A lot of damage in Gulf can’t be counted, compensated
Allen Kruse ran a charter-boat operation out of Gulf Shores, Ala., taking tourists and fisherman out to fishing grounds now closed because of the oil spill. Even after the leak is sealed and the oil disappears, the chance that the fish will reappear in numbers large enough to sustain that kind of livelihood looks pretty dim.
The Washington Post tells the rest of the story:
Two weeks and two days ago, with his fishing grounds closed, Kruse, 55, took a job working for BP’s cleanup crew. For the very people who’d caused the mess.
Other boat captains said Kruse, like them, found the effort confusing, overly bureaucratic and frustrating. He told them to keep their heads down, not to worry about the hassles. But those close to him saw he was losing weight.
On Wednesday morning, Kruse drove to his boat as usual. As the deckhands prepared for the day’s work, Kruse, as the captain, was supposed to turn on the generator. But after a few minutes, the crew members said, they didn’t hear anything and went looking for him. A deckhand found him in the wheelhouse, shot in the head.
… Thad Stewart, a friend who works at the Orange Beach, Ala., marina where Kruse docked his boat, said he noticed a difference about the time Kruse went to work for BP. “He stopped talking. That’s all there is to it. He stopped talking,” Stewart said. “I’m not saying that this was the cause of it . . . but he was seeing what was his home, which was the Gulf of Mexico, just be slowly destroyed.”
Frank Kruse, his identical twin brother who is a probate lawyer in Mobile, Ala., said his brother was waiting for about $70,000 in payments from BP for working two of his boats for the past two weeks. “There’s no question in my mind that this is directly related to the oil spill,” Frank Kruse said in a phone interview Wednesday night. “He had been losing weight. Every day he was worried.”
He said his brother “was very, very upset at the way BP was handling the oil spill. There was a lot of wasted money, a lot of wasted time. They’d give him a different story of what needed to be done.”
I guess Allen Kruse didn’t think he’d ever get his life back.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
271 comments Add your comment
AmVet
June 24th, 2010
12:52 pm
Duty calls and as Jackson Browne wrote:
I’m gonna be a happy idiot
And struggle for the legal tender
Later…
godless heathen
June 24th, 2010
12:53 pm
Well you are wrong, larry and it’s your kind of pseudo-science clap-trap that probably sent Mr. Kruce over the edge. Pick a copy of the book, “Things that the Black Sea and the Gulf of Mexico Have in Common.” It will be a quick read.
josef nix
June 24th, 2010
12:54 pm
@@
The “be still” is welcomed…
For those with the RIP for the captain…the sentiment is from the kind, generous and forgiving hearts…but, for me, no! Don’t rest in peace. May your spirit come forth and haunt and curse the existence of all that which drove you to that grave and may they never know a moment’s peace..
theyeshaveit
June 24th, 2010
12:55 pm
Bosch, thanks. My wife and I enjoy a good magarita every now and then. And yes, I, too, am a Midori fan.
Midori
June 24th, 2010
12:57 pm
you guys are too sweet
just like the liquer!!
@@
June 24th, 2010
12:57 pm
jay’s guilty of supporting “The Copy Cat Effect”.
When researching my book, I looked into this topic, and did write in The Copycat Effect (Simon and Schuster, 2003) one short passage in summary.
Historical studies conducted by sociologist Steven Stack and others have discovered a noticeable dip in suicides and related violent events when there is society-wide anguish, for example, in times of massive immediate grieving in periods of wars and economic depressions.
Will there be an increase in actual suicides “caused” by or in the wake of the Great Crash of 2008? It is highly doubtful.
Nevertheless, look for a dramatic spike in reporting on every stockbroker and bankrupt CEO, fisherman (emphasis mine) who dies by suicide.
http://copycateffect.blogspot.com/2008/10/stock-market-suicides.html
jay, you oughta be ashamed of yourself.
I’m outta here.
RIP, Mr. Kruse…your pain and suffering is over, but you left a lot of people to go it alone without your support. ‘Ya could’a done better.
stands for decibels
June 24th, 2010
1:00 pm
theyes (and anyone else who is interested), I highly recommend The Worst Hard Time: The Untold Story of Those Who Survived the Great American Dust Bowl
Soames
June 24th, 2010
1:01 pm
A sad story for sure. Some people have a hard time dealing with the ebbs and flows of life. I know a lot of people who are going through hard times because they lost their jobs and I feel for them.
Saul @ 12:09
Nuclear and coal are the only viable sources available. We don’t have enough earth mass to accomodate our needs with the available alternatives. Wind and solar power account for just one-sixth of 1% of America’s annual energy consumption today – that’s 0.0016 for all of you engineers out there. To generate electricity comparable to a 1,000 MW gas-fired power plant you’d have to build a wind farm with at least 500 very tall windmills occupying 40,000 acres of land. What about solar power? America’s most productive utility-scale solar electricity plant has a capacity 8.2 MW, and it’s located on 82 acres of land in southwest Colorado. When you take into account the fact that the sun doesn’t always shine, you would need roughly 250 of these plants, occupying roughly 20,000 acres to replace a single 1,000 MW gas-fired power plant (which occupies only 10-15 acres). This is what 30 years and $30B dollars worth of government subsidies gets you. Who’s going to make the biggest polluter on the planet (China) abide by the same rules and cut back on their carbon addiction? That’s where all of the manufacturing went, which is why they are the biggest polluter on the planet. Will politicians rescue us? I think not…Politicians and doomsdayers were wrong in the 70’s when the planet was thought to be cooling (ice age scare) and I bet they will be wrong about our current situation.
@@
June 24th, 2010
1:01 pm
Lawd ah mercy!
I see everyone has resorted to booze.
That’s no solution either.
larry
June 24th, 2010
1:02 pm
well, if that is the case, lets all go to the gulf for a swim….since it is so healthly right now. I am just repeatin g what a marine biologist at UGA is stating. If the fish do come back , it wont be in our lifetime.
Southern Comfort
June 24th, 2010
1:03 pm
@@
At the same time, the government has said BP was in charge. Someone (I don’t really give a rats a$$ who) needs to take charge of the situation. Instead, we have BP and the government both looking as adept as a one-legged man in an a$$-kicking contest.
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
1:04 pm
Larry. You dont know that.
larry
June 24th, 2010
1:07 pm
http://www.cnn.com/video/flashLive/live.html?stream=stream3&hpt=T1
Come on , outhouse , lets go for a swim !!!
Im out, i have to pay for the deregulation that helped this happen.
professional skeptic
June 24th, 2010
1:09 pm
AmVet
June 24th, 2010
12:13 pm
I second this. Or third, fourth… where’s the line start?
Bosch
June 24th, 2010
1:09 pm
Snicker. Italy is going home, they finished last…… snort.
josef nix
June 24th, 2010
1:09 pm
eyes
Thanks. It appears to have been a national sampling.
For the record, my personal opinion is that suicide is one of the most selfish acts the human being is capable of. But it is not for me to judge what drives a person to commit that act.
That said, the conclusion I am inclined to draw from what I have read here is that it is suck it up, Bubba and get on with it. The Social Darwinist perspective at work, then what’s the point of even trying to cap the well or clean up the mess…just suck it up as the price of doing bidness and get on with it. It certainly makes it easier. I don’t buy it, but it does make it easier to keep Scooter’s stiff upper lip and @@’s be still…and, well, back to my own d*mnable eternal optimism, it’ll all turn out all right in the long run…
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
1:12 pm
WHy would a company allow Hugo sh*thead to nationalize their property? I would set bombs and hugo would have a mass of steel at the bottom of the ocean, which he is welcome to, but I would never hand them over intact.
Supreme court invalidates Skilling and Black convictions…good news for the constitution , for once.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:13 pm
AmVet:
I’ve got an idea !
While you are at it, why don’t you speak up for the thousands of unborn children who will be slaughtered today or is that a problem for you because Obama supports that and it’s not BP’s fault?
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
1:13 pm
I hope someone takes a shot at Hugo chavez and kills that freak soon.
Bosch
June 24th, 2010
1:14 pm
josef,
“just suck it up as the price of doing bidness and get on with it”
Which is why I don’t understand those blaming the government and griping about their efforts because BP could very easily have taken that position and not a damn thing could have been done about it.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
1:14 pm
Venezuelas economy is the worst in south/central america because it is now the most socialist..see the corrolation?
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:15 pm
stands for decibels:
“Daddy, why are you sending other daddies to Afghanistan for the 9th time? Some of them don’t come back?”
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
1:18 pm
I think the one true time obama hears his kids ask something is when they say “Daddy, can you make your ears flap again?”
Disgusted
June 24th, 2010
1:20 pm
An onslaught of oil has washed ashore at Pensacola Beach. It is the largest amount of oil to hit Florida’s coast yet. Lifelong residents fear the beach life they’ve known is now gone forever. CNN.com
Just wait until it works its way completely around the Florida coast, including Miami and Palm Beach. The current goes in that direction. You’ll see an almost complete folding of the tourism business. Drill, baby, drill indeed!
Southern Comfort
June 24th, 2010
1:21 pm
Kinda off topic but in the spirit of energy regulations…
http://www2.timesdispatch.com/news/2010/jun/23/MASSGAT23-ar-229600/
Massey Energy sues federal agency
The suit asks the court to rule that the Mine Safety and Health Administration can not dictate mine ventilation plans; that a coal company has the right to a hearing when the federal agency denies a ventilation plan; and that coal firms can use scrubbers, which Massey claims reduces coal dust coming off on machines.
I can understand the last two somewhat, but doesn’t the first thing sounds like regulations. Does Massey want a court to rule that the MSHA can not regulate ventilation in mines? Is ventilation not part of “Safety” and “Health” in a mine environment? Or am I just comprehending this wrong?
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
1:22 pm
Disgusted, just curious, what the hell does your car run on..and how many plastic items do you use
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
1:24 pm
Now if Mr Kruse had been served up heaping helping of Hamburger Helper, by his wifey, the I could more understand this suicide if not possibly condone it.
This being the case…do we have any updates on the Hamburger Helper Factor?
@@
June 24th, 2010
1:25 pm
SoCo:
Agreed!
jay:
This one’s for you.
I make my living off the evening news, people love it when you lose. Get the bubble headed bleach blond, comes on at 5, she can tell you about the plane crash, with the gleam in her eye, it’s interesting when people die- give us dirty laundry. Kick em when they’re up, kick em when they’re down, kick em when they’re stiff, kick em all around – Don Henley
You are Henley’s “benevolent” dictator in that you dictate text.
Now I’m gone…for now anyway.
Normal
June 24th, 2010
1:26 pm
Scout,
been on the phone talking to my sister, so I missed your posts of 11:55 and 12:02. I see AmVet replied and good for him, but I gotta say this.
I agree with you that the ROEs are stupid. Always have been, always will be. We both know that ROEs are natures way of showing how chickensh*t our leaders are. And I think, if you’ve been honest with your service stories, you nknow why some of us take our own lives.
Bottom line, they have nothing to do with your posts. You can’t presume that Mr. Kruse was insane and “would have done it anyway”. not very Christian. And as much as you’d like too, you can’t rightfully blame President Obama. Mr. Kruse lost his livelyhood, a way of life that he has probably known since birth and had wanted no other. To see your world destroyed by another’s mistakes, is like seeing your child run over by a drunk driver. Very devastating.
Final thought. Nobody knew what was going to happen in the beginning of the spill. BP kept covering up and we (President Obama and most of us) believed them because we wanted to, and if President Obama had jumped in then, you’d be screaming bloodly murder about too much government interference, or some such thing. As things got progressively worse, President Obama started looking for ways to help, but still wanted BP to take charge, as it was their fault. Options failed, and here we are.
A man’s way of life is probably gone forever and all you do is try to put the balame on Obama. Why don’t you send a letter of apology to BP?. Good grief, man, have some empathy.
TaxPayer
June 24th, 2010
1:26 pm
Is the use of birth control, such as “the pill” or even condoms, considered “killing the unborn”.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
1:27 pm
Panama city beach is still open for business, and all areas south of shell island open for fishing.
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
1:30 pm
Ive been to shell island…
Normal
June 24th, 2010
1:30 pm
Josef,
you said, “For the record, my personal opinion is that suicide is one of the most selfish acts the human being is capable of.”
Again I disagree. I believe that suicide is the most unselfish act a person can do. I’ll explain at St. Eslewhere, if you’re interested, but bottom line, it’s my body, my life.
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
1:32 pm
Thats correct…its MY life, its MY body and who cares about others its MINE.
The democratic I ME MINE theory raised its head yet again.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:34 pm
Normal:
1) Agree with you on the ROE’s. In fact, I was at Camp Carroll (forward Marine artillery base near the DMZ) on 12/25/67 when a 24 hour truce was called by our side (and again on 1/1/68). During those periods, the NVA pounded the heck out of us with their artillery (we did not respond until the stroke of midnight 12/25 and 1/1) and used the opportunity to run supplies freely down the Ho Chi Minh Trail.
Now who do you suppose authorized that truce? Our military leaders in Vietnam or the politicians in Washington?
2) Regarding the rest of your comments, yes it is a shame that Jay politicized the suicide of this man with this thread by assuming (as you say) he did it because of the oil spill.
Thank you for the exchange.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
1:35 pm
Other than terminal bone cancer, I can’t think of many situations where homicide can’t clear up a problem better than suicide, because it’s usually other people causing the problem.
Southern Comfort
June 24th, 2010
1:35 pm
Normal
Clue me in on that 1:30 as well. Your final thought @ 1:26 was well thought out as well.
Lord Help Us
June 24th, 2010
1:37 pm
Scout, ‘Jay politicized the suicide of this man with this thread by assuming (as you say) he did it because of the oil spill..’
Where?
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:38 pm
Lord Help Us :
Are you back again? I told you it was because the Braves lost to the White Sox ! Surely, you can see that !
Bosch
June 24th, 2010
1:39 pm
Scout,
How exactly did Jay politicize this man’s suicide – he reported it happened. Where did he mention politics? I believe that was you politicized it when you blamed Obama for the man’s death.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:40 pm
Jay:
Please tell “Lord Help Us” why you wrote this thread and why you think this poor man killed himself.
Bosch
June 24th, 2010
1:41 pm
Scout,
Jay did that already. Backpeddling from showing your ass is not very becoming on you.
Lord Help Us
June 24th, 2010
1:41 pm
Scout, ‘Are you back again?’
I show up now and then when people make ugly accusations and then refuse to back them up…
jt
June 24th, 2010
1:41 pm
An Indiana man has apparently filed suit against the IRS, blaming his wife’s suicide on an IRS raid on their home in 2007. James Simon, 57, filed suit against the IRS and its agents, claiming that 10 IRS agents in bulletproof vests raided his family’s home around 7:00 am on the morning of Nov. 6, 2007. Simon was away in Ukraine at the time, but his wife Denise and their 10-year-old daughter were there. She was apparently grilled about a family trust, farm subsidies and other tax matters, causing emotional distress.
In a suicide note, she later wrote, “I am truly innocent of any attempt to evade taxes, launder money, commit fraud or any of the other things I am being accused of.”
Steven Miller, deputy commissioner for services and enforcement at the IRS, testified before the Senate Finance Committee on Thursday in a hearing on various aspects of this tax season. “We recognize that some people are struggling to meet their tax obligations and need assistance,” he said in his prepared testimony. “The IRS wants to do everything it can to help those taxpayers who have lost their job or face financial strain, especially those who have done the right thing in the past and are facing unusual hardships.”
However, Miller also discussed the agency’s stepped-up enforcement efforts. “Vigorous enforcement also encourages voluntary compliance, further increasing revenue, by generating public awareness of the consequences of not meeting one’s tax responsibilities,” he said.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
1:43 pm
IRS agents are scum , pure scum, and if they get hit by lightning, good.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:43 pm
Bosch:
No. Your reading skills are poor. Read my post. I said “maybe” ………….
“Maybe he killed himself because Obama is doing such a poor job and hindering a lot of Louisiana’s efforts?”
…………. and “maybe” it was as much Obama’s fault for not responding effectively enough …….. or “maybe” BP’s fault or “maybe” mental illness …………. take your pick.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:44 pm
Lord Help Us:
LOL !
Matilda
June 24th, 2010
1:44 pm
People do it because they can’t take the pain anymore. They have to make it stop. Those who are quick to judge just never felt pain that powerful, and should be grateful for that, except they’d rather judge others instead, because putting people down is the only way they know to feel good about themselves.
scrappy
June 24th, 2010
1:45 pm
jt – I’m confused… are we supposed to be blaming Obama for this woman’s suicide? Or are we supposed to be praising Obama because he is making people pay taxes?
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
1:46 pm
All IRS employees should be fed Hamburger helper 24/7.
Bosch
June 24th, 2010
1:46 pm
Scout,
It doesn’t matter with the word “maybe” – you brought up Obama therefore politicizing it and trying in vain to blame Jay for it taking the responsibility of the situation off yourself — typical wingnut hypocrisy — and further showing your ass by dodging it to include a comparison abortion and mocking a child. You should stop while your ahead, go to church and say some prayers for your soul.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:47 pm
jt:
I know ……….. I used to work for IRS-CID.
Later, when I was a supervisor with the USSS I sent two of my squad agents out to investigate a possible threat against the POTUS. That night (after the interview) the individual committed suicide. Whose fault?
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:47 pm
Bosch:
You’re a piece of work. LOL !
Bosch
June 24th, 2010
1:49 pm
Scout,
Blog God blocked me from saying what you are a piece of.
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
1:49 pm
Obama should be force fed Hamburger Helper….BurgerBoarded if you will.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:50 pm
Matilda :
We are not putting this guy down or judging him.
We are only discussing reasons as to why he might have done it.
The only reason we are doing that is because Jay (with everything else going on in the world) chose it as a thread this morning.
AmVet
June 24th, 2010
1:51 pm
My client has been delayed, so I can hang out a bit longer. (whilst working on other items.)
Corporal, you’re doing one helluva ballerina imitation.
SPQR, you talk a BIG game. Maybe you’re just the guy to take out Chavez. And those IRS agents. (Does that include former ones like the ballerina?) And the gawdknows how many innumerable others you want disappeared.
You are a caricature of the impotent but bloodlusting far right wing…
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:51 pm
Bosch:
Good !
“Cursing is the effort of a feeble mind to express itself forcibly.”
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:52 pm
AmVet :
Did I ever tell you the favorite thing we used to like to play on defense attorneys ?
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:53 pm
Outhouse GoKart :
Careful ……….. don’t cross a line.
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
1:54 pm
“And the gawdknows how many innumerable others you want disappeared.”
Kinda like the Star Trek Mirror Mirror episode where the evil Mr Spock was shown the device in the evil Capt Kirks quarter that just by pressing “this little button” one could make ones enemies disappear.
Jackie
June 24th, 2010
1:54 pm
@Scout
You know that if YOU had violated any of the rules of the Geneva Convention during your tour of The ‘Nam, your hip would have been in the brig before “quick gets ready.”
When and where were the rules of engagement designed to keep any of our troops from protecting themselves against an armed enemy? Are you saying that all those in Vietnam were part of the Viet Cong/NVA infrastructure, therefore, we did not do enough to eliminate those that caused us harm?
With that logic, all we had to do was remove the troops and drop nuclear weapons on the country. Victory is ours!
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
1:55 pm
No threats were made…direct or indirect.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
1:56 pm
Outhouse GoKart:
I know …………. just sayin.
Bosch
June 24th, 2010
1:57 pm
“Cursing is the effort of a feeble mind to express itself forcibly”
Says the Puritans.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
2:02 pm
Jackie:
If you are serious about this discussion of ROE’s may I suggest you read “Firebase Ripcord” by Keith Nolan.
In brief ……….. it was the Army’s last major battle in Vietnam. The Battalion Commander won the Medal of Honor posthumously. His unit was at a remote firebase and was being over-run by Regiments of NVA. At one point when they asked for artillery support they were told “they had already utilized their allocation for the month” …………… and that was per the U.S. Congress who had set the limit for the number of artillery rounds a unit could use per month. Good men died because of that and no one was ever held to account ………….. criminal account !
It’s being done again in different ways in Afghanitan. Makes me sick !
Oh, peridious nation !
Normal
June 24th, 2010
2:02 pm
Josef, SoCo,
St. Elsewhere…
Scout
June 24th, 2010
2:03 pm
Bosch:
Says me.
Scout
June 24th, 2010
2:03 pm
Excuse me ………. “perfidious”
Matilda
June 24th, 2010
2:03 pm
Scout,
If you didn’t do it, then I wasn’t talking about you, and therefore do not understand your use of the word “we” to defend what someone else said with which you do not concur.
joan
June 24th, 2010
2:03 pm
Every grifter in the country will be out there after BP for a handout–Obama was just the first.
Midori
June 24th, 2010
2:04 pm
Normal,
I doubt if he can find empathy in the dictionary.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
2:04 pm
It’s illegal to say one wants to off certain peoples, ask scout..i’m not stupid. Just hatefull..
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
2:04 pm
I still want Hugo Chavez to die, I am pretty sure he has no value .
Jackie
June 24th, 2010
2:05 pm
@Scout
Since you have read the book, tell me what firebase, why Army division was involved in that debacle.
Don’t believe it.
As for you and your experience, did you ever encounter ANY incidents where you were ordered not to protect yourself for enemy fire?
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
2:05 pm
Well then Joan I too want my Obama-BP check…
“Im rich BEEATCH!”
Steve
June 24th, 2010
2:05 pm
I see several references to this being a temporary problem. That is correct in that it will be over in a finite amount of time. However most estimates I’ve heard are quoting possibly 10 or more years for the environmental impact to heal. For a fisherman in that area that’s 55 years old, that pretty much means they may never see it as it was.
AmVet
June 24th, 2010
2:05 pm
OGK, don’t recall that episode, but in regards to the would be hitman, I was thinking of disappeared more along the lines of the 30,000 or so Argentine civilians who suffered that fate in the 1970s and 80s at the hands of the dictators who ran the country. (Saint Ronnie loved and armed the murderers.)
Bosch
June 24th, 2010
2:06 pm
Scout,
More like, says the champion in your own mind.
joan
June 24th, 2010
2:08 pm
Say what you will about suicide, but it does separate the weak from the strong. The only time it shows strength is when you are old, veg like and are more of a burden on the world than not. Oh, I forgot a lot of people are veg like and more of a burden on the world than not. If they committed suicide our economy would be well on the road to recovery.
SPQR(laissez Faire)
June 24th, 2010
2:08 pm
I wish i did have a button I could push to make people disappear forever..Me and charlie daniels and the staff at the coors distillery would have a wide open universe.
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
2:10 pm
AV…thats the episode where there were parallel universes with one being Starship Enterprise as the usual good guys and Starship Enterprise the Bad Guys.
The Bad Kirk and company just cruised around blowing up planets and killing everyone possible. Plus Lt Uhura was scamperig about with cute little red skirt with gold trim, bare belly and low cut top…as the evil Lt Uhura she was even more sexy than usual.
Bad Sulu made an attempt on Good Kirks life.
Bad Sulu made an attempt to seduce Uhura who pulled a knife on Bad Sulu.
One of the better episodes.
Normal
June 24th, 2010
2:10 pm
Careful Joan, you might end up on that list…
Jay
June 24th, 2010
2:11 pm
Scout, the nonsense you are willing to believe and repeat is simply astounding.
So Congress set a limit on the number of artillery rounds each unit could use? That makes your handshake claim seem almost plausible by comparison.
Jackie
June 24th, 2010
2:14 pm
@Joan
Using your logic, it appears you would be first in line. NO?????
Scout
June 24th, 2010
2:15 pm
Jackie:
You have hurt my feelings in questioning my integrity. However, I will respond:
1) “Ripcord (Screaming Eagles Under Siege – Vietnam 1970 by Keith Nolan, Presidio Press, 2000
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andre_Lucas READ THE BOOK !
2) I just told you …………. we were being pummeled by NVA artillery and we were NOT ALLOWED to return fire during the truce. What part of that do you not understand ?
Scout
June 24th, 2010
2:17 pm
Jay:
…………. and I suppose you don’t believe that President Johnson and McNamara picked individual targets to be bombed (or not) in N.V. ?
READ THE BOOK !
Scout
June 24th, 2010
2:21 pm
Jay:
………. and while you’re at it ……. this one just out:
“An American Amnesia (How the U.S. Congress Forced the Surrender of South Vietnam and Cambodia)” by Bruce Herschensohn
AmVet
June 24th, 2010
2:21 pm
i’m not stupid. Just hatefull..
LOL. I like the honesty. Alas, iIf only le petite caporal valued such a concept…
OGK,
Dammit Jim! You’re making me want to see those old shows again. Perish the thought, am I going to have scour the TVLand listings?
Jay
June 24th, 2010
2:23 pm
Scout I do believe that they picked individual targets. That’s well documented.
BADA BING
June 24th, 2010
2:24 pm
Daddy, have you and BP done anything for the ’small people’ yet?
BADA BING
June 24th, 2010
2:28 pm
Here is something none of you small minded people have not said. ‘GOD rest his soul and be with his family”.
RF
June 24th, 2010
2:28 pm
Scout, et.al.: Depression, which is what leads to most suicides, is either chronic to a person, or situational based on stress. Most people face some depression at various times and we all cope differently. It would seem the abrupt change in this guy’s behavior signalled a bout of depression he just couldn’t cope with. I don’t think it’s fair to say he would have done it sooner or later anyway. Clearly the recent stress on his business was a big contributor to his decision.
What makes it sad, and this isn’t liberal or conservative in nature, is that the mess we want the government to fix was caused by a corporation whose bottom line is money, not safety. The well was over budget and behind schedule, so it made fiscal sense to cut corners. Basically no government or corporate oversight of safety encouraged reckless behavior that is now costing everyone connected with this in any remote way (all of us eventually). Deregulation is partly to blame as is lack of monitoring by federal and state agencies charged with that job.
Outhouse GoKart
June 24th, 2010
2:30 pm
LOL…
Union
June 24th, 2010
2:32 pm
“A lot of damage in Gulf can’t be counted, compensated”
so very very true… sigh
Scout
June 24th, 2010
2:33 pm
Jay @ 2:23:
Good – I’m glad you believe that ………….. and how stupid was it!
Now, read the two books I mentioned and you will discover additional “documented” stunts by the Congress of the United States !
Scout
June 24th, 2010
2:34 pm
Jackkkkiiieee:
Are you out there re: my 2:15 ?
Opus
June 24th, 2010
2:35 pm
To bad General Mcchrystal-light wasn’t in the Gulf he could have covered up this incident/suicide like he covered up the murder/friendly fire of Tillman….
Jackie
June 24th, 2010
2:35 pm
@Scout
You are talking about what went on with the 101st at Hamburger Hill in 1970. I know personally, a 1st Lt that was part of that operation. He has NEVER indicated that they had trouble getting ammuntion to their unit(s). Secondly, the 101st operated jointly with the 1st Cav. There were literally hundreds of interlocking firebases around that area. They were designed to interdict supplies on the Ho Chi Minh trail and at various times, the Command in Siagon decided to fight for insignificant pieces of territory. This happened to be one of those fights.
Secondly, there were many “truces” called; Christmas, Tet, Easter, someone’s birthday. I have witnessed with my own eyes and ears where we fired back if someone fired at us during one of those truce periods.
I have 3 high school classmates that were at Dong He and NONE has ever recounted any experiences like you have described. My wife’s brother was a KIA in the 1st Marine/1st Battalion, Company C. His high school friend was with him at the time (1967) of his death. On top of that, a very good friend was a E7 in the Corps and operated in that area and DID NOT experience any of the denial of artillery cover that you purport.
Where do you get this crap?
BADA BING
June 24th, 2010
2:36 pm
Since some of you cannot vacation in the Gulf this year, go to Arizona and support their economy. The Parks Dept. has suspended any entrance fees and you can see the Grand Canyon for free.