What we don’t talk about when we don’t talk about race
Shirley Sherrod
Even in intimate discussions among friends, it can be hard to talk honestly and in depth about race and racism.
It’s easy to see why. Irrational sentiments that burble up out of the most primitive recesses of our souls — emotions that are then refracted through personal and collective experience — just don’t translate easily into rational thought.
And once such a thought is formed and expressed, it must then be heard and processed by other minds that are grappling with those same challenges, but from a very different perspective.
A lot can go wrong in that translation from one mind to another. And when you scale that conversation up and try to involve millions in the discussion, the number of ways that things can go wildly wrong increase geometrically, particularly when some in the conversation are trying to manipulate it for economic gain or political ambition.
Those dangers have led many to conclude that in public, it is better to avoid the topic of race altogether than to risk misunderstanding and the inflammation of dangerous passions.
I disagree.
As painful as the Shirley Sherrod case has been, for example, I think the country understands itself better today than it did a week ago.
True, some of what we’ve come to understand is not that pleasant. We’ve seen the power of people such as Andrew Breitbart, who released a harshly distorted video depicting Sherrod as a racist. He almost destroyed her career and her life in the process, yet he still refuses to apologize or take responsibility.
Andrew Breitbart
We also saw elements of the American media as well as the Obama administration leap to conclusions on command, like well-trained poodles wearing shock collars, only to sheepishly reverse course once the truth became known.
In the process, though, we also became familiar with the real story of Sherrod, a black woman who was born and raised in the Jim Crow South and who lost her father in a murder supposedly committed by a white neighbor who was never prosecuted.
In the last few days, hundreds of thousands if not millions of Americans have watched the 43-minute videotape in which Sherrod relates her struggle to overcome the resentment and distrust toward white people created by that and other experiences.
It’s a great story, honestly told, and I’d bet that most of those who took the time to watch that tape at one point reflected on their own, perhaps uncompleted journey to that same grace that Sherrod has tried to attain.
That is a good thing. America has never been a static concept. To the contrary, it has existed in a permanent state of transformation politically and economically as well as demographically.
Within the past generation, long-term trends such as immigration, civil rights, gay rights and feminism have transformed the face and power structure of the country. As a result, the ability not just to tolerate but to welcome and celebrate those of other backgrounds has become essential to success.
Until a few years ago, many Americans had talked themselves into thinking that we had put questions of race behind us, that we had already emerged into a post-racial society in which such things no longer matter. And while the election of Barack Obama might have been seen as confirmation of that belief, in fact it has done the opposite. It has brought to the surface elements of racism that many had tried to pretend no longer existed.
It is important to keep that statement in perspective. In uncertain times, strong and sincere disagreement about the nation’s course ahead is inevitable. The political standoff that exists in Washington today would exist even if Obama looked and talked like Mitt Romney, because it is based on honest differences of policy and ideology, not race.
But if we’re honest, we must also acknowledge that race has given some of the opposition to Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration.
These are tough times. It is a lot easier to trust your fellow man when you feel secure in your job and home than when you wake up each morning fearful it all might be snatched away by forces that you cannot comprehend or control. What we’ve seen in the last few days is the danger posed by those who would profit by stoking and feeding those fears, rather than try to calm them.
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542 comments Add your comment
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
7:08 am
well said, Jay
seeitall
July 23rd, 2010
7:13 am
Whites were ready to move forward, but those who make money, garner votes, amass power from racial anomosity were not ready to give it all up.
arnold
July 23rd, 2010
7:15 am
I agree with USinkUK. Very well said. I hope it turns out to be beneficial.
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
7:16 am
But if we’re honest, we must also acknowledge that race has given some of the opposition to Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration.
I’ve given this a fair amount of thought, and I think the key here is understanding that this utterly correct assertion is simultaneously a bit too easy for Democrats to make, and a bit too difficult for Republicans to acknowledge.
If anyone has a workaround, I’m all ears.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
7:17 am
“Until a few years ago, many Americans had talked themselves into thinking that we had put questions of race behind us, that we had already emerged into a post-racial society in which such things no longer matter.”
did we, though?
it seems that we’ve only moved from blatant racism (white robes and lynchings) to the more subtle … for instance, we’ve been having discussions about sentencing inequality (crack vs. cocaine) since the mid-80s. add to that issues such as under-representation in professional sports management as well as the ongoing issues of representation in media, and I don’t know that race is as “behind us” as we would like to think.
Granny Godzilla
July 23rd, 2010
7:18 am
I’m with USinUK and arnold.
Well said Jay.
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
7:24 am
Another thing we don’t talk about when we don’t talk about race (great headline, by the way, Jay):
“Discrimination happens in USDA. . . . And it’s there because the agency never did deal with the people who caused it,” Sherrod said Thursday morning on the “Today” show. “No one lost their job because they discriminated against black farmers, Hispanic farmers, Native American farmers, women farmers. . . . Those individuals . . . some have retired, but many of them are still there.”
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
7:28 am
And yet another thing we don’t talk about when we don’t talk about race is the ongoing assertion by some on the right, and it is a nasty, unfounded, race-baiting assertion, that “for 20 years Barack Obama attended a church that promoted race hatred.”
I wish that Trinity United Church of Christ could have a nickel for every time it’s been slimed like that.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
7:28 am
dB – my first thought was that I talk about food and cooking when I’m not talking abut race (especially now that the World Cup is over) … but I don’t think that’s what Jay meant …
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
7:34 am
I don’t think that’s what Jay meant …
No. If that’s what he’d meant, the headline would read “How we fill the nearly-endless rhetorical void when we don’t talk about race.”
No, this is about those topics we decide just aren’t worth dredging up. You think, for example, I’m looking forward to the inevitable poster who’ll hype some stupid thing Rev. Wright said and use that to back up their ridiculous assertions about the entirety of the Obama’s experience at TUCC?
I really won’t be able to hang ’round much longer to see it through (much pressing stuff awaits me at Top Seekret Food-on-FamblyCo), which makes me realize it’ll be more or less for naught if no other rational individual picks up that particular ball and runs with it.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
7:37 am
dB – “You think, for example, I’m looking forward to the inevitable poster who’ll hype some stupid thing Rev. Wright”
about as much as I look forward to the inevitable CRA-bomb whenever we talk about housing.
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
7:43 am
“But if we’re honest, we must also acknowledge that race has given some of the opposition to Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration.”
And if we’re TRULY honest, we must also acknowledge that race has given some of the supporters of Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration.
Are any of you Obama supporters prepared to admit as much?
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
7:44 am
OMG … is that the lovely and talented BRU-DOG??? Haven’t seen you in WEEKS (and I’ve been asking about you!)
you doing okay?
TaxPayer
July 23rd, 2010
7:48 am
How many on the right have denounced Breitbart for his actions.
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
7:48 am
Special hello to USinUK, and thanks again for reacquainting me with Nick Drake. Lately, the “Cello Song” has been well reflecting my mood:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1YsFgDaEeo
So forget this cruel world
Where I belong
I’ll just sit and wait
And sing my song.
And if one day you should see me in the crowd
Lend a hand and lift me
To your place in the cloud.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
7:50 am
I would admit as much Bruno (and welcome back.)
I’d argue that there’s a difference in scale, but yes, the phenomenon does cut both ways.
As Kevin Drum pointed out earlier, “There have been three big conservative outrages that have choked the airwaves over the past couple of weeks. #1 was about a bunch of scary black men, the New Black Panther Party. #2 was about a bunch of scary Muslims who want to build a triumphal mosque on the sacred soil of Ground Zero. #3 was about a vindictive black woman who works for the government and screws the white people she deals with. The running theme here is not just a coincidence.”
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
7:52 am
Taxpayer, a number have done so, or at least have urged him to apologize (he refuses.)
The real question is what price he will pay, if any, within the conservative movement itself.
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
7:53 am
Are any of you Obama supporters prepared to admit as much?
(raising hand) Sure. I think I actually just did, kinda, in my post @ 7.16.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
7:53 am
“Are any of you Obama supporters prepared to admit as much?”
I’d be willing to admit it…if YOU would be willing to admit that it wouldn’t be either needed or used if Jay’s statement was not needed either.
Or, to use my own words, if race wasn’t brought up either implicitely or explicitely, by the “opposition” we wouldn’t see it being brought up by the “supporters” either.
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
7:55 am
“you doing okay?”
Well, I quit my job last week, so it’s a little scary at the minute. I’m digging deep to believe that there’s a place in this world for me, a place of goodness and light.
A love song by Nick dedicated to you, beautiful:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtyLL_BE-oo&feature=related
I never felt magic crazy as this
I never saw moons knew the meaning of the sea
I never held emotion in the palm of my hand
Or felt sweet breezes in the top of a tree
But now you’re here
Bright in my northern sky.
It’s been a long time that I’m waiting
Been a long time that I’m blown
been a long time that I’ve wandered
Through the people I have known
Oh, if you would and you could
Straighten my new mind’s eye.
Jack
July 23rd, 2010
7:56 am
If there’s a double standard, its promoters are writers like Bookman.
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
7:56 am
One of the narratives that have emerged among Breitbart and his apologists is that they have provided exculpatory evidence that ABSOLUTELY shows that Congressman Lewis and others lied when they said that some people attending a tea party rally called them the ‘n’ word and/or spat upon them.
Among John King and others I did not see any pushback to this claim.
Personally, I believe Congressman Lewis has a lot more credibility than either Erick Erickson or Breitbart…
Is there any truth to these ABSOLUTE statements or is their claim that since we do not have video evidence that it did not happen?
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
7:58 am
Off Topic #1:
I assume you guys know about Zombie Nick Drake hawking the glories of AT&T world domination, right?
http://stereogum.com/369262/att-discovers-nick-drake/franchises/commercial-appeal/
TaxPayer
July 23rd, 2010
7:58 am
What price with Breitbart pay! Better yet, I wonder what price some in the media (of course I’m thinking of FOX when I say that) are willing to pay him. After all, Limbaugh, Hannity, et al, are getting old and they will need suitable replacements.
Gale
July 23rd, 2010
7:59 am
Well written, Jay. I have been considering my own attitudes about race lately, in light of this latest flair-up. I find myself much more negative about hispanics than blacks. I find this interesting because there is no real oppressive history between whites and hispanics that I am aware of. We have no reason to dislike each other racially. I think my attitudes are primarily because of the people I come into contact with. Blacks I live near and work with every day are fine people. When I look at them or talk to them, I do see a person of color. I do not mean to imply I am color blind. By contrast, there are very few hispanics in my sphere. I don’t come in contact with them so I haven’t been able to form a personal opinion. Because of that, perhaps, the negative press does effect my attitudes toward them as a group. Individually, I hope I could still give each person respect. But even with that, I know that respect is not the same thing as considering them equals. The more we know about people, the more bias and bigotry will dissolve.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:00 am
TaxPayer – “How many on the right have denounced Breitbart for his actions”
flat-out denounced? not many.
Jonah Goldberg: “I think she’s owed apologies from pretty much everyone, including my good friend Andrew Breitbart. I generally think Andrew is on the side of the angels and a great champion of the cause. He says he received the video in its edited form and I believe him. But the relevant question is, Would he have done the same thing over again if he had seen the full video from the outset? I’d like to think he wouldn’t have.”
Erik Erikson “Andrew Breitbart promised he would do to the left what the left has been doing to the right for years. He is gathering quite the collection of leftwing scalps and will forever warm the hearts of the right for the ACORN takedown alone. I’m glad he is on our side. That said, I think Shirley Sherrod has been unfairly characterized as a racist.”
(he goes on to say what IS disturbing is the White House’s reaction)
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
8:01 am
“I would admit as much Bruno (and welcome back.)”
Thank you for the warm greeting, Jay. I’m asking my friends to pray for me right now.
“I’d argue that there’s a difference in scale, but yes, the phenomenon does cut both ways.”
I guess I can’t argue much about the “difference in scale”, although such a perception is usually in the eye of the beholder. If it makes you feel any better, there are times when I’m not proud of my fellow conservatives due to the natural human inclination to want to appeal to the lowest common denominator. Unfortunately, as most politicians who take the “high road” find out, the “low road” gathers more votes.
I’d argue that there’s a difference in scale, but yes, the phenomenon does cut both ways.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:02 am
Bruno – 7:55 – that’s my all-time FAVORITE Nick Drake!! awwww. thanks, boo!
meanwhile … wishing you MUCH LUCK in finding something new that makes you happy. Try not to be afraid (hard, I know – I’ve been there, too) – and look at this as an opportunity.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
8:02 am
“(he goes on to say what IS disturbing is the White House’s reaction)”
It looks like it’s going to get better…now the “question” is: was this a White House conspiracy?
http://mediamatters.org/research/201007220054
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
8:04 am
since we do not have video evidence that it did not happen?
Sigh. When the debate has degenerated to an actual question of whether you trust John Lewis when he says someone called him a “n!gg3r”–remember, John Lewis is the same man John McCain cited during the 2008 presidential forum at Rick Warren’s church, as one of three living moral beacons in his life–we are perhaps, as Shakespeare might put it, well and truly FUBAR.
Gotta run. Have fun, kids.
Normal
July 23rd, 2010
8:06 am
Good Friday morning y’all…is it music yet?
When I was in ‘Nam and after Bobby and Martin had been killed, black members of my unit called for a meeting. As a preamble, when Martin had been killed, to them it was a black versus white thing. A black man was killed by a white man because he was getting too powerful and was presenting a message that couldn’t be denied. I won’t detail the months between the assassinations but at the time I felt my unit was falling apart at the worst time of the war, and didn’t know who I could trust to watch my back.
After Bobby died, we all realized that this wasn’t a “black vs white” thing, it was a “us against them” thing (for lack of a better phrase). Good fundimental changes were trying to take place in our country and it frightened some enough to kill to stop it.
Anyway, the question was raised as to how do we, as a unit, go back to where we were before. To me, and I said so, that while the rift was bad, it opened our eyes to our differences, and bottom line, we still wanted to go home. To do that we had to trust each other again. I tried to say, rather poorly at the time, that each one of us had to be measured on how we did our duty. In the bush there was no race. You looked at the man beside you and you measured his heart. By the way, none of my unit lacked heart.
People aren’t often put into those situations that force realizations that knock down the preconceptions your environment taught you, but when they do, to me at least, you learn just how …I don’t know…small race issues really are.
Bottom line, you can’t not talk about race. Constant reminders that we are all the same in our Higher Power’s eyes is needed. School work shops, church meetings, town hall meetings…what ever it takes.
Teach the children so that when their turn comes, they will approach the world knowing that race does not matter. We are all the Human Race.
Ok, so now I’m taking my soap box and going home.
Normal
July 23rd, 2010
8:10 am
BTW, when I started “typing” my above there were only four posters. I really need to learn how to type…
Jacob
July 23rd, 2010
8:10 am
White people ruined America.
http://whyamericanssuck.blogspot.com/2010/07/1-white-people.html
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:12 am
“It looks like it’s going to get better…now the “question” is: was this a White House conspiracy?”
I read that Glenn Beck actually outdid himself on nuttiness last night …
oy.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
8:14 am
Gale, I appreciate the honesty of your comments. Take a look at last night’s post about the desegregation of the military in the ’40s, and in particular the survey taken of white commanders of black combat troops and how their perceptions changed with greater exposure and familiarity.
It echoes what you’re saying here.
Gale
July 23rd, 2010
8:16 am
Good story, Normal. I believe it is our mistakes that teach us best. When we understand why an attitude is wrong, we are better able to overcome and learn to be better people. That was the gist of Sherrod’s story.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:16 am
G’morning, Normal!! how’s your sister?? my surrogate mom is currently in the N’side Bone Marrow Transplant unit, having finished a round of chemo for leukemia. if you could keep her in your thoughts, that’d mean the world
“Good fundimental changes were trying to take place in our country and it frightened some enough to kill to stop it.”
’twas ever thus. anyone who challenges power or the status quo is always regarded as a heretic and one who must be stopped from changing Life as We Know It.
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
8:18 am
“After Bobby died, we all realized that this wasn’t a “black vs white” thing, it was a “us against them” thing (for lack of a better phrase).”
Just my 2 cents, Normal, but I think it all goes back to our human nature of being pack animals. Due our technological sophistication, it’s often easy to forget that we still are animals, subject to the same instincts/reactions that the “lower” animals experience. In that way, we perceive others as either being “in” the group, or “out of” the group. The only difference I find among people is how large their groups are.
“Good Friday morning y’all…is it music yet?”
You know when I’m around, the music’s going to be playing. Much better than TV, IMO…….
Here’s one more that I’ve been saving for USinUK, “Inside My Love” by Minnie Riperton:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1aMSZp_WHc
Such a beautiful, sexy song. Minnie was everything that Mariah Carey tries to be, but so much better, so much more authentic.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:20 am
okay, my sweet “between gigs” friend … I told you weeks ago to go get Corinne Bailey Rae … this is why
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IoNli84m1mQ
(btw … don’t know about prayers, but you know I’m keeping you in my thoughts until you post that you’ve gotten THE job you’ve been hoping for!!)
Gale
July 23rd, 2010
8:22 am
Jay, I was reading last night’s posts with my breakfast. Perhaps that is part of my thoughts on this issue. Certainly, some of the same could be said for attitudes about gays. The difference is that gays are not easily identified. If we were pink, we could claim the same issues.
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
8:22 am
A great article until:
But if we’re honest, we must also acknowledge that race has given some of the opposition to Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration.
Let’s face a reality the people who don’t like him because he is black did not like him because he was black in November 2008.
He is losing moderates and independents.
I honestly can’t tell the difference between the mean spirited attacks on Bush and Republicans or Obama and Democrats. There is a allot of malice in the left and the right often encouraged by the politicians and their apologist. They are both over the top but in a country with 300 million people I am sure that is going to happen. However, it is sad when these people find their way into the traditional mainstream media.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:23 am
Bruno – even better:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/video/2010/mar/25/corinne-bailey-rae-are-you-here
ty webb
July 23rd, 2010
8:24 am
Sorry, he doesn’t need to apologize. Nothing was done to her by breitbart that isn’t done to countless other public officials(and many private citizens) everyday. Not saying it’s right, but her case is ahardly a special one. In an odd way, it shows just how “equal” we’ve become. We have finally reached the point when everyone can be falsely called a racist.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:25 am
moderate – I don’t think Jay is saying that there was an increase in the number of people who didn’t like him because he is black – he’s just saying that there are elements in the opposition who don’t like him for that reason.
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/07/conservative_activist_forwards_racist_pic_showing.php?ref=fpa
larry
July 23rd, 2010
8:25 am
There are counties in this state where there are no African-Americans. When i went to school ,in a certain un-named North Georgia county, there were no African-Americans. When i went to college, the number of African-Americans at this un-named two-year school was twelve. At the time, i didnt know why. Until after i dropped out of college, i found out one of my friends wore the sheets and hoods. We were not friends after that.
The point is ……..although i had no say in where i was raised, i was and am a lesser person because what happened above. To me , race does not matter as the why i judge a person. It never has.
Normal
July 23rd, 2010
8:26 am
USinUK,
My little sister is doing good…bald but good. I’m going down to see her and Mom this evening. Feels like an Italian night…
As for your suggogate mom, I’ll send good vibes her way and when I’m out
wood walking, I’ll ask Mother Earth to lend a hand. We will help her make lemonade anyway we can…
Gale
July 23rd, 2010
8:29 am
Interesting thoughts about group behavior, Bruno. I have often thought that human behavior is more effected by lower, primitive mind processes than we like to pretend. Pheromones, air pressure, things like that, effect us at a subconscious level. These, I think, are the basis of deja vu experiences, for example, or the reason we may immediately like or dislike someone for no identifiable reason.
USinUK, I have been reading about high success rates with bone marrow transplants in treating leukemia.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:29 am
Normal – garlic bread and chianti cures what ails ya!
thanks for the good vibes
SOUTHERN ATL
July 23rd, 2010
8:30 am
This is an excellent article. Race relations can be defined by two words;
Attitude and Tolerance!
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
8:30 am
“I honestly can’t tell the difference between the mean spirited attacks on Bush and Republicans or Obama and Democrats.”
One other enduring truth that I’ve discovered, Moderate Line, is that the splinter in our neighbor’s eye always looks so much larger than the plank in our own eyes. I know a lot of conservatives were deeply offended by the Left during the Bush years. It should always be ok to criticize policy, but the personal attacks got out of control. I’m sure it’s just my biased, conservative opinion, but the attacks on Obama seem to be more about policy to me.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:31 am
Gale – well, they say they caught it very early, so she underwent an intense 5 days of chemo (no bone marrow transplant), and is now just hanging out in the ward for the next 3 weeks so that she doesn’t get an infection. after that, they’ll go back and see how she’s doing.
larry
July 23rd, 2010
8:34 am
Southern ATL @ 8:30……….AGREED
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:38 am
Bruno – “It should always be ok to criticize policy, but the personal attacks got out of control. I’m sure it’s just my biased, conservative opinion, but the attacks on Obama seem to be more about policy to me.”
and the “attacks” on Bush weren’t about wiretapping, outing of CIA agents, a war based on cherry-picked intel, the economy, what he did or didn’t do before 9/11, etc?? you make it sound like any critics were just being peevish and criticizing his cowboy boots.
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
8:38 am
“I told you weeks ago to go get Corinne Bailey Rae … this is why”
Very nice, USinUK. We seem to enjoy the same groove…….
Sorry to hear about the fight with cancer that Normal’s sis and USinUK’s surrogate mom are going through. There’s got to be a better way of checking out of this place than that. If any of you remember, my featured artist this AM, Minnie Riperton also died from cancer at a young age. Her biggest concern about it was that she wouldn’t be around to see her children grow up. When she was in the terminal stages of the disease, she went back into the recording studio one last time, and came out with “Back Down Memory Lane”:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0z7MaFE-uRQ&feature=related
If you listen carefully at the end, you can hear the pleading in her voice. Very powerful, raw human emotion…..
JP
July 23rd, 2010
8:38 am
BRUNO – good question. I am an Obama supporter and I will admit that I sometimes think about race whenever Obama gets slammed by the right. And that is wrong for me to think like that. I think there will always be people that will not like Obama b/c he is black. Just as there were folks that didn’t like Bush b/c he was white. Both sides are wrong. But I hope and believe that most people who don’t like Obama is b/c of his policies – and that’s OK.
schrutebeets
July 23rd, 2010
8:39 am
How must it feel to know that, whenever you sit down at the keyboard to produce a column, you will be expressing collective spin as personal conviction.
Breitbart’s the bad guy? Breitbart is who he is…a counter to the thousands of Democrats who have signed on to the National Democratic Party website’s call-to-arms to get dirt on Republican and Tea Party principals on tape.
Doesn’t bother you that the Sherrod speech was at a NAACP function…yet it was at the NAACP’s urging that the Obama Administration executed her termination?
And you have the nerve to say that you DISAGREE that “it is better to avoid the topic of race altogether than to risk misunderstanding and the inflammation of dangerous passions?”
I don’t recall you having a lot to say during the disgraceful, self-imposed media embargo of the racially-charged New Black Panther-Department of Justice debacle.
The fact that a respected DOJ attorney resigned in order to testify before the Civil Rights Commission that DOJ managers would not prosecute blacks charged with violations of whites’ voting rights wasn’t newsworthy?
How must it feel?
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
8:39 am
There can never be any HONEST dialog on “racism” as long as idiots like Joseph Lowery make the claim that a black person can’t be a racist. Many like to bandy the “I have a dream” speech about but then they seem to forget a line or two of it:
“But there is something that I must say to my people who stand on the warm threshold which leads into the palace of justice. In the process of gaining our rightful place we must not be guilty of wrongful deeds. Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for freedom by drinking from the cup of bitterness and hatred.”
Living in Dekalb County, I experience or witness blatant racism on almost a daily basis. It is NOT limited to white people. Those who pretend so are fools.
Normal
July 23rd, 2010
8:40 am
I heard he wore knee hose under his cowboy boots…
EA
July 23rd, 2010
8:40 am
Racial prejudice goes both ways. That is what is so often left out the discussion of race. The Shirley Sherrod case highlighted that fact. I completely sympathize with racial prejudice, but it important to recognize that both sides are guility.
As far as Breibart, why does the right have to stand up and condemn this man? We did not hear that same argument about Reverand Wright on the left. It is best to leave these type of men alone and refuse comment. Their actions speak for themselves.
Bubba Bob
July 23rd, 2010
8:40 am
Another issue with race is that we can’t trust the media….or at least the right cannot trust the media.
This is from the Journolist situation:
“In one instance, Spencer Ackerman of the Washington Independent urged his colleagues to deflect attention from Obama’s relationship with Wright by changing the subject. Pick one of Obama’s conservative critics, Ackerman wrote, “Fred Barnes, Karl Rove, who cares — and call them racists.”
So, instead of having a real discussion on the issues they decided to pick someone and accuse them of being racist. For no other reason than to help Obama. And this was the media no less. Every one of them.
That’s why I don’t believe anything about race any more unless it’s on tape and I get to see the full, unedited version.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
8:40 am
Jay, Have to agree with most that this to me is one of your better articles, only a couple a small points that I disagree on though…
1. “Abunch of scary black men, the New Black Panther Party..look, there is wrong doing on both sides of the isle, but the right(repub/conserv)..have every right to be concerned with those nut jobs.When is the last time you heard a repub/conserv say lets kill all the black people and there babies…or, praise Bin Laden..If the Left and this admin. would just publicly denouce these idiots, I think the right would feel alot better..
2..I do believe that Brietbart should apoligize, but so should CNN for the great edit job they did about the “crazy teabagger” with an assault rifle, who turned turned out to be a black man..they conveintly left that out..
Bottom Line if the Right and Left would both hold there sides accountably, I think this country would start moving in the right direction
Gale
July 23rd, 2010
8:41 am
USinUK, I’ll hope for the best, but keep a close watch. Infections acquired ‘in’ the hospital are worse than what we are exposed to on the outside. But given the facility, I will bet they are especially careful about infections. I wish her well.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
8:42 am
“I’m sure it’s just my biased, conservative opinion, but the attacks on Obama seem to be more about policy to me.”
And I don’t think you can make a sweeping statement like that, and be accurate, about either Bush OR Obama.
I, for one, don’t like personal attacks on any politician…there’s enough to attack about their political attitudes and policy decisions. But, just off-hand, I can’t recall many – if any – attacks on Bush that used “race relations” code words for him, as have been used repeatedly against Obama.
How often do you remember Bush being described as “uppity” or “arrogant”? And the people who DO use those words, and others like them, against Obama…can deny it all they want, most of us DO know what they are code for.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:44 am
Bruno – 8:38 – that’s why the Eva Cassidy cover of “Imagine” always makes me cry … it’s heartbreaking that she died so young!
Gale – the unit she’s in, you evidently get the full “Silkwood” treatment if you want to visit … me, I think they obviously don’t know this woman – she keeps her home clean enough to do surgery in!
joe
July 23rd, 2010
8:45 am
Seems to me there are still elements of racism out there, but not as much as say 30 years ago. Time seems to lessen the haters out there…as they die off. Younger people don’t seem to carry those feelings around quite as much as back in the day. But, when politics enter this equation, that is a whole other level.
As a white conservative thinking man, part of me was glad we were able to elect a black president. However, I think we just elected the wrong black president because his policies are not a good fit for our country in my opinion. Plus, the way he rams spending bills down our throats is another issue altogether.
Had we elected Colin Powell or Condi Rice or Herman Cain…I would be way more inclined to be happy with the direction of our country and there are many many more who share the same outlook. That is why I believe Nov will be very rough for the Dems and make it hard for BO to do anything in the next two years that would get him re-elected. I just don’t see that happening.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:45 am
Doggone – “How often do you remember Bush being described as “uppity” or “arrogant”?”
no, but in all fairness, I and many others called him “intelligence-challenged” … or, my favorite nickname, C+ Augustus.
Bubba Bob
July 23rd, 2010
8:46 am
Doggone,
Uppity and arrogant are code words for race? Never heard that one.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
8:46 am
I found amusing the uproar that ensued when t-shirts where printed with the likeness of President Obama and Curious George. Oh the “racisism.” WHere was the same uproar when President Bush was depicted as Curious George? http://ezineblog.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/bush-monkey.gif T
The double standard HAS to stop for there to be any meaningful progress.
mike
July 23rd, 2010
8:46 am
First of all, we do talk about race. All the time and to little positive result.
Second of all, perhaps Jay and the rest of those on the left who are suddenly extolling the virtues of not making baseless accusations of racism based on cherry-picked clips from hyper-partisan media might take a second to realize that they have been doing just that for months now.
Nah, that would never happen. That would require both intellectual honesty and self-awareness, things that Jay and his crowd do not posses.
Guess what, race baiters? You were sickened by your own poison. You deserve it too.
Gale
July 23rd, 2010
8:47 am
USinUK, I guess I would avoid the Silkwood treatment and visit from outside the bubble. It sounds like they have learned the lesson well there.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
8:47 am
“Not saying it’s right, but her case is ahardly a special one”
So…because it’s not “special” he owes her no apology for nearly ruining her reputation, for losing her job, and for spreading LIES about her? Sorry, can’t agree with that. He not only owes her an apology, if this was truly a just world, he would owe her a large monetary settlement as well…large enough to make him think more than twice about doing the same thing to someone else.
mike
July 23rd, 2010
8:47 am
Fred –
That’s nothing. Start passing this link around:
http://www.zombietime.com/hall_of_shame/
mike
July 23rd, 2010
8:48 am
Nice to see that USinUK is hard at work as usual. LOL
jt
July 23rd, 2010
8:48 am
You heard it here first. (I just made it up).
Federo-sexual——–A person who is continually screwed by the federal government but who also continually votes to increase the federal government’s size and negative influence. See Democrat or Isackson supporter.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:48 am
Bubba – arrogant, maybe / maybe not … but uppity, definitely.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:49 am
nice to see mike has nothing of substance to say and so reverts to personal jabs, as usual.
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
8:51 am
“and the “attacks” on Bush weren’t about wiretapping, outing of CIA agents, a war based on cherry-picked intel, the economy, what he did or didn’t do before 9/11, etc?? you make it sound like any critics were just being peevish and criticizing his cowboy boots.”
Certainly, a lot of the criticism of Bush was legitimate, and came from both sides of the aisle. If you recall, I have been vehemently opposed to the Patriot Act from the gitgo, both under Bush and now under Obama. Per the “outing” of Valerie Plame, that was a bit overblown by the Left in relation to the reality of the situation. Per the “cherry-picked intel”, Bush’s assessment of the danger of Iraq was little different from that of Bill Clinton (no-fly zones, anyone?). Per the economy, it was the Democratic leaders in control of Congress from 2007-2008 who continued to whistle past the grave yard despite clear calls to action from the Republicans.
All of those items are legitimate criticisms. And if that’s all I ever heard, I would have great respect for the Left. But it went way beyond that, and you know it. Don’t make me call on the spirit of TOJ/NIF to bring up all the examples of the comparisons of Bush to Hitler.
Don't forget
July 23rd, 2010
8:51 am
The biggest consequence for Breitbart is his loss of relative anonymity. There will be significant skepticism for anything he produces if it’s been edited in any way. He’s been shown to have the capability to create an appearance that is totally misleading. In other words, he’s lost any credibility he may have once had.
Gordon
July 23rd, 2010
8:51 am
First of all, I agree with what Jay said and think this was well written.
The point I want to make is that there is a habit among the right and the left of taking the most extreme people from the other side and trying to portray them as typical. They are not. I am a conservative. I favor limited government. Breitbart in no way, shape, or form represents my views when he does things like he did here, just as Jeremiah Wright or some other extreme leftist represents Jay or others who are not as conservative as I am. I am weary of the extremes getting so much attention and causing division.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
8:51 am
Bubba Bob, there are MANY code words you have never heard of. The list changes daily. You can’t keep up with it. I don’t even try. I use the same words for everyone and if someone doesn’t like it then they can kiss my hairy butt. LOL I guess I was a racist on last night’s blog when i called myself arrogant.
You see Bubba Bob, it’s a not so clever ploy that some folks use to try to “win” an argument. WHen they label every word you use as “racist” then they don’t have to do any real thinking on the content of what you are saying. It’s a little control game people use.
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
8:51 am
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:25 am
moderate – I don’t think Jay is saying that there was an increase in the number of people who didn’t like him because he is black – he’s just saying that there are elements in the opposition who don’t like him for that reason.
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/07/conservative_activist_forwards_racist_pic_showing.php?ref=fpa
++++++++++++
I didn’t say Jay said “Jay is saying that there was an increase in the number of people who didn’t like him because he is black.” I also acknowledge inderectly that some people dislike Obama because he was black. The numbers of those people did not increase since the election. However, how many black people voted for McCain or any Republican.
I am saying his problem is moderates and independents. He is losing them.
Thanks for the lecturer on what Jay is saying. I would expect the same consideration.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
8:51 am
“If you listen carefully at the end, you can hear the pleading in her voice. Very powerful, raw human emotion”
I hear the same thing in “Who wants to live forever” by Queen. Freddie Mercury knew he was dying of AIDS when he recorded that, and you can hear it in his voice.
Bubba Bob
July 23rd, 2010
8:53 am
USink,
‘Uppity’? Been using that word forever and have never once heard it used in the context of race. Just goes to show that one man’s regular word is another man’s racism.
T-Town
July 23rd, 2010
8:53 am
Progress will be made in race relations when we stop thinking of others, who do not share the same characteristics, as the enemy and start thinking of them as our friends from different cultures. Until we do, fear of others unlike ourselves will rule our behavior.
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
8:54 am
I did a search of comparing Hitler to Bush, Obama and Clinton.
Obama 7.5 mil
Bush 5.9 mil
Clinton 3.5 mil
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
8:54 am
Have to disagree Doggone, while I agree he should apoligize, It’s the White House and Dept of Agrc. that is responsible…Had they done what they were suppose to, launch an investigation first, she would have kept her job, Brietbart would have been dismissed, and this would have been a one day story…They didnt learn there lesson from last year!
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
8:54 am
To Hell with obama and to hell with his minions and followers. (Just checking in, until this idiot sherrod is not the topic).
Scout
July 23rd, 2010
8:57 am
Jay:
Two comments …………….
1) Why can’t we start by using the correct words? Racism really means you believe your race is genetically superior to others. I doubt there are enough people still in that category to even be worth discussing. If you want to talk about bigotry, bias, prejudice, etc. then fine ……….. we ALL (black & white) have some.
2) Don’t lump everything in the same category. Placing homosexuality in the same phrase with one’s skin color is a great disservice to black Americans (just ask some of them). Tolerance is good but it doesn’t ALWAYS mean elevating one’s viewpoint or lifestyle to your own. I “tolerate” smokers but I don’t have to live with their habit for my own good health if I don’t want to.
Just sayin ………………..
TaxPayer
July 23rd, 2010
8:58 am
If only Limbaugh and Hannity and Breitbart, et al, were pink. I hate pink.
Then again, “hate” is such a strong word… and pink is not really that bad once you get to know it. I’m doing pink a disservice by associating it with that pack.
I do hate dayglo orange though especially when I see it all over folks like Chambliss and Boehner. I dislike those two very very much and the more I hear them, the more I dislike them.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
8:58 am
letting the Plame situation lie … “Bill Clinton (no-fly zones, anyone?)”
um, that wasn’t because of WMDs – that was because of the Iraqi attacks on the Kurds.
as for the Bush/Hitler comparisons, you’ve seen me go off on one about any comparisons to Nazis / Hitler / the Holocaust, regardless of whether it comes from the left or the right.
there were plenty of jabs about Bush’s … ummm … unfamiliarity with the English language and his apparent lack of intellectual curiousity — are those the personal attacks you speak of? because I sure didn’t hear him criticized for using a teleprompter.
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
8:58 am
Gordon
July 23rd, 2010
8:51 am
First of all, I agree with what Jay said and think this was well written.
The point I want to make is that there is a habit among the right and the left of taking the most extreme people from the other side and trying to portray them as typical. They are not. I am a conservative. I favor limited government. Breitbart in no way, shape, or form represents my views when he does things like he did here, just as Jeremiah Wright or some other extreme leftist represents Jay or others who are not as conservative as I am. I am weary of the extremes getting so much attention and causing division.
+++++++++++++++++
One of the reason the media likes to show the extremes is it drives ratings. That is why these people get on TV. Even the news is driven by ratings.
candide
July 23rd, 2010
8:59 am
You cannot talk about race owing to liberal political correctness. You cannot criticize blacks for their immoral and decadent style of life.. You cannot tell the truth.
ty webb
July 23rd, 2010
8:59 am
Doggone,
yeah, that’s what I’m saying. He didn’t ruin her reputation, he didn’t hastily fire her, and he didn’t spread LIES(all caps for emphasis) about her. He simply used a soudbyte of her own words to score political points. Her case is hardly unique. If she deserves an apology, she should go to the back of the line and wait, like the countless others who’ve had it done to them by your “team”.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
9:00 am
“In other words, he’s lost any credibility he may have once had.”
Unfortunately not. Just read back on this blog, and you will find those for whom his credibility has not been destroyed. We can only hope he has destroyed his credibility among those who have the greatest power to spread his lies…the media.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:00 am
Gordon, I think thats an excellent point, but to get there I think if both sides would stop making excuses for thee people and just denounce them we could get past it, but they dont
Scout
July 23rd, 2010
9:00 am
P.S.
The word “racism” has been so “watered down” that it hardly means anything anymore.
“I disagree with someone’s economic policy so I’m racist” ………….. give me a break !
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
9:00 am
Private sector thinking..customer service and cutting prices will attract the discretionary buyer/user.
Public(MARTA) service thinking..concentrating on the inner city ghetto core routes, and closing all the damn bathrooms, will doubtlessly attract the discretionary user/buyer.
Any questions?
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
9:01 am
I think Bruno, via Normal’s story has kinda revealed the sad truth; it is in our DNA to distrust anyone or anything not “like” us. and the lines are not exculisively racial; political (lib v con), theological, (christian v muslim, christian v jew, jew v muslim, etc.). the divising lines can be as silly as UGA vs. GA Tech, or Nike v Under Armour, but human being like a good fight (and I suspect, as Bruno notes, it’s a anthroplogical thing, that probably can be traced back to males). self-preservation and providing/protecting one’s ‘herd’ can manifest itself in some pretty drastics legal (disrcimination) and technogogical (indescriminant total war/terrorism) ways. interestingly enough, my neighbor and I discussed this issue a couple of weeks back (he is black and I am white) at our own “beer summit”. he said; black or white, political or economic, people in power got to be there because they like power, and they’re not going to share their power with anyone. you have to take it, because that’s how they came to be in power.
Jimmy62
July 23rd, 2010
9:02 am
Breitbart didn’t make anyone fire her. The administration made a knee jerk decision to do so without getting all the facts, typical behavior for them. I guess they know there are a lot of black racists out there, so it wasn’t hard for them to believe. And the NAACP members in the audience did in fact cheer when she mentioned her previously racist actions, and the stated point of releasing the video was, in fact, to show racism at the NAACP, not to show Sherrod being racist. The video showed exactly that, NAACP members cheering on someone’s racist actions. You can twist the story to condemn Breitbart, but all he did was release a video. Everything that happened after that is the fault of the people who took action based on that video. Interesting how you shift the responsibility for a firing to someone who didn’t actually fire anyone, and could not have done so in any circumstances, rather than blame the person who actually did the firing. Responsibility is not a big thing for the left wing, it’s always Bush’s fault, or Breitbart’s, no matter who actually did it.
The Truth
July 23rd, 2010
9:02 am
I preface this comment by saying I am an independent who votes his conscience whether it be right or left. I also will say that I was a Journalism major in college in the 70s who was taught to report the facts not rumor or inuenndo.
Now, Jay, having said that, I think it is high time that we begin to classify Fox and MSNBC for what they really are. They are not true ‘news’ organizations that are fair and balanced but entertainment channels that cater to certain crowds. Just like ESPN is to sports, MSNBC is to the left as Fox is to the right. It is just a shame that, in this example, Breitbart is exposed as a gossip columnist that like Walter Winchell, takes some bits and pieces and shapes it into a story. It is time that people stop blindly following these organizations believing everything these guys spout at them….otherwise, we will all become National Enquirer clones. I mean, after all, even Boortz admits he is an entertainer…..
Don't forget
July 23rd, 2010
9:02 am
Bruno
Couldn’t agree more. The extremist’s suck all the air out of the room and make rational discourse impossible. Their compass is ideology not reality and they are a major reason we can’t solve problems that have plagued us for decades. And it’s usually the party that is out of power that is braying the loudest and upping the ante on every percieved slight they have experienced.
DawgDad
July 23rd, 2010
9:03 am
“The political standoff that exists in Washington today would exist even if Obama looked and talked like Mitt Romney, because it is based on honest differences of policy and ideology, not race.
But if we’re honest, we must also acknowledge that race has given some of the opposition to Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration.”
Jay, to be blunt, your article was surprisingly honest. I’d have never dreamed in 1000 years you’d write a sentence like the first quoted above. The problem lies in your follow-up. You’re only acknowledging half the issue, and the lesser half at that. To be honest and provide a path to healing instead of cleaving further divide you AT THE VERY LEAST must reference racial influence on BOTH sides. To infer that the Obama side is somehow above all this racial stuff moreso than his opposition is pure nonsense (Reverend Wright, anyone?). This type of analysis is pure race-baiting in both your tone and message.
Call it like it is.
July 23rd, 2010
9:03 am
I will have to admit I don’t care. I am tired of the racial nonsence. Our country is unique where a race was brought into slavery, and then made citizens. Decades have gone by and the hurt is still there and not going away. Yes Blacks and Whites have common goals, wants and needs, but both also have different beliefs and attitudes. Not saying this is a bad thing, but we are different and need to accept it.
Lets face it people, races for the most part want to stick with their own kind. Is this bad? We have our own churches, our own parks, our own hangouts, our own restaurants. I have no great desire to go to downtown Atlanta to attend a Southern Black Church, as I am sure Atlanta citizens have no great desire to come to Cobb County to my church. So what? I don’t listen to rap, doesnt mean I hate it, I just don’t listen to it. Again so what? People our races can be friends and we can live together, but we are never going to have some utopia.
Everything is not based on color of your skin, you know you may getting treated like your an ass, because maybe you are one.
I tell you what Jay, get back to me when each race gets rid of their special little social clubs, caucus for a certain race, TV for a certain race, magazines for a certain race and so on and so on……………It will never happen, so quit worrying about it
jt
July 23rd, 2010
9:03 am
Federo-sexual—————–See also African-American, Neo-Con.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
9:07 am
I appreciate your post, Mark, and its tone. I do want to address this point:
“When is the last time you heard a repub/conserv say lets kill all the black people and there babies…or, praise Bin Laden..If the Left and this admin. would just publicly denouce these idiots, I think the right would feel alot better.”
Reading that, it sounds as if you believe that “demo/libs”, to borrow your phraseology, had said let’s kill all the white people and their babies or praised Bin Laden.” They haven’t. One nutcase with the New Black Panthers did so, but they are no more “demo/libs” than neo-Nazis and KKK members are “repub/conservs.”
Nobody felt George W. Bush was in any way obliged to condemn such groups simply because he is white and they are white. It would have been ridiculous. So why on earth would you feel that Barack Obama is obliged to do so? A fringe hate group is a fringe hate group, and requiring Obama to denounce said groups implies that otherwise, you suspect he shares their ideology. And that’s nuts.
The problem is that to gin up fear, Fox and others have turned the New Black Panthers into some major threat to white people, when in fact they are utterly inconsequential. By Media Matters’ count, Fox dedicated 95 segments and more than eight hours of national air time to the New Black Panthers between June 30 and July 16, all because one guy stood in front of a polling place for an hour with a baton before being marched off by police.
I suppose CNN could also do 95 segments on that lone, heavily armed nutcase in California whom police intercepted on his way to shoot up the ACLU and the Tides Foundation. I suppose I could imply that NRB2, who posted here about his Timothy McVeigh fantasies, is a “repub/conserv” whom the rest of you conservatives must denounce.
But that too would be lunacy.
david wayne osedach
July 23rd, 2010
9:07 am
It is because of commentary like that this that I read the AJC every day! The subject of race is constantly evolving – for the better. But it is big and it is still there.
Paulo977
July 23rd, 2010
9:08 am
“The more we know about people…….” Oh well said Gale
Real American
July 23rd, 2010
9:09 am
Race will always take place in this country as long as low life like Hannity, Rush, Beck keep selling it to lower class whites who wont reseach the truth themself.
CNBC REACTS TO EVERY THING FOX DOES, AT LEAST THAT DONT PROMOTE RACE BAITING LIKE FOX, THESE IS NOT NEW WALTER CRONKITE WAS NEWS, COMPARE HIM TO SHAWN HANNITY, WHAT A JOKE.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
9:09 am
Yeah, it’s only the right who makes race a issue, it wasn’t Bill clinton who talked about all of the burning black churches in his youth(which I recall noone could find evidence of within 100 miles of hicksville, arkansas where he was raised)
Normal
July 23rd, 2010
9:11 am
Enter your comments here
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
9:11 am
And to “call it:”
What you claim will never happen is in fact happening right in front of you. Compare the situation today to what it was 10 years ago or 20 years ago, and the progress is obvious. The generations coming up behind us have a lot less baggage about such issues than we do, and their own children will have still less.
Utopia? No. But the lines between us are growing more and more dim.
Big D
July 23rd, 2010
9:12 am
Jay,
As I have stated before I am of mixed race and grew up on an AFB and in Black and white communities in the south during the 50’s, 60’s and 70’s. I saw it all, from the freedom riders buses burned in Anniston to Bull Conner hosing people down in Birmingham when my parents took me to see a concert there. I was lucky and moved in both worlds and when people didn’t know my lineage they would inadvertently share there innermost opinions on this subject. The conclusion I came to was simple, some of the white people are racist and some of the Black people are too. I remember well LBJ and the ” Great society” and the steady decline of the Black community after that and in Alabama the building of the “Government Housing” later to become the “Ghetto”. After MLK was killed the atmosphere on both sides of the issue drastically changed with paranoia showing it’s ugly head on both sides of the world I traveled in. When it became profitable to keep blacks and whites at odds with each other we ALL lost. It started with the Black “leaders ” and migrated quickly to the white “pundits” and has been used effectively ever sense. From my position I have always looked at it from a position of logic, if white people were ALL bad the slave issue would have been a non issue in the Civil War, it took a MAJORITY of white people to make slavery an issue let alone abolish it. When the War was over it took a majority of WHITE legislatures to intact the 13, 14 and 15th amendments. Last but not at all the leased White people elected Barrack Obama. We should all look at the ones who are profiting the most from the racial divide we are now in and move quickly to ostracize those people and not each other, we have too much to lose.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
9:12 am
Scout: come on down to rural south GA where I am and you’ll see racism alive and well. People get along as long as “the coloreds” stay in generally accepted geographical areas to live (public places like Wal-Mart are okay to mix). If there weren’t racism still lurking in the dark corner of American consciousness (at least politically), then why would Breitbart, et. al. jump so furiously at every opportunity to try to prove the NAACP is racist. Makes one feel better about one’s own sin when one can, like my children, say “see, he did it toooooo!!”
I think many out there are consciously racist, they’re just scared. Scared of the shift in power that is slowly happening, scared of the country falling apart if the “uppity” folks find their power, scared of what might happen if they end up being the minority. For all that has been accomplished in the last 60 years, the basic white power structure hasn’t shifted significantly across this country. Electing Obama, at least symbolically, points out a shift in the power structure that scares some people mightily.
The Ugly Truth
July 23rd, 2010
9:12 am
Keep it up Jay. Maybe you’ll get invited invited to an NAACP party. Wait, probably not. Racism exists only within those who can benefit from it.
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
9:13 am
The Truth
July 23rd, 2010
9:02 am
I preface this comment by saying I am an independent who votes his conscience whether it be right or left. I also will say that I was a Journalism major in college in the 70s who was taught to report the facts not rumor or inuenndo.
Now, Jay, having said that, I think it is high time that we begin to classify Fox and MSNBC for what they really are. ……………………
++++++++++++++++++
They are driven by ratings. O’ Reilly brags about FOX’s ratings. Telling people what they want to hear will make you more popular but it is hard to do that and establish credibility at the same time. What FOX really shows is there are more conservative than liberal who are willing to spend time listening to people tell them what they want to hear.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
9:13 am
The equating of Shirley Sherrod with Mother Teresa is as absurd on Friday as painting her as David Duke was on Monday. She still said the GOP only opposes Obama because he’s black and she labels the Fox News Channel as a racist organization, which says a lot about what she thinks of their viewers, but refuses to go on the channel and attempt to make her point.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
9:13 am
Oops, meant to type AREN’T consciously racist….haven’t had the second cup of joe yet!
Normal
July 23rd, 2010
9:15 am
Sorry about my 9:11…
I was going to commend Mike on his tolerance for the ones different in political postures than he, and to tell him what a fine example of understanding and empathy he is…but I froze…
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
9:16 am
“It’s the White House and Dept of Agrc. that is responsible”
And they have apologized, as they should have, and have offered reparations. Where is Breitbart’s apology and offer of reparations? You can try to pin this on the WH and Ag dept all you want, Breitbart is ultimately the one at fault and the one who most owes her an apology. He is the one who started the lies about her, and he is the one who bears the greatest burden of fault.
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
9:16 am
Jay…thanks for being on point today!!
candide July 23rd, 2010
8:59 am
“You cannot talk about race owing to liberal political correctness. You cannot criticize blacks for their immoral and decadent style of life.. You cannot tell the truth.”
Wrong….in many circumstances, the truth IS being told…but what happens in many cases is the TONE is more derogatory than effective! Look at how the preponderance of minorities are seen: unemployed, “welfare queens” (as was stated by Reagan), criminals…when the counter is more the case! Look at how conservatives portray minorities in election cycles; look at the DEARTH of minority representation in the GOP!!
Look…the argument affects both sides of the coin….but the tone and the schism that conservatives create to amplify their position does not help solve the problem. If one also notes how black conservatives are being used by white conservatives to fracture the black community…then a better conversation of race could begin! If conservatives would note how laws like SB 1070 that TARGET minorities and promote racial profiling add to the discourse, then….conversations as to how to solve the issue could commence in earnest!!
This is from someone who HAS been adversely affected by more conservative policies than progressive….
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
9:17 am
Big D
July 23rd, 2010
9:12 am
Jay,
As I have stated before I am of mixed race and grew up on an AFB and in Black and white communities in the south during the 50’s, 60’s and 70’s. I saw it all, from the freedom riders buses burned in Anniston to Bull Conner hosing people down in Birmingham when my parents took me to see a
++++++++++++
Well written Big D.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
9:17 am
The more I read about sherrod and her husband and the albany movement and the SNCC, this couples been race pimpin it since the 60’s and seem to have constructed an entire race based government check mill in sw GA based around the 1 day a year farmer system.
I hope some investigative reporting will look into their actions as they wick taxpayer funds into their leftist pockets, but to do that would be pickin on the black lady, and racist, i guess
@@
July 23rd, 2010
9:18 am
We have finally reached the point when everyone can be falsely called a racist.
Yep! …then there’s the more subtle accusations like the one jay laid on me the other day.
jay:
I’ll see if my neighbor wants to engage in this online intervention. Anything I say or do might be misconstrued as racist…seein’s how I’m dark but not yet black.
I doubt seriously if he can find the time or the interest. He’s a black small business owner (home improvement). He’s working hard to keep his head above water in anticipation of Obama’s tax hike on the “wealthy”. Loves his sisters (biological). Hates their politics (democrats).
Thanks for your “concern” though.
Big D
July 23rd, 2010
9:19 am
Thanks Mod…Just the truth.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:21 am
Jay I agree, as you would see in my later post…BOTH SIDES need to denouce these people, then there would be no story. and while thet may not be obligated to do so, I think it would help ease tensions in this country..
But, Im still gonna have to disagree about the NBP’s…anybody that spreads that kind of message needs to be taken seriously no matter how small an org. thay may be.
Richie
July 23rd, 2010
9:22 am
if a white person disagrees with a black person u are a racist. Havent u folks fig.that out yet.
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
9:24 am
Breitbart said he did not edit the tape, however, it sure looked like it had been edited exactly the same way as the Pimp/Acorn tapes…
Coincidence…I think not…
I posit that Breitbart is a partisan hack with a destructive agenda AND an outright liar. Let’s see how FOX and others treat him going forward…it will be very illuminating.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
9:24 am
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
9:16 am
candide July 23rd, 2010
8:59 am
“You cannot talk about race owing to liberal political correctness. You cannot criticize blacks for their immoral and decadent style of life.. You cannot tell the truth.”
Why did you feed the troll? Now it will be back spewing even MORE stuff HDB……….. the shelf life of an ignored troll is very short, we had almost reached candice’s……….
T Knight
July 23rd, 2010
9:24 am
“I know of no rights of race superior to the rights of humanity” Frederick Douglas
If only Frederick Douglas’s philosophy were true today. Race relations will never improve as long as people keep looking back.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
9:25 am
So Mark, do you also think we need to highlight the KKK, Stormfront.org, etc.? Do Sarah Palin and Mitch McConnell need to go before the cameras to denounce those groups, just so we know they don’t agree with them?
Bruno
July 23rd, 2010
9:25 am
Enjoyed the fellowship this morning.
Best wishes to all…………….
El Jefe
July 23rd, 2010
9:26 am
One question,
How could the NAACP get “snookered” by Fox News, when it was the NAACP’s video of the event, and before Fox reported on it?
I guess the NAACP stepped on their own dingus this time.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
9:26 am
Jacob, if you post the same self-serving link three times in the same post, you are spamming if not trolling.
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
9:27 am
Yup, El Jefe, the NAACP and the Obama Administration scewed up…but they admitted it and are trying to repair the damage.
Novel, huh?
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
9:28 am
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
9:16 am
Look…the argument affects both sides of the coin….but the tone and the schism that conservatives create to amplify their position does not help solve the problem. If one also notes how black conservatives are being used by white conservatives to fracture the black community…then a better conversation of race could begin! If conservatives would note how laws like SB 1070 that TARGET minorities and promote racial profiling add to the discourse, then….conversations as to how to solve the issue could commence in earnest!!
++++
OK. Once the conservatives see the world the same way you do then we can start to have conversations as to how to solve the issue.
As a moderate I don’t agree with conservatives or liberals consistently. I don’t believe that everyone should believe the same way as I do. In fact I believe in having converstations with people who disagree with me so I can understand how they feel and why they believe what they believe.
Sherrod dislike white people because her father was killed by white people and based on her recollection the person who killed him escape justice because he was white. Now, I don’t agree with how she felt at the time but I think that is perfectly understandable reaction to what happen to her. Eventually, as time went on and her experiences change and her feelings towards whites changed.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
9:28 am
Fine, no link -
White people are so AFRAID of people of color. Look at Atlanta: why don’t Cobb or Cherokee want MARTA going up 75? Look at the demographics of this city: 40 years after we elected our first black mayor, the white folks are holed up in North Fulton and the northern suburbs. Do they engage in the process of improving the urban heart of our city? Nope. Not their problem and so South Atlanta’s infrastructure, public education facilities and economic development await the scraps of whatever is left over AFTER North Fulton and the northern suburbs get theirs.
White people don’t really want to talk about the deep-seated issues that surround race in this country. Yes, slavery happened over a century ago. Yes, the civil rights bill did happen. Yes, there have been things like affirmative action to attempt to “equalize” opportunity between the races of this country. But, the fact remains, there are very real residual effects from those centuries of oppression and the subsequent Jim Crow era and the present age of veiled prejudices. White people don’t want to hear that.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
9:30 am
Bruno, you’re walking into a Sherrod-like ambush when you dismiss the Plame outing as “overblown by the left”. you sound like a lawyer in a divorce mediation (I know, I’ve been there… TWICE); one side levies any and all baseless claims to merely trade horses to get “the best deal”. this is what stinks about the two party American dog and pony show. the truth is; the Bush administration ‘cherry-picked’ intel (then threw non-Plame CIA employees under the bus). this was how Bush, Cheney et al “rolled” when it came to using the CIA to further its own skewed political agenda. in many ways, it is no better than the Rah, Emmanuel mantra of “not letting a good crisis go to waste…” why can’t you simply call a spade a spade and admit Cheney and “Scooter” acted in a cowardly and vindictive manner, with NO regard for “national security” or “the war on terror” (all while they were enacting The Patriot Act and pursuing warrantless wiretaps to “protect” America? It seems to me that it wasn’t so much the faux outgrage of the left, but the arrogance of the “checken hawk” right that made the Plame case so vulgar and offensive to any American who truly values freedom or “supports the troops”. I know people who have worked in the intelligence community (analysts and operatives). I went to school in he DC area and any kid whose family lived in McLean, VA or Columbia, MD or Vienna, VA or whose mom or dad “is stationed with the State Department in Lagos, or Beruit, or Honduras” was probably a “spook”. So, to bring this all together, how is what “Scooter” Libby did to Valerie Plame any different than what Obama and Vilsack did to Shirley Sherrod? While the Plame “termination” was more malicious (vis a vis her husband’s NYT editorial questioning war with Iraq), it was no less “political” (as opposed to due to job performance or lack thereof). we need to be able to hold both politicians and journalists to the same standard, and we the People need to look beyond superficial differences and admit there is room for improvement everywhere (not simply on the left or the right)
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
9:31 am
All In all, since I don’t care about race, just ideology, and since this has harmed obama by his own ham handed handling of it, I say right on BREITBART!
Now , investigate sherrods USDA shakedown lawsuit and the government check mill run in albany.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
9:32 am
JacobLocke. Most respectfully sir, you are a racist idiot. I’m not “afraid of people of color.” I don’t know any one who is. Keep telling yourself that, it apparently bolsters what little self esteem you have.
As to MARTA? The reason it doesn’t go into the suburbs is because MARTA is run by idiots. Remember Laura Lawson? By electing the welfare queen as the chairman of the board of MARTA, the board lost any inroads it might have gained towards getting support from anyone with brains in the suburbs.
As to Atlanta? You mean your black mayors aren’t helping the black folks of Atlanta and you need us dreaded whitey’s to bail you out? Did you really just say that? Still blaming the white folks for everything eh? (BTW, I live ITP not in the burb’s. My mailing address says Atlanta.)
godless heathen
July 23rd, 2010
9:32 am
Breitbart tricked the administration into firing Ms. Sherrod. Bush tricked all those Democrats in the House and Senate into supporting the Gulf War. Democrats are easily fooled, but we knew that already.
Boots
July 23rd, 2010
9:33 am
I don’t have time to read all the posts and don’t read Jay, or other AJC bloggers ever day. But, I must say the civil, thoughtful content of he first couple of handsful of posts makes me feel good. Didn’t know it was still possible to have civil discourse in American society, digital or otherwise.
ken
July 23rd, 2010
9:34 am
The Truth, I grew up with NBC, CBS and ABC news and print. Looking back, they had an agenda to slant the news also. Power of the TV , pen and money.
jt
July 23rd, 2010
9:34 am
Remember, President Obama is NOT the first black president.
That was Bill Clinton.
President Obama is our first WOMAN president.
See baseball throw.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:34 am
Absolutley Jay!
Del
July 23rd, 2010
9:35 am
If Breitbart knowingly and with malice edited the Shirley Sherrod video, his act would be in my opinion reprehensible. Like many I watched the video in its entirety, knowing beforehand that Ms. Sherrod’s complete message wasn’t racist in nature. She did, however take sometime getting to her point and I could see how someone could easily take that one portion of her speech and conclude that she was making a racist comment without listening to her entire message. Perhaps, Breitbart only heard that portion of her speech where she sounded racist, cut it and released it without understanding where her message was ultimately going. I don’t know but what we do know is that his intention was to counter the NAACP’s vote to brand the Tea Party as a racist organization. Jay’s comment “that race has given some of the opposition to Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration” is great word smithing but it conveys a partisan message. While, no doubt there are some who dislike Obama because of his race, the far greater majority simply reject his policies apart from racial considerations. Clearly, the left is attempting to introduce race into the equation in hopes of igniting their base for November’s midterm election and that’s reprehensible
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
9:36 am
jt
July 23rd, 2010
9:34 am
President Obama is our first WOMAN president.
See baseball throw.
LOL jt, THAT was funny. But I’ll bet he could whip your butt in hoops. Pres has a wicked jump shot…..
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:37 am
Lord Help Us..
while I dont agree with Brietbart on this latest issue, If you think for one second that Accorn is not a corrupt org., you’ve lost your mind!
jt
July 23rd, 2010
9:38 am
Fred
Of course he could. White men can’t jump.
Phillopinos either.
jm
July 23rd, 2010
9:39 am
I’m sorry, but the truth still is: if a white person had made the same comments in reverse, it’s likely that the minority community would have been calling for their scalp.
There’s racism on both sides, and a lot of fundamentally false racism claims are being made against the tea party folks. It’s high time it stopped on both sides.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
9:41 am
I want to echo Boots. I appreciate the tone in which we’ve agreed to disagree this morning.
More please.
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
9:41 am
Mark, I said nothing at all regarding whether or not ACORN is corrupt. All I said was the Sherrod tape was editied exactly like the ACORN/PIMP video. Interesting that the Sherrod tape was edited very similarly, yet Breitbart claims he did not do any editing.
I think he is lying and I hope that he is sued…
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
9:41 am
Wow, Fred, didn’t have our coffee yet?
MARTA doesn’t go into Cobb and Cherokee because the county commissions of both adamantly refused to explore trainlines/bus routes into their communities. Calling Laura Lawson a “Welfare Queen” just further illustrates the point. Your experience with people of color doesn’t go beyond vaudevillian stereotypes and caricatures.
And that “great white hope” crap in your last paragraph is just about the biggest chip on a white man’s shoulder, isn’t it. No one is asking for a “bailout.” What’s happening in Atlanta is “good ole boy” politics of the worst sort. And, yes, I’ll blame white folks. White people destroyed Native Americans. White people created the African diaspora. White people destroyed the structure of the African-American family. White people formed the KKK. White people abused the Chinaman, the Irishman, the Sweed, the Jew, the Pole – over the entire history of this great nation, White people have inflicted more damage on the vitality of this nation than any other ethnicity in this great country of ours. However, I’ve yet to meet a white man who is willing to recognize those atrocities and engage in an actual discussion about them.
And I’m “ITP” as well – right in the heart of it.
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
9:42 am
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
9:28 am
Fine, no link -
White people are so AFRAID of people of color. Look at Atlanta: why don’t Cobb or Cherokee want MARTA going up 75? Look at the demographics of this city: 40 years after we elected our first black mayor, the white folks are holed up in North Fulton and the northern suburbs. Do they engage in
+++++++++++++++++++++
I don’t know if you realize it but Cobb has it’s own transit system which links to MARTA. GRTA also goes to Cobb.
Why is it racism for Cobb to relinquish control of their transit system to MARTA?
RF
July 23rd, 2010
9:43 am
Mark- yeah, Acorn is corrupt because Fox News said it was….which is why it lost all government funding, so what’s left of it anyway? Breitbart either knowingly edited the video to suit his needs or accepted an edited version as truth without fact-checking. Either way, he’s a fool and proved his corruption in a very public way without the help of a “pimp”…
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:44 am
While I still dont believe she should ahve been fired(for this)…technicaly she could have been fired for violating the Hatch Act
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
For other uses, see Hatch Act.
The Hatch Act of 1939 is a United States federal law whose main provision is to prohibit federal employees (civil servants) from engaging in partisan political activity
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
9:44 am
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:37 am
Lord Help Us..
while I dont agree with Brietbart on this latest issue, If you think for one second that Accorn is not a corrupt org., you’ve lost your mind!
+++++++++++
Now HERE is the root of the problem with having a discussion about race, or differing political views.
Mark says he doesn’t agree with Briebart, but then turns around and implies it’s ok though because of ACORN. That is EXACTLY how these discussion go. They quickly turn into the “he touched me first” argument that two 5 years old play in the backseat of a car on a long trip. ANy meaningful dialog is quickly buried and the original topic is lost in the pile of poop that gets shoveled deeper and deeper.
Note: I’m not singling you out persay Mark, it’s just your post was a perfect and SHORT example. I could have picked any of dozens on this blog alone, yours was just handy and as I said SHORT.
Ninja
July 23rd, 2010
9:44 am
Hey Bruno, if it’s any consolation, I’ve got two interviews today and more responses in the last week then I’ve had in the last two years combined. And that’s in Michigan, so take heart. Or better yet, find a way to strike out on your own.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:44 am
Lord Help Us…fair enough
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:47 am
Fred…I never said it was ok because of Accorn..those words never came out of my mouth nor did I imply that
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
9:47 am
Jacob Locke, you are so full of s**t it it coming out of your ears. I am a “white people” who has lived in Atlanta since 1989. I lived in Buckhead between ‘89-99 and I purchased a home in a southside neighborhood in ‘99. The “black” leadership that has run Atlanta for the past 40 years is just as corrupt and self-serving as any white leadership. Do you live in Atlanta? Are you getting bang for your buck in terms of your property taxes (education, police,). did you not just receive your Solid Waste tax bill ($88 add-on for “recyling”). How ’bout your July water bill (12% increase on top of the highest water rates of ANY major city). have you been following the “Airport concessions” trial? Does the name Bill Campbell mean anything to you? this isn’t a “black/white” thing, and it has nothing to do with “racism”. Politicians are politicians. they don’t see race. You just set this blog back 25 years.
Don't forget
July 23rd, 2010
9:47 am
The majority of Americans describe themselves as moderates (about 57%) which suggests they don’t buy into the ideology of either party completely. The extremists know this and realize they cannot accomplish their agenda without deceiving the public and discrediting the opposition. The extremists also put much more energy and effort into the political process, again, because they know thy cannot completely win an argument and would have to compromise if they simply debated an issue. In other words the strategy is divide and conquer. The left is no better than the right generally speaking over time but the side that is out of power tends to be the more aggressive and the right outnumbers the left by about 33% to 20%.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
9:48 am
Jacob, I’ll let your biased, racist rant stand as it is. It deserves no comment. Power to the people.
Big D
July 23rd, 2010
9:49 am
Jacob, do you really think what you are saying really reverberates with anybody?
Whites being scared of Blacks when the community is mostly Black and every window has burglar bars on them… GAM ..the Blacks are scared of each other, do you think those bars are for keeping the KKK out???. Get over being Black or what ever color you are, this kind of rhetoric is what we want to Die….
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
9:50 am
Wow…ACORN ’suspected’ of being corrupt and costing the taxpayers a few million causes right-wing hysteria and days on end of ‘pimping’ (pardon the pun) the story on FOX.
Hallibuton and are found to have perpetrated $BILLIONS of fraud and, if you watched FOX, you might not ever know it.
No credibility…
A CONSERVATIVE
July 23rd, 2010
9:50 am
JAY…You are giving Andrew Nreitbart way too much credit in the saga…Jay is saying the all powerful president of the United States…made a harsh decision/ rush to judgment…. based on a video Breitbard posted on line…Breitbard had nothing to do with the decision to fire SHERROD..that was Obama’s decision alone
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
9:51 am
However, I’ve yet to meet a white man who is willing to recognize those atrocities and engage in an actual discussion about them.
++++++++++++++
Uh! I have meet alot of white people who recognize those atrocities. Also, I thought that is one of thing white conservatives complain about liberals was that they were always pointing out the negatives of what white people had done and not the positives.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
9:51 am
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:47 am
Fred…I never said it was ok because of Accorn..those words never came out of my mouth nor did I imply that
++++++++++
Oh really? Then what was your motivation for bring them up in your comment? What logical conclusion was one supposed to reach? you just inadvertently strung two unrelated phases together with a comma?
jm
July 23rd, 2010
9:52 am
Jay –
“So Mark, do you also think we need to highlight the KKK, Stormfront.org, etc.? Do Sarah Palin and Mitch McConnell need to go before the cameras to denounce those groups, just so we know they don’t agree with them?”
I think the answer is “yes” to the first question, and “no” to the second. Racism, as it still exists, should be reported on and the perpetrators exposed for being the cowards they are. Of course, on the flip side, I do think racism in general is less common these days, so over-reporting these incidents can lead to the impression of a greater racial divide that there actually is. That would obviously be a negative outcome.
As to your second question, people should be left to their own devices as to whether something should be denounced. People can judge leaders by their silence or response using their own common sense.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
9:53 am
“based on a video Breitbart posted on line…Breitbart had nothing to do with the decision to fire SHERROD..that was Vilsack’s decision alone”
there ya go. typos fixed, free of charge.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
9:54 am
@ModerateLine – I’m speaking about a train line.
@neo-Carlinist – I’m guessing your name is a tribute to George Carlin?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSJmYnHdvsc
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
9:54 am
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
9:50 am
Hallibuton and are found to have perpetrated $BILLIONS of fraud and, if you watched FOX, you might not ever know it.
+++++++++++
What is your point? This pertains to race relations and race discussions HOW? Why are you bringing up the company that President Clinton used in Bosnia with no bid contract? Wasn’t that a long time ago? We are 2 Presidents and almost 3 terms PAST Bill Clinton………
Van Jones
July 23rd, 2010
9:56 am
“born and raised in the Jim Crow South and who lost her father in a murder supposedly committed by a white neighbor who was never prosecuted.”
Got any facts about this “murder” or does presenting it this way defend the heroine of the story better? Ever hear of journalistic integrity?
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
9:56 am
Mark, nice pull on “the Hatch Act”. does the Hatch Act acknowledge that the Executive Branch (White House/West Wing) and Legislative Branch (Congress and Senate) are “federal employees” and “civil servants” (politicians LOVE to put that title on their business cards). and in the irony of all ironies, the law was drafted, passed and signed by “partisans” from both sides. you getting this? OR, maybe they were saying (as always), well, we’re mostly talking about the little people… you know, the people we were elected to REPRESENT. you and I should engage in partisan political debate, not the dipsh*ts in DC. they should “uphold and defend the Constitution” which last time I checked does not contain the words Liberal or Conservative.
@@
July 23rd, 2010
9:58 am
I’ve always viewed Obama as bi-racial. After reminding everyone of that several times, I even went so far as to say his incompetence could be blamed on his white genes, mom jeans…
I don’t care.
Incompetence is incompetence. Inexperience is inexperience. Extreme left is extreme left.
Refusing to anticipate the unintended consequences of his economic policies will leave us ALL wanting.
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
9:58 am
Fred, ‘What is your point?’
My point is that FOX, the channel that pimped the ACORN/PIMP video for days on end and ALSO pimped the Sherrod video for days on end…has NO credibility…
jt
July 23rd, 2010
9:58 am
“The Hatch Act of 1939 is a United States federal law whose main provision is to prohibit federal employees (civil servants) from engaging in partisan political activity”
Silly Mark.
Obeying laws is sooooooo 20th century.
Get with the program.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
9:59 am
Van – are you saying that her father wasn’t murdered? wasn’t murdered by white men? what?
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
9:59 am
@BigD – and where does crime originate? Are criminals born or are they created? If you answered with the former, you just show your ignorance about human nature and the impact of one’s environment on his or her behavior.
@neo-Carlinist – here’s a better one:
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2333410/george_carlin_on_white_people/
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
10:01 am
Van Jones
July 23rd, 2010
9:56 am
Got any facts about this “murder” or does presenting it this way defend the heroine of the story better? Ever hear of journalistic integrity?
++++++++
I don’t think we need to ask if you watched the unedited video of Sherrod now do we Van Jones? I say that because had you watched the video, you would know where those “facts” came from. Even if you have a short attention span and couldn’t stay with all 43 minutes, Sherrod mentions that event from her life very early in her speech.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:01 am
Fred, my motivation was that I was responding to a post by Lord Help Us @ 9:24…I didnt bring the subject of Acorn up
RF
July 23rd, 2010
10:03 am
@Fred: “They quickly turn into the “he touched me first” argument that two 5 years old play in the backseat of a car on a long trip. ANy meaningful dialog is quickly buried and the original topic is lost in the pile of poop that gets shoveled deeper and deeper.”
Well said!!
jm
July 23rd, 2010
10:03 am
Jacob Locke – ignoring your political comments for the time being (I think Reed’s great, past mayors have been awful), let me respond to this paragraph:
“And that “great white hope” crap in your last paragraph is just about the biggest chip on a white man’s shoulder, isn’t it. No one is asking for a “bailout.” What’s happening in Atlanta is “good ole boy” politics of the worst sort. And, yes, I’ll blame white folks. White people destroyed Native Americans. White people created the African diaspora. White people destroyed the structure of the African-American family. White people formed the KKK. White people abused the Chinaman, the Irishman, the Sweed, the Jew, the Pole – over the entire history of this great nation, White people have inflicted more damage on the vitality of this nation than any other ethnicity in this great country of ours. However, I’ve yet to meet a white man who is willing to recognize those atrocities and engage in an actual discussion about them.”
I’m white. And yes, the white people did all of that. Of course, Irish, Sweeds, Jews and Poles are essentially white, but let’s ignore that for a moment too. The question is, do past disgraceful actions by the white community absolve the black community of taking responsibility for their own current problems (economic, safety, family)? I would argue no. Is it an uphill battle the black community faces? Yes. Are they making lots of progress? In my opinion, hell yes.
So yes, the white community (in the past, not so much the present) is guilty of a lot of abuses of power, deception, etc. Is the current generation responsible for this? Sometimes (some inherited wealth is built on the abuse of previous generations, but most wealth is not). So should we have reparations? No. Should both communities do whatever they can to help each other? Yes.
And perhaps the white community (whatever that really means) deserves some applause also for the development and spread of a lot of human rights as well. Starting with Magna Carta and carrying through to the American Revolution. And if you want to give some credit to this snowball effect, one might carry this through to the modern day liberation of Iraq (of course, it ain’t all white folks paying for the war or fighting the war).
I’m done for now. Work would be a good idea.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:03 am
Not to be rude but maybe you should stay out of other people’s conversations
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
10:04 am
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
9:44 am
While I still dont believe she should ahve been fired(for this)…technicaly she could have been fired for violating the Hatch Act
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For other uses, see Hatch Act.
The Hatch Act of 1939 is a United States federal law whose main provision is to prohibit federal employees (civil servants) from engaging in partisan political activity
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The Hatch Act only prohibits certain politcal activity not ALL. The purpose of the Hatch Act is to protect federal employess from being forced into partisan activities. I was disappointe when Sherrod when it brought to her attention did not know if she was in violation of this law. She was not but at her level she should have know the law but after what she has been through I think she can deserves a mulligan.
Employees may**, for example:
register and vote as they choose
assist in voter registration drives
express opinions about candidates and issues
contribute money to political organizations
attend political fundraising functions
attend and be active at political rallies and meetings
join and be active members of a political party or club
sign and circulate nominating petitions
campaign for or against referendum questions, constitutional amendments and/or municipal ordinances
campaign for or against candidates in partisan elections
make campaign speeches for candidates in partisan elections
distribute campaign literature in partisan elections
campaign for and hold office in political clubs or parties
volunteer to work on a partisan political campaign
participate in any activity not specifically prohibited by law or regulation
**While engaging in these activities employees must be acting in their personal capacity, not their official capacity. For example, they should not identify their official title when engaging in any of these activities.
http://www.osc.gov/haStateLocalexamplePermittedActivities.htm
These federal employees may:
register and vote as they choose
assist in voter registration drives
express opinions about candidates and issues
participate in campaigns where none of the candidates represent a political party
contribute money to political organizations or attend political fund raising functions
attend political rallies and meetings
join political clubs or parties
sign nominating petitions
campaign for or against referendum questions, constitutional amendments, municipal ordinances
TaxPayer
July 23rd, 2010
10:04 am
Breitbart posted a deceptive video. Vilsack and the Obama administration reacted by wrongfully “firing” Ms. Sherrod. Vilsack and the Obama administration, after examining the whole truth surrounding the allegations of racism, recognized their mistakes and apologized and offered to make amends. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, Breitbart, although now armed with the whole truth, is still elated with his behavior and, apparently, by the sounds of silence (if only), so are his co-horts on the right.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
10:05 am
“The Hatch Act of 1939 is a United States federal law whose main provision is to prohibit federal employees (civil servants) from engaging in partisan political activity”
So how is a woman addressing a gathering of the NAACP and discussing her growth and learning a “partisan” political activity? If anything, she showed folks in that room, and the nation as a whole now, how she overcame her partisan feelings. Dots not connecting here…
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
10:05 am
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
9:58 am
My point is that FOX, the channel that pimped the ACORN/PIMP video for days on end and ALSO pimped the Sherrod video for days on end…has NO credibility…
++++++++++
Ah, got you. I’ll agree with that wholeheartedly. I came to that conclusion very early on in their attempt to be a ‘news” channel. They aired stories that where exactly that, stories. They had no facts or rushed to the air before they could check their sources. i didn’t watch them enough to know if they were right wing slanted or left wing slanted. I decided they were more National Inquirer slanted. Although that is an insult to the NI, THEY at least have actually broken a couple of big stories that were true……….
getalife
July 23rd, 2010
10:06 am
They will take their hate to their graves.
If you talk to the younger generation, you would see more tolerance and that is the future of this country.
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
10:06 am
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
9:54 am
@ModerateLine – I’m speaking about a train line.
@neo-Carlinist – I’m guessing your name is a tribute to George Carlin?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSJmYnHdvsc
++++++++++++++++++++++
Uh! So since Cobb county has a bus system instead of a train they are a bunch of racist? Hmmm!
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
10:07 am
Jacob, I’ve read everything Carlin has ever written (including personal correspondence to me), and viewed just about every one of his performances. That said, he was a writer, actor, comedian and entertainer. He was just as apt to highlight the hypocrisy of whites or liberals as he was blacks or conservatives – in my opinion, he simply felt the historical “body of work” offered by white conservatives was too rich not to mine. your knowledge of Carlin is about as solid as your take on Atlanta’s demographic/racial dynamic.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:08 am
My point is that FOX, the channel that pimped the ACORN/PIMP video for days on end and ALSO pimped the Sherrod video for days on end
LHU,
Fox hadn’t even aired a single segment concerning this video before Sherrod was fired, but don’t let facts get in the way of your hysteria.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
10:09 am
Reasonably well written and thoughtful essay and it has brought out some interesting comments.
However, once again the atavists keep on keeping on with the black-white dichotomy and in so doing miss the point completely. Racism is not a black-white issue and nothing more. In between there are yellow, red and brown and, quite frankly as Jay has pointed out before, the red really isn’t an issue around here. Maybe not in some houses, but it is here.
I was scrolling through here and passing on some of the more intriguing comments to Unmentionable whose first comment was, “oh, go on back to that bunch of malcontents you hang out with and quit interrupting my reading.” When I insisted he said, “remember that Paracelsus quote you like so much? Well excuse me if I just sit over in my assigned corner out of sight and out of mind and you go listen to the meae culpae of the wh*res discussing chastity.”
Why, I wanted to know, do you not bring it up. “Oh, you’ll do that for me and you can deal with they don’t give a sh*t what I think, never have and never will and right now I’ve got other things to do than look for a little meat on the bone they might throw the doggie…woof. woof and let me get back to more important things.”
“Like what?” “My spy novel…see, the counter spy has just flown in from Chile and what he doesn’t know is…”
So, there’s the contribution from the corner…
BRUNO
Good to see you back! Looking forward to you reports on navel contemplation and change of focus…
jt
Federosexual? I don’t care who you are, thass funny!
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:09 am
Well I came to that conclusion when she bashed the Bush admin….maybe I was wrong on that one
Regina Lanier
July 23rd, 2010
10:11 am
Beautifully said, Jay.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
10:11 am
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:03 am
Not to be rude but maybe you should stay out of other people’s conversations
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but this is a COMMUNITY conversation. If you want a private conversation use email, IM, or a phone. This is a BLOG. In a blog a comment or opinion is posted for the entire blog community to see and respond to. Don’t go getting all petulant on us now and acting aggrieved. Likewise, if you are talking loudly in public on your cell phone forcing all around you to become a party to your “private” conversation, expect someone to comment on it.
you seem to be a tad bit lost about the dynamics of a blog………
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:12 am
Taxpayer, im amused that people are still blaming Fox News…Do you think they were the only news source to run the edited tape..and I do recall Glenn Beck defending her from day one, and O’Rielly apoligizing
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
10:13 am
Moderate Line July 23rd, 2010
9:28 am
“OK. Once the conservatives see the world the same way you do then we can start to have conversations as to how to solve the issue.”
No….not what I meant! My point is that conservatives deny that their policies and their inflections aren’t the source of the problem; they feel that only progressive policies are the root cause of racism. What conservatives need to realize is that political conservatism is somewhat based in racist ideology…starting from the 1964 Dixiecrat invasion of the GOP…progressing to the 1968 Nixonian “Southern Strategy”….accelerating in Reagan’s 1980 support of “states’ rights” in the South!! Many also lay blame at LBJ’s feet with the passage of the “Great Society”…and use it as the cause of the demise of the black family. To a point, that is also true!!
“As a moderate I don’t agree with conservatives or liberals consistently. I don’t believe that everyone should believe the same way as I do. In fact I believe in having converstations with people who disagree with me so I can understand how they feel and why they believe what they believe. ”
No argument there….what many white people need to understand is that the preponderance of black people DO have conservative beliefs…education, solid work ethic, family….but too many view them in the MINORITY…which is not true!! The big problem is that politically, the GOP is NOT a viable option for the black vote….for the GOP does not want to address certain black issues honestly!! I’ve noted how those who disagree with conservative idiom (i.e., Colin Powell) get treated in the GOP. As Colin Powell stated: “I didn’t leave the party….the party left ME!”
Big D – Good points!! Well said!!
JohnnyReb
July 23rd, 2010
10:13 am
“The political standoff that exists in Washington today would exist even if Obama looked and talked like Mitt Romney, because it is based on honest differences of policy and ideology, not race.”
It is true someone looking like Romney with Obama’s ideology might do the same as has Obama, but the real Romney would not.
Obama is a black radical with enough sense not to act like the black panthers, and while his agenda may be aimed at other races he considers to have been wronged by the white man, it is clearly based on Obama being indoctrinated his whole life by people like Jereamiah Wright.
All of Obama’s big legislative pieces force money from those who have it to be spread to those who do not.
This country put a radical in the white house and we are paying for it, at least until November.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:14 am
Im not confused at all, but if your going to comment on something , no what your talkling about..you obviously didnt realize I was responding to someone else, and by so, wrongly accused me of something I didnt say
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
10:15 am
jo nix … I prefer naval contemplation
BenFranklin
July 23rd, 2010
10:15 am
JB and friends:
Maybe we should ask all of those wonderful scribes from JOURNOLIST what their thoughts are on race. JB, if you have an account, you could share your colleagues’ insights.
I’ll pay more respect to authority when race is left off of applications for work, schools, etc.
jt
July 23rd, 2010
10:16 am
jm- you wrote.
“Of course, Irish, Sweeds, Jews and Poles are essentially white,”
What the hades do you mean by “essentially” ????????????
You don’t get no whiter than this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDSud7vAH_0&feature=related
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
10:16 am
“Fox hadn’t even aired a single segment concerning this video before Sherrod was fired, but don’t let facts get in the way of your hysteria”
“The Agriculture Department announced Monday, shortly after FoxNews.com published its initial report on the video, that Sherrod had resigned.”
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/07/19/clip-shows-usda-official-admitting-withheld-help-white-farmer/
don’t let facts get in the way of your hysteria
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
10:16 am
“JOURNOLIST”
SQUIRREL!
RF
July 23rd, 2010
10:17 am
As a dear friend of mine once said during a discussion about how to reach our poor and minority kids better in our school: “You have to quit looking at yourself at white or black and quit looking at the kids as white, black, latino, or poor. You just have to love them and make sure they know you care about them as a living, breathing, feeling human being. When the categories we put ourselves and them in cease to matter, there is no struggle to teach them…”
Of course, quit finger pointing and the news shows would be a LOT shorter.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
10:17 am
jt
jt
July 23rd, 2010
10:18 am
And joNix…………..tankx
I knew someone here had a sense of humor. I grant you permission to use it.
You will hear of this term on REAL news networks in the future.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
10:18 am
RW, you are correct about the timing of the firing. It did precede the Fox barrage.
But the Fox barrage occurred nonetheless.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
10:18 am
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
10:15 am
jo nix … I prefer naval contemplation
+++++++=
An orange?
@@
July 23rd, 2010
10:19 am
HEY! I take issue with George Carlin’s forbidden dance during those 2…3 months when I happen not to be black. It’s happening, dude, whether you like(d) it or not.
Happens to be black? Too funny, considering!
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
10:20 am
“SQUIRREL!”
USinUK – what’s so funny to ME is that I never heard of JOURNOLIST until I saw a mention of it on MMFA. I can go there, read the headlines, find out what’s the latest meme from JUST those headlines and then come here and confidently expect they WILL be brought up. Usually, quite quickly too!
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
10:21 am
“RW, you are correct about the timing of the firing. It did precede the Fox barrage”
Not according to FOX itself…see my reply
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
10:21 am
Doggone, as I understand it, the chronology went:
1. Firing occurs.
2. O’Reilly makes initial mention of tape, but doesn’t show it.
3. Firing is announced.
4. Fox goes crazy.
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
10:21 am
RW, do you believe FOX covered the Sherrod story fairly?
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
10:21 am
Moderate Line, I would not use the word “tribute” beyond the fact that what I know about Carlin suggests he would be embarassed and uncomfortable being “honored” as such (I refer to him as my lord and savior, and as THE founding father of my political ethic). I use the prefix neo as a tongue in cheek shout out to the (dumb) neo-cons, but also to underscore the fact that there were 2 George Carlins; the straight laced, suit and tie, mainstream America Ed Sullivan show Carlin, and the counter-culture, seven dirty words, drug addict and anarchist Carlin. like most artists, there was a dark area in his psyche and lile most people, he wrestled with demons, and as I said, I think he would be absolutely pissed off (in a Monty Python’s “Life of Brian” kind of way) that I now see him as something of a demigod.
barking frog
July 23rd, 2010
10:21 am
I have never seen a white person(although albinos come close). I have never seen a black
person. All the people I have seen are different shades of brown. Hispanic has something
to do with the language a person speaks but I don’t know if I become hispanic if I learn
to speak spanish. Also will I become Asian if I move to china and return? Mexican is
a nationality not a race so I could become Mexican. America is a continent sometimes
named by North and South so I guess everyone that lives on this continent is American.
Underneath all this BS its all about money.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
10:22 am
Fred … yep, that type, too …
Doggone … I just think the poutrage is a laugh effing riot … liberal writers writing for liberal publications talking about liberal topics. color me unimpressed, as scandals go.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:22 am
DoggoneGA,
In your haste to nitpick you seem to have missed the word AIRED.
A CONSERVATIVE
July 23rd, 2010
10:22 am
JAY THE AJC has lost thousands of white readers due to the papers passionate dislike for white conservative Christians…& their values…
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:24 am
LHU,
I really couldn’t say whether they covered it fairly or not. The only part of their coverage I actually saw was Glenn Beck and he seemed to be channeling Jay B.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
10:24 am
“All the people I have seen are different shades of brown”
then I’m a very pasty shade of brown …
(sounds like a bad version of whiter shade of pale)
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:24 am
Doggone, thats when it was announced, not when she was acctually fired..and once again, why just Fox News..CNN erported the same thing Fox did
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
10:25 am
@neo-Carlinist – Fair enough, and I knew Carlin as well. Frank Zappa introduced him to my mother and I in California back in the 70s (Zappa and mom ran in the same circles). And I’m a satirist and write for a number of publications and am toying with a new blog concept.
When my family moved to Atlanta, it was in the midst of the white flight era and, while I agree with you and others about the equally poor governing of the black political establishment in Atlanta, I saw firsthand the new lines being drawn in the sand between blacks and whites in this city and recognized how whites perceived their black neighbors. I also recognize the new racist paradigm in this country and find the divisiveness stems largely from the cultural misunderstandings between the races – black, white, Hispanic, Middle Eastern, Indian, etc. However, I cannot ignore that a large majority of whites (especially those of the WASP variety) continue to perpetuate the practices of their forefathers, though now creatively veiled in “patriotism.”
@jm – Ah, but the Irish (as I am one of those as well), were primarily Catholic and, thus, not “white” in the sense of the white establishment of the US (and how Jack Kennedy became president is an absolute miracle). Poles and Sweedes spoke strange languages and Jews, well, we know how the klan reacted to them (and you people do know that the KKK was THE largest fraternal organization in the US in 1925 – extending far beyond the borders of the South).
The magna carta was defunct after WWI. Actually, it was defunct after the Panama Canal. As for the “liberation of Iraq” – surely you jest. We created that mess too, you know.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
10:26 am
“Obama is a black radical with enough sense not to act like the black panthers, and while his agenda may be aimed at other races he considers to have been wronged by the white man, it is clearly based on Obama being indoctrinated his whole life by people like Jereamiah Wright”
@reb: Thank you for the fine example of 21st century racism at its finest! If he’s “radical”, is it any worse to be a “black” radical? Why does black matter?
What evidence do you have of his association with the black panther organization?
What, in his writings or speeches (or videos- talk to Breitbart, he’ll share his library with you) proves that Obama was “indoctrinated” by Wright? He attended the church. I attended a Baptist church for years, but they didn’t “indoctrinate” me to anything…especially since being gay is so frowned upon by them.
The modern racist uses words like “radical” “terrorist” and “indoctrination” and “agenda” to cover up what they really feel- they think he’s a black man out to destroy the all-deserving white folks who are the only real workers and taxpayers in this country. It’s like my grandmother talking about “the coloreds”, as if using another word made her opinions any less racially motivated.
Gotta find some new verbage- we’re on to the current vocabulary.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
10:26 am
Okay, I posted and what do I get in response? A couple of comments on a little off-the-cuff half-witticism that had nothing to do with the discussion of race.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
10:26 am
Neo, about your last line regarding Carlin:
I wrote something similar in a post right after his death, and Carlin fans around the country jumped me as a Carlin hater.
Which I am not by any means.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
10:27 am
Jay…then were does this quote from FOX itself fall into the chronology: “shortly after FoxNews.com published its initial report on the video”
Keith
July 23rd, 2010
10:30 am
Okay, we’ve heard “her” side of the supposed murder of her father. I’m sure there’s another side to that considering the FACT that no charges were filed.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
10:30 am
“In your haste to nitpick you seem to have missed the word AIRED”
According to dictionary.com…one of the many, many definitions of “air” (as a verb) is: to expose ostentatiously; bring to public notice; display
Equality 7-2521
July 23rd, 2010
10:31 am
Decision Tree of Liberal Newspapers:
IF black AND liberal, THEN Cover
IF black AND conservative, THEN Disparage
IF black AND libertarian, THEN Ignore.
John Monds, Libertarian Candidate for Governor, the first Libertarian to ever receive a million votes in a State Wide Race.
Where is the media coverage on Monds? Is it because he is not using his race to propel his career? Is it because those that vote for him have already moved to a future where race is not the issue, but what he believes and supports is?
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
10:31 am
@ModerateLine – and for what reasons do you think that the Governor and Legislative majority have all but abandoned MARTA or any kind of substantial public transportation – a system that largely benefits minorities and lower-class working types?
DP
July 23rd, 2010
10:31 am
I watched the entirety of Sherrod’s speech and she was done a great disservice, first by Breitbart and the right wing talk circuit that jumped on it, then by the Obama administration. She seems like a very nice lady and I admire that she is not consumed by hatred after the murder of her father and the racism she endured growing up in south Georgia in the 50’s and 60’s.
However, there were a few things that disturbed me in her speech, not specific to her but with regard to business as usual at the federal government.
Early in her speech, she talks about how many African Americans don’t think about careers in agriculture because their first thought about agriculture is working in the fields. She talks about how many good government jobs there are and says something to the effect of “When’s the last time you saw somebody lose their government job?”
Later, she laments that the Agriculture Department has a lot of money to give away but not enough people are applying for it, either because they don’t know about it or because their credit score isn’t good enough. She mentions $7500 grants (i.e. gifts, don’t have to be repaid) for low income people to fix up their houses, 1% loans for up to $20,000 for home renovations, 100% loans for mortgages.
Our country is essentially bankrupt, we’ve seen that home ownership can be a millstone around the neck of people who can’t even scrape together a down payment, much less pay for ongoing maintenance. We hear about fiscal austerity, underfunded state pension funds, etc., yet the federal government still has pots of money (actually borrowed money) available to pour more money into housing (which we’ve already spent far too much on as a society) along with jobs that will never be at risk of elimination, unlike those in the private sector.
Russ555
July 23rd, 2010
10:31 am
Talking about race in public is always dangerous, especially for a federal employee or someone in politics. Subject to misinterpretation and misunderstanding, and basic disagreements. Hard to do without being subject to attach and criicism from all sides. Most people avoid the issue and play it safe. Except for whispers to family and friends.
Don’t think we will ever be post race as long as race exists. It will always be there and a factor. As she put it, question is whether or how much it matters.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:31 am
RF, while I wont call Obama a racist, I will call him a radical. If he isnt, explain why on his website under “Organzing for America” why would he have in the suggested reading, Rules for Radicals”.which btw the author, Saul Alinsky, dedicates the book to satan
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
10:31 am
perhaps I missed a double entendre, but Bruno and Josef, navel gazing/contemplation (what bloggers do) is not the same as naval gazing (what Tom Clancy and convicted spy Jonathan Pollard does)
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
10:32 am
“Okay, we’ve heard “her” side of the supposed murder of her father. I’m sure there’s another side to that considering the FACT that no charges were filed.”
I mean. just. wow.
pat
July 23rd, 2010
10:32 am
Uh, not a fan of Bush, but people many folks were down right nasty, calling for his death and such.
There will always be racists of all demographics, I don’t feel the need to dwell on ignorance though.
jm
July 23rd, 2010
10:33 am
Jay, would be interested in your thoughts on this one. I have a hard time disagreeing with it Democratic Senator Webb.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703724104575379630952309408.html
Karen
July 23rd, 2010
10:34 am
Jay, I hope that “The Sherrod Incident” will lead to some thoughtful discussions amongst ourselves about race. The culture from which we come shapes us in ways untold. To be candid with one another, requires speaking and listening with impunity, something so lacking in our society now. Thanks for your succint words on this topic.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:34 am
Jay B,
I think the fact that O’Reilly mentions the tape but doesn’t show it is pretty responsible reporting because his show is one of the few that are taped and she hadn’t been fired yet when he taped the segment.
DoggoneGA,
What does your dictionary say about the difference between channel and dot com?
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
10:36 am
Equality
“Where is the media coverage on Monds? Is it because he is not using his race to propel his career? Is it because those that vote for him have already moved to a future where race is not the issue, but what he believes and supports is?”
I’ve been asking myself the same question. I’ll probably wind up voting for him and not because I’m a Libertarian, but because its a choice other than cancer or polio being offered by the Dems or GOP. Since I probably will, I’ve been paying closer attention to what I’ll probably be voting for…
But don’t count on the media hacks to give him or his campaign any attention…not divisive enough to make “good” copy…
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
10:36 am
@Mark – this country was founded by radicals and radical ideas … I imagine the Tories probably felt much like you do now.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
10:37 am
What is your point Keith? You want to open up a murder investigation? Her point was to describe where she had come from to explain where she currently is. How she overcame her own preconceived notions and prejudices through understanding and compassion. The death of her father is only a part of the whole. Why don’t we focus on the whole instead of trying to nit pick a little here and there and get further out of context?
jt
July 23rd, 2010
10:37 am
Equality 7-2521
That upsets their little world. They will vote for whom they are told to vote.
Good post.
With that, I will take my “essentially white” self to work.
There’s no shades here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBsrZ-016fs&feature=related
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
10:37 am
“why just Fox News”
Because the charge has been made, repeatedly, that she had been fired BEFORE FOX news reported on it.
jm
July 23rd, 2010
10:37 am
jt – on “essentially”, I figured that would get some attention after I wrote it. Who cares? I’m not too particular about race. Most people, though not all, will find non-white ancestry in their family tree. Whatever, for all intents and purposes, yes of course they’re white.
@@
July 23rd, 2010
10:38 am
I LUV’d George Carlin. He was unsurpassed in his astute observations of humankind. Got a little macabre during the end of his life. I think he’d given up on us. I think he always knew he’d have to.
RIP, George.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:39 am
josef nix
He sounds pretty good to me
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
10:40 am
I haven’t had time to read the entire blog this morning, but I wanted to weigh in on the whole Breitbart issue. Here’s the thing that everyone is either missing, or deliberately ignoring…I have seen at least 3 interviews with him since this whole thing began. His point from the beginning was that the story was not about Ms. Sherrod. His whole point is that when she said that she had denied complete help to the farmer because he was white, THE PEOPLE IN THE AUDIENCE…MEMBERS OF THE NAACP…LAUGHED AND APPLAUDED. THAT is the story here. It never was about Ms. Sherrod’s supposed racism, that was President Obama’s assertion. Breitbart said from the beginning that it was about the racism exhibited by the members of the NAACP that he was pointing out in light of THEIR condemnation of the Tea Party.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
10:40 am
neoCarlist
Unmentionable says to give you a shout out on that one, says he’ll talk to you about Clancy! But, yes, contemplation…ego centric…used in its proper meaning, not the Engrish interpretation…
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
10:40 am
ok, that exactley right..she was fired BEFORE Fox News reported on it…so how is that there fault?
John Birch
July 23rd, 2010
10:43 am
Okay, taken in full context Sherrod was relating a story about overcoming her racial prejudices. However, isn’t just the phrase “their own kind” patently racist, the kind of comment the NAACP would eact to if it had been made by a white person? Secondly, when the Dekalb board recntly followed her advice and alleged spent $1M more of the taxpayers money to hire an attorney of “ther own kind” isn’t that racist as well? Is it okay for minorities to be racist?
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:44 am
chuck,
You’re right in what you say the point was, but if you stick around to read the responses to your 10:40 you’re going to find out the left side of this blog has already flushed that possibility down the rabbit hole and refuses to even entertain it.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
10:45 am
The firing was not Fox’s fault. That one’s on the administration.
The rush to use the faulty tape as evidence of Sherrod’s racism — a rush designed to inflame the righteous sense of persecution among Fox’s audience — THAT is on Fox.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:47 am
Jay B,
Why wouldn’t Fox take the tape at face value once the administration had fired her over it?
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
10:47 am
Mark and Equality…
I’ll say this for Monds, he’s talking about things that matter,
RF
July 23rd, 2010
10:47 am
Okay, I’m a sucker for British humor. Here’s a racism test to view. See how YOU score!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cebo_kI_BOo&feature=related
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:48 am
No fair Jay B. Nobody else gets to remove their comment when they hit submit without typing anything.
Class of '98
July 23rd, 2010
10:48 am
“But if we’re honest, we must also acknowledge that race has given some of the opposition to Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration.”
Fine. We can agree on that. Can we also agree that 95% of blacks vote for a black candidate simply because he or she is black? If we’re honest, we must acknowledge that a high percentage of blacks distrusts whites for nothing else than the color of their skin.
If this country ever sees a presidential election between a white candidate and a black candidate, and both white and black electorates vote in roughly equal numbers for each candidate, we will finally claim to have achieved that “post-racial” America we all yearn for so badly.
Maybe a thousand years from now.
Lord Help Us
July 23rd, 2010
10:48 am
RW, so you don’t know if FOX covered the story fairly…cough, cough…
How about Breitbart…do you see any fault with him…or do you intend to take the fifth again…
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
10:49 am
RW
“Why wouldn’t Fox take the tape at face value once the administration had fired her over it?”
The EOI perspective…
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
10:49 am
chuck July 23rd, 2010
10:40 am
“His whole point is that when she said that she had denied complete help to the farmer because he was white, THE PEOPLE IN THE AUDIENCE…MEMBERS OF THE NAACP…LAUGHED AND APPLAUDED. THAT is the story here.”
Since that did NOT happen, Breitbart was wrong AGAIN!! Since he’d never experienced a person’s giving a testimony…and the audience’s acknowledgment of said experience, it would appear to the unenlightened that the audience was laughing…when they were, in actuality, acknowledging and agreeing with the experience!
Remember what MLK said: “11AM on Sunday is the most segregated time in America!”
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
10:49 am
And Chuck, when Breitbart makes that claim repeatedly, he’s repeatedly lying.
Go back to his original post. As RW and I discussed earlier:
Here’s what Breitbart said in his first post on the subject:
http://biggovernment.com/abreitbart/2010/07/19/video-proof-the-naacp-awards-racism2010/
“Context is everything.
In this piece you will see video evidence of racism coming from a federal appointee and NAACP award recipient and in another clip from the same event a perfect rationalization for why the Tea Party needs to exist…”
He then goes into a long recounting of the Tea Party vs. NAACP feud before returning to the tape.
“We are in possession of a video from in which Shirley Sherrod, USDA Georgia Director of Rural Development, speaks at the NAACP Freedom Fund dinner in Georgia. In her meandering speech to what appears to be an all-black audience, this federally appointed executive bureaucrat lays out in stark detail, that her federal duties are managed through the prism of race and class distinctions.
In the first video, Sherrod describes how she racially discriminates against a white farmer. She describes how she is torn over how much she will choose to help him. And, she admits that she doesn’t do everything she can for him, because he is white. Eventually, her basic humanity informs that this white man is poor and needs help. But she decides that he should get help from “one of his own kind”. She refers him to a white lawyer.
Sherrod’s racist tale is received by the NAACP audience with nodding approval and murmurs of recognition and agreement. Hardly the behavior of the group now holding itself up as the supreme judge of another groups’ racial tolerance.
The crowd reaction is mentioned, but only in passing. The emphasis is on “racism coming from a federal appointee and NAACP award recipient” who manages her federal duties “through the prism of race and class distinctions” and “racially discriminates against a white farmer.”
Breitbart’s latest claims are after-the-fact baloney, to use a sadly inadequate euphemism.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
10:50 am
@RW/Chuck – how is the NAACP audience’s reaction any different than the reactions of conservative audiences to ideas like “we must fight our Muslim, socialist president” or “WE (and who is “we” exactly) have to take our country back from the immigrants who are destroying this great nation.”
DP
July 23rd, 2010
10:50 am
Well Chuck, the problem is that the NAACP audience didn’t “laugh and applaud” when Sherrod said she denied complete help. Watch the speech on line if you doubt it; the part in question is in the first 5 or 10 minutes. The audience was most supportive (with some audible encouragement, can’t remember if there was any applause or not) when she said God touched her heart and she realized it was about helping poor people, not about black versus white.
We have no hope as a country if people continue to get their “facts” from the likes of Fox News and MSNBC without thinking critically and verifying information on their own.
Mick
July 23rd, 2010
10:51 am
johnny reb
Paranoia will destroy ya. I suppose you are in favor of preserving tax cuts for the wealthy 2 percenters? Amazing how many average joes want to protect those that can afford to pay more. They want to wriggle out of it but their tax increases are but a drop in the bucket in relation to their wealth. They should pay more, why not?
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:51 am
LHU,
Dude, I told you I hadn’t seen Fox coverage of the story and I hadn’t. If all you’re here for is to call me a liar I don’t have the time or inclination to converse with you.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
10:52 am
@Class of 98 “If we’re honest, we must acknowledge that a high percentage of blacks distrusts whites for nothing else than the color of their skin.”
No, a high percentage of blacks distrust whites because of a very long history of whites giving them the shaft, beginning with slavery and up to, most recently, the disenfranchisement of unforced segregation.
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
10:52 am
chuck – you may actually want to watch the video yourself, rather than rely on Breitbart’s self-serving excuses …
“Furthermore, I sat down to watch the clip in question again, and I don’t see evidence even for Breitbart’s latest claims. Early in the clip, the audience responds and chuckles along with Sherrod. But once she begins to talk about doing less than she might have for the white farmer, that reaction ceases and the audience falls quiet. Take a look for yourself:”
http://blogs.ajc.com/jay-bookman-blog/2010/07/21/sherrod-likely-to-get-job-back-breitbart-still-flinging-baloney/
RF
July 23rd, 2010
10:52 am
@RW and Chuck- yes the crowd chuckled. They did because they’ve all felt that way at times. After a long history of struggle, of course some feel the need for retribution. This woman showed them though, how wrong that view was by telling them what she learned. She taught them to inspect their own views and consider their thinking. The point of Breitbart’s posting of the edited video was to get this woman and the NAACP for her racism. Breitbart didn’t care about or point out the chuckling, cheering, whatever until after he was caught. Pointing out their reaction doesn’t make Breitbart innocent, and you know it. It’s the childhood argument of “he touched me fiiiiiirrrst!”
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
10:53 am
JacobLocke, well then, I am sure you will agree that Carlin viewed the majority of people as dumb, superstitious and prone to surrender critical thinking/independent thought for the false security of being part of a larger herd – one of my favorite Carlin observations – “think about how stupid the average person is, and realize that half the population is stupider”). but Carlin also noted that people are kept in herds for a reason, which has nothing to do with personal security (or growth). and JB, I think Carlin was something of a “Carlin hater” himself, if you know what I mean.
Jay
July 23rd, 2010
10:53 am
““Why wouldn’t Fox take the tape at face value once the administration had fired her over it?””
Uh huh. Because Fox always takes administration actions at face value.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:53 am
Jacob,
I don’t see how the reactions would be any different as you describe them. Do you have some video to share so we can compare the scenes?
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
10:54 am
RF
Funny…but Johnny Depp is an Indian…oooh noooo!
jm
July 23rd, 2010
10:56 am
When will people see poverty instead of race? Our laws for helping people advance should be based on income, not race.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
10:56 am
“Uh huh. Because Fox always takes administration actions at face value.”
And which face would that be?
Moderate Line
July 23rd, 2010
10:58 am
racism. What conservatives need to realize is that political conservatism is somewhat based in racist ideolog
what many white people need to understand is that the preponderance of black people DO have conservative beliefs
++++++++++++
Maybe you need to realize or understand something about white conservatives. How does that statement make you feel? Does it make you less likely or more likely to listen to what I have to say. Does it make you more defensive as if your under attack?
Based on what you wrote you don’t seem to think you need to understand or realize anythings about white conservatives. Perhaps they feel the same way.
Now we are at an impasse.
Colin Powell stated: “I didn’t leave the party….the party left ME!”
I thought Ronald Reagan said that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_Reagan
Class of '98
July 23rd, 2010
10:58 am
@JacobLocke—
Fewer than 5% of whites owned slaves in 1860. Also, many, many Africans got rich on the slave trade too. Native Africans captured members of rival tribes and sold them to white men.
Using your logic, blacks should be just as distrustful of other blacks.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
10:59 am
Uh huh. Because Fox always takes administration actions at face value.
Jay B,
Need I mention once again that you and Fox’s Glenn Beck had the very same perspective on this? Your paper even said so except they left your name out of the story.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
11:00 am
@neo-Carlinist – Yes! The herd mentality is exactly my problem with much of the country. This whole Sherrod incident is another example of how dangerous this paradigm is – and it affects the black community too (see Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, et al).
@RW – sure
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=336974536902
Don't forget
July 23rd, 2010
11:00 am
Does anybody know if Christian Adams was asked if he thought he had violated the Hatch act?
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
11:00 am
doggone, the charges that I have heard from the NAACP is that they were “snookered” by O’Reilly and Hannity NOT Fox News. The point is that Sherrod was fired before EITHER of them made any kind of comments on the story. THAT is the FACT. CNN reported the story almost exactly the way it was reported by Fox in the beginning. Fox in fact, unless I missed something, was the first to report that there was more on the tape.
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
11:00 am
I wonder….how many people would call this statement “racist” now??
“A good many observers have remarked that if equality could come at once the Negro would not be ready for it. I submit that
the white American is even more unprepared.”
Martin Luther King, Jr.
“Where Do We Go From Here: Chaos or Community?” 1967.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
11:01 am
“blacks should be just as distrustful of other blacks.”
I would suspect that the first generation of blacks “exported” to slavery DID. But their children, and subsequent generations who grew up under slave conditions would blame their owners, not the people they never met who put their parents into that slave condition.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
11:03 am
@@ spot on re: the end of Carlin’s career. and interestingly enough, if you check out some of the non-performance/interviews clips form the last 2-3 years of his life, you will see that off stage, he was quite reflective and insightful, and while he was absolutely frustrated and disappointed with mankind as a whole, he saw great beauty and “potential” in the lives and dreams of individuals. to paraphrase, “once people start talking about values, or morality it becomes a means to discriminate or marginalize…” race, religion (politics) is no different.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
11:03 am
josef nix…I didnt know a lot about him until you mentioned him so I looked him up…like I said sounds pretty good, just hope he’s not your typical politician..say anything to elected
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
11:04 am
@Doggone/Ga – Well, you’ve said plenty with that statement. Nice revisionist history. They teach you that at “Jawja?”
Don't forget
July 23rd, 2010
11:05 am
HDB
I think your post illustrates how comments have to be taken in the context of the times in which they were made.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
11:05 am
Jacob,
Just so I’m clear on this. Are you for or against heavily edited videos?
Where's My Party?
July 23rd, 2010
11:05 am
Is it appropriate to go “FOX News…..SQUIRREL”. I think it is.
On Monds, I agree with Equality and Josef. Other than editorial and opinion page blogs, I find no coverage in the AJC about his campaign. Maybe i am just missing it. I think the main reason is that he is lacking the funds for ads, signs, etc. He sent out an email that did make a very good point on the results of the primaries.
“This was supposed to be the year of angry voters, right? Apparently the handful of establishment voters in yesterday’s primary didn’t get the message. Whatever they might say with their mouths, they spoke more clearly with their votes.
And what did these partisans say?
They said that you deserve to have 3 other remaining candidates for governor with a combined total of 51 years in public office.”
Good point.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
11:05 am
Quick, don’t google, who is President Obama’s head of the Bureau of Indian affairs…
Just trying to have a dialogue on race here…
RF
July 23rd, 2010
11:05 am
HDB- personally, I think he’s right.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
11:05 am
Dont Forget
Christian Adams resigned so he was no longer a federal employee
Class of '98
July 23rd, 2010
11:07 am
Okay Doggone/GA, point taken. I agree. Blacks should have every right to distrust those who put their parents into that slave condition.
But I don’t know anybody who owns slaves. Do you?
Those that put their (great-great-great-grand) parents into that condition died a long time ago.
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
11:07 am
USinUK, I did watch the tape myself. It’s been on the news on every network all week. I heard the same thing that Breitbart heard. TRUTH TIME, If you had heard a WHITE AG worker making those comments about a BLACK farmer, you would have been outraged and so would I. The TRUTH, though, and also the difference between you and me, is that you would have laughed at that part of Sherrod’s speech where I would have been outraged in BOTH situations. You see, the part of the speech that is redemptive (on her behalf), was not the story. The HYPOCRISY of the NAACP is the story. Where are the calls for them to remove the “racist elements” from THEIR group.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
11:07 am
Mark
he probably is and probably will, but at least he’s not Tweedle-De-Dum or Tweedle-De-Dee
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
11:08 am
Moderate Line July 23rd, 2010
10:58 am
“Maybe you need to realize or understand something about white conservatives. How does that statement make you feel? Does it make you less likely or more likely to listen to what I have to say. Does it make you more defensive as if your under attack?
Based on what you wrote you don’t seem to think you need to understand or realize anythings about white conservatives. Perhaps they feel the same way.
Now we are at an impasse.”
I was always taught that the truth HURTS…but it also will set you free!! A review of history will show that that statement is true!! You asked me how I feel; to be honest, it does pain me to have to state what has been done…and what continues to be done! In “A Few Good Men”, Jack Nicholson said it best: “You CAN’T handle the truth!” When we start dealing with the truth…no matter how bad it hurts, then we can work on resolving the issues!! I DO want to understand more about white conservatives….but their current actions have made themselves evident; how does one get past that paradigm??
I’m willing to listen…if one is willing to come honestly….and based in truth!!
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
11:09 am
who is President Obama’s head of the Bureau of Indian affairs…
Jack Abramoff?
RF
July 23rd, 2010
11:09 am
Josef- I knew the answer to that, but have forgotten. What we’ve all been “snookered” into is discussing race as black vs. white, or white vs. black issue. At least we’re not having to watch Jan Brewer go on about her ludicrous immigration law…
Don't forget
July 23rd, 2010
11:09 am
Mark,
My understanding is that Christian Adams is a long time right wing activist. So, did anyone ask him?
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
11:11 am
RW
From the corner…”hey, at least he’s paying attention that there may be something else besides black and white…”
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
11:11 am
Must be a pretty boring spy novel
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
11:12 am
Don’t forget
July 23rd, 2010
11:05 am
HDB
I think your post illustrates how comments have to be taken in the context of the times in which they were made.
Question: Why shouldn’t Shirley Sherrod’s statement be treated LIKEWISE?? THIS is the point that needs to be realized!! Ms. Sherrod was referrring to an incident in her life that occurred 24 YEARS ago prior to her becoming a government employee…..no one has looked at that concept!!
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
11:13 am
This is classic …
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8500HxYv-FE&feature=related
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
11:13 am
Jay, I have never been to Breitbart’s site, but in your post, you acknowledge that he did mention the NAACP audience. My assertion is that in every INTERVIEW that I saw Breitbart give, he focused on the audience reaction and NOT Sherrod, Additionally, the NAACP had complete possesion and control over the ENTIRE VIDEO and yet THEY condemned Sherrod FROM THE BEGINNING.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
11:15 am
RW
Nanh, and he says to leave him the hell alone…but I’m only interrupting him when somebody touches on the subject…so, he’s pretty safe from interruption…
RF
Larry Echohawk…but he’s not a goy!
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
11:16 am
“If you had heard a WHITE AG worker making those comments about a BLACK farmer, you would have been outraged and so would I.”
if that was the ONLY quote I saw, of course I would. but, of course, context is everything – as this week has proven – isn’t it? what she was, in fact, saying was the the exact opposite of the highly edited video.
as for Breitbart’s after-the-fact interviews … it’s called CYA.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
11:18 am
Dont Forget
I believe that’s true but what has he said that would violate it?
Jefferson
July 23rd, 2010
11:18 am
Speaking on races, I don’t like a Ford or anyone who does.
Outhouse GoKart
July 23rd, 2010
11:19 am
“And that “great white hope” crap in your last paragraph is just about the biggest chip on a white man’s shoulder, isn’t it. No one is asking for a “bailout.” What’s happening in Atlanta is “good ole boy” politics of the worst sort. And, yes, I’ll blame white folks. White people destroyed Native Americans. White people created the African diaspora. White people destroyed the structure of the African-American family. White people formed the KKK. White people abused the Chinaman, the Irishman, the Sweed, the Jew, the Pole – over the entire history of this great nation, White people have inflicted more damage on the vitality of this nation than any other ethnicity in this great country of ours. However, I’ve yet to meet a white man who is willing to recognize those atrocities and engage in an actual discussion about them.”
Blame, blame, blame…lol.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
11:20 am
Jefferson- Definitely CHEVY for me!
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
11:20 am
Only in loony lefty lala land can something that’s apparent in the initial posting be called after the fact.
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
11:21 am
Just curious, Does anyone know whether Breitbart even had the entire video? I don’t know the answer to that question. We do know however that the NAACP did.
Scooter
July 23rd, 2010
11:22 am
Speaking on races, I don’t like a Ford or anyone who does
Only a bigot would say something like that! And I’m with you.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
11:22 am
@outhouse gokart – you’re a little behind the discussion – you may want to catch up.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
11:22 am
“loony lefty lala land” —But is’t so much more FUN over here than in stodgy, hateful, morally upright Righty-tighty land…
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
11:23 am
And I just realized, that should be “Swede” (sorry, grandpa).
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
11:23 am
this may appear profoundly obvious to all critical thinkers (left, right, middle, and carlinists) RACISM is not so much a character flaw as it is a “weapon” or tactical tool for those who would profit from any type of war or even competition. as I said, how is positioning whites against blacks for the purpose of garnering votes, any different than positioning the Netherlands against Spain for the purposes of generating revenue (the World Cup)? again, this may sound obvious, but either nobody is a racist, or we’re all racists. as I noted a couple days ago, even Christians (or Muslims) who feel their god or their “faith” makes them superior (in god’s eyes) demostrate “racism”. how is what Tim McVeigh did any different than what the 9/11 terrorists did? terrorists are criminals and race or creed is not what makes them “criminal” but rather the accelerate used by OTHERS to foster criminal behavior. look no futher than JB’s data on the amount of air time and attention Fox News gave the New Black Panthers. If Fox News really cares about the future of the USA it needs to spend more time covering the antics of Lady Gaga or Katy Perry. Fox gave some clown in a beret “15 hours of fame” because it drew viewers, which the sales people could then take to advertisers and say; “here’s our demographic bewteen 8-10 PM, doesn’t it make sense to advertise with us?”
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
11:24 am
chuck – “Does anyone know whether Breitbart even had the entire video?”
he’s had the video since March.
popeye
July 23rd, 2010
11:24 am
Jay…you got the chronology pretty much correct on your 10:21 except you left out the part on what transpired the next day….
When Fox once again went loopy calling the administration out for acting so hastily. You can’t win with that crowd!
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
11:26 am
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
11:01 am
I would suspect that the first generation of blacks “exported” to slavery DID. But their children, and subsequent generations who grew up under slave conditions would blame their owners, not the people they never met who put their parents into that slave condition.
++++++++++
But isn’t that what you are doing? Holding ALL white people responsible for what 5% of the population in 1860 did? I didn’t have any slaves. You weren’t a slave. Hell, my family didn’t come to this Country until long after slavery was abolished. This whole “race issue” and your silly code words thing is old and tired. If you want to combat slavery, then go to Africa where it is STILL practiced today. Get over yourself. Blacks aren’t the only people to have been slaves.
The future can never come if you are worried about digging up the past and living it. As a white man, I owe the black race NOTHING. As a human being, I owe my fellow human beings nothing other than to treat them as I wish to be treated regardless of the color of their skin. The blame game leads no where. Instead of casting blame and making excuses how about we all just work for a solution. (The same thing would work for our economy as well lol.)
Mick
July 23rd, 2010
11:26 am
The boob tube and talking heads, what a splendid convergence at this point in time. When I was a young teen our tv died and my dad vowed not to replace it. The first few days felt like an old friend gone missing but then something happened. Each day without it really did free up your thinking and reading was relaxing, this is when I got hooked on newspapers and reading, I still buy one everyday. We all have great capability to adapt to the situation, we just don’t realize it. Eventually, we got another tv, mainly because the dolphins were undefeated and going to the super bowl, even that pivot is revelatory. The point is, fox or msnbc, no matter who you watch or listen too, take a step back and actually process what is being said, many of the talkers are far more interested in perpetuating themselves no matter what the story. So, for old times sake, I still take sabbaticals from tv and life just seems so much cleaner.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
11:26 am
HDB
I dont have any problem with her story about what happened 24 years ago, but her statements about racsim in the teaparty’s about healthcare and that during the 8 years of the Bush admin. that “they” had to endure, that no one made comments about Bush like they have about Obama.
first we “all” had to endure the Bush admin. not just “they” and there are many examples of where Bush was bashed in the media and on the Left..
DP
July 23rd, 2010
11:31 am
Chuck, your repeated assertion that the NAACP audience laughed and applauded when Sherrod said she didn’t give the white farmer all of the support she could is a lie. There were a few chuckles, no applause, when she said that while he was trying to show her he was superior to her she was deciding how much help to give him. When she said she initially didn’t give him her full support there isn’t even a murmur in the audience.
Here’s a link to the full video, you or anybody else can forward to about 16:30.
http://www.naacp.org/news/entry/video_sherrod/
How about you either give one example of where the NAACP audience was inappropriate (with the approximate time into the video noted) or shut up? You can repeat a lie over and over but that doesn’t make it the truth.
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
11:32 am
Hey RF, getting ready for another year in the classroom?
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
11:32 am
DP – “You can repeat a lie over and over but that doesn’t make it the truth.”
the Breitbart M.O.
John Birch
July 23rd, 2010
11:35 am
Today racism is largely perpetuated by those who stand to profit from it, NAACP, Jackson, Sharpton, Breitbart, Bookman, Fox News et al.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
11:35 am
chuck- I taught 4 weeks of summer school, went to a conference in Kentucky, and have some freshman summer camp stuff next week. I haven’t slowed down long enough to get ready and here it comes!! You ready for the rush of pubescent energy headed your way?
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
11:36 am
DP,
Chuck may or may not want to fall into your trap, but whether Breitbart is right or wrong about the audience reaction makes no difference whatsoever to that being the focus of his posting.
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
11:40 am
17:32
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
11:41 am
Looking forward to it RF
USinUK
July 23rd, 2010
11:43 am
RF and chuck and Jo Nix – good luck and good wishes for the new school year! (god knows, I don’t have the patience to do what you guys do)
chuck
July 23rd, 2010
11:43 am
I spent a couple of weeks working with kids in Romania but other than that I’ve been laying by to pool or swimming in it.
TaxPayer
July 23rd, 2010
11:43 am
Speaking of Bill O’Really, I thought Rachel did a most excellent job of setting the facts straight for him. And as for anything Glenn Beck has to say. Well, that about covers it.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
11:46 am
Someone down the line said blacks should be leery of other blacks , basically due (my words here) to blacks being the sellers in africa, of other blacks, to whitey, so whitey could ship them to the usa for retail sale. I would also note that the biggest killer by far of black males 18-45 sure isn’t white people in sheets, it is other black males 18-45.
Statistics don’t lie..liberals do.
@getalife saying “If you talk to the younger generation, you would see more tolerance and that is the future of this country.”
As a gen Y member (under 30 I think they call it) even I can say that should scare you to Freaking death. Todays kids are idiots. Moreso than gen x or gen Y, todays 18-25 somethings are the kind of loser who sues because they skinned a knee playing dodge ball, and want the game banned..and mommy and daddy coddled them so much that, at the first sign of adversity or taunting, they spaz ou and cry or try to lash out, but thanks to living in front of the xbox, their uncoordinated spastic attack looks like rhymic dance finals at the special olympics..it’s fun to watch, try it sometime.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
11:47 am
USinUK- thanks for the good wishes. I still love the job, even after basically a 10% paycut…which is exactly why I taught summer school and did summer camp. Gotta feed the crumb munchers at home!
DP
July 23rd, 2010
11:48 am
Chuck, I heard a few chuckles (as I noted earlier) but I didn’t hear “laughter and applause” as you have falsely asserted several times. And the chuckles weren’t even at the part of the speech that you claimed earlier.
Did you hear applause?
DP
July 23rd, 2010
11:49 am
Oh yeah, we need Rachel Maddow to set everything straight. She’s about as fair and balanced as Glenn Beck.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
11:49 am
chuck
Kids in Romania? The Romany?
@@
July 23rd, 2010
11:51 am
Is the intervention still going on?
Oooohhh MAN! It’s not helping me much.
Here’s how I see it:
Breitbart needs to take care of his business.
All FOX news pundits need to take care of their business.
CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, NBC need to take care of their business.
The NAACP needs to take care of their business, which is the ADVANCEMENT of colored people, not the history of slavery. We know it already.
The Obama administration, Vilsack (sp?), and Mrs. Sherrod need to “take care of the government’s business” which, unfortunately, doesn’t seem to be the people’s business.
Where are the jobs you promised, Mr. President?
And George Carlin is a BAD AMERICAN!
DANG! James Webb is a Democrat? You’d never know it by that piece he wrote in the WSJ. Sounds like a conservative. Switch parties, Senator Webb!!! Your party doesn’t wanna hear what needs to be said.
jay, was your intention to heal me or bring me to heel?
RF
July 23rd, 2010
11:51 am
“Statistics don’t lie..liberals do.” And conservatives tell the truth? ROFLMAO!!!!! Dang, I gotta quit drinking coffee while I read the posts here!
That statistic isn’t news. That fact has been well documented for decades. What kills most caucasian males between 18-25? I’ll guar-on-tee it has something to do with drugs, alcohol, or driving.
Bosch
July 23rd, 2010
11:52 am
“But if we’re honest, we must also acknowledge that race has given some of the opposition to Obama a nasty edge and a passion that at times is out of proportion to its inspiration.”
Amen.
As I’ve written, racism can be subconscious and subtle, it has nothing to do with if you disagree with Obama, you’re racist. I certainly feel that, as Jay wrote, it is the cause for a certain edge to the passion of some — like the Joe Wilson’s of the world.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
11:53 am
@@
He DID switch parties…and is a burr under the saddle of the Democrats!
JohnnyReb
July 23rd, 2010
11:54 am
RF July 23rd, 2010 10:26 am
If he’s (Obama) “radical”, is it any worse to be a “black” radical? Why does black matter? What evidence do you have of his association with the black panther organization?
First, I have no evidence associating Obama with the black panthers and did not state so.
Next, “Why does black matter?” Give me a break. Have you been living in a hole somewhere with no TV? Show me video of white church gatherings where there is the vile ranting against other races as was the case of Wright – where Obama set for 20 years of indoctrination.
I was naive and thought the black race had become pretty much satisfied with how America had changed. Clearly that is not so. Wright, the NAACP, and the new panters show there is still a lot of work to be done. The problem is, there are not enough blacks like Sharrod trying to change the racial attitudes of the black community.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
11:55 am
Here’s what Maddow said in previewing an upcoming segment —
Rick Perry, the governor of Texas, appears to have his sights set on higher office. What is higher office if you’re already governor in Texas? Of course, that would be president of Texas. The return of Confederacy in American politics as seceding from the Union comes back into Republican fashion….yeah, I laughed too!
TaxPayer
July 23rd, 2010
11:56 am
Perhaps, DP would like to discuss the content of the Maddow clip regarding the fairly unbalanced Bill O’Really.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
11:56 am
BOSCH
Good morning….
Hey, let’s get real, I get called a racist all the time over on my side of the aisle any time I dare criticise an Obama policy…
Bosch
July 23rd, 2010
11:57 am
“there are not enough blacks like Sharrod trying to change the racial attitudes of the black community”
Reb,
I disagree. I think, like in most cases, we see the radicals on the TV and think they represent the entire population — remember, sensationalism sells.
Alatsea
July 23rd, 2010
11:57 am
USinUK
How was the corn infused mango salsa??
@@
July 23rd, 2010
11:58 am
He DID switch parties…
He DID? I did NOT know that.
Went behind enemy lines, eh?
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
11:59 am
I could not possibly hate anyone as much as I hate a white person stealing from me thru the government (leftist) except for a black person or yellow person or red person or purple people from freaking mars, stealing from me thru the government (leftists). I would call that a ideology tinged burning hatred with an edge, not racial…so maybe the fact obama is the most socialist POS since FDR is why the burning opposition is so intense? I think so.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
11:59 am
I must belatedly thank JB for clearing one thing up for me. I wondered where all this talk about the new black panthers was coming from. I hadn’t seen a mention of it in the papers or websites I usually get news from. So it’s fox eh? That would explain why I didn’t see it.
on another note. I sent an email with a resume to apply for a job. i got a reply on 2 minutes. is that a good thing or a bad thing?
AmVet
July 23rd, 2010
12:00 pm
OK, kids I’ve got some really, really, really bad news.
As I’m heading down to Florida for some well deserved R & R, you poor schmoes are gonna have to endure a Friday night sing-along without me! (I know, I know, how will you EVER make it? LOL!)
Try to play nice tonight and forget about your socio-political hangups for the evening, OK?
Take care, all. Here’s a couple of appropriate ones to get you going!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXos3qQPrw4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ea0759BeJ2U
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
12:00 pm
“A government study was funded to study various sexual perversions: sado-masochism, necrophilia and bestiality. The study was soon halted however … the researchers decided they were just beating a dead horse.”
Normal
July 23rd, 2010
12:03 pm
DP
July 23rd, 2010
11:49 am
With a remark like that, you ought to put an “i” between your “D” and “P”…
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
12:03 pm
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
12:00 pm
“A government study was funded to study various sexual perversions: sado-masochism, necrophilia and bestiality. The study was soon halted however … the researchers decided they were just beating a dead horse.”
++++++++++
That’s a pretty damn good summation of this mornings blog. I think could ALL agree to that lol.
Normal
July 23rd, 2010
12:04 pm
AmVet,
Fair winds and following seas to you my friend…
DP
July 23rd, 2010
12:04 pm
TaxPayer, Sean Hannity may accidentally get something right once in awhile but I’m not going to cite him in support of an argument any more than I am Rachel Maddow.
I’d rather go to the source than let a biased talking head on either side of the political spectrum spoon feed me.
JohnnyReb
July 23rd, 2010
12:05 pm
Bosch, you may be correct. I am not out in the black community attending gatherings, etc. And, yes sensationalism sells. There is, however, enough of the sensationalisim on TV to cause deep concern. Plus, I stand by my assertion that Obama is a radical. He’s obviously black, so he is a black radical. And, with the Wright/church thing and all his other known radical associations, coupled with his agenda, it is not a stretch to think he against white people.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
12:05 pm
@@
Second paragraph
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1813705,00.html
@@
July 23rd, 2010
12:07 pm
I hate reading this regardless of who delivers it…
Try to play nice
Yes, Mommy.
Thbbpppttt
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
12:07 pm
So how are we supposed to have Frustrated Wannabe DJ Night without our frustrated wannabe DJ?
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
12:08 pm
@@
Carlin didn’t write that:
http://www.georgecarlin.com/home/bogus.html
http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/carlin.asp
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
12:08 pm
And George Carlin is a BAD AMERICAN!
please.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/carlin.asp
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
12:08 pm
early drivetime food fracism test…
Rep Corrine Brown’s remarkable and ..barely comprehensible..house speech congratulating UF on the national championship
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgbBP9Em00A
now.. is she(and anyone who voted for this woman) an abject retard, or are we racist for pointing out this remarkable video.
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
12:08 pm
Damn you, Jacob.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
12:10 pm
JohnnyReb, have you ever read his book, Dreams From my Father?
stands for decibels
July 23rd, 2010
12:10 pm
Ultra off-topic # 1:
For those who have a hard time waiting for Jay’s afternoon drive selection–might I suggest this blogger’s Friday “List-o-Mania?”
http://powerpop.blogspot.com/
this week’s entry: Post-Elvis Pop/Rock Music Trend You Either Fervently Wish Hadn’t Caught On or Are Glad That Actually Didn’t!!!
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
12:11 pm
go gata!
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
12:12 pm
@StandsforDecibels – I’m “quick draw” with “the Snopes”
SPQR(laissez Faire)
July 23rd, 2010
12:12 pm
Pop had Genco, look what we got…
but tim tivo is a stud, and irvin myers is a good coach
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
12:13 pm
Mark July 23rd, 2010
11:26 am
HDB
I dont have any problem with her story about what happened 24 years ago, but her statements about racsim in the teaparty’s about healthcare and that during the 8 years of the Bush admin. that “they” had to endure, that no one made comments about Bush like they have about Obama.
first we “all” had to endure the Bush admin. not just “they” and there are many examples of where Bush was bashed in the media and on the Left..”
Granted…but the level of the vitriol that is spewed NOW with Obama in the White House vs. Bush’s reign is so much greater. Was anyone on the right crying about the deficit and health care reform under Bush? Who is more adversely affected by health care issues??
In that case, Ms. Sherrod is on point….has anyone called Bush a ‘non-American’? Has anyone challenged Bush’s birthright? Was there a ‘birther” movement under Bush??
Bosch
July 23rd, 2010
12:15 pm
Reb,
I dare say that you have known people in your past, and the preacher at your church could have said things or done things so that if you were ever POTUS, the far left could paint you as a radical as well, and it be just as valid as what you are applying to Obama. Remember, you see what you want to see, and as you admitted yourself, you are not in the black community at large, so you go on perceptions that you know nothing about.
I mean, your call name alone could be used against you — as mine — as anyone’s.
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
12:15 pm
stands for decibels,
“For those who have a hard time waiting for Jay’s afternoon drive selection”
How about those of are so very weary of hearing the name Sherrod one more time? Lindsay Lohan is this over-exposed at this point…sheesh!
And…CURSES! I went to your link and saw the video posted of “I want it that way” by the Backstreet Boys. I didn’t even have to click on it to have the insipid song reverberating through my skull…and it will probably be there for WEEKS!
@@
July 23rd, 2010
12:16 pm
Oops! My bad on George Carlin is a BAD AMERICAN.
No apology though. They’re pretty much useless in my opinion.
Words, just words.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
12:16 pm
“What we don’t talk about when we don’t talk about race”
Anything other than black and white…oh, well…answers that question…
RF
July 23rd, 2010
12:16 pm
Reb- again I ask why, or if, it matters to be a “black” radical? You inadvertently, and perhaps unintentionally, bring a tinge of negative racial attitude into your discussion by pointing out his blackness. The underlying implication is that his being black matters, which it does not if one is already a “radical”… just sayin’.
So, next question for you. What, precisely, in his words (printed, vide-recorded, etc.) prove him to be a “radical”? Liberal I’ll give you. But radical?? Prove it, please.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
12:16 pm
to piggyback SPQR (laissez faire) – something I shared with some friends last night over beers – I think the one promise Obama has kept is also the biggest one he hasn’t . He campaigned on the hope/change/transparency tagline, and really, contrary to his promise, he hasn’t changed the status quo and it is still “business as usual” in DC – he’s merely got a different business plan. so, I guess he has offerend us “transparency” in that we all have an unobstructed view as it relates to seeing nothing has really changed. the essential difference between neo-libs and neo-cons is simple (and the neo prefix is important); neo-libs foolishly try to keep everyone happy (and boy is it expensive for everyone!) and neo-cons work to make sure those who share their skewed views are happy (and boy is it expensive for everyone!). I think a good paleo-con vs paleo-lib battle to determine who leads the herd actually makes the herd as a whole, stronger, but the present state of affairs is so infected with special interests and influence peddaling, and the “business” side of journalism/news, that the exact opposite is true. regardless of who wins the beauty pagent every 4 or 8 years, the herd as a whole suffers, while Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity, AND Rachel Maddow and Keith Olberman; done there respective red or blue clown suits and “entertain” us all.
Outhouse GoKart
July 23rd, 2010
12:18 pm
I agree with Mick…lettuce step back, fire one up and enjoy!
Dusty
July 23rd, 2010
12:21 pm
Fer Pete’s sake! Yet another Sherrod symphonic with race and the rubicon corssed over and over by the liberal lemmings of the morning skipping after the lead lemming. (Hi, Jay!) Is there nothing else in your lives besides moaning music and motivated missives of propaganda?
It sems incurable. Day after day!! A steady diet of artful accusations and Dem declarations. It has the usual effect. If you would excuse me, BURP!!!
JohnnyReb
July 23rd, 2010
12:21 pm
“have you ever read his book, Dreams From my Father?”
Fred, no I have not, but I have heard a few lines from the audio version. I was not impressed.
For the sake of brevity, and to use a favorite Obama statement, let me be clear. There is nothing Obama has put forth or likely to put forth that I agree with. He is a far left progressive whose ideoligy is on the opposite end of the universe.
If you want some really good reading to better understand how America got to where we are today, go The American Spectator on line, select contributor Angelo Codevilla and then the July-August issue article entitled America’s Ruling Class — And the Perils of Revolution. It explains how the Democratic party is the ruling class and how Republican’s are want-to-be’s of the Dems. Most of us are in the Country Class.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
12:21 pm
@@, you are aware that “Bad American” screed was not Carlin’s work. he dismissed it (I believe) as “bad writing”. anyone who studied Carlin could see it was not his. then again, in an ironic way, Carlin was a “bad American” in that he saw no value in being a “good” American (”we like war”).
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
12:21 pm
Outhouse GoKart
July 23rd, 2010
12:18 pm
I agree with Mick…lettuce step back, fire one up and enjoy!
+++++++++
I’d be a liar if I said I don’t sometimes miss those carefree days……………… I was young, the Floyd was new, the lungs strong and healthy and life had promise…………
RF
July 23rd, 2010
12:22 pm
“Anything other than black and white…oh, well…answers that question…” Give Breitbart time to quit sputtering over his latest faux-pas. The next thing in his video library, I’m sure, is the border-jumping, drug-dealing, job-stealing Mexicans. Maybe he’ll think to confer with Jan Brewer first…
RF
July 23rd, 2010
12:24 pm
“There is nothing Obama has put forth or likely to put forth that I agree with. He is a far left progressive whose ideoligy is on the opposite end of the universe.”
See, now I may not agree with you, but there’s a statement I can respect. This is what I was hoping I could point out to you earlier- you can disagree with someone without using “black radical”, a statement that is emotionally charged and impossible to prove.
Oh Well
July 23rd, 2010
12:25 pm
@JohnnyReb “Plus, I stand by my assertion that Obama is a radical. He’s obviously black, so he is a black radical.”
?!?!?!?!
Are you saying that because a person is Black, they are also radical? Or how about just leaving it as (in your opinion) that Obama is radical. Let’s leave race out of it…
and I also love how people on this blog use phrases like “the blacks”, “their kind/your kind”…nope, it sure doesn’t make me think in the slightest that America still has work to do with regard to the discussion of race
I am praying for this country…
Georgian Citizen
July 23rd, 2010
12:27 pm
This race dialogue is thereupudic–
I had a favorite aunt back in the early 70’s. Babe.
She went up North and got impregnated by a yank. My daddy and boys went up to New York to get her. the baby didn’t make it back on the train. They said it was medical problems.
The family put her into Milledgeville State Hospital……….Where she died.
The baby being a yank always troubled me, but they didn’t deserve that. It’s good to get this off my shoulders.
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
12:27 pm
RF
Point…what ought to be fun is how the lot hereabouts and representative of society in general try to fit it into the black-white paradigm…
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
12:27 pm
I’m not denying the level at which Obama is criticized compared to Bush. I was simply referring to Mrs Sherrod semi-racist comments that only black people had to endure his policies and that people that are opposed to Obamacare are racist..Her statements are just an example of why we will never get past race in this country
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
12:28 pm
JohnnyReb; i got tired of hearing the talking heads hand pick “quotes” from the book to use as darts, much the same way the sherrod video was edited, so I went out and bought the thing and read it. It’s a shame you couldn’t do the same but to each his own. To me, it read like a novel, not like the usual political commentary. I can’t say I agreed with everything he said, but I can say I was educated by it. It opened my eyes to a point of view I had never really explored before.
Understanding does not mean acceptance or adoption of a different point of view. It means simply understanding where someone else is coming from. Unless you take the time to understand a differing point of view it seems silly to argue that it is right or wrong, in most cases, don’t go all crazy on me with weird examples. Call me close minded but I don’t need or want to “understand” a pedophile who rapes and murders little children, I just want them dead. But differing political views aren’t in that classification.
If you understand WHY the other person wants what they want, then perhaps you can then work out a way where they can get it that is agreeable to you as well.
@@
July 23rd, 2010
12:28 pm
…anyone who studied Carlin could see it was not his.
Well just call me ignorant, why don’tcha?
Carlin was a comic, disrespectful of humankind. What’s not to like. Not sure I needed to “study” him though. Like so many of those mentioned here, he was an entertainer, first and foremost.
I hope he died wealthy.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
12:29 pm
@neo-Carlinist – Stands for Decibels and I beat you to the punch
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
12:30 pm
Fer Pete’s sake! Yet another Sherrod symphonic
Dusty,
What’s funny is Jay B says Fox went nuts over this story without even noticing the irony.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
12:30 pm
@@ – Carlin was a humanist, he just wasn’t ready to dive into the BS with knife and fork like the majority of Americans.
Bosch
July 23rd, 2010
12:31 pm
” It explains how the Democratic party is the ruling class and how Republican’s are want-to-be’s of the Dems.”
Put down the Kool-Aid, and reading something as biased as that is, well, it’s silly.
It’s certainly not the Democrats over the past 20 years who have the corner market of getting the rich, richer — tax cuts for the wealthy is not a Democrat idea.
chemist007
July 23rd, 2010
12:31 pm
When will people realize that Sherrod broke the law 20 years ago the law still said that the govt. could not discreminate on race. She did this at first which is wrong if at had been the reverse situation if she had been white and the farmer black then she would have still been tarred and feathered. People also realize that as long as we ask the question race, age etc. you are discriminating. We are suppose to judge everyone individually so sherrod should have been fired and be in trouble everyone should see that everyone discriminates everyday against someone or something when you make a choice. I think Obama should have not gotten involved it is not a presidential matter. However I guess it take the eyes off of the bigger issues and problems of his administration.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
12:32 pm
RF
I’d be glad to prove it…just look at my 10:31am post
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
12:32 pm
@@: Have you finished your lawn yet? Come do mine. It’s MUCH smaller than yours…………
RF
July 23rd, 2010
12:34 pm
” I can’t say I agreed with everything he said, but I can say I was educated by it. It opened my eyes to a point of view I had never really explored before”
THAT is exactly what just about all of us could use a dose of…I don’t agree with everything my conservative friends believe, but when we sit and discuss things rationally without throwing buzzwords like “black radical” into the conversation, we actually end up with a good discussion.
Just don’t ever apply for a job with Fox News. Your quote above would get you kicked right out to the curb.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
12:36 pm
“i got a reply on 2 minutes”
Depends on if it’s an automated reply or not. If not, well I got one once within 30 minutes and that was 5 years ago and I still have the job!
RF
July 23rd, 2010
12:38 pm
Mark- ONE book title on a reading list?? Surely you can do better than that. BTW, what’s the web address for the site? I’d love to see what else is on the list. Gotta get ready for the winter when there’s nothing to tend in the garden…
RB from Gwinnett
July 23rd, 2010
12:38 pm
This whole conversation is a waste of time as long as the black mayor of Atlanta can produce an ad accusing a political candidate of wanting to return to a time of “water hoses and police dogs” and there is no fallout, yet every white person who ever says anything in any circumstance or context it villified. See Trent Lott.
When you liberals are ready to hold your own kind to the same standard you hold white conservatives to, I’ll listen to you on the subject of race relations. Until then, you can all go preach your apologist message to some other choir.
@@
July 23rd, 2010
12:41 pm
Fred:
Have I finished my yard yet?
Nope.
Due to circumstances beyond my control, I will be trying your suggestion. I figure if I get started around 4:00, I can get it done no later than 9:00.
I’m about to start weed eating the borders though. That part, I DON’T like.
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
12:41 pm
“When will people realize that Sherrod broke the law 20 years ago the law still said that the govt. could not discreminate on race”
And when will you realize that 24 years ago she WAS NOT working for the government?
RF
July 23rd, 2010
12:43 pm
“Point…what ought to be fun is how the lot hereabouts and representative of society in general try to fit it into the black-white paradigm…” Josef, it fits under the “us against them” paradigm. Just wait, the judge is already hearing the initial stuff in the lawsuits against AZ. I expect today, or at the latest tomorrow, we’ll be off to ranting about the borders. The Sherrod situation was just a diversion to the well-worn black-white subtext.
Mark
July 23rd, 2010
12:47 pm
Does there there have to be more than one..But since you asked, there are more than one. .Why would you recommened a book like that anyone unless you were a radical?
An Atlas reader, Chuck, has a student in the eleventh grade in an Ohio High School. Her government class passed out this propaganda recruiting paper so students could sign up as interns for Obama’s Organizing for America (OFA is the former mybarackobama.com site.)
Obama is using our public school system to recruit for his Alinsky-inspired private army. Organizing for America is (and I quote) recruiting in our high schools to “build on the movement that elected President Obama by empowering students across the country to help us bring about our agenda” …………of national socialism.
The Ohio High School is Perry Local in Massillon, Ohio.
This is incredible. And evil. Suffer the little children — enlisted like SS youth. This is no accident. Obama is poisoning our public school system. He acts as if it’s his own private breeding farm. Once again academic learning and achievement is hopelessly abandoned, and supplanted by radical leftist activism from the leftwing Alinsky indoctrinators in the perverse public school system.
Children must be advised to expose this ugly propaganda. Children must tell their parents how they are being used and manipulated. Parents, warn your kids. Better yet, home school.
Check out the recommended reading list page 4:
Rules for Radicals, Saul Alinsky
The New Organizers, Zack Exley
Stir It Up: Lessons from Community Organizing and Advocacy, Rinku Sen
Obama Field Organizers Plot a Miracle, Zack Exley, Huffington Post
Dreams of My Father Chicago Chapters, Barack Hussein Obama
JohnnyReb
July 23rd, 2010
12:48 pm
Bosch, here’s the link to the article – America’s Ruling Class. You will find this very interesting reading, it slams both the Dems and Repubs. Take notes, I will be asking quesitons!
http://spectator.org/archives/2010/07/16/americas-ruling-class-and-the
@@
July 23rd, 2010
12:48 pm
One last comment on this thread, then I’m out to crank that sucker (weed eater) up. It’s the hardest part of lawn maintenance.
Was on the track with a friend this morning. She mentioned something a friend of hers said. The friend “just happened” to be black.
Had she never been the descendant of slaves, she would never have had the opportunity to be American, and for that she was thankful.
Kewl!
Mick
July 23rd, 2010
12:50 pm
Outhouse
Here’s something to get this tropical storm kick started-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UmmbF1Zyvk
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
12:51 pm
Doggone/GA
July 23rd, 2010
12:36 pm
Depends on if it’s an automated reply or not. If not, well I got one once within 30 minutes and that was 5 years ago and I still have the job!
+++++
Nope, it came from the person I sent it to. I’ve spent the last several years raising my daughter and my wife says now that she’s in school, I gotta get a job. It’s a painful thought lol. I have been a contractor for the past 20+ years, but I don’t want to do that any more.
@@: dang, that’s too late. If the grass isn’t mowed by the time SWMBO gets home my butt will get mowed. Guess I better get out there and do it……….. Think i can convince her that it took all day to apply for that job?
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
12:53 pm
I wonder when Obama will ‘refudiate’ claims he is a racist…
And now a geography lesson from Ms. Palin (since we’re still beating a dead horse):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRENP2D55LQ
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
12:55 pm
@@,
“I’m out to crank that sucker (weed eater) up. It’s the hardest part of lawn maintenance.”
Stay hydrated…it’s scorching out there!
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
12:57 pm
Wow JCB, it’s a regular epidumbic………….
theyeshaveit
July 23rd, 2010
12:57 pm
Old Wrath of Sour Grapes mike was here again.
JohnnyReb
July 23rd, 2010
12:57 pm
“Are you saying that because a person is Black, they are also radical?”
Oh Well, no I am not stating that. I have known and worked with many black people who I believe were a better person than I. However, that does not mean Obama is not a black radical.
Fred, I should read Obama’s book, but it will not change my mind. Why a person believes as he does will not influence my disagreement on what he does. I have seen enough evidence to know that I hope every single change Obama has made and will make be repealed, starting with the health care bill.
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
1:00 pm
Fred,
“it’s a regular epidumbic………….”
RF
July 23rd, 2010
1:00 pm
@Mark: Web address please??? As I said, I’d love to see the reading list also. If you want to persuade someone by mentioning a website, it’s a good idea to post the address… Could I PLEASE have the website to which you referred for the reading list?
theyeshaveit
July 23rd, 2010
1:07 pm
JCB,
That was funny.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
1:07 pm
And AGAIN, dear Reb, you are allowed to believe him to be a radical. I don’t have a problem with that view (even if I most adamantly disagree). But you have yet to adequately explain why calling him a “black radical” is necessary or proves anything. It would seem that you think being a “black radical” is somehow more potent than just being a regular radical. Your repeated denial of that just doesn’t hold water. Does it add any power to the word “radical” to call someone a “white radical”? We don’t hear that term used because it’s meaningless. Yet the repeated mention of one’s skin color in connection with the term radical says that you believe that there is a distinction between a “black radical” and a “white radical”. What about “hispanic radical” or “native-American radical”? What about “Jewish radical” or “Christian radical” or “Feminist Radical” or “Gay Radical”? Do we really need the class, race, or sexuality distinction? NO, so why the emphasis on black radical???
NJ
July 23rd, 2010
1:08 pm
The problem I have with people blaming Democrats or Republicans or the ruling classes, is that we created them. The voters that is.
Basically the Founding Fathers had it worked out. Or they thought they did. No matter how much conservatives want to argue, the founders wanted to “limit personal wealth” They did not mind a person getting wealthy enough to live very comfortably and for their family to live very comfortably” But they wanted to strip away any wealth that went beyond that of allowing them comfort, and allowing them to use the excess wealth to take over government in their own interests. So the founders hated corporations, because to a man, they believed corporations would create a new aristocratic ruling class, based on money, rather than land.
Conservatives in America even conservatives among the founders, wanted to create a new ruling class. Alexander Hamilton was the foremost proponent of creating a ruling elite, even to the point of wanting to create an American monarchy, with a hierarchy of aristocratic positions beneath the monarch. Jefferson opposed this, and later on Andrew Jackson reinvigorated Jeffersonian Democracy in a way that gave the small man as much power as the wealthy one.
Every president from Washington to Lincoln predicted that America would not be destroyed from the outside, by some foreign power, but from the inside, and the mechanism of that destruction would be the corporation. It allows a small group to put together a huge amount of excess wealth, to use it to control government in their interests and against the interests of the average working man, the average American in any age of our history. The founders had an answer and each one of them who favored popular rule rather than aristocracy called for a progressive “INCOME” tax. The base of a person’s wealth, property, was not to be so subject to tax as to cause the owner to have to lose his property rights. But any wealth produced by that property was fair game for taxation to prevent any single person, or group of people, from being able to combine their wealth in order to subvert the government and use the wealth to propose legislation that favored them at the expense of any other particular group.
The primary thing that cause the end of the great American experiment was reducing the top marginal tax rate to an absurdly low rate under Reagan. This did nothing to stimulate growth of the American economy. It created the growth of profit for a small elite ruling class, which is now America’s Aristocratic class. No one can get elected to office without becoming part of this class, and favoring it’s interests. European history is filled with such examples. The Kings always had to bend and give way to the lower level nobility, as happened with Magna Carta. In Eastern Europe and Russia, it was not the highest level aristocrats who had the most power, but the boyars, who were at the bottom rung of the nobility. This roughly translates into “count or countess” and it was this group who for example, formed a governmental body to elect the kings in countries like Poland.
As soon as you allow one group to gain enough wealth to control government, you have lost your Democratic Republic. Because the wealth of the one allows them to constantly have the ear of the government. Who LOBBIES, for Joe Average?
theyeshaveit
July 23rd, 2010
1:13 pm
RF, you raise some good points with Reb. Let’s see if he can “refudiate” them.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
1:19 pm
@@, OK then, perhaps “observed Carlin” is more appropriate than “studied”. I was not suggesting Carlin should be “studied” in the academic sense. but to bring the whole thing full circle (in an internet-age) kinda way, it didn’t matter whether or not Carlin penned it because somebody “saw it on the interent” (as with the edited Sherrod clip). ever hear the John Fogerty tune “I Saw It on TV”? “…I know it’s true because I saw it on TV…” As far as yard work goes, when you mentioned cranking up the weed whacker, I picture “Carl” (Bill Murray) cleaning up his living quarters in Caddyshack with a gasoline powered blower. Oh, and RB from Gwinnett, you know so much about “the Black mayor of Atlanta” because you live in Gwinnett?
NJ
July 23rd, 2010
1:20 pm
Yes that is how Boortz and his ilk can get around the issue of “reporting” the news, and distorting it. They claim to be a conservative “Saturday Night Live” however because conservatives like Boortz are notoriously lacking in any ability to be humorous, the point is lost on those who listen to them.
Anyone Remember Fox News’ disastrous attempt at humor to compete with people like John Stewart and the Colbert Report. Went down in flames, because conservatives really have an inability to not take themselves too seriously.
The difference is all in their ideas on taxation. Even guys like John Kerry openly stated, double, triple my taxes. I will still be doing fine. Conservatives squabble about having their taxes increased by 900 dollars a year, on hundreds of thousands of dollars in income.
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
1:23 pm
NJ,
“Anyone Remember Fox News’ disastrous attempt at humor to compete with people like John Stewart and the Colbert Report. ”
That “Half hour news hour” was horrible…their regular news coverage is more humorous…
JohnnyReb
July 23rd, 2010
1:24 pm
To RF and theyeshaveit
From Wiki – The Black Radical Congress or BRC is an organization founded in 1998 in Chicago. It is a grassroots network of individuals and organizations of African descent focused on advocating for broad progressive social justice, racial equality and economic justice goals within the United States.
Clearly Obama fits within that description.
Paulo977
July 23rd, 2010
1:24 pm
NJ..@1:08pm …well presented!
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
1:24 pm
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
1:00 pm
At what point did being smart and educated become a liability?
++++++++
As I keep saying, I’m an Independent. But just damn, the Pubs give more fodder to comedians than the Dem’s. The “Bushism’s” were great, but it looks now like Palin has leaped in with both feet to fill the void left by Bush. I really don’t think there is a political bias among comedians, it’s just that pub polico’s just do more stupid stuff than the Dem’s. Hank Johnson’s “island tilt’ was only good for a few days, but Palin produces material for them every time she opens her mouth. But……… maybe since sh is such an easy target there should be a bag limit on her……….
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
1:28 pm
Paulo977@1:24pm, agreed. I guess this makes Dwight Eisenhower (military industrial warning) a Jeffersonian. Interesting, and somewhat ironic that he cut his teeth in the military, which is itself and aristocracy.
Southern Comfort
July 23rd, 2010
1:32 pm
focused on advocating for broad progressive social justice, racial equality and economic justice goals within the United States.
It’s a shame that in this day and age, those who would seek racial equality and economic justice would be considered radical.
(SMH)
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
1:32 pm
Holy Bat Poop NJ, that little monologue is about the most twisted factually incorrect thing I have read in ages that wasn’t labeled as satire or comedy. Did you go to public schools?
Do you remember the name of the comic book you read all that “history” in?
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
1:33 pm
Fred @ 1.24,
I agree with your post. I thought Biden would be a rich source of comedy for Republicans; he certainly is for Democrats.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
1:34 pm
Fred, as I see it, Palin is just Bush with a nicer a** and bigger t*ts. she’s the same malleable anti-ideologue. that’s right, it’s not a typo. Bush was too wealthy to concern himself with “ideology”. Palin is not part of NJ’s “ruling class” or American aristocracy, but she is too blinded by her own ambition and ego (much like Obama) to concern herself with ideology, which makes her useful to what my friend calls “the true decision makers”. so, to stay on message, Palin or Bush are not racists anymore than Shirley Sherrod is. these people are merely useful to those who benefit from keeping race on the table.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
1:39 pm
@Reb: Shoot……and MISS again! The BRC is what it is…and so are radical organizations on the right (I’m sure you know the names so I won’t waste time typing them). Is Obama a card-carrying member of this organization? No? Just as Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Carter, Ford, Nixon, etc., etc. were not members of any “radical” organization that I can recall, so you couldn’t pin any of those names on them.
I still don’t get, and quite frankly don’t think you can explain, why it’s necessary to call Obama a “black radical”. I accept your opinion of him as a radical and totally allow you to call him that all day long. Again, does being a “black radical” make one any worse than any other type of radical? If not, then why does that particular title have to be used?
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
1:39 pm
Southern Comfort
July 23rd, 2010
1:32 pm
It’s a shame that in this day and age, those who would seek racial equality and economic justice would be considered radical.
+++++++++++
What is more of a shame is that someone who can obviously turn a computer on and off AND find a website and make a post has such abysmal reading comprehension skills. The Black Radical Congress CHOOSE that name. THEY “labeled” THEMSELVES. JohhnyReb didn’t do it for them. i doubt they even know who he is.
Just Damn JohhnyReb. I don’t agree with your assessment of our current President, but I applaud you on your defense of your use of the term. They may not like it, but i don’t see how RF and Eyes can refute it. That was a good find. I’m impressed. I have to admit I underestimated you on your first few posts.
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
1:39 pm
It’s a shame that in this day and age, those who would seek racial equality and economic justice would be considered radical.
SoCo,
It seems to me that the closer we get to racial equality the more radical it makes someone trying to organize a group to agitate for it.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
1:42 pm
Fred, I don’t know that NJ’s screed came from a comic book. that said, thanks for replying AFTER you drank the Kool-Aid. The status quo is evidence we the People traded a Monarchy for an Aristocracy (well, maybe a plutocracy or oligarchy, but such distinctions are like demonstrating the difference between a monarch and a dictator. Six or one half-dozen). the only question in my mind is; where the Founding Fathers prescient, radical thinkers, or did they simply feel like having 10 people run the show was better than having one? The idea that what made the United States unique (social mobility, or the ability to move between classes) may have been in play before 1900, but once the wiring was done and the concrete set (Aristocracy in place), that club was no longer accepting applications. And Bill Gates, Warren Buffet, Mark Cuban, Arthur Blank and Donal Trump ARE NOT in “that club”
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
1:44 pm
Well crap…there goes a legend.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128565997&ps=rs
“Journalism Legend Daniel Schorr Dies At 93″
RF
July 23rd, 2010
1:47 pm
Fred- I adamantly defend Reb’s or anyone else’s right to call the president a radical. Is there a point to calling him a “black” radical?
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
1:47 pm
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
1:39 pm
SoCo,
It seems to me that the closer we get to racial equality the more radical it makes someone trying to organize a group to agitate for it.
++++++++
And another one lol. the BRC named THEMSELVES as radicals. No one else did that for them. SO by using the term that they themselves CHOSE (I put one too many O’s in the post to SoCo) it somehow makes those of us not in the group as racists?
I don’t get it. one of us needs a sign…………
http://www.clevver.com/music/video/23505/bill-engvall-heres-your-sign.html
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
1:50 pm
Fred July 23rd, 2010
1:39 pm
JohnnyReb July 23rd, 2010
1:24 pm
Maybe the reason the BRC labeled themselves as “radical” is that for the US, it IS a RADICAL concept that racial equality and economic justice should be an American idea!! Would that not be an extreme change from the current paradigm??
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
1:50 pm
Fred,
Has anybody ever told you you’re obnoxious?
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
1:53 pm
The Kool-aid Neo? Perhaps you can do a little research on the founding fathers and income tax. YOU may call masonic and modern day neo nazi conspiracy theories as credible sources of “history’ but I sure as hell don’t.
RF: He explained that. He used little words too. He had decided President Obama is a radical. President Obama is black. Connect the dots. As to WHY he has to call him a black radical? Well I reckon he doesn’t HAVE too, but he wants to. Last time I looked he is still free to do so. WHy are you riding his ass becasue he does? I seem to have missed your tirade on the group 100 black men. Or the Miss BLACK USA pagent, or BLACK entertainment tv. DO white people have some sort of lack of freedom to express ourselves the same as black people have?
Southern Comfort
July 23rd, 2010
1:54 pm
Fred
Do we have to go there with the reading comprehension??? For starters, where did I even say anything about JohnnyReb in my post? And you want to try to talk about my reading comprehension? Maybe you should focus closer to home first. It’s clear that he thought the group as radical as he’s already said Obama’s a black radical and then stated that Obama fit that group’s description. If that was not what he was trying to say, then maybe he should have stated it a little differently.
RW
I’ll just be glad once it’s all over with. Dealing with ignorance kinda grows old after a while.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
1:56 pm
seems to me whatever “racial equality” means, we have it in the 14th Amendment. but it is no different than any other “law” or “right” – namely it exists to create the illusion we have rights and choices, and exist in a free society. Marx said religion is the opiate of the masses. well, the Constitution is the opiate of America’s unwashed masses. might still be a pretty good deal, but not really “as advertised in my book” and I freely admit that I (nor George Carlin) have the first idea about how to make a better mousetrap, or if trapping mice is worthwhile to begin with. of course, filling peoples’ minds with horibble stories of plaques, chewed electrical wires and stolen cheese kinda creates the need for a mousetrap, doesn’t it? here’s my question (and I presented the same question to JB a few days ago); if our rights are “inalienable” and “bestowed by our Creator” then why is the 14th Amendment even necessary? Carlin always said, “power does what it wants…” so as I said earlier, either nobody is racist (just being human) or everybody is a racist (just being human). laws (and allegations) benefit those who crave power and control. that’s not a radical idea. it’s just a sad fact of life.
JohnnyReb
July 23rd, 2010
1:57 pm
RF, here’s my last stab at this. Obama is a black radical because he fits the description and commonly accepted connotation. If he was not pushing the same objectives of black radicals, he would not be one.
If a white boy was spewing the same BS as does the black radicals, he would be a radical, but certainly not black. Trying to erase “black” from black radical bucks history and accepted norms. You may not like the term black radical, but it desribes a certain group and their objectives.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
1:59 pm
Many people find the truth obnoxious RW. But to answer your question, don’t you think the answer is self evident? Of COURSE people have told me I’m obnoxious. People like lies and PC talk and not being held accountable for the things they say or do. THEY want the freedom to express THEIR views, but really don’t want those who disagree with them to have the same rights.
I have a knack with English (actually American as that’s really what we speak) and a tendency to get to the point, not beat around the bush. That discomfits the insecure or those trying to obfuscate. Most people fail to see their own hypocrisy while calling other hypocrites. I kind of act like an umpire lol and help them see it. Like the Baptists who say every word in the Bible is true and correct and then go on to say that Jesus really DIDN’T turn water in to wine at a party, he made grape juice…………… boy they REALLY get mad when you laugh at them about that………
Are you a Baptist RW?
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
2:04 pm
Good for you, Fred and no.
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
2:05 pm
Fred July 23rd, 2010
1:53 pm
Can’t you see that BET, the Miss Black USA, 100 Black Men, et. al., were CONSERVATIVE, FREE-MARKET answers by African-Americans in response to not being considered a part of the media….or American representation?? What year was Vanessa Williams crowned Miss America? (1983)!! When was BET launched? (1980)!! When was the Miss America Pageant founded? (1921)!! When were the major broadcast networks founded? (ABC: 1943, CBS: 1928,NBC: 1926). Note the time frame of reaction to being excluded!
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
2:09 pm
Fred, I am spinning many plates at the moment, but NJ’s screed wasn’t some half-baked “masonic conspiracy theory”. As one who favors an occassional “summit” with John Barleycorn, I am quite familiar with the Founding Fathers and their views on the income tax. when the Republic was just a wee lad, (end of the Revolutionary War, Washington was President), the Congress needed to pay down the war debt (taxes). In many areas (especially Western PA) many Americans of Scotch-Irish decent distilled their own whiskey, and it became something of a currency. This really wasn’t an issue because most of these folks were farmers or tradesmen, with little income to show, so in lieu of payment for a new barrel, or a bushel of corn; a jug of hooch was traded. Now how is Uncle Sam gonna repay the French when he can’t “tax the income” of these “rebels”? A ta was levied on whiskey, but it was particularly harsh (higher) on the home-brewed variety. The (corporate/commercial) distillers in Boston or Baltimore might have to pay $5 for a 100 barrel batch, while Joe Six Pack had to pay $5 when he brewed a 10 barrel batch. The farmers “rebelled” and Washington himself mounted up, mustered a force of Federal Troops, and put down the rebellion. That’s not some drunkard’s bar story; it’s the first (and last) time an American President led troops into battle (well, except for the movie Independence Day, but that was against aliens, so it doesn’t really count).
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
2:09 pm
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
1:56 pm
seems to me whatever “racial equality” means, we have it in the 14th Amendment.
Not really…..note the differences in sentencing when a black person and a white person are charged with the same crime; note the denigration of black people in the media….but white people are the largest group on welfare (note Appalachia!)! Note how Ronald Reagan created “welfare queens” and put a black face on them! Equality has yet to occur in the US….although the Constitution guarantees it!!
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
2:10 pm
Southern Comfort
July 23rd, 2010
1:54 pm
It’s clear that he thought the group as radical as he’s already said Obama’s a black radical and then stated that Obama fit that group’s description.
+++++++++
Gee, and the fact the call THEMSELVES Black Radicals is somehow different isn’t it? That is their NAME. How can it be more clear? We are back at reading comprehension skills. Try reading the words ON the page, not putting your own in there. And yet you DARE talk about the ignorance in others?
Don’t pout and get all discombobulated, open your mind and understanding WILL come eventually. I know many people who think President Obama is a radical. Depending on the definition, they may be correct. There is no denying the FACT that he is Black. SO what? Is being a radical a BAD thing? Is being black a BAD thing? I don’t think so on either score. Jesus was a radical. He loved to go to church on the Sabbath and pick fights with the preacher and church leaders. If we want to label him further, I think we could correctly say he was a RADICAL JEW. Oh the horror someone who is not afraid of words or afraid to use them. Whatever shall we do with this Fred character………….
Black Radical or not, I still support my President. A radical is what we need in my opinion so I can’t say I’m all worked up about it. One could even say that I have expressed some radical ideas in this post. You gonna call me a radical and expect me to get all upset about it? It ain’ta gonna happen. RW implied that he thinks I’m obnoxious. SO what. I am and can be. Am I supposed to get mad because he uses the correct word that accurately describes my behavior at times? Ain’ta gonna happen.
Words are beautiful. Use them, embrace them, love them. Don’t try to wipe them off the face of the earth because you either don’t like them or don’t understand them.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
2:13 pm
@Fred – reminds me of a joke:
What’s the difference between a Baptist and Methodist?
The Methodist will say hello to you at the liquor store.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
2:13 pm
@Fred: I read his little words and YES he does have the right to use whatever name he likes. I just don’t see why it matters whether one is a “radical” or a “black radical”. I’m only making a point about it because of the inanity (oops, big word- too much for you?) of having to tack on “black”. It is irrelevant, pointless, and frankly doesn’t help move the discussion in any positive direction. Just as there is no useful purporse to call someone a “white radical” or any other racial tag before “radical”, I thought it might be pertinent to make him think about it. I keep forgetting that conservatives have a hard time doing that without one of Glenn’s chalkboards…
@Reb- So, would it be fair, or even necessary, to call someone in the KKK a “white radical”? I seriously don’t recall hearing that used with the same frequency that “black radical” seems to be used. I could be wrong, but just IMO. But, you have the right to whatever title you choose and I’ll accept the reason- even if I most adamantly do not agree. Stalemate- now let’s move on.
I’m officially off this subject. Anyone seen Nathan Deal’s first ad since the primary? OMG he needs to put some money into advertising because this one is sooooooo lame!! It’s on youtube- Pit-i-ful!!!
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
2:14 pm
Fred July 23rd, 2010
2:10 pm
In some semblance, we ALL are radicals…..
Can’t argue with you there!!
RF
July 23rd, 2010
2:18 pm
Okay, Fred, one last parry and I’m REALLY out of this. The BRC does, in fact, call themselves Black Radicals. Okay- so how does that connect to Obama? Just because he might have similar views doesn’t make him a member of the party and thus not subject to the title. I could start a “White Radical Congress” and it wouldn’t necessitate calling Bill Clinton a “white radical” because we shared similar views on some issues. Just saying I wish we could get past the distinction of race. And as my dad would say, “wish in one hand and sh*t in the other and see which fills up first.”
Southern Comfort
July 23rd, 2010
2:18 pm
Fred
Dude, whatever you’re drinking or taking, slow down a bit. You’re getting all pouty and discombobulated and fustrated too over this, not me. I could care less if they named themselves The League of Slap-Happy Incompetent Snickerdoodles. I don’t see Obama as a “radical”. He’s just another politician in the long line of politicians we’ve had leading this country. He’s no better or worse than any previous one. People throw around adjectives like Mardi Gras beads to the point that they don’t carry much weight anymore.
I’ll leave you to ponder on ignorance. There is a difference between being dumb, stupid, or ignorant.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
2:21 pm
HDB, my point exactly. politicians and “activists judges” (and conservative judges, for that matter) can repeal or re-affrim whatever laws they like. no law, and I mean NO LAW is worth the paper it is written on. anyone who has sat on a jury or heaven forbid been a litigant in a criminal or civil case knows this. think about it, for whatever reason, we faught a civil war. 600,000 Americans died, and when it was over, Lincoln “freed” the slaves, and Congress “put it in the book” with the 14th Amendment. did this “act of Congress” wipe out (whatever) “racism” (is)? sure, and it was SOOOOO effective a law, that less than 100 years later, LBJ et al, passed the 1964 Civil Rights act. So here we are in 2010 (45 years later) and gosh oh gee, oh my, isn’t our “society” absofreaking-lutley “great”? To whom should I address the thank you notes?
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
2:24 pm
Are you referring to the Whiskey rebellion of 1794 Neo? If so some of your facts are a bit wrong. Henry, “Lighthorse Harry” Lee actually commanded the Army. but in a general sense you hit some of the main points. It was however an EXCISE tax, not an INCOME tax that caused the dispute. Note the difference between the words EXCISE and INCOME. Initial boy with the comic book history book was talking about some mythical “income tax” that the founding fathers supposedly created……..
RW-(the original)
July 23rd, 2010
2:25 pm
RW implied that he thinks I’m obnoxious
Fred,
Let me be more clear then. You are obnoxious. Better? You’re also delusional if you think your behavior comes from some position of enlightened truth. You’re just obnoxious for the sake of being obnoxious and I guess I’ll put you down as a scroll troll.
Southern Comfort
July 23rd, 2010
2:26 pm
gosh oh gee, oh my, isn’t our “society” absofreaking-lutley “great”?
neo
You sound just like my PT instructor at the academy. I was just waiting for you to say, “Now drop and give me 20!”
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
2:27 pm
SoCo….I’m more worried about the CONCEPT than the name…in some ways, we ALL are radicals…..any time we invoke change and people can’t handle it…we’re considered to be radicals!! I can deal with Obama being called a radical…because he’s attacking the status quo!! As Fred said….maybe we ALL need to be a bit radical sometimes……
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
2:27 pm
RF
Appreciate the response above and agree with you entirely…
One question–
In a free and democratic society, what’s wrong with being a radical of any stripe? Radical–from the Latin radix, root…radicals get to the root of what’s rubbing them the wrong way or what it is they want to talk about…
Paulo977
July 23rd, 2010
2:35 pm
Can we live together in our lifetime?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9O1aAfbYKwo
DawgDad
July 23rd, 2010
2:36 pm
“Electing Obama, at least symbolically, points out a shift in the power structure that scares some people mightily.”
Yes, but to the vast, vast majority on the right that’s because he’s LEFTIST and has nothing whatsoever to do with race. There are any number of black people I would vote for for President in a heartbeat, certainly over McCain, and Obama just happens to NOT be one of them. Policy, not race.
JacobLocke
July 23rd, 2010
2:38 pm
neo_Carlinist – ooooooooh. LOL!
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
2:38 pm
Fred, from Wikipedia:
In October, Washington traveled west to review the progress of the military expedition. He met with the western representatives in Bedford, Pennsylvania, on October 9 before going to Fort Cumberland in Maryland to review the southern wing of the army. Convinced that the federalized militia would meet little resistance, he placed the army under the command of the governor of Virginia, Henry “Lighthorse Harry” Lee, a hero of the American Revolutionary War. Washington returned to Philadelphia; Hamilton remained with the army as civilian adviser. See, way before Richard Nixon and Watergate, “plausible deniability” (a/k/a CYA) was de riguer in DC.
Not from Wikipedia: a tax is a tax, and it seems to me that if whiskey was a currency (income) the tax on whiskey was an income tax in excise tax’s clothing.
MARK
July 23rd, 2010
2:38 pm
RF…ever heard of google?…but since you are not able…here ya go..barrackobama.com
MARK
July 23rd, 2010
2:39 pm
sorry…barackobama.com
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
2:40 pm
DawgDad July 23rd, 2010
2:36 pm
You may be one of the few…but that’s not the case of many!! I couldn’t vote for McCain because he didn’t think that many like me are viable constituents….and his voting record was antithetical to my interests!! I can’t vote GOP because of the same reasons….and I have no other options available! I may be taken for granted by Democrats…but at least they know I exist as a constituent!!
BravesFan79
July 23rd, 2010
2:40 pm
I love black women, its a shame that their men abuse them at such a high rate that Femicide is the 2nd leading cause of death for young Black women. #1 is AIDS.
I worked all over Atlanta for my job, including the heavy latino gang areas of Buford Hwy as a door to door sales rep. The thing i like about latinos compared to blacks. #1, they take care of their women and kids. #2 they usually only do violent crime against other hispanics.
Dusty
July 23rd, 2010
2:41 pm
RW,
There’s always hope. Fred said he applied for a job. Let’s hope it was not for Bookman’s “position”. There are some things even worse than …. ….oh nevermind…
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
2:46 pm
I don’t need to ponder on the differences between ignorant, stupidity, OR dumb. I can sum them up very neatly.
Ignorance is not knowing something. By definition we are ALL ignorant because no one knows everything.
Stupid is lacking the basic intelligence to understand something. Not understanding that we are all ignorant could be called stupid I would think.
Dumb means you lack the ability to speak. In earlier days some equated the lack of ability to speak with intelligence so a more informal definition propagated and used by the ignorant became “accepted.” IE that dumb meant stupid.
I am not ignorant on any facet of the conversation thus today and since you say you aren’t, I have to conclude that you are just plain stupid. Or arrogant, or perhaps both. Just because YOU don’t think President Obama is a radical, does not mean he is not. You have already shown that you lack the capacity for dispassionate logical thought and the ability to admit ignorance. You have preconceived notions of what you are going to read before you read it, therefore you don’t actually comprehend the meaning of what you are reading. You won’t entertain the idea you may be wrong on something much less admit it. That’s ok, most people have that problem. Don’t tell anyone, but I make that same mistake myself occasionally. I had to step back and re-evaluate the erroneous conclusion about Scout I made last night and correct it. Unlike you however, I see it as no loss of face to be wrong and will freely admit it when I am. I did last night on the blog below.
So basically SoCo, I need “ponder” nothing that you have said, because you basically have said NOTHING other than if you think it should be this way then THAT’S the way everyone should think it should be. If they don’t they are stupid. but I DO have to get those tomatoes peeled and cooked down for my sauce to night.
You are welcome to come over for a plate or two of spaghetti lol. You see, I don’t get mad. I exchange ideas when I can, learn when I can, and teach when I can. In a good conversation, all three happen, but not anger. Passion maybe, because good ideas and values demand passion, but rarely anger.
Ed Troncalli of Troncalli Doge in Cumming gave me a good lesson some 10- 15 years ago. He told me anger is a wasted emotion, it only harms you, not the person you are angry with. The person you are angry with either doesn’t care or WANTS you to be angry with them, either way it doesn’t help you. . One of the wisest things anyone has ever told me. I wonder how that old fart is doing lol, haven’t thought of him in years, but I have never forgotten that lesson.
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
2:47 pm
Dusty,
I found something for you…slightly strange..yet intriguing at the same time:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awp3-7EVM0Q
RF
July 23rd, 2010
2:48 pm
Josef- absolutely agree with you. Often the most impact, throughout history, has been made by those later branded as radicals. I’m sure even the president doesn’t mind being called a radical. In light of how life in this country went down the tubes by ‘08, anyone suggesting change will earn that moniker. I guess I get punchy because I’ve heard, too many times, about the president being a “black radical”. And most of the time it’s in the context of trying to make him look worse than just your ordinary, run of the mill radical. It’s like degrees of sin- most people will say there aren’t any, but talk about having an abortion or being gay and they’ll get worked up in an instant.
Dawgdad- I think you’re right about the majority. We’ve were in a huge conservative movement there for a while, and any change is going to take a while to accept. But it doesn’t take long to find the rather ample minority who are, in fact, scared that the traditional power structure is changing-and not in a good way. I come from a long line of country folk who are convinced it’s the beginning of the minority takeover of the United States- which they began fuming about in ‘65 when the Civil Rights Act was passed. There are more of them out there than you might think.
BravesFan79
July 23rd, 2010
2:50 pm
By tha way.. i like Obama as a man. I cant think of a better role model for the black community! If more young blacks modeled themselves after Obama instead of rappers that promote pimping, abusing women, and drug dealing then blacks would get more respect from all the other races.
RIP to the decent young man killed in Clayton yesterday, its a shame the bad ones take out the few good ones. #1 killer of black men = murder. #2 killer of young black women = murder. Its not racism, its realism.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
2:50 pm
BravesFan79, no offense, but I don’t think your brush is quite broad enough. only after you “go door-to-door” in “latino gang areas” beyond Buford Highway (Dekalb) should you present your extensive research findigs about the Lationo culture – try Gainesville (Hall), or maybe some of the areas off Jimmy Carter Blvd(Gwinnett)
RF
July 23rd, 2010
2:55 pm
Mark- went there earlier in the day, but didn’t see a reading list. I just went back, and maybe I’m scanning too fast and missing it. I’m not being sarcastic here, I promise. I really do want to see the reading list, but I’m not sure what page it’s on.
roldawg70
July 23rd, 2010
2:58 pm
great article jay
one of the best
it reminded me, that america is an ideal. we all see what it could be, both left right center.
we may all different visions of what could be, but i would pray they we all would remember that most of us want whats best for america. even when we know we disagree on what that ideal state would be.
not demonize one another
enough of my preaching
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
2:59 pm
Dusty and RW: Bite me. You use the first trick of the rushophiles. When you don’t have an intelligent response, attack someone and call them names or hurl insults. How sad and pathetic. I see nowhere where you refute my posts or conclusions, you just go straight to personal attacks. I understand. You lack the capability to attack my reasoning and personal attacks usually draw one into the 5 year old “I know you are what am I” arguments that you so crave. Sorry I can’t accommodate you.
I am not defined by the labels YOU choose to foist upon me. I am defined by who I am and the truth. It’s sad that you really have nothing to add except insults. But then, that is the main problem in America today. The only “solutions” to any problem is “You suck and your mother does too.” People have so much pent up rage that they can’t respond rationally. They think thye have to be “right’ no matter what. About EVERYTHING. It’s as sad as it is amusing………..
But in the political scheme? RW and Dusty are irrelevant. You two will vote republican no matter what. You will be cancelled out by the democratic fanatics. It’s people like me, who actually think that decide EVERY election lol, and you just HATE that fact.
MARK
July 23rd, 2010
3:00 pm
ok, let me see what i can do RF…gimme a sec
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
3:01 pm
RF
On the matter of race and radicalism. I’m one of the few hereabouts who is in support of reparations for slavery, which qualifies me as a radical. I share a perspective with a black fellow. We agree on a plan. He’s no doubt a radical, too. The plan we agree on was proposed by some Confederate veterans following the late misunderstanding and the so-called reconstruction. Does that qualify us as neo-Confederate radicals?
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
3:03 pm
I’m interested in your plan jo-nix. I am curious how I am responsible for something when my family didn’t come to this country until long after slavery was over and done with……..
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
3:08 pm
Fred,
“It’s people like me, who actually think that decide EVERY election lol, and you just HATE that fact.”
Hopefully you aren’t one of these as well:
http://www.newyorker.com/humor/2008/10/27/081027sh_shouts_sedaris
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
3:09 pm
Braves Fan–
I am pretty much a no-fan of President Obama as a poltician. But when it comes to what you are addressing, I am very much a fan. He is a role model for family values and not just for black men, but all men. I get accused when I say something against his policies of being a racist and told that I never agree with anything he does. The attackers conveniently overlook that I sing his praises for his having told his followers in no uncertain terms to leave Palin’s kids alone (they didn’t heed him, of course), that he dotes on his own children like a proud papa should without trotting them out for show. I got my feathers in a ruff when he was being pilloried for taking his beloved for a night on the town. I could go on and on, but the point is, this is one place he walks the walk. I respect and admire him for that. Now, if he’d just get off his sorry ass and…
Don't forget
July 23rd, 2010
3:13 pm
Lets cut the bull on why the conservatives call Obama a black radical rather than just a radical. It’s to stir up fear and loathing for Obama and distinguish it from a term they love and respect, namely radical conservative.
MARK
July 23rd, 2010
3:15 pm
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c60bf53ef0120a83335c6970b-popup….try that…sorry im not very good at this computer stuff
MARK
July 23rd, 2010
3:16 pm
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c60bf53ef0120a83335c6970b-popup
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
3:16 pm
Fred–
It’s not my plan. It’s a Confederate Veteran plan. Simple, those companies and institutions still in business which profitted from the iniquitous system–Aetna, Metropolitan Life, Harvard, Brown, Stanfrod Universities, Illinois Central, Baltimore and Ohio Railroads, among others–should be assessed the value of, for instance in the case of the insurance companies, the slave properties they insured and never paid up on, in the case of the railroads the cost of the slave labor which went into their construction, the universities the portion of their endowments which came from slave-trade interests–and that money used to equalize the gap…under the Confederate veterans plan, the idea was to provide the resources (sort of 40 acres and a mule) to give the freedmen a base from which to start for socio-economic development. It was the failure to do this post emancipation which led to pretty much the problems of the 20th Century and which we are taking with us into the 21st.
Mama Says
July 23rd, 2010
3:16 pm
Jay and fellow bloggers,
As a white male conservative I have supported several things that are of “liberal thought” and in doing so I have come to understand the true meaning of political labels. As a moderate conservative I have and still do support gay adoption, gays in the military, equal pay, truth in sentencing and most of all the efforts to ensure that our environment is taken care of. With that said I CANNOT escape the label which is placed on me by liberal minded folks.
All I have to say is that I am a conservative and the assumptions are made. People assume I am against anything Obama-because I am a racist rather than and overall disapproval of his policies, I am against ILLEGAL immigrants when all I want is for everyone to follow the law–not just me etc….
The truth is this case demonstrates what has been done to white men, in particularly southern ones, over time. Race relations is the tipping point–it has the ability to deflate an otherwise adult conversation and the simple allegation illicits a defensive response that in most situations is used to “prove” the accusation itself. No person can every deny racist exist, the problem it brings are apparent but an often ignored problem is also just as likely to illicit that anger—that hidden 2nd problem is the fact that the accusation immediately disarms both parties from reasonable conversation and it is assumed that the accuser is correct–for the accusation is never challenged. (I suspect out of fear of being associated with a racist)
I’ll end with this, and I have often asked this of several of my non-anglo friends. If I go to the store and the white clerk acts as if I am not there and then slowly responds to my need, I feel she/he is just lazy and unresponsive. How do minorities face the same employee and feel so confident saying that person is a racist ? Perhaps if we asked we may find out that person has lost a family member, gotten demoted of suffered something that impacts their life, yet some folks seem to already know they answer—–which in and of itself is a judgment based on color.
The truth is in the eye of the beholder and as you say Jay discerned by us though our life experience, a life experience which by definition makes us bias in our judgments. When we learn to stop jumping to conclusions about each other and take the time to get the entire truth we will overcome racism. The question of knee jerk reactions and jumping to conclusions should have been addressed a long time ago—at best when the public was just suppose to assume that we, who do not support Obama for policy reasons, are the ones who are judging based on race.
MARK
July 23rd, 2010
3:18 pm
its not on his website any more bacause it said they were no longer taking apps…but that was a page from the application that showed the reading list
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
3:19 pm
Fred
How are you responsible because your ancestors were bog trotting the auld sod, so to speak, when all this took place? Well, they came here, became Americans for what this great land promised them, bought into it and called it theirs. Well, there’s the bad that comes with the good…
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
3:20 pm
Mama Says,
“With that said I CANNOT escape the label which is placed on me by liberal minded folks.”
That knife cuts both ways…
RF
July 23rd, 2010
3:22 pm
Josef- “Does that qualify us as neo-Confederate radicals?” LOL Well, I guess if we’re going to have to tack on a subjective title so we can tell each other apart at the radical conventions, you could have that one…
Okay, so since I support gay rights and women’s right to choose, and also have strong family values since I’m raising two wonderful children, what would be my title…. Rainbow Neo-Wacko Family radical??
Mama Says
July 23rd, 2010
3:25 pm
jewcowboy, when have yo been called a racist ?
I will simply go by your moniker—-and I will assume you are of Jewish faith. I will ask you this either way though. In the modern era of race relations which would impact you the most being “labeled” a Jew or being labeled a racist ?
Sen. Webb says ‘white privilege’ is a myth | Cynthia Tucker
July 23rd, 2010
3:29 pm
[...] pretty difficult to have a rational discussion about race, for the reasons my colleague Jay Bookman has outlined today. Quite frankly, his list of reasons is incomplete: Today’s political and [...]
Dusty
July 23rd, 2010
3:30 pm
Dear jewcowboy @ 2:47
Thank you for your musical selection. Needless to say, I shall always think of you when “Yodeling Queen” comes up.
PS,,,I am beginning to feel that FRED may not like me. Would you mind sending him a musical selection? Something like “You aint nuthin’ but a hound dog”. Thank you again.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
3:33 pm
Mark- Interesting… the source of the page looks a bit dubious, but if it is an actual application to intern for OFA, there would be some discussion to have. I’m going to have to read some of Alinsky before I can judge him. Just looking at the titles, and the fact that “radical” rarely has a good mainstream connotation, I can see where it would bother you. I’ll have to see if I can scare up a copy of Alinsky’s book (hopefully the public library will have it) and let you know how dangerous it is. As Josef pointed out in recent posts, being a “radical” is not necessarily a bad thing, as long as the radical is for a cause you support. I doubt the titles listed in this application mention government ovethrow or socialist takeover of western society as chapter headings.
Thanks for the link. I’ve got some new reading to do!
HDB
July 23rd, 2010
3:36 pm
Mama Says July 23rd, 2010
3:16 pm
‘All I have to say is that I am a conservative and the assumptions are made..”
Reverse the paradigm..and the situation is similar: All I have to say is that I am a liberal…and look at the assumptions that are made!! Conservatives say that they want to follow the law…but fail to note that certain laws TARGET those that conservatives FEAR….not to make the situation equal!! When a liberal disagrees with a conservative policy, we are called traitors, fascists, communists…anything BUT Americans! If that liberal is also a person of color….conservatives quickly play racial issues to marginalize the opposition!
Don’t get me wrong..it does happen on both sides of the equation…but as a white male, you have yet to have people FOLLOW you in stores thinking that you are a thief; you have yet to have cabs pass you by because you are a person of color; you have yet to be a victim of bad service because clerks feel you won’t tip…or you don’t have any money to purchase things!! These are things that when brought forth…are marginalized by the majority and stated that we are too “sensitive” about what occurs….and we just need to let it go!! Aretha said it best: RESPECT!! The problem is that too many from the conservative side deem respect a one-sided idiom….but it isn’t!! THAT is the paradigm that needs to change: mutual RESPECT! Don’t have to agree all the time….but at least respect me as a human being!!
MARK
July 23rd, 2010
3:41 pm
your welcome.RF..I assure you it came from his website, but I understand wanting to do your own research on it.
Alinsky is often credited with laying the foundation for the grassroots political organizing that dominated the 1960s.[5]
Alinsky advises his followers that the poor have no power and that the real target is the middle class: “Organization for action will now and in the decade ahead center upon America’s white middle class. That is where the power is. … Our rebels have contemptuously rejected the values and the way of life of the middle class. They have stigmatized it as materialistic, decadent, bourgeois, degenerate, imperialistic, war-mongering, brutalized and corrupt. They are right; but we must begin from where we are if we are to build power for change, and the power and the people are in the middle class majority.”
In Rules for Radicals, he argued that the most effective means are whatever will achieve the desired ends, and that an intermediate end for radicals should be democracy because of its relative ease to work within to achieve other ends of social justice
Alinsky’s most famous book, Rules for Radicals, is basically an instruction manual on communist organization and agitation. It compiles decades worth of philosophy and research by Alinsky, much of which had already been successfully implemented throughout his career. As you probably know, today’s most famous community organizer is Barack Obama. It also turns out that this is not by coincidence. Obama was a long-time student of Alinsky’s ideas and methods, and has spent time implementing them and teaching them. It has also been rumored by some media personalities, such as Rush Limbaugh, that Michelle Obama even used quotes from Alinsky’s book in a speech
josef nix
July 23rd, 2010
3:42 pm
RF
That’s a radical group I can join! I am gay and we raised three kids with traditional family values!
jewcowboy
Now, remember, we’re a RACE! Adolf said so…
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
3:43 pm
Dusty, don’t go there. Hound Dog was written by the famous Jewish writing team of Lieber and Stoller. It was first recorded (1952) by an African American woman named “Big Mama” Thornton, then recycled through the Hillbilly genre (country) a half-dozen times by various white artisits, then spent some time in the custody of an Italian-American Doo-Wap group called Freddie Bell and the Bellboys, finally being covered by a white trash rock n roller from Memphis named Elvis Presley. I suspect there is a “jewcowboy” jock in there somewhere.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
3:44 pm
joke, not jock
Scout
July 23rd, 2010
3:54 pm
RF:
Racism is Rural Georgia? You’re kidding?
I’ll tell you what ………. I can sent you to certain places in L.A., Chicago or Detroit where if you set foot you (if you are white) stand a good chance of not getting out alive ……… in broad daylight.
What do you call that ????
Legend of Len Barker
July 23rd, 2010
4:04 pm
I hate to bring up something from the first page, but Doggone, Who Wants to Live Forever was written by Brian May, not Mercury and possibly even predates Mercury’s diagnosis. I believe you’re actually thinking of The Show Must Go On, which was from 1991.
I want to make a book suggestion, The Race Beat by Hank Klibanoff and Gene Roberts. It provides a very firm foundation for understanding race relations and how everything played out during 1950s and 1960s, plus some realizations from the Watts riots.
I also suggest looking into newspaper archives from 1964-70, which is when the vast majority of Georgia counties integrated schools (minus Dawson, Union, Forsyth, Towns, and Lumpkin counties who didn’t have any integration to do).
Local papers about the JFK assassination are also interesting to see the divide in opinion. He was more or less a hero to youth, but he wasn’t a favorite of several adults because of his stance on integration.
I don’t know if we can start progressing in race relations until we understand just what happened.
Buckagon
July 23rd, 2010
4:10 pm
Jay,
You’re saying WE DON’T TALK ABOUT RACE??? —YOU???
WTF?
Where’s the President on this issue? It wasn’t Breitbart that ruined her career. Vilsack fired her you idiot! Obama will benefit greatly from racial insecurity of Americans this Fall, and so will Democrats!
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
4:16 pm
Scout, and how is this evidence of “racism” (you know, by your definition that “one race feels it is superioir to another”? I would “call that” for the sake of argument, and without lending a shred of credibility to your claim, I would “call it” a crime, or just plain murder. I frankly don’t see (or maybe I do) that zip code or the race of either the perpertrator or the victim is evidence of “racism”.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
4:25 pm
Buckagon, yeah and when you fall from a roof, the “fall” doesn’t kill you, hitting the pavement at 33 feet per second and severe internal injuries kill you. “Justin Bieber” posted an edited video for the purpose of discrediting (and possibly libeling) Sherrod and discrediting the Obama administation. Vilsack (also known as Nilsack) should be fired for his ignorant and short-sighted RE-action to “Bieber’s” video, but again, you sound like a bank robber whose gun accidentally discharged, killing a teller; “I didn’t mean to shoot her. I just wanted to demonstrate the lax security procedures at the bank.”
Don't forget
July 23rd, 2010
4:25 pm
Mark, that page you posted is from atlasshrugs.com, a site run by a birther and general nut. Here’s a thought, if you want to see an application for an internship for OFA just go to their site:
http://my.barackobama.com/page/s/2010Intern
Scout
July 23rd, 2010
4:28 pm
neo-Carlinist :
Not my definition. Look it up. “Geneticalliy superior”.
The rest of your thought process I couldn’t decipher.
Gone permanently upstairs …………………………
RF
July 23rd, 2010
4:30 pm
Josef- HIGH FIVE!! How did you survive the teenage years (12-16 specifically)? I’m getting gray hair just trying to deal rationally with a 14 yr. old…
Scout- I lived in West End (Atlanta) for about three years. I was the only white guy in sight and actually did quite well. I got a house for next to nothing and figured, why not try it? What I found out was that the stereotypes just didn’t apply- for them or for me. The only reason I left was because I changed counties to teach and it was too far to drive. I hated selling that house after all the work I did and I still go back to visit some of my old neighbors every now and then. While not as bad as some parts of Detroit or LA, I’m pretty sure it’s more about one’s attitude as an outsider than it is about race. The residents there are at enough risk themselves, let alone someone white showing up.
Ferguson
July 23rd, 2010
4:35 pm
You white people started all this mess with slavery.
mmm, mmm, mmm, Barack the Liar Obama - BEND OVER, Here comes the CHANGE!
July 23rd, 2010
4:39 pm
I have NO problem talking about race. My question is where’s the heat on blacks that most only vote for a black candidate, no matter if the white running is more in line with their thinking? Because if whites voted that way NObama would have only received about 15% of the vote. Chew on that awhile…..mmm, mmm, mmm….and could somebody PLEASE hire his daughters as baby sitters!
mmm, mmm, mmm, Barack the Liar Obama - BEND OVER, Here comes the CHANGE!
July 23rd, 2010
4:40 pm
Ferguson…show me a slave that’s still alive, nimrod.
Mama Says
July 23rd, 2010
4:53 pm
HDB,
you say “When a liberal disagrees with a conservative policy, we are called traitors, fascists, communists…anything BUT Americans!”
I cannot even argue with you on this because you place equal repercussions on all the labels when all labels are not created equal. Tell me the last time someone lost their job because they were labeled a traitor, fascists OR communist. Tell me the last time you know of a lawsuit being filed against a corporation because they were traitors or fascist. I don’t believe you can. The label of racist has lifelong implications it would be nice if you proved it before you throw it out there.
“If that liberal is also a person of color….conservatives quickly play racial issues to marginalize the opposition!”
You have to be kidding—–EVERY HOT TOPIC right now is solely about the liberals accusing conservatives of being racist. We are racist because we are against “ILLEGAL” immigration–(note the word ILLEGAL) although libs leave out the Illegal part when they are accusing us OF BEING RACIST. You guys jumped to conclusions about the cop and the professor—despite what the black cop on scene said. You guys are even blaming conservatives of racism in the Sherrod incident even though the knee jerk response came from libs, as usual you assailed her character, fired her and THEN looked at the facts.
” as a white male, you have yet to have people FOLLOW you in stores thinking that you are a thief; you have yet to have cabs pass you by because you are a person of color; you have yet to be a victim of bad service because clerks feel you won’t tip…or you don’t have any money to purchase things!! These are things that when brought forth…are marginalized by the majority and stated that we are too “sensitive” about what occurs”
thank you for doing exactly what I said you do—-you have assumed that because of my color I have not experienced what you have. You are making a judgment based solely on my skin color. You have no idea what race I have dated, who I am married to nor how I have been received by various PARENTS AND FRIENDS of the women I have associated with. You also have never gone into a minority owned restaurant and been starred at like you don’t belong. And you dang sure have assumed that the cab drove by you because you are a minority, that the waitress ignored you because you didn’t look like her and that the security in the store only watches minorities.
You readily accept those reasons because that is what you have been told they are. You have apparently no desire to look at things from another s perspective, it’s all about what you perceive. I’ll ask you once again–tell me how you know the waitress is looking at you as a minority, did you ask ? How many minorities did she serve that day with no problems ?—you have no clue do you ? That in and of itself is fine tough–it’s called prejudice. What is not fine is for you to insist people are something that YOU define them to be based on your thoughts, all while you condemn THEM as racist bigots—for it sounds to me like you judge people by the group you associate them with, and that is exactly what you CONDEMN about conservatives and in particularly whites.
Tell me how does the throne of righteousness feel –are you comfortable ? I assume it’s in the middle of your glass house, so you can see everyone equally !
Mama Says
July 23rd, 2010
5:08 pm
By the way slaves were first brought to The new continent by the SPANISH–they were sold to the GEORGIA colonist at Sapelo Sound.
The rest is history as they say.
I will take ownership of my ancestors involvement in slavery when African Americans look at their true history and acknowledge the fact that tribal leaders in Africa were the main resource for the slave trade—they are the ones who kidnapped the members of other tribes and sold them to Whites.
That dosen’t ignore the treatment of slaves in Southerners hands but it does demand some consideration if we are truly looking to work this issue out.
With that factual history lesson—is it possible that some minorities have ancestors who sold slaves to the America’s ? I would say YES. Just as it’s possible that my ancestors were some of the 333,000 Northern, Midwestern and Western whites that died freeing slaves and keeping this country together, but that would throw a problem in your racism theory wouldn’t it ? That if they are white they are racist.
G Cancryn
July 23rd, 2010
5:26 pm
SIX PAGES OF COMMENTS AND COUNTING!!!!!!! That tells you that the fact that some people are lighter or darker in skin color than others is a huge issue. Race is the number one issue, especially in this town!!
G Cancryn
July 23rd, 2010
5:33 pm
I never heard anyone call another president uppity, ever. Many try to disguise their racism around the “issues”. They’re full of crap. If president Obama ran the country into the ground, and a white guy was left to clean it up, these racists would blame Obama (rightfully so) and be more patient. This president hasn’t even had 2 full years to fix a broken country, a country that took 8 years to break, and the racists are trying to blame him for everything.
G Cancryn
July 23rd, 2010
5:41 pm
As for slavery and institutionalized racism, Jim Crowe, Not allowing blacks to vote until the 1960’s predatory loans, or no loans at all, law enforcement profiling, Not hiring because of race, all types of racism for hundreds of years, racists want to ignore it, or say it’s in the past stuff like that. Many powerful companies that exist today were founded in a time when black people would never be allowed to receive the license or cooperation necessary to launch a company. So, this country is dominated by white companies and white people that really don’t care about race at all, they just want control, and they get it by keeping racists fueled with stuff like the edited speech that just blew through the country.
john
July 23rd, 2010
5:44 pm
G Cancryn:
Race has nothing to do with people hating Obama. Obama and the Democrat controlled Congress are single handling driving the US economy into the gound and spreading ultra liberal policies to a center to right country. That is why I and many can’t stand Obama. Don’t try to bring race into an issue. Oops, I forgot, that is what Democrats do best…
Living in Atlanta for the past 6 years I have come to one conclusion. African-Americans are
john
July 23rd, 2010
5:45 pm
Oops..
finish my sentence….African Americans are BY FAR more racists towards white people….its not even arguable.
killerj
July 23rd, 2010
6:06 pm
Bull s#it from one Jay to another Jay-GA> GOVERNOR RACE: Republicans for gov.-676,867.000…..Democrats for gov.-393,897.000…Sad day for Obama come november,go tea parties.
neo-Carlinist
July 23rd, 2010
6:25 pm
OK Scout, I’ll break it down. you wrote: “I can sent you to certain places in L.A., Chicago or Detroit where if you set foot you (if you are white) stand a good chance of not getting out alive” then asked; “what do you call that?” I simply replied that I would not call it “racism” – by your definition (what does “genetic superiority” have to do with the ability to commit murder?). I also suggest that I would “call that” a “crime” or “murder” – and I would further guess that the ethnic background of anyone in these ‘hoods (black, Hispanic, East Asian, Central Asian, Persians or Arab) would not determine his/her chances of survival. Just like there are areas in Mexico City where EVERYONE is at risk. I suspect the same is true in Somalia, parks of Kandahar, and maybe Moscow. No need to “decipher” my thoughts, just trying to help out with the words. Night, night
TruthBe
July 23rd, 2010
6:27 pm
Blacks are the MOST racist people in American and they have the groups and organizations to prove it. ( NAACP,CBC,Urban League, Black Churchs, Affirmative Action,New Black Panthers, Southern Poverty Law Center, and etc..) Also Downtown Atlanta, City Hall, and it’s Mayor.
Sandra
July 23rd, 2010
6:39 pm
There are racists in every race, every color and everywhere in the world. Racism is an equal opportunity virus.
RF
July 23rd, 2010
6:41 pm
Truthbe- and whites have the KKK, Neo-Nazis, those known as Skinheads, various militia groups, and places like Alpharetta, John’s Creek, and the list goes on and on. I attended a “black church” for a long time and was fully accepted as a white man, so strike that one off your list. Actually, they were much more open to me being there than many white churches would be to a minority showing up, IMO.
barking frog
July 23rd, 2010
6:42 pm
Racism means thinking your race is superior. I thought that was pride.
vuduchld
July 23rd, 2010
6:47 pm
So, I guess scum like Breitbart and Hoax News get yet another free pass to continue their “fair and balanced” bs. What is it going to it take for these sub-humans to be called out for destroying a person’s reputation with lies and more lies. I surely hope that Ms. Sherrod sues the pants off both of these clowns. They deserve it! And for the rest of you conservative, teabegger meth monkeys out there, keep watching and listening to this this drivel. All this does is expose you as the racists you’ve always been.
Sandra
July 23rd, 2010
6:59 pm
Vuduchld, I hope that you are not calling all conservatives and/or those who watch Fox racist. I am a conservative and I do occasionally watch Fox but I am not racist.
vuduchld
July 23rd, 2010
7:21 pm
@Sandra, It is what it is. I’m calling out all you conservatives because I keep haering this crap about being aganist President Obama’s policies when all the while there is a racist tinge to it.
The first teabegger convention was held in Nashville, TN where the KKK was born. The posters, speeches and now this incidient with Sherrod. Do you think that the average person is stupid? Glenn Beck with his meaningless ralmblings about Prsudent Obama being racist. Others comparing President Obama and his wife to monkeys. Show me where this isn’t racist. Hoax News dragging some black person from the sewer trying to promote their bogus agenda.
Sorry, I’ve lived in the south all my life and I know racists when I see them. How do I know? Because I grew up around alot tof these same people ranting against that “communist, socialist Obama” but me and others know the real story. So please, don’t give me that cop out. I’ve seen this so many times that it’s become laughable. You conseravtives are racists and it time you admit that you are…END OF STORY!
W
July 23rd, 2010
7:42 pm
LARRY CRAIG FOR PRESIDENT
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
7:54 pm
jewcowboy
July 23rd, 2010
3:08 pm
Hopefully you aren’t one of these as well:
I can’t say I liked that article too much JCB or your suggestion that I am as mindless as that guys mom, but I’ll play along I guess. Do us folks who AREN’T mindless neophytes to a political party scare you that are so much? Sorry, I said I’ll play so play I should.
Most Presidential elections aren’t about a choice on an airline between Chicken and fried crap with glass in it. Where did that a-hole come up with THAT imagery anyway? He must be an elitist because only first class gets meals served on flights nowadays. But we’ll let THAT slide.
Today the decision between candidates is between horse crap with glass in it and cow crap with glass in it. In the Bush/sKerry election, I chose the BS over the HS. Kerry slimed his fellow servicemen and besides, he is nothing more than a gigilo who is the lapdog or pet poodle of the rich stupid women he marries and exploits. This past election however I didn’t see it that way. Neither did the rest of the 40% of us thinking voters. We were all pretty much aligned with Barry and his message. After 8 years of President Bush, we didn’t see much use in voting for McSame. I’m STILL with President Obama. I don’t buy the negative hype and still have confidence in him.
But I still don’t get your portrayal of us who think rather than mindlessly vote along party lines. But then, you probably don’t get us who think either………
Sandra
July 23rd, 2010
8:01 pm
Vuduchld, I am absolutely livid now. How dare you. The only thing that you know about me so far is that I am a conservative that occasionally watches Fox. I am also not white!!! I am part white, part Vietnamese and part Native American and I have lived in the South most of my life. I currently live in the Uk but all of my family is in Georgia. Most of the time while growing up I lived in a small town where racism was rife and have been spat on, hit and threatened. My father was threatened with a gun and someone tried to knife one of my brothers in the back. Before you spot off your venom next time you should get your facts straight.
Fred
July 23rd, 2010
8:31 pm
Jo-nix (2 times): Interesting thought on the reparation plan. I can’t say I disagree. It mirrors something that our Jewish brothers would like to impose on Switzerland. I think thta one has legs.
As to the “good with the bad” thing? I’m all over taking the good with the bad, I’m just not all over taking the stupid or ridiculous with the good and the bad.
Dusty: Get over yourself already. You are meaningless to me. You have YET to refute anything I said, you just continue to hurl insults. It that REALLY the best you can do? I’m disappointed lol. I really see no need to respond to you further unless you have something intelligent to add to the conversation. As a newb here, I realize I don’t know ALL the dynamics, but it would appear to me so far that you really add nothing other than drive-by’s. I could be wrong. Maybe you ARE a Rhodes scholar or something just having an off week. But if i were forced at gunpoint at this juncture to make a judgment, I would surmise that you are a female with big boobies who wears low cut blouses and doesn’t really have to think very much, just flash a tit and get what you want. But like I said, I have been wrong before……………..
moonbat betty
July 23rd, 2010
11:10 pm
Fred, git over your self negro. Fred.
moonbat betty
July 23rd, 2010
11:11 pm
woohoo.
MARK
July 24th, 2010
5:35 pm
Hey Dont Forget, Obama took it off his site, said said there is no more room for applications…If you really believe that didnt come from His website, Ive got some ocean front in arizona for ya…Do your research idiot
ghostwriter
July 25th, 2010
12:29 pm
By the way, who brought up the race of John McCain’s adopted daughter in the 2000 South Carolina primary?
RF
July 25th, 2010
1:20 pm
@Mark: What I find interesting is that it’s only available on Atlasshrugs.com. Definitely not a neutral source, so I wonder at the authenticity of the document. For the sake of discussion, let’s assume it’s real. When I went and read the entire thing, there are lots of books on the reading list. Alinsky’s book mentions “excerpts” and I don’t think a speed reader could read everything on the list in a week.
I’m not a big fan of Alinsky after perusing what’s available about him online, but then it hit me. What he recommends is exactly what the party NOT in power generally does. Find an issue, start talking and creating fear and distress, find a person/group to blame, then create a group to discuss it, focus energy and emotion. and help spread the concern. If you think about it, it’s a successful process for getting people involved and ready to vote on emotion. That’s how elections are won. I realized that this isn’t a new or extreme strategy. This is exactly the way the Tea Party Movement got started- and we see the impact that is having and could have in November. Community organizing is only bad to the side opposed to it, if you think about it. In this cycle, it’s race, deficit, taxes, etc. All issues to get people polarized and fired up. Exactly as Alinsky would prescribe. Read his 11 rules for radicals. You could name prominent groups on both sides who have done or are doing almost exactly what he advises.
I’m not downing anyone for the tactics- just saying that both sides are doing essentially the same thing when trying to regain power. While written to a liberal audience in the early 70’s, the general guidelines apply for either party when trying to change the balance of power. Interesting thought…
Lil' Barry Bailout
July 25th, 2010
10:13 pm
Funny how it’s almost always Democrats and liberals focused on race. Republicans simply don’t care about race. Can’t you race-based haters move on?
Petgrooming Scissor Group » Ousted ag official unsure about returning to work – Washington Post
July 26th, 2010
7:23 am
[...] MonitorObama agenda: All about race…msnbc.com (blog)Race: Still Too Hot to TouchNew York TimesAtlanta Journal Constitution (blog) -Slate Magazine -Detroit Free Pressall 2,835 news [...]
realist
July 27th, 2010
1:19 pm
Obama does not appear to me to be “uppity or arrogant”. He is however, a mixture of many races but can only be classified as “black”. I consider this to be a lose on our part and a gain on the part that he is classified as….
PW
July 28th, 2010
8:10 am
I wholeheartedly agree with the majority of your column. I am astounded almost daily, when I read the comments of people to various articles and columns. If people really want to know the status of race relations in this country they just need to read those to be frightened of what faces us. Just here in GA in Lilburn we had a community wake up the other morning to racist spray painting on their homes, cars and property. It is sad and scary.