McCain issues whining: ‘”There will be no cooperation for the rest of the year’

I guess if the GOP aren’t going to participate in the process for the rest of the year, they’d be ok with a quick rules change eliminating the filibuster?

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“What’re you going to do, bleed on me?”

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Well, let’s see how that sits with the American people who pay their salary.

I imagine that it will sit quite well with the Earl Grey crowd since they want little or no government anyway.

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Someone give that great war POW a hankie, he’s breaking my heart…

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As I predicted, it won’t end here, either. The filibuster is dead forever, all due to the arrogance of Democrat leaders who will insist on using reconciliation for virtually everything in the changes bill.

When you do something that 75% of Americans don’t want, and override the rules of the Senate as they are about to do in order to accomplish that feat, you have poisoned the well.

And it can’t ever be un-poisoned.

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giving millions of illegal aliens legal status will sit really well…….a double whack….

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Go ahead and gloat Jay, you libs deserve to. When one side loses a battle, what do you expect them to say? You’re being a little childish now, but it’s not all that unwarranted.

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“As I predicted, it won’t end here, either. The filibuster is dead forever, all due to the arrogance of Democrat leaders who will insist on using reconciliation for virtually everything in the changes bill”

Why would this kill the filibuster?

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Peadawg,

“Crap…I actually agree w/ Jay this time.”

I think my eyes are bleeding?!

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Can’t be done. It takes a more votes to change the Senate rules than the Dems have.

So they’d like you to believe. In truth, a simple majority can do it, if Reid really wanted it done.

The GOP were threatening this back during the SCOTUS appointment difficulties and we were hearing murmurs of the “nuclear option”; they claimed it would just take 50 votes plus Cheney if it came to it. I’ve ever reason to believe they might well have gone there if the Dems hadn’t caved.

Generally, however, the Senate folks who’ve brought up this possibility of late say it would likely be a rules change for a new session of Congress, not the current one; and I’ve heard it said that maybe they’d just lower the number needed for cloture from the current 3/5 to something closer to half, rather than a literal simple majority.

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Normal, remember when Bushie stole the election? Oh! The OUTRAGE! OMG! The DEMS really defined good sportmanship that time didn’t they? Gloat away… we all do it.

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Wow, I use to think more of McCain; he use to act like a reasonable person. The repugs are truly sore losers.

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Why would this kill the filibuster?

It doesn’t.

Dave is pretending that the GOP didn’t use reconciliation to get crap passed over the objections of Democrats. Difference was, the Dems weren’t quite the WATBs about it that the Goopers are today.

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And this behavior from a War Hero???

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Dave R

You keep saying 75% of americans are against this bill, I believe that is an overstatement by about 25% or more.

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sfd, I never ignore history, and never pretend that something didn’t exist.

But find me some issue where the GOP used reconciliation to force through a bill that 75% of the American people didn’t want, or an instance on major legislation where no Democrats voted for it.

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I heard recently that reconciliation was used almost equally by both parties. It just depends on which party wants to use muscle to push through a bill that lacks broad support, such as this one.

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This is only the beginning. Yes, there will be much rancor in the rotting halls of Congress and states are lining up in front of the Supreme Court.

This does not bode well for the future of our country. All over one word ……….. POWER.

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Well, let’s see how that sits with the American people who pay their salary.

It will probably set quite well on November 10.

The dimwittocrats who voted this monstrosity are already dead, they just don’t know it yet.

And given the fact that Obowo plans to issue an ‘executive order’ to circumvent what will be an existing law? He can change or alter anything with the stroke of a pen? That smells of making him a dictator.

Then, Obowo will become quite impotent indeed.

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“That smells of making him a dictator.”

Oh my freaking God.

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“The project was too big and should have been broken into do-able segments that each addressed a single problem.”

and I think exactly the opposite. I think they should have take a sword to it and gone for single-payer in one fell stroke.

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“The project was too big and should have been broken into do-able segments that each addressed a single problem.”

But Obama and Pelosi needed to do something NOW to try and save face.

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Wait a minute! Did I miss some cooperation somewhere along the way.

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Democrat logic:

we have no money…so let’s keep right on spending. We love China.

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Pelosicare, Obamacare, whateveryouwanttocallitcare; will never be implemented. It will be tied up in court for years. And, by that time, us obstructionist repugs (I love the insults) will be in control of both houses of congress.

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Total = about 75%.

I guarantee you I could dredge up a number like that who thought giving enormous tax breaks to trust-fund brats was a terrible idea, if I were to have polled it at the time.

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Mick, and you have now proved my point perfectly. Thank you.

What stopped Clinton from being convicted of impeachment? The cooling system of the U.S. Senate. That system is being destroyed by the reconciliation process in fixing a bill that never should have passed the filibuster. And when you do it with 75% of Americans against it, knowing that the House wouldn’t have passed the ORIGINAL Senate bill if they knew they couldn’t get the Changes Bill passed through reconciliation, you have a recipe for legislative disaster.

The House would have never passed the original Senate bill without knowing that their concerns were not already handled in the Senate without an improper use of reconciliation.

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I like it!!

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Doggone, Do you think single payer would address the problems of how to pay MDs? How about fraud?

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I think I see the Democrats plan. Make all of the illegal immigrants tax paying citizens and pay for the healthcare costs. Then do bank reform and low interest mortages to the newly minted citizens and stimulate, get this, not only the economy but create jobs too. Freakin’ God Bless The Democrats!

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“Doggone, Do you think single payer would address the problems of how to pay MDs?”

Yes

“How about fraud?”

What about it? Fraud is an enforcement issue. It’s going to exist no matter what system we have.

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I think someone needs to change his depends.I used to think McCain was sort of ok ,now just like every other republican,he has had too much kool aid and tea.

spit the tea party balls out of your mouth and get a clue.

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Georgia Republicans are such lousy lawmakers, they could not even get their unconstitutional tort reform past their own Georgia Supremes. That is just so pitiful. I like it.

Dang! Where’s Karen Handel when you need somebody to keep judge-shopping till you find one that will declare the law constitutional?

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jewcowboy – explained earlier, but I’ll repeat it.

Recent polls showed between 55% and 60% wanted Congress to start over – they didn’t like THIS bill. Another 15% to 20% wanted no changes to health care at all.

Total = 75% or so that didn’t want this bill at all.

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And there was cooperation before health care reform?

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jewcowboy @ 1:00pm:

Heavy stuff you bring up ………. reminds me of:

“We have no king but Caesar”. “Let His blood be on us and our children”.

……….. and they/you have been paying the price ever since.

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Reform offers risk, opportunities for Lilly, WellPoint

“Drugmakers like Eli Lilly and Co. and health insurers like WellPoint Inc. will gain millions of customers under legislation passed by the House Sunday night that overhauls the nation’s health care industry. But firms in the industry also will pay new fees to the government, and face stricter rules that may narrow profit margins and fuel mergers.”

http://www.ibj.com/update-reform-offers-risk-opportunities-for-lilly-wellpoint/PARAMS/article/18818

By the way Wellpoint stock is down .78% right now…the end of capitalism is nigh!

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Well, I have to say if single payer had been the entirety of the bill, I would probably like it. Doubtless, many others would not like it for that same reason. As it sits, the bill is a mess. Too many deals were made to get votes.

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Dave R,

“jewcowboy – explained earlier, but I’ll repeat it.”

Thanks Dave R. You’ve explained the polls, but did not cite the source of those polls…

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“the American people agree with McCain, just sayin…”

yeah thats why we elected him president…….

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Yes, and the libs on this site (including Jay) only agree with the ones that suit their fancy, and ignore the rest.

Which is why, ultimately, that blowing up the Senate rules on this issue will ruin the Senate forever and take down Democrat majorities in the House and Senate in the next 4 years.

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Outhouse GoKart,

“Which spells downward spiral of stock price”

Did you read the article?

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“They have poisoned the well in what they’ve done and how they ve done it,”said John McCain. He is CORRECT.

I repeat a line from my late post on the last subject: We see that Obama’s “change” is mainly in our form of government which we have had since 1776. I am against that. We elected a president, not a king.

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good or bad poll Dave lets see it,I think you are making up numbers or are you just talking about % of “real Americans ” everyone around me is happy HCR passed.

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Read the article…what about Obama gonna now mandate wage and price controls thereby keeping the HCare industry falsely solvent. No havent read that one but I expect it any day.

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Dave R.,

“ALL of them. Fox, Rasmussen, you name ‘em.”

Weird…I can’t find them…do you have a link?

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Read the article…what about Obama gonna now mandate wage and price controls thereby keeping the HCare industry falsely solvent. No havent read that one but I expect it any day.

And once again, the dialogue is creeping towards the twilight zone. See y’all later on…

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Seeya SC…!

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“I’m not sure that will sell with the people that matter (independents).”

As one of those swing votes, both sides need to do a lot of convincing that 14 trillion is the number they are worried about to gain my vote – didn’t see it under Bush, and definitely don’t see it right now. Shall be interesting come Nov.

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“Look, then. I’m not your librarian”

Translation: I can’t back up my assertion with proof

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Look, then. I’m not your librarian.

Curses! That coffee stain has blotted out the code.

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Dave R.,

“Look, then. I’m not your librarian.”

I have on FOX, Rasmussen, NYT, CNN, LA Times, Washington Times and Post, NY Post, Voice of America, ABC, CBS, BBC, Herald Tribune and NPR…and I still cannot find it. If it is a prominent as you say, why isn’t it easy to find?

If you have the link, I would certainly appreciate it.

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I wonder if you asked someone who said they didn’t like the new law “Why?” could they answer with a specific.

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“I’m not your friggin’ librarian”

Careful, you’ll offend Pennsylvanian with your use of a euphemism for “that word”

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My 1:23 refutes DAVE R’s numbers, I believe…

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“My 1:23 refutes DAVE R’s numbers, I believe…”

Better post a link, though, before he starts crowing about it.

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I wouldn’t be whining if I were him, I would be as mad as hell. Boehner said it all. Backroom deals, shady deals, arm twisting, and God knows what else got this awful bill across. I am for reform–most are. But not government takeover. Now it owns automotive companies, can control which colleges students can go to and our healthcare. Isn’t that pretty socialistic? How far does it have to go to be socialist? If McCain weren’t a whiner, he would have been elected President. Too bad we didn’t have a stronger man in play.

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“And when you do it with 75% of Americans against it,”

“Just curious…Where is this number coming from?”

1 of 2 places -

1. Fox News

2. Where the sun don’t shine.

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Doggone/GA,

“Better post a link, though, before he starts crowing about it.”

Normal posted the byline, which leads to the link

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/88309-poll-majority-oppose-health-bill-still-trust-dems-and-obama-

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2010/images/03/22/rel5a.pdf

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“The Party of No is announcing its intention to become the Party of Hell No.”

Should have been that way from the beginning.

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Fox News poll. Closer to 65% total.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/03/18/fox-news-poll-oppose-health-care-reform/

Satisfied?

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But not government takeover. Now it owns automotive companies, can control which colleges students can go to and our healthcare.

啊我的 freaking 上帝。

Thought I’d do that one for you Bosch.

Can you show where the government controls which college a student can attend?

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“Fox News poll. Closer to 65% total.”

You are using a Fox News poll? I think it speaks volumes that a rightwing hack network could only get 65% of their glassy eyed robots to oppose reform.

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To kinda borrow a phrase from “Clerks”:

Senator McCain, You’ll be missed!

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So the GOP keeps being the party of No. No new ideas. No meaningful compromise. No reason to stay in office.

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If costs is the problem, we better quit spending so much. PERIOD.

There, jefferson, fixed your sentence. It’s getting way out of hand….

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“If costs is the problem, we better quit spending so much overseas…”

It is going to take a lot more than that, we need to quit spending so much across the board. Take a look at Greece – in reality, we are not too far behind them as far as % of deficit to GDP. It is going to get ugly, it has to.

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The great thing about this bill will be how some of you fools react when the cost of this bill and the loss of rights become a reality. You are so dependent upon government support and control that you only think you have rights. When the socialism you support and your devotion to the chosen one is depleted, it will make great viewing. No whinning here and McCain is dead on. F*** **

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“to everyone who says this: how are we going to pay for the inevitable rise in healthcare costs that is going to come anyway? The costs ARE going to go up. So where is the money going to come from…healthcare bill or no healthcare bill?”

The million dollar question. When costs go up in your household, what do you do? Spend more?

If it continues, the options get smaller and smaller – we have to cut something, where do you suggest? Give everybody insurance – OK, now, what you gonna cut? SS? Medicaid? Medicare?

Somebody is going to get screwed, if it continues, 30 million without insurance will be the least of our problems.

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NowReally, please make your case that health care is a right.

How can something that requires the active participation of another be a right?

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“The million dollar question. When costs go up in your household, what do you do? Spend more?”

That’s not an answer to the question I asked. If my MEDICAL costs go up, I don’t save money by forcing someone else in my family to give up THEIR medical options.

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I wouldn’t cooperate either. Why aid the slide into socialism?

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Dave R.

The case is NotReally is unemployed, has no prospect of potential employment, doesnt want to be employed and wants everyone else to pay.

Since NotReally has nothing and intends to do nothing about it, it is everyone else responsbility to and his/her right to have HCare. Plus there is that constitutional guarantee thing also…

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Rephrase…

“…this out of control clusterf&ck, this corporate fleecing of American families via the Bush Crime Syndicate.”

Now…isnt that much better!!

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Before the previous presidential election, I had a lot of respect for Sen. John McCain even though I sometimes disagreed with his policies.

But he is really starting to remind me of Zell Miller who seemed to lose it around the time he spoke at the Republican National Convention. He’s another one I used to have a lot of respect for.

Do you suppose politicians have an expiration date tattooed somewhere?

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“But even more egregious is the irrefutable fact that for year after year after year when they controlled both the executive and legislative branches they did exactly what to deal with his obvious growing monster, this out of control clusterf&ck, this corporate fleecing of American families?”

We all know it is about votes and power, same with immigration, SS, medicaid/care, etc. Nothing will get done until the next crisis hits – will the next be too late?

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Are we worried about Golf yet? Could it get that bad?

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“Teachers could easily absorb a 15% salary decrease as during their summer vacations there is ample PT work available. Teacher and administrative personel layoffs need examination also”

and I would never agree with this. I don’t think teacher’s are paid enough as it is. You DO realize, don’t you, that teachers are only paid for 9 months of work…but it is divided into 12 payments so they don’t have that huge gap of time when there is no money comeing in? Don’t you?

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OG, it ain’t my problem, in fact it is quite the opposite, it was ultimately to my every lasting joy, that GWB, and apparently by proxy, you, had/have so little regard for the rule of law or the US Constitution.

This is not even debatable.

Even the ABA, which is chock full of Republican lawyers, sent not one, but three letters to King George expressing their dismay at his taking the law into his own hands and circumventing the rule of law in five different areas.

Had you educated yourself you’d already know about this…

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“…but it is divided into 12 payments so they don’t have that huge gap of time when there is no money comeing in?”

Oh sure…and those 3 months vacation would provide them with ample PT work in order to have some of the niceties…supplemental income, if you will.

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“that GWB, and apparently by proxy, you, had/have so little regard for the rule of law or the US Constitution.”

So Republicans are now also members of the Bush Crime Syndicate…guilt by association?

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Last I checked, opening ones legs was a choice – why would they need a doctor?

That level of ignorance in a man just isn’t attractive.

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“Teachers could easily absorb a 15% salary decrease as during their summer vacations there is ample PT work available. Teacher and administrative personel layoffs need examination also”

Oh my mother f*cking freaking Supreme Being of the Universe.

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Doggone/GA

March 22nd, 2010
2:38 pm

Doggone, you just don’t get it. Why do you thonk the GOP is lead by its collective noses by the Religious Right? Because is says right there in Genisious

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Perhaps JC…however when The GoKart was between jobs I certainly wasnt above working at the Quiktrip…taking out trash, mopping floors, cleaning lava*yuck*tories, making the coffed etc…

If one wants to survive they will find away.

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Teachers could easily absorb a 15% salary decrease as during their summer vacations there is ample PT work available. Teacher and administrative personel layoffs need examination also.

If you really wish to look at the Dept of Education, teachers aren’t the problem. That is, unless you’re wanting to move the US permanently towards a 3rd world status.

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Bosch

March 22nd, 2010
2:44 pm

LMAO…

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“Oh my mother f*cking freaking Supreme Being of the Universe.”

Bosch, can you pass the monitor clean up kit?

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“But then, you aren’t sharp enough to understand that, are you?”

I am, actually…I just don’t agree. The way I figure it, God is a big boy and if he doesn’t like it he knows what to do about it. If he didn’t want us to exercise our freewill, why did he give it to us in the first place?

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So Republicans are now also members of the Bush Crime Syndicate

So it would seem.

Except for those tiny few GOP lawyers who told him and his habeus corpus hating, torture loving gang to stop wiping their fat_sses with the US Constitution..

And the even more miniscule number of GOPers who advocated that he should be impeached for his criminal behavior…

But enough of that loser. We’ve got GWB II now and the neo-cons are not even grateful…

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“If he didn’t want us to exercise our freewill, why did he give it to us in the first place?”

Free will? No such thing. Its all pre-destination.

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SoCo,

Here ya’ go – how do you say that in Bengali?

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“But then, you aren’t sharp enough to understand that, are you?”

Jesus h christ on a popsicle stick.

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One thing for sure…McCain needs to shut his trap.

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Outhouse,

I know you don’t mean half the stuff you write, maybe more – you’re all about shock, right?

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“Over 50% of those trained in MA leave. Think that might be a sign of things to come?”

For some strange reason, I think that is total bullsh*t.

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“Free will? No such thing. Its all pre-destination”

I see. So there really wasn’t anything that could have been done to stop this healthcare bill after all. We were predestined to have it pass. Glad to hear it. Maybe you should inform all those protestors against it that they were fighting God’s will.

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Here’s a picture of McCain taken just this morning:

http://icanhascheezburger.com/2007/03/14/get-off-my-lawn-you-damn-kids/

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“Some have said the Executive Order is illegal and even implied that President Obama should not have issued any Executive Orders.”

I believe it has more to do about current laws on the books vs being illegal. As I understand it, it carries no weight in a court of law as law takes precedent over executive order.

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You know after this bill, I may have to rename President Obama “GWB One a Half.”

Yes he kept The War President/BushCo’s fascistic spying and habeus corpus crimes in place.

And yes he surged into Afghanistan.

But unlike King George’s War on the Middle Class, BHO is only interested in getting Americans killed overseas, instead of there AND at home…

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AmVet, put up or shut up.

Here’s the pertinent text from the U.S. Constitution (I know, something you’re not every familiar with, which is why I posted it).

“The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.”

Please detail any and all crimes for which George W. Bush was formally charged in order to have him impeached.

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First on the third, baby!

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Outhouse GoKart,

“when the Feds complete the taking over of HCare they will be dispensing leeches and encantations..”

Too late…they have already started to release the leeches:
http://pinstripebindi.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/michele-bachmann-cuhrazy.jpg

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Bosch – Google is your friend. Instead of posting what you think it to be, try doing as I did and look it up.

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He bows down for the tea party.

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I see that Go Fish Sonny has issued instructions to his lawyers to pursue the route being taken by other states and explore initiating a suit against the HC bill. These dead-enders are really something. I’m sure that if the red states had the kind of weaponry owned by the Army, the Marine Corps, the Navy, and the Air Force, we’d be headed for Civil War II.

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md,

Nah, I don’t spend much time on generalized bs statments. If you say it’s true, then whatever, I still think it’s total bs.

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“This health care bill will bankrupt our nation. It will lead to diminished care. Hospitals will be forced to cut services to medicare patients. And the fact the Democrats past this in spite of the fact the majority of the nation doesn’t want it is something the Independent voters will never forgive or forget. Come November the voters who pay the Democrats salary will have their say.”

Oh my freaking God.

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I recommend cutting out md’s computer privileges or give her a pay cut.

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Bosch,

I’ve warned you once about that use of “oh”!

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jewcowboy,

How ’bout “D’oh”?

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@Dave R.

Since you are aware of many aspects of a Presidential Executive Order, would it not be in everyone’s best interest to makes this knowledge available. It helps eliminate superfluous discussion.

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http://pinstripebindi.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/michele-bachmann-cuhrazy.jpg

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Fundamentally (but not evangelically) I think the neo-cons just misunderestimated BHO…

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Thurbert Baker needs a new wig.

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Yes, Curious, Congress can. However, it takes the votes of 435 members to do so, and another 100 in the Senate, which up until today meant a 60% agreement that it should be voted upon. And a signature by the Executive IF he or she agrees with it. If not, you need a 2/3rds majority to override the veto.

Just a little bit tougher hill to climb than the changing whims of a single political animal.

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“Nah, I don’t spend much time on generalized bs statments. If you say it’s true, then whatever, I still think it’s total bs.”

Somehow, I didn’t think you would care to educate yourself – good for you. And since you don’t plan to educate yourself, you might also like to know that $88000 is the threshold for subsidies in this bill – you know, the ones that don’t want to work in order to get other people’s money.

$88000 – thats assinine.

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I suspect it will sit well with many; the “screw the government” crowd. The well was eaten up with poisonous venom years ago. McCain should retire. It’s time.

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“I recommend cutting out md’s computer privileges or give her a pay cut.”

Assumptions – ain’t they grand.

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@Dave R

Your post of 3:14 seems to explain how many members of the House and Senate that make up the Congress. It does not appear you are explaining how laws are passed or vetoes are overridden?

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For those of you going for the shock value in your posts. God is incorporeal (without a body), therefore unable to “freak”, “frik”, “frak” or “fruk”.

“When I was a child I spoke as a child I understood as a child I thought as a child; but when I became a man I put away childish things.”–1 Corinthians 13:11

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Bosch, that poll is about 6 months old, and while it accurately reflects their opinion then, you notice support is dropping. Take a look at recent news articles about budget problems associated with that plan, and that their governor (and BFF of Hope & Change) is considering limits in coverage.

This, in a Commonwealth (everybody knows that Mass. is not a mere state) that is knee-deep in debt. They are also likely to lose yet another Congressman to the U.S. Census because people are leaving that state in droves due to their taxes and finances.

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“Notice there are two words that do not seem to translate no matter which language is used”

Try using the actual word that all those “f” words are euphimisms for, and for “freaking” try insane or crazy

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BTW stands, that Python reference earlier was outstanding…

I would suppose HeadRush, Pretty Boy Sean, Kneel Boar-tz, Mann Coulter, et al ad nauseum, have gone through more than their usual allotment of Depends today…

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Dave,

True enough, but I still don’t think those in MA want it gone. So your theory of the failed test case, I’ll call a bs card to that too.

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Assumptions – ain’t they grand.

Why yes, yes they are Grands. Fluffy and light. Try them some time. They’re in the refrigerated foods. Of course I use the word “food” rather loosely.

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“Oh my mother f*cking freaking Supreme Being of the Universe.”

by the lords of Kobol now that’s funny

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Doggone

Using insane instead of freaking and removing the asterisk returned this in Chinese:

啊利用宇宙的瘋狂最高的生物的我的母親。

When translated literally, it says “The crazy universe, ah, use the highest biological my mother.”

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Normal:

So did I, and one of those childish things was the Bible. That’s because when I became a man, I saw what a truly con job it was.

Your personal opinion? There is no ONE greater than you?

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Was watching Pelosi last night and never noticed before but she has “man-hands”. She proabably could hold in one had a Wendys Triple w/cheese and all the fixins and a Double Angus burger Whopper w/cheese, onion strips and A1 in the other.

Scary…

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Et tu brute’?

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SoCo,

That kind of sounds like Yoda on crack.

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yes I am bosch, caprica too.

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Our non-heroic flunkout, know widely by his peers as “punk, jerk, the flying drunk, Ace McShame” and….”The Hanoi Hilton Song Bird” never much “cooperaterd” with anyone but himself.

The only guy in American military history to refer to himself consistently as “a hero.” Lotsa credibility in John!

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Bosch

The true intent and meaning somehow gets lost in translation.

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Outhouse – since I am unemployed and want everyone to pay my bills. I’ll just direct the bill collectors to send everything to the C/O of Outhouse GoKart P.O. Box 999 Loserville, Georgia.
Since you know that I’m unemployed and seriously in need of Charity.

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““The crazy universe, ah, use the highest biological my mother.””

Excellent. I like it.

And, it won’t remind our “Pennsylvanian” of the phrase he heard from outside his bedroom door that one time he arrived home really early from work.

Over and over again. Louder. And louder.

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Loserville, Georgia.

LOL…

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“When I was a child I spoke as a child I understood as a child I thought as a child; but when I became a man I put away childish things.”–1 Corinthians 13:11

But what does an Operating Thetan say?

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md

March 22nd, 2010
2:25 pm

FYI…. a womans right to choose after conception is also an option (since you say she had a choice to open her legs). Why should she be forced to follow your rules? Abortion is still legal in this country, in case you forgot.

Also, I’m not about to debate Roe vs Wade with you. It’s settled law.

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Let the record show that we allowed OGK’s Michelle Bachmann “pearl necklace” reference go unmolested for an entire half-hour.

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Not even close to the ONLY rebuttal, Midori. Just one of many you refuse to admit are true.

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69 % of all statistics are made up…

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truth vs irrelevance?

truth vs stupidity?

truth vs psychosis?

I see all of the stupidity, psychosis and irrelevance.

I’ve yet to see the “truth”.

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stands for decibels,

“Help!!!! HEEEELLLLLLPPPPPP!!!!! I was being held against my will!” ~ Sen Michele Bachmann, Women’s Restroom in Scandia, Minnesota, April 9, 2005

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Headin’ out for my man cave…sleep well knowing y’all all have heath coverage now. May the Great Spirit enlighten and protect y’all…

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Dude.

Talk to the Go-Kart.

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When Rush Limbaugh said that he wanted Obama to fail, he was intelligently explaining his own interests. What he omitted to say — but what is equally true — is that he also wants Republicans to fail.

If Republicans succeed — if they govern successfully in office and negotiate attractive compromises out of office — Rush’s listeners get less angry. And if they are less angry, they listen to the radio less and hear fewer ads for Sleep Number beds.

So today’s defeat for free-market economics and Republican values is a huge win for the conservative entertainment industry. Their listeners and viewers will be even more enraged, even more frustrated, even more disappointed in everybody except the responsibility-free talkers on television and radio. For them, it’s mission accomplished.

For the cause they purport to represent, however, the “Waterloo” threatened by GOP Sen. Jim DeMint last year regarding Obama and health care has finally arrived all right: Only it turns out to be our own.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/OPINION/03/22/frum.healthcare.gop.strategy/index.html?hpt=T2

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99.9 % of the people on this blog will never open their mind to the possibility that the other side of the argument is correct.

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Should tell everyone here something that the drug companies invested millions in trying to get this bill done. Their puppets in congress came through for them.

No, the right can also offer up that Pelosi looks like a plastisized Iggy Popp. Only Iggy is much smarter and has the self respect not to inject himself with facial preservatives.

See you in the healthcare queue, suckers.

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Dave R.

March 22nd, 2010
2:26 pm

If you can believe in the “Right to LIFE” of a fetus, it’s almost biblical that you would believe that healthcare is a necessity to substain that right to LIFE.

Parents are punished for not seeking treatment of a child that is sick. If I didn’t seek treatment for my child, you people would send me to the death chamber. There was a case that the conservatives held dearly, just last year, when a family decided not to continue to seek treatment for their terminally ill son. The christian right (usually republicans) faught for Terri Shivo (sp) for dear life, but of course she had medical insurance.

Where does the right to life start and where does it end? I say the republicans believe it starts in the womb and ends at the BANK. LOL

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McCain is not the only pissed off member of the electorate. Even the MSNBC poll today from a liberal news organization shows that over 65% of Americans are angry about the passage of this fiasco and only 27% are pleased with it. Bozo and the Demos aren’t listening. Maybe the results of the November election will improve their hearing.

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From Jay Cost:

Liberal commentators are comparing the passage of ObamaCare to other landmark pieces of legislation – like Social Security and Medicare. I agree that in the provision of social welfare, this bill ranks nearly as high. But when you examine how the welfare is provided – it is strikingly inferior. Franklin Roosevelt and Lyndon Johnson made use of an ingenious social insurance system – promoting the idea that we all pay in today to take out tomorrow. It was consistent with American individualism. It was simple. It was intuitive. It was bipartisan.

The first is an imbalance between winners and losers through the next two elections. Harold Lasswell defined politics as who gets what, when, and how. By this metric, ObamaCare is bad politics for the foreseeable future. Like any major piece of legislation, this bill assigns winners and losers. The winners will be those who today are uninsured, but who will (eventually) acquire insurance. But there will not be a major reduction in the uninsured until 2014. So, the actual winners are going to be pretty few in number for some time.

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“FYI…. a womans right to choose after conception is also an option (since you say she had a choice to open her legs). Why should she be forced to follow your rules?”

I said nothing about my rules, just stated a fact. It boils down to excuses and bad choices, like most everything in life.

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1. healthcare reform – check
2. immigration reform – next on the docket
3. take away everyones guns – we should get to this by August

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“Yeah, it’s pretty obvious that he and Keith Richards didn’t get into the plastic surgery.”

They just embalmed themselves with other means.

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Bush, bush, bush, rove, rove, rove, mccain, mccain, mccain, blah, blah, blah.

Meanwhile, real damage being done……

chirp, chirp, chirp, just sayin….

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Midori: “I’ve yet to see the “truth””

Truer words were never written.

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Finn,
You left out “redistribution of wealth” on your list.

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especially when reading your tirades, Dave.

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How come there are no defenders of the $88000 threshold and that “redistribution of wealth”? Where are all the cases for that threshold of the “poor”.

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Before you claimed you couldn’t scroll past them fast enough, Midori, and now you claim to read them.

Which is it? Perhaps just another liberal lie?

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The polarization has just begun. Both sides banked their all on it. It passed by a mere 7 votes. The winners are not being humble in victory. The losers are not being gracious in defeat.The prediction that November should be a bell weather is true. The voters, the majority of whom are absolutely fed up with these shennanigans and incivility that they will 1) stay away from the polls in droves or 2) throw the b*stards of both parties out or 3) accept the status quo and keep kvetching. We’ll see. But whatever happens we’re in for a tour on the Fifth Circle of Dante’s “Inferno.”

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jewcowboy:

Unlike the Scientologists, tithe is not mandated by my church. It is encouraged and if given, given freely in the interest of others outside our church. It doesn’t cost me thousands of dollars to progress to some acceptable level of “thetanism.”

To each his own though.

This is an excellent read on Massachusetts health care.

Some people who need care will always be left out. Because the building blocks of Massachusetts coverage are disjointed, people still seek treatment at the state’s safety net hospitals and emergency rooms, which wasn’t supposed to happen as people became insured. The Globe just reported that more people are seeking care in emergency rooms, and that the cost of treating them increased by 17 percent from 2005 to 2007, a period that includes two years covered by the law. The problem, it seems, is more complicated than simply mandating insurance coverage.

And any system based on financial eligibility holds an incentive for enforced poverty. If people try to earn more money because they need it, they get bumped into a higher tier in the state’s subsidized coverage and either their cost sharing goes up or they lose coverage altogether. They must choose between earning more money or losing subsidized insurance. NBC Nightly News briefly mentioned the problem, reporting on a clarinetist with the Boston Ballet orchestra who took a semester teaching job, earned more money, and lost his insurance. Its reporting should have gone much further. As the Financial Times reported last July in a package on the ailing U.S. health system, enforced poverty is a Catch-22.

jay’s has once again devolved to a level of juvenile silliness. Nothing to be learned here.

I’m out.

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“Where are all the cases for that threshold of the “poor”.”

Perhaps there is confusion between “poor” and “struggling.”

$88K after taxes is about $62K or monthly about $5.100. In a major metropolitan area rent can eat into half of that easily, another $1.500 a month for health insurance that many pay, and now you have about $1000 left over for everything else…food, car payment, gas, braces, clothing, etc….

Not exactly living like a Hilton.

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And a couple making $250,000 in NYC or California with all the same expenses?

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The will of the American people was ignored last night so—– Pay Day is coming, bring on Nov 2010

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Well damn. My mom just called – my uncle has cancer, no health insurance – irony never ceases.

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Why do only 33% of large group healthcare plans cover oral contraceptives, yet the majority cover erectile dysfunction medication?

I’ve often wondered about that myself, JCB………..

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@@,

“And a couple making $250,000 in NYC or California with all the same expenses?”

I thought you were out…

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Let me understand this clearly. McCain & GOP does not get their way so, no more support for anything from the DEM’S for the rest of the year ?? As an American I’m sorry but it is his JOB to work with the DEMS. Thank God he was not elected with that attitude. If he does not want to WORK THEN HE CAN GO HOME. I’m more than a little tired of the childish crap form our alleged leaders. If he wants to act like a spoiled child we should treat him like one and give HIM A TIME OUT FOR THE REST OF THE YEAR.

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Doesn’t matter if the GOP cooperates or not. Obama isn’t going to do what anyone wants to do…. but Obama..

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Midori,

“I’ve often wondered about that myself, JCB………..”

I guess making sure middle aged men can get an erection is more important than making sure unwanted children are not brought into this world or aborted.

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another thing I’ve wondered about while watching the GOP make fools of themselves, JCB — they want to rant and rave about “preserving the sanctity of life”, yet they don’t want to ensure the health of the mothers.

It’s as if all they care about is women getting pregnant and not aborting babies. To heck with the health of the mother and/or baby.

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Midori,

ED is a medical diagnosis and a lingering symptom of a much greater problem. Last time I looked, pregnancy is not a disease.

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Country First right?

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“Twelve U.S. states are reportedly ready to sue the federal government over the massive health-care overhaul passed in the House yesterday, claiming it constitutes a major overstep of federal power.”

“The health-care reform legislation passed by the U.S. House of Representatives last night clearly violates the U.S. Constitution and infringes on each state’s sovereignty,” Florida Attorney General Bill McCollum, a Republican, said in statement.”

“On behalf of the state of Florida and of the attorneys general from South Carolina, Nebraska, Texas, Utah, Pennsylvania, Washington, North Dakota, South Dakota and Alabama,” McCollum announced, “if the president signs this bill into law, we will file a lawsuit to protect the rights and the interests of American citizens.”

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kayaker 71,

Pregnancy is not a medical diagnosis?

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UPDATE II: A new CNN poll today finds that Americans oppose the current health care plan by a margin of 59-39%, but a sizable portion of those opposed — 13% — oppose it because “it is not liberal enough”.
Thus, a majority of Americans either support the plan or believe it should be more liberal (52%), while only a minority (43%) oppose the plan on the ground that it is too liberal.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2010/images/03/22/rel5a.pdf

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Before y’all go off on the abortion canard again, do be reminded that under the Massachusetts health plan the number of abortions decreased last year, and the number of teenage abortion by a significant percentage. That, in and of itself, should be a point of consideration.

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“The true intent and meaning somehow gets lost in translation.”

Soco…that’s always the problem with those kind of translators…their too literal. For instance, if I put “my little darling” into an online translator for French, it comes back: “mon petit chéri” – which is OK. But if I put “mon petite chou” into a French to English translator it comes back “my baby cabbage”

But “mon petite chou” should be indiomatically translated to “my little darling” – because they are both terms of endearment, in their respective languages.

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if that’s the case Kayaker, and pregnancy is relegated to such a lowly status, why can’t you and your ilk stay out of a woman’s decision to terminate or not?

we sure don’t get all up in arms about treating your broken members.

no pun intended.

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Midori:

Our “broken members” don’t grow up to become President of the United Statess …….. well, on second thought……………..

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Finn,

they love to waste our money on their jerk a*s vendettas.

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FinnMcCool :

“Fruitless” ?

Isn’t that what you said about the 2nd Amendment case? A 5-4 is as good as a 9-0.

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That’s so nice to know ahead of time…Now let’s get the things we need like Financial Services Reform, Immigration Reform and Climate Change…

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“I belong to that 13%. I was opposed to the bill at one level because I am not going to be satisfied with anything short of free, universal health care as a right”

Yeah, Finn, what josef said.

But I’m not gonna pitch a fit like McCain cause I didn’t get all I wanted. I’ll take this as a first step – and take it from there.

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“This country, with it’s institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their right to amend it or their revolutionary right to dismember and overthrow it”.

Abraham Lincoln, March 4, 1861
Ist Inagural Address

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“So the Republicans are the party of no? So tell me when was the the last time the Dems ever said yes to what the Republicans wanted?”

I don’t know about that last time…but ONE time was when they helped approve the “Use of force” that led to the invasion of Iraq.

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“when a nation’s ruler can bypass standing law by simply signing an edict/executive order/whatever you call it, then what classification would you call him or IT?”

Not sure Bud, why don’t you ask Bush, he seemed to do it every other day while POTUS.

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josef or Bosch, please tell me how can something be considered a “right”, when it requires the active participation of someone else?

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Oh my freaking God – kayaker wants another Civil War.

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“How can these working poor expect sympathy from the more privileged when they have no sense of empathetic proportion.”

I can’t speak for others, but I’ve hovered around that $88000 for most of my working days, and there is no way I would ever consider it to qualify for subsidies. As a matter of fact, when I was well under that number, I stuck to the “needs” in life and actually sold off assets vs ever thinking it to be right to require others to give me money against their will.

No wonder this country is in such poor shape. The entitlement attitude will do nothing but expand the debt we already can’t afford. Hard to believe the amount of posters here that have lost the concept of providing for oneself.

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jewcowboy…my favorite Bush Quote (in light of the Iraq invasion) is this one: “I don’t think our troops ought to be used for what’s called nation building.” Oct. 11, 2000 George W. Bush

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“This country, with it’s institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their right to amend it or their revolutionary right to dismember and overthrow it”.

Are you freaking kidding me…and interrupt 24, American Idol and Dancing with the Stars..good luck with that.

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We have laws and courts that rule on the laws. A woman has control over her own body is a law. It has been ruled. This means its her business not mine or anyone else’s unless she deems so. This is law. Why don’t people mind their OWN business. That is rule #1 and law. Mind your own business. If you can’t follow rule #1 or the law there is no use talking. Refer to the rule. Mind your own business.

That’s about all I have to say about that.

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on abortion funding for poor blacks and illegals. we have ’nuff of those already.

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md

The question was, how many hours do you work for what you purchase? At $10.00 an hour, your bring home would be around $7.50, not enough to purchase that bread, milk and eggs. Calculate your $88,000 based on the number of hours (let’s stick with the standard 40, though you may well put in far more, I do) and then see how many hours you would work. I make this argument to bring this into perspective…

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So, what’s new? They couldn’t possibly be any more obstructive than they already are.

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Actually, no we don’t josef. That is not a right, but a defined duty of government according to the U.S. Constitution.

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Doggone,

You might ask Mr. Lincoln. The numbers don’t lie and there are a lot of very pissed off people in this country. Or haven’t you noticed? Or do you even care? You and Bozo don’t care what the majority of the people feel about this health care fiasco, which, BTW, passed by only 7 votes. The most important thing is to enshrine this egotistic jerk in the God Hall of Fame and make his legacy one of perpetual bliss. No one, including you, is listening to what the majority of people are saying. In a country of over 300M, the majority are very happy with their health care and don’t want it changed, especially if it is government run. And this is just the first step, as Bozo has continually said in his attempt to “permanently change the face of America”. Most of us don’t want the face of America changed, especially by this Chicago hack politician and his gang of thieves.

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Bosch:

Only if you can be drafted into the infantry !!!

jefferson:

Does a man under U.S. law have control over his own body?

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“Not sure Bud, why don’t you ask Bush, he seemed to do it every other day while POTUS.”

To the tune of 800 times!

EIGHT HUNDRED TIMES.

Yep King George single handledly blew past every single US President before him. COMBINED!

And talk about the luck of the Irish!

To our grave misfortune the slimeball had the enormous luck of being enthroned over a gutless US Congress headed by Pelosi/Reid/Obama/Clinton et al who took impeachment “off the table”…

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No Work No Pay. That is the American Way….

The GOP must GO.

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This column was in a magazine I read today. I have replaced the actual topic with __ and made a few word substitutions to mask the real topic. Can you figure out the real topic? Hint: it’s an area where the Obama administration set aside $7.2B last year in stimulus funding, and is certain to be one of the next “rights” that everyone will have. It seems pretty clear that the topic is being treated with the same logic that health-care was presented as a “right.”

——————————————————

According to Congress, the National __ Plan must “seek to ensure that all people of the United States have access to __ capability” at affordable prices. As if that’s not enough, [the plan] must suggest strategies to improve consumer welfare, public safety,[…],education, job creation, economic growth, and a slew of related imperatives.

Those hoping for an entirely market-based solution to fill current gaps in __ will hope in vain. As [a government agency] recognized in comments filed prior to the __ plan’s release, and as __ reform advocates have long recognized, there are problems with market structure and market failures that have affected the U.S. __ system.

Private [funding] alone, in the current regulatory climate, cannot overcome [corporate] dominance and engender robust competition to benefit consumers. Neither can market forces alone extend [coverage] to [consumers] where there may be no business case to do so. Nor will such forces subsidize __ for people who would benefit from [access], but who cannot afford __.

The [government] cannot hope that __ will trickle down from entrenched incumbents. Therefore, its plan must reform universal [coverage] to promote efficient __ and adoption with the aim of closing divides that make __ more costly and less appealing to people who are in underserved [markets].

It should also revise access and __ allocation policies to eliminate bottlenecks that arise from monopoly pricing and inefficient use where [government intervention could] lead to greater gains. And the plan should strengthen __ consumer protection rules to require greater accuracy and transparencies in disclosures to new and existing customers about [benefits] and prices.

Finally, the plan needs to preserve the open [market] and promote [portability] so that users retain the freedom to access the [provider] of their choice and gain flexibility to switch providers.

——————————————————–

Another hint, the magazine was EE Times. Of course, the topic is high-speed internet access, coming soon to a theater near you as an “entitlement” to which you have a “right” to force others to provide for you. Just like health care!

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Bosch,

Good night and good luck.

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Doggone–
One of the interpreters’ entertainments is to pass around some of these machine translations…”our records show that your child has not filled 6 a$$holes as of Sept 1..” and the only thing that was lacking was the tilde over the n!

Kept to a simple subject-predicate-complement structure, these machines work pretty well, but don’t try a complex-compound structure or subtlety of syntax–and stay the h3ll away from metaphore, idiomatic expressions or slang!

For “rush jobs” we will use the machine and then take the text for human editing. It cuts the time down to about half of what it would take if we did it “cold.”

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“Only a small minority (extimated about 10%) actually had the guts to physically take up arms and found this country”

Yes, maybe, I haven’t seen that particular figure before…but they profited from the support of many who were less active. I don’t know that 10% would be enough to overthrow our government today. Of course, I also see no need to do so either.

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The 21st century “Freedom” fighter:

http://www.filehurricane.com/viewerthumbnails/619200820544PM_american_fat_soldier.jpg

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“and stay the h3ll away from metaphore, idiomatic expressions or slang! ”

Yep! No doubt about that. If you’re involved (as I am) in a fairly unusual endeavor (in my case the “dog fancy”) translators can be even more frustrating…as the terms used are pretty specific. As in the term “get” – which in the “dog world” means the offspring of a male dog.

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“You raise an interesting point with ramifications far beyond this particular issue/topic at hand.”

Dave…in reference to this, and before the discussion gets too fractured…what do YOU consider to be the “rights” to which we are entitled?

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To Doggone/GA and jewcowboy:

Neither would I participate in a physical revolution ………. not over healthcare ……… but maybe a bigger issue someday – depends on what it is.

My point was ………. noisy people (usually the minority) always run things. That goes for families, church committee’s, neighborhood groups, and government. It’s just the way it works.

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Basic ones, Doggone, Life, liberty, the PURSUIT of happiness. Freedom of speech, assembly and worship. The freedom to defend myself and my family when in danger.

Basically, a right is what you can do without the help of anyone else that does not harm anyone else.

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“CHICAGO, March 22 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ — Yesterday was an historic day in Washington for a different reason than the passage of a healthcare bill that essentially goes into effect some four years from now. All over national television, throughout the day and into the night, the leadership of the Democrats and Republicans proved that the two party system in America is fatally flawed, hopelessly deadlocked and terminally dysfunctional.”

http://www.independentpoliticalreport.com/2010/03/tri-partisan-group-to-explore-third-party-option-in-illinois/#more-13822

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Never happen, AmVet. There are too many obstacles at the state level that keep third parties off the ballot.

Georgia is one of the more restrictive ballot-access states in the nation. You think the yahoos at our State Capitol are going to relax their rules for a third party?

Never gonna happen.

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” Say adios to Senor Rush, that is if Costa Rica will allow in illegal aliens to use their Universal Helathcare coverage.”

Actually, it is big business in Costa Rica, they call it “Medical Tourism”. Darn that capitalism.

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Scott Brown won in The Peoples Republic of Taxachusetts campaigning as the 41st vote against Obamacare. As Bill Kristol pointed out today: “Repeal is the heart of the matter. It should be the heart of the message. Think of it this way: This year Obama has handed Republicans a one-item Contract with America, an item a majority of the public supports–opposition to, and therefore repeal of, Obamacare.”

If Brown carried the day in deep blue Taxachusetts, how do you think “Repeal Obamacare!” is going to fly with the rest of the country?! (The dems are already doing damage control.)

To the libs: Bring on Cap-and-Tax, bring on Amnesty, (and throw in gay marriage if you particularly sadistic). The rout is on.

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M Percy

March 22nd, 2010
5:19 pm

Now this is something that really intrigues me and I don’t say that in snarky fashion.

“Please, then, answer me a hypothetical question. It’s the end of the world, and you find yourself amongst a small group of survivors.”

If it is indeed the end of the world, then the rest is a mute point! But given that I find myself among a small group of survivors, I shall go on…

” None of them is a doctor or nurse. How will you exercise this “right” to health care then?”

If we have reached the point you postulate, and there’s no reason to assume it couldn’t happen, then society as we know it has vanished and with it the “rights” we associate with a developed civilization.

” Let’s assume that one of them *is* a doctor, but he (or she) wants nothing to do with your group and wants to just be left alone to live out the remainder of his (or her) days. Will you use force to make this doctor treat you?”

Not at all. If the self-centered and supposedly self-sufficient sob wants to be left alone, then that’s one less mouth to feed or cantankerous voice to be heard in the councils being called to determine the future (if there is to be one) of the species…same could be said for teachers, lawyers, and store clerks (and newspaper columnists in case the Bruin is amongst the survivors!)

“It’s okay if you do, but at least have the balls to call it what it is.”

As I said, I don’t mean to be snarky. For a really intriguing contemplation of just this question, read (if you have not already done so) Walter Miller’s “A Canticle for Leibowitz.” His vision is pretty much mine, and, I am the Old Jew Benjamin–I’d go off to a mountain top, raise blue-headed goats, chunk rocks at anyone come calling and periodically come down to see if the latest contender is, indeed, the Messiah. Meanwhile, “tents mended here.”

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md

Costa Rica and health care…I have a friend whose business is catering to just such…he’s living in high clover…

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TGT–

Quite frankly, I’d just as soon gay marriage be left out which, given Fierce Advocate’s record so far seems to be a given…I’m not that masochistic and the last thing I feel like being right now is a birdie for this badminton horsesh*t from the polarized…the blue-headed goats up on Turrialba are looking better by the minute…

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“Ok, how to you protect your “right to life” when you are too young to survive without the intervention of others?”

Interesting – with roe v wade, the gov’t took away the right of life and with this bill gave the right of hc.

Life, liberty and pursuit of happiness…………hmmm.

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“Yeah the DNC and RNC with their army of lawyers who they can send out to harass third party candidates and make them jump through expensive hoops and the American Politburo, aka the Commission on Presidential debates, established by the same corrupt, self-serving duopoly and the corporate owned “free press” (HAH!) who allows NO other voices to be heard, you’re right.”

Third Party? They don’t even play fair within the Two Party, especially during the debates.

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“The only “poll” that matters (on health care) is the one that was taken November 5, 2008.”

And historical data indicates the pendulum is in motion.

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Why have political party or unions. Why not just have candidates? Top 2 have a run off. Winner takes it. Too simple.

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Gone upstairs…same thread, but less to scroll through to keep up…

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josef nix: I know the situation is far-fetched, which allowed you to sidestep the question without actually answering it, but it’s hard to otherwise fashion the question. It’s my fault for not being able to bound the scope without seeming ridiculous.

How can you exercise a “right” that pretty much by definition *requires* some else to provide the materials and services which constitute that “right” (unless that person is willing to provide them voluntarily)? And if the person is not willing to give them to you voluntarily and if you’re willing to force them to, well, as I said, there’s a name for that. The same can be said if you’re willing to force others to provide these service by proxy (i.e., if you’re not willing or able to convince the provider to provide his services and materials at a cost you can afford or are willing to pay, but are able to force others to cough up on your behalf).

The Constitution does provide one instance when, in the 6th Amendment, it provides for the right to counsel (but only in capital cases). The Father’s felt this was important enough to call it out specifically. They had doctors then too, but didn’t seem to think that there was a reason to list access to a doctor (at public expense) among those other rights.

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Other than a stupidly placed apostrophe, I can’t see why my 5:59 is in moderation?

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The odd thing is that the American people are VERY competitive.

Except when it comes to our government. Where we sit stupidly by and allow the Repdem (or is it DemRep?) Party to completely monopolize arguably the single most important aspect of our very country

There are many great ideas to correct these injustices and travesties.

As Jefferson referred to – Instant runoff elections.

Elections on Saturdays or Sundays (sorry Jews & Christians, its a secular nation), not during a working day. We should b elooking for ways to getting MORE Americans to vote, NOT less.

We could implement the National Initiative.

We could reform our corrupt and pernicious campaign finance system.

We could set term limits for members of Congress.

We could expand citizen standing rights.

We could regain control over “taxpayer assets.” On behalf of the American people, the U.S. government owns and manages a wide variety of taxpayer assets: national forests, grazing lands, mineral deposits, power projects, information resources, research and development rights, broadcast frequencies, among others. The Reagan and Bush administrations boasted of their intention to run government “like a business” before proceeding to host a massive fire sale of taxpayer assets to assorted corporate interests. Here, too, citizens and taxpayers must be empowered to stop the widespread abuses of government stewardship of publicly owned assets.

We could reclaim the public airwaves.

We could create shareholder democracy.

We could establish a new model of consumer representation via Citizen’s Utility Boards.

We could much better protect victims’ rights.

We could ensure an hospitable environment for whistle blowing.

These are but some of the tools for democracy.

In other words we could reclaim our sacred sovereignty and shift the power back to the people, who rightfully own it, instead of abdicating it to the highest bidder…

http://www.failvote.com/issues/political/shift-the-power/#46869

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Dave R — If 75% of Americans REALLY don’t want health care reform then the Democrats will suffer a major defeat in November and the House Republicans with their 326-109 majority (more or less) will have no problem following American’s wishes in 2011. In the meantime, the GOP was fired (voted out of office) by Americans not that long ago and will have to live with what they have sowed. And the way they are going that 326-109 majority I threw out above will be with the Democrats.

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We’ll see who’s whining come November there Mr. Kiss Ass Liberal. I think you might need to get a pair of balls before you start criticizing the Republicans. Seems like they’re the only ones up there that will tell you bleeding heart liberals where to stick it.

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How can you people be so oblivious!?
McCain didn’t say “he” would cooperate, he said “There will be no cooperation” obviously referring to GOP, which he does not control. It wasn’t a threat. He was expressing his opinion of things to come. I realize tone can be hard to understand from text, but it’s damn near impossible when you aren’t even listening to the other side.

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Is he in the 4th grade?

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How many different ways can you say “the party of NO.?”

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M Percy : I guest you republicans enjoy paying your senator and congressman when they say they will not work….in the “Peoples Seat”.

Taxpayers Welfare for the Republicans–they will not be working this year?

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