Gallup reports historic poll margin for GOP in Congress
According to the folks at Gallup, Republicans now hold a 10-point lead over Democrats in what’s called the generic ballot for Congress. (Registered voters are asked whether they would be more likely to vote for a Republican or a Democrat, with no mention of actual candidates.)
Gallup reports that the 10-point lead is the biggest it has ever found for Republicans (Democrats had a 32-point lead in 1974, during the Watergate scandal.) The finding adds to evidence that a GOP takeover of the House is likely this year, although as Gallup also cautions, “Democrats moved ahead in Gallup’s generic ballot for several weeks earlier this summer, showing that change is possible between now and Election Day.”
As I’ve noted earlier, the GOP base has made it clear that it has no interest whatsoever in any sort of compromise, and will in fact punish any of its leaders who suggest otherwise. As a result, I think we’re doomed to two of the most divisive, tumultuous years we’ve seen in American politics in a long, long time. It could make the Clinton/Gingrich years seem tame in comparison.
And come 2012, the American people will be asked to render its verdict on that approach.
Politics, like baseball, is a long game played in half-inning increments. And in this particular frame, the Republicans have the bases loaded and nobody out, with the Dems just hoping to limit the damage until their own turn at bat.
UPDATE: Someone in comments asked for an explanation for the 10-point GOP surge. I responded that people are scared and frustrated, and in their fear and frustration they want government to do something. (The demand to be saved even comes from those — in some cases ESPECIALLY from those — who claim they want government out of the economy).
As I’ve written before, though, government even under President Bush didn’t deserve the lion’s share of the blame for getting us into this mess, and nothing government can do under President Obama can turn it around quickly either. But that doesn’t stop people from wanting what they can’t have.
As supportive evidence, take a look at the Yahoo chart below of the Dow Jones Industrial Average over the last three months. More specifically, look at the timing of the Dow high this summer and compare it to the timing of the Democrats’ highest advantage in the generic ballot. It lends credence to the economic explanation; as the news sunk in about a stalled recovery, the GOP poll performance began to improve considerably.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
586 comments Add your comment
dbc
August 31st, 2010
2:19 pm
Democrats have squandered their opportunities at bat. You can only cram so many pieces of un-popular legislation down the voters throat before the voter will take things into his or her hands. Fancy words and hollow promises will not erase the vision of arrogant politicians standing before Town Halls and essentially ignoring the concerns of the American people. The bill has now come due and will be collected in November. Democrats have lost their turn at bat to the voters they ignored. Now it is the politicians who will stand back and watch helplessly as the voters take a swing in the batters box. And I suspect their hits will be well placed and many. Good luck in November.
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
2:21 pm
“You know that most of the foreign auto manufacturers have moved to states in the South because they are right-to-work states meaning they can pay what they choose and have you work in any condition they choose without having to worry about someone complaining.”
That isn’t strictly true. The states still have labor and working condition laws. Basically a “right to work” state has laws making it illegal for you to be required to join in union in order to be hired.
” Isn’t the average beginning wage at many of those manufacturers close to $15 dollars per hour? Wal-Mart starts you at $10 per hour.”
I don’t know about this, but I think it was Toyota (some Japanese car manufacturer anyway) that had to essentially pay their non-union workers competitive pay with the unionized car factories in TN in order to get good workers. So they weren’t unionized, but they might as well have been.
Outhouse GoKart
August 31st, 2010
2:22 pm
Jay, all my comments from my other computer wont seem to post any longer. I guess my IP was banned? Was it something I said? tee hee.
Would you be so kind as to grant an early release?
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:22 pm
jackie.. remember eastern airlines? how bout ford? its unions made concessions to ford.. gm’s did not.. how much have we tossed that way? unfunded pensions.. in the hundreds of billions.. even trillions.. to mostly union employees.. will have to be covered. you want to work at walmart? thats your choice.. i have gone back to school twice to change jobs when i lost one. meanwhile.. an employee in california, has their paycheck garnished by the unions.. no choice there.. some areas it $1500 a year going to the union.. just for the right to work
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:23 pm
ogk@2:22
Its the ghost in the machine, kindly request an exorcism.
RW-(the original)
August 31st, 2010
2:23 pm
Oh gawd not this load of hooey about the 1.2 trillion dollar deficit Obama “inherited”
It includes the TARP money, $700 billion, as if that were never being paid back so if Obama brought it in at 1.4 trillion then he’s on the hook for 200 billion plus any TARP funds that were repaid and even then Obama as a Senator voted for all that spending.
/drive by…unfortunately.
Jay
August 31st, 2010
2:24 pm
And Gordon/Byteme, if I recall correctly the requirement about not adding to the deficit was necessary in order to pass the measure through budget reconciliation. They couldn’t use reconciliation as a means to pass legislation that increased the deficit, only legislation that DECREASED it.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:25 pm
Jackie
It’s almost useless to argue with the anti-union loosers, they are all about sterotyping, not reality.
steve brown
August 31st, 2010
2:25 pm
I used to think liberal was a good thing. Now it connotes a godless and corrupt know-it-all who puts his or hers own beliefs and fads ahead of the Country’s well being. I hope the Dems never have another at bat in my lifetime. I want to know how much the children and multiple children born to a single parent are costing taxpayers. 72% of African-American children are born into single parent homes, the bedrock of liberals and Democrats. But we just pay and pay in many ways and not a whisper from liberal dems. Oh I forgot, these welfare scams must be the fault of Bush and the Conservatives. The audacity and corruption of politicians has no bounds and the media feeds off it like leeches both on the left and right, “full of sound and fury signifying nothing.”
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
2:26 pm
@DogoneGA
When you indicate my post about right-to-work laws and working conditions are not “strictly” true, I will concede this is a point that is open for discussion. However, the link I am posting leaves lots of leeway concerning what can be done in implementing work rules.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-to-work_law
Midori
August 31st, 2010
2:26 pm
Headline: “The Oval Office gets a makeover”
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/
Ah, ……………… not really. That comes in 2012.
will you be ready to hold hands and kiss him then, Scout?
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:27 pm
@mick.. sorry.. i have a spine.. dont need a union to pretend to be my backbone..
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
2:29 pm
“what can be done in implementing work rules.”
“work rules” yes…but they can’t violate the states work LAWS. Just as a small for instance: I must take two 15 minute breaks, one each in each half of my work day. That is a GA law, and my company cannot make me NOT take them.
Outhouse GoKart
August 31st, 2010
2:29 pm
The Imams latest failure…only “non-combat” troops remain in Iraq. LOL…kinda like when we had “advisors” in Vietnam.
Nice try Sucka!
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
2:29 pm
@DoggoneGA
The marketplace may dictate paying a higher wage, but many of the new manufacturing employees do not get immediate benefits with those entry-level wages. I have a family member that has been employed in manufacturing for more than 25 years and he indicates new employees are not given health insurance coverage for 180 days and the starting pay is $13 per hour. Along with that, if you are currently certified in a skilled position and are moved to another position, your pay is cut to the $13 per hour.
buck@gon
August 31st, 2010
2:30 pm
“People are scared and frustrated, and in their fear and frustration they want government to do something. (The demand to be saved even comes from those — in some cases ESPECIALLY from those — who claim they want government out of the economy). ” –Jay Bookman
This is a perfect exposition of the paternal/maternal-istic straw-man excuse for the anti-Democrat sentiment. The economy sucks (and it’s really nobody’s fault), and so we’re all just scared and worried that we’re not going to be taken care of. It’s entirely understandable that people would cling to their ___________________ (Obama said “guns and religion”, but YOU Bookman, seem to be saying, “jobs & security.”) Fine. Let’s assume your obvious moral narcissism is instead a true reality.
First, let’s acknowledge the truth. If the shoe were on the other foot and if this recession weren’t captured by Obama-Pelosi for two years now, Republicans would be getting all the blame. Second, if you had been listening to the tea party AT ALL you would know that personal and financial security is not really a personal concern of tea party members. Yes, for all Americans, it is about the “economy stupid,” but ALL Obama-Pelosi prescriptions for fixing it are so appalling that most tea partiers have solid philosophical and ideological reasons why this is outrageous–fine arguments that have been utterly ignored by you, Cynthia, Mike and the hard-left Atlanta and newspaper establishment.
Most Americans DO NOT want security at any price–that is tax and redistribute. Each O-P diagnosis, indicates that they believe in a whole lot more of it, and we hear the rumblings about the VAT, increases on taxes, and we still know nothing about what the O-care is going to cost us. We don’t know that cap and trade isn’t yet going to be imposed on us unilaterally by the EPA. You ignore these arguments and concerns, and essentially echo the O-sentiment of the term: It’s just those stupid sheep I’m leading and their clinging to their ____________________ (fill in form).
If financial security is, to you Mr. B, is THE reason why the Pres 0 is having a hard time doing anything that doesn’t look stupid to the American people, then there is no hope for you in understanding what is going on in this country, much less for you making a valid case against it.
Harry Callahan
August 31st, 2010
2:30 pm
JohnnyReb, I’ll save you the trouble. I’ve posted this data many times, and I’ve asked Bookman many t imes to explain why the total outstanding debt INCREASED every year if in fact there ever were a real surplus. Still despite the fact that he knows it to be a lie, Bookman continues to crow about the “Clinton surplus”, just like he continues to repeat the lie that the bottom 47% of income earners actually do pay federal income taxes.
09/30/2001 5,807,463,412,200.06
09/30/2000 5,674,178,209,886.86
09/30/1999 5,656,270,901,615.43
09/30/1998 5,526,193,008,897.62
09/30/1997 5,413,146,011,397.34
09/30/1996 5,224,810,939,135.73
09/29/1995 4,973,982,900,709.39
09/30/1994 4,692,749,910,013.32
09/30/1993 4,411,488,883,139.38
09/30/1992 4,064,620,655,521.66
This data is from the U.S. Treasury Dept website, by the way…
Gordon
August 31st, 2010
2:31 pm
Jay,
I appreciate your response, but what you posted were projections. What I was looking for was a yes/no answer to the question of whether the bill has a provision that it MUST BE DEFICIT NEUTRAL BY LAW. You actually quoted directly from the bill during our conversation in January at one point, before it was law, that the provision was in there. Obviously I don’t expect you to remember that as you have written hundreds of columns since then, nor do I believe you deliberately misrepresented what was in the bill. But my objection was that this bill is ultimately not paid for (e.g. the $500 billion being cut from Medicare which is one of the assumptions the CBO used). ByteMe refers to those cuts in his 2:19 but I’ll believe them when I see them.
Thanks again for your response.
Jay
August 31st, 2010
2:32 pm
Gordon, did you see my later addition, about reconciliation?
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
2:33 pm
@Union
The union did make concessions to GM two years past. They agreed to take on the health care cost and remove that liability from the company. The fight the unions were having with GM was pension funding and health care costs for retirees. Ford had exactly the same contract.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:33 pm
union
Question for you: Let’s say you are a plumber, what would you rather have; a union job paying you $22.00 per hour with health and dental benefits or non-union job that pays $10-12 per hour with no benefits? What does that have to do with backbone? It’s all about a decent wage…
The Leg Lamp is a "major award", much like Cynthia Tucker's Pulitzer and Obama's Nobel
August 31st, 2010
2:33 pm
Strong unions:
Teacher’s union – things are in the crapper there. I believe reductions in teachers have some classrooms in Georgia exceeding 30 students with no parapro.
Auto workers’ union – oh yes, the automakers are in great shape.
Steelworkers union – does the US produce steel anymore?
Airline union – another strong union.
“Made in China” = American company with a union.
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
2:33 pm
“but many of the new manufacturing employees do not get immediate benefits with those entry-level wages.”
And that is one of the disadvantages of working in a “right to work” state. You can’t be required to join a union, and that means you don’t also get the help of a union in negotiating better pay and benefits, if the company you seek to work for is not unionized.
It’s a trade-off
The Leg Lamp is a "major award", much like Cynthia Tucker's Pulitzer and Obama's Nobel
August 31st, 2010
2:35 pm
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:33 pm
But if a homebuilder decides to forgo a union plumber for a non-union plumber to control costs, how much will $0 buy you?
Gordon
August 31st, 2010
2:35 pm
Jay,
No sir. I did not. I’m not sure what you are referring to.
Answer man.
August 31st, 2010
2:35 pm
Over and over and over again President Obama has tried to include the republicans in the house and Senate, but all they do is obstruct and say no. If they’re voted back into the majority I guess we get what we deserve….nothing!
The Leg Lamp is a "major award", much like Cynthia Tucker's Pulitzer and Obama's Nobel
August 31st, 2010
2:38 pm
Answer man.
August 31st, 2010
2:35 pm
Sure, Dorothy, keep clicking the heels of your ruby red slippers and repeat your mantra over and over again……
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:39 pm
mick.. i have always managed to get a very decent wage.. its all about making yourself marketable. so.. using yours and jackies example.. lets say you start a business, it grows and prospers.. you pay your employees competitive wages with the area. all of a sudden.. a group called a union comes to you and says if you dont pay more, they are going to shut you down until you do. this group, that had nothing to do with the growth of your business, now dictates to you what are to do?
BS Aplenty
August 31st, 2010
2:39 pm
Obama took over the presidency as every other president before him. You need to quit making excuses for your man, Bookman. Adversity happens and we truly get to see the ‘mettle of the man’ – his ability to LEAD. In this case, Obama has shown his leadership is sadly lacking. He tackles problems like healthcare that don’t need tackling. You know kind of like tackling a guy who doesn’t have the ball. The coach ends up not playing you much and the cheerleaders start laughing at you.
And then you don’t get reelected or your party gets thrown outta office.
A far better analogy (for a genuine leader, anyway) might be Alan Mullaly who took the CEO job at Ford Motor in September 2006. Mullaly engineered a turnaround of a company with enormous losses and a mountain of debt. They are now profitable in spite of a difficult auto market. That is leadership. No excuses.
That’s what the American people expect of their political leaders as well, Mr. Bookman. No excuses.
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
2:40 pm
@DoggoneGA
Last bit about this subject.
Had a family member who was injured on the job and went through the medical process and filed for worker’s compensation. When he returned to work, he was fired for missing too many days. Fight is still ongoing after 4 years.
So, you contention about what the companies can’t do in violation of state law is not factual.
Gordon
August 31st, 2010
2:40 pm
I found it. Your 2:24. I don’t understand what you are saying there.
Does the final legislation that was passed include it or not? Whatever objections I have to any bill (and I have plenty about this one) are greatly assuaged when I know it is at least paid for.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:41 pm
leg
How much will the homeowner have to pay when the job gets botched and has to pay for a recall?
Jay
August 31st, 2010
2:41 pm
Harry, please post the link where those figures can be found.
My own data are from the OMB historical tables, more precisely Table 1.1 at http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/Historicals/ , reporting total federal receipts vs. total federal outlays.
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:42 pm
@jackie.. yeah.. of course you do.. and my girlfriend lives in canada..
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
2:42 pm
“When he returned to work, he was fired for missing too many days. Fight is still ongoing after 4 years.
So, you contention about what the companies can’t do in violation of state law is not factual.”
What state law did that company violate?
JB
August 31st, 2010
2:43 pm
Things that WON’T change between NOW and Nov. 2nd.
1. Unemployment of close to 10%
2. A tape of Pelosi saying ” we’ve got to pass it to know what’s in it”
3. Every American worker being told in the last 60 days by their employer that Health Insurance rates are going through the roof.
4. A President that been on what seems on permanent vacation that can’t smell the smoke of Rome burning.
5. Democrats who continue to say the stimulus wasn’t big enough, but created few jobs but plenty of pork.
6. A president who openly bribed Senators with tax payer money for votes.
7. Increased more National debt in 19 month’s than in the last 20 years.
8. Uses tax payer money without Congressional approval to give money away overseas under the guise of foreign affairs.
9. Gave in to the soviet union for a missile shield WITHOUT GETTING ANYTHING IN RETURN
10. Has insulted every friend we have in the world.
Just a few………This will all be on our minds and in play in the next 60 days. Dem’s are toast.
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
2:45 pm
@DoggoneGA
If you are hurt on the job, the company and the state have a responsibility to you through Workers Compensation Insurance to make you whole and you can not be terminated because the injury was not due to your negligence.
As far as you are concerned, it appears all you want is a job regardless of the conditions and circumstances.
The Leg Lamp is a "major award", much like Cynthia Tucker's Pulitzer and Obama's Nobel
August 31st, 2010
2:46 pm
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:41 pm
Oh, okay. In your world “non union” workers are sure to botch something every time while the “union” worker does it right every time. Yeah, that’s the ticket. Try selling that to the public.
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
2:46 pm
@Union
Please explain your 2:42?
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:46 pm
union
Actually that example works both ways. What do you do if you are a union worker making a decent wage and then a non-union shop starts up paying his workers half that wage with no benefits? Besides, I’m mostly talking about the big commercial jobs versus private homes. At least the union worker has served an apprenticeship and knows how to do the jobs. Non-union, not so much. I’ve seen some plumbers down here that have to use color codes on pvc because they don’t know the correct fittings. So, not all unions and workers are the bad guys.
Jay
August 31st, 2010
2:47 pm
Gordon, the provision is not in the law.
If you recall, the package was passed through the Senate via the reconciliation process, as a way to avoid the filibuster. Under Senate rules, however, reconciliation can ONLY be used to pass bills that according to the CBO will lower the deficit.
That was the source of the requirement. The CBO had to certify that the bills would lower the deficit. The bills were rewritten repeatedly in order to get them to meet CBO’s approval.
Yes, the CBO can only project — that’s all anyone can do at this point. And no projection will be exact. But CBO is recognized as expert and honest, which is all you can hope for.
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:47 pm
.President Obama will spend Labor Day alongside AFL-CIO President Richard Trumka, the union announced Monday.
Obama, Secretary of Labor Hilda Solis and Trumka will all participate in a Labor Day “celebration and rally” in Milwaukee on Monday, an appearance confirmed by the White House this afternoon, which separately announced the president would travel to Wisconsin for the Laborfest.
makes sense to me.. lol
JEM
August 31st, 2010
2:49 pm
Well said, andygrd
August 31st, 2010
1:00 pm
Jay
August 31st, 2010
2:49 pm
In other words, Gordon, the CBO’s best guess is that yes, the legislation is paid for. And with something that is only beginning to be implemented, that’s the best we can do.
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:50 pm
@mick.. of course they are not the bad guys.. (the workers) didnt mean to imply they were and apologies all around if it appeared that way..
to your analogy though.. the shop that pays less, will have less expensive end product and the union shop will be out of business.. unless of course its the govt..
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:50 pm
did the dems pass a budget yet?
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
2:51 pm
“If you are hurt on the job, the company and the state have a responsibility to you through Workers Compensation Insurance to make you whole and you can not be terminated because the injury was not due to your negligence”
I’m no expert on Worker’s Comp…but I seriously doubt that’s true. Check this site:
http://library.findlaw.com/2000/Jul/1/130050.html
“Q. If I am disabled and cannot do my regular job, is my employer required to provide me with a “lifetime” job I can do?
A. No. If you are injured in your employment and your employer determines that you are unable to return and perform the regular duties of your employment, the employer does not have to accept you back as an employee. He will be required to pay you workers’ compensation benefits until you can find new work suitable to your impaired condition at the same or greater salary, but he does not have to accept you back. “
ByteMe
August 31st, 2010
2:51 pm
Jay: the reconciliation process can’t increase the deficit beyond what it already was projected in the earlier passed bill. Not that it can’t increase the deficit if the original bill increased the deficit. It just couldn’t be higher through the reconciliation process. What Gordon was asking was whether there was any specific provision in the bill that the bill had to be “deficit neutral” and I don’t recall seeing any provision like that in the bill and in fact the bill was scored as being a path to reducing the deficit when compared to current trajectory.
And Harry is talking about the total Federal debt issued and you’re talking about revenue vs. outlays in the budget, which are really two different things, since the budget does not include several large off-budget programs, like Social Security.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:52 pm
leg
I see it everyday. Of course there are bad in every profession but plumbing is a skilled trade and I do believe those that have apprenticeship tend to know more and get it right more the first time.
Scout
August 31st, 2010
2:52 pm
Midori !
How have you been ?
“will you be ready to hold hands and kiss him then, Scout?”
Now I explained this to you once but I will do it again.
One (handholding/kiss on the cheek) denotes “friendship” (at least outwardly).
The Other (bowing) denotes subservience (outwardly).
The Vietnamese “men” liked that hand holding stuff too and it drove us Marines crazy!
“The president’s bow to the Saudi King should have surprised no one. It was a submission to their mutual aspiration: a symbolic moment in the transformation from the America that was to the America of Barack Obama’s fancy, a vision that would mark a giant leap forward for the global Islamist project.”
“The Grand Jihad” by Andrew McCarthy
(Mr. McCarthy was the federal prosecutor in the first World Trade Center bombing)
Big difference and I hope you can understand that.
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
2:53 pm
@Union
Your example indicates that you are willing to hire someone off the street to do the work for your house instead of hiring someone who has the training and experience to do the job right the first time, or in case of a problem, come back and rectify any errors made in the earlier job action.
Matti
August 31st, 2010
2:53 pm
Leg Lamp,
I believe you attributed words to Mick that he did not write. Nobody said what you claim at 2:46. The credibility of any reference to “always,” “never,” or “every” is suspect, IMO. A study of American history shows that there were reasons unions developed. Isn’t that the free market at work? Supply and demand? If the reasons these unions were able to rise up and take power had not existed in the first place, then they would not have succeeded, or perhaps would not have endured. As to whether they’re still necessary, there are no unions for what I do, so I can’t comment.
I can say that the fresh food and service at (unionized) Kroger SUCK, though the prices are better on many things. The food and servcie at (non-union) Publix are much better, but prices on some things are absurdly high. Can anyone comment on what it’s like to be an employee of either?
John Birch
August 31st, 2010
2:53 pm
Generically the peeps want change again because the economy makes them unhappy with the theoretical change they got about 19 months ago. But when you look at specific races the picture is different because the stupid party is running some extremist candidates who won’t fare as well. Think 2004 when the Dems should have taken the WH if they’d run anyone more presentable than the cigar store indian fom Massachusetts.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:54 pm
union
I can only speak for my experience. My dad ran a union shop and every job he ran was on time and under budget with practically zero call backs. Those that went with the non-union shops, well break out the chipping hammer. So in the end that old maxim stands true – you get what you pay for,
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:56 pm
@jackie..
actually yes.. bring them in.. train them.. then lose them to other companies that might pay them more. thats how it works in the non union world..
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/brooklyn/dems_find_trouble_in_tore_Qc0lq1lWw8zD9YCWE08dLM
walmart trying to move in.. unions say no.. we dont need jobs here in ny..
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
2:57 pm
@DoggoneGA
Sorry, your posting can not disprove what I know to be factual. The company did not have the right to fire the worker; they did and are continuing to get away with it.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
2:58 pm
union
So you think its better that those making a decent wage should go – backwards toward a lower wage? Convuluted logic, I’d say.
Union
August 31st, 2010
2:59 pm
mick.. i dunno about you.. but in california a union driven economy has netted a several hundred billion dollar plus hole.. i would call that a pretty dang big break..
and good for your dad.. some folks in dc could learn a thing or two from him..
Jay
August 31st, 2010
2:59 pm
ByteMe, I believe you are incorrect, at least regarding the budget numbers I used.
There are on-budget numbers, off-budget numbers and TOTAL numbers. I cited the TOTAL or combined budget numbers.
Jackie
August 31st, 2010
3:00 pm
@Union
It is such a thing as prevailing area wage that usually help in keeping most workers in place. Plus, the way the company deals with their workers is a major factor in worker loyalty.
Union
August 31st, 2010
3:01 pm
some wage is better than no wage.. actually have the manager of a walmart that lives a few houses down.. she started by stocking shelves.. and got promoted.. what a concept.
Gordon
August 31st, 2010
3:01 pm
Jay,
Thanks for your response. I’ve heard the CBO is limited to making projections based on the assumptions of the authors of the bill. One such assumption was that $500 billion would be cut from Medicare. I’m sure they do the best they can with the assumptions they are given, but I’m afraid this entitlement will end up just like the others. I hope I’m wrong.
By the way, you asked Harry Callahan for his link supporting his contention that the debt has risen constantly, including under Clinton. I don’t want to speak for him, but I did find this:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/histdebt/histdebt.htm.
Thanks again for your responses.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
3:01 pm
union
So california’s deficit problems are solely caused by unions? I think not..
Mick
August 31st, 2010
3:03 pm
**some wage is better than no wage**
So, that’s the american future our children have to look forward to? Might as well be a socialist or communist for that matter.
Left wing management
August 31st, 2010
3:04 pm
Blame for “getting us into this mess” lies at the feet of one thing. Capital.
Interesting Observation
August 31st, 2010
3:04 pm
Dave The Man, your point is moot. Ford was not at bankrupt’s door. Oh I know you and others were betting that governmental action would kill GM. Why you wish for the demise of an American Institution like GM that has meant so much for increasing the middle class in this country all because the wrong party took control is foolish. Blind party loyalty means your critical thinking skills are woefully lacking at best. By the way Ronald Reagan bailed out Chrysler. Are you old enough to remember that? Ask mama, daddy or grandma.
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
3:05 pm
“such assumption was that $500 billion would be cut from Medicare”
that is not correct. The cut is to be from the Medicare Advantage progrom, not from regular Medicare.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/aug/14/barack-obama/obama-claims-medicare-benefits-will-not-be-cut-und/
ByteMe
August 31st, 2010
3:05 pm
Jay: what Gordon posted about the numbers is what I’ve seen as well. It’s the total debt issued by the Treasury. And it didn’t decrease under Clinton in any year, although it came VERY close at the end. Now how that number reconciles with your numbers, I’m not clear.
Swede Atlanta
August 31st, 2010
3:05 pm
The GOP will make significant gains this Fall, very possibly enough to take control of the House but unlikely in the Senate.
So where will that leave the American people? I suspect nothing will get done in this Congress as the agendas in the two chambers of Congress are misaligned and neither party is interested in compromise lest they appear weak.
Divided government works when the people’s representatives understand that governance requires compromise in the name of progress on important issues.
Without some action or targeted inaction (yes I mean targeted inaction) by Congress, the economy is likely to sputter along or dip back into recession. The deficit will get even worse as tax revenues continue to slide.
That will create a very interesting scenario for 2012.
Union
August 31st, 2010
3:07 pm
mick.. OMG.. thats two funny.. who do you think demanded all those unfunded pension liabilities? you can retire in ca after 20 years making more in retirement than you did while you were employed (if you scam the system properly).. i am sure all the strikes and threatening to strike had nothing to do with those demands?
Union
August 31st, 2010
3:07 pm
two = too*..
Gordon
August 31st, 2010
3:09 pm
Doggone/GA,
Thanks for the correction, but my point remains. Has it been cut? Will it? Do you believe it will be? I’ll believe it when I see it. I believe tt is one of the assumptions used by the CBO to score the HCR bill. If it is not actually done, those assumptions are meaningless.
Midori
August 31st, 2010
3:09 pm
Imam Obama and his company of keystone kops (democrats) are just handing it over on a silver platter.
Child molester Gocart – see how that works?
Peter
August 31st, 2010
3:10 pm
Folks if you think one party is better than another…..drink more of the Purple Kool aid…..
When Republican’s are in they squander the money on WAR and let the American infrastructure go to heck, and when the Dem’s get in the waste their time on silly stuff.
Neither party will work as a team to HELP AMERICAN’s the two party system is a JOKE !
President’s critic powerful insider, little-known outside the Beltway – CNN
August 31st, 2010
3:11 pm
[...] Take Unprecedented Lead in Poll on Midterm ElectionBloombergWall Street Journal (blog) -Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog) -New York Daily Newsall 374 news [...]
BADA BING
August 31st, 2010
3:12 pm
And Hillary smiles.
Joe
August 31st, 2010
3:13 pm
Actually Jay the Dow started in its decline when the dems took control of Congress. I guess that’s an easy fact to forget since it does smear the party you so eloquently cheerlead for…. Of course we could talk about the many other horrendous things that have happened since the dem erosion of America since 06’ but that’s not what a partisan like you would touch with a ten foot pole….
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
3:13 pm
Gordon – I don’t know the answers. It’s moot to me, because my attitude was that we need health coverage for all. Get that, and we can tweak it in the future if need be. I’m willing to wait until it actually goes into effect to see what the fall-out is.
Midori
August 31st, 2010
3:13 pm
and in 2012, Scout will bow.
and then hold hands.
and ram this tongue down his throat.
and then bow again.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
3:13 pm
union
Is limbaugh worth $15 million a year? Don’t blame the union for negotiated contracts, blame the gov’t entity that approved them.
Joe
August 31st, 2010
3:14 pm
The way it looks not the Republicans will win 65-75 seats in Congress and 10 seats in the Senate. More doom and gloom for the dummycrats… LOL…..
Jay
August 31st, 2010
3:14 pm
Gordon, thanks for the link. I think I understand it now.
The numbers that Harry cites reflect what is called gross federal debt, which includes the money that the federal government owes to itself, for example, to the Social Security Trust Fund.
The numbers I have cited reflect total annual federal outlays vs. total annual federal receipts.
I can see an argument for using either statistic in this kind of discussion.
buck@gon
August 31st, 2010
3:15 pm
We anointed Obama because he was the post-racial, post-divisive, post-separate America’s president. He was going to UNITE us–which is high-minded BS anyway. Turns out he did none of this. He demonized much of America during his campaign, and he has alienated nearly all independents since then (and, we’re learning, the champaigne and brie crowd in New York’s financial circles that voted for him).
What we found is that he is divisive, racial and post-competent.
And Jay Bookman is already talking about republicans compromising? Compromising on what? What did O compromise on?
Oh Boy, it’s going to be a great November!!
Good luck, Jay. Maybe in the new year, you’ll win an argument.
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
3:16 pm
“the two party system is a JOKE !”
so are multi-party systems. There’s no REAL difference. In a two-party system compromises have to be made before elections. In a multi-party system compromises have to be made after elections. Either way, compromises have to be made. And the end result is ALWAYS a two-”party” system…the legislators either vote yes or no.
Union
August 31st, 2010
3:17 pm
mick.. his advertisers think so.. if someone twisted your arm and said they were gonna break it unless you gave them your wallet.. you gonna hang on to that wallet? yes.. the unions did drive those deals.. they get a percentage of the salaries their members get paid..
Paulo977
August 31st, 2010
3:17 pm
flacker@12:19 pm re: hypocrites who yell for government help ONLY when their needs are threatened. Of course…just reference Palin’s indignation that the Obama govt was not involving itself enough in
BADA BING
August 31st, 2010
3:17 pm
No joke here…..one of the girls pictured on the Classmates.com to the right of this blog is an old girlfriend. I am excited and repulsed at the same time.
Scout
August 31st, 2010
3:18 pm
Midori :
Now, now ……….. you’re being a little infantile.
Did you bother to read my 2:52? Would you like to debate any of those issues?
Swede Atlanta
August 31st, 2010
3:18 pm
Joe,
Why do you hate America? Your “LOL” addition to your post indicates that you are a “win at all cost” kind of guy.
Even if the Republicans were to take both houses of Congress (likely in the House but not so likely in the Senate) they will not get much done to promote their agenda. The promotion of tea party candidates may dampen support from Independents who don’t like extremists from the Left or the Right.
Obama will veto any significant policy changes and the Republicans will lack the 2/3 majorities needed to override.
I weep for this country when both parties are more concerned about political victory than representing the people.
Union
August 31st, 2010
3:19 pm
@ doggie…
” And the end result is ALWAYS a two-”party” system…the legislators either vote yes or no.”
nicely put.. shame there is not room for a “maybe” vote
Scout
August 31st, 2010
3:19 pm
buck@gon:
I can’t “find” anyone who will (in person) admit to voting for him.
And ……….. all of those Obama stickers on vehicles are rapidly disappearing.
BADA BING
August 31st, 2010
3:20 pm
Daddy, what does ‘lame duck’ mean?
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
3:20 pm
“they get a percentage of the salaries their members get paid..”
The union in the company I work for doesn’t get a percentage. They have a flat rate membership fee that doesn’t change based on pay earned.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
3:20 pm
union
Ever see clear channels bottom line? Limbaugh’s salary is killing them and because he is so top heavy they have cut staff to the bare bones and are as we speak – not profitable. Hey nice to debate you, we just disagree.
Doggone/GA
August 31st, 2010
3:22 pm
“nicely put.. shame there is not room for a “maybe” vote”
Well, in a way there is…they can not vote at all.
Pennsylvanian
August 31st, 2010
3:22 pm
This election will be very interesting. A lot of working folks have come to the realization that their employers are poised to dump their health care plans if HCR does not get repealed. And Cap & Trade is a job killer.
I’ll say it again. Losing the House majority, and hopefully the Senate majority, and dumping Pelosi and Reid is the only way for President Obama to pull his legacy out of the toilet. Better to finish his one term as a lame duck than Daffy Duck.
Mick
August 31st, 2010
3:22 pm
scout
George w. bush planted a kiss on the cheek of a saudi king and held his hand as they walked – what would you say if obama did that?
Union
August 31st, 2010
3:23 pm
mick.. back at you..
@doggie.. maybe i should have expressed that better.. you are correct it is “dues” based on a flat rate.. the flat rates went up in california over the last few years as the salaries went up…
RJ
August 31st, 2010
3:23 pm
Someone said: “Enjoyed the earlier debate over Keynes. Something those on the left seem to miss- Keynes also said stimulus should be a much smaller percentage of GDP than ours was. But beyond that, results of the stimulus are showing that the supposed multiplier for government stimulus spending is not 1.5 or 2 or whatever Keynes said, but is more like 0.8. In other words, for every dollar the government spends, society gets the benefit of 80 cents. That’s a pretty damn bad investment, and this is the kind of junk that would get a CEO at a private company thrown in jail for fraud.”
Actually, this entire statement is false. First the big drawback to Keynes is that it IN NO WAY talks about the amount of money spent. It only refers to the effect of money that is spent. Second, Keynes never says the multiplier is a specific number. He said the multiplier is based on people’s marginal propensity for consumption.
If you agree with Keynes, you would look at the stimulus and say that the worse than expected impact is the result of people spending less money thereby decreasing the multiplier. Of course if you subscribe to classical theory, you’d say the low multiplier is because Keynes doesn’t work.
Scout
August 31st, 2010
3:25 pm
BADA BING:
Did you see the new “double-wide” trailer den Obama made out of the Oval Office? Real class.