The Andre Bauer solution: Starve the poor, they’ll stop breeding

“My grandmother was not a highly educated woman, but she told me as a small child to quit feeding stray animals. You know why? Because they breed! You’re facilitating the problem if you give an animal or a person ample food supply. They will reproduce, especially ones that don’t think too much further than that. And so what you’ve got to do is you’ve got to curtail that type of behavior. They don’t know any better.”

– Andre Bauer, lieutenant governor of South Carolina
and candidate for S.C. governor.

It’s hard to know where to start with a statement like that. Apparently, Lt. Gov. Andre Bauer believes that we should try to starve the poor out of existence. Deprive them of food and they will cease breeding: Problem solved, neat as that. (An audio version of Bauer’s remarks with additional context is available here. Hearing the vehemence with which Bauer makes the above statement only compounds its ugliness.)

For the moment, though, let’s set aside the pure viciousness of that statement and address what Bauer claims is his larger point. In effect, his thesis is that government assistance actually causes poverty because it subsidizes and encourages irresponsible actions. “In government, we continue to reward bad behavior,” he said. “Any time we give somebody money we’re rewarding them. We’re telling them to keep doing what they’re doing.”

Cut off those subsidies, in other words, and poverty will decrease.

In some circles, that’s a politically popular explanation for the problems of the underclass. So let’s take it seriously for a moment and try to test that analysis against what we know to be reality.

The first problem is history. Human poverty has existed in every culture and era, without exception. It is a constant of human existence, a pre-existing condition, so to speak. No matter what Bauer chooses to believe, government did not create it. South Carolina, for example, was mired in deep poverty long before school-lunch programs and welfare programs existed.

Second, if Bauer were right, we would expect that poverty would be lowest in those nations that do nothing to “subsidize bad behavior,” and highest in those countries where the government support system rewards such behavior. Yet if you look around the world,  the opposite is true. Poverty levels are highest in those societies that make little attempt to address it, and lowest in those that offer some form of safety net.

We can also test Bauer’s thesis here at home, by comparing states that offer varying degrees of support for the poor. A liberal Northeastern state such as Connecticut, for example, offers a more extensive government support system to its poor than does a conservative state such as South Carolina. Mississippi offers even less support to its poor than does South Carolina. Put in Bauer’s terms, Connecticut rewards poverty while South Carolina and Mississippi try to penalize it.

If Bauer’s thesis is correct — if government support causes poverty — then Connecticut ought to be drowning in poor people while Mississippi has relatively few poor people.  Yet in fact the exact opposite is true, and Census Bureau figures prove it. In Connecticut, which “subsidizes bad behavior” most heavily, 5.7 percent of families lived below the poverty line in 2007, while 16 percent did so in Mississippi, where poverty was least subsidized. (The figure in South Carolina was 11.2 percent; in Georgia it was 10.8 percent. And all those numbers are undoubtedly a lot higher in 2010.)

That data suggest that poverty is a much more complex phenomenon than Bauer would like to pretend, and is not in the least “caused” by government assistance.

Nor does government assistance encourage “breeding,” as Bauer so cruelly described it. It is demographic fact that in every culture and in every era throughout history, poorer families tend to have more children than affluent families. The presence or absence of government support has nothing to do with it. By the way, Bauer’s dismay is also nothing new; in cultures throughout time, the more affluent have always been dismayed by those “breeders” in the lower classes.

In his speech, Bauer recounts a second-hand tale of a 10-year-old child who supposedly gave birth to a baby of her own. If true, it is a tragic tale for both. Even if that particular story is false,  the larger problem of teenage and out-of-wedlock births is very real and must be confronted honestly. However,  that honest discussion must begin by acknowledging that the 10-year-old did not “breed” in response to financial inducements offered by the government.

Bauer did offer one concrete suggestion in his speech, proposing that parents be required to attend parent-teacher conferences and take drug tests or lose government benefits such as school lunch programs. If they want government benefits, he said, they should be required to act responsibly.

To any responsible person, that instinctively sounds great, but let’s think it through. The population that Bauer is attempting to target are by definition not responsible. They are parents who abuse drugs or simply don’t care enough about their children to ensure that they get a good education. Is that population going to change its behavior in response to a possible cutoff of free school lunches? Sadly, no. If they responded to that kind of thing, they wouldn’t be in that predicament in the first place.

And if you nonetheless go ahead and deny a free or subsidized lunch to a kid whose parents are on drugs, what have you accomplished? You condemn the child to hunger and malnutrition, heaping another significant problem on his or her already overburdened shoulders. You reduce the incentive for that child to go to school every day, where at least he or she knew food was available. And you make people like Andre Bauer feel better.

Bauer’s fundamental mistake is his assertion that the poor respond to market signals sent by the government.  The real problem is that they don’t respond to market signals at all.  Living in poverty ought to be a huge market signal, but for a variety of reasons, the poor are largely immune to it. Many of them don’t recognize what the signals are saying, they lack the education to know how to respond to them, and they have no faith that the market would reward them anyway.

Changing that is difficult; only a small percentage of those born into poverty escape it.  Perhaps the best we can do is to champion programs — and the school lunch program is a perfect if small example — that increase the odds of escape for individuals mired in poverty.

One last point: In his speech and subsequent press release, Bauer complained that “political correctness” makes it impossible to discuss such issues publicly. I would suggest that rhetoric likening our fellow Americans to overbreeding stray animals makes it far more difficult to discuss these things rationally than does political correctness.

404 comments Add your comment

Kamchak

January 24th, 2010
12:23 pm

“My grandmother was not a highly educated woman, but she told me as a small child to quit feeding stray animals. You know why? Because they breed! You’re facilitating the problem if you give an animal or a person ample food supply. They will reproduce, especially ones that don’t think too much further than that. And so what you’ve got to do is you’ve got to curtail that type of behavior. They don’t know any better.”

Substitute “food supply with “health-care” and it’s the same mind-set.

Geez.

Southern Comfort

January 24th, 2010
12:24 pm

I was wondering if you were going to touch base on that, Jay…

I’ll listen to the audio when I get home so I can comment. I hope it’s not as bad as it seems.

Exitus acta probat

January 24th, 2010
12:31 pm

good afternoon everybody….this guy must have skipped his meds that day…

Jackie

January 24th, 2010
12:35 pm

A perfect example of how the so-called conservatives use the tactic of making unsubstantiated, outrageous statements and when asked to verify those statements, the person making that statement apologizes and issues another statement declaring the liberal press published an out-of-content release that the press should apologize for.

getalife

January 24th, 2010
12:37 pm

Ah, a new con hero hits the stage.

Kamchak

January 24th, 2010
12:41 pm

Bauer/Palin 2012!

getalife

January 24th, 2010
12:44 pm

“The Obama administration soon may guarantee as much as $18.5 billion in loans to build new nuclear reactors to generate electricity, and Congress is considering whether to add billions more to support an expansion of nuclear power.”McClatchy.

Going nuke to create jobs.

emo

January 24th, 2010
12:45 pm

Another brilliant comment from a Republican who has undoubtedly never missed a meal in his life, probably many from lobbyists.

Jay

January 24th, 2010
12:45 pm

I’m sure Andre Bauer will mention that in his next speech, getalife, pointing out how government handouts create a lazy, dependent corporate class, etc.

Sandy

January 24th, 2010
12:55 pm

Where is Andre’s evidence that parents living in poverty do not participate in school? At my rural SC school with 80% poverty level, we had 95% of parents attend parent conferences. We had to offer flexible times and rides for parents without transportation. Many parents lose pay when they are not at work. And so many are working multiple jobs.

A better idea would to mandate drug-testing for the people of SC who keep voting these idiots into office.

professional skeptic

January 24th, 2010
12:56 pm

I’d say a lack of guidance in the area of human compassion during the formative years breeds angry individuals who harbor lifelong contempt and disdain for others. Perhaps if we could find some way starve our youth of exposure to hateful parents and wicked grandmothers…

KidsRpeople2

January 24th, 2010
12:57 pm

So what this fat cat politician is saying is that just because a person is born into poverty they are not worthy of a hot meal as a helpless child and they will never amount to anything, they are disposable? How many times have we heard of people who have made a real and lasting positive impact on the world coming up from poverty and other adverse circumstances? Many, many times. Judge not lest you be judged!

professional skeptic

January 24th, 2010
12:59 pm

… And get hateful politicians off the government dole. They might breed!

AmVet

January 24th, 2010
1:03 pm

Just another malevolent, uber-right wing, “pro life” “Christian” in the Coat Hanger Party…

Maybe like his boss, he’ll find some redemption on the Appalachian Trail…

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
1:07 pm

Bauer’s granny may have not had much education, but she had a pretty good grasp of Darwinian princples. It’s just that we are not talking about ferral animals here, but G-d’s noblest creature. There is a moral element and, left, right and center, our collective moral compass is out of whack. And as a sidelight, I doubt very seriously that Granny Bauer would appreciate her grandson’s use of the lesson she was trying to teach. I doubt she was, as professional skeptic insinuates, “wicked.”

Jess

January 24th, 2010
1:07 pm

Having lived in Connectiicut, I can tell you that supporting the poor Connecticut is not much of a problem. Through zoning and red lining they manage to keep the few poor that they have pretty well confined in a few areas of their largest cities. The small town I lived in had three acre residential zoning. Needless to say there were not too many poor folks for this town to support..

jconservative

January 24th, 2010
1:14 pm

Bauer may be Lt Governor but he is ignorant of history. Poverty breeds a larger population, always has and probably always will. Check out St. Augustine’s writings 410 to 420. He proved it then and it has not been disproved since.

Taxpayer

January 24th, 2010
1:14 pm

Well, you know Andre is just the perfect little mouthpiece for South Carolina’s ruling elite — the SC-GOP. After all, he was a Varsity Cheerleader.

getalife

January 24th, 2010
1:15 pm

Jay,

It is sad he said this to become Governor of South Carolina.

They want to go backwards.

Exitus acta probat

January 24th, 2010
1:16 pm

I’m new to the neighborhood, so I might stumble along a little….Isn’t being poor the opposite of being rich? You could not have one without the other, right?

If you don’t like that concept make everyone the same(isn’t that socialism?)

What does this guy from SC really want?

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
1:17 pm

JAY

“…only a small percentage of those born into poverty escape it.”

I have no data at my disposal to rebutt this contention, but I would be inclined to disagree on the use of the adjective “small.” I would contend that precisely because of such programs, school lunch and government subsidized higher education (i.e. Hope, etc.) have moved many from poverty. Say what else you will about “hand outs” down here in Uncle Sam’s Oldest Colony, we’ve come a long, long way in the last half-century and no small part of that has been due to education, itself a government subsidy.

roger

January 24th, 2010
1:18 pm

All you liberals..taking something totally out of context. If you were providing housing, food, etc for someone and told them they had to drug test, go to meetings, etc in order for you to keep supporting them, would you? I am sure none of you will give an honest answer. How is it that the USA is the first nation in history in which the poorest are the most obese? I am SICK AND TIRED of watching folks in front of me with 50 dollar manicures, 200 dollar cell phones, buying crab legs, filet mignon and driving off in a new car, but paying with food stamps. They know how to “work the system”. We must break this habit. Maybe all of you should take a point from Margaret Thatcher when she said “Socialism, a great idea until you run out of other peoples’ money.”

professional skeptic

January 24th, 2010
1:18 pm

Disclaimer: From time to time I’ll address one absurd assertion with another, equally absurd. I have no idea what kind of person Granny Bauer was, but I’m left wondering whether Bauer was taught any compassion during his youth, and whether it would have made a difference.

Alternatively, His upbringing could be completely irrelevant, and the man could just be another sleaze-ball politician who’ll say anything in order to pander to his perceived base.

Tilli

January 24th, 2010
1:22 pm

He’s an idiot, no not Jay….this time.

This is just one example of a politician being a politician. Conservatives, Liberals, Democrats and Republicans all have members of their parties or groups that make the rest look bad. This moron is a mole hill, don’t make a mountain out of him because tomorrow someone on the other side will do something equally as stupid. Jay might eve be forced to defend it.

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
1:22 pm

professional skeptic

“..the man could just be another sleaze-ball politician who’ll say anything in order to pander to his perceived base.”

I would be inclined to agree with this.

Taxpayer

January 24th, 2010
1:23 pm

Basically what Andre is saying to his constituency is to “vote for me so I can take away your entitlements and make your life better.”

Kamchak

January 24th, 2010
1:24 pm

How is it that the USA is the first nation in history in which the poorest are the most obese?

Maybe it’s because calories are so cheap in the ‘hood. Fast-food, convenience stores are prevalent but not so grocery stores–and even if they were, quality food is expensive whereas fast-food is filling and cheap.

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
1:29 pm

Jess–
Your point is well taken. In a society such as Connecticut with its long tradition of comfortable financial circumstances, high level of education and monocultural population base, the poor are not now, nor have they ever been, a significant demographic. South Carolina and Mississippi are inheritors of a substantially different socio-cultural historical process. Comparing the two is an apples and oranges thing and does little to address the problem, its cause or its effect.

getalife

January 24th, 2010
1:30 pm

“It amazes me how some Republican politicians claim a monopoly on Christianity and then go out and say and do some of the most un-Christian things imaginable,” said Charleston attorney Mullins McLeod, who participated in a candidates forum in Columbia along with Bauer Saturday. “… Bauer’s comments are despicable and the total opposite of the Christian values Bauer espouses.”

“This is out of love and compassion,” Bauer said. “If I have to take a hit, then fine. … I will take short-term pain for long-term gain.”

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/82910.html

I guess Yucca mountain is back open for the nuclear waste.

AmVet

January 24th, 2010
1:33 pm

josef, agreed. Systematic injustice for the POOR (not always black) has become the de facto American way. Katrina showed this to all, even the right wing ostriches.

JB, against my better judgment, I listened to entire clip from this zealot.

Because he speaks just like one of those pontificating a**holes, perhaps if this politics thing doesn’t work out, he can always become a pastor somewhere in SC.

And if the breeding of these “stray animals” is the problem as he asserts, what does the good Dr. Mengele of the Palmetto State propose?

But I’d wager that he’s guaranteed to take 99% of the “conservative” vote in SC now though.

The truth be told, when I first heard of this, I presumed it was another GOP troglodyte and good “Christian” – Gary Bauer.

Taxpayer

January 24th, 2010
1:36 pm

I’d sure hate to hear his thoughts regarding Haitians and what he would do to them should any of them refugees head toward his state.

roger

January 24th, 2010
1:36 pm

Oh yeah Kamchak….and why then can they not cook food at home? Are they too damn lazy to turn on a stove or operate a microwave and prepare food themselves? They HAVE to go eat food at McDonald’s or pricey foods at convenience stores? I say if you are on the take…give rations. Years ago, Jack Kemp and the FDA came up with a diet in which a person could live in very good health for less than $400 a year. But instead of getting your protein from crab legs or filet mignon, you get it from kidney beans or navy beans, not as tasty, but far healthier and CHEAPER. For the most part, the obese make their own poor choices. Why not take a ride around the projects? See how people get free housing sit on their duffs but are too lazy to pick up the trash in the neighborhood. But you are right, instead of exerting effort in picking up their own trash, they do make a stroll to a convenience store to buy beer and toss the trash in their yards

Southern Comfort

January 24th, 2010
1:42 pm

I’m willing to guess that roger has never lived in the ‘hood. He seems to describe it oh so well, but doesn’t have the faintest clue that Publix, Kroeger, nor Trader Joe’s builds too many stores in the hood. The grocery stores in the hood don’t typically have many healthy choices to choose from anyway.

Go shop in the hood for a few months, then rant about the choices.

frank

January 24th, 2010
1:43 pm

Dear Taxpayer: One idea of his “thoughts regarding Haitians” can be found that on Satuday he was working with Samaritan’s Feet gathering four truckloads of donated clothing and goods that he will be flying to Haiti this week. Samaritan’s Feet has the goal of providing 1 millions pairs of shoes to unfortunate children throughout the world. Andre and Manny have a goal of proving shoes to 40,000 children in SC — with the target being kids receiving free lunches.

AmVet

January 24th, 2010
1:44 pm

“Why not take a ride around the projects?”

Though the term black was gutlessly omitted from the above (just covert bigotry) please redact to read “Why not take a ride around white trailer parks.” and note how it works just as well.

Too bad, because notwithstanding the “color blind” racial animus, the message is of some value…

roger

January 24th, 2010
1:46 pm

Southern Comfort…FOR YOUR INFORMATION….I am self made. I know the HOOD! Don’t judge what you dont know! And, yes, they do have grocery stores right beside most of them. OR THEY CAN USE PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION FOR FREE TO GET THEIR GROCERIES!

HG3

January 24th, 2010
1:47 pm

Good job, Jay.

El Jefe

January 24th, 2010
1:47 pm

It sounds like he was going back to Benjamin Franklin

“I am for doing good to the poor, but…I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed…that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”

Kamchak

January 24th, 2010
1:49 pm

SC Citizen

January 24th, 2010
1:50 pm

Interesting you took that one quote, which was a terrible analogy, and wrote this whole blog without even touching on what Bauer was actually saying. How did you decide to leave out the entire point he was making? In addition to the comments that were published along with this mistake of an analogy, The State paper includes this today:

“His comments, Bauer said, are not about hardships associated with the economy, but a culture of dependence that is there during good economic times. He also said he wasn’t advocating the abolition of the federal school-lunch program or any other government aid.”

The world would be a much better place if the media and bloggers would actually write about things IN CONTEXT.

roger

January 24th, 2010
1:50 pm

Great quote El Jefe. Kind of the “teach a man to fish” ideal.

Kamchak

January 24th, 2010
1:51 pm

roger

January 24th, 2010
1:52 pm

Oh yeah Kanchak…kidney beans are SO expensive. So are canned beans and the like. WAY more than McDonald’s. Why dont you acquire some common sense!

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
1:52 pm

A rich, fat white folks and food stamps story. Back when we were in college in the lilly white, well off Pacific Northwest, we went to pay for our groceries one day and the cashier, paid union scale and benefits, looked at our cash, then at us and said, “you’re paying with cash?” We were a bit huffy, “yes ma’m, we are.” This was a college town. “Aren’t you students?” “Yes ma’am.” “Well why aren’t you taking advantage of food stamps? You’re entitled to them.” Recent arrivals from the Deep South, from comfortable backgrounds, the idea of being “entitled” to subsidy was an alien concept and the idea that we were not “taking advantage” of the program was, well, an affront…the state of Washington could afford such a line of thought. Our native Mississippi and Louisiana could not.

Finn McCool

January 24th, 2010
1:52 pm

Excellent commentary.

Southern Comfort

January 24th, 2010
1:53 pm

I never said you were not self-made. There’s a difference between knowing the hood and living in the hood. I can say I know Buckhead, but I don’t know jack about living there, because I never have.

If you “know” the hood so well, you would have commented on the QUALITY of the grocery stores, which you completely ignored. As I stated earlier, they have stores, but the quality is nowhere near what you’d find in Buckhead/Lenox.

As for free public transportation….
HA!! That doesn’t exist.

See y’all in a few. Time for the drive home.

Jess

January 24th, 2010
1:53 pm

Not to sound insensative but I used to hike quite a bit in the mountains. The forest service always warned people not to feed the bears. This was not because of safety concerns for the hiker, but because bears very quickly become dependant on handouts and spend their time and energy looking for handouts rather than foraging which is their natural instinct.

Of course we should provide basics for those who have nothing. I think the issue is what are basics. Between section 8 housing, free lunches, earned income credits, food stamps, peach care, free child care, etc. what we call poor in this country is solid middle class in many europeon countries.

roger

January 24th, 2010
1:54 pm

Well, as Thomas Jefferson stated, “Common sense is not so common”.

Matilda

January 24th, 2010
1:54 pm

Lemme guess: This is is “STAUNCHLY PRO-LIFE,” right? Of course he is.

roger

January 24th, 2010
1:55 pm

Oh gosh, Southern Comfort…low end grocery stores dont sell canned veggies…I didnt know that!

El Jefe

January 24th, 2010
1:56 pm

roger,

Also a commentary on the current American war on poverty – give them everything they want and need – to hell with the rest of society.

Heck, if we gave every family on welfare $100,000 a year, we would not move that many out of poverty. Now, if they earned $100,000 – that is a different story.

roger

January 24th, 2010
1:58 pm

El Jefe…wonderful points….if you are ever in town, I will take you out for a FREE lunch!

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
2:01 pm

AmVet–
There you go on the trailer parks again! I’m tellin’ ya… :-)

Matilda

January 24th, 2010
2:01 pm

From his website: “Lt. Governor André Bauer has always supported and will continue to support anti-abortion legislation. He believes every child deserves the chance to explore the world we live in and experience God’s creations.”

Please don’t confuse that to mean children born to people who don’t want them or can’t afford to feed them should expect any help from HIM or any othter good God-loving (according to his website) person to receive the basic necessities to sustain life: food or medicine. THOSE children need to learn personal responsibility. How dare they demand to be born without a clearly-mapped personal economic plan?

Kamchak

January 24th, 2010
2:04 pm

ESM2

January 24th, 2010
2:06 pm

I have to say that Mr. Bauer makes it evident that we definitely have a breeding problem here.

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
2:06 pm

SoCo–
Your point is well made. I live in Buckhead. The departmental offices for my program are in the hood. Unmentionable does our food shopping. When he’s out to pick me up from a meeting, he sure doesn’t use the time on his hands for grocery shopping. The nearest supermarket is miles away and the quality and quantity (and prices) of the goods offered are a heap sight worse than those at any of the six chain supermarkets within walking distance of home…

High school dropout

January 24th, 2010
2:08 pm

Keep em coming Rodger, you know so little and it shows.

getalife

January 24th, 2010
2:09 pm

“McCain says there’s not much that can be done about campaign financing now. Still, he predicts a backlash over time from voters once they see the amount of money that corporations and unions pour into political campaigns.”

On day three, McCain admits corporate power is here to stay.

Tim

January 24th, 2010
2:11 pm

What’s even more telling is the (lack of) response from Bauer’s fellow Republicans. That’s because what he said is actually orthodoxy in the Republican Party. In America, there’s no greater sin than being poor, unless it’s being poor and black at the same time.

http://www.indigojournal.com/diary/1644/bauers-stray-animals-comments-represent-gop-orthodoxy

AmVet

January 24th, 2010
2:11 pm

It is my stereotypical repost to inane stereotypes, josef.

Apparently Bauer and the conned want one thing and one thing only – to eliminate ALL social welfare.

Thus leaving more for the fascists who already own the country and are in the process of selling it to the highest bidder.

Time to get really proficient in Mandarin…

Jackie

January 24th, 2010
2:12 pm

How many are aware that food chains do exist in “the hood” but fail to realize those chains are at the end of the distribution chain. Old, wilted veggies; dented and swelling cans of goods; tainted and sometimes spoiled meats. To add insult, these same goods are usually substantially higher than goods found in the stores at the beginning of the distribution chain.

Liberal Like Jesus

January 24th, 2010
2:13 pm

Hey ROGER,
I have see the lazy poor people you refer to. I have seen the trash strewn areas around poor housing. However, these are the exceptions. Before raging against those that you obviously see as inferior to you, please consider that the majority or people receiving gov’t assistance work hard, but just don’t have much to show for it. Marta and the CCT are full of single parents getting home from work late after working at a job that doesn’t pay a living wage. It’s a complex problem, but please don’t assume that the majority of poor people are lazy. It simply isn’t true. And to “punish” ANY child for things they have no control over? I don’t care if their parents are lazy or not… it isn’t their fault. They are human beings. WWJD?

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
2:16 pm

For Bauer and his ilk (okay, K’chak, there’s the “ilk” card!)

http://art-bin.com/art/omodest.html

john

January 24th, 2010
2:17 pm

Let’s hope the people of S.C. will get motivated by this and VOTE this guy out of office. Let him go out and look for a real job. Maybe we can even stop him from breeding.

PLEASE VOTE!!!

Kamchak

January 24th, 2010
2:19 pm

OH NOES! NOT THE “ILK” CARD!

Jackie

January 24th, 2010
2:19 pm

@El jefe

Do you know where any of us could get a job paying $100,000?

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
2:21 pm

AmVet–you know I know that! Jus’ sayin’ if you ain’t kerful, yore invitation to the beer-bash, poker party will be rescinded…! :-)

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

January 24th, 2010
2:22 pm

Well, the guy’s got a point. Give Those People food and they won’t work for it. Give them health care and they won’t get healthy and stay that way. Make the men get fixed and they won’t be the Baby Daddy of so many welfare kids.

If we cut out all this welfare pretty soon everybody would have plenty to eat and live in good places. And we could get another Tax Cut.

It’s just my opinion but it’s very true. Of course, I reckon if I was poor I might could feel a little diffrent. But I ain’t and I don’t.

Have a good Sabbath everybody.

SC Citizen

January 24th, 2010
2:27 pm

John, your post another example of how people don’t think for themselves. You read a headline posted on a blog and can’t be bothered to take 5 minutes of your time to find out the real story.

For starters, Andre knows what hard work is. He has been working hard since his teen years, if not before. That’s all the guy did!

The guy came from a broken home and did not grow up wealthy. He worked for everything he has. Each one of his elections is a result of extremely hard work.

Just read the story. Even the Boston Herald was able to get it right by posting it in its actual context. This blogger here is a hopeless amateur.

mike

January 24th, 2010
2:31 pm

Wow. Talk about trying to change the subject.

How much hunting did Jay have to do to find this extreme voice?

Nice to see that Jay, like Obama, has such keen insight into the issues that Americans are really concerned about. I don’t blame Jay for ignoring the important political news of the day in favor of this irrelevant gibberish. The reality of the situation for the Dems is so dire that reflexive smearing of opponents has become an even more attractive option than usual. Jay isn’t as blunt as Olbermann with his crass attempts to smear those who don’t share his ideological views as racist, but the intent is the same.

The White House has responded to the latest round of challenges with a call for more partisanship. Liberal pundits have responded as usual by smearing political opponents as racists. Neither of these strategies are going to help their cause.

Jackie

January 24th, 2010
2:35 pm

@SC Citizen

If one were to follow Mr. Bauer’s advice, how would the citizens of your state justify the “corrodor of shame?”; the state being one of the poorest in the nation?; Williamsburg County, SC being at or near the top as the poorest county in the nation?

TaxPayer

January 24th, 2010
2:36 pm

Dear frank:

I assume from your comments that you think that it is acceptable to help those in poverty as long as that help comes from a “Charitable” Organization and not from the government. Is that because the “Charitable” Organization is capable of doing more with the tax breaks than the government is capable of doing with the same tax money or are there other factors involved here as well. Could it also have to do with getting that direct feedback from those that are helped instead of no feedback when the money is directed through the government amongst other things. You seem to be well informed regarding Andre’s efforts so surely you would not mind sharing some more with us. Thank you ever so much in advance.

Hillbilly Deluxe

January 24th, 2010
2:36 pm

Well, I got here late so somebody has already played “the ilk card”. ;-)

If they did manage to starve out the poor, what would they do for a source of cheap labor? They’d probably import them but they wouldn’t import upper class people, so wouldn’t the cycle start again?

And finally, sure there are some sorry people in the world who will game any system (although not as many as some would have you believe). Always been that way, always will be, but no matter how sorry and no ‘count their parents may be, the kids can’t help it.

John

January 24th, 2010
2:39 pm

Nice try, Bookman, Race bating again. It’s the only thing you seem interested in writing about.

Let’s try to approach the issue from a standpoint that liberals never want to discuss – basic fairness. here is a difference between something that s fair and something that is guaranteed. Liberals who want the US to move more towards a European model conveniently forget that the ancestors of a majority of US citizens fled Europe precisely because of the European model. In the US, the citizens simply want one thing – that they be given a fair shot. This doesn’t mean everything is guaranteed. It just means to given everyone a fair shot to succeed. However, success is a personal choice. This is the way it’s supposed to be in the US. This is why the US was created.

True, we do need a safety net for the truly needy and unfortunate. But, that system’s been abused and expanded far beyond recognition. If it were up to me, everyone who is unemployed should be required to prove inability to work. Those that can work should be placed in a civil service sector of the military. Simply collecting food stamps and unemployment when you are otherwise able bodied just isn’t fair. And that’s the problem. When something like 20% of the population supports everyone, things are way out of whack. It’s not fair to penalize the wealthy (or the middle class) just because they’re successful. They give a ton on their own anyway. I’ve found these people to be far more generous and charitable than their equal counterparts of your beloved Europe.

TaxPayer

January 24th, 2010
2:39 pm

From his website: “Lt. Governor André Bauer has always supported and will continue to support anti-abortion legislation. He believes every child deserves the chance to explore the world we live in and experience God’s creations.”

Now I’m all confused. Is he for breeding or against it.

larry

January 24th, 2010
2:39 pm

This coming from an official whose state is last in SAT scores in the whole country.Now we know why.

mike

January 24th, 2010
2:40 pm

Jackie –

“If one were to follow Mr. Bauer’s advice, how would the citizens of your state justify the “corrodor of shame?”; the state being one of the poorest in the nation?; Williamsburg County, SC being at or near the top as the poorest county in the nation?”

Yeah. SC needs to be run like Democrats run the areas they control. Like Detroit for instance.

TaxPayer

January 24th, 2010
2:41 pm

Did someone play the race card. I thought we were talking about Andre’s constituency.

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
2:41 pm

Jackie–

Okay, let’s go there. Why are they so poor? In 1860 Adams County Mississippi was the wealthiest in the nation. 150 years later it’s among the very poorest. Where did all that money go? It certainly didn’t go to those who had created it…coulda bought lots of 40 acres and a mule with what Connecticut and sister states absconded with…

mike

January 24th, 2010
2:41 pm

“Now I’m all confused. Is he for breeding or against it.”

I don’t agree with the offensive statements Brauer made above, but it seems to me that he thinks that “breeding” should be done with the expectation that the “breeders” are going to take care of their children.

mike

January 24th, 2010
2:43 pm

“Did someone play the race card. I thought we were talking about Andre’s constituency.”

Oh the thrust of this argument is racial in nature. Jay wouldn’t find comments about white folks “offensive”.

I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm!

January 24th, 2010
2:44 pm

Yet if you look around the world, the opposite is true. Poverty levels are highest in those societies that make little attempt to address it, and lowest in those that offer some form of safety net.

Poverty level for a family of two, Bookman’s hypothetical woman and child, is $14,570.

http://aspe.hhs.gov/poverty/09poverty.shtml

In France it is $13,080.

Raise your hand if you’d like to raise a child on $13,080 per year.

In France the per capita median income is $37,200.

In the United States it is $47,000 just sayin….

It’s all about what you want for yourself and the opportunity to get it.

(Stupid statement by the lt gov, duh.)

RGB

January 24th, 2010
2:44 pm

mike,

I agree with you. If the president-messiah I supported produced a real unemployment rate of 18% and planned on quadrupling U.S. debt in just 10 years, I’d hunt down an obscure candidate for Lt. governor in a state that is way outside of my circulation area and make him the issue.

We are not distracted. And we are not impressed.

ornery

January 24th, 2010
2:45 pm

How can we get Lt. Brauer to take care of things here in Georgia. He has hit the nail on the head. It is cruel and vicious, but it is the way it is. We need more logic, and not the feel good compassion streak tjat want us to save a constant problem such as Haiti. Fix the problem not apply a bandaid.

Daniesza

January 24th, 2010
2:46 pm

Ironically enuff Bauer’s mind set cuts their capitalist nose to spite their face.
Do away with poverty and what part of the population would be left to exploit?
Keep them in numbers and you’ve got a breeding ground for capitalist fodder.
But, history is not the problem, human reliance on an economic system that perpetuates
the concentration of power (read land, capital..) and considers human resource as second to it is
the crux of the matter.
And though I’d like to believe a semblance of sanity might reflect our next economic phase, history tells us that we might have to see yet another one based on haves and have nots.
Namaste

Exitus acta probat

January 24th, 2010
2:50 pm

@john…are you part of the 20% that supports us?

@SC cititzen…Mr. Bauer cam from a broken home? Well that settles it…If he can make it everyone can…I will let the poor children know this immediatly….

Elle

January 24th, 2010
2:55 pm

“My grandmother was not a highly educated woman, but she told me as a small child to quit feeding stray animals. You know why? Because they breed!
_________________________________________

You know his grandmother must know my grandparents and parents. At my house, you got a whipping if you brought home another mouth to feed…….be it animal or human. We even had relatives with a lot of children and they weren’t allowed to visit either because they ate too much of our food.

If your pet doesn’t have a job, they can’t stay at your house because everyone must be self-sufficient. I’m going to wake my cat up to ask her if she’s found a job yet (LOL).

roger

January 24th, 2010
2:56 pm

Nice spelling Highschool dropout…The name is R O G E R…not Rodger. Thanks for expressing your ignorance.

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
2:56 pm

Roger–
For Pete’s sake…if I got into a snit every time somebody spelled my name…!

I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm!

January 24th, 2010
2:58 pm

“The Obama administration soon may guarantee as much as $18.5 billion in loans to build new nuclear reactors to generate electricity, and Congress is considering whether to add billions more to support an expansion of nuclear power.”McClatchy.

Going nuke to create jobs.

I’m sure Andre Bauer will mention that in his next speech, getalife, pointing out how government handouts create a lazy, dependent corporate class, etc.

Excellent case in point about the mindless waste that is government bureaucracy.

Anybody want to take a guess as to how much nuclear regulations, the utter total waste of burning coal, the soaring cost of natural gas used for energy production and the needless deaths suffered from smog have cost We The People of the United States?

Does anybody even have a calculator that will go that high?

And now the Great Monolith wants to subsidize nuclear energy?!?

Something they should have done forty years ago?

RW-(the original)

January 24th, 2010
2:58 pm

McMaster has been steadily gaining on, and last I saw had overtaken, Bauer as the front runner so maybe Bauer decided to go for the insanity coalition.

Isn’t there anything more interesting in the news than a South Carolina gubernatorial primary that’s five months away?

Jay

January 24th, 2010
2:59 pm

Mike and John have suggested that I have somehow made this into a racial issue and even indulged in race-baiting by posting this. It’s an interesting claim, given that I made no reference or inference whatsoever regarding race. Nor did Bauer.

It is even more interesting given that 58 percent of South Carolina schoolchildren participate in the free or reduced-price lunch program, but only 28 percent of the state is black. It would seem that a very large number of those in the school-lunch program are poor white citizens of South Carolina.

If Mike and John believe this is somehow about race rather than about poverty, it says more about the mindset they bring to this discussion than about anything written here or implied here.

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
3:02 pm

RW

“…so maybe Bauer decided to go for the insanity coalition.”

“South Carolina..too small for a republic…too large for an insane asylum.”
–James Pettigru, 1860

Southern Comfort

January 24th, 2010
3:04 pm

Geez, an hour and roger still didn’t address “quality”. I take that to mean that he realizes there is a difference in the quality of food available in the “hood” vs. well-to-do areas. Good. Now that we know there’s a problem, let’s find a solution…

Jackie @ 2:12

Thanks for that follow thru. I’m always tickled at how people always know the problems of others without walking a day in their shoes.

I don’t know how the ilk or race card got played, but they so often do here. This isn’t about race. It’s about class, and how we’ve divided ourselves in our society.

josef nix

January 24th, 2010
3:05 pm

JAY–
Thanks for making that point. And thanks for the stats…

Thogwummpy

January 24th, 2010
3:06 pm

Well, I can quote a whole slew of early 20th Century Progressives (liberals) who thought the best way to eliminate poverty was to eliminate poor people. Yeah, the same folks that touted eugenics (which led to the Holocaust). Until I actually see Americans starving to death, this column was more hysterical nonsense from a devout Lefty.

getalife

January 24th, 2010
3:09 pm

“insanity coalition.”

The tea party?

getalife

January 24th, 2010
3:10 pm

Exitus acta probat

January 24th, 2010
3:15 pm

Go Jets….

Go Saints….