The abuse of heavenly prayer for earth-bound politics
Last week, as the Texas Board of Education prepared to finalize controversial new textbook standards, board member Cynthia Dunbar was asked to offer the opening prayer.
Here’s what she said:
“Most gracious heavenly Father. We come before you today, and ask that you grant to us the ability not to be anxious for the future, wisdom and understanding for the day, and hearts of gratitude for our past. As we look to our past to guide us, let us reflect on the convictions of those who have gone before us. I believe that nobody can look to the history of our country without realizing that the Good Book and the spirit of the Savior have from the beginning been our guiding geniuses. Whether we look to the first charter of Virginia, or the charter of New England or the Charter of Massachusetts Bay, or the Fundamental Orders of Connecticut, the same objective is present: a Christian land governed by Christian principles.”
I believe the entire Bill of Rights came into being because of the knowledge our forefathers had of the Bible and their belief in it. Freedom of belief, of expression, of assembly, of petition, the dignity of the individual, the sanctity of the home, equal justice under the law, and the reservation of powers to the people. I like to believe we are living today in the spirit of the Christian religion. I like also to believe that as long as we do so, no great harm can come to our country. All this I pray in the name of my lord and savior, Jesus Christ.”
When I came to Georgia 20 years ago, I found the practice of opening almost every governmental meeting with prayer a little startling. I had worked as a journalist in every other section of the country, and had never seen it done so often. Even subcommittee meetings at the state Legislature are often begun with an invitation to pray.
Most of the time, the prayers amount to pleas for wisdom and guidance in decision-making, and only the eager-to-be-offended could find much to criticize. Occasionally, prayer leaders become much more specific and fervent, for example pledging all in attendance to obey the teachings of Jesus Christ in how they vote. That’s more troubling.
You are, after all, speaking to an audience of diverse beliefs, not to a congregation of the same-minded. A citizen should not be compelled to take part in religious activities contrary to his or her beliefs as a price for participating in government. All are supposed to stand on level ground in that setting.
And once in a while, you’ll get somebody who really abuses the privilege and uses the prayer to make explicitly political statements, as Dunbar did last week.
Let’s side aside the political and historical content of Dunbar’s prayer, which is of course highly debatable in its own right. What I find more outrageous is her decision to smuggle that content into the form of a prayer that others in attendance were required to listen to silently, heads bowed, as if in agreement, with no dissent allowed.
She was not using the prayer to talk to God, which ought to be its purpose; she was using it to tell others what God would say to them if He was there.
Personally, I find it highly offensive to watch people place their own political viewpoints into the mouth of God, in effect turning God into their personal sock puppet. Whatever your concept of a Supreme Being, you cheapen it by drafting Him as a megaphone for your own political views, and to do so in that kind of setting.
Government and religion are each very powerful in its own realm, and if allowed to join in mutual purpose they constitute an overpowering force that inevitably, always tries to sweep away all dissenting views. Dunbar speaks fervently about the lessons of the past; the lessons of the past in that regard are distressingly clear, as our Founding Fathers knew from direct and recent experience.
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832 comments Add your comment
Bosch
May 24th, 2010
11:22 am
Scout,
The only thing that I know to be true is that I was born and one day die – and that you are the lamest person on this blog.
Interesting Observation
May 24th, 2010
11:22 am
Think about this. In the distant future this nation will be so diverse, and people of all religious persuasions will be in public offices everywhere. Can you imagine before meetings each individual gets to run through his or her own religious ritual. By the time everyone has his or her say the business at hand will get pushed way back if they ever get to the business at hand.
jt
May 24th, 2010
11:22 am
Remember, it is all about the collective——————(even treat the sacred inconsiderately)-
“A World-historical individual is not so unwise as to indulge a variety of wishes to divide his regards. He is devoted to the One Aim, regardless of all else. It is even possible that such men may treat other great, even sacred interests, inconsiderately; conduct which is indeed obnoxious to moral reprehension. But so mighty a form must trample down many an innocent flower—crush to pieces many an object in its path.
The innocent flowers should not object to their destruction. The World-historical individual is acting for the best interests of the whole. In that special individual the state is embodied, and the state is the future of the collective. Even while being destroyed, the innocent flower has worth only through—and so should glory in—his participation in that larger future.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:23 am
Scout – “I will feel much better and safer after you enlist. Will the Royal Marines take you?”
I’m sure you dig a gal in uniform … particularly one who gives orders …
SAWB
May 24th, 2010
11:23 am
md, I didn’t say it. John Adams did!
hmmmm
May 24th, 2010
11:24 am
different day, same pi$$ing contest.
courtesy of jay bookman and the ajc URINAL/CONSTIPATION.
SAWB
May 24th, 2010
11:24 am
Interesting Observation, that will never happen.
Bosch
May 24th, 2010
11:24 am
Hey Kamchak!
Did you watch Inter Milan and Bayern Munich? It was sad for me.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:25 am
SAWB – “The further we stray from the wisdom and morality of God. The worse it gets”
really? things were better when we had slaves?
things were better when we were committing genocide against the indians?
things were better when we were turning the dogs and fire hoses against people because they were black? or stringing people up because they were Jewish?
to quote Archie Bunker “those were the days …”
DoggoneGA
May 24th, 2010
11:25 am
“How do you feel about the new Supreme Court ruling keeping sex offenders in jail after they have served their full sentence ?”
I don’t know much about it. In principle, I disagree with it…but in practice? That might be different. I think a lot depends on whether the offender is merely warehoused in prison, or is required to undergo therapy for his problem.
If he’s merely warehoused, a case might be made for agreement with the SC…but if he has undergone treatment and improved, then there is room for disagreement.
Rightwing Troll
May 24th, 2010
11:26 am
Of course, not suprisingly, @@ omitted the #4 on the list of highest paid superintendants.
So, to be clear on this:
#1 highest paid – Gwinnett
#2 highest paid – Fulton
#3 highest paid – Dekalb
#4 highest paid – Cobb
So if it’s “leftists” fault that the supers of two of the largest counties in the state are the highest paid, whose fault is it that the other two people are on this list?
md
May 24th, 2010
11:26 am
“what, exactly, is your problem with ordering American troops to stand ready in case of further aggression???”
Because lately, it is always “American” troops that are doing the standing by. And in SK particularly, the population has no lost love for our troops in peacetime, yet everything changes when hostilities are a possibility.
It is time to end all treaties – especially NATO.
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:28 am
Doggone/GA:
Now you are being inconsistent. A sentence served is a sentence served. Are murderers more dangerous than sex offenders? Want to keep them past their sentence also?
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:29 am
md – “Because lately, it is always “American” troops that are doing the standing by”
you realize that the US troops have been manning the DMZ for the last 40+ years, don’t you? this is nothing new but telling the guys who are already there to heighten readiness.
Rightwing Troll
May 24th, 2010
11:29 am
“courtesy of jay bookman and the ajc URINAL/CONSTIPATION.”
But the biggest urinator isn’t here, at least not here posting under his USUAL name. But he’s been known to post under other names as well…
It’s a discussion about religion, so I expect him to kick in the door any second and declare hisself the biggest, baddest F’in christian in these here parts…
Peadawg
May 24th, 2010
11:29 am
“Doggone – 10:04 – nope. sorry. your living room = Times Square.”
I still don’t see how to made that leap. Living room w/ family DOES NOT equal your room, door closed, by yourself…according to the scripture YOU posted.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:29 am
“It is time to end all treaties – especially NATO”
and NATO has nothing to do with NK/SK
md
May 24th, 2010
11:31 am
“The only thing that I know to be true is that I was born and one day die ”
Wrong – we know the born part is true because we are here, but one never knows what the future holds – we may all be frozen for future generations for all we “know”.
Saul Good
May 24th, 2010
11:31 am
USinUK….you forgot about burning witches…or should I say those they “accused” of being a witch… I’m pretty sure that our country was founded upon THOSE principles as well.
Jay's blog
May 24th, 2010
11:31 am
Is Cynthia Dunbar giving to Caesar what is God’s, or giving to God what is Caesars? WWJD?
Doug Suttles, BP’s COO was just on CNBC squinting his eyes as he addressed the camera about the delays of a “few more days” and all the alternative fixes BP has in the pipeline. He mentioned again the 5000 feet of water the leak is under. When Doug Suttles squints, he really looks like he knows what he’s talking about.
That leak may as well be on the moon, eh?
BP phone home.
John K
May 24th, 2010
11:31 am
I think those who clamor for the “good ol’ days” think that Leave it to Beaver and The Andy Griffith Show were documentaries.
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:31 am
USinUK @ 11:18am
In all seriousness, I can promise you the North Koreans are really not wanting to take on the South Koreans (and will only do so to “save face”).
The South Koreans had their White Horse Division, Blue Dragon Division and a Marine Brigade in South Vietnam. The problem was, they were such ferocious fighters (and took no prisoners) that the Viet Cong and NVA refused to engage them whenever possible or tried to break contact as soon as they realized who it was.
They are “bad dudes”.
Rightwing Troll
May 24th, 2010
11:31 am
Has anyone looked up seepage today?
md
May 24th, 2010
11:32 am
“and NATO has nothing to do with NK/SK”
Didn’t say it did. Just happens to be the biggest treaty we need to abolish.
Cornelius
May 24th, 2010
11:32 am
You’re a liberal kept by better men than yourself.
Scout likes to use that line when he gets flustered. I suppose it could make his life of servitude to better men than himself more bearable if he imagines others living the same life.
DoggoneGA
May 24th, 2010
11:33 am
“A sentence served is a sentence served. Are murderers more dangerous than sex offenders? Want to keep them past their sentence also?”
You’re not going to get me to follow you into your “black and white” mindset. A rapist might be a greater threat after serving his sentence than before, if he does not get treatment. Especially one who preys on children. Sometimes it really DOES come down to that “your rights end where my nose begins”
A murderer? It depends. There aren’t so many people who kill at random, murders TEND to be specific to the murderer and his victim…but yes, I would place random murderers (such as those 2 in the Washington area) in the same gropu as rapists…in that a case MIGHT BE made that they should not be released even after they have served their sentence.
Kamchak
May 24th, 2010
11:33 am
Bosch
No, I actually forgot about the UCL championship game–not sure I would have watched anyway.
Not at all a fan of Mourinho, even when he managed The Blue Lions. I understand that he wants to go to Real Madrid and I got no problems with that except he might procure Drogba and Lampard.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:34 am
Peadawg – “Living room w/ family DOES NOT equal your room, door closed, by yourself”
awwwwwww … still clinging to your straw, hours later … sad, that.
if you want to go back and review the quote, it doesn’t say by yourself — you chose to add that. in other words, be private – with a friend, with your family, with a neighbor – but don’t make a big show of it IN PUBLIC.
DannyX
May 24th, 2010
11:34 am
Bush saw Putin’s soul. He talked weekly to spiritual adviser Reverend Haggard. Of course Jesus told him to bomb Iraq.
Its not about Christianity. Its about the cult like Christian right that so far has everything wrong. Starting with the Texas woman’s prayer. Everything the right does ends up embarrassing Christianity.
Falwell, Haggard, Swaggert, Bakker, Robertson, Roberts. Focus on the Family crusades against homosexuality. Cures young boys by having them shower with an adult. No surprise the founder uses rent Boy.com.
Don’t forget the Schiavo incident. Purple Teletubbies. Hurricanes.
Your good Christian leaders are also dropping like flies. Craig, Ensign, Sanford, Vitter, Richardson, Newt and all the others.
Your house is a mess! Then you say things like “Christian Nation.” Lets hope not.
AmVet
May 24th, 2010
11:34 am
OGK, LOL. Not sure about worthless, but I agree, Sting was amazingly over-rated! Lots of forgettable stuff.
Unlike this guy…
And god said
You are not serving me, you’re serving something else
Cause I don’t need to be pleased, just get over yourself
You can’t suck up to me, I know you all too well
But I don’t dwell upon you, so get over yourself
Cause you’re not praying to me, you’re praying to yourself
And you’re not worshipping me you’re worshipping yourself
And you will kill in my name and heaven knows what else
When you can’t prove I exist so get over yourself
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Djc6dldCk3U
Kimberly and Clark, Don't leave home without it.
May 24th, 2010
11:34 am
Has anyone looked up seepage today?
That depends. Who’s asking.
lib dem
May 24th, 2010
11:35 am
Black social dems are some of the most religious bigots in the country…
DoggoneGA
May 24th, 2010
11:35 am
“Living room w/ family DOES NOT equal your room, door closed, by yourself…according to the scripture YOU posted.”
*I* have not posted any scripture today, except to correct someone’s post of one of the Ten Commandments. And *I* fully understand that the injuction to pray “alone” is an indictment of hypocrisy…and not entirely a command to not pray in public AT ALL.
md
May 24th, 2010
11:35 am
“you realize that the US troops have been manning the DMZ for the last 40+ years, don’t you? this is nothing new but telling the guys who are already there to heighten readiness.”
I’ve lost a good number of family to that “situation”, so I’m am quite aware of what it is.
The point is, there should be a UN treaty, not a US treaty. Of course the UN is worthless and toothless and needs to be abolished too.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:36 am
Scout – 11:31 – actually, I agree with you – but the fact remains that there is evidence that NK sunk the SK ship. the acts of aggression may not be from NK but from SK, which would, then, require KJI to respond … wash / rinse / repeat.
Soothsayer
May 24th, 2010
11:36 am
Please someone call me when they allow dancing again.
AmVet
May 24th, 2010
11:36 am
“I think those who clamor for the “good ol’ days” think that Leave it to Beaver and The Andy Griffith Show were documentaries.”
HA!
Still pining for another Joseph McCarthy, they are…
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:37 am
“Black social dems”
just out of curiosity … is that as opposed to black reticent dems?
AmVet
May 24th, 2010
11:38 am
“Black social dems are some of the most religious bigots in the country…”
Der. Is it just me, or does this make ANY sense?
Rightwing Troll
May 24th, 2010
11:38 am
First ruminating about people getting “beat up” in school, now glorifying the murder of vanquished foes?
Like an onion, slowly but surely the layers are being peeled back…
Scout will alternately whine about being abused in boot camp and the corp then brag about being a lifelong government employee… can’t make out which end is up…
Sunday, Monday, Happy Days.
May 24th, 2010
11:39 am
AmVet is Eddie Haskill.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:39 am
saul good – 11:31 – yep! add that one to the list, too!! thanks
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:40 am
USinUK: That’s why we are so fortunate to have “Private” Obama to sort it all out.
Doggone/GA: As I said, you are being inconsistent.
DoggoneGA
May 24th, 2010
11:40 am
“Doggone/GA: As I said, you are being inconsistent.
No one’s perfect
AmVet
May 24th, 2010
11:41 am
Gee Wally, somebody is stuck on 50s stupid…
And Ward, quit being so hard on the Beaver…
Scout, tsk, tsk, tsk, Insulting YOUR Commander in Chief. The nerve…
Rightwing Troll
May 24th, 2010
11:42 am
The ‘private” Obama brings up an interesting question.
Do you prefer a person who’s never served or a person who went AWOL to be CIC?
Birthers Anonymous
May 24th, 2010
11:42 am
Poor Cub Scout. He still has not come to grips with the fact that Obama is his Commander in Chief.
jt
May 24th, 2010
11:43 am
It is a big chasm to jump from worshiping God to worshiping the State, and most people refuse to consider that they could do so. It is a small jump from worshiping the POWER of God to the POWER of the State, however, and I believe this is what has happened.
Got that? you righty war mongers and you lefty aborto freaks?
It is time you ALL got down on your knees and beg forgiveness. Just for decency’s sake. (if you vote for the R & D party.).
williebkind
May 24th, 2010
11:43 am
To be a progressive liberal and socialist, you must be atheist. There is no absolute truth, right. Jay, you said you came to Ga 20 years ago. Did you forget the road that brought you here? You can not find you way back. Most people who want to change Ga are not from Ga. So the idiom of the nonbeliever to take away the belief. We are a Christian nation founded on Judea/Christianity beliefs. Glenn Beck has proven that progressive liberals have not taught and deliberately chose not to teach about our founding fathers and their journey to the constitution. Nor did the progressivel liberals reflect on our forefathers life post constitution. What is up with that Jay?
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:43 am
AmVet:
It’s call “verbal cartooning.”
You know, the same thing Luckovich’s does with his crayons.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:44 am
“That’s why we are so fortunate to have “Private” Obama to sort it all out.”
yeah, because mr. “bomb-bomb-bomb-Iran” would be SO preferable in this situation …
Peadawg
May 24th, 2010
11:44 am
USinUK, so, you and your family have dinner in your room w/ the door closed?
I can take the verse you posted and twist it just like you can. You started all this bs by posting it in the first place.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:45 am
“Glenn Beck has proven … ”
dammit, Bosch — please pass the screen cleaner …
Big D
May 24th, 2010
11:45 am
Most intelligent people do not even consider “right or wrong” in global decision making due to the fact that it is a variable. Cause and effect always wins at the end of the day.
1. If it ain’t broke don’t fix it.
2. A wise man learns from experience a fool learns no other.
We have to choose who we are as a nation.
Birthers Anonymous
May 24th, 2010
11:45 am
Someone has gone and dragged us into the gutter for sure now. They used Glenn Beck’s name. He’s so vain. He probably wrote a song about himself.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:45 am
Peadawg – “USinUK, so, you and your family have dinner in your room w/ the door closed?”
man … talk about desperate … thanks for the laugh today, Pea -
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:47 am
Birthers Anonymous:
Thou dost err sir. He is my president but NOT my commander in chief ……….. I am no longer in the military.
Rightwing Troll :
Well, not to “nitpick” but one can be proven the other cannot. That said, I would “prefer” the AWOL as they had at least some military experience. BTW: Even learning to fly a military fighter jet was more dangerous (just check the accident statistics) than most of the jobs one could have in Nam except maybe the infantry.
md
May 24th, 2010
11:47 am
“Do you prefer a person who’s never served or a person who went AWOL to be CIC?”
You do know that trotting this one out just makes you look silly – right?
kjdf
May 24th, 2010
11:48 am
i think the bible says if we don’t tell people about god, the rocks will do it. i would like to see the aclu get the rocks in to court.
AmVet
May 24th, 2010
11:48 am
AH! I see, Corporal! It’s all good…
To be a progressive liberal and
socialistnon-Republican, you must be atheist.Patently fallacious. BUT…not a bad idea.
willie, Glenn Beck??? Yoiks…
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:48 am
USinUK:
Nope. The real danger is have a president that shows weakness to people who only understand strength and power.
happy2be
May 24th, 2010
11:49 am
gods have always been and will always be sock puppets, badges, swords and bullets, monsters, and whatever else a power seeking group can conjure for their purposes. now, granted, sometimes those purposes are for the greater good. … but, in the end, power corrupts, and a sense of absolute power corrupts absolutely
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:50 am
md :
See my 11:47. I try to humor them ………….. sometimes.
stands for decibels
May 24th, 2010
11:50 am
to quote Archie Bunker “those were the days …”
To quote the TX BoE: “Mister we could use a man like Joe McCarthy again”
bobo
May 24th, 2010
11:50 am
God doesn’t believe in atheists
AmVet
May 24th, 2010
11:51 am
Ragging on Boo Hoo Beck is kind afun, but I honestly have not watched more than about 5 minutes of him ever.
All I know is that he got his BIG break with the Communist News Network and that’s good enough for me!
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:51 am
Scout – “The real danger is have a president that shows weakness to people who only understand strength and power”
and ordering troops in the DMZ to raise their readiness levels is showing weakness … how, again???
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:52 am
Birthers anonymous:
Since you are talking about “Private” Obama vs. Commander in Chief …….. check THIS out !
“The Community Organizer was delivering his commencement address to the Cadets at West Point over the weekend. As you probably already know, he was using a teleprompter.”
“Now I don’t know how the media found out about this one … maybe they had an advanced text of his speech … but at one time during the address Obama was supposed to say “That’s a lot of cheering.” Trouble is .. he couldn’t say it. He couldn’t say it because there was NOT a lot of cheering.”
Boortz
Even the cadets know …………………… don’t they.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
11:52 am
dB – 11:50 – I never should have posted that … now, I’ve got “and you knew who you weeeeerrrrreeeee then … goils were goils and men were men … ” going through my head …
oh, Archie!
Birthers Anonymous
May 24th, 2010
11:53 am
I am no longer in the military.
Given your past rants about your service, you’d never convince anyone other than yourself of that. I have also heard lines such as “Once military, Always Military”. Also, I assume that you rely on the military for your retirement so you are most certainly beholdin’ to the military and its command structure for your very livlihood. Bottom line. Obama is currently your Commander in Chief no matter how much you deny it.
Jay's blog
May 24th, 2010
11:53 am
If a state prayer offends everybody then certainly that would fit right in with government policy.
I think Cynthia Dunbar did a good job.
Peadawg
May 24th, 2010
11:53 am
“man … talk about desperate … thanks for the laugh today, Pea ”
Ditto. I enjoyed it. Twisting words and using the Bible verses that help your argument is fun, right USinUK?
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:54 am
USinUK:
Unless I missed something he didn’t order any troops anywhere he just ordered them to be alert (like he had to do that). The understaffed 2nd Infantry Division (some of them are in the Middle East) is already there as a “firebreak”.
Scout
May 24th, 2010
11:56 am
Birthers Anonymous:
Sorry, you are technically and legally wrong. I am NOT subject to the “Military Code of Justice.” Therefore, he is NOT my Commander in Chief. Nice try.
BTW: I get zero military retirement.
Birthers Anonymous
May 24th, 2010
11:56 am
You do know that trotting this one out just makes you look silly – right?
You know that labeling Obama as “Private” makes someone look silly — right?
@@
May 24th, 2010
11:58 am
RWT:
Hellooooo from the sidelines!
Of course, not suprisingly, @@ omitted the #4 on the list of highest paid superintendants.
Where, pray tell, did I submit such a list and, more importantly, why would I care what superintendent’s in those four counties get paid? I will say that past superintendents in my county (Clayton) were overpaid if they were paid $100 annually. All we got for our money was loss of accreditation.
Back to removing the metal stains from my pool. For those of you who have a pool, don’t buy that expensive powder stuff from the pool supply place. Buffered Vitamin C tablets go much further and cost less….A WHOLE LOT LESS as a matter of fact. $32.00 vs $7.00.
Can’t beat those kinda savings and the end result is the same.
Wander on, RWT. The wilderness awaits.
Weirdo!
Birthers Anonymous
May 24th, 2010
11:58 am
Sorry, you are technically and legally wrong. I am NOT subject to the “Military Code of Justice.” Therefore, he is NOT my Commander in Chief. Nice try.
BTW: I get zero military retirement.
Then clearly you are kept by better men than yourself. No Oorahs for you either.
gagay
May 24th, 2010
11:58 am
Those prayers will continue until 51% of Texas is Muslim and then they open with a prayer to Allah and you will see all hell break loose because “those people” are trying to shove “their” beliefs down “my” throat!
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
12:00 pm
Scout – 11:54 – exactly – which is why I don’t understand people getting all het up about it – the troops are there, already (and have been for 40+ years) – they’re just increasing their readiness …
peadawg – “Twisting words and using the Bible verses that help your argument is fun, right USinUK?” I wouldn’t know … however, you do seem to have issues with deliberately misinterpreting them in some kind of desperate need to prove … something …
theyeshaveit
May 24th, 2010
12:00 pm
Pray Tell, Who’s Side Is God On?
For centuries, someone, somewhere has invoked the name of God in support of a cause. Meanwhile, the other side, with equal passion and faith, proclaims that God is on its side. How naive we are.
Frankly, I find Ms. Dunbar’s prayer disgusting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEKuGcmW70I
md
May 24th, 2010
12:00 pm
“You know that labeling Obama as “Private” makes someone look silly — right?”
If one wants to get technical, “Private” for Barry is being generous, considering he never served.
Rightwing Troll
May 24th, 2010
12:01 pm
“Well, not to “nitpick” but one can be proven the other cannot. That said, I would “prefer” the AWOL as they had at least some military experience. BTW: Even learning to fly a military fighter jet was more dangerous (just check the accident statistics) than most of the jobs one could have in Nam except maybe the infantry.”
The fact that it cannot be readily disproved speaks volumes about the “allegations”.
For a soldier to go AWOL, he must disrespect the uniform and his brothers whom he abandoned and left to die, now you would prefer that person become the CIC of that same force he abandoned?( Granted there wasn’t much hostile activity in the skys of Alabama, but still…)
Seriously, remove the R and the D from the equation.
Peadawg
May 24th, 2010
12:03 pm
USinUK, are you a woman or a man? Men can usually admit they’re wrong. Woman can’t the taste of those words coming out of their mouths. You sounds like a woman right now.
Scout
May 24th, 2010
12:03 pm
Birthers Anonymous :
My USMC service was a long time ago and I am getting up there in age so, yes, right now I am kept by better (and younger/stronger) men than myself. God bless them.
AmVet
May 24th, 2010
12:04 pm
Zooks! PLEASE NOT the nobody respects us because Barry’s too weak nonsense anymore!!!
Hell, your George Bush II *surged* into Afghanistan with how many more divisions? How many more men? We ain’t leaving there until the Republican Party finds themselves another Abraham Lincoln.
WHo here really gives a flying fork what these countries think? I am CERTAIN you did not when the Hero of the Texas ANG was playing rogue cowboy…
Scout
May 24th, 2010
12:05 pm
Birthers anonymous:
Sorry. He is really: “Che/Karl/Capo/Private/Jimmy/Jose/El” Obama
theyeshaveit
May 24th, 2010
12:06 pm
Peadawg said USinUK, are you a woman or a man? Men can usually admit they’re wrong. Woman can’t the taste of those words coming out of their mouths. You sounds like a woman right now.
Peadawg, when you generalize, you will generally be wrong.
USinUK
May 24th, 2010
12:06 pm
“USinUK, are you a woman or a man? Men can usually admit they’re wrong. Woman can’t the taste of those words coming out of their mouths. You sounds like a woman right now.”
wow – deliberately obtuse AND sexist … what a package!
Scout
May 24th, 2010
12:06 pm
Rightwing Troll:
Since “Che” Obama is president now (and not Bush) let’s concentrate on “allegations” about HIS past ………………
Time for noon chow ………….. be back later !
Normal
May 24th, 2010
12:07 pm
bobo
May 24th, 2010
11:50 am
God doesn’t believe in atheists
Good! Then we’re even…
theyeshaveit
May 24th, 2010
12:07 pm
md, Did you do any military service?
md
May 24th, 2010
12:07 pm
“the troops are there, already (and have been for 40+ years) – they’re just increasing their readiness …”
My beef, is that they are still there, by themselves, with no UN support.
Why is that? Technically, the war never ended, but the UN certainly bailed.
Peadawg
May 24th, 2010
12:07 pm
Just a simple question. You haven’t been able to answer many of them today it seems…..
stands for decibels
May 24th, 2010
12:09 pm
PDawg, I am fairly sure that my doors are shut most every time the fambly and I sit down and give thanks prior to dining at home. I guess you leave yours open?
DannyX
May 24th, 2010
12:09 pm
If we are a Christian nation we will need a new cabinet level position. The Dept of Stoning. This department will be responsible for upholding Christian Law.
We’ll be starting with the Ten Commandments. Unfortunately some of our “best Christians” are first up. Georgia for example has about 6.5 million “best Christian.” adults. A combination of illegal divorce, and adultery will require the stoning of 6.25 million of them.
For future generations let this be an example. God created “Adam and Eve.” NOT “Adam and Eve then Cindy.” Divorce is a choice.
God Bless our Christian nation. Remember, DON”T COVET.
DJ
May 24th, 2010
12:11 pm
Hey PEADAWG – we get it. You are a born-again, double-dipped fundamentalist who thinks everyone should live life the way you and you’re pastor’s interpretation of your chosen translation of some books of the Christian bible says we should. And further, you would like to see this narrow world view codified into law and enforced by the state at the point of a gun. We get it. That’s what you think. Wonderful. Now let some other people have the floor for a while and express what they think. The world knows what you think – nothing else you say adds to the conversation. It’s not a conversation – it’s just you pontificating. But we can get that from our own pastors on Sundays (or whatever heathen religion we may be a part of). WE DON’T NEED TO HEAR YOU PLAYING PREACHER. You’re really not that good at it.
AmVet
May 24th, 2010
12:12 pm
The Dept of Stoning.
With an undersecretary of Witch Burning!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIaORknS1Dk
theyeshaveit
May 24th, 2010
12:12 pm
A study of Cynthia Dunbar’s “history” would surely include a chapter on the Dark Ages. It would surely be called Contemporary Texas Oh, lord, may you show Ms. Dunbar the light.
md
May 24th, 2010
12:12 pm
“md, Did you do any military service?”
The answer would be no – my parents strongly discouraged joining due to heavy losses within the family. I honored their wishes.
stands for decibels
May 24th, 2010
12:13 pm
Men can usually admit they’re wrong.
As in, “I was wrong, earlier, when I called you a f–king a-hole, you’re really a f–king f–ktard”