Breach between Israel, White House a bit more public
The breach between the Israeli government and the Obama administration becomes a little more public:
from the Israeli daily Haaretz:
“The White House responded angrily Tuesday to Israel’s plan to build 900 new housing units beyond the Green Line in Jerusalem, despite specific objections from the U.S., saying that “we are dismayed.”
In a statement, White House spokesman Robert Gibbs voiced the U.S.’s disappointment with “the Jerusalem Planning Committee’s decision to move forward on the approval process for the expansion of Gilo in Jerusalem.”
The Jerusalem municipal planning committee approved the construction plan Tuesday despite an expose in Israel’s Yedioth Aharonot newspaper earlier in the day revealing that the U.S. has specifically objected to the construction outlined in the plan.
“Ata time when we are working to relaunch negotiations,” the White House spokesman went on to say, “these actions make it more difficult for our efforts to succeed. Neither party should engage in efforts or take actions that could unilaterally pre-empt, or appear to pre-empt, negotiations.”
“The U.S. also objects to other Israeli practices in Jerusalem related to housing, including the continuing pattern of evictions and demolitions of Palestinian homes,” the statement continued.”
I’m afraid the current Israeli government overestimates the durability of its political support here in the United States, even among many Jewish Americans. It is behaving as though it can ignore American requests without consequence, and in the long run I don’t think that’s true. Israel is certainly a sovereign country; it has every right to make its own decisions. However, the same is true of the United States, which supplies substantial financial, military and diplomatic support to Israel that it can adjust as its national interests dictate.
The almost monolithic support for Israel in Congress is not reflected among the American people as a whole. In addition, the acts of Palestinian terrorism that once provided political cover and justification for Israel’s settlement expansion have largely ceased, in large part because of Israeli military success. Under these conditions, continued expansion makes Israel look like the party that is refusing to negotiate in good faith.
The British government has responded in a similar fashion, reports AFP:
LONDON — Government condemned Tuesday Israel’s green light for hundreds of new housing units to be built in annexed east Jerusalem, saying it made a peace deal more difficult.
Foreign Secretary David Miliband “has been very clear that a credible deal involves Jerusalem as a shared capital,” said a spokeswoman, after Israel’s interior ministry approved the construction of 900 new units in Gilo.
“Expanding settlements on occupied land in East Jerusalem makes that deal much harder. So this decision is wrong and we oppose it,” added the Foreign Office spokeswoman.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
484 comments Add your comment
Jimmy Carter
November 17th, 2009
3:53 pm
Barack Hussein Obama
Israel
Barack HUSSEIN Obama
Israel
A breach?
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
3:59 pm
Bosch
**Vouchers divert critical dollars and commitment from public schools**
Public schools are failing ALL the children. Can’t we just save the more promising? It’s not like anyone is trying to save any of them. A few is much better than none.
**Vouchers eliminate public accountability**
That would be testing. Most good private schools are much more academically sound than the horrible public school system. And again, we are not taking kids from Mountain Park High School. The scores of the ghetto schools are horrible.
**Vouchers leave behind many students, including those with the greatest needs—**
So they all have to stay behind? What kind of logic is that?
*Vouchers waste taxpayer money**
Giving the more gifted students a better education is wasting money? I couldn’t think of a better investment.
**Vouchers give choices to private schools, not parents—**
THis section just says that the private schools get to decide whether they will accept vouchers. that’s OK. Find a good school that does. there are plenty of them.
**Vouchers remain publicly unpopular**
Well that settles it. Keep em ignorant and pregnant. Those poll buses will be by every two years. Be sure to vote!!!
ROLLERGIRL
November 17th, 2009
4:00 pm
Why would Jews have ever thought HUSSEIN the muslim kenyan would be on their side?
Jerusalem is Israel’s capital, it’s their land, palestine doesn’t exist anymore than the cherokee and mohawk nations exist. Land won in war becomes Yours not the vanquished.
Obama is such a stumbling bumbling fool in everything he touches, that only Jimmy carter is smiling. He won’t have to be considered the nations sh*ttiest president ever, for much longer.
josef nix
November 17th, 2009
4:01 pm
Mark my words. This is but prelude to letting Israel off the leash to do our dirty work in Iran. Get in all the “distancing” from Israel possible and, then bash the h*ll out of them following the raid on the Qom facility, but it will be put out of commission.
ROLLERGIRL
November 17th, 2009
4:03 pm
BTW most so-called “palestinians” are muslim, and as we all know, typical muslims like nidal hasan, revere mohammed, and we all know mohammed was a pedophile..yep..sex with 9 year olds…sick cult ..Islam is bad, mmm kay?
MMM MMMM MMMMM barack hussein obama
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:05 pm
@ROLLERGIRL
You have a situation where verborrhea fits your rants precisely. Look it up and enjoy.
Jerusalem does not belong to Israel.
The only way he will be consider the nation’s “sh*ttiest president ever” is no one call you out for your stupidity.
Mrs. Godzilla
November 17th, 2009
4:06 pm
so called palestinians??????
ROLLERGIRL
November 17th, 2009
4:07 pm
Ah..input from one of the west end mosque attendees..you know, mohammed’s house of chicken and waffles.
stands for decibels
November 17th, 2009
4:07 pm
Jay, sometimes I wonder why you bother leaving the comments open on any Israel-themed post; it is, if such a thing is possible, a more reliable draw for The Stupids than a Birther thread.
That said, I do wonder if you have any polling data to back up this statement:
The almost monolithic support for Israel in Congress is not reflected among the American people as a whole.
I suspect you may be correct, but I’d be curious to see what you base this on.
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:07 pm
@ROLLERGIRL
Too bad you had not posted another of your misstatements before I posted.
More than 40% of the Palestinians are Christians. The cities of Bethlehem, Ramallah, Jenin to name a few, are considered Christian cities.
By the way, the Palestinians are one of the most highly educated groups in the Middle East. Too bad you did not have a means of getting your basic education in Palestine.
Mrs. Godzilla
November 17th, 2009
4:08 pm
’bout time we let Israel know our support for them is not limitless.
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
4:08 pm
Bosch
**It is simply a study on the effects of metropolitan areas on minority school children. There is no conclusive evidence in the study to support that vouchers will address the problem.**
I was framing the problem with the harvard study. Government-ran metropolitan schools are failing students. It didn’t give a solution.
And yes, Black parents that have been able to see their children attend great schools where they were not afraid of being killed or maimed every day, while their grades improved and they were, for once. being told that they could achieve the American dream are huge advocates for vouchers. So why would you not want to listen to them?
i read the article you posted and addressed every single point. If that is your argument against school vouchers, I would rather listen to the parents of the children that are benefitting.
Vouchers aren’t perfect, but a good school means everything. Why would you not want poor kids to get a chance at a good education?
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:11 pm
@ROLLERGIRL
Not an attendee of any mosque, just someone that notice how whack you are!
ROLLERGIRL
November 17th, 2009
4:13 pm
ME: most so-called “palestinians” are muslim
allah gal X: More than 40% of the Palestinians are Christians
Webster: most; adj… in the greatest quantity, amount, measure, degree, or number
60% is more than 40%, and the 40% are powerless because of the 60% pedophile worshippers and their penchant for blowing up those that say screw you to their revered pedophile mohammed
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:13 pm
NIF,
Left you some comments downstairs
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:14 pm
@ROLLERGIRL
How would you know about the mosque in the West End?
Is that part of your “stroll?”
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
4:14 pm
Jay
**continued expansion makes Israel look like the party that is refusing to negotiate in good faith.**
How many years did they negotiate in good faith? Did they achieve any concessions, or better yet, did they enjoy any type of peace from the suicide attacks and the rocket attacks?
it’s a two way street. Until I see concessions from Palestine and a cease of attacks on Israeli citizens, I support Israel completely.
Mrs. Godzilla
November 17th, 2009
4:16 pm
off topic
c street house of the “family” just had its tax exempt status pulled
Taxpayer
November 17th, 2009
4:16 pm
I can follow redneck convert’s parody but Rollergirl is like the mystery meat in those weird meals that they served up in the school cafeteria back in the day — you want to know but you don’t want to know and another option would be even better. Then again, maybe they still serve it up.
Del
November 17th, 2009
4:18 pm
Does anyone remember those video clips showing the Palestinians cheering in the streets just after 9-11. They aren’t our friends and never have nor will they ever be. Just another failure in Obama’s foreign relations policy or lack thereof.
ROLLERGIRL
November 17th, 2009
4:18 pm
Jackie, simple..sometimes one has to drive thru the ghetto..the mosque/temple to terrorism and pedophilia… is a red brick building next to what may have been the original huddle house , and some store that sells socks 20 pairs for 6 bucks..I guess they need a lot of socks in the ghetto.
pat
November 17th, 2009
4:18 pm
I frequently wonder why Jews tend to be yellow dog democrats when so many non- jewish democrat are so openly antisemetic?
If we want to sever ties with Israel we will have to sever ties Saudi Arabia, UAE, Jordan, etc. first. Israel is our eyes, ears and more importantly guns in that region. Israel has carte blanc and they know it. Further, they knew obama is against them, so they are testing him.
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:19 pm
@NIF
You indicate that your support Israel until the Palestinians make “concessions.”
Would you care to elaborate on your list of concessions?
Taxpayer
November 17th, 2009
4:19 pm
Cut Isreal loose and let them sink or swim on their own if they cannot accept the terms that we impose in exchange for our help. Their choice.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:20 pm
NIF,
No, you did not address every point in that article – and the ones you did are your opinion, not fact.
I want all kids to get a good education, poor, rich, white, black, purple – and I do not think private schools are the panacea to this problem. We should invest to fix the schools we have – the ones who help all children, not just the ones who can get into and afford private schools.
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:20 pm
@ROLLERGIRL
They probably do need lots of socks in the ghetto. Let’s just hope that when you “stroll” through, you don’t spout this vile screed to someone; you may get to wear of pair of those socks on your hip.
Taxpayer
November 17th, 2009
4:21 pm
c street house of the “family” just had its tax exempt status pulled
Well, it’s a good start.
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
4:22 pm
Bosch
**Left you some comments downstairs**
I know. I addressed those points here. I addressed every single point that your one link made.
I’m completely amazed at your last comment: “but this, in no uncertain terms proves that Democrats are somehow keeping black kids from a good education. ”
According to the parents of the Black children that have benefitted from vouchers, you are wrong. I still don’t see any sort of valid point that would discredit the idea of vouchers. You are simply saying that the status quo is good enough. I disagree.
josef nix
November 17th, 2009
4:22 pm
Palestinian Christians have left Palestine in such massive numbers that they now no longer constitute a majority of any Palestinian city including Bethlehem, Their number is placed at between 50-100,000 in areas designated to form the Palestinian state, this is 1-3% of the population. The Palestinian Christian population of the State of Israel is estimated between 150 and 200,000 or 2-3% of the total population, roughly the percentage of Jews in the United States.
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:22 pm
@Del
I don’t remember, neither do I think that you do.
Common Sense
November 17th, 2009
4:22 pm
The day we abandon Israel is the day God abandon’s us ………. if He hasn’t already.
P.S. He’s a closet Muslim
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:24 pm
@josef nix
You do believe the West Bank has become a area much like that of apartheid South Africa?
AmVet
November 17th, 2009
4:24 pm
pat, it is indeed a quandry isn’t it?
Why American Jews overwhelmingly vote against Republicans.
And at the risk of sounding like the new but not at all improved, and once banned Vandy Girl, one can’t even use the same argument as they apply to all those lazy and shiftless blacks, who are ostensibly too stupid to know better…
But I loved to hear the thoughts of some of the so-called conservatives here explaining this…
pat
November 17th, 2009
4:25 pm
NIF, every time Israel negotiated in good faith, they suffered a rash of suidcide bombings….I think they are over the “good faith” thing.
All the palestinians have to do is renounce terror and recognize Israel’s right to exist. The negotiations have been made, that is all they have to do to solve this problem. The resolve of their hate is so strong that they will impoverish thier own people and put them in harms way rather than have peace. They hate Jews so much, that they will not even recognize thier right to exist. On the flip side, they are so pathetically inept at war that all they are capable of is skirmishes and openly targeting innocent men, women and children. It’s hard to feel bad for somebody who puts themselves in a bad position and refuses to get out. They have a choice, they have chosen to call for the destruction of Israel rather than peace.
Del
November 17th, 2009
4:25 pm
Jackie,
Well I would think you were more than just a gleam in your daddy’s eye during 9-11. Yeah…I do remember.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:25 pm
NIF,
No, you didn’t address all the points, and again you are presenting your opinion, not facts – not even valid conclusions.
Of course you don’t see a valid point to the opposition of school vouchers because you think education in this country should be privatized, am I right?
“According to the parents of the Black children that have benefitted from vouchers, you are wrong.”
I’m not disputing that school vouchers have helped some children, but as a general rule, I feel it is wrong for this country to put tax payer money into privatizing education. It’s not the right solution in my opinion.
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:26 pm
@NIF
Where did you get your numbers to validate that black parents believe vouchers are best for education of children. What benefit does a voucher offer?
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:28 pm
@Del
Not an answer, nor have you presented any facts about my daddy’s eye.
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
4:30 pm
@pat
The Palestinians have renounced violence and have publicly stated they believe in Israel’s right to exists.
Even Yasser Arafat committed to Rabin before he was killed by a Jewish extremist.
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
4:31 pm
Bosch
**We should invest to fix the schools we have – the ones who help all children, not just the ones who can get into and afford private schools.**
When we start investing in those schools, I’ll be right there with you. But we are not. So why punish yet another generation while we wait?
**No, you did not address every point in that article – and the ones you did are your opinion, not fact.**
What facts would you like? You present a very biased form from the National School Board Association, and I present articles from Harvard, The Washington Times, CNN and a Wisconsin newspaper, but you completely discount that.
And you wonder why most conservatives won’t give in to your demands for proof of every single thing we say.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:31 pm
NIF,
These are the issues you failed to address:
No academic advantage in publicly‐funded voucher programs
A 2001 GAO report to Congress confirmed that the official, state‐mandated and state‐funded evaluations of the Milwaukee and Cleveland voucher programs “found little or no difference in voucher and public school students’ performance.”i The same report also cast doubt on the validity of research that claimed positive academic benefits from vouchers, noting that the studies of Milwaukee and Cleveland by pro‐voucher researchers Jay Greene and Paul Peterson contained flaws so significant that GAO could not include the results.
Kim Metcalf, the state‐contracted researcher for the Cleveland program, found that students who attended private schools that were established to take advantage of the voucher program (fulfilling the free market theory that new schools will emerge to meet demand) were outperformed academically by their public school peers in all academic subjects.ii
Meanwhile, a Congressionally‐mandated evaluation of the federally‐funded Washington, D.C. voucher program has twice found no statistically significant differences in academic achievement between voucher students and their public school peers.iii
Pro‐voucher research on privately‐funded voucher programs debunked
With research on taxpayer‐funded voucher programs unhelpful to their cause, voucher advocates have also funded research into privately‐funded voucher programs seeking evidence to support their claims. And despite trumpeting findings from research into programs in New York City and Dayton (Ohio) the pro‐voucher claims unraveled under scrutiny. For example, the aforementioned Peterson promoted academic gains for African‐American students in the New York City program during the 2000 presidential campaign, only to see the policy research company that gathered and analyzed the data call those claims “premature.”iv That was followed by Princeton University researchers who reanalyzed the data and concluded that the so‐called gains for voucher students were statistically insignificant and the previous claims could be substantiated only by excluding achievement results of 44 percent of the students in the experiment.v Meanwhile, the Dayton portion of the Peterson study ended after two years because too few voucher students remained in the private schools for any data to be statistically relevant.vi
National studies undermine claims of private schools’ superiority
Three separate studies in recent years have turned conventional wisdom on its head regarding the long‐held assumption that private schools are “better” than public schools. University of Illinois researchers found that when factoring in demographic and socioeconomic status, public school students at every income level outperformed private school students on the 4th grade and 8th grade math exams for the 2000 National Assessment of Educational Progress.vii A U.S. Department of Education study released in 2006 also found that after controlling for socioeconomic and demographic differences, public school students performed about evenly with private school students on the 2003 NAEP exam. Specifically, public school students outperformed private school pupils by a statistically significant margin on 4th grade math, were outperformed by private school pupils by a statistically significant margin on 8th grade reading, and performed about equally to private school students on 4th grade reading and 8th grade math.viii One year later, a study for the Center on Education Policy examined a nationally representative sample of low‐income students attending urban high schools, and, after controlling for socioeconomic and parental involvement factors, found that public school students performed at the same academic level as private school students, were as likely to attend college, to be satisfied in their jobs and to be as civic‐minded in their 20s.
Common Sense
November 17th, 2009
4:31 pm
To Pat:
Exactly !!!
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
4:33 pm
Jackie
I posted four different articles downstairs, three of them addressing vouchers and the other addressing the horrible conditions in our metropolitan schools. I had to repost them as four different posts so they would post, so please forgive me for not wanting to repeat that.
jt
November 17th, 2009
4:34 pm
ROLLERGIRL-
Do you prefer pivot, blocking, or jamming?
Do players routinely switch positions?
Are you pictured on the Atlanta RollerGirls homepage?
When is your next Derby?
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:34 pm
NIF,
Again, the study from Harvard did not conclude that school vouchers are the solution to the problem of minority children in metropolitan areas – which the study was about.
Again, you are trying to force their conclusion to meet your own.
The other articles were simply pro voucher articles – nothing – nothing on an analysis of the program.
Common Sense
November 17th, 2009
4:34 pm
To Bosch:
Why did the president put his kids in private school ? If you say “for security” it’s bogus. The Secret Service can secure any school.
ROLLERGIRL
November 17th, 2009
4:34 pm
One senior government official said that Netanyahu was “willing to show the greatest possible restraint concerning building in the territories, and has even received praise for that restraint. But that is in the West Bank.
Gilo is in Jerusalem, and that is the capital.”
Netanyahu is an ace at the political game..B. Hussein is in over his head. From bowing to inferiors like the emperor of japan (inferior national status, not inferior to obama himself..obama commands no respect ..the country does) to being punked by Bart Stupak on abortion thus setting up a huge fight within his own party, to the glowing piece in Der Spiegel “obama lied to europe” , this calligulan kenyan is going down in flames.
Jimmy Carter
November 17th, 2009
4:35 pm
stands for decibels
November 17th, 2009
4:07 pm
You say it’s a “draw for The Stupids” yet here you are, posting you little heart out. Coincidence?
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:35 pm
NIF,
“What facts would you like?”
Any. Any at all.
Bud Wiser
November 17th, 2009
4:37 pm
To say there is a ‘breach’ between Obowo and Israel is a racist remark against Obowo. Any criticism against our stooping figurehead is racist.
Jimmy Carter said so, so it must be so.
I sit here listening to the staggering numbers coming from Hank Greenberg, former CEO of AIG, about how AIG is getting away with stealing billions from the taxpayers when we ’saved’ them (because they were too big to fail, dontcha know), and I wonder how so many from the Bush and Obowo administrations are not on the way to filling up that empty Illinois prison before the terrorists get there.
Oh wait.
That means Obowo would have to investigate his own administration for corruption, since they tossed the most money at AIG. Odds on that one?
Snowballs shall freeze in Hell before this corrupt group of criminals in Washington shine a light on their own power grubbing activities.
But….thank God there are a few, mostly at Fox, that show how deep and wide it is, and it is just not Democrats either for you moonbats who just fainted.
Impeach the idiot, before he destroys anything else.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:37 pm
Common Sense,
It’s quite rude to ask a question and then tell the person you asked that if I respond a certain way, it’s bogus. You’ve already reached your conclusion, so why bother?
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
4:37 pm
Bosch
You posted a report from the US government about an program that allows private schools to directly compete with US government schools.
Again, I will listen to the parents of the students that participated. I don’t care about the public schools any more than the Dixiecrats who have ruined them.
Bud Wiser
November 17th, 2009
4:38 pm
Lou Dobbs got tired of vomiting in his own shoes for staying at CNN too long.
Mrs. Godzilla
November 17th, 2009
4:39 pm
Please support Mike Stark and Credo’s call for action against the Stupak Amendment
http://crooksandliars.com/john-amato/please-support-mike-stark-and-credos-ca
Yo'momma Obama
November 17th, 2009
4:40 pm
Oy Veyhh!!! You limp wristed liberal talk amongst youselves…..Me and my friend Rabbi Smirnoff “Rambo”-stein will gladley take your guns and waste every “sand flea” that surrounds us and do your job for you. A little “thank you” is all we ask!
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:40 pm
NIF,
Again, your opinion, not fact. Those studies are listed above – do some research and check out their validity. I plan to.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:41 pm
NIF,
“Isn’t that what you said?”
No, it’s not. I asked you to support your claims with facts.
Lloyd Braun
November 17th, 2009
4:41 pm
Enter your comments here
Taxpayer
November 17th, 2009
4:42 pm
Bosch,
You may wish to consult with Mrs. G on the hazards present during meltdowns. Then again, perhaps NIF has deceived me up ’til now. I shall observe.
Lloyd Braun
November 17th, 2009
4:42 pm
Enter your vomits here
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
4:42 pm
Bosch
**Again, the study from Harvard did not conclude that school vouchers are the solution to the problem of minority children in metropolitan areas – which the study was about.**
And yet again. That was to frame the debate. That was to support my claim that metropolitan schools, which are almost all ran by Dixiecrats are letting inner city kids down. That’s twice I have explained that to you. and please address the other THREE articles I posted.
josef nix
November 17th, 2009
4:42 pm
Jackie–
I would not draw too close a parallel between the situation on the West Bank and apartheid. There are elements which do have a lot in common. The Palestinians are more of a pawn in the international scheme of things with no friends to be found anywhere. Under apartheid the disenfranchised did have vocal support from outside. Secondly, apartheid played divisis et impera with the non white population, creating distinct policies toward the Indians, Coloureds, and Bantu. The Palestinian population is ethno-homogenous, with small minorities of non Arab, non-Muslims.Finally, Israel is committed to self government for the Palestinians, the devil being in the details.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:43 pm
NIF,
Are you under the impression that explaining things to someone is a debating style? If you are explaining your argument, then that’s one thing – that is usually based upon facts. Otherwise you are explaining your opinion which is not a debate – it’s simply one opinion against another.
Bud Wiser
November 17th, 2009
4:44 pm
Obama Appoints two ‘Devout Muslims’ to homeland security posts.
Doesn’t this make you feel safer already?
Obama and Janet Napolitano appoint Arif Alikhan, a devout Muslim as Assistant Secretary for Policy Development Source announcement: Homeland Security Press Room.
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2009/06/obama-appointment-arif-ali-khan-asst-secretary-dhs.html
The American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee (ADC) is proud to announce that the DHS Secretary Janet Napolitano swore-in Kareem Shora, a devout Muslim, who was born in Damascus, Syria as ADC National Executive Director as a member of the Homeland Security Advisory Council (HSAC). http://www.adc.org/
Common Sense
November 17th, 2009
4:46 pm
Bosch:
Because securing a private school (which is probably on a much larger campus with more buildings) is probably as or more difficult than a public school building.
The real reason is what those in power often do. What’s good for you and your kids is not good for theirs.
It’s the same reason Congress exempted themselves from the Civil Rights Act and many others they have passed. It’s the same reason they have “their” health plan but they have another one for us.
Taxpayer
November 17th, 2009
4:46 pm
Nope, no deception. Bosch rules.
Nothing Is Free
November 17th, 2009
4:47 pm
Bosch
Please show a single FACT that you have presented that prove that school vouchers are a bad idea. I am reading a lot of biased opinions by others, but no facts coming from your side.
You hide behind this “fact” nonsense in every single debate you enter. You are constantly demanding facts on programs and ideas, but you prove your point by listing links to biased sources that offer no facts, but opinions.
Now please, cut and paste that first sentence in the last para.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:47 pm
NIF,
“That was to support my claim that metropolitan schools, which are almost all ran by Dixiecrats are letting inner city kids down. That’s twice I have explained that to you. and please address the other THREE articles I posted.”
But it doesn’t support your claim. No where in the study does it address anything other than the fact that metropolitan children are not succeeding in school. You can not force a conclusion to fit your own.
You can not use the conclusion of a study to correlation your own hypothesis. You can use the studies findings as a back ground to another study, but that particular study would have to be based on something other than your own opinion.
I DID address the other three articles – they are simply pro voucher articles. That’s it. No study, no analysis, no conclusion.
Mark Levine
November 17th, 2009
4:48 pm
The Jews rolling over the the homes and land of the Palestinians reminds one of the Nazis rolling through Poland.
Oh the irony!
The US’s support of Israel has long grown weary. Although no politicians or the NYTimes won’t talk about it, ardent support of Israel was a contributing cause to 9/11.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:48 pm
NIF,
One more thing:
I could post three anti-voucher articles – it would not support my theory that vouchers are a bad thing. Just because you found three articles supporting the voucher program does not make it a good program.
ROLLERGIRL
November 17th, 2009
4:49 pm
@JT,
I am a jammer which my team determins in a pre-season skate-off. Faster , smaller skaters make the best jammers..we distinguish ourselves with helmet covers. You can change positions between jams if you want but you have to change helmets.
I am on the website, happy to say:) And hopefully will be featured in a upcoming segment on Women flat track derby on the tv show ‘whacked out sports’ on the VS cable channel..I will post info when they let me know.
March is the start of the 2010 season but I will post more info on upcoming exhibitions.
Common Sense
November 17th, 2009
4:49 pm
To Nothing is Free:
You really “can’t” debate with a liberal …………… they start “screaching” !
Just go back and forth a few times with them (opinion or facts – it doesn’t matter), have a little fun and then move on.
@@
November 17th, 2009
4:50 pm
I wouldn’t invest too much political capital on this, jay. It’s a geopolitical game of who’s gonna blink first.
Israel, Iran, Russia or the U.S., in that order. Following it at Stratfor.
It’s fascinating….like watching a waltz in slo-o-o-o-w m-o-o-o-tion
pat
November 17th, 2009
4:50 pm
@Jackie…LOL! Jewish extremists killed Yasser the terrorist Arafat? Ok, that was rich….
Del
November 17th, 2009
4:52 pm
Jackie,
I just asked if anyone remembered the Palestinians cheering in the streets right after 9-11. I only presumed that you may have been around about that time. The MSM even showed the video clips back then. I can remember and I’m sure many others on this blog can remember as well. BTW…the Palestinians have not recognized Israel’s right to exist. Israel isn’t “lilly white”, I remember the USS Liberty, so that should tell you something. We cannot, however, write Israel off. We need them as much as they need us.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:52 pm
NIF,
I believe it was you who is insisting that the voucher system is the panacea to all the education woes and that Democrats are ruining the chances of black children’s chances to suceed.
It’s not up to me to prove your point – it is up to me to show you contrary evidence to support my point. I am under no delusion that my point is the absolute correct one. All studies are biased – it’s the ones based on the best data that are the most credible and reliable.
Bosch
November 17th, 2009
4:54 pm
Common Sense,
I am not screeching, I am typing. And I feel I have been nothing but civil in this debate. Would you care to point out otherwise?
The family is home and I’m going to spend some time with them. Later folks (maybe)!
DoggoneGA
November 17th, 2009
4:56 pm
“Jewish extremists killed Yasser the terrorist Arafat?”
A Jewish right-wing extremist killed Rabin…which is what Jackie said.
ROLLERGIRL
November 17th, 2009
4:58 pm
A so-called”palestinian” left wing extremist killed Robert Kennedy..I saw the video
Famous last words; “where is that arab waitah with my chowda!”
josef nix
November 17th, 2009
4:58 pm
MARK–
“The Jews rolling over the the homes and land of the Palestinians reminds one of the Nazis rolling through Poland.”
Except for one little detail, the Poles weren’t lobbing missiles into Germany and were not strapping bombs to their children and sending them into Germany markets, weddings, buses, etc.
Secondly, it would behoove you to be more careful with your language. Do you mean “Jews” or “Israelis?”
If you want to draw a parallel, I would suggest the Wall as a better one…there is the irony which should tear at any Jewish soul anywhere in the world…
Taxpayer
November 17th, 2009
4:59 pm
Just go back and forth a few times with them (opinion or facts – it doesn’t matter), have a little fun and then move on.
I already do that with Republicans.
@@
November 17th, 2009
5:01 pm
Bosch isn’t looking for solutions. He’s looking to be on this board, all day, everyday, to “debate” solutions, hoping that none will ever come.
It would be the end of his social life.
That’s my opinion, and I’m sticking to it.
josef nix
November 17th, 2009
5:03 pm
On the school argument: all I have to say is that I’ll put my public school little ones up against anything the private schools can produce. Why? We have homes that care, we have a dedicated and professionally skilled staff, and we have a community of business and civic partners who freely and generously give of their time and resources. If we can do it with our demographics, any place can.
@@
November 17th, 2009
5:06 pm
Another personal opinion. Parents should, at least, be given the opportunity to decide what’s in the best interest of their child’s education. It’s a shame the government doesn’t feel they’re entitled.
Loosing their grip over the people (little and otherwise) is a prospect the government doesn’t want to face.
Pogo
November 17th, 2009
5:10 pm
The Palestinians are not even wanted by their fellow Arabs and have been kicked out of a number of their countries. Why were they kicked out? Because they brought unrest and they brought strife wherever they landed. Now, Obama (and apparently Jay) are asking that Israel just capitulate and hand over whatever land the Palestinians think they need. The Arabs hope that if this happens it will it would spell the end of “Zionist” Israel which they all hate anyway. I mean, in the Arab world, if Palestine is given a homeland next to Israel the next natural step of progression is to eliminate Israel from the face of the earth. There can be no peacful co-existance because the Palestinians do not believe in that, even for and among themselves. I would expect nothing less from the Obama Whitehouse about their position as that Jay stated for them above about Israel. Obama certainly has no connection with the Jews and I think we are coming to know with which group his sympathies lie.
And Jay, I think you under-estimate the degree of support of Israel here in the United States. If you think that Israel is the real threat to the world, I think that you are blind.
And the British, they live in fear of a revolt amongst their fast growing and almost uncontrollable Muslim population. They have appeased, appeased, appeased. I don’t put much faith on their take of circumstances when it comes to Muslim/Jewish relations.
DoggoneGA
November 17th, 2009
5:10 pm
“Parents should, at least, be given the opportunity to decide what’s in the best interest of their child’s education. It’s a shame the government doesn’t feel they’re entitled”
And just exactly why should MY money pay for some kid to go to a private school? If their parents can’t afford it, too bad. They can just send them to the public schools like my parents did with me. I’m alread paying for them to go to public school when I don’t have any kids of my own. What was good enough for me is good enough for anyone.
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm!
November 17th, 2009
5:16 pm
Written like a true Nazi.
@@
November 17th, 2009
5:17 pm
DoggoneIt:
And just exactly why should MY money pay for some kid to go to a private school?
Because the government schools have been in decline for decades. It’s the children’s education that should be foremost in your mind. Not the wasting of your tax dollars and the children’s education.
Think of it as an experiment. Enough people take their money and walk, looking for something better, the government run schools will be forced to get their act together.
BTW, my daughter attended public school. I was involved….didn’t do much good overall. My daughter, in an effort to avoid disruption in the classroom, strived to get into AP classes. She succeeded. The other kids, whose parents weren’t involved, got left behind.
El Jefe
November 17th, 2009
5:18 pm
So, El Presidente won’t meddle in Iranian protest and elections, but Israel is a fair target – damn
I thought the land belonged to the victor – Israel. Screw the palestinians.
Mark Levine
November 17th, 2009
5:20 pm
nix,
you have your chickens and eggs in the wrong order. the jews stole the land before the palestinians started fighting for their freedom and rights. but the jews have kept them down with their craftiness and american financial and military support.
the US should help balance the military and financial scales for the palestinians and then get out of the whole area and mind our own business.
AmVet
November 17th, 2009
5:22 pm
2nd request…
pat, it is indeed a quandary isn’t it?
Why American Jews overwhelmingly vote against Republicans.
And at the risk of sounding like the new but not at all improved, and once banned Vandy Girl, one can’t even use the same argument as they apply to all those lazy and shiftless blacks, who are ostensibly too stupid to know better…
But I loved to hear the thoughts of some of the so-called conservatives here explaining this…
DoggoneGA
November 17th, 2009
5:23 pm
“Enough people take their money and walk, looking for something better, the government run schools will be forced to get their act together.”
yep, that’s the argument. I don’t buy it. Who is going to pay to get those children TO the private schools? Who is going to pay the extra money over and above the school taxes already paid to get them IN a private school? Who is going to buy their uniforms (if needed), their supplies, etc?
And who is going to pay to expand those private schools to absorb all of those children? Private schools don’t have an infinite capacity to take in new students.
And the VAST majority of problems with schools could be solved easily – take ALL funds collected in the state for schools and divide it equally among ALL of the schools. Every school gets exactly the same amount per student as any other school.
josef nix
November 17th, 2009
5:28 pm
Mark–
Let me pose the question: Did not the U-ne-ga steal Georgia from the Tsa-la-gi? Did not the Yankees seize the South in conquest? Did the Anglo not steal Aztlan and forcibly incorporate it into the United States?
“…but the jews have kept them down with their craftiness…” This one phrase tells me an awful lot about your perspective.
josef nix
November 17th, 2009
5:31 pm
AmVet…
“Why American Jews overwhelmingly vote against Republicans.”
Against the Republicans? Why not FOR the Democrats? And why? Well, I think a lot of it goes back to Tevye…”Tradition!”
Jackie
November 17th, 2009
5:31 pm
@pat
My posting said nothing about Jewish extremest killing Yasser Arafat.
I said specifically and directly that a Jewish extremist kill Rabin, who had negotiated a deal with Arafat.
I invite you to go back and read that more carefully, giving you a chance to rethink what you just posted.
Matilda
November 17th, 2009
5:32 pm
an·thro·po·mor·phism (noun) Attribution of human motivation, characteristics, or behavior to inanimate objects, animals, or natural phenomena.
The government “doesn’t feel?” The government “doesn’t want to face?” REALLY? The government is a collective mass of individual humans, some elected, some appointed, most hired to do a specific job for which they are [we hope] qualified, engaged in a legal and administrative structure, the purpose of which is to provide for the collective needs of our nation and communities in ways that we cannot provide for ourselves individually. In this country, almost anyone can become a part of what they so criticize, if they work hard and make some darned sense once in awhile.
Ascribing feelings to “the government” is, at best, a straw man technique used to frighten us to gain some political one-up, ah-ha moment. (Bored now!) At worst, it reflects a complete ignorance of how the structure of our society, and the role of government in it, is supposed to function.
Bottom line: Parents and citizens who care about education get involved in their local schools and school systems, or in the lives of individual children. We are ALL better off when our neighbors’ children receive the education, skills, and motivation they need to become productive.
Picking and choosing which childrens’ futures to care about — dang the others to heck — is astoundingly stupid, IMO. But that’s just my opinion.
AmVet
November 17th, 2009
5:34 pm
josef, I suspect like me you know the real reasons.
I just wanna see if one of the conned has the nads AND the intellectual honesty to step up to the plate on this one.
I have grave doubts any ever will. But we’ll see…
After all, Common Sense proposes liberals don’t know how to debate. (Don’t ask me, I just report the JB blogging news…)
El Jefe
November 17th, 2009
5:34 pm
Mark Levine, you’re all wet – and ignorant of the history.
in the late 19th century the jews started returning to the Holy Land.
They turned a desert into farms working with the native Jordanian and Egyptians living there – Yes, it was part of Trans-Jordan at that time.
In 1948, Israel was born out of a UN partitioned land deal, giving the Jews and the locals their own piece of land.
Israel was okay with their small portion, but the arab states attacked and got their butts kicked – in ‘58, more trouble in Sinai, Israelis won again. In ‘67, more trouble and again Israel beat the snot out of the Arabs. In ‘73 the Egyptians almost won, but Israel was still the winner.
In each case the conquered land by international law was under the control of Israel, including the majority of the Sinai Desert. Israel stopped at the Suez Canal and gave the Egyptians a good sized buffer zone.
Now, tell me how the Israelis have been unfair to the palestinians?
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm!
November 17th, 2009
5:35 pm
The Jews went quietly into the ovens of Nazi Germany because they held out hope that good would overcome evil.
Roosevelt dithered, they died.
I think they learned from their mistakes, so when the new little tard fascist says jump, they say blow me.
Good for them.
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm!
November 17th, 2009
5:39 pm
Taxpayer
November 17th, 2009
4:19 pm
Cut Isreal loose and let them sink or swim on their own if they cannot accept the terms that we impose in exchange for our help. Their choice.
Without America’s implicit guarantee of defense against attack, this would embolden the savages and would leave Israel no other choice but to completely annihilate them, which is well within their capabilities of doing.
I say yes, let’s cut off aid.
Today.