South Korea fingers North Korea as culprit; North Korea threatens war … again

Sinking another nation’s ship and killing 46 of its sailors is by any definition a provocation to war. But this is a tough one.

From The Washington Post:

“SEOUL — South Korea said Thursday that an international investigation has found overwhelming evidence that one of its warships was sunk by a torpedo made in North Korea and that the weapon was fired by a North Korean submarine.

“There is no other plausible explanation” for the sinking of the Cheonan on March 26 near a disputed sea border between the two Koreas, said the report. It was based on the findings of 50 experts from South Korea who worked with 24 investigators from the United States, Australia, Britain and Sweden.

After the results of the investigation were released, South Korean President Lee Myung-bak said his country “will take resolute countermeasures against North Korea and make it admit its wrongdoing through strong international cooperation.”

…. North Korea immediately denounced the investigation as a “sheer fabrication” and accused the South of “pointing a dirty finger at us like a thief.” It added that if there is any retaliation or punishment of the North, it will respond with “various forms of tough measures including all-out war.”

…. The exploded torpedo was fired by a midget submarine, equipped with night-vision technology, that approached the Cheonan from international waters to ensure “the covertness” of the attack, South Korean Rear Adm. Hwang Won-dong said Thursday. Speaking at a news conference held to elaborate on the findings, he said the midget submarine fled the scene following the same route.”

162 comments Add your comment

Soothsayer

May 20th, 2010
1:42 pm

Heck! What’s one more war among friends?

Peadawg

May 20th, 2010
1:48 pm

They gotta find someone tall enough in N. Korea to pull the levers on the missile launchers.

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

May 20th, 2010
1:48 pm

You got a big old warship and you let it get sunk by a little midget submarine? I wouldn’t of told that if I was S. Korea.

Have a good p.m. everybody.

Gale

May 20th, 2010
1:49 pm

A midget submarine attack? By North Korea? If so, they had to have help. Who or what country profits from having the Koreans at war? So, where did they buy a mini-sub? There cannot be a lot of companies that build those, especially torpedo-equipped subs. That all assumes North Korean actually did the dirty deed. They do seem to be spoiling for a fight.

Normal

May 20th, 2010
1:59 pm

Off topic #1 to Gator Joe.

From the Huffington Post:
Rand Paul’s interview with Rachel Maddow and NPR:

See new updates below.

The morning after he declined to endorse the totality of the Civil Rights Act in his much-discussed appearance on the Rachel Maddow Show, Dr. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) copped to feeling regret — not over his comments, but rather his decision to be interviewed by Maddow in the first place.

“It was a poor political decision and probably won’t be happening anytime in the near future,” the Tea Party endorsed Senate candidate said on the Laura Ingraham show on Thursday morning. “Because, yeah, they can play things and want to say, ‘Oh you believed in beating up people that were trying to sit in restaurants in the 1960s.’ And that is such a ridiculous notion and something that no rational person is in favor of. [But] she went on and on about that.”

Blaming the messenger is a tactic often used by politicians when the message itself is to blame. And Paul’s appearance on the Maddow show on Wednesday night was anything but bland. For 15 minutes, he and the host went back and forth in debating where there should be limits to government efforts to desegregate private institutions (Paul was skeptical that the government should play any role at all). But the notion that the MSNBC host was somehow unloading liberal hostilities on him doesn’t jibe with the fact that Paul got the same type of treatment during an NPR interview earlier that morning — or, for that matter, that a conservative voice on MSNBC, Joe Scarborough, seemed aghast at his answers. “He needs to come up with an answer today, or Kentucky will be Arizona: a battleground for ugly, racial politics,” Scarborough said. “He has 24 hours.”

(Paul, in fact, chose Maddow’s show to initially launch his Senate candidacy a year prior to last night’s appearance.)

Paul did seem to draw back (or tighten) his discussion of the Civil Rights Act during his interview with Ingraham.

“These are settled issues in the Civil Rights Act,” he said. “I have no intention of bringing up anything related to the Civil Rights Act… I think [segregation] is sort of a stain and blight on our history — so, no, I have never really favored any change in the Civil Rights Act or any of that. But they have seemed to unleash the loony left on me.”

Story continues below
UPDATE I: Rand Paul’s campaign has now issued a lengthy statement about his views on the Civil Rights Act. The key quote: “I unequivocally state that I will not support any efforts to repeal the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

“I believe we should work to end all racism in American society and staunchly defend the inherent rights of every person. I have clearly stated in prior interviews that I abhor racial discrimination and would have worked to end segregation. Even though this matter was settled when I was 2, and no serious people are seeking to revisit it except to score cheap political points, I unequivocally state that I will not support any efforts to repeal the Civil Rights Act of 1964.”

“Let me be clear: I support the Civil Rights Act because I overwhelmingly agree with the intent of the legislation, which was to stop discrimination in the public sphere and halt the abhorrent practice of segregation and Jim Crow laws.”

“As I have said in previous statements, sections of the Civil Rights Act were debated on Constitutional grounds when the legislation was passed. Those issues have been settled by federal courts in the intervening years.”

“My opponent’s statement on MSNBC Wednesday that I favor repeal of the Civil Rights Act was irresponsible and knowingly false. I hope he will correct the record and retract his claims.”

“The issue of civil rights is one with a tortured history in this country. We have made great strides, but there is still work to be done to ensure the great promise of Liberty is granted to all Americans.”

“This much is clear: The federal government has far overreached in its power grabs. Just look at the recent national healthcare schemes, which my opponent supports. The federal government, for the first time ever, is mandating that individuals purchase a product. The federal government is out of control, and those who love liberty and value individual and state’s rights must stand up to it.”

“These attacks prove one thing for certain: the liberal establishment is desperate to keep leaders like me out of office, and we are sure to hear more wild, dishonest smears during this campaign.”

UPDATE II: TPM highlights another potentially problematic view of Paul’s that came up during the same NPR interview during which Paul discussed the Civil Rights Act.

Rand Paul’s interview with NPR’s All Things Considered last night was the first sign the the freshly-minted Kentucky Republican Senate nominee might have some explaining to do today. The blogosphere is already alight with Paul’s interview with Rachel Maddow, but his interview on NPR shows that his libertarian views go deeper than just his take on the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Speaking with NPR’s Robert Siegel, Paul made the case for less federal involvement in workplace and environmental regulation, including his opposition to some components of the Americans With Disabilities Act. [...]

Here’s the interview in a nutshell, from Paul’s response to a question about whether or not he thinks the ADA is an example of federal “overreach”:

“I think a lot of things could be handled locally,” Paul told Siegel. “For example, I think that we should try to do everything we can to allow for people with disabilities and handicaps…I think if you have a two-story office and you hire someone who’s handicapped, it might be reasonable to let him have an office on the first floor rather than the government saying you have to have a $100,000 elevator. And I think when you get to solutions like that, the more local the better, and the more common sense the decisions are, rather than having a federal government make those decisions.”

Normal

May 20th, 2010
2:00 pm

Gale,
You have the basis for a good techno-triller going there… :)

Normal

May 20th, 2010
2:01 pm

Thriller…I’m such a poor typist…

Normal

May 20th, 2010
2:02 pm

Peadawg…
Gotta tell those pesky NK’s not to get short with us, huh?

AmVet

May 20th, 2010
2:04 pm

It’s Obama’s fault!

Nobody respects us since The War President left office!

Gale

May 20th, 2010
2:06 pm

Normal, I was thinking that as I typed it. It seems all too absurd.

Jefferson

May 20th, 2010
2:06 pm

The beat goes on…

Outhouse GoKart

May 20th, 2010
2:11 pm

The US should ride around in N Korean waters doing figure 8’s and such,
daring them to act.

moonbat betty

May 20th, 2010
2:12 pm

Obama should promptly go to north korea and apologize to Long Duck Dong.

AmVet

May 20th, 2010
2:13 pm

A lawsuit against a 2009 Atlanta Gas Light bill increase has been dismissed.

The suit, brought by the senior advocacy group AARP, challenged the legitimacy of a gas bill increase the state Public Service Commission approved last fall.

“I guess they’re right, old people, though slow and dangerous behind the wheel, can still serve a purpose. Don’t you go dyin’ on me!” ~Ace Ventura

Scout

May 20th, 2010
2:14 pm

If we could only get McArthur back …………………

Outhouse GoKart

May 20th, 2010
2:15 pm

Doesnt S Korea give aid to N Korea in the form of food stuffs, fuel etc? The S Koreans should cut all aid immediately.

The US S Korea should begin immediatel war games.

Scout

May 20th, 2010
2:15 pm

P.S.

Let’s hope a full scale North Korean invasion doesn’t take place or what’s left of the 2nd Infantry Division (not already deployed to Iraq/Afghanistan) will unfortunately be history.

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2010
2:17 pm

I’m having one of those “sure wish I were a fly on the wall inside the Pentagon briefing rooms” moments, reading about this (as I did when I heard about it earlier today.)

Also, having seen the linked story–If it’s any consolation, it would appear that the WaPo’s comments page regulars can be every bit as dopey and small minded as we are.

AmVet

May 20th, 2010
2:17 pm

So let’s see if I have this correct.

Ayn Rand Paul has said repeatedly he did not serve in Viet Nam but in this instance said he did?

Oh the Hume-Hannity of it all!

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2010
2:21 pm

In related news, I was blessedly not able to get the keywords “deep kimchi” to link to any recent stories about this flareup.

The Dutch

May 20th, 2010
2:21 pm

U know what, let the Koreans fight thier own war between them. they have been wanting to war with eachother for so long. theres no point britain getting involved in another pointless war, but then again we are America’s lapdog and there continuation of trying to police the world will result in britain losing more of its brave troops. and with north korea testing neuclear weapons and Kim Jong il being a war mongering lunatic a don’t thing this will end well.

Disgusted

May 20th, 2010
2:29 pm

let the Koreans fight thier own war between them. they have been wanting to war with eachother for so long.

They are, in fact, still at war with one another. There has never been a peace treaty—only an armistice.

JohnnyReb

May 20th, 2010
2:32 pm

Make no mistake, sinking the warship is a calculated test of Obama, not South Korea.

mike

May 20th, 2010
2:35 pm

Definitely Bush and/or Obama’s fault.

Gale

May 20th, 2010
2:40 pm

I don’t doubt they are testing the US. But it was South Korean sailors who died. The North seems to pick any fight it can. I cannot believe they would win if it came to an all out fight. I suspect the South just doesn’t want the economic drain a serious conflict would cost. I believe there is also an issue of separated families in Korea.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
2:46 pm

Yeah Reb,

The N Koreans sank that ship just to prove to you guys on the right that Obama is a failure.

JohnnyReb

May 20th, 2010
2:52 pm

Bosch, us on the right know Obama is a failure. It’s you on the left that are in denial. The N Koreans are measuring him up so they will know if to proceed with their nuclear ambitions.

Scout

May 20th, 2010
2:52 pm

The disturbing thing is in spite of what some will tout, our military is not prepared to fight a two front war.

When Clinton came into office there were 20 U.S. Army Divisions. When he left there were 10. When George W. left office there were still 10.

I fault them both.

JohnnyReb

May 20th, 2010
2:53 pm

And, do you really think S Korea would attack even one ship of N Korea without knowing if they will have the USA’s support. Without us, they would be toast.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
2:54 pm

Ok, I’m gonna use an off-topic pass here:

Scientists Reach Milestone On Way To Artificial Life

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=127010591&sc=fb&cc=fp

I mean, really, didn’t these people see Jurassic Park? But I love this part:

Kaebnick says there are two basic concerns about what Venter and others in the new field of synthetic biology are doing. First, that one of these synthetic organisms will escape from the lab and run amok. And the other is whether this kind of work crosses a line where humans start playing God.

I would say that the running amok is a big concern cause we all know what happens when you create artificial life and it turns on you – I mean, you all did take notice of mine and Paul’s discussions on the greatest TV show of all time, Battlestar Galactica, right? It doesn’t work out — one day everything’s fine and the next, your swearing in the Secretary of Education as Prez cause she’s like 100th in line cause, EVERYBODY ELSE IS DEAD except you and 38,000 of your closest friends, and you spend the next four years running from organism whose run amok.

Mick

May 20th, 2010
2:55 pm

JohnnyReb

I guess under your rules, you would have to count bush a failure too. It was during his admin, that they expanded their nuclear capabilities.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
2:55 pm

Reb,

“Bosch, us on the right know Obama is a failure.”

Precisely my point – you so think that NK sank that ship just to make that point? Do you really think the whole world thinks like you?

chuck

May 20th, 2010
2:56 pm

Scout, PLEASE. The 2nd ID could cut their strenght in half and still handle those little commies. (assuming Obama doesn’t tie their hands).

SfD, from the previous topic:

According to the Century Foundation, aboutthe initial publication:

“The book received good reviews and sold about 10,000 copies, a modest success.”

That means total sales of about $250,000…not even enough to cover the $165,000 in advances he got after printing costs.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
2:57 pm

make that “so you think” blah blah – wouldn’t want to give the impression I had gotten out my crystal ball.

Dusty

May 20th, 2010
2:57 pm

I thought they had this all worked out on MASH.

Outhouse GoKart

May 20th, 2010
3:01 pm

“First, that one of these synthetic organisms will escape from the lab and run amok.”

LMAO!!

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
3:01 pm

Dusty! Me too! I mean I saw the series finale and it was all over and then Hawkeye was going off in the helicopter and then BJ had spelled out “goodbye” in rocks and everything!

Oh, remember that episode where Col. Blake goes home then at the end of the episode they having “incoming” and are operating and Radar comes in to tell them all that Blake has been killed? — that was tough. Tough.

Mick

May 20th, 2010
3:02 pm

bosch

battlestar galatica? how so?

Scout

May 20th, 2010
3:02 pm

chuck:

Well sit, I think you need to read up on the Korean War. You will find that in 1950 the North Koreans pushed the entire South Korean Army and the entire U.S. Eighth Army into the Pusan Perimter on the Southeast coast and came very close to wiping them out right there. Sure, we have better weapons today but so do they.

[...] a vessel equipped with night vision equipment, Han said. This is not the first clash the …South Korea fingers North Korea as culprit; North Korea threatens war … againAtlanta Journal Constitution (blog) all 2,551 news [...]

JohnnyReb

May 20th, 2010
3:02 pm

Bosch, no, N Korea did not sink the ship to make a point, mine or any other. They sank the ship to see if the Obama response will be of concern. If he appears weak, they will proceed without concern. They are already starving their people to death, sanctions wont’ work. They have little concern for anything other than the possibility of being attacked. S Korea will not attack them, the UN is a laughing stock, the only country who will call their bluff is us. The question is, will Obama do it or blink.

Scout

May 20th, 2010
3:03 pm

Excuse me: “sir”

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
3:04 pm

Outhouse,

For real! I mean that sounds pretty damn serious. Like, if that happens, I would call a pretty serious design flaw.

Mick

May 20th, 2010
3:04 pm

Yes, let’s do get ourselves involved in a third war. Cooler heads should prevail.

Outhouse GoKart

May 20th, 2010
3:04 pm

“Most chemical synthesis techniques stop working when you get to a few thousand of DNA letters. That means you can’t copy a whole genome — you have to do it in parts.”

Well couldnt one just perform construction using an assembly line process? A finger here, a wing there etc…

Outhouse GoKart

May 20th, 2010
3:05 pm

Then splice it or “weld” it together.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
3:06 pm

“They sank the ship to see if the Obama response will be of concern”

Of course they did Reb, of course, because they wake up every day and think, “hmmm, how can I test Obama today and make him look worse to the right wing fringe?”

:roll:

chuck

May 20th, 2010
3:06 pm

Scout, this ain’t 1950. Do you really think the NK is that much better than the “Royal Guard” in Iraq? I don’t. Sure the rest of the Iraqi army sucked but the royal guard was relatively well trained and somewhat motivated. Do you really think the NK army is made up of true believers? Especially when they look over the border and see how well those “capitalist pigs” are doing in the south?

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
3:06 pm

Mick,

“battlestar galactica” “how so what?”

not following….I’m high on popsicles still.

Mick

May 20th, 2010
3:09 pm

bosch

greatest tv show ever?

Outhouse GoKart

May 20th, 2010
3:09 pm

I can just envision “it” running amok, raping, pillaging, opening fire hydrants, indiscriminantly lopping of heads, feeding on corpses, throwing rocks at passing automobiles, tossing old used toilets off of highway overpasses…oh the carnage.

Then “it” would begin reproducing with some type of farm animals. We would see 4 legged humans cavorting in back alleys like a oversexed rats. I guess “running amok” is a good description…lol.

chuck

May 20th, 2010
3:09 pm

The only concern is whether or not Obama will let them win it. I actually think that he may. He did authorize the “drone” attacks in Pakistan.

joan

May 20th, 2010
3:11 pm

Normal–may I say that you sound like anything but. Unless of course you are a normal leftist looney who will twist and distort in order to cast a perjorative about someone about whom you know nothing. I doubt seriously if anyone wants segregation again, and to accuse Rand Paul of it makes clear the lefties are worried that the voice of sound reason may yet again prevail in the nation. The Huffington Post is a liberal rag and everyone knows that as well.

joan

May 20th, 2010
3:12 pm

I guess we ought to assess whether and why we care about North or South Korea. And about those countries, how thin are our troops scattered already? How much money do we have to throw behind yet another world policing effort? And why is it our business–full circle. But you get the drift.

Doggone/GA

May 20th, 2010
3:12 pm

“that was tough. Tough”

Well, it was meant to be anyway. I knew a little too much about WHY it happened to find it as emotional as it was intended. The last “episode” though, the movie, I cried when they saluted the Colonel.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
3:14 pm

Outhouse@ 3:09,

LOL! That was funny – I think that reason I found that so hilarious is that many moons ago when I was in college, while sitting in a psychology class, my professor told us that back in the Middle Ages, some people believed that mental illness was caused because some womens’ vaginas would disconnected from their bodies and would run amok amongst town causing havoc and causing possession. That mental image was just too much – so anytime I hear “run amok” I go back to that image from that class – it changed me, it changed me it did.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
3:15 pm

Mick,

“greatest tv show ever?”

Yes! The new one not the old one – but now that I’m remembering MASH….no, BSG is the best!

Normal

May 20th, 2010
3:16 pm

Joan,
I just posted it. Never said I agreed with it. But, in fact, those were Rand’s words and there’s video to prove it. Take it or leave it…your choice.

Outhouse GoKart

May 20th, 2010
3:17 pm

“run amok amongst town causing havoc and causing possession.”

Same here…whenever I here “running amok” I picture total chaos and mayhem.

Scout

May 20th, 2010
3:18 pm

Mick: It’s not if but when.

chuck: You are pretty naive on this. The North Koreans have a massive army with tons of armor and artillery units. The 2nd Infantry Division is basically that ……….. an infantry division without that much armor. They’re depending on the South Koreans for that.

The bottom line is a massive all out attack by the North Vietnamese would kill thousands of thousands of civilians (do you know how close Seoul is to the border?) and thousands of our troops before we could mount any kind of a decent counter attack. It takes weeks to get the armored units over there ……….. and most of them are in Iraq & Afghanistan.

Now if you are proposing we use some tactical nukes …………. well, that’s a different matter.

lmno

May 20th, 2010
3:19 pm

One one hand, the North Koreans probably did this and a strong retaliation is more than likely called for.

On the other, Gulf of Tonkin.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
3:20 pm

Doggone,

Sigh. Whew. That show had lots of “OMG, I’m SOOO not gonna cry” moments – or moments when I’d have to get up quick out of the living room.

AmVet

May 20th, 2010
3:20 pm

I told you at 2:04, it was Obama’s fault!

The NK pinkos would NEVER have done anything untowards with a manly Republican at the helm!

Jesus H, if only some of these armchair geopolitical experts would just serve in high places, ALL of these problems would disappear…

Mick

May 20th, 2010
3:20 pm

joan

Don’t get too excited,
“while only 37% of Kentucky’s 2.8 million registered voters are Republican, which means there’s roughly a million of ‘em, the supposed gleeful excitement and genital-throbbing thrill of the Rand Paul candidacy garnered about 206,000 votes. That’s 20% of Republican voters in Kentucky. 57% of the state’s registered voters are Democratic. The top two Democrats in the primary got more votes than the alleged Randmania express.” excerpt from the rude pundit

Scout

May 20th, 2010
3:24 pm

lmno :

It’s not “if” but “when”.

scrappy

May 20th, 2010
3:25 pm

Thanks Bosch – now you’ve given that mental image to the rest of us!

JohnnyReb

May 20th, 2010
3:26 pm

Bosch, since you disagree, what is your opinion on why N Korea sank the ship?

lmno

May 20th, 2010
3:27 pm

Who, if anyone would gain from another Korean “Conflict”?

The last one was a disaster for ALMOST everyone.

chuck

May 20th, 2010
3:27 pm

Scout, maybe you should bone up on your knowledge of military fire power. According to http://www.globalfirepower.com/, South Korea is rated 12th in military firepower while North Korea is all the way down at Number 20…behind those military super powers Italy and Egypt.

Normal

May 20th, 2010
3:30 pm

Mick @ 3:20

Here’s the words on the matter…

“It started as a slow rumble in the middle of summer and now it’s running at a full roar,” Brian Williams intoned during the opening minutes of Wednesday’s NBC Nightly News, setting up the mainstream meme about Tuesday’s elections, which went something like: we are all Tea Partiers now. It was, as a Politico headline said, a “Shot Heard Rand the World,” aimed right at the heart of Washington, D.C., by the archetypal Angry Opthalmologist.

In one of Fox’s election-night wrap-ups, it was all Rand Paul and his lopsided victory over the Mitch McConnell-approved Trey Grayson for Kentucky’s GOP Senate candidate. Followed, in quick succession with smaller visuals, by the results from a galaxy far, far away, where races in Pennsylvania, Arkansas, and, oh, yeah, Kentucky itself (where a more progressive but barely mentioned Democrat beat out the centrist favorite to face Paul in November) suggested that the public continues to see the GOP as a discredited rump.

What we really saw in last night’s election were Democrats who chose, against their Beltway leaders’ advice, a more liberal Dem over a Republican-lite pseudo-Dem every time. Senator Blanche Lincoln, for example, is a closeted Republican who squeaked by Bill Halter by only two points in the Arkansas Democratic primary, forcing a run-off that favors her challenger. Pennsylvania Senator Arlen Specter, a truly closeted Republican (who jauntily insists he was a closeted Democrat before that), lost to progressive Joe Sestak by much larger margin than expected, 54 to 46.

Well, as most media pundits have vigorously prepared the ground for us to believe, these results can be explained away by anti-incumbent fever—but a fever that strikes only one way. If you’re angry about the government, you must be a Tea Partier, since only Tea Party protests get national coverage (unlike, say, the much larger anti-war rallies during the Bush years). But there was no incumbent in the race that so many commentators designated the bellwether, the special election in the late John Murtha’s conservative district. Indeed, though Republican businessman Tim Burns and former Murtha aide Mark Critz were virtually tied in pre-election polls, many in the media excitedly talked about a “Massachusetts-style” upheaval, in which a long-held Democratic seat gets flipped by a little-known conservative who grazes only on grassroots. But as it turned out, of course, Critz trounced Burns, 53 to 45.

True, Critz is pro-life and pro-gun, but it was not, as Politico’s Jim Vanderhei tried to spin it on Wednesday’s Morning Joe, somehow really a victory for Republicans. Joe Scarborough—joined by Pat Buchanan, fer Reagan’s sake—simply laughed at such an obvious Republican talking point designed to sugarcoat the results. Critz isn’t gung-ho for health care reform, but he isn’t dunking tea bags in the hot water of demanding its repeal. Instead, he’s been calling for government-funded jobs programs and re-regulation of Wall Street banks.

Meanwhile, back at the glam Tea Party that is Rand Paul’s Kentucky, the national media had barely a word to say about those Democratic primaries. But guess what? Not only did the more progressive Democrat, Jack Conway, beat the more centrist Dem, Dan Mongiardo, but the number of Democratic voters Tuesday night dwarfed Republican turnout, 453,520 to 331,522. Mongiardo might have lost, but he actually pulled in more votes than the mighty Paul, at 224,989 to 206,812.

As TPM’s Evan McMorris-Santoro notes,“Nowhere else will the battle between the progressive left and the hard-core tea party right be clearer than” in the Conway/Paul race. As attorney general, Conway refused under great pressure to sue the federal government over Obamacare, while the anti-mandate Libertarian Paul campaigned saying it’s unconstitutional. In the general election, his extreme positions—like coming out against of the 1964 Civil Rights Act and the Americans with Disabilities Act of 1990, as well as calling for the dismantling of the departments of agriculture and education—might confirm the growing public perception of theTea Party as ridiculous, and maybe even scary. (For scary, see Rachel Maddow’s Wednesday night interview with Paul.)

Similarly, according to my Blue Grass sources, the fact that first-term Democratic congressman John Yarmuth will face a Tea Party candidate, Todd Lally, in November makes the liberal, Jewish Yarmuth a shoo-in for re-election. He represents mostly Louisville and its suburbs and, according to my Louisville born-and-raised husband (who, full disclosure, once worked for a magazine Yarmuth started), “Louisvillians think of Tea Partiers as noisy, messy, obstreperous yahoos, not justified patriots.”

But it is understandable that the mass-media brain simply can’t focus on pols who don’t emit that sexy (to the media, anyway) Tea Party sizzle. It’s not that the press like the Tea Party’s know-nothing policies, such as they are. But the press (me included) are enthralled with the spectacle: the signs, the anger, the shouting, the derring-do while in dentures. The TP gives the MSM dramatic conflict at the funnest cartoony level.

The harbinger of Tea Party victories to come that the right is squinting so hard to see in yesterday’s elections is a little like the Libertarianism that some film critics are decrying in the new Russell Crowe vehicle, Robin Hood, which opened a few days before the polls. But that only works if you think of Newt Gingrich’s Contract with America as equivalent to the Magna Carta–and I doubt that many contemporary folks do.

Scout

May 20th, 2010
3:31 pm

chuck:

I know a little bit about military fire power having served in combat in the Marine Corps. How about you?

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
3:31 pm

scrappy – sorry – but misery loves company – and you totally ruined another one of my favorite TV shows (Scooby Doo).

Reb,

Who knows? There country is ran by a crazy man?

Dusty

May 20th, 2010
3:33 pm

There once was a mini submarine

Raised on North Korean cuisine

She cruised squealing “squirrel”

In a nutty torpedo swirl

Blew a warship. Now that’s mean!
——–
There once was a mini submarine

That decided at sea she was queen.

But there was a big boom

And now we can assume

There’s a new tarball mini machine.

Awwwww!

Normal

May 20th, 2010
3:35 pm

Dusty’s high on grape popcicles, too…

Scout

May 20th, 2010
3:38 pm

Scout

May 20th, 2010
3:41 pm

chuck

May 20th, 2010
3:46 pm

Soth Korea is simply in a better position to wage war than the North. They have over twice as many men of military age, 14,000,000 to 6,000,000. They are WAAAAAAAAY better off financially than the North, AND they have the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA behind them. I can’t believe that a MARINE would make such a statement.

chuck

May 20th, 2010
3:50 pm

BTW, Scout, Thank you for your service.

chuck

May 20th, 2010
3:50 pm

gotta go scout. Semper Fi

lmno

May 20th, 2010
3:51 pm

Chuck, much of what you wrote could also have been written in 1950.

I mean, there are too many examples in history of large countries invading small countries with inferior fire power and the larger country still ends up in a long drawn out battle that seems to never end and money is spent and lives are lost and nothing good comes of any of it.

I’m not saying that there should be no response to acts of aggression, I’m just suggesting that war and invasion seems to be a fairly lousy option.

moonbat betty

May 20th, 2010
3:51 pm

chinese haiku proverb:

No come north round eye

Bayonet chop suey you

all walmart run dry

Gale

May 20th, 2010
3:51 pm

I think a response to NK is called for, but not from US. The US has in no way been injured. I cannot think of any strategic reason we should care what goes on in the waters off N Korea. Like so many other border wars around the world, this one is not our affair.

@@

May 20th, 2010
3:52 pm

Life sucks when you’re making other plans, doesn’t it, Mr. President?

Anyhoo…about Obama’s foreign policy “initiative”….The Center for a New American Security has released their assessment of Obama’s efforts thus far. They have all sorts of advice to offer, ’cause basically, he’s suckin’ wind. They refer to it as his “Say-Do Gap”.

Obama cannot fool the world for much longer without looking like a fool. He’s so-o-o-ooo

lacking in know-how except when it comes to community organizing. He’s got that goin’ on over in India.

While the Obama administration runs away from ACORN here in the United States it is quietly
embracing ACORN overseas.

The Obama administration is using U.S. government resources to help the embattled radical advocacy organization spread the gospel of left-wing community organizing in India.

President Obama’s ambassador to India, Timothy J. Roemer, recently lent his name and the prestige of the U.S. government to ACORN India’s efforts to organize rag-pickers in Mumbai (formerly known as Bombay). Roemer is a former Democratic congressman who represented an Indiana district.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2010/05/17/obama-administration-helps-acorn-defend-socialism-%e2%80%93-in-india/#ixzz0oUW1sBDw

ACORN SQUIRREL! Saved ‘ya the trouble, Clamchat.

A private sector employee

May 20th, 2010
3:59 pm

Why is it a “tough one” Jay? We have not been attacked. The “progressive” stance is clear: any subsequent war on our part would be an “illegal war”. If Obama were to go to war over this, then he would be a “war criminal”.

Gale

May 20th, 2010
4:03 pm

Off topic question for the financially minded… If the market sank today because of Euro fears, why did the dollar sink against the Euro?

Scout

May 20th, 2010
4:05 pm

lmno:

It was written in 1950. We and the South Koreans thought it would be a cakewalk if they attacked.

Sadly, many men paid with their lives for that error ………. made by people like chuck who have never been there to “see the elephant” !

Scout

May 20th, 2010
4:06 pm

A private sector employee :

So if they attack our U.S. 2nd Infantry Division we don’t respond. Is that correct ?

Scout

May 20th, 2010
4:08 pm

Gale:

Because of the enormous debt “Che” Obama has gotten us into and the worst of his plans are yet to come.

Gale

May 20th, 2010
4:08 pm

Different situation, Scout, if I may be so bold as to respond though the question was not addressed to me. We have not been attacked. If we are attacked, it would be a different situation.

Scout

May 20th, 2010
4:13 pm

Gale:

I said “if” our 2nd Infantry Division was attacked. What is your response then?

josef nix

May 20th, 2010
4:13 pm

I think I’d think twice ‘fore messin’ with an fellow named Hwang Won Dong!

Bosch–
I agree this is a test of Obama…why would North Korea not? They’ve done it with all previous administrations…

Dusty

Keep slurping the popsicles and think of my kinfolks when you do… :-)

“The Popsicle was first made (But not patented) in 1905 by Frank Epperson, who was only 11 years old at that time.”

M*A*S*H may not be THE greatest tv show of all time, but I put it in my top 5…movie and book in my top 20….

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
4:13 pm

Normal,

Orange – so if they drip on her shorts it won’t stain.

Pogo

May 20th, 2010
4:16 pm

I never thought I would see an American president stand beside a world leader and publically critisize one of the States (Arizona)in the country he is supposed to be representing. I saw it yesterday. Not only did he critisize Arizona but he sat like a nodding puppy while Calderon railed against Arizona as well. The real Obama is showing now and he really doesn’t care if he is doing the American peoples will or not. It is all about the progressive ideology with this megalamaniac. He is a true child of the corrupt, liberal/progressive Chicago political machine. Boy, they’ve done a lot for Chicago, haven’t they?

Obama knows he is a one termer and knowing this, he is going to carry out his most far fetched liberal fantasies until either the people, by way of their congressional vote shut him down or he is voted out in 2012. Watching yesterday and today, I wondered just who is our president anyway, Calderon or this pathetic clown? It appears he loves to prostrate himself in front of whatever world leader passes by and to publically condemn America as the “Great Satan” every chance he gets. I think his wife said it all when she spoke of “for the first time in my life and all”. I think she was speaking for household, not for herself.

Scout

May 20th, 2010
4:16 pm

You guys are using up your “off topic” posts ……… better watch it.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
4:17 pm

Hi josef!

“I agree this is a test of Obama…why would North Korea not? They’ve done it with all previous administrations…”

Sometimes not everything is about us. I know, it’s hard, we Americans are SO ethnocentric.

““The Popsicle was first made (But not patented) in 1905 by Frank Epperson, who was only 11 years old at that time.””

All I’ve gotta say is God bless that man.

MASH book? Do you mean “Catch 22?” I always thought that’s what that movie/show was based on. Great book – one of the best.

Scout

May 20th, 2010
4:18 pm

Pogo:

Wise words. “Jose” Obama has turned his back on this country.

Bosch

May 20th, 2010
4:19 pm

“Not only did he critisize Arizona but he sat like a nodding puppy while Calderon railed against Arizona as well.”

I have to cry foul on that one – as someone currently taking care of some noddling puppies, he looked absolutely nothing like them.

Curious Observer

May 20th, 2010
4:20 pm

Anybody who thinks that a South Korean war with North Korea would be a piece of cake is on the white powder. North Korea’s active armed forces number 1.2 million, with another 3.5 million in the Red Guard. South Korea has 690,000 active in its armed forces, with 4.5 million reservists. Let’s not forget either that North Korea has nuclear weapons and the rockets to deliver them. Add to those facts that South Korea’s capital, where half the country’s population lives, is well inside 50 miles from the North Korean border. There would be a lot of dead people before such a war was resolved.

ron

May 20th, 2010
4:24 pm

well…….The majority of Nork Korean troops are not fed well ans the technonogy they have in far beneath that of not only the Republic of Korea but the US or any othe world power. If it came down to war, there would be more defections than POWs or fatalities on the northern side. The citizens of N. Korea were seperated from their own families involuntarilly for the most part 5 decades ago and they have not been permitted to leave their own country or visit with brothers, sisters, etc…..who are in the south. After spending nearly 4 years in South Korea personally and with all the crap their dictator Kim Jong Il is pulling with nucs and threats………It may be time to go in again……China wants nothing to do with war started by an idiot with S. Korea, the US or anyone else since their entire economy relys on N. America and Europe. I cant see the entire operation taking more than a week. This would be a actual response to war, not a police action as vietnam was treated…..

AmVet

May 20th, 2010
4:26 pm

Bosch and josef, do not make me come over there!

The greatest show on TV? The Simpsons!

It replaced M*A*S*H*.

And Bosch though I’m a big sci fi fan myself, there simply can be no confusion on this.

Got it???

Popsicles. Schmopsiciles. Somebody make them out of beer and I’ll take a look see.

BTW, loving that sophomoric, hyperbolic rhetoric from the ever enraged.

It’s another puerile variation on their ever popular if not tortured (get it Dickhead fans?) faux poutrage.

DEATH TO MEXICO!!!