Obama v. Fox News, a long American tradition
In an interview with Rolling Stone, President Obama was asked a question about the impact and role of Fox News. He responded as follows:
“Look, as president, I swore to uphold the Constitution, and part of that Constitution is a free press. We’ve got a tradition in this country of a press that oftentimes is opinionated. The golden age of an objective press was a pretty narrow span of time in our history. Before that, you had folks like Hearst who used their newspapers very intentionally to promote their viewpoints. I think Fox is part of that tradition — it is part of the tradition that has a very clear, undeniable point of view. It’s a point of view that I disagree with. It’s a point of view that I think is ultimately destructive for the long-term growth of a country that has a vibrant middle class and is competitive in the world. But as an economic enterprise, it’s been wildly successful. And I suspect that if you ask Mr. Murdoch what his number-one concern is, it’s that Fox is very successful.”
Personally, I think that statement is A.) quite accurate; and B.) a natural, inevitable part of the give and take of politics. When media outlets run stories that are critical of a politician, the politician responds, sometimes with criticism of his or her own. Here in Georgia, politicians have campaigned against “those lying Atlanta newspapers” for generations, and they continue to do so to this very day. It comes with the territory.
And yeah, Obama’s the president, which means that his words carry a lot of weight. But Rupert Murdoch and Fox News are big boys too — somehow I think they can handle it. If you can’t withstand a little pushback from politicians, you better go find another line of work, because you’re too much of a wimp for this one.
However, some of my media colleagues disagree with me. For example, David Zurawik, a TV critic for the Baltimore Sun, claims to see Obama’s running feud with Fox as some sort of threat to “a press independent from the reaches and power of any of the branches of government” and further suggests that the president doesn’t respect the role of a free press.
I wonder what Zurawik and others would make of Thomas Jefferson, who wrote eloquently and often about the importance of a free press, calling it our single most important bulwark in defense of liberty. But in 1805, in his second Inaugural Address, Jefferson also complained bitterly that in order to destroy his administration, “the artillery of the press has been leveled against us, charged with whatsoever its licentiousness could devise or dare.” Again, that was in his inaugural address, not in some interview with Rolling Stone. And it was just one of many examples of Jefferson complaining about press abuses, which “have been carried to a length never before known or borne by any civilized nation.”
In his Rolling Stone comments, Obama mentioned another prime example in William Randolph Hearst, who in the first half of the 20th century owned a powerful chain of newspapers and used them to conduct a bitter assault on Franklin Roosevelt. For example, in one 1936 editorial that he wrote himself and published on the front page of every newspaper he owned, Hearst charged that FDR was doing the handiwork of the Communists in Moscow and had “adopted the platform of the Karl Marx Socialists in almost every word and letter.”
The FDR White House responded to what it called “a certain notorious newspaper owner,” releasing a statement that in some ways sounds eerily modern.
“Such articles are conceived in malice and born of political spite,” the statement read. “The American people will not permit their attention to be diverted from real issues to fake issues which no patriotic, honorable decent citizen would purposely inject into American affairs.”
Roosevelt himself, in an appearance at the annual Gridiron Club dinner in Washington, took playful note of the press campaign against him. Some character by the name of Franklin Roosevelt, a true villain, kept showing up in all his newspapers, FDR said. This guy Roosevelt, he said, “combined the worst features of Ivan the Terrible, Machiavelli, Judas Iscariot, Henry VIII … and Jesse James. He was engaged in a plot to wreck the American Constitution, to poison the Supreme Court, to demolish capitalism, to wreck old-age security…. in short, to blot from the face of the Earth the United States as we have known it.”
That too sounds familiar.
Obama, in other words, is doing somewhat gently what Jefferson, FDR and others had done aggressively, and in fact what politicians everywhere do. He has every right to point out that Fox has “a very clear, undeniable point of view,” because it’s the truth and everyone knows it. That point of view shows up in myriad ways, some large, some small. And the small ways are often the most telling.
In that same Rolling Stone interview, for example, Obama was asked about his musical tastes these days. He responded:
“My iPod now has about 2,000 songs, and it is a source of great pleasure to me. I am probably still more heavily weighted toward the music of my childhood than I am the new stuff. There’s still a lot of Stevie Wonder, a lot of Bob Dylan, a lot of Rolling Stones, a lot of R&B, a lot of Miles Davis and John Coltrane. Those are the old standards.
A lot of classical music. I’m not a big opera buff in terms of going to opera, but there are days where Maria Callas is exactly what I need.
Thanks to Reggie [Love, the president's personal aide], my rap palate has greatly improved. Jay-Z used to be sort of what predominated, but now I’ve got a little Nas and a little Lil Wayne and some other stuff, but I would not claim to be an expert. Malia and Sasha are now getting old enough to where they start hipping me to things. Music is still a great source of joy and occasional solace in the midst of what can be some difficult days.”
Personally, the bit about Maria Callas gets me worried. But that’s not what caught the attention of those good folks at FoxNation.com. Here’s how they pitched it on their website:
Hearst would be so proud.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
839 comments Add your comment
Nice Guy
September 30th, 2010
3:42 pm
AmVet – “TOP RACIST RUSH LIMBAUGH QUOTES”
Keep’em coming AmVet…I know this topic makes you down right giddy. But just know, the more you toss around Jesse Jackson’s name the more you A.) look bad and B.) discredit any of your statements concerning race.
Jackson is the king of all kings when it comes to being a racist.
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
3:43 pm
Good column, Jay, and not an easy one to have written given your position. Tip of the chapeau…
Every time I hear someone taking off on the press of today, all I can do is shake my head…for all its outrage, it’s pretty tame compared to the tradition in the great land of freedom of the press.
President Obama, in my opinion, has been relatively restrained and no doubt it’s his elitism showing through. I wish he would got to a mud roll with the press…it’d show us some of what he’s made of not what his handlers want us to think he is and what we want him to be.
historian–
DDR and I will got to a tussle when it comes to interpretation of history, but when it comes to her knowledge of history, she’s probably the most widely read and best informed people around today and not just on this blog. And when I found out her age, I was blown out of the water!
JKL2
September 30th, 2010
3:43 pm
HDB- Does it count if you called into the Limbaugh show to counter his monotribe with factual information, then you get denigrated and cut off?? (Personal EXPERIENCE!!!)
Alot of the callers are cut off for obscene profit breaks. They can make excuses with some of the soft hacks, but have to hit the hard ones. The call screener is probably to blame as much as anyone for people getting cut off.
Not knowing the subject, I would say it was your opinion that got you cut off and probably had nothing to do with the color of your skin.
What about the genuflectors?
September 30th, 2010
3:43 pm
Did President Obama bring up MSNBC (must have bad knees due to all the genuflecting) or CNN (same), or even the three major news networks as being liberal? (Of course, they are “neutral”…hee hee ha ha).
Javier
September 30th, 2010
3:43 pm
Sorry JAY,
You are 100% incorrect.
“He has every right to point out that Fox has “a very clear, undeniable point of view,” because it’s the truth and everyone knows it.”
He has the right to give his opinion on whatever he wants because the constitution protects his rights as well.
Media bias?
September 30th, 2010
3:43 pm
Amvet,
Good one there about the composite pics resemebling Jesse. But I think that Rush is more making fun of Jesse than anything else because jesse is nothing more than a professional shakedown artist. The fact that people follow this pastor who commits adultury and impregnates a coworker while he’s in his 50s his laughable.
While we’re at it is it also racist to suggest that black men commit more crime than anyone else? Or is it simply a statement of fact that people don’t want to hear? An ugly truth that people just don’t like so rather than face the truth they simply call it racist?
Didn’t you know sir that truth is the new hate speech?
Paul
September 30th, 2010
3:45 pm
Doggone/GA
“here’s how: white ALREADY HAVE THE POWER”
Something I’ve thought about: was in a minimall, bunch of vendor stands. One selling t-shirts. One t-shirt had a group of African Americans, in graduation gowns, and the caption was “The Blacker The College, The Better the Knowledge”
Nothing about power, there. the word “Better.” Some serious implications, there.
AmVet
September 30th, 2010
3:46 pm
TOP RACIST RUSH LIMBAUGH QUOTES (AS SUPPORTED BY NICE GUY).
“The NAACP should have riot rehearsal. They should get a liquor store and practice robberies.”
williebkind
September 30th, 2010
3:46 pm
Real American
September 30th, 2010
3:42 pm
And what country does that not apply? What empire did not do simular or worse? Did they correct that behavior? You liberals have a saying,”You got to break a few eggs to make an omelate.” My family lived through reconstruction and you got your vengence.
HDB
September 30th, 2010
3:46 pm
williebkind
September 30th, 2010
3:42 pm
Who had to DIE to ensure that I got the same rights as white men? BLACK MEN AND WOMEN!! Remember: Crispus Attucks, the first person to DIE in the Revolutionary War…was black!!
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
3:46 pm
DebbieDoRight,
“You can’t fall asleep if you’re too busy trying not to throw up…”
For me it’s his voice…It’s like nails down a chalkboard…EGAD!
DebbieDoRight
September 30th, 2010
3:46 pm
Debbie and the term dogmatic seem to go hand in hand. The AJC needs an ignore poster button… Obama hates white people, republicans and anyone doesn’t support him. How do I know – because I said so. He even throws his mother under the bus.
Oh ok I got it now. All this time I was not only “talking” to a troll, I was talking to childish one!!! School’s out already?
NG: Besides, if Rush was a true racists, as so many like claim, then he wouldn’t be the most successful talk radio host, and he surely wouldn’t still be on the air. I don’t care who you are, network bosses, the media, responsible audiences, etc., don’t put up with racism (unless it’s towards the white folks, I should say).
So Rush isn’t a true racist he just plays one on radio?
AmVet
September 30th, 2010
3:47 pm
Redact the above post to read:
TOP RACIST RUSH LIMBAUGH QUOTES (AS SUPPORTED BY NICE GUY & MEDIA BIAS).
“The NAACP should have riot rehearsal. They should get a liquor store and practice robberies.”
williebkind
September 30th, 2010
3:47 pm
AmVet
September 30th, 2010
3:46 pm
That is funny! No wonder he is entertaining.
MacDaddy
September 30th, 2010
3:48 pm
Here we go again, Fox News taking shots from dems and the media. How original. What you liberal idiots do not understand is that Fox News is now the main stream, while ABCNBCCBSCNN are considered the networks out of touch with reality, and they have the ratings to prove me right. Go ahead, find 1 story on Fox News that is not fact. Liberal media folks have been tring for years to find one, but they can’t.
It all comes down to Obama can’t take the heat, and in November we will remove his little helpers, then in 2012, Obama gets his pink slip. What a great day that will be.
HDB
September 30th, 2010
3:49 pm
JKL2
September 30th, 2010
3:43 pm
“Not knowing the subject, I would say it was your opinion that got you cut off and probably had nothing to do with the color of your skin.”
The fact that I REFUTED Limbaugh with facts, examples, dates…and showed him to be wrong….specifically when he talked about black people…got me cut off!! You have to kiss Limbaugh’s rear end for him to accept your premise!!
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
3:49 pm
stands for decibels.
“You lie! Bush didn’t go clear brush, he delivered a birthday cake to John McCain. Remember?”
Ah yes…there was just always soooo much brush….
Del
September 30th, 2010
3:49 pm
“I can’t believe they gave a maniac like that a gun and access to the president.”
Sounds like your diagnosis of mania links to your political ideological or religious views. You would have been a reject.
JKL2
September 30th, 2010
3:49 pm
Paul-
unofficially yes. Anything that hasn’t been reproted? no. The media doesn’t want to believe all the little smoking guns (no big ones were found that I know of) so they stopped reporting them.
The biggest question is still “where did they go?”, because as Clinton and everyone else has said, we know they had them.
Scorekeeper
September 30th, 2010
3:49 pm
Liberal TV allies 5- ABC, NBC, CBS, MSNBC, CNN
Conserv TV allies 1- Fox news
5-1 Liberals win it. So what in the hell are they complaining about?
Do we need to compare major American newspapers- nearly every one of which is heavily liberal? Do we? Do you liberals really want to go there? NY Times, AJC, LA TIMES, CHICAGO TRIBUNE, WASHINGTON POST, SAN FRAN CHRONICLE, practically every big paper in every big city is liberal. I could go on all day about that.
Nice Guy
September 30th, 2010
3:50 pm
AmVet – “The NAACP should have riot rehearsal. They should get a liquor store and practice robberies.””
LOL! Now that is a good quote! Again, same as with Jesse Jackson, the NAACP is full of hate and racism.
Keep’em coming!!
ken R
September 30th, 2010
3:50 pm
Real American, what have you done to right the wrongs of the past????? While your at it don’t forget Attila the Hun, the Vikings, Spanish Inquisition, and hundreds more. Sounds kind of dumb, doesn’t it!
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
3:50 pm
josef nix,
HIYA!
“President Obama, in my opinion, has been relatively restrained and no doubt it’s his elitism showing through.”
It’s all the organic arugula…
DebbieDoRight
September 30th, 2010
3:51 pm
My family lived through reconstruction and you got your vengence.
As you conservatives love to say — “Get over it already!!” Just quoting…..
josef – hey josef!! Regarding your comment on my age, I have an old soul!! You know my best friend in the world is my grandfather…….sometimes his mannerisms (at least some of them) rub off on me.
md
September 30th, 2010
3:51 pm
Media @ 3:35 – he was doing a great job of making himself look silly without you pointing it out.
Media bias?
September 30th, 2010
3:51 pm
HDB,
What was the subject with which you disagreed with Limbaugh and what facts did you present to him?
Doggone/GA
September 30th, 2010
3:52 pm
“the word “Better.” Some serious implications, there.”
Yes, I’m thinking we’re finally getting close to no longer needing the “Black power” chant…and of course having Obama elected to Pres helps a lot.
The thing that still strikes me the strongest is what I call the “open faces” of black people today. I’m old enough to still remember the severe “poker faces” they had to adopt when around whites, to keep from being accused of (something)
It’s just marvelous to see how REAL black AND white people can be around each other. We still have a long way to go, but we’ve come a long way too.
DebbieDoRight
September 30th, 2010
3:53 pm
LOL! Now that is a good quote! Again, same as with Jesse Jackson, the NAACP is full of hate and racism
Why don’t you ever hear Rush saying anything about Skin heads, KKK and Neo Nazis? I mean aren’t they full of hate too……..?
Nice Guy
September 30th, 2010
3:53 pm
Debbie – “So Rush isn’t a true racist he just plays one on radio?”
Correct, Rush is not a racist….nor does he play one on the radio.
AmVet – “(AS SUPPORTED BY NICE GUY & MEDIA BIAS).”
Yes, I support Rush, no doubt. But a racist I most certainly am not.
Now gimmee another “racist” quote from Rush!
middleaged
September 30th, 2010
3:53 pm
I grew up about 30 miles east of Atlanta with no colored TV or cable. I only had rabit ears so all I got was CBS, NBC and ABC. That is until we were graced with the vision of Ted Tuner evry Sunday morning as he introduced his AMC movie of the week. Of course we had channel 36 that was the first MTV I can remember. for the mijority of my life there was no conservative outlet on TV or radio. Thank god for changes in law that allowed talk radio to come of age. I do not wish to listen to Katie Curic, never did. Don’t care about any of the big 3’s anchor’s. Never cared about the CNN need to be loved all over the world. I am not a global citizen. I enjoy travel but hope and pray that the rest of the worlds way of life stays there and does not come here. IF there are those of you who wish to live like the English, French, German, Rusian, Africans, Mexicans, Spanish or Swedish please pay them a visit. I you like it stay but if you come back to the USA please leave the crap at the door.
HDB
September 30th, 2010
3:53 pm
Media bias?
September 30th, 2010
3:43 pm
“While we’re at it is it also racist to suggest that black men commit more crime than anyone else? Or is it simply a statement of fact that people don’t want to hear? An ugly truth that people just don’t like so rather than face the truth they simply call it racist?”
Question: Can the belief that black men commit more crime be attributed to the fact that black men are TARGETED by law enforcement…and that black life has been marginalized by the white establishment?? If black people are 12% of the population, by sheer numbers, they can NOT commit the preponderance of crime!!
“Didn’t you know sir that truth is the new hate speech”
Depends on WHOSE truth….certain truths are NOT true!!
AmVet
September 30th, 2010
3:53 pm
TOP RACIST RUSH LIMBAUGH QUOTES (AS SUPPORTED BY THE NICE GUY, MEDIA BIAS & WILLFULLY BLIND).
“Right. So you go into Darfur and you go into South Africa, you get rid of the white government there. You put sanctions on them. You stand behind Nelson Mandela — who was bankrolled by communists for a time, had the support of certain communist leaders. You go to Ethiopia. You do the same thing.”
He catches a break on this one from his fellow racists, as it is a theme virtually parroted by the apartheid-loving, dictator-coddling Ronald Reagan.
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
3:54 pm
williebkind,
“You liberals have a saying,”You got to break a few eggs to make an omelate.””
Conservatives and centrists don’t ever say that? Hmm.
“My family lived through reconstruction and you got your vengence.”
From 1865 – 1877…another hmmmm.
DebbieDoRight
September 30th, 2010
3:54 pm
Well the young and the shiftless are on their way home. C U guys later……
and josef – I got a new father boa (snap).
Doggone/GA
September 30th, 2010
3:54 pm
“The biggest question is still “where did they go?”, because as Clinton and everyone else has said, we know they had them.”
Yep. HAD being the operative word, because WE gave them to them. And they still existed, but had deteriorated into unusability by the time Bush invaded them.
Pogo
September 30th, 2010
3:56 pm
Hearing the wailing from Obama and the liberals about FOX news is music to my ears. Liberals have become so intolerant and quite frankly spoiled that they can’t concieve that any media or press outlet would not walk lockstep with them. Long live FOX as long it goes against the liberal propoganda machine that is the American Press and the American Media. Democracy lives!
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
3:56 pm
I am always bemused when this blog and popular commentary take up racism. The whole discussion is locked in a black-white dichotomy the perpetuation of which is the bread and butter of a whole lot of folks who have a vested interest in keeping it locked there. I’m lucky enough to live in a home and serve a community where the “other” is the point of perspective and, quite frankly, they often see little distinction between black and white here and pretty much feel “a pox on both your houses.” While that may seem trivial, the simple fact of the matter is that in the future as things are going now, the brown-red-and yellow will be where the power lies and it might be in our own national best interest to keep that in mind. White and black alike may well be shuttled to the Fifth Circle of Dante’s Inferno.
Abrazos
September 30th, 2010
3:56 pm
Media Bias @3:35
“Perhaps you should read a little more before accusing someone of outright fabricating stuff.”
I like MARTA and use it whenever I go to the airport or meetings downtown. Since I’m pretty familiar with it, let me say this: not even a blind man could confuse a MARTA train or MARTA bus with a shuttle.
You know why you said you were on MARTA: since many minorities use it, it’s a better backdrop for the illustration of a racist radio show that you said you heard. And you thought you wouldn’t get called on it or you wouldn’t have said it.
If you were “confused” about the mode of transportation you take, how would you expect anyone to believe that you would remember an offensive radio show in the detail you described?
You dug yourself into that hole, amigo. Best to stop digging.
Nice Guy
September 30th, 2010
3:57 pm
Debbie – “Why don’t you ever hear Rush saying anything about Skin heads, KKK and Neo Nazis? I mean aren’t they full of hate too……..?”
If they were a significant group (think NAACP/Jesse Jackson/Al Sharpton) that could have a serious effect on a large group of Americans, then he would no doubt condemn their behavior (but I’m not saying he hasn’t condemned them in the past). But the truth is, the skin heads, KKK, Nazis are a small, insignifant group that no one takes seriously (of course there are exceptions here). And yes, they are hate filled racists, no doubt about that.
Media bias?
September 30th, 2010
3:58 pm
DebbieDoRight,
Rush probably doesn’t bring up those hate groups because they are virtually irrelevant and they are not invited or included in conservative events. Do high level republican or conservative leaders openly associate with skinheads and KKK members at speeches, events, etc. No.
Do black leaders openly convort and associate with hatemongers such as the reverand Jeremiah Wright, the hatemongering bigot Louis Farrakhan- “those white devils, Judaism is a gutter religion”, etc. Not only do black leaders openly welcome these bigots but so do masses of black citizens who admire a hatemongering bigot like Farrakhan. What’s wrong with this picture when an entire group of people see a bigoted hatemonger like Farrakhan in a positive mannner and embrace him?
Paul
September 30th, 2010
3:58 pm
JKL2
Well, there was that CIA report I posted earlier. Then there was the UN Commission and our Iraq Survey Group. And Pres Bush’s own Iraq Intelligence Commission, which concluded US prewar estimates were flat-out wrong.
I think Saddam had an effective disinformation campaign (altho it ended with a result – war – he wasn’t expecting) and I think many saw what they wanted to see. But the bottom line is, we blew it.
Which is why I regularly cite this in questioning Obama supporters about their ‘proof’ of an Iranian nuclear weapons program. And why I get nervous when the response is “trust Obama.”
paleo-neo-Carlinist
September 30th, 2010
3:59 pm
md @ 3:00. OK, let me rephrase…. better yet, as stated, war was a given (given the lack of cajones in the House), so Fox News et al simply jumped to the bandwagon and started beating the drums per Bush’s direction. and as far as “politics” goes, even if the House stood up to Bush, who shamelessly tried to grandfather Iraq in with his “global war on terrorism” (9/11, Afghanistan), I’m sure an Executive Order would have been in order. but I commend you on you concise and rational answer.
Tosh.No
September 30th, 2010
4:00 pm
Just had to say this, don’t exactly like Obama, but I don’t like Fox news more. They both act like children and it is bad for this country. That is all.
AmVet
September 30th, 2010
4:00 pm
“But a racist I most certainly am not.”
Riiiight.
As pitiful a non-apology as this:
When asked about the racist they-all-look-alike connotation of a statement like “Have you ever noticed how all newspaper composite pictures of wanted criminals resemble Jesse Jackson?” this professional talker from a family of lawyers pleads total innocence.
“You may interpret it as that, but I, no, honest-to-God, that’s not how I intended it at all. Gee, don’t get me in this one. I am the least racist host you’ll ever find.” Recalling a stint as an “insult-radio” DJ in Pittsburgh, he admits feeling guilty about, for example, telling a black listener he could not understand to “take that bone out of your nose and call me back.”
The Excellence in Bigotry mooch gives cover to you fellow bigots of his everywhere under the guise of conservatism.
Media bias?
September 30th, 2010
4:01 pm
I remember seeing one time an article on hate groups and reading that according to the federal govt there are approximately 3,000 white supremacists and white supremacist “sympathizers” nationwide.
If a bigot like Farrakhan comes to ATL he will sell out the Georgia dome arena downtown with 20,000 people every night that seem to think his particular brand of bigotry and racism is A OKAY.
HDB
September 30th, 2010
4:01 pm
Media bias?
September 30th, 2010
3:51 pm
HDB,
What was the subject with which you disagreed with Limbaugh and what facts did you present to him?
Black people and education; he kept perpetuating the myth that black people didn’t succeed in college! I pointed out the graduation rates of HBCU’s….and at that time, I was in college in a state institution preparing to graduate (Computer Science major!!)!! When I asked him about the numbers of black people in executive positions…..and the lack of mentorship opportunities for black people in Corporate America because of discriminatory practices……and the statement that Affirmative Action is still needed because of the dearth of black management…he cut me off!!
Scorekeeper
September 30th, 2010
3:49 pm
Not quite – you failed to mention the Dallas Morning News, Tampa Tribune, Pioneer-Press (St. Paul), Denver Post, Hartford Courant, Manchester Union-Leader, San Diego Union-Tribune…..
There are more conservative media than you think…..in fact…ALL media is conservative….for ALL media is corporate-owned!!
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
4:01 pm
JKL2,
“The biggest question is still “where did they go?”, because as Clinton and everyone else has said, we know they had them.”
Hans Blix and UNMOVIC might shed some light…
http://www.un.org/Depts/unmovic/documents/S-2003-580.pdf
Paul
September 30th, 2010
4:02 pm
Doggone/GA
It was a while ago, so maybe we are progressing.
As far as “and of course having Obama elected to Pres helps a lot.” That’s one of the things that gets me. Pres Obama has said, time and again, ‘move on’ ‘let it go’ ’stop looking back.’ But seems even his supporters have a difficult time with that.
As far as your growing-up experience, that does indeed shape us. Me, it was a part of southern Cal where it just wasn’t the same as most environments.
stands for decibels
September 30th, 2010
4:04 pm
All that business about how Christian Obama really is, on account of possibly not being properly baptized, upthread, and I forgot to link to this…
http://features.pewforum.org/quiz/us-religious-knowledge/index.php
it’s an abbreviated version of that now-famous religious knowledge quiz, reported earlier this week. Try taking it!
(I, um… managed 15 for 15. Not that I’m bragging, because it’s really not very hard.)
HDB
September 30th, 2010
4:04 pm
Media bias?
September 30th, 2010
4:01 pm
“I remember seeing one time an article on hate groups and reading that according to the federal govt there are approximately 3,000 white supremacists and white supremacist “sympathizers” nationwide.”
Those are what’s KNOWN….willing to believe there’s a LOT more!! Go to any small town….
“If a bigot like Farrakhan comes to ATL he will sell out the Georgia dome arena downtown with 20,000 people every night that seem to think his particular brand of bigotry and racism is A OKAY.”
To many, Farrakhan is NOT a bigot; remember, there IS some semblance of thruth in what he says! Many don’t like it…but there is truth in his words!!
Doggone/GA
September 30th, 2010
4:05 pm
“But seems even his supporters have a difficult time with that.”
Cetainly they do. Sometimes, as harsh as it sounds, you DO have to wait for some people to die before old coping strategies die with them.
“As far as your growing-up experience, that does indeed shape us. Me, it was a part of southern Cal where it just wasn’t the same as most environments.”
Yes, I grew up in Harrisburg, PA and while racism wasn’t overt there it most definitely existed.
Atlantan
September 30th, 2010
4:05 pm
Remember when Jesse said he’d like to cut off Presbo’s nuts – hot mike incident. Guess that doesn’t bother Amvet & Debbie Do Little – Fox News again…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Wf6LnwRZXA&feature=related
What's Important
September 30th, 2010
4:06 pm
And ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, HLN, MSNBC don’t have clearly defined points of view and opinions.
Tosh.No
September 30th, 2010
4:06 pm
Will say this also, nobody makes me watch Fox News, but I do have to do whatever the Pres tells me to. So maybe I am moving to more of dislike for Obama and Fox News. And Little Wayne dude, really? Grow the F up Pres.
md
September 30th, 2010
4:06 pm
“Yep. HAD being the operative word, because WE gave them to them. And they still existed, but had deteriorated into unusability by the time Bush invaded them.”
This argument is kin to religion and man made global warming – neither side can prove anything, yet it continues……
Paul
September 30th, 2010
4:07 pm
Hi josef nix
Good point. I’ll offer the black/white interchange has more to do with the backgrounds of those blogging than anything else.
That, and a remembrance of some of the vitriol that unleashed when someone questioned the state of Hispanic/Black relations, particularly as it dealth with shifting the levers of political power.
@@
September 30th, 2010
4:07 pm
cowboy:
Katrina?
Aren’t left-wingers always saying it conservatives, who live in the past?
Katrina? 1988 Stafford Act puts on-shore states, not the federal government in charge. The feds offered help, it was rejected to Blanco and Nagin. The feds were there four days after Katrina hit.
Deep Horizon Spill? 1990 OPA (Oil Pollution Act) specifies that, in the event of an offshore oil spill, the President shall ensure effective and immediate removal, mitigation, or prevention of a substantial threat to human health and welfare. 12 days passed before Obama showed up to assess the situation.
We could do this all day, but what would be the point, REALLY?
Now ’scuse me. I’m in the process of laying a tile floor.
larry
September 30th, 2010
4:07 pm
For what its worth………………..
I wish that Rush Limbaugh would just go by Limbaugh……………….
Whenever i see Rush, i think of the group
No finer musicians on the planet , in my opinion. And a great group of guys who rocked Atlanta last night.
And i was there.
Lets just call him Limbaugh okay
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
4:08 pm
Doggone/GA,
“Sometimes, as harsh as it sounds, you DO have to wait for some people to die before old coping strategies die with them.”
Still waiting for the homophobes to drop…
Nice Guy
September 30th, 2010
4:08 pm
AmVet – “Riiiight.”
So now you’re calling me a racist? Wow, you are truly delusional from that one track, angry mind of yours. The more you post, the deeper the peak you give me into what really motivates you and who you truly are. It must be hard to get thru each day with your attitude and your outlook on life.
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
4:08 pm
PAUL
We’re progressing in some areas, stalled in others, and backsliding in still others. Again, break with the black white dichotomy.
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
4:10 pm
HDB
Don’t come offering any more defense of Farrakhan than you would of David Duke.
Earth to Many of You
September 30th, 2010
4:11 pm
Here is a view from the real world for many of you:
There are only 3 national politicians with a net positive rating, Bill Clinton, Barack Obama, and Mike Huckabee. Clinton is by far the most popular with a net positive rating of 32%, followed by Obama at 6% and Huckabee at 1%.
Seems there are rational people somewhere in this country.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0910/42878.html
Doggone/GA
September 30th, 2010
4:13 pm
“This argument is kin to religion and man made global warming – neither side can prove anything, yet it continues……”
“The United States exported support for Iraq during the Iran–Iraq war|over $500 million worth of dual use exports]]”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction
md
September 30th, 2010
4:13 pm
“in fact…ALL media is conservative….for ALL media is corporate-owned!!”
Are you actually inferring that all corporations are conservative??
Since when????
David
September 30th, 2010
4:14 pm
Mr. Bookman how typical of you to define the dabate and then to take a side without presenting the full picture. You are correct. Based on this one interview I see nothing wrong with your statement. However this article doesn’t present the whole truth. President Obama has been “fighting” with Fox News since before he was elected. Where his fight becomes dangerous is not that he is fighting. It’s how he is fighting. In the past he has tried to say that Fox News is not a news station. Unable it appears to seperate their news programs from their opnion programs. Sorry Jay I don’t think you are reporting the news I think you are offering opnion. This came to a head in the past year when the White House Tried to exclude Fox News from the Press Pool for a special meeting. Fortunately at the time the other agencies stood up to the bully in the pullpit and would not allow him to do that. Sorry Jay but in this administration we do have to be careful, and they can be a threat to free press.
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
4:14 pm
@@,
“Aren’t left-wingers always saying it conservatives, who live in the past?”
I know how much you adore our (thankfully) former President…I thought you would just like a little perspective.
Katrina = a foretasted and naturally occurring Cat 5 hurricane hitting a major metropolitan city and eventually 1.836 confirmed deaths
Deep Horizon Spill = man made industrial accident with 11 dead
I can see how you would equate them…
Doggone/GA
September 30th, 2010
4:15 pm
“Still waiting for the homophobes to drop…”
I wish I could be as optomistic about that…but the fear that “I” might become gay is deeper and harder to eradicate, because it MIGHT happen. A white man can look at a black man and know that he will never be black…he can’t be so sure about “becoming” (or being) gay.
jm
September 30th, 2010
4:16 pm
josef nix – I think we’re progressing in all respects….
md
September 30th, 2010
4:17 pm
“I’ll offer the black/white interchange has more to do with the backgrounds of those blogging than anything else.”
Of course it does – every one of us was once a newborn with zero knowledge and we are all a product of our environment. By the looks/sounds of things, don’t look for it to change too much anytime soon.
HDB
September 30th, 2010
4:17 pm
Paul
September 30th, 2010
4:07 pm
You and j-nix bring forth an interesting situation! When the black/Hispanic paradigm is brought forth…many don’t understand the problem! It’s quite a simple thing: Communication and trust! Many black people can’t communicate with Hispanics (language barrier)…and neither side trusts the other!(Been in LA to see it…and experience it for myself!) If EITHER side would be able to communicate with the other (English or Spanish)….then that barrier would fall bit by bit!! Although not fluent in Spanish, I can communicate enough to let Hispanics know that I can be trusted!! From that point, I’ve had no problems with my Hispanic contemporaries!!
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
4:17 pm
@ 4.14,
“a foretasted and naturally occurring”
Damn spell check and my lack of attention…forecasted
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
4:18 pm
jm
I don’t. I live with an American Indian and I serve a Latino community.
Soothsayer
September 30th, 2010
4:20 pm
Hi! Everyone. I just wanted to share some video of my camping trip. I hope you enjoy it!
jm
September 30th, 2010
4:20 pm
FOR ALL YOU ANTI-FOX, ANTI MURDOCH, ANTI ANYTHING SLIGHTLY CONSERVATIVE, ANTI EVERYTHING.
READ THIS: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0910/42944.html
HDB
September 30th, 2010
4:20 pm
md September 30th, 2010
4:17 pm
“I’ll offer the black/white interchange has more to do with the backgrounds of those blogging than anything else.”
“Of course it does – every one of us was once a newborn with zero knowledge and we are all a product of our environment. By the looks/sounds of things, don’t look for it to change too much anytime soon.”
Right on point….except for one thing: it IS changing!! What has to be done is to take the level of ANIMUS out of the conversation!! Haven’t you noticed that those who try to keep the tone civil are always shouted down by others?? Civility is a lost art….but in some avenues, it’s coming back!!
md
September 30th, 2010
4:21 pm
“The United States exported support for Iraq during the Iran–Iraq war|over $500 million worth of dual use exports]]”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction”
There is a difference between “not finding” and “proving none existed”. We know the first to be true, clueless on the second.
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
4:22 pm
jm,
““It is nonsense to talk of expelling 12 million people,” said Murdoch, who immigrated to the United States from Australia. “Not only is it impractical, it is cost prohibitive.”
Yeah…that is 12M potential viewers…
jimma
September 30th, 2010
4:23 pm
What media outlet doesn’t have a point of view? Jay, the rag you work for certainly has its point of view and all one has to do is look at what’s covered and not covered. Obama gets a pass from the mainstream media on most issues, and they certainly don’t look too closely at anything his administration does, especially questionable, now do they? Too much invested in our intellectual failure. Fox news was very successful well before Obama came on the scene, and it was the only alternative to the liberal biased written and broadcast media. You conveniently omit the actions of the press hammering GWB on almost every issue, and calling him everything but a human being. I’d venture to say 95% of you Fox haters never watch the hard news on Fox since you spend your time on the Huffington Post, Daily Kos, Media Matters, John Stewart, this blog, etc.. Yes, I watch Fox, read the WSJ, liberal NYT and several other publications. My point of view is that Obama is a lying, thin-skinned, excuse-making bully and failure who doesn’t have the experience, vision or confidence of the American people to lead this county. His incompetent allies in congress are running from his many accomplishments, but thankfully many of them won’t be returning after November!
Del
September 30th, 2010
4:23 pm
“Obama at 6%.” positive approval. Source Politico.
Interesting as the average from major polls have Obama at +45 and -50.6 approval. Politico +46 and -51 approval.
Doggone/GA
September 30th, 2010
4:23 pm
“Civility is a lost art….but in some avenues, it’s coming back!!”
HDB – one of my favorite quotes roughly in line with this is: “Tact is the art of telling someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip” (don’t know who said it though)
jm
September 30th, 2010
4:24 pm
josef nix – why not?
Paulo977
September 30th, 2010
4:24 pm
Real
American…re: illegals who stole this country …as for the current undocumented workers , they pick lettuce , work in chicken factories, pick tomatoes , work on construction sites for low wages and hard work AND they pay into SS BUT don’t collect benefits. So to whom are we to give this country ?
md
September 30th, 2010
4:25 pm
p-n-c,
I’d contend that the UN had a big hand in the mess as well – what good are xxx number of resolutions coming from a world body that has no mechanism to enforce them??
Needs to be abolished.
Pennsylvanian
September 30th, 2010
4:25 pm
jewcowboy @ 4:14 – re: Katrina – I was in New Orleans the day after Katrina passed through, stayed for 3 weeks helping locals restore services. They all confirmed that Nagin and Blanco rebuffed federal offers to help. Recall the people stranded in the Superdome and school buses sitting underwater? That was a Nagin/Blanco failure.
Doggone/GA
September 30th, 2010
4:25 pm
“There is a difference between “not finding” and “proving none existed”. We know the first to be true, clueless on the second”
I never said anything about “never existed” – I said we knew he HAD them, because we gave them to him. And do you really think that if he’d had weapons like that in good working order he wouldn’t have used them when we invaded? Peronally, that’s all the proof I ever needed that they either no longer existed, or were no longer in usable condition.
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
4:26 pm
HDB,
“Civility is a lost art….but in some avenues, it’s coming back!!”
Yeah..enough to make young people take their lives…
http://www.towleroad.com/2010/09/tyler-clementis-story-unfolded-online-but-offers-real-life-lessons.html
http://www.towleroad.com/2010/09/yet-another-gay-teen-lost-to-bullying-suicide-in-minnesota.html
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
4:26 pm
HDB
You make an interesting point and I will be the first to agree on people of good will. I will say this, though, in my experience when it comes to Latinos, if I close my eyes, I can’t distinguish between black and white in the gist of what “they” say. It’s far more complex than the language of expression, but what is being expressed in that language. Even though I am fluent in Spanish and use it as a language of daily discourse, I am still a gringo and there is always that ear open for what it is that I’m saying. That trust is possible, but it takes a dedication that few of us are willing to put into it and often that is much of “shut up and listen.”
Hillbilly Deluxe
September 30th, 2010
4:27 pm
When you get right down to it, the vast majority of people read and listen to, news outlets that reinforce the views they already have. There are exceptions to that but not many. It’s just basic human nature.
The way this if going, if Jay could have figured out a way to include Dick Cheney and Sarah Palin, this thing could’ve hit 1000 posts by suppertime.
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
4:27 pm
Pennsylvanian,
“They all confirmed that Nagin and Blanco rebuffed federal offers to help. ”
Source please.
HDB
September 30th, 2010
4:28 pm
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
4:10 pm
Not defending Farrakhan…..but in any statement, there can be found a modicum of truth!! We don’t have to ACCEPT it…..but it does happen! Even though we call it as we see it…and call a bigot a bigot…….
BTW – you reminded me of my first roommate in the military; he is half-Native American (Sioux) and half-Hispanic!! Many were perplexed as to how a black uy from Georgia could hang with Native/Mex from New Mexico…but we were cool together…and the black guys hung with us constantly! In fact, my roomie started teaching me Spanish when we hung in the barrios in Denver……
jewcowboy
September 30th, 2010
4:29 pm
Hillbilly Deluxe,
“When you get right down to it, the vast majority of people read and listen to, news outlets that reinforce the views they already have. There are exceptions to that but not many. It’s just basic human nature. ”
Bingo!
jm
September 30th, 2010
4:30 pm
More “china messing with the US” stuff. This time they’re screwing with the military on the rare earth metals thing. Great.
http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=a8eYONm3_OIM&pos=10
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
4:31 pm
jm
I’ll go with just the Indian thing first. This is the only group in America which has to “prove” its status with the CDIB card and that one is consistently held onto despite all challenges. Latinos have a harder time finding employment now than they did just a few years ago, never mind their families go back in US territory to the early 1600s in many cases. The Spanish surname and the olive complexion suffice to send them back to a place they were not only a few decades ago. The term of Hispanic on the race-check was established in 1954.
jm
September 30th, 2010
4:32 pm
When will we wake up and realize China has absolutely no interest in playing fair in the international markets, and is clearly happy to screw us up if need be?
Doggone/GA
September 30th, 2010
4:32 pm
“When you get right down to it, the vast majority of people read and listen to, news outlets that reinforce the views they already have.”
I don’t agree. I think they read and listen to NEWS outlets whose writers and/or personalities seem most trustworthy to them. I do think they frequent OPINION writers or personalities, though, that reinforce the view they alread have.
But that’s not necessarily a bad thing. It’s when they allow those opinion personalities to FORM their views that trouble can ensue.
AmVet
September 30th, 2010
4:32 pm
“Wow, you are truly delusional…”
Let’s play back the tape shall we boys and girls?
NC: “Besides, if Rush was a true racists, as so many like claim, then he wouldn’t be the most successful talk radio host, and he surely wouldn’t still be on the air. I don’t care who you are, network bosses, the media, responsible audiences, etc., don’t put up with racism (unless it’s towards the white folks, I should say).”
Then when shown irrefutable racist statements by the blowhard: “The NAACP should have riot rehearsal. They should get a liquor store and practice robberies.”
NG: LOL! Now that is a good quote! Again, same as with Jesse Jackson, the NAACP is full of hate and racism.
So, rather than say, NO there is nothing funny whatsoever about the bigmouth’s bigotry, the supposed non-bigot does what? He thinks it’s humorous.
And proceeds to eat a big bowl of red herring soup by calling Jackson, the NAACP and everybody else under the sun bigots instead.
Why is that, Guy?
Why are you so petrified to call out a right winger for the repulsive, racist, bone-in-the-nose comments he has made over a long period of time? (Even he supposedly felt bad about saying such a disgusting thing. But NOT you.)
You likely think that the outright bigots here like willie are funny too, right?
Your irrational defense of those comments is pretty damning, wouldn’t you agree?
It is no skin off my ___ if you louts hate everybody.
But when you spew that racist bigotry here, I am damn sure gonna call you out for it. I will not give you tacit approval through my silence. I watched as my parent’s generation did, and I will not follow that lead.
So, the good people here can decide for themselves, but I’d say that anybody with an iota of intellectual honesty would agree, you love your right-wing bigots, will defend their every bigoted comment and are arguably one yourself.
Now because you can’t handle the truth, tell me how angry I am…
Paul
September 30th, 2010
4:33 pm
jm
thanks for that link. Sounds like Rep Maxine Waters isn’t going to muddy up her opinion with facts or new information, does it?
SugarHillDawg
September 30th, 2010
4:34 pm
Why do you Leftists fear Fox News so much? You all have ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, MSNBC and EVERY other “mainstream” (left) news organization PLUS Fox is a cable channel so their viewership is even smaller right?Lighten up Lefties! The truth will DESTROY you!!!
josef nix
September 30th, 2010
4:34 pm
HDB
Would you make that same contention about David Duke? Is there a modicum of truth there as well? I’m not being snarky, understand, but would you feel comfortable in going back and replacing Farrakhan with Duke in what you said?