No racial profiling in Arizona. Or Georgia either.
UPDATE: As my colleague Jim Galloway reports, former U.S. Rep. Nathan Deal, now a leading GOP candidate for governor of Georgia, says that if elected he would try to enact a law here very similar to that passed in Arizona.
———————-
Karl Rove, speaking in a Florida retirement community as part of his book tour, expressed regret at Arizona’s passage of a harsh new immigration policy, but said he doubted it would lead to racial profiling.
“These are modern police forces that respect the rights of people in their communities,” Rove said. “They’re going to do it on the basis of reasonable suspicion that these people are here illegally, like they’re driving a car with a Mexican license plate or they can’t speak English or they don’t have a drivers license.”
That’s such a nice thought. On the other hand, there’s this:
Last week, an Arizona truck driver pulled into a commercial truck weighing station in Phoenix, as required by law. He produced a valid commercial truck license, as also required by law. But he was arrested by Immigration and Custom Enforcement officers, handcuffed, transported to ICE headquarters and held there until his wife could bring a birth certificate documenting that the man was a U.S. citizen and in fact had been born in this country.
“It’s still something awful to be targeted,” his wife told 3TV, a Phoenix TV station. “I can’t even imagine what he felt, people watching like he was some type of criminal.”
Jackie says, “It doesn’t feel like it’s a good way of life, to live with fear, even though we are okay, we are legal…still have to carry documents around.”
A representative at U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) returned 3TV’s calls after researching the incident and she said this was standard operating procedure.
The agents needed to verify Abdon was in the country legally and it is not uncommon to ask for someone’s birth certificate. She also said this has nothing to do with the proposed bill or racial profiling.
Nothing to do with profiling. No sir. Nothing at all. I’m sure the ICE officers thought that the native-born American in question might be … what, Canadian?
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344 comments Add your comment
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
10:42 am
This is really not racial profiling. This law grants law enforcement to legal right to “pullover” anyone suspected….not just mexicans, illegals, polocks, etc. Its for everyone and is no different than most steps taken by society. For instance, video cams within stores…the assumption is everyone is guilty so lettuce monitor everyone.
This is really nothing new.
“The needs of the many/legal citizens outweigh the needs of the few/illegals.”
Normal
April 28th, 2010
10:42 am
Celebration day in Afghanistan…but the last paragraph worries me…
http://www.navytimes.com/news/2010/04/ap_afghanistan_soviet_collapse_042810/
The Real McDeal, 1 billion served
April 28th, 2010
10:43 am
Microchips in everyone! That is just so unethical. I cannot possibly offer public support for such an endeavor. Call me at my private office later.
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
10:43 am
USinUK,
“ahem … corporate welfare … s’all I’m saying …”
Defense spending is corporate welfare at its worst. It comprises nearly a quarter of the entire US budget. If someone is not serious about cutting the defense budget, then they are not really concerned about deficit spending.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
10:43 am
USinUK,
I’d seen that. I’ve spazzed and done something similar before – yes, it’s rather embarrassing. I saw a really bad miss this past weekend, can’t remember who it was (maybe Chelsea Kam?) where a guy was right in front of the goal and all he had to do was flick it in, but he fell down or something – I can’t remember, but I remember my son and I going, “ooooooh” at the same time.
Gale
April 28th, 2010
10:43 am
I know it was said earlier, but really, if I were in a country where I didn’t look like most of the natives, say an Asian or African country. I would expect to keep my papers on me. Further, I would expect a police officer to request them if I was loitering or otherwise not looking like I had a reason to be there. What do you really think would happen in Singapore, for instance if a white American hung out on a corner looking for day work day after day? Why the whining about Mexicans being treated differently here? If they are here legally and look like they belong, are they really being harassed?
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
10:44 am
“Defense spending is corporate welfare at its worst”
LOL…nice try.
ty webb
April 28th, 2010
10:45 am
jewcoboy,
everything, at least 20% across the board. Completely eliminate healthcare and education.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
10:46 am
JKL2,
All poor parents whose kids benefit from such a program are deadbeats? Most deadbeat parents aren’t gonna get up out of bed and take their kids to school to ensure a meal.
Are all poor people deadbeats?
JKL2
April 28th, 2010
10:47 am
USinSK-
What part of entitlement program are you missing?
Bosch-Yes it is cool. I really liked how my propety taxes went up 20% to help pay for it too. Good thing the focus of the school is on providing “free” meals. I thought they were there to teach children. I guess they are learning how to become dependent on the government for things like Obama wants them.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
10:47 am
ty,
Education? Dude. Don’t go into the “all public schools suck” mode. OR should we all go back to the day when education should only be for the wealthy. I personally like going forward instead of backwards in our policies.
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
10:47 am
Depends on the definition of poor.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
10:48 am
JKL2,
Or perhaps your being a bit over hyperbolic.
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
10:49 am
ty webb,
“everything, at least 20% across the board. Completely eliminate healthcare and education.”
Well as long as your are willing to have a rational debate.
SOUTHERN ATL
April 28th, 2010
10:50 am
Immigration reform needs to be revised on the NATIONAL/FEDERAL instead of the state level. There have been several cases of racial profiling amongst the African American community and the majority of them were U.S. citizens…The political system in various states (including Georgia) is too corrupt. Just imagine Georgia adopting similar legislation where anyone can carry a weapon and not be required to have a permit. A person could encounter another armed person that is having a bad day which could result in a shoot out…The weapon of choice for some NOW can be defined as “road rage” and we do not need any more of that!!
FinnMcCool
April 28th, 2010
10:51 am
Don’t bite the hand that keeps America humming just because you don’t like people who are different than you.
johnnyReb, are you going to work in the fields for below minimum wage to help out the farmers?
OuthouseGoKart, are you going to cook AND wash dishes in one of the thousands and thousands of restaurants across this land for meager wages?
ty Webb, are you going to wash the windows and clean the garage of the busy businessman or housewife for untaxed, really low wages?
USinUK
April 28th, 2010
10:51 am
“lettuce monitor ”
lettuce monitors???!!! leave my salads alone!!!
JKL – “What part of entitlement program are you missing?” … yeppers, nothing like malnourished children to create a safe, healthy society
Bosch – “I’d seen that. I’ve spazzed and done something similar before” – here, they’re calling it the Hand of Clod goal
Russ555
April 28th, 2010
10:52 am
Requiring people to carry around their birth certificates to prove citizenship is just dumb, and should not be happening in the US. Question people if there is resonable grounds ot suspect they have committed a crime, but nothing more.
Normal
April 28th, 2010
10:54 am
Even pro baseball is getting into this…
http://www.thenation.com/blogs/notion/555894/d_back_protest_update_cubs_smack_down_immigrant_rights_message
ty webb
April 28th, 2010
10:54 am
Bosch,
sorry, although I do not believe “all public schools” suck, I do believe as a whole, they have failed us miserably. I just believe the private sector could do a better job. and no I don’t believe only the wealthy deserve an education.
JKL2
April 28th, 2010
10:56 am
Bosch-
The government definition of “hungry” is missing TWO meals in a week. I am will most of the people on this board quailfy as “hungry”. It doesn’t mean I need to buy them lunch. It means they need to get off the couch and make something to eat. I didn’t say go to McDonalds, I said make something.
Yes there are people who benefit from the program. Most just take advantage of it. Nobody can resist getting something for “free”.
Kamchak
April 28th, 2010
10:56 am
Bosch
Yep–Salomon Kalou and Florent Malouda both missed from close range.
Chris Salzmann
April 28th, 2010
10:56 am
Outhouse GoKart April 28th, 2010 10:42 am SAID: This is really not racial profiling. This law grants law enforcement to legal right to “pullover” anyone suspected….not just mexicans, illegals, polocks, etc. Its for everyone and is no different than most steps taken by society. For instance, video cams within stores…the assumption is everyone is guilty so lettuce monitor everyone.
This is really nothing new.
_____________________________________________________________________________________
CHRIS SAYS: Go read the 5th, 6th and 14th amendments of the US Constitution regarding the PRESUMPTION OF INNOCENCE. You cannot pull people over simply because they look illegal. Which is why this law will be thrown out as a colossal waste of time. In this country, laws are based on the assumption of innocence, not guilt. Who are you kidding?
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Outhouse GoKart April 28th, 2010 10:42 am SAID: “The needs of the many/legal citizens outweigh the needs of the few/illegals.”
CHRIS SAYS: Yeah, try quoting Spock in the Supreme Court. That should be good for a few laughs assuming the Justices are current of their Science Fiction while you argue fiction.
The Real McDeal, 1 billion served
April 28th, 2010
10:57 am
Hey! How come you moderate my 10:52 but not the 10:50 that I got the word derivation from.
ty webb
April 28th, 2010
10:57 am
Finn Mccool,
Sorry, I don’t really understand your question.
The Real McDeal, 1 billion served
April 28th, 2010
10:58 am
That’s mopre like it.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
10:58 am
ty,
“I do believe as a whole, they have failed us miserably.”
Public schools just like most public institutions are a reflection of our society. They are “us.” Connect the dots. Just saying.
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
10:58 am
“OuthouseGoKart, are you going to cook AND wash dishes in one of the thousands and thousands of restaurants across this land for meager wages?”
I have done so in the past and if need be then yes I would.
During hard times I ve been employed by Texaco/StarMart, Quiktrip, Mad Italian, Western Sizzling Steakhouse and last but not least The BK Lounge.
So whats your point?
Hillbilly Deluxe
April 28th, 2010
10:59 am
SoCo @ 10:50
As noted Atlanta radio personality, Ludlow Porch says, “If everybody carried a gun, it might not cut down on crime but people would sure have a lot better manners”.
On the original topic, Nathan Deal isn’t going to be elected, so anything he says he’s going to do is a moot point.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:00 am
JKL2,
You are dancing around the subject. Just admit it – you don’t like poor folks, and think they are all deadbeats. There, I saved you thousands in psycho analysis bills. Work on your poutrages from there. K?
AmVet
April 28th, 2010
11:00 am
“…get more guns on the border, and shoot them as they are crossing.”
joan, nee vandy girl, see my comment about right wing cretins from earlier this morning.
I DO NOT indict all right wingers, just the vast percentage of those that post on this forum.
I guess I could naively hope they are not representative of their “persuasion”, but I might as well hope that the Easter Bunny is real.
A miserable lot of human beings…
Chuck Bannister
April 28th, 2010
11:01 am
And also designed to have some illegals in AZ pick another state and for new illegals to re-direct their first border crossing to CA, TX or NM instead of AZ. After that maybe move on to GA, especially Gwinnett County!
____________________
“Nice cherry picking. I think Arizona passed the law to force the Federal Gov to do something about securing the border. I wouldn’t be suprised if some sort of deal was struck in the next few weeks for the Fed to do something about securing the border with Arizona repealing the law. After all, the end game for Arizona is do something about cost of illegals to the state.”
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
11:01 am
You cant pull people over becaues…why not Chris? We video street corners, entire blocks, inside shopping centers all in the name of protection or for anti-theft purposes. And this is “for the common good”.
The law in AZ is just the next logical step in the progression of the nanny State. You should be jumping for joy…
JohnnyReb
April 28th, 2010
11:02 am
FinnMcCool – johnnyReb, are you going to work in the fields for below minimum wage to help out the farmers?
No, I’m long past being able to survive farm work. However, that’s the blessing and curse of capitalisim. Produce prices will go up because farmers have to pay more per hour to get legals to work the fields. I am willing to pay more.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:02 am
Outhouse,
Western Sizzlin? Ewwwwww. Just saying.
Chuck Bannister
April 28th, 2010
11:03 am
Don’t worry Joan, you’ll never be more miserable and bitter than AmVet.
md
April 28th, 2010
11:04 am
I have to carry my passport card at all times when in Canada, the Caribbean and MEXICO. Why should it be any different here?
ty webb
April 28th, 2010
11:05 am
bosch,
fine, but the private sector is also a reflection of our society, and are also comprised of “us”.
AmVet
April 28th, 2010
11:06 am
Or more full of dogsh_t than Chuckie…
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
11:06 am
Gale,
“Why the whining about Mexicans being treated differently here? If they are here legally and look like they belong, are they really being harassed?”
Gee Gale…I guess police harassment only happens when it’s legitimate…I mean police never target legal citizens doing nothing:
http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/11/24/georgia.gay.club.lawsuit/index.html
JohnnyReb
April 28th, 2010
11:06 am
Jewcowboy – of course I am concerned of legal citizens being harrassed due to their color or language – IF – it was to be a permanent situation. After most of the illegals are gone, and/or the police remember, hey I checked that guy before, he is legal, the hassle will subside. There is a price for freedom. For legal hispanics, the price will be temporary hassle.
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
11:06 am
Western Sizz…that one was loooooong ago and they were the top of the line/what ya could afford in the blue collar hoods…my origins. At one point my aspirations were to be…ONE DAY…”fry cook”…LOL!!
Glad I didnt sell myself short.
“Yes…I’ll have the number one with “tossed salad” (LOL), thousand island dressing, baked potato and iced tea. Thank you sir that will be $2.27.”
SOUTHERN ATL
April 28th, 2010
11:06 am
Hillbilly Deluxe@ 10:59…that was funny…but seriously can you imagine being stuck on Interstate 75 in the month of July when it is ninety eight degrees and you have not moved a quarter of a mile in forty five minutes…Someone gets into an argument and starts shooting followed by several others around you???
Del
April 28th, 2010
11:07 am
md@11:04,
It appears that many on here haven’t traveled out of the country very much, so they may not understand why.
md
April 28th, 2010
11:07 am
“are you going to work in the fields for below minimum wage to help out the farmers?”
Won’t have to, as it is illegal to pay below minimum wage. And with unemployment around 15% (actual), won’t be much longer when those jobs will be snapped up by folks willing to take anything.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:08 am
ty,
You put all the kids out of public schools, and into private schools, it’s still the same kids. Are you saying that private school teachers are just somehow magically better than public school teachers? And if kids are all privately schooled, then all of our societal woes will be cured? Because that’s what I’m hearing.
No, private schools are comprised only of the people who pay that school, not a reflection of the society as a whole, only a small segment of it. “WE” are the government, not the other way around.
Paul
April 28th, 2010
11:08 am
Russ555
[[Requiring people to carry around their birth certificates to prove citizenship is just dumb, and should not be happening in the US. ]]
Captain Borodin (Sam Neill): …then I will live in Montana …and I will have a pickup truck…or possibly even a recreational vehicle and drive from state to state. Do they let you do that?
Marko Ramius (Sean Connery) Yes.
Captain Borodin: No papers?
Marko Ramius: No papers.
From the Hunt for Red October, about a Soviet submarine crew defecting to the US.
They’d have to rewrite the script if it was done today.
Chris Salzmann
April 28th, 2010
11:08 am
Chuck Bannister April 28th, 2010 11:01 am SAID: “Nice cherry picking. I think Arizona passed the law to force the Federal Gov to do something about securing the border. I wouldn’t be suprised if some sort of deal was struck in the next few weeks for the Fed to do something about securing the border with Arizona repealing the law. After all, the end game for Arizona is do something about cost of illegals to the state.”
_____________________________________________________________________________________
CHRIS SAYS: I’m as much against illegals as the next guy. The only way this crisis can be controlled is to dry up the supply by enforcing already existing laws regarding the hiring of illegal workers. ENFORCE existing employment lays and ENFORCE the existing FINANCIAL PENALTIES on those who employ illegals. This means also enforcing these fines on those who pick up day laborers. Once people start paying $10,000 fines for each illegal worker they hire, the work for these illegals will dry up.
Kill the supply of jobs for illegals and they will start heading back.. This already started happening because of the recession when illegals already in the country started going home.
Scooter
April 28th, 2010
11:09 am
Dang, I hope the Easter Bunny doesn’t try to go in Joan’s backyard. Whew!
md
April 28th, 2010
11:11 am
Del,
I’d say you may be correct, as over 70% of the US does not have a passport. I’m beginning to understand why europeans look at us as culturally illiterate.
@@
April 28th, 2010
11:13 am
Oh my! Well the truck driver knows to have his papers on him from now on. Since Arizona’s law hasn’t been enacted yet, do ‘ya think they were following federal law?
href=”http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2010/04/16/20100416shuttleraids0416.html”>Five shuttle companies used vans to carry migrants
Immigrants paid the organization as little as $700 for transportation from northern Mexico to the U.S. However, authorities said one Chinese immigrant paid $75,000 to be smuggled into Arizona.
Geez! a chinese immigrant had to pay $75,000…that’s SEVENTY-FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS to get smuggled in?
I doubt he/she’d be working for peanuts. Where might he/she end up working?
Guanxi! Trust? No, verify!
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
11:13 am
Well some kids will need to remain in public schools. Not everyone should be allowed to attend private schools because if they are then whats the point of having them.
md
April 28th, 2010
11:13 am
When pulled over by a cop for an infraction, how many here have never had to produce a drivers license and insurance?
Bradon
April 28th, 2010
11:14 am
MD the question is do the people who live there have to carry papers to prove the belong there. Its about placing a burden on legal citizens
Kamchak
April 28th, 2010
11:14 am
Roswell police officers who work overnight must make 25 drunken driving arrests a year or risk poor performance evaluations and a transfer to a less lucrative assignment, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution has learned.
Next up–a quota for illegals.
JKL2
April 28th, 2010
11:14 am
Bosch-
I like helping people. I give/work with organizations that help people. It’s not the governments job to take all my money and give it to people who “claim” they are needy.
When I give it’s called charity. When somebody takes from me (in this case the state/local government) it is stealing. Then I can’t afford to help people I really know need help.
My daughter’s best friend is on welfare. She has a 60″ plasma, all access cable and a PS3 in her room just like her two brothers and her Mom. I don’t have any of those in my house, let alone four. Good thing I have to buy her kids breakfast.
Chris Salzmann
April 28th, 2010
11:14 am
joan April 28th, 2010 10:05 am SAYS: They may be illegal, but we are feeding their kids through WIC programs. Follow any hispanic in a line at Wal-Mart and find out for yourself. Answer is, get more guns on the border, and shoot them as they are crossing.
CHRIS SAYS: Oh look, Joan our resident Tea Party racist and big Sarah Palin supporter has her solution here. Sounds like a version of the FINAL SOLUTION to me. And these Tea Party idiots wonder why the country thinks they’re a bunch of racist morons???
LMAO……………………..I bet Joan would fail the citizenship test if she ever had to take one.
@@
April 28th, 2010
11:14 am
Whoops!!!
Guanxi!
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2010/04/16/20100416shuttleraids0416.html
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
11:15 am
JohnnyReb,
“After most of the illegals are gone, and/or the police remember, hey I checked that guy before, he is legal, the hassle will subside. There is a price for freedom. For legal hispanics, the price will be temporary hassle.”
So by that line of reasoning, since the majority of embezzling in done by Caucasians, you would be fine with the government asking for your id and your reason for being their every time you enter a bank if you are a Caucasian? Overtime, as all the embezzlers were caught, the harassment would diminish.
Paul
April 28th, 2010
11:17 am
md
[[When pulled over by a cop for an infraction, how many here have never had to produce a drivers license and insurance?]]
How many here have ever been pulled over in a cop-manufactured situation?
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
11:17 am
@@
April 28th, 2010
11:14 am
Phoenix is the alien hub and Atlanta is the drug hub.
md
April 28th, 2010
11:18 am
Any idea why e-verify is not a mandated program? I see plenty here that want business to be held accountable, yet the misfits in DC do nothing.
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
11:18 am
How many here have ever been pulled over in a cop-manufactured situation?
How would one know?
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
11:19 am
Apples and orange JC.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:20 am
JKL2,
“It’s not the governments job to take all my money and give it to people who “claim” they are needy.”
Actually, it is. If welfare work were left up to charities, then people receive help based on the agenda of the charity organization – i.e. you want this food, you become a Christian, and so forth. I don’t buy that. Again, I’ve saved you thousand in psychoanalysis, so work on the poutrages (and stereotyping) from there.
Outhouse GoKart
April 28th, 2010
11:20 am
Plus the comparision makes no sense…ILLOGICAL WILL ROBINSON.
Kamchak
April 28th, 2010
11:21 am
My daughter’s best friend is on welfare. She has a 60″ plasma, all access cable and a PS3 in her room just like her two brothers and her Mom. I don’t have any of those in my house, let alone four. Good thing I have to buy her kids breakfast.
Dear Penthouse forum–you may not believe this, but a set of triplets and I were at a Holiday Inn Express last night and….
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
11:21 am
Outhouse GoKart,
“How would one know?”
http://www.365gay.com/news/lawsuits-accuse-chicago-cop-of-gay-harassment-false-arrests/
md
April 28th, 2010
11:22 am
“MD the question is do the people who live there have to carry papers to prove the belong there. Its about placing a burden on legal citizens”
No its not.
First, the law is basically the same law that is on the federal books per immigration.
Second, it states “legal contact” occurs first. In other words, one gets pulled over and does not have drivers license and insurance, they got problems. Either they are illegal or driving without a license.
Jack Jones
April 28th, 2010
11:22 am
“When pulled over by a cop for an infraction, how many here have never had to produce a drivers license and insurance?”
How many have had to produce a birth certificate? No of us!! So your point holds no merit!
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
11:22 am
Outhouse GoKart,
“Apples and orange JC”
Why?
Yes to Racial Profiling
April 28th, 2010
11:23 am
There isn’t anything wrong with racial profiling. It works and we need to bring it back, and soon. Most other countries use it to protect their citizens, why shouldn’t we? Political correctness is on its way out, and not a moment too soon.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:23 am
md,
“yet the misfits in DC do nothing.”
Put blame where it’s due – the companies have to actually USE the system before it works.
danjonglee
April 28th, 2010
11:23 am
i love to be in line at the airport and have a dark middle eastern looking young man saying prayers and chanting while wearing bulky clothing sent right though without question. Gives me the warm and fuzzies while flying…
Paul
April 28th, 2010
11:24 am
Outhouse
[[How would one know?]]
Ever known anyone pulled over for failing to signal a lane change three seconds in advance?
JKL2
April 28th, 2010
11:25 am
Bosch-
Cry for them all you want. Just don’t expect me to pay for your crap. It’s not the governments job. Try reading the constitution sometime. It’s not in there. Defend our boarder. It’s there. Buy kids lunch because their irresponsible parents waste all their money buying crap. Can’t find it.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:25 am
“i love to be in line at the airport and have a dark middle eastern looking young man saying prayers and chanting while wearing bulky clothing sent right though without question.”
And I’m sure that happens all the time.
Gale
April 28th, 2010
11:25 am
Yes, jewcowboy, gays are the most vulnerable minority. Everyone feels free to harass us. We need a larger voting block. Have you recruited your quota this month?
md
April 28th, 2010
11:25 am
“How many here have ever been pulled over in a cop-manufactured situation?”
I’m guessing HBD would say that is a big affirmative. I’ve not been personally, but have spoken to several that say they have.
Accidentally set off the alarm one day, and when the cops arrived (even after calling in a false alarm) was told to produce ID – very slowly – in my own house. Its a tough job, but beats not doing anything.
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
11:25 am
md.
“Second, it states “legal contact” occurs first.”
And it always works that way, doesn’t it?
http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/woman-61-arrested-for-309285.html
Curious Observer
April 28th, 2010
11:26 am
Any idea why e-verify is not a mandated program? I see plenty here that want business to be held accountable, yet the misfits in DC do nothing.
Better to waste billions on an easily evaded fence and additional border patrol agents than to establish a national database of legal workers.
Carnivore 69
April 28th, 2010
11:27 am
Anyone noticing that the people who don’t like the new law, also don’t live in a border state? Guys like Bookman really should not write about topics without some firsthand knowledge. Ideology tends to take a backseat to reality most of the time. I think if Bookman had spent any time in Arizona, he would feel much differently.
Paul
April 28th, 2010
11:28 am
md
The larger point I was driving at with the specific questions was, if cops want to stop you, chances are they can figure out something to provide ‘reasonable cause.’
stands for decibels
April 28th, 2010
11:28 am
Bosch – over 70% of the people in AZ want the law.
Just to clarify–Rassmussen got 70% of people to answer affirmatively to this:
Do you favor or oppose legislation that authorizes local police to stop and verify the immigration status of anyone they suspect of being an illegal immigrant?
They also got 58% of people to say they were either concerned or very concerned that “efforts to identify and deport illegal immigrants will also end up violating the civil rights of some U.S. citizens”.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:29 am
“Just don’t expect me to pay for your crap.”
You don’t pay for their crap. So get off your high horse.
“It’s not the governments job.”
Again, yes it is. You don’t know where their crap came from, or did you ask for the receipt? For all you know it could have come from one of your precious charities. So again, you can blame the poor deadbeat mamma who has the 60″ plasma because it’s easy, or you can put blame where it’s due — or even on something real.
And while your at it, since you are so poutraged at this particular deadbeat mother, what kind of “welfare” is she on? Or have you asked? You should, since you are so outraged that you are paying for all her crap, you should have the kahunas to ask what kind of program she’s on.
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
11:29 am
“i love to be in line at the airport and have a dark middle eastern looking young man saying prayers and chanting while wearing bulky clothing sent right though without question.”
How about the white woman in a boxy Talbot’s suit that was sitting in front of me in seat 1E on a recent Delta flight, that upon descent to landing in a thunderstorm started chanting the Lord’s Prayer and yelled over and over “Lord, take me home…we’re all in your hands now!”?
md
April 28th, 2010
11:29 am
“How many have had to produce a birth certificate? No of us!! So your point holds no merit!”
Fear mongering? They only need to produce a drivers license for auto infractions. And under
“legal contact”, if on foot it will be for an infraction. You folks don’t give the law much credit for doing a tough job. You guys are declaring marshall law before anything has even taken place.
Paul
April 28th, 2010
11:30 am
Carnivore 69
[[Anyone noticing that the people who don’t like the new law, also don’t live in a border state?]]
Careful with those absolute statements. They’re usually wrong.
md
April 28th, 2010
11:30 am
“Put blame where it’s due – the companies have to actually USE the system before it works.”
I did, the misfits are the ones in charge of US security.
Paul
April 28th, 2010
11:31 am
jewcowboy
[[“Lord, take me home]]
Jersey?
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:35 am
JKL2,
And, I’m sure you’ve reported your suspicions to the local authorities right? I mean, welfare fraud is real, and if you suspect that she is defrauding the system, then you have the obligation to do something about it.
Or, you could just demand that she start paying you back in full for all of your tax dollars wasted.
md
April 28th, 2010
11:35 am
md.
“Second, it states “legal contact” occurs first.”
And it always works that way, doesn’t it?”
Jewco – sure doesn’t, but does that mean we do nothing? Its the only system we have, is it perfect? not by a long shot. Happens every day as it is a human run system with human tendencies. There will never be a perfect system.
You gonna do nothing until the perfect system never comes?
md
April 28th, 2010
11:37 am
“The larger point I was driving at with the specific questions was, if cops want to stop you, chances are they can figure out something to provide ‘reasonable cause.’”
That’s done regardless. In every corner of the country. Doubt it will ever change – do you?
AmVet
April 28th, 2010
11:38 am
This is mainly a matter of melanin content.
If you are an “illegal” from Guatemala, but are nearly black, no problem.
If you are an “illegal” from Guatemala but are virtually white, no problem.
But if you were born in Apache Junction, just like you father and his before him, and are just the right shade of tawny copper color, problem.
But hey, in the far right world of “color blindness” (LOL) this is just a bad break…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzE227yE1hk
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
11:38 am
Paul,
“Jersey?”
Orlando. I was in the 2nd row next to a young father, and his child and mother were across the aisle. She was freaking the kid out, and the father asked several times for the woman to stop, yet she didn’t. I did the best I could, and started kicking her seat. That finally shut her up. Passive -aggressivness sometimes works.
jewcowboy
April 28th, 2010
11:39 am
md,
“You gonna do nothing until the perfect system never comes?”
No, but I am also not advocating for making it worse either.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:40 am
jewcowboy,
Or you could have dumped a big giant glass of liquor on her head. Poor kid, all traumatized before going to see Mickey Mouse. Some people just ain’t right.
Jack Jones
April 28th, 2010
11:40 am
MD” Fear mongering? They only need to produce a drivers license for auto infractions.”
Look @ the example of the truck driver. He produced his commercial drivers licence, and even gave the police a SSN. Was that good enough?? NOPE!
Be honest with yourself and ask yourself, had that been a white, black or asian American, would that scenario or situation even have happened?-NO it wouldnt have.
And even if you want to make an arguement to say all people can be questioned, thats true, but your licence and SSN would have been suffice RIGHT?
md
April 28th, 2010
11:41 am
“How about the white woman in a boxy Talbot’s suit that was sitting in front of me in seat 1E on a recent Delta flight, that upon descent to landing in a thunderstorm started chanting the Lord’s Prayer and yelled over and over “Lord, take me home…we’re all in your hands now!”?”
I’ll take her anyday compared to a 12-15 hour flight sitting amongst a group of people from cultures that do not believe in daily bathing. One miserable plane ride.
Bosch
April 28th, 2010
11:42 am
“a group of people from cultures that do not believe in daily bathing.”
That’s my culture – who needs to bathe everyday? That’s just stupid.