Athens-Banner Herald to read daily editorials. The AJC only does editorials on Sundays- ONE DAY A WEEK. The number of letters to the editor has also decreased. With a region as large as metro Atlanta, how can the AJC only publish 3 letters to the editor?

We need an editorial every day, blogs are not enough.

For instance, what does the AJC Editorial Board think about these issues:

1. The Prison Protest– Prisoners in Georgia have been protesting poor food, living conditions, lack of pay for work, a lack of educational opportunities,etc. In Georgia, prisoners can only get a GED. In most other states they can earn a high-school diploma while incarcerated. What does the editorial board think about the deprivation and exploitation that Georgia prisoners must endure every day?

2. The 29 MILLION Oaky Woods Purchase. While Republicans claim that Georgia is broke and must continue to furlough teachers, close state parks, cut back on the HOPE scholarship, decrease funding to colleges, etc, they somehow found 29 MILLION to purchase Oaky Woods.

The state paid twice as much as the property was worth! What about the corruption in this deal? Governor Perdue passed on this deal in 2004 because he said the state didn’t have the money. And yet, we have the money six years later, so that he could enrich his developer buddies down in Houston County. Why doesn’t the Editorial Board attack this corruption and graft with the same zeal that they went after Atlanta School Superintendent Beverly Hall?

3. What about the Republican scam to shift the burden on the poor by lowering income and corporate taxes, and then raising the sales tax? They’re even talking about taxing groceries.

Where is the AJC editorial board on these important issues? The largest paper in the state should have Daily Editorials. Blogs should be a supplement to the editorials and columns, they shouldn’t be a replacement. There is no excuse for smaller newspapers in Georgia writing daily editorials, while the AJC only has them on Sundays. It’s truly pathetic.

larry

December 16th, 2010
3:32 pm

It does make you wonder who’s driving the Republican train, leaving people such as Huckabee and Gingrich scrambling to keep up.

Why they are going off the rails on their Crazy Train!!! Ozzy is driving the train. He looooooooves his tax cuts.Make that his accountants loves them.

RW-(the original)

December 16th, 2010
3:34 pm

At the 2:00 minute mark in the video, Huckabee goes on to make his stance on cap and trade as explicit as possible.

stands,

That part of the story sure makes it sound like there is supposed to be a video.

josef nix

December 16th, 2010
3:38 pm

Somebody do me a favor, please explain cap and trade in 50 words or less that an economics dud such as myself can understand. I am not being an ass, I really am lost.

As for Huckabee, it’s interesting to watch the liberal-democrat-progressive-left moving him to the front of the line for attack/criticism. Is he now the GOP front runner in those eyes?

Jay

December 16th, 2010
3:39 pm

There WAS to have been a video, but the embed code is faulty. I’ve now linked to the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KicX3Zc994c

Disgusted

December 16th, 2010
3:40 pm

I wish to congratulate all those state employees who voted Republican in the gubernatorial race, thinking they were striking a blow for conservatism. Nathan Deal has announced in a speech to business leaders that one of the ways he will “shrink the size of government” is to lay off oodles of state workers. Enjoy your time in the unemployment line, suckahs.

Keep up the good fight!

December 16th, 2010
3:40 pm

Cap and trade is a market based solution to carbon that has been discussed and proposed for years. Not surprising that many Republicans were for it before they were against it. The reason for their change of position is not based on a problem with the market based solution or valid scientific point….its simply because they have sold their souls to the Koch brothers and their other overlords.

Union

December 16th, 2010
3:42 pm

Disgusted
December 16th, 2010
3:40 pm

“Nathan Deal has announced in a speech to business leaders that one of the ways he will “shrink the size of government” is to lay off oodles of state workers. Enjoy your time in the unemployment line, suckahs.”

why should state workers be any different from someone working for a private company?

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
3:42 pm

“That part of the story sure makes it sound like there is supposed to be a video”

There was one.

josef nix

December 16th, 2010
3:42 pm

Tim
In answer to your question I would venture that the other papers you mention have not forgotten the market and demographic they serve…Georgia. The AJC has a rather inflated view of itself as something other than a provencial publication serving an essentially Georgian population.

Keep up the good fight!

December 16th, 2010
3:43 pm

Nix…in very oversimplistic terms. A cap is set on carbon emissions as a result of manufacturing and production. Those companies that are below the cap can “sell” their unused volume to those that are over. Those companies that are over can buy additional volume or they can invest to reduce their emissions.

stands for decibels

December 16th, 2010
3:44 pm

It would be interesting politics if it weren’t for the fact that we’re in such difficult times.

Yep. Thinking bigger-picture here, it’s never a good sign for the country when a President is experiencing a serious primary challenge, whether it’s Gerry Ford in ’76, Jimmy Carter in ’80, or, potentially, Obama in ’12. I tend to hope that Obama isn’t primary-challenged, not so much because I wouldn’t rather have (oh, let’s say…) a President Al Franken, but rather because the economy, and especially the employment situation, would have to be even more FUBAR than it already is for that to happen.

jconservative

December 16th, 2010
3:45 pm

“If there are wishy-washy moderate souls who have awakened from their leftist slumber and now use the cognitive gifts God gave them, we welcome them enthusiastically. Those whose brains were dead are now alive again, a point to celebrate.”

If, if ,if!

If “if and buts were candy and nuts……………”.

If one could be sure they are not lying, one could believe that they have awakened. That they had indeed found the “holy grail”.

But, but, but!

There seems to be a lot of “redemption” happening to the right of center. Maybe too much much too late. And so the L word enters the discussion. “Tell the voters what they want to hear”. Sound advice from an old political sage.

The former “Liberal Republican Governor of Massachusetts” is now a “true believer”. The former “Speaker of the House” is so far out that at times he appears to have dropped off the edge of the world.

And now the former “Moderate Republican Governor of Arkansas” finds it necessary to veer to the right in an apparent attempt to fine the base.

I guess it is just my age and just being old and ornery. But if someone stands up and says with all sincerity “this” and a couple of years later stands up in all sincerity and says “that”, I just get suspicious.

And now from the left of center I hear those who never saw a spending bill they could not support voting “NO” on a big spending bill.

More proof that it is all about the base when one is running and all about the center when one is governing.

ty webb

December 16th, 2010
3:45 pm

“What does the editorial board think about the deprivation and exploitation that Georgia prisoners must endure every day?”

Better yet, why don’t we ask their victims what they think about it…sheesh. And editorials? really?…guess someone needs to be told what to think.

josef nix

December 16th, 2010
3:46 pm

good fight…
@ 3:43
Thanks. I could follow that.

Union

December 16th, 2010
3:46 pm

sfd.. do you think the anti obama rant by the dems will slow down soon? i was wondering the same thing.. if they extend the tax cuts.. then someone from within the democratic party may challenge him on just that issue alone?

Paul

December 16th, 2010
3:46 pm

Okay, now that the Huckabee stuff is over -

Can we please get back to this issue of what the heck has happened (and who is driving it) to Republicans, given their past support for an individual mandate for health insurance, arms control, energy policies?

As far as the individual mandate, I’ve an idea: given Pres Obama said people should be responsible for their own health care and not expect others to pay for it, I’ll wager Republicans didn’t want to be associated with him, so they swapped positions and took up what they saw as the old Democratic position of “you don’t want to take care of yourself? Poor dear, here… let me do it for you.”

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
3:47 pm

Josef – a basic cap-and-trade system sets a value on a particular pollutant (sulpher for example) and sets a limit on how much of that pollutant can be put into . The companies that emit those pollutants are give a set number of “stocks” in those pollutants. If a company makes changes and reduces their emissions, they are free to sell any extra “stocks” to companies who need to have more “room” for emissions.

is that 50 words? There are all sorts of variations though. One way to work towards REDUCING emissions is at set intervals, yearly or whatever, the government buys some of the “stocks” that are available…thus making them no longer available for companies to buy. That, effectively, reduces the emissions “cap” for the next set interval.

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
3:47 pm

Tim,

I think the AJC quit doing editorials because, typically, they were so far to the left that people kept dropping the paper out of disgust that only the left side was represented….but thats just my opinion.

As for point # 1, prisoners are where they are due to their own actions. I think they should be fairly treated and fed, but other than that, BS. They repay the cost to society for being segregated from us with their labor, whether it be road work or whatever and I strongly support that. And when we are talking about cutting back on HOPE for lack of funds, damn if I will endorse the state giving them a college education. That is ludicrious.

2. Agreed, but every leftist environmentalist in the state swallowed and said do the deal, just dont let this virgin property get away, at any cost. I dont think this was just to help the governor with his own piddly 100 or so acres; however, I agree this was virtual robbery by the owners….

3. sorry, but we have different philosophies on this, so I will pass on this argument….

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
3:49 pm

“I’ll wager Republicans didn’t want to be associated with him, so they swapped positions and took up what they saw as the old Democratic position of “you don’t want to take care of yourself?”

It would be fun to see the Dems try that. wouldn’t it?

Kamchak

December 16th, 2010
3:50 pm

i doubt you could even carry my bags..

Your “baggage” is your own to carry.

Lil' Barry Bailout

December 16th, 2010
3:51 pm

Wow, that’s almost as bad as “I will shut down Guantanamo Bay within one year”.

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
3:51 pm

“I think the AJC quit doing editorials because, typically, they were so far to the left that people kept dropping the paper out of disgust that only the left side was represented….but thats just my opinion”

And I have a totally different take on the whole issue of editorials. I don’t think a news organization should be doing editorials at all. Stick to reporting the NEWS.

Keep up the good fight!

December 16th, 2010
3:52 pm

Nix — in general it is a very effective way for an industry to determine whether it wants to invest in reduction equipment. If, for example, they are at 98% efficency and if costs them 10% of their income to upgrade to achieve 98.5% or it costs them 1% to purchase additional credits, then capitalism provides an answer to claims of unrealistic regulation. If a company can invest 1% to achieve great reduction and has credits to sell that adds 10% to the bottom line, it also makes sense.
Its a smarter overall approach to claims of inefficient regulation.

Paul

December 16th, 2010
3:52 pm

Doggone/GA

“It would be fun to see the Dems try that. wouldn’t it?”

And I thought I had a sick sense of humor! :-)

Union

December 16th, 2010
3:52 pm

Kamchak
December 16th, 2010
3:50 pm

“Your “baggage” is your own to carry”

ahh.. if only that were true.. not so much.. im too busy spitting on the less fortunate.. didnt you read?

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
3:53 pm

“Obama Issues Directive to Shut Down Guantánamo”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/22/us/politics/22gitmo.html

problem is, CONGRESS refuses to fund that shut-down.

Doggone/GA

December 16th, 2010
3:54 pm

“And I thought I had a sick sense of humor!”

I think the problem is that not enough Dems in power HAVE enough of a sense of humor to even give such a strategy a thought, let alone a trial.

Hillbilly Deluxe

December 16th, 2010
3:55 pm

josef

For what it’s worth, I have a different view of cap and trade. It’s a way for industries to keep on producing emissions, while buying credits. In my opinion, it’ll create a vast market with much money to be made, selling pieces of paper. (See credit default swaps). If we want to cut emissions, which I’m not opposed to, why not pass regulation,s as to what emissions can be and fine the hell out of those who aren’t in compliance? Do we really need another shell game, where people can make tons of money, swapping pieces of paper? And wouldn’t this just allow polluters to “buy” their way out of compliance?

As usual, that properly ain’t the popular way of looking at it but it’s my way.

md

December 16th, 2010
3:58 pm

I thought there was a separation of church and State, yet this religion is preached openly by those on the left as gospel………..always in the eyes of the beholder.

Keep up the good fight!

December 16th, 2010
3:59 pm

Hillbilly…Certainly I understand your position. You may want to see my 3:52 for an general overview of rather than just setting a cap for everyone, the attempt is a market based solution. Of course those buying credits when others in their same industry are not are at an intentional competitive disadvantage.

josef nix

December 16th, 2010
3:59 pm

keep, doggone

Again, thanks…I’m getting an education here…appreciate it…

mark…
There is something to what you say about dropping the editorials…

doggone
I disagree that newspapers should not be doing editorials…it is an entrenched and fundamental part of the raison d’etre of print journalism…it’s when they carry over the editorial stance into the news pages that I begin the have a problem…

The AJC, in my opinion, crossed that line sometime back whereas those papers outside the perimeter were more traditional…

JKL2

December 16th, 2010
3:59 pm

Jay-

Thanks for your faux interest in Republican presiditial nominees. I guess I missed the part about Huckabee driving the Republicans. I thought Michael Steele was still the RNC Chairman?

I am still trying to figure out how leaving tax rates the same is considered a tax cut for the rich that will magically create jobs by all the Demwits on here?

ty webb

December 16th, 2010
4:00 pm

“problem is, CONGRESS refuses to fund that shut-down.”

Leaders lead(for better or worse). They especially lead when they got majorities in both houses. I know…”Party of No”, yada yada yada. But maybe…just maybe “we aren’t the ones we’ve been waiting for”.

Adam

December 16th, 2010
4:00 pm

Doggone: You beat me to it with the Gitmo rant. Well done.

Del

December 16th, 2010
4:00 pm

josef nix

December 16th, 2010
4:01 pm

Hillbilly
Your opinion, as always, is valued and considered…thanks.

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
4:02 pm

Doggone, I agree with your take on editorials….the thing I liked about them, though, was usually there was an op-ed so I got both sides of the argument.

md

December 16th, 2010
4:03 pm

“A cap is set on carbon emissions as a result of manufacturing and production. Those companies that are below the cap can “sell” their unused volume to those that are over. Those companies that are over can buy additional volume or they can invest to reduce their emissions.”

So…….end result is zero change??????? Why bother…………

Hillbilly Deluxe

December 16th, 2010
4:04 pm

Keep Up the Good Fight

I understand your position, but I disagree with it. It strikes me as more of everybody not being treated the same. A small business might not have the capital to buy credits, that a large one would. So they’d be at a disadvantage, even more than they would be just because they are smaller to begin with. I don’t just hold this view on cap and trade. I’m basically against all kinds of tax credits and breaks. Let’s just level the playing field. If one person or company gets a credit or break, then some other person or company somewhere is at a disadvantage because of it.

Adam

December 16th, 2010
4:04 pm

ty webb: Leaders lead, and sometimes an obstinate few refuse to follow. And apparently Senate rules allow them to do that AND stop the government from working. Those Senate rules are about to change. At that point you may see some more of what you erroneously call “leadership.”

As for cap and trade, it creates a market based on nothing but made up stuff. That means it’s susceptible to fraud and can actually lead to creating a WORSE problem than simply capping emissions.

I'm Regular

December 16th, 2010
4:04 pm

If one of the Republican presidential FOX regulars were to win the White House, would that mean that FOX would have exclusivity over the White House too.

JKL2

December 16th, 2010
4:05 pm

Hillbilly- And wouldn’t this just allow polluters to “buy” their way out of compliance?

Better hope Al Gore doesn’t find out about this or he’ll have Clinton put a hit out on you. They already closed his phony market for buying “air” from third world countries.

Jefferson

December 16th, 2010
4:05 pm

I’d like to cap and trade gasoline. Tell the aye-rabs this is all we will import this year. Let them fight for our business. Drive a ecomomy car, you can sell your gas credits to the soccer moms in the Suberban with one kid riding. If you want to waste gas fine, let americans make the money on your wasteful ways instead of driving the price up for all consermers, plus the suppliers will have to decide how bad they want the business.

ty webb

December 16th, 2010
4:08 pm

“an obstinate few refuse to follow.”

and who would that be, Adam?

carlosgvv

December 16th, 2010
4:09 pm

There is no doubt whatsoever who is driving the Republican train. Big Business is firmly at the controls and has beeen for some time. It is a sweetheart deal for the Republicans because they get tons of money for elections and re-elections. Big Business, in return, gets puppets in the House and Senate who vote exactly as they are told to.

josef nix

December 16th, 2010
4:10 pm

Regular

Of the few times I’ve tuned in to the Huckabee show, I’ve been somewhat impressed with not only his choice of guests “from the other side” and his gentlemanly demeanor, courtesy and dignity.

marky mark

December 16th, 2010
4:10 pm

By the way, Tim there is a weekly magazine called “The Week”. It is also online, I think. It captures the top editorials and news stories of the week and reprints them. It always shows both sides of the argument. I have seen Jay and CT’s articles in it occasionally, along with the opposing points of view. Great way to keep up with business, arts food, politics, etc. and get reprints from the AJC to Washington Post, to anybody else you can name. Also shows the best political cartoons from all over the country. I recommend it to everybody here with our interest in politics, etc….

Adam

December 16th, 2010
4:10 pm

a cap and trade on gas already exists in your scenario. The people driving gas guzzlers have to pay more to get their gas.

Hillbilly Deluxe

December 16th, 2010
4:11 pm

JKL2

I’ve never met ‘ol Bill but I suspect if he and I were to sit down and talk, we’d probably get along fine, as long as we didn’t talk about politics. Not sure I’d get on with Al, though.