Poll: By 2-1, U.S. voters oppose West Bank settlements

Rasmussen has been in the field the last few days, polling 1,000 U.S. voters about their attitudes toward Israel, its settlements in the West Bank and its relationship with the United States.

According to the poll, 49 percent of Americans believe that “Israel (should) be required to stop building new settlements in occupied Palestinian territory,” while only 22 percent believe it should not. That represents a strong endorsement of the position taken by the Obama administration.

An even-more overwhelming percentage of Americans — 75 percent — believe that “Palestinian leaders (should) be required to acknowledge Israel’s right to exist as a Jewish state” as part of a peace agreement.

But here are the most troubling numbers from Israel’s perspective:

In the poll taken March 15-16, 58 percent of Americans said they consider Israel an ally of the United States, while 32 percent consider it somewhere between an ally and enemy.

In a poll taken by Rasmussen in August, 70 percent said they considered Israel an ally, while just 16 percent considered it somewhere between an ally and enemy.

That kind of erosion ought to worry Israeli policymakers deeply.

145 comments Add your comment

RW-(the original)

March 17th, 2010
11:58 am

Every time I get a chance to drop in here the daily Jew bashing article appears. See y’all later if the topic ever changes.

Paul

March 17th, 2010
11:59 am

I see the change in the numbers, but “while 32 percent consider it somewhere between an ally and enemy” is kinda close to the Rule of Thumb: about 20 percent of the people will believe almost anything. But yeah, the increase is noteworthy.

In a followup to “49 percent of Americans believe that “Israel (should) be required to stop building new settlements in occupied Palestinian territory” when asked ‘Why’ 100 percent answered ‘well, because!’

When asked to identify the West Bank on an unlabeled map, 25 percent of respondents pointed to Gibraltar, 24 percent pointed to the Sinai, half picked the Panama Canal and one percent pointed to an area deemed ‘close enough.’

jefferson

March 17th, 2010
12:00 pm

What’s the end game?

pat

March 17th, 2010
12:08 pm

Israel looks real concerned about a Rasmussen poll taken in the U.S. Like we care what France thinks of us….

Outhouse GoKart

March 17th, 2010
12:08 pm

I wonder how many see the unwashed palestinians w/their hamas govt as enemies?

pat

March 17th, 2010
12:11 pm

Most Jews vote democratic, yet most democrats are antisemites…I’m stumped.

Drain The Swamp (NIF)

March 17th, 2010
12:11 pm

Jay

Anything to avoid this horrible coup of our government.

You should be ashamed of yourself, Jay for deflecting away from this bill. What haven’t you said anything about the government taking over the school loan program? Why aren’t you opening discussion of why the government should begin to be able to decide which school lives and which school dies.

Call it what you want, but you know as well as I what this bill is going to mean.

And Jay, TRY to consider this: The dims are going to be thrown out on their ear this fall. We both know it. So who will control this enormous power that the libs are stealing then? Who will be in charge of deciding which school lives or dies then?

Outhouse GoKart

March 17th, 2010
12:12 pm

Part of the problem is stations like CNN run some soundbite of some idiot located somewhere in the US, crying and screaming about Israel “playing dirty pool” with the unwashed palestinians and some other idiot beleives the first un/misinformed idiot.

Kinda like a snowball rolling downhill, the dumbing down of US citizens begins to increase exponentially. Evidence of this occuring? The Obama/Biden win.

Drain The Swamp (NIF)

March 17th, 2010
12:15 pm

INTRODUCING TO THE AMERICAN PUBLIC:

Dennis Kucinich, The New Double Secret Vice President of The United States of America

Whacks Eloquent

March 17th, 2010
12:17 pm

I want to know who wins the IQ test! Kucinich or Biden? LOL!

GoingBroke

March 17th, 2010
12:19 pm

Most Americans have no understanding / grasp of our own GOVT and we are going to poll them over someone elses issues? Make sense to me.

Mick

March 17th, 2010
12:21 pm

**The dims are going to be thrown out on their ear this fall.**

That is an assumption which may be correct, however, you need to know that out of these 50 united states, it seems georgia has the most rabid obama haters – you are the exception rather than the rule.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
12:24 pm

I heard Gene Simmons today on a radio interview. I guess I knew, but forgot he’s Jewish and was born in Israel. I wish the radio guy would have asked his opinion – somehow I think he’d be rather blunt about the whole thing.

Mick

March 17th, 2010
12:27 pm

Why should israel care about american polls? They usually get what they want or need from us anyway.

If you don't want the answer

March 17th, 2010
12:34 pm

Don’t ask.

MaJo

March 17th, 2010
12:35 pm

Jay loves to cite polls, except those that say that the majority of the American public opposes the health care bill in its current form. That poll doesn’t matter, of course, because the American public doesn’t know what’s good for them.

Help! I've fallen on my ear and I can't get up

March 17th, 2010
12:36 pm

Drain The Swamp (NIF)

March 17th, 2010
12:39 pm

Mick

Funny you should mention that. I had a meeting last night with the heads of one of the biggest nonprofits in the country. They are dying. When Obama cut out the tax incentives for charitable giving, it cut out about 60% of their donations.

They were from NYC, Washington State and California. The word they used all night was furious. Not upset. Not angry: furious.

This 70 year old non-profit is looking at it’s end. It has helped kids in primarily minority neighborhoods. So the democrats will be taking that away from Black People.

If you think that this is only people in Georgia, you just aren’t paying attention.

Drain The Swamp (NIF)

March 17th, 2010
12:40 pm

Whacks Eloquent

Testing is a Republican Concept. And if you start testing the Democrats in Congress, they would be hell to pay.

Bob

March 17th, 2010
12:51 pm

I supported Obama and Clinton but do not like them much now. They lied so much. Will vote Republican for some time. Democrats became extreme leftist-socialist-proIslam-antiSemit. There is no place for moderates or independents there.

When Iranian opposition was killed in Iran or China suppressed Tibetans Obama and Clinton were so quiet. They apologized to …dictator of Libya!!! They attack Israel, the only real democracy in most of Asia!

Israel is not perfect but it is much more democratic then Iran, China or Libya. Administration attacks Israel because Israel listens. Iran or China do not care about what Obama says.

Jay

March 17th, 2010
12:52 pm

There’s a problem, or rather several problems, with your story, Swamper.

First and most fundamental, the cut in deductions never happened. Congress rejected it. How could something that never happened be responsible for an alleged 60 percent decline in giving?

Nice try though.

Second, the proposed cut would have reduced the maximum amount of the tax savings from 35 percent of the contribution to 28 percent, hardly a huge amount. That’s what it was back in the Reagan era. The Center on Philanthropy at Indiana University estimated that if enacted, it would lead to a 4.8-percent reduction in charitable donations.

Got any more stories?

Hef

March 17th, 2010
12:52 pm

Off Topic-This should put to bed any idea that Health Care Reform is really about the millions of people living without,or a cost cutting measure, or curtail all those megaprofits by the mean ol rich insurance companies. This just reported on MSNBC “You do have to be very careful that the potential of President Obama’s presidency not be destroyed by this debate” Dennis Kucinich as to why he changing his vote to “yes”.

Mick

March 17th, 2010
12:53 pm

NIF

OK, but it’s still not across the board. I know some people cannot stand obama. Now you know exactly how the other side felt during bush. The difference is that most americans were willing to give bush a chance after 9-11 (happened on his watch) but he over reached and got us into iraq (1.2 trillion later). Obama inherited this mess and the other side declared from day one that they wanted him to fail. Let me ask you this: how would you feel if we started adding new jobs every month until november? The american people have notoriusly short memories. If we are adding jobs by november we will see who the motivated voters are cause thats what its about in the end who shows up and votes. I may not like it, but I believe in majority rule. So let the chips fall where they may..I also believe that israel and the US regardless of polls, will always have a special relationship.

AmVet

March 17th, 2010
12:58 pm

Man, that first post was profound!

Barack Obama suffers from the same disease as John McCain, John Kerry, George W. Bush, and every other enthroned politician in this nation.

A complete lack of moral courage. A total absence of fortitude to stand up to the corporate powers and get things done for the American people.

Hell, in 1950 President Truman proposed universal health care. AND WE STILL DON’T HAVE IT!

We have the worst tax system imaginable. It perversely rewards Wall Street speculation and heavily taxes human labor and sales taxes necessities like food,clothing, furniture and appliances.

The courage to stand up to the pro-war lobby that runs this country and Israel We spend as much as the rest of the planet COMBINED on the war machine and the chickenhawks want even more!

And there is not even any debate about this.

Obama is in fact only marginally better than the serially impeachable and criminal regime that preceded him.

The R&D party does not speak to the American people problems anymore. They do not speak to our family’s problems anymore.

Gigantic deficits, increasing poverty and endless give aways to the monied plutocrats and oligarchs.

Hope and change…

Hef

March 17th, 2010
1:00 pm

“gave him a chance after 9/11″ -oh yeah that really happened. The far left that cried that he stole the election from ol honest Al only gave him a passing nod then went right back to screamin & kickin on the floor.

Mick

March 17th, 2010
1:01 pm

Amvet@12:58

Amen..

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:04 pm

Swampy,

“Got any more stories?”

Yeah, like please, please, tell us about all the important people you know and have meetings and lunches with. Please?

Biased question

March 17th, 2010
1:04 pm

Just the framing of the question leads to the answer they are looking for. If you call it ‘occupied Palestinian’ land, what answer were you expecting from an uneducated American public, most of whom don’t know where the ‘West Bank’ is. If you ask the question ‘Israel (should) be required to stop building new towns in Judea and Samaria’ or in ‘disputed territory’.

How about asking an unbiased question next time?

AmVet

March 17th, 2010
1:06 pm

As for charitable giving, i just have to wonder out loud if the attempted corporate destruction of capitalism and the subsequent nightmarish fall out which devastated millions of American families had anything to do with reduced contributions.

Nah…

RB from Gwinnett

March 17th, 2010
1:06 pm

“Most Jews vote democratic, yet most democrats are antisemites…I’m stumped.”

You have to understand there are Jews by religion and Jews by heritage and they are NOT the same thing. Only a very small number of the Jews in this country are committed to the Jewish faith.

AmVet

March 17th, 2010
1:09 pm

“Only a very small number of the Jews in this country are committed to the Jewish faith.”

No matter, the good news is that virtually all of them – Reformed, Conservative and Orthodox – vote against Republicans.

Mick

March 17th, 2010
1:10 pm

Hef

Not true, in my case I even tried to re-enlist (too old) but thank god I wasn’t able cause if I’d have been sent to iraq, well what a disaster. Never liked bush or jeb from day one. Jeb ruined florida and w took care of the rest of US. Then rove started using fear tactics in the 2002 midterms and gay wedge issues in 2004 and thats why we had incompetents who left the country in shambles. He was good for israel and never challenged them for whatever they wanted.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:11 pm

AmVet –

If you missed it last night, you REALLY need to see this video — it’s kind of long (10 minutes), but it’s hilarious and not trying to be all weird and all, but I watched this right before going to bed, and it made me think of you and it made me feel all weird inside:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/

It’s the first video “In Dodd We Trust” – it really gets funny about mid-way through….

Hef

March 17th, 2010
1:12 pm

I had lunch with Maxie Price once,he of “cryin towell” fame

Pointing at the bedwetter

March 17th, 2010
1:13 pm

@Bosch Jump on Jay’s bandwagon, because you haven’t anything else. You really do fit the stereotype of a bedwetting liberal wuss. Don’t faint at the concert tonight! Oh, “Woah is me”.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:16 pm

What’s wrong Swampy? Doing that name changey thing again?

Hef

March 17th, 2010
1:17 pm

Mick-While I agree Bush was not the best Pres we’ve had,logic tells us we’re not in the mess we’re in based solely on Bush and in only eight years. If so, you,me,everyone is to blame.

Hef

March 17th, 2010
1:18 pm

My 1:12 was for Bosch@1:04,sorry

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:20 pm

Hef,

I got that — no worries, but I have no idea who Maxie Price is.

Hef

March 17th, 2010
1:21 pm

Oh and for what it’s worth had I been polled, I would have voted in favor of Israel.

Hef

March 17th, 2010
1:22 pm

Bosch-He owned a Chevy dealer in Lawrenceville,and used to do commercials with his cryin towell.

Amiel Ungar

March 17th, 2010
1:23 pm

The question elicitis the answer .Once you say that it is occupied Palestinian land rather than disputed land. Change the question and the statistics will change as well.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:25 pm

Hef,

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah! I remember that guy now.

Felix Ungar (amiel's brother)

March 17th, 2010
1:25 pm

I agree 100%

AmVet

March 17th, 2010
1:26 pm

Bosch, part of me wants to laugh out loud and part of me wants to cry.

The white collar criminals colluded with each other and stole all of that money and just walked.

And the Republican nutjobs here think they are the good guys…

Hef

March 17th, 2010
1:27 pm

Oh and I had a beer at a bar with Jeff Van Note once,as one can see I’ve moved up quite a bit since college.

Whacks Eloquent

March 17th, 2010
1:29 pm

health care poll numbers…
RealClearPolitics (non-biased) has a compilation of all of the poll numbers for the current health care plans…
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/obama_and_democrats_health_care_plan-1130.html

Note – this is not a poll on whether Americans want meaningful health care reform. But if you want an indication, scroll down to the bottom of that list at last spring’s numbers – before all the ugly ridiculous details of Congress’ plans were known. People still believed that a real change could come from it, but they have become disillusioned…

Hef

March 17th, 2010
1:30 pm

To put majority of blame on any one portion of the population is what myself and others don’t agree with. Wrong is wrong,

GoingBroke

March 17th, 2010
1:31 pm

AmVet..
What do you mean walked?? They are still in Washington?

Mick

March 17th, 2010
1:34 pm

hef
**solely on Bush and in only eight years.**

Yes, you’re right about that. Compare these two time frames: 1950-1980 & 1980-2010
The first 30 years growth of middle class, shared wealth. The next thirty years deficit spending and irresponsible tax cuts plus tech and real estate bubbles, and lest we forget savings and loan disaster. Throughout, israel friend and allie to US.

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

March 17th, 2010
1:34 pm

Well, I never seen such a slanted poll question in my life. They should of asked, “Do you think the godless, greedy Jews should build houses in the land belonging to the Terrist towel-heads?”

Anyhow, ask a stupid question and you get a stupid answer.

Have a good p.m. everybody.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:36 pm

Whacks,

And if you look at any of those polls, it does not ask “WHY” people are opposed to HCR – take me for instance, I’m opposed to it – Why you may ask? Because it doesn’t include the public option. I want the public option or a single payer system. See? This whole “Americans are against it” isn’t necessarily what you might think.

AmVet

March 17th, 2010
1:36 pm

No, gone broke, They still run the quasi-criminal operations on Wall Street.

And the conservatives would never admit so, but they are thrilled that GWB II, aka Barack Obama, didn’t implement widespread prosecutions…

Paul

March 17th, 2010
1:38 pm

So… who were those guys in the white coats on stage with Pres Obama?

Nearly One-Third of Doctors Could Leave Medicine if Health-Care Reform Bill Passes, According to Survey Reported in New England Journal of Medicine

“Nearly one-third of all practicing physicians may leave the medical profession if President Obama signs current versions of health-care reform legislation into law, according to a survey published in the latest issue of the New England Journal of Medicine.

The survey, which was conducted by the Medicus Firm, a leading physician search and consulting firm based in Atlanta and Dallas, found that a majority of physicians said health-care reform would cause the quality of American medical care to “deteriorate” and it could be the “final straw” that sends a sizeable number of doctors out of medicine. ”

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/print/62812

Tax target

March 17th, 2010
1:39 pm

Meanwhile among the deem and pass, lack of transparency, NE/LA/union and other closed backroom deals, Thomas Sowell sums it best –

In a swindle that would make Bernie Madoff look like an amateur, Barack Obama has gotten a substantial segment of the population to believe that he can add millions of people to the government-insured rolls without increasing the already record-breaking federal deficit…

…Fraud has been at the heart of this medical care takeover plan from day one. The succession of wholly arbitrary deadlines for rushing this massive legislation through, before anyone has time to read it all, serves no other purpose than to keep its specifics from being scrutinized– or even recognized– before it becomes a fait accompli and “the law of the land.”

SouthGaDawg

March 17th, 2010
1:39 pm

Jay,

Since when do you care about polls?

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:40 pm

AmVet,

As Jon pointed out last night – now that corporations are considered the same as people, now the financial officers or top managers can go to jail just like people would if they pulled the kind of crap Lehman Bros. and the like did.

Whacks Eloquent

March 17th, 2010
1:41 pm

Bosch, I have not heard a fully good proposal from either side. You make a good point – but it still waters down to the fact that people don’t want this nearly $1 trillion piece of garbage…
The Democrats would gain some respect if they’d truly listen to some of the GOP proposals, and then try to get some kind of middle ground. All we get with the current bill is…well, I don’t know who it will truly benefit. Insurance companies short term, maybe the currently uninsured (in 4 years – still don’t get that). How can we not get a provision that will immediately help the uninsured (if they want it – I hate the notion of forced coverage).

Paul

March 17th, 2010
1:42 pm

Bosch 1:36

You may find this interesting. Then again, maybe not! :-)

http://pollingmatters.gallup.com/2010_03_01_archive.html

“Gallup’s latest survey was conducted March 4-7. We found that 48% of Americans would advise their representative in Congress to vote against “a healthcare bill similar to that proposed by President Obama”; 45% would vote in favor. The other most recent poll, conducted by AP-GfK at roughly the same time, found 43% would oppose and 41% would support “the health care reform plans being discussed in Congress.” (This poll offered respondents an explicit “neither support nor oppose” alternative, taken by 12%, with another 4% saying they were unsure.)

How to characterize these results? I might say “tilt slightly against” as a little more precise summary than “divided.” But, in any case, I would not agree with the Caddell/Schoen interpretation that a “solid majority” of Americans opposes the legislation. At least, not based on the most recent poll data.

A side note. All of this highlights one of Benenson’s challenges. His employer, the White House, is attempting to proactively pass a new bill. But Benenson can’t use poll data to say that a majority of Americans want the healthcare bill passed. So he is, in essence, reduced to arguing that the other side is wrong if they say that the majority oppose passing a healthcare bill. In this case, to say the public is “divided” is a positive thing.

Clearly a lot of this is a glass half empty/half full situation. Caddell and Schoen are correct that the battle for public opinion on healthcare has not been won. Benenson may be right that it has not been totally lost either. The data still suggest that if the bill were put to a national referendum with a full turnout, it would lose.”

Proud American

March 17th, 2010
1:42 pm

I was not polled, I did not vote for Obozo, I do not want Obozo care, but no one is listening. polls can be manipulated, if you go to one side of town it will be pablum puking Liberals, if you go to the mosque they will denounce Israel, if you ask me Irael has every right to build, they captured the land after they were attacked. Why let the Palistinians have a closer location to launch there rockets and continue to kill inocent civillians.
Jay Bookman, Cynthia Tucker, Oblunder, Peloser, where are we headed ?

Disgusted

March 17th, 2010
1:43 pm

. . .found that a majority of physicians said health-care reform would cause the quality of American medical care to “deteriorate” and it could be the “final straw” that sends a sizeable number of doctors out of medicine.”

Oh, sure thing! They’re going to leave an exclusive profession the training for which is largely paid by taxpayers and take up work as $35K-per-year Burger King floor managers. Yup, sounds like a reason to kill the health care bill to me.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:43 pm

Paul,

My answer to that is:

Let the b*sterds go. Let them walk….they really gonna just quit? I think that’s rather over dramatic. Sure, some might retire, but big deal – what does that say about those doctors? They are really going to pick unemployment over being a doctor. Yeah right.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:43 pm

Disgusted,

Oh, you and I just had a zen moment. Are you scared?

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:44 pm

Proud American,

“I did not vote for Obozo”

Here’s my shocked face:

:shock:

Mick

March 17th, 2010
1:45 pm

Paul

I find that ludicrus also, my sister is a doc and she seems to think her earnings will INCREASE so bring it on..

stands for decibels

March 17th, 2010
1:46 pm

RealClearPolitics (non-biased)

ha. you made a funny.

RCP was Andy’s go-to site back in the dark days of autumn, 2008, when he was trying to find someone with something nice to say about the OldGuy/BibleSpice ticket’s prospects.

Paul

March 17th, 2010
1:46 pm

Bosch – Disgusted

New England Journal of Medicine reported it. I think it might, just might, be advantageous if the White House asked themselves why such a highly educated group of people who would be in the middle of all the effects would feel that way. Rather than dismissing their concerns.

Paul

March 17th, 2010
1:47 pm

Mick

Why does your sister think her earnings will increase?

stands for decibels

March 17th, 2010
1:47 pm

They’re going to leave an exclusive profession the training for which is largely paid by taxpayers and take up work as $35K-per-year Burger King floor managers.

You guys… you’re aren’t actually taking a CNS-reported poll sponsored by a freaking doc-headhunting outfit at face value, are you?

Paul

March 17th, 2010
1:49 pm

Y’know, when there’s an excerpt posted, and a link, it’s generally a good idea to click on the link.

[[Despite all the opposition to the bill as it stands, only a little more than 3 percent of respondents said the status quo was best, with the vast majority (62.7 percent) saying they believe changes are needed.

The same 62.7 percent said they wanted reforms made, but that they “should be implemented in a more targeted, gradual way, as opposed to the sweeping overhaul that is in (the) legislation.”]]

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:50 pm

Whacks,

“but it still waters down to the fact that people don’t want this nearly $1 trillion piece of garbage”

No, not really – again, it depends on who you ask. I am opposed to it, but I’m not gonna sit and pitch a fit and hold my breath because I didn’t get my way – I want something passed, and I don’t think it’s gonna be the “end of all end” like the GOP says it will.

The problem is costs, costs, costs – there is no way to get costs down without a single payer system. Period.

“The Democrats would gain some respect if they’d truly listen to some of the GOP proposals”

You mean like the (what is it Paul?) 200 or so amendments that the GOP wanted that they’ve put in there? The GOP leaders are just flat out lying when they say they’ve been ignored. They want this to fail because they want Obama to fail – they don’t care about the actual people who would benefit from this – they simply want to be back in power (and of course, that’s my own opinion).

[...] Rasmussen poll, reported by Jay Bookman, Atlanta Journal-Constitution: [...]

Paul

March 17th, 2010
1:51 pm

sfd

I thought we were beyond dismissing a report because one doesn’t like the agency who picks up the story? Associated Press writes a story, it gets linked on Drudge or cited in National Review and suddenly the story’s not credible? Click on Google – many, many outlets reported this.

And it originated in the New England Journal of Medicine.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
1:52 pm

Paul,

I really don’t care if the White House themselves reported it – a doctor can get all high handed and say, “Well, hell yeah I’d quit” but when it came right down to it – I’d call his bluff and say, go ahead, dude. You think that many doctors would just hang up their lab coats? I say bs.

Mick

March 17th, 2010
1:53 pm

Paul

More people with health insurance will use it. Right now, people with no insurance go to the ER for a headache.

Doggone/GA

March 17th, 2010
1:53 pm

“New England Journal of Medicine reported it.”

Might want to double-check that before you state it so surely:

http://mediamatters.org/blog/201003170036

Paul

March 17th, 2010
1:54 pm

Bosch

I heard one of the Democratic leaders a couple days ago say it was over 200 Republican amendments and proposals in the final. And Republicans still won’t vote for it.

Both sides are dug in, playing politics and blaming the other side.

stands for decibels

March 17th, 2010
1:56 pm

But to Jay’s topic (and shame on me for not first addressing it) — the cynic in me has to wonder how Question #5 would poll if Rassy were to change ” occupied Palestinian territory” to “the Holy Land.”

I guess I also have to wonder, non-cynically, just realistically, how much the polling is a reflection of how much bandwidth the American public has for foreign policy stories like this. It is possible that the “erosion” of support Jay cites is really more a reflection of a population that is a bit better informed about the issue. (or perhaps less informed–maybe the last time the polling was done, Israeli settlement construction was MORE in the news than it is at the moment, but I kinda doubt that.)

Paul

March 17th, 2010
1:57 pm

Bosch

Jay just posted a poll citing the number of people who don’t count Israel as an ally. The number had doubled from the last report.

Yet, that percent is about half the percent of unhappy doctors. If it’s worth considering implications for the ‘Israel’s not our ally’ group, then why not consider the implications for the doctors? I believe one of the points from the earlier thread was Israel and her ardent supporters blithely dismissed those folks – and it could prove harmful to them over the long haul.

Yet we see the current health care reform supporters doing the same with doctors?

GoingBroke

March 17th, 2010
1:57 pm

We are going to get a “Bill” or something with a health care label..The bottom line is this..
The final version is not complete.. they will vote on it anyway.
No ones knows the costs, but who cares.
No one can explain it.
The IRS is going to enforce it. (read more IRS employees)

stands for decibels

March 17th, 2010
1:57 pm

I thought we were beyond dismissing a report because one doesn’t like the agency who picks up the story?

That must’ve been some other guy. I’ll rag on a cheezy outfit like CNS ’til the cows come home.

Disgusted

March 17th, 2010
1:58 pm

Oh, you and I just had a zen moment. Are you scared?

More like mortified.

And why would the sister-physician think she’d make more money if the bill passes?

Well, there are about 40 million reasons. People currently uncovered by health insurance would be going to see a doctor, instead of waiting until a condition warranted an emergency room visit. And those doctors seeing the 40 million additional patients would be getting paid for their services.

Duh.

Paul

March 17th, 2010
2:02 pm

Doggone/GA

Thanks! For those of you who didn’t read the link, it wasn’t the NEJournal of Med as many sources cited, but the parent organization that also publishes the NE Journal.

Before I read your link I scanned the current and last issue of the Journal. The subject was nowhere to be found.

Paul

March 17th, 2010
2:04 pm

Mick 1:53

So your sister thinks her population base is heavily comprised of people who don’t currently have health insurance?

Does your sister treat a large number of Medicare patients? Is she planning on expanding care for our rapidly increasing aging population? Because the bill includes a 20-something percent decrease in payments to doctors for ten years, doesn’t it?

Your sister’s not cherry-picking patients by refusing new medicare or medicaid enrollees, is she?

Normal

March 17th, 2010
2:05 pm

GoingBroke

March 17th, 2010
2:07 pm

Disgusted.. wow. when was the last time you went to see a doctor?
Doctors have stopped taking Medicare patients in droves as the GOVT has an issue with paying and paperwork. (go figure)

stands for decibels

March 17th, 2010
2:08 pm

I supported Obama and Clinton but do not like them much now. They lied so much.

Dear Penthouse Forum: I never thought I’d be writing to you, but I had this wild experience with horny triplets that I simply must share…

Proud American

March 17th, 2010
2:09 pm

Paul

You don’t expect Obozo and his gang of hoods to listen to reasoning do you ?

Outhouse GoKart

March 17th, 2010
2:09 pm

Dow Jones at New 52 WEEK HIGH…Awwww Hell yea G!!

Lettuce hope it holds into the close!!

MO MONEY MO MONEY MO MONEY!!!!

AmVet

March 17th, 2010
2:11 pm

Everyday I read there’s been one more, another life they say it’s part of war
Have we made this world of ours a safer place, I don’t think so
Taking over the world just ain’t my thing, I’d like to know who died & made us king
I think it’s time we do some listening

If we’re too busy now will we ever have the time, change is never easy

Should we take a stand now, or just go with the flow
Are things getting better, is the answer no
Are we gonna speak out, or turn our backs and go
Should you join the cause, If you gotta ask you’ll never know

Can’t we look beyond our own needs, focus on another hear their plea
They say what goes around, comes around, I believe it
The common people fight for those with more, that’s the way it always goes in war
I think it’s time we do some questioning

If they did it back then we can do it again right now, times they are a changin’

Can’t trust those politician’s, who are slaves to special interests
But you gotta have the money
Don’t blame the Armed Forces, cause they are not the sources
They’re heroes either way

If they did it back then we can do it again right now, times they are a changin’

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NnEg1FeVk0

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
2:11 pm

“Doctors have stopped taking Medicare patients in droves as the GOVT has an issue with paying and paperwork. (go figure)”

There goes my bullsh*t meter again.

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
2:12 pm

Paul,

Are you trying to get me back on topic? Huh?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Disgusted,

I’m sorry that I mortified you.

Mick

March 17th, 2010
2:14 pm

Paul

I am not my sister so I’ll answer what I know.

**So your sister thinks her population base is heavily comprised of people who don’t currently have health insurance? ** YES

**Does your sister treat a large number of Medicare patients?** NO

stands for decibels

March 17th, 2010
2:15 pm

the daily Jew bashing article

[…]

most democrats are antisemites…

Do righties get a Cracker Barrel coupon or suchlike every time they post some version of this tiresome nonsense?

Disgusted

March 17th, 2010
2:17 pm

Disgusted.. wow. when was the last time you went to see a doctor?
Doctors have stopped taking Medicare patients in droves as the GOVT has an issue with paying and paperwork. (go figure)

There’s such a thing as begging the question. It is a logical fallacy in which a false premise leads to an erroneous conclusion. Your premise appears to be that insurance obtained by virtue of the current bill would be Medicare-like. It would not be. I don’t know how many doctors would be willing to turn down a 10 to 15% increase in paying patient load merely because the patients are insured through a plan offered by a cooperative, not by Medicare. Keep in mind that insuring through Medicare went by the boards during the Senate negotiations. The insurers of the currently uninsured would be regular insurers–like Aetna, UnitedHealthcare, etc. I fail to see why doctors would be anxious to turn the patients down, since they would be getting paid by the insurers, not the government.

Jackie

March 17th, 2010
2:18 pm

Polls taken in Israel show that 80% of the Israeli population do not like the way the government treats the Palestinians.

The coalition government that Israel uses is controlled by the ultra-rightwing parties. A coalition comprising 20% of the Israeli government can bring down the government by withdrawing from the government and forcing new elections.

Until the USA starts to stand up to the reality that 20% of the Israeli government controls the Middle East, the USA and essentially holds world peace in their hands, the problem will not go away.

Outhouse GoKart

March 17th, 2010
2:19 pm

“Do righties get a Cracker Barrel coupon or suchlike every time they post some version of this tiresome nonsense?”

No but we do get a free meal. No coupon needed. We just walk in and say “HEY…Mr Mgr did you know most democrats are antisemites” and Mr Mgr says “We have a WINNER…welcome to craker barrel, this one is on the house”.

You should try it some time!

Bosch

March 17th, 2010
2:19 pm

sfd,

I swear my dog could get smashed in front of my house and you’d still manage to make me laugh. Thanks.

Ray

March 17th, 2010
2:23 pm

“Premiums are likely to keep going up even if the health care bill passes, experts say. If cost controls work as advertised, annual increases would level off with time. But don’t look for a rollback. Instead, the main reason premiums would be more affordable is that new government tax credits would help millions of people who can’t afford the cost now”

Let those who have a problem with this denounce their ‘Christianity.’

Hillbilly Deluxe

March 17th, 2010
2:25 pm

Bosch @ 2:11

My family doctor stopped taking new Medicare patients 3 or 4 years ago. Now, I haven’t asked him, so I won’t hazard a guess as to why. Could just be that his practice is built up enough to where he can be more selective as to who he sees. He’s not that far from retirement.

A question to everybody……Has anybody else but me noticed, that when you go to the doctor, there are as many office and clerical people working there as there are medical people? It’s that way everywhere I go, so it can’t just be that a particular doctor has that problem.