History will record TARP, stimulus as major successes

The much-reviled TARP — that socialistic, hugely expensive, $700 billion monument to foolish government intervention — will end up costing the federal government a grand total of about $25 billion, the Congressional Budget Office now estimates.

Among other things, TARP also happened to save Wall Street from total collapse, prevented a slide into global economic depression and — oh yeah — helped preserve about a million jobs at Chrysler and GM.

No, it wasn’t perfect. Nothing cobbled together in such haste could have been perfect. But history will note two important things about TARP:

1.) It was an enormous economic success story;

2.) Those who guaranteed its failure, bitterly fought its passage and continue to belittle it have somehow managed to turn their opposition into political gold.

Last week, the CBO also released its latest, legally mandated report on the impact of spending programs and tax cuts in President Obama’s equally reviled stimulus package. In the third quarter of 2010, according to the CBO, those policies:

* (R)aised real (inflation-adjusted) gross domestic product by between 1.4 percent and 4.1 percent,
* Lowered the unemployment rate by between 0.8 percentage points and 2.0 percentage points,
* Increased the number of people employed by between 1.4 million and 3.6 million, and
* Increased the number of full-time-equivalent (FTE) jobs by 2.0 million to 5.2 million compared with what would have occurred otherwise. (Increases in FTE jobs include shifts from part-time to full-time work or overtime and are thus generally larger than increases in the number of employed workers).

Nobody, including the CBO, is arguing that the economy is strong (although it should be noted that holiday sales are up significantly). However, the evidence is overwhelming that the economic situation today would be far, far worse without policies that it has become politically fashionable to oppose.

In fact, seldom have so many politicians who were so mistaken about so much reaped so much benefit from being flat-out wrong.

privatejobs_sep10

Job loss or gain in private industry, by month. Red months mark Bush presidency, blue months mark Obama presidency. Stimulus bill was signed into law in February 2009. Source: Steve Benen at Washington Monthly

383 comments Add your comment

Left wing management

November 30th, 2010
11:26 am

A man comes along and saves a capitalism in one of its greatest moments of crisis in a century – and gets called a socialist for his troubles.

We need Marx right now. Bad. And Hegel.

R Thomas Berner

November 30th, 2010
11:31 am

I think you’re over-stating holiday sales when you say they are up “significantly.” They are up, but not that much, if I’m understanding the WSJ and CBS News.

Stew Day

November 30th, 2010
11:36 am

As long as you are okay with China owning our debt and all the strings attached–Nothing in this life is for free.

larry

November 30th, 2010
11:43 am

In fact, seldom have so many politicians who were so mistaken about so much reaped so much benefit from being flat-out wrong.

Im wondering if they all ate crow at Thanksgiving.

Don’t most of them have R’s next to their name ?

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
11:44 am

R Thomas – I think it’s predicated on a low base – when you think about how anemic sales have been for the last 3 years, they are percolating along.

jewcowboy

November 30th, 2010
11:47 am

Will Republicans start taking credit for it now?

Paul

November 30th, 2010
11:49 am

Another couple examples of theory and ideology trying to trump reality. Unfortunately, I wonder how many “lessons learned” will be included in future efforts. If the legislation passed so far is any indication… not much.

As far as the stim package, I have to wonder… would the same results have happened if Congressional Democrats had put forth a package closer the the lower numbers proposed by Pres Obama, as Republicans did? We’ll never know.

Matti

November 30th, 2010
11:50 am

It was a successful response to a willful, carefully-crafted step in the process of implementing institutional plutocracy in these Corporate States of America. It buys the common schmoes a little more time, just as allowing (and even helping) the election of Barack Obama afforded us a little more hope and the illusion that we actually have some bit of control that our founding fathers intended. (Although they intended it only for wealthy white men…)

The train is still on the track and barreling toward the intended destination.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
11:51 am

paul – tomato soup link downstairs!

pat

November 30th, 2010
11:51 am

The stimilus was one of the biggest colosal failures in history. Leave it to liberals to tout failures as successes.

You’re no jedi and your mind trick didn’t work.

Mick

November 30th, 2010
11:52 am

We started this millenium with a botched election and a great political divide. The past election has revealed and even deeper chasm between the two political parties. Consensus does not have any place for the ideological politician – it is a sign of weakness. Where will we be ten years from now? Something has got to give…….

pat

November 30th, 2010
11:53 am

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
11:53 am

pat – just cuz you say it doesn’t make it so (jsut like yesterday’s discussion)

pat

November 30th, 2010
11:54 am

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
11:54 am

pat – 11:53 – you’re confusing the stimulus bill with TARP – 2 different things

pat

November 30th, 2010
11:54 am

Southern Comfort

November 30th, 2010
11:54 am

History will record TARP, stimulus as major successes

Not if the Texas Book Commission has their way with it!!! :)

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
11:56 am

ohmygod, pat – no matter how many links about the stimulus bill you post, it is not the same thing as TARP

Doggone/GA

November 30th, 2010
11:56 am

” you’re confusing the stimulus bill with TARP – 2 different things”

Jay’s headline does mention both, though.

Jefferson

November 30th, 2010
11:57 am

Many were enriched by TARP, many lost jobs, many banks continue to fail. Just because the gov’t got the most of the money back does not solve the problems of non regulation. Yes you may call this operation a success, but the cancer remains.

jewcowboy

November 30th, 2010
11:57 am

“You’re no jedi and your mind trick didn’t work.”

At least not on those without minds…

Southern Comfort

November 30th, 2010
11:57 am

UnU

Somehow, I don’t expect to see anything positive mentioned about Obama in the Washington Times until the day he leaves the White House.

pat

November 30th, 2010
11:57 am

pat

November 30th, 2010
12:00 pm

The differnce USinUK is that I can prove myu points and you can’t. I am talking about the ARRA, not TARP. TARP was an emergency measure, ARRA was an entitlement program which failed and increased our debt to the moon. Keynes was an idiot, everything he said and theorized is wrong.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:00 pm

SoCo – snowballs in hell … something positive about any Dem in the Washington Times … about equal chance, I think

Mick

November 30th, 2010
12:01 pm

pat

Remember, almost a third of the stimulus went to that great republican solution for all that ails – tax cuts. Where are the surplus jobs from the bush tax cuts? Mythology 101, republicans and their beloved tax cuts. Meanwhile, the country’s infrastructure disintergrates before our tax cutting eyes…

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:01 pm

pat (and Doggone) – and the majority of Jay’s post is about TARP

Matti

November 30th, 2010
12:02 pm

Mick @ 11:52,

This too is as intended. You must divide a people to conquer and enslave them, especially a people as strong as we once were. They have us thinking that our own neighbors are our enemies, squabbling and fighting amongst ourselves, projecting anger and blame at new bosses who, except for a few crumbs tossed around for the sake of appearance, are virtually no different from the old bosses.

I ask no one to trust my words, only to look at the evidence themselves. There’s plenty.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:02 pm

pat – “The differnce USinUK is that I can prove myu points and you can’t”

posting op-ed pieces from the Washington Times or other rightwingnuttynutnuts is many things … PROOF of anything, it is not.

Left wing management

November 30th, 2010
12:03 pm

pat: “The stimulus was one of the biggest colossal failures in history. Leave it to liberals to tout failures as successes.”

You seem to be suffering from some delusional thinking here ol’ chum. C’mon, lower that head of yours, this is gonna hurt a little …. time of get some of those kinks out.

Now, as for the facts. It’s YOUR side who do nothing but tout failure as success. It’s your side that offers such a nasty mingling of denial, cynicism, and sheer incompetency that you long ago lost the ability to even distinguish between lying for reasons of CYA and lying just to advance your corrupt power-grabbing agenda.

I corrected your typos by the way.

Jefferson

November 30th, 2010
12:03 pm

Tea party played like cheap fiddles, EARMARKS ? WE DON’T NEED NO STINKING EARMARKS.

pat

November 30th, 2010
12:04 pm

47 out of 50 states lost jobs since the stiumulus was signed….
http://www.bls.gov/

Southern Comfort

November 30th, 2010
12:05 pm

UnU

I guess that’s the difference between mainstream and conservative media. I don’t expect conservative media to credit the opposition with anything good.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:06 pm

pat – you do realize that the job massacre started BEFORE Obama took office … it’s not like it started when the stimulus was signed

soames

November 30th, 2010
12:06 pm

The CBO has been known to be wrong….remember that 8% unemployment figure?

This is just like Healthcare Reform. We will not know the true cost until long after it has been in place and has ran it’s course.

Also, unemployment is still at a ridiculously high level and will remain that way for some time to come so I wouldn’t pull a Bush and call it “Mission Accomplished” yet.

everyday American

November 30th, 2010
12:07 pm

wow, good for Jay, actually applauding something that Bush did!!! I’m proud of you Jay… the TARP thing was one of Bush’s tough calls he had to make at the end of his Presidency, and like you, i hope history shows it was a success…

pat

November 30th, 2010
12:07 pm

RB from Gwinnett

November 30th, 2010
12:07 pm

Is this the same CBO that said Obamacare would save us money and then 2 months later said “oops…”?

Seriously, with their track record, shouldn’t you take anything they say with a grain of salt?

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:08 pm

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:08 pm

The CBO has been known to be wrong….remember that 8% unemployment figure?

that didn’t come from the CBO

pat

November 30th, 2010
12:09 pm

So, you know why the democrats lost so badly? Because they FAILED.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:09 pm

I love how people post opinion blogs as “proof”

it amuses me.

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

November 30th, 2010
12:09 pm

Well, you can tell Bookman don’t know how to think Republican-wise. See, TARP and the stimulus were bad because us Conservative Republicans beleive somebody’s always got to be punished when things go wrong. We don’t believe in bailing out the banks. It’s better to let the economy go belly-up and about 20 million Americans get fired than pay a penny to bail out the banks. That way, somebody gets punished. Same thing with the stimulus. Somebody done something wrong for the economy to go bust and people need to get punished for it. Oh, I know, some librul’s going to come up with the argument that our whole state would of been bankrupt if not for the stimulus money, but I say it’s better for 200,000 guvmint workers and teachers to get fired than let somebody off of the hook for doing something wrong. I mean, that’s why we have the Death Penalty.

But I’m just wasting words. People like Bookman will never see things Right. Have a good lunch everybody.

Paul

November 30th, 2010
12:10 pm

USinUK – thanks!

Jay

November 30th, 2010
12:10 pm

Paul writes:

“Would the same results have happened if Congressional Democrats had put forth a package closer the the lower numbers proposed by Pres Obama, as Republicans did?”

Not sure what you mean by that.

As to R. Thomas Berner (who was my journalism prof at Penn State, by the way, so blame him for everything you don’t like about me), Bloomberg reports:

“The average shopper in the U.S. spent 6.4 percent more over Thanksgiving weekend than last year as more people picked up jewelry and toys, heartened by the economic rebound.

About 212 million shoppers went to stores and websites over the holiday weekend, on average spending $365.34, the National Retail Federation said Sunday. The proportion of sales online rose to more than one-third of the total, the highest ever, according to the Washington-based trade group.”

Web sales on “Cyber Monday” also reportedly rose 19 percent over a year ago.

(On a side note, had I written that Bloomsberg lede for Mr. Berner, he would probably have given it back to me with a reminder that toys cannot be heartened.)

pat

November 30th, 2010
12:10 pm

I love how people post nothing as proof….It makes me chuckle.

These are the same people that believe that something can come from nothing and that everything is random yet determined.

Kamchak

November 30th, 2010
12:10 pm

pat – you do realize that the job massacre started BEFORE Obama took office …

I would venture to guess that will never be realized.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:11 pm

Paul – 12:10 – I’m a giver. what can i say.

Paul

November 30th, 2010
12:11 pm

USinUK

Sure beats the four or five bucks I pay for a container of the exact same stuff!

@@

November 30th, 2010
12:11 pm

I dunno, jay…we’ll have to let our children and their children determine whether either was a success. It wasn’t, after all, OUR money, it was theirs. Well….theirs and China’s.

pat

November 30th, 2010
12:12 pm

You realize that the stimulus didn’t add jobs. It’s tough to say “Yea, we added jobs!” When the economy contiuned to diarhea jobs into the double digits.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:13 pm

Kam – I’m sure she’ll dig up someone’s blog as “proof” that the economy was just fine until Obama moved into the White House. the moment he and Michelle unpacked their last box, the economy went t*ts-up

pat

November 30th, 2010
12:13 pm

I know, it suck to be wrong, but you should be used to it by now…Got to get back to work to pay your welfare checks.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:14 pm

paul – 12:11 – nuttin beats homemade! :-)

@@

November 30th, 2010
12:15 pm

“The average shopper in the U.S. spent 6.4 percent more over Thanksgiving weekend than last year as more people picked up jewelry and toys, heartened by the economic rebound.

Question is…how many shoppers were adding to last year’s Christmas debt? The American consumer has learned well from the government who leads the way in debt crisis.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:15 pm

You realize that the stimulus didn’t add jobs.

someone needs to inform pat that jobs growth has been positive for the majority of this year (only negative when the gov was done with the census) …

Paul

November 30th, 2010
12:19 pm

Hello Jay

Without looking up the exact numbers, my recollection is Pres Obama put forth a stim proposal of N, comprised of spending and tax cuts. Reps came in lower with their proposal, Dems came in a couple hundred million higher. The passed bill was higher than Pres Obama’s initial proposal. Happens all the time, but my point was… would we have had the same results with $100 million less? $200 million? Who knows? But it might have deflected some of the criticism and winnowed out the questionable items.

We were at a point where people were willing to do something, but I’m afraid what many perceive as gross excess has poisoned the well.

jewcowboy

November 30th, 2010
12:19 pm

@@,

“It wasn’t, after all, OUR money, it was theirs.”

As was the money for 2 wars of choice, revenue lost from massive tax cuts, Medicare Prescription Plans, etc…

Jimmy62

November 30th, 2010
12:20 pm

Haha, we’re not even close to out of this mess and you are declaring victory. Let’s see what we think of TARP in five years when all the chickens have come to roost, when we realize all the things we saved with TARP and stimulus are albatrosses around our necks that will keep our economy from recovering for the long term.

Give a homeless man $5,000, and he’ll be great for a while. But he’ll most likely be back on the streets soon after.

StJ

November 30th, 2010
12:21 pm

“and — oh yeah — helped preserve about a million jobs at Chrysler and GM”. “Preservation” in this case means “keep em running until the next bailout”.

Chrysler and GM haven’t made reliable cars in decades. If anyone needs further proof of that, check the Consumer Reports car-buying guide (and then maybe schedule a visit with the eye doctor if you keep seeing little black spots).

If a car requires constant fixing after the “new” has worn off, it’s not worth owning. I know several people who own newer GM cars (less than 10 years old) and they spend more time in the shop than they do on the road. And as bad as GM cars are, Chryslers are worse. Maybe GM and Chrysler should have spent more money in R&D and less on marketing. If they made a quality product, they wouldn’t need “rebates” and other sales gimmicks to sell it.

Mick

November 30th, 2010
12:22 pm

usinuk

Didn’t you get the memo? Facts don’t matter anymore, ideological beliefs trump all factual information. Only liberals use facts to prove their points, what fools…

Jimmy62

November 30th, 2010
12:22 pm

Oh yeah, also Obama had some pretty specific results he expected from his stimulus, including certain levels of unemployment. We’re not even close to meeting those goals, so for you to call this a resounding success when it didn’t meet it’s own stated goals is simply ludicrous.

TaxPayer

November 30th, 2010
12:22 pm

Apparently our compassionate conservative brethren cannot even see 20/20 in hindsight.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:22 pm

Let’s see what we think of TARP in five years when all the chickens have come to roost, when we realize all the things we saved with TARP and stimulus are albatrosses around our necks

um. you mean the banks? the place where we keep our money and the folks who make loans?

Granny Godzilla

November 30th, 2010
12:23 pm

AND

I predict History will also show the GOP taking cerdit for it…..and Healthcare and Financial reform and ending DADT……

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:23 pm

Mick – “Didn’t you get the memo? Facts don’t matter anymore”

dude. and pat is the QUEEN of “if I say it’s a fact, it IS”

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:24 pm

“and Healthcare and Financial reform and ending DADT……”

wouldn’t surprise me one bit … they took credit for “giving” women the right to vote …

Jay

November 30th, 2010
12:26 pm

Paul, the GOP didn’t HAVE a stimulus proposal. They opposed the whole idea.

Every single Republican in the House voted against it, and only 3 in the Senate voted in favor. The final number of $787 billion was less than the $827 billion Senate version and the $820 billion House version.

Mick

November 30th, 2010
12:28 pm

stj

Bought a chevy s-10 in 92 which survived hurricane andrew – still have it and it runs fine except for the a/c. Bought a chevy silverado in 2000 and gave it to my dad and it still runs fine, a/c still works. I bought another silverado in 06, still have it and no major repairs and runs great along with pretty good gas mileage. Know many other gm owners that have had a good experience so, what you talking about willis?

Jay

November 30th, 2010
12:29 pm

I’ve posted the pertinent jobs chart up above, just for pat.

carlosgvv

November 30th, 2010
12:29 pm

The TARP and stimulus are major successes in the same way as a starving farmer eating all his seed corn is. His hunger is put off for now but come planting time there is nothing left. A similar time of recokning will come for this spending all we have now and aquiring a huge debt. It is just a matter of time till the chickens come home to roost on this.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:30 pm

but, jaaaayyyyy, the stimulus is a failure – all the conservo-nutty blogs say it is … your charts and facts are therefore moot

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:31 pm

carlos – so, your choices are starvation and death or life with debt …

hrmmm …

tough decision.

Kamchak

November 30th, 2010
12:31 pm

Ooooooh, charts.

Common Sense isn't very Common

November 30th, 2010
12:32 pm

StJ@12:21 pm

Chrysler and GM haven’t made reliable cars in decades.

Maybe GM and Chrysler should have spent more money in R&D and less on marketing. If they made a quality product, they wouldn’t need “rebates” and other sales gimmicks to sell it.
——————————-

Yep, it would have been much better for all the corporations if they had left the innovators and engineers in charge of the companies instead of bringing in the bean counters who only understand the term ‘BONUS’

Southern Comfort

November 30th, 2010
12:32 pm

Every single Republican in the House voted against it, and only 3 in the Senate voted in favor. The final number of $787 billion was less than the $827 billion Senate version and the $820 billion House version

Hmmmmmm…..

Jay

November 30th, 2010
12:32 pm

We do have to deal with the deficit, Carlos, but you don’t tackle that one in the middle of the biggest economic calamity in 80 years.

I’ll also note once again that TARP, the stimulus, the auto bailout and the Obama health care plan COMBINED won’t have close to the same impact on the deficit as the Republicans’ Medicare prescription drug plan passed under Bush.

Mick

November 30th, 2010
12:33 pm

Speaking about spending, what about our unfunded war debt? Now, they are seriously talking about tax cuts for the top 2 percenters which will add another 700 biliion in 10 years? They can’t be serious, can they? Oh yes they are, that disfunctional duo mcconnell/boehner…

Common Sense isn't very Common

November 30th, 2010
12:34 pm

TaxPayer@12:22 pm

Apparently our compassionate conservative brethren cannot even see 20/20 in hindsight.
———————
They have perfect 20/20 hindsight because their head is up their arse. To see ahead they need a glass navel.

jt

November 30th, 2010
12:35 pm

It is tapeworm economics.

Iceland is the only country that will have a happy ending.(Banksters and Politicians taking the perp walk.)

Americans have been too federosexualized.

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:35 pm

oh, by the way … I said this much earlier today, but it bears repeating …

happy St. Andrews Day to all my fellow Scots and Scot hybrids!!

Southern Comfort

November 30th, 2010
12:36 pm

They have perfect 20/20 hindsight because their head is up their arse. To see ahead they need a glass navel

:shock:
:lol:

jewcowboy

November 30th, 2010
12:37 pm

StJ,

“know several people who own newer GM cars (less than 10 years old) and they spend more time in the shop than they do on the road”

Ummm….1st off, i wouldn’t consider a car that is a decade, or even 4 years old, “newer.”

2nd off…have yo even looked at JD Powers dependability surveys? Trust, and this comes from an Audi owner, I would love to have a Buick or Cadillac.

http://businesscenter.jdpower.com/JDPAContent/CorpComm/News/content/Releases/pdf/2010034-vds2.pdf

3rd off, are you saying that even though a company may have lost its way in the past, it can never turn out a great product ever again? I think Apple would beg to differ…

Southern Comfort

November 30th, 2010
12:37 pm

Not a Scot or Scot hybrid, but I do enjoy a good Scotch!!!!

Happy St. Andrews Day to you too!!

TaxPayer

November 30th, 2010
12:37 pm

I’ll also note once again that TARP, the stimulus, the auto bailout and the Obama health care plan COMBINED won’t have close to the same impact on the deficit as the Republicans’ Medicare prescription drug plan passed under Bush

There goes Jay blaming it all on Bush again. There. I just saved several compassionate conservatives the trouble. :roll:

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:39 pm

SoCo – that counts! :-)

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:40 pm

Taxpayer – nah – they’ll blame the medicare prescription bill on Kennedy

Jay

November 30th, 2010
12:40 pm

Hey jt, I owe you a lunch.

jewcowboy

November 30th, 2010
12:40 pm

“I’ve posted the pertinent jobs chart up above, just for pat.”

Which will not make one bit of difference in minds that, for whatever reason, will not accept what they do not want to, regardless of fact, figures, charts, etc.

Rightwing Troll

November 30th, 2010
12:40 pm

Yeah…but, but, but…

Don’t worry, President Delay will fix all this in 2013…

Southern Comfort

November 30th, 2010
12:41 pm

jcb

I’d agree. 3 out of 4 cars/trucks in my driveway are GM products, all Chevys. When it comes to replacing them, they’ll be replaced with more GM cars. I haven’t have any problem with the newest one (2009 model) at all. I had the transmission rebuilt on the 99 suburban, but no other issues with that one. The only thing I hate is it’s harder to work on the newer models now because of all the computer systems and stuff. With my older one, I can get downright dirty in the engine compartment if I had to.

Doggone/GA

November 30th, 2010
12:41 pm

“happy St. Andrews Day to all my fellow Scots and Scot hybrids!!”

One of my Father’s great-grandmother’s was Scot – does that count?

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:42 pm

time to start working on supper … (and no, it’s neither haggis nor is it deep fried Mars bars)

have a good evening!

USinUK

November 30th, 2010
12:42 pm

Doggone – of course it does! :-)

Rightwing Troll

November 30th, 2010
12:42 pm

I own a GM, 2001 Tahoe, never been in the shop once, unless you count oil changes.

Ragnar Danneskjöld

November 30th, 2010
12:43 pm

I respectfully disagree with both thesis and “proof.” The “TARP” will be remembered as a policy success on a par with Smoot-Hawley, and that would be a reasonable comparison. Both TARPs were unnecessary, and led to nothing more than an expanded government, which has subsequently produced the slowest economic recovery since the Great Depression.

As to the “proof” – CBO? You must be kidding. CBO is allowed to consider only those assumptions the question-asker permits. Suggest looking at a real economics think-tank; I suspect even Brookings is beginning to rethink its marriage to Lord Keynes..

Rightwing Troll

November 30th, 2010
12:43 pm

“We’re not even close to meeting those goals, so for you to call this a resounding success when it didn’t meet it’s own stated goals is simply ludicrous.”

Whoa!! did somebody declare “Mission Accomplished”???

Matti

November 30th, 2010
12:45 pm

In honor of St. Andrew’s Day and the Scot half of my blood, will somebody please bring me a bottle of Dalwhinnie 15? That’s MY kind of stimulus! THANKS!

Paul

November 30th, 2010
12:46 pm

Jay 12:28

While Republicans opposed the final bill, they were in favor of stimulus.

They had objections on the tax cut/funding mix, the size of the funding and how funding was allocated. Their proposals were rejected and they voted against the final package, as you noted.

http://tinyurl.com/26jogjt

Their objections and proposals (sketchy tho they are) are here:

http://www.house.gov/budget_republicans/press/2007/pr20090213stimulusconf.pdf

Normal

November 30th, 2010
12:46 pm

I’m of French blood, but I partook of the single malt once, does that count?