Empty homes a symbol of pain, economic and otherwise
You think you get it. You read the headlines, you follow the economic reports — unemployment above 10 percent in Georgia, foreclosures rising, retail sales stagnant. You also hear the stories of frustration told by friends, neighbors and relatives. So you think you’ve come to grips with just how dramatically things have changed.
Then you see something you hadn’t noticed before, and once again you realize that this transformation is more profound than statistics and headlines can communicate.
Personally, I had grown used to driving down a prosperous in-town street and seeing a dozen for-sale signs in less than a mile. In other parts of town, where the real-estate boom never really took off, it’s been common for months to see several homes on each block with boarded-up doors and windows, foreclosure signs in the front yard disappearing behind high grass and weeds.
But visiting a high-end gated golf community in the northern suburbs of Atlanta this weekend, it was sobering to see the same phenomenon on a different scale — empty house after empty house, proud mansions of brick and stucco with no cars in the driveway, no grills on the back porch, no balls in the yard, no sign of human activity at all.
Abandoned mansions — there’s something about that image that grabs your attention.
Most of the houses were 5,000 square feet at a minimum; many were new enough that they had probably never been occupied. So developers and banks, which in some cases means taxpayers, had been forced to eat the loss. Others, however, had been dream homes to families that had been forced to pack up and leave that dream behind.
According to Zillow.com, the phenomenon is national in scale and growing. Three years ago, high-end housing accounted for just 16 percent of total foreclosures, writes Stan Humphries, chief economist at Zillow. Back then, the problem was concentrated at the cheaper end of the market, which accounted for almost 55 percent of foreclosures. Homes in the middle one-third of home values made up almost 29% of foreclosures.
But by July 2009, the most recent data available, the numbers had become “shocking.”
“Thirty percent of foreclosures are homes in the top tier of local home values,” Humphries writes. “That means that top-tier homes make up almost twice the proportion of foreclosures as they did just three years ago.”
We talk a lot about the economic and political impact of the Great Recession, and for good reason. But it’s the psychological impact on millions of individuals, the fear and humiliation, that is likely to linger from all this.
No, it won’t have the generation-defining impact of the Great Depression. But like the Depression, this recession shows no sign of being temporary. The dislocation and redefining of goals are long term and massive in scale.
At the moment, stories of recession-related suicides and divorce are still just anecdotal; the data collection systems haven’t caught up to reality. But at every economic level, abandoned houses represent abandoned dreams; they symbolize lost security and futures that may never be realized.
In the good times, we as a culture bought easily into the idea that self-worth could be measured by financial worth. The size of your home, the make of your car and the school where you sent your children told the world something important about you. People arranged their lives around that understanding.
That mind set doesn’t disappear easily. Successful people proud to have provided well for themselves and their families suddenly find themselves unable to do so, and the discovery is wrenching. They tell themselves they haven’t changed, the world did, and they’re right. But in their hearts, their perception of themselves and their place in the world has changed forever.
I don’t know — maybe I’m reading too much into it. But it seems to me that empty houses aren’t really empty at all. You can peer into the windows, at the abandoned, darkened rooms, and see things that used to be. And you can see pain and trouble for people to whom economic loss is the least painful loss of all.
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180 comments Add your comment
I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:
October 13th, 2009
8:02 am
Can it be anymore obvious what the libs desire for America, a diminished standard of living, a weakened economy and the end of the dollar’s dominance abroad?
You know, all those things they whined about while Bush was in power and no such conditions existed?
Can you not sense the longing and passionate lust and absolute happiness and sense of upmanship that bookman feels towards the successful, the very people that drive the engine of prosperity, and most of all, buy the product and advertising that allows him to pontificate with such abandon?
Is it not so utterly bizzare?
I Report (-: You Whine )-: O Stands For Zero
October 13th, 2009
8:03 am
Ooops, forgot the new name, busy this morning.
Night Train
October 13th, 2009
8:04 am
I do not feel sorry for anyone who lost their home when they were living well beyond their means. You want to look like a big shot and live in a 5000sq.ft. home and drive a high-end car while making 30k/yr. They earned the fate they received.
TnGelding
October 13th, 2009
8:13 am
I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:
October 13th, 2009
8:02 am
We pretty much picked this apart below. Zero is a hero!
I Report (-: You Whine )-: O Stands For Zero
October 13th, 2009
8:14 am
It would do you libs some good to check the unemployment rate for the young, poor and minorities to see that “trickle down” does actually work.
Your greedy, pathetic war on the prosperity, especially considering the average net worth of the goon politicians waging it, is absolutely hammering those that you profess to want to help.
Unless, of course, you lie.
Peadawg
October 13th, 2009
8:15 am
“I do not feel sorry for anyone who lost their home when they were living well beyond their means. You want to look like a big shot and live in a 5000sq.ft. home and drive a high-end car while making 30k/yr. They earned the fate they received.”
And now they expect Obama to bail them out..
Shawny
October 13th, 2009
8:17 am
ditto what nighttrain said. over extended poor planning on their part does not necessitate a crisis, nor is it reason to extend a bailout.
TnGelding
October 13th, 2009
8:22 am
Night Train
October 13th, 2009
8:04 am
You’ve got a point. The consumer does own some responsibility, but many were duped. We’ve got to do a better job of teaching homec.
Brad Steel
October 13th, 2009
8:23 am
Whiner,
Are you talking about the haters who clapped and rejoiced when the US lost the Olympic bid or the arrogant loudmouths, like yourself, who screech “I HOPE HE FAILS!” Or are you referring to the derision hurled at the president, the EU, and the rest the world about a peace prize? It’s prize for peace for god’s sake. The haters now even hate peace.
Why must you hate so much? Why do you hate America? Why do you spend so much time eagerly wait to show your 1st post hate for Op-Ed columnist?
Now, you can go back to hating.
TnGelding
October 13th, 2009
8:25 am
I Report (-: You Whine )-: O Stands For Zero
October 13th, 2009
8:14 am
Looks like a lot of the tax cuts and unclaimed income trickled into off-shore tax havens. Once the freefall stops, the economy will gush up, like it always does after a Republican greed orgy.
FinnMcCool
October 13th, 2009
8:27 am
So the liberals caused the middle-upper and upper classes to lose everything and those losses trickled down to the poor, minorities, and the young people who are now unemployed?
You are hopeless.
Mrs. Godzilla
October 13th, 2009
8:28 am
Glad to see compassionate conservatism so well represented.
Finn’s right. Hopeless.
Doggone/GA
October 13th, 2009
8:28 am
I have even less sympathy for the real estate speculators who contracted to build those 5000 – 8000 sq. foot homes BEFORE they even HAD a buyer, then couldn’t sell them. The same speculators who priced the average Jane & Joe out of the market, because they weren’t building homes J & J could afford. And I have zero sympathy for the loan companies who lied to persuade J & J they COULD afford a big house on their average level income.
cas
October 13th, 2009
8:30 am
In some cases it may actually be people overextending themselves but for most of those living well within their means to wake up to a loss of their job or business and give up their homes is a symbol of todays pain. More so these were the people supporting our economy by buying things others made or served. You have to wonder how many dollars go unspent and how many other jobs lost are represented by each of those vacant high end homes. And most of them didn’t want an Obama bailout but simply the Obama leadership nowhere to be found..
I Report (-: You Whine )-: O Stands For Zero
October 13th, 2009
8:31 am
The AHIP study also illuminates the other taxes and regulations that will increase insurance costs and weren’t part of the bargain. The 40% excise tax on “Cadillac” health plans—above $8,000 for individuals and $21,000 for families—is structured so that it will ultimately hit the Chevy plans too, much like the alternative minimum tax. Reductions in Medicare payments mean that doctors and hospitals will be forced to raise prices in the private market, which will cause a 1.2% increase in the underlying health costs that drive premiums.-WSJ
This whole rotten scheme is good for no one except for the democrat politicians hell bent on wrecking the US economy.
Enemies of the state, all of them.
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
8:32 am
Whiner is just upholding his namesake, Brad. Nothing more.
FinnMcCool
October 13th, 2009
8:32 am
Look at your 401k’s, folks. That money didn’t disappear. It was swept into the accounts of those who work (or hire those who work, ie hedge funds, etc.) on Wall Street.
This was collective, legal, theft of the middle classes. And when they had bled the middle class dry, they went after the upper class. That’s where we stand now.
Matt Tiabbi at Rolling Stone can explain it much better than I can. Well worth the read.
TnGelding
October 13th, 2009
8:34 am
Jay, don’t you know all those poor folks that took advantage of the CRA just returned to the ghettos?
We needed to become more frugal, but it’s a shame it had to be forced on us. The human toll will be everlasting in many cases. But most will recover, eventually, and be the better and wiser for it.
Mrs. Godzilla
October 13th, 2009
8:35 am
ANdy
AHIP report was a threat. Screw ‘em.
FinnMcCool
October 13th, 2009
8:36 am
Cas is right, those who lived in those homes Jay described were probably fairly high up in management at their companies or ran their own businesses. If their businesses failed or they were laid off then those who worked for them were probably also out too.
Gale
October 13th, 2009
8:40 am
Doggone @8:28, right on the mark. The problem at the high end was less duped consumer than greedy speculators who walked away. They may or may not have been burned. I am sure in their minds, they were burned; they failed to gain the millions they expected.
Scooter
October 13th, 2009
8:40 am
Look at your 401k’s, folks. That money didn’t disappear. It was swept into the accounts of those who work (or hire those who work, ie hedge funds, etc.) on Wall Street.
Thanks Finn, I knew someone got my money!
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
8:41 am
Republican greed orgy.
A Republican creed.
We do it with greenback,
We do it with gold,
We do it to both young and old.
We just do as we’ve always been told.
Do unto others before they do unto you.
hehehe
Normal
October 13th, 2009
8:43 am
Howdy Whiner, your: Can you not sense the longing and passionate lust and absolute happiness and sense of upmanship that bookman feels towards the successful, the very people that drive the engine of prosperity, and most of all, buy the product and advertising that allows him to pontificate with such abandon?
I don’t know Whiner, and it’s probably a chartacter defiecency on
my part, but I have a hard time feeling sorry for a billionaire who have suddenly become a multi-millionaire.
Gale
October 13th, 2009
8:43 am
Enforced frugality is good for us. I’ve gone through several periods of unpleasant belt-tightening. But I think it made me wiser in the long run. I sincerely hope I won’t need another lesson. I never went hungry or homeless and I really don’t want to.
FinnMcCool
October 13th, 2009
8:46 am
And if you don’t think the workers (upper-middle, middle, lower) of this country aren’t getting shafted I have three words for you: Defined Contribution Plan.
Pensions are Defined Benefit Plans. This is a plan in which the benefit on retirement is determined by a set formula, rather than depending on investment returns.
In a Defined Contribution Plan, contributions are paid into an individual account for each member. The contributions are invested, for example in the stock market.
Investment Returns is the kicker here. Before the popularity of Defined Benefit Contribution plans, people knew exactly how much money they would have in retirement to live on. Now, every penny you or your employer puts into the plan is at the mercy of the greedy wall street bankers who can wipe you out in a heartbeat.
And don’t tell me “oh, well it’s the employers money anyway”, no, it’s not. This is what is called Deferred Compensation which is part of your pay package.
Those who were set to retire last year, this year, or over the next 3 years. What in the heck are they supposed to do with a 401k that has just been wiped out?
lovelyliz
October 13th, 2009
8:47 am
Try looking for a “modest” home built in the last 10 years. I a lot of areas where people have to live and work, they don’t exist because builders won’t build them. They concentrated EVERYTHING into mega-mansions and high end condos.
Bosch
October 13th, 2009
8:47 am
“You want to look like a big shot and live in a 5000sq.ft. home and drive a high-end car while making 30k/yr.”
Everything fits so little and tight in the mind of a wingnut. To those who believe such hooey. They have to blame all this on someone, and it is so much easier to blame it on the working poor, just like it is so much easier to blame social problems on the poor poor. Yes, ^^ that is the problem, the only problem – that’s exactly what happened. It had nothing to do with this:
“I have even less sympathy for the real estate speculators who contracted to build those 5000 – 8000 sq. foot homes BEFORE they even HAD a buyer, then couldn’t sell them.”
Oh, no, it couldn’t have because (gasp!) that would be a strike on the (gasp!) free market!
lovelyliz
October 13th, 2009
8:49 am
Well FinnMcCool the neo-cons would tell you to just get a job.
Doggone/GA
October 13th, 2009
8:51 am
“What in the heck are they supposed to do with a 401k that has just been wiped out?”
The same thing you “do” with a “regular” retirement benefit that was wiped out in bankruptcy proceedings…or that just disappeared because the company went under.
Gale
October 13th, 2009
8:51 am
Too true lovely liz. I have been looking for a home less than ten years old and less then 2000 sqft on one floor and there are none to be had, not even if I take on a long commute. My other option is to build and the property within my acceptable commute is very expensive.
Bosch
October 13th, 2009
8:52 am
lovelyliz,
Good point. I wonder if it’s possible to find a house built in the last 10 years that wasn’t in a subdivision called “Wondering Pines” or “Oak River” or “Whispering Willow” or some bs name like that.
Bosch
October 13th, 2009
8:53 am
Gale,
I wouldn’t dream of buying a house that was under 10 years old because it’s made out of sawdust and will disintegrate in the next 10 years.
Scooter
October 13th, 2009
8:54 am
I don’t know Whiner, and it’s probably a chartacter defiecency on
my part, but I have a hard time feeling sorry for a billionaire who have suddenly become a multi-millionaire.
Good morning Normal. You said a mouthful there Brother!
So did you Finn.
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
8:56 am
Why do you think Georgia is number one in bank failures. They freely dumped money into the hands of the developers and their fields of dreams and they accepted those overpriced rows of abandoned homes and promises of more to come as collateral. We’re all paying for those losses via the FDIC and the monies that they must extract from those banks that are still standing. (Of course, that is a very small part of the total price that we are paying but that’s another story.) It’s the Republican way and all the winner needs now is a little sympathy in the form of a tax break. Armey of teabaggers, anyone.
Doggone/GA
October 13th, 2009
8:56 am
“Oh, no, it couldn’t have because (gasp!) that would be a strike on the (gasp!) free market!”
Just think what speculators are missing out on. If they’d go back to building affordable, middle-income housing they’d made a FORTUNE. They might not make such a big profit as they would on a bigger house, but those middle-income houses would SELL. You can’t make a profit if the house just sits there unsold.
godless heathen
October 13th, 2009
8:56 am
In recent years I would drive past huge new home after huge new home and wonder how that many people could afford that many big new houses. Apparently they couldn’t.
Gale
October 13th, 2009
8:57 am
You have a point, Bosch. However, some of the composite building products are better quality than the “real” wood available today. When’s the last time you went looking for a bunch of straight 2×4s ? Slowing down the residential construction industry might bring some standards back into play. The down side of an older home is the remodel potential. Having remodeled my own kitchen, I am not eager to do it again. But I have been spoiled by what I have now, which is not high-end by any streatch.
Fly-On-The-Wall
October 13th, 2009
8:59 am
Unbridled speculation is the scurge of capitalism.
Finn McCool
October 13th, 2009
9:01 am
From Wikipedia:
In a defined contribution plan, investment risk and investment rewards are assumed by each individual/employee/retiree and not by the sponsor/employer. In addition, participants do not necessarily purchase annuities with their savings upon retirement, and bear the risk of outliving their assets.
The “cost” of a defined contribution plan is readily calculated, but the benefit from a defined contribution plan depends upon the account balance at the time an employee is looking to use the assets. So, for this arrangement, the contribution is known but the benefit is unknown.
So…..
Employers have shifted all the risk to the employees. So, everything is hunky dory as long as the stock market is doing well and the average investor is protected by systems put in place to limit legalized theft on Wall Street. Yeah, right. We are screwed from the get-go.
stands for decibels
October 13th, 2009
9:05 am
Don’t really have time to address all broader sociological issues Jay has raised in his worth-the-wait column, but there are two more prosaic issues that came to mind.
By Zillow’s reckoning, what’s really happened here is that the upper tier of homeowners are now officially as well-represented among the foreclosed as the middle and lower tiers, nothing more or less. This comes as little surprise to those of us who’ve been following the trends, although sociologically of course it’s of interest.
However–what did surprise me was this factoid, tucked in at the end of the piece Jay had linked:
At the end of Q209, Zillow estimated 23% of single-family homes are underwater on their mortgages.
If that’s actually right…Holy cow. Wow. Just wow. How can a society that’s thought of itself as being mobile and flexible carry on when so many are saddled with property that can’t be moved without taking what I’m assuming would be a serious loss?
Again–23 percent under water? That it was that high was news to me. Holy cow.
jt
October 13th, 2009
9:06 am
“Empty homes a symbol of pain, economic and otherwise.”
It is Jay,
Thank God, our congress has alleviated the worst of it by TARP funds. Those bankers were really feeling the pain.
Normal
October 13th, 2009
9:07 am
Good morning Scooter, you keeping dry?
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
9:07 am
Doggone/GA
October 13th, 2009
8:51 am
“What in the heck are they supposed to do with a 401k that has just been wiped out?”
The same thing you “do” with a “regular” retirement benefit that was wiped out in bankruptcy proceedings…or that just disappeared because the company went under.
Actually, my retirement benefit is backed by the PBGC. Defined contribution plans have no such protection or guarantees of any standardized form. For example, in hard times, the company simply quits making contributions. Further, if you happened to ‘invest’ your money in stocks or even many bonds, then you likely lost out yet again. Not to worry though, if you put your money in the bank, well, it’s protected up to the new $250,000 limit (until that protection expires and it reverts to $100,000) while it earns nothing, plus or minus whatever.
Bosch
October 13th, 2009
9:08 am
Finn,
“and bear the risk of outliving their assets.”
I would say that is the next big national crisis. We will see more and more elderly homeless people in the next few years because there will be no one to care for them. The elderly require a LOT of care and that care is VERY expensive. The naysayers of health care reform has obviously NO clue about what it takes to care for an elderly person.
danjonglee
October 13th, 2009
9:11 am
I sense a bit of happiness and glee over the 16% real unemployment, forclosures, and misery of fellow Americans………..It can be fixed……but will it….
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:12 am
sfd
I found out that I was underwater last April when I tried to refinance. The value was less than $2k underwater, but my appraised value was about $30k less than what my taxes were assessed at. By the time I received a copy of the appraisal, it was too late to contest my tax assessment. Henry Co. will have to make good next year though. I know they will because Republicans love tax cuts.
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
9:12 am
Again–23 percent under water? That it was that high was news to me. Holy cow.
I saw slightly higher estimates some time back. Maybe it’s a sign that things are getting better.
Normal
October 13th, 2009
9:15 am
“and bear the risk of outliving their assets.”
This too, is one of my fears. Even though my house and cars are paid for, and I work, what savings I have would not last through a medical emergency or other disaster. I am thinking about converting my upstairs bonus room into a studio apartment for the extra income. It would be a risk to drain some savings for the work, but I don’t know what else to do without trying to sell and severely downsize.
Finn McCool
October 13th, 2009
9:16 am
Bosch wrote: We will see more and more elderly homeless people in the next few years because there will be no one to care for them.
Wasn’t one of the nice side effects of the Social Security system the fact that older folks no longer had to live with their kids? So, you no longer had extended families living in one house so you needed at least two housing units: one for the elderly parents and one for the kid’s family. Now you have a housing market! Well, the housing market lasted for a good 60 years anyway.
oh well. Welcome the granparents into your 4th bedroom in the ghost town of a subdivision called “Whispering Woods” (fitting name!), eh?
Gale
October 13th, 2009
9:16 am
Angry Black Man, you are one among many whose tax assessment is higher than the appraised value of the home. Often it has nothing to do with an under-water mortgage. The tax juristiction is simply looking for additional revenue and property taxes are a handy way to do that.
david wayne osedach
October 13th, 2009
9:19 am
It is payback time for all those who took out humungous equity loans and splurged! Oh weren’t they so smart investing in real estate?
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
9:19 am
I know they will because Republicans love tax cuts.
That was sarcasm, right! I know what you were saying between the lines was that Republicans love to take advantage of those voters that are willing to buy in to the lie, right. Whatever it takes to get elected and the end justifies the means. The truly Noble causes that only Republicans are able to see and therefore they must be in power. It’s for our own good.
Kayaker 71
October 13th, 2009
9:21 am
For the first time in quite awhile, I agree with what Bookman is saying. My next door neighbor was a hard working, dedicated business owner whose businesses failed and he had to face bankruptcy. He moved to Greenville, SC, where is selling cars for KIA. His home is empty, his pool is green with weeds growing everywhere in a lawn that used to be pristine. They live with his wife’s sister. I cut the grass in the front yard to make it look like someone lives there. It goes up for auction on Thursday on the court house steps in Macon.
This is an upscale community on a large lake west of town. If it can happen here, it can happen anywhere.
Finn McCool
October 13th, 2009
9:22 am
If you think your house/property is being taxed too high it’s worth a trip to the Tax Assessors Office to give them details as to why you think it is too high. It’s not that hard to make a case and it could save you some money.
I’ll post the Gwinnett Tax Assessor site as an example:
http://www.gwinnettcounty.com/cgi-bin/gwincty/egov/ep/gcbrowse.do?channelId=-43980&pageTypeId=536880236
joe matarotz
October 13th, 2009
9:22 am
You can thank Gramm-Leach-Bliley for streamlining the fall of our economy. That single piece of legislation threw open the door for such financial scalpels as interest only mortgages. I will believe that Jimmy Carter Jr. is serious about the future of our country when he spearheads the effort to get that bill overturned. So far – nothing.
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:24 am
Gale
As long as I’ve had my house, the appraised value was close to what the taxes were assessed at. Even when the housing meltdown started, we were lucky in my area. There was only one foreclosed house in my subdivision. What started to hurt my value is when those speculative houses started going into foreclosure. There’s at least 10 unfinished or unstarted subdivisions within a 3 mile drive from my house. I know it’s a way to get additional revenue without breaking a sweat. They got me this year, but payback is a B***H!
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:26 am
Taxpayer
It was oozing and dripping sarcasm!!
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:28 am
Finn
Thanks, I contacted my TAO back in April. I’m sure they are not looking foward to my next phone call.
pat
October 13th, 2009
9:30 am
Well considering you all hate rich people and all they are. I’d imagine this should make you happy. They are getting pinched, much the opposite of your general connotation that income gap is growing and the rich never suffer.
You lot spend so much time deamonizing these people, take a few minutes to gloat. Enjoy the moment. Rejoice in the sufferings of those you loath.
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
9:32 am
Meanwhile, back at the ranch,
…To put that $23 billion bonus pool number in perspective, it is the most Goldman Sachs has accumulated for bonuses in its history — twice as much as in 2008. And it is doing so while memories are still fresh that just a year ago taxpayers had to step in when Wall Street, and even Goldman, were facing a run on the bank…
Of course, the Armeys of the world will unite to fight for the right that only the might of money can bring forth and rally the unsuspecting partiers, with their Lipton tea bags that they purchased from Wal-Mart on sale, to demand death to unfair taxes and government intervention into these poor people’s lives. After all, they worked so hard for theirs and it’s just not right to ask them to give back so much. It’s just not right.
Mrs. Godzilla
October 13th, 2009
9:32 am
you all hate rich people and all they are……there’s your sign!
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:32 am
pat
Who said anything about hating rich people?
Finn McCool
October 13th, 2009
9:35 am
I don’t hate rich people at all. I hate greedy people who “game” the system to legally rip everyone else off. They fall in the category of scamsters and other names that Clark Howard has a list of somewhere.
Scooter
October 13th, 2009
9:36 am
Yeah Normal, keeping dry except for the soaking my 401 K got!
stands for decibels
October 13th, 2009
9:36 am
It is payback time for all those who took out humungous equity loans and splurged! Oh weren’t they so smart investing in real estate?
Any kind of schadenfreude I might have experienced must have been so far in the past that I can’t even remember feeling it, now.
jconservative
October 13th, 2009
9:37 am
“The size of your home, the make of your car and the school where you sent your children told the world something important about you. People arranged their lives around that understanding.”
This is it. The way people felt the need to impress someone else with their make of auto, size of house, brand name of clothes & even choice of church. I have never been able to understand that need in people. But it is there & has been for years.
Most folks could use a little Robert Frost in their lives:
I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I–
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.
Finn McCool
October 13th, 2009
9:37 am
Joe, add to the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act the passing of the Commodities Modernization Act around that same time and you have it all right there.
Politicians passing an act about things they don’t have a clue on – heck most financial experts don’t even know how most of those tools work!
Davo
October 13th, 2009
9:38 am
“Abandoned mansions — there’s something about that image that grabs your attention.”
Nah…just reminds me that you don’t have to be poor to be stupid. These erstwhile homeowners and developers leveraged themselves right into a lifestyle that eventually hit the wall of reality.
And Bookman…you can cut,paste and save this column for Mar.’10…just replace ‘high-end housing’ with ‘mid and high-end retail stores’. This xmas is gonna be the shocker.
Normal
October 13th, 2009
9:39 am
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:32 am
pat
Who said anything about hating rich people?
Well, I haven’t yet, but I do…simply because I’m not one of them…
Scooter
October 13th, 2009
9:41 am
USinUK, where are you? This thread is right up your alley!
Normal
October 13th, 2009
9:41 am
Scooter, I hear you and feel your pain.
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:42 am
Normal
Well hate me if I win the lottery.
I’ll definitely rub it in!!!
Nothing Is Free
October 13th, 2009
9:42 am
Why would anyone have health insurance?
Our lawmakers are about to pass a bill that will require that no one can be refused insurance because of pre-existing conditions. So why pay month after month when anyone can waltz into a doctor’s office, use their cellphone, buy insurance at the door They pay a few hundred bucks to activate and the insurance companies are on the spot, having to pay for anything that is required.
Does anyone see this any differently? I saw this idea being discussed last night and some very smart pundits had no answer. Even with the a Government option, this bill will still leave an estimated 250 million uninsured. Hell, it will leave 300 million uninsured. Why would ANYONE buy insurance? To cut down on paperwork?
Once again, our government, for the sake of trying to appear to be fair, is about to really mess up our health care.
AmVet
October 13th, 2009
9:42 am
Yep, the conned were laughing like hyenas last year, hoping beyond hope that all of the economic ruin foisted on the nation was on the non-conneds only. Especially Those People.
Fools.
Now that untold numbers of their Reich-wing cousins get to share in the misery, the laughing as subsided slightly.
Yet, some of the worst still look to the “fiscally conservative” criminals on Wall Street, K Street and Main Street as their friends and “trickle down” benefactors.
Willing dupes in the BushCo orchestrated corporate destruction of capitalism.
And they STILL shuck and grin for them.
???
Bosch
October 13th, 2009
9:43 am
pat,
Could you be so kind as to define what makes a person “rich? “
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
9:44 am
If it can happen here, it can happen anywhere.
Well, ‘anywhere’ might be pushing it. There are those out there that do not even dream of dabbling in the fears of the lesser. Doing without is not a thought that has even once been entertained.
It pays to be among the top 400 taxpayers who earned roughly $250 million on average in 2005. According to an analysis by the New York Times and David Cay Johnston for Tax Notes, the last IRS report on the top 400 taxpayers showed that they made a little more than a penny of each dollar of total income in America, but paid income taxes at a 17.2 percent rate. Add in payroll taxes, and the figure still rounds to 17.2 percent. Those top 400 paid a tax rate lower than that of a family making between $50,000 and $75,000 a year — which was 17.4 percent, according to Johnston.
When Will Ferrell channels former president George W. Bush with his immortal words: “You’re Welcome America!” those top 400 taxpayers are the only ones who understand what he means. For the average American whose income has been unchanged since 2000, W’s message remains: Let them eat cake!
But, they earned it and it is just not right to ask them to give back, to support the very economy and people that made their existence possible, to help fund the very armys that keep their assets safe. No! That would just not be right.
Normal
October 13th, 2009
9:45 am
ABM…MY FRIEND!!!
Nothing Is Free
October 13th, 2009
9:47 am
It is staggering reading the posts this morning, blaming people for owning nice homes and not being able to afford them.
I contend that very few people bought million dollar homes that make 30 grand a year. Our problems came from people buying $200,000 homes while they had NO income.
The houses that Jay talked about were probably lost because someone lost their job, not that they had tried to live beyond their means. But never let a chance go by to dig at people who had tried to have a good life, could, at the time afford the houses, but now are living off unemployment.
Scooter
October 13th, 2009
9:49 am
Well hate me if I win the lottery.
I’ll definitely rub it in!!!
ABM, don’t forget to let me know when you go to a stipclub!
Nothing Is Free
October 13th, 2009
9:49 am
AmVEt
**Yep, the conned were laughing like hyenas last year, hoping beyond hope that all of the economic ruin foisted on the nation was on the non-conneds only. Especially Those People.**
What? Where do you get this garbage? You really ned to stop reading the Daily Koss.
N-GA
October 13th, 2009
9:52 am
Angry Black Man: They will still get you even if the assessed value of your home goes down. I just received my property tax notice for 2009. It included a notice that the State of Georgia has had to suspend the Homestead Tax Relief Grant that funded the increased homestead exemption. As a result, most homeowners will have to pay $200-300 more on their 2009 tax bills. In addition, the county in which I live has lost considerable revenue due to lower fee collections, lower retail sales, etc. So what did the tax commissioner do? Simple. He raised the millage rate. So we’ve been shafted twice. Heaven forbid that the county tighten its belt!
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
9:52 am
Nothing Is Free
October 13th, 2009
9:42 am
All you need is a magic marker, a poster board, a yard stick and staples to construct your very own,
We’re all DOOMED!
sign. Then, just pick out a busy street corner and you’re set for the day.
Finn McCool
October 13th, 2009
9:52 am
Nothing is Free, you are talking about care at the point of need. What that doesn’t cover are the meds to get you better, the preventive care and meds.
If you break your arm, they will set it but YOU still have to provide for the pain meds and any physical therapy or check-ups needed later on.
If you need to be on Lipitor, well, you wouldn’t know that cause you wouldn’t be visiting a doctor unless it was an emergency. Even if you knew you needed Lipitor, you would have to pay out the pocket (and the whazoo!) to get the meds. Then, you need a blood test every 3 months to make sure the Lipitor isn’t tearing up your kidneys(?? or liver??) so that part aint happening either.
Preventive medicine (something we really don’t focus on in the US) is jsut as important as the treatment medicine we focus on in the US.
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:52 am
Norm
That doesn’t sound like the hate pat was talking about
Scooter
I put your name at the top of the guest list!!
Your morning jolt: Putting Georgia in charge of health care? | Political Insider
October 13th, 2009
9:53 am
[...] Some opinion: Jay Bookman on empty homes and other signs of pain. [...]
thomas
October 13th, 2009
9:53 am
greed, plain and simple greed.
Consumers were greedy in buying houses that they were not financially sound enough to afford.
Then developers became greedy when they saw the amount of people they believed dumb enough to buy these houses showing up in mass numbers.
But who owns that responsibility is the question. Aren’t by definition businesses suppossed to be greedy? I mean their main goal is to make money right?
So in my opinion there is always more blame to be had on the behalf of the consumer.
Has anyone ever witnessed Wal-Mart making sure someone could afford the new Flat screen? People dropping anywhere from $400-$2000 on a TV can cause economic pain as well.
Businesses (developers) are suppossed to be greedy. If they are not then they will suffer in times of prosperity.
But maybe I am evil, I feel like I should take care of my family and myself before I worry about others, and their families. Remarkable thing though still manage t donate money to charities I choose.
Why can’t we all be held accountable for our own self and our own family? Why is it or should it be anyone elses fault in life if you make a bad decision, regardless of if you were duped or not?
Nothing Is Free
October 13th, 2009
9:54 am
Taxpayer
As usual, another incredibly intelligent and detailed discussion. I expected no more.
TnGelding
October 13th, 2009
9:55 am
Normal
October 13th, 2009
9:39 am
I don’t think you have a hate bone in your body.
I don’t hate the rich. I just get tired of the rich wannabes complaining about high taxes. Most of the truly wealthy don’t mind paying a little more than their “fair” share.
Finn McCool
October 13th, 2009
9:56 am
nothing is Free wrote: But never let a chance go by to dig at people who had tried to have a good life, could, at the time afford the houses, but now are living off unemployment.
I don’t think Jay was digging at the people who owned the homes, he was digging at the fact that we allowed ourselves to get into this situation. An economy that goes from one speculative bubble to the next.
A percentage of those houses were from folks in middle-upper management who were trying to live the way our parents lived with just one working spouse and when the job went, so did the morgage.
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
9:56 am
N-GA
October 13th, 2009
9:52 am
And, this is happening here in Georgia, in counties that voted 75% for the Republican party, the party of no. No taxes. No government intervention. Can you just imagine how much harder things are for the places that voted for a Democrat. I shudder to think. They’re probably suffering through double digit unemployment and massive property tax increases and… the horrors.
mmm, mmm, mmm.....
October 13th, 2009
9:58 am
O ne
B ig
A ss
M istake
A merica
Angry Black Man
October 13th, 2009
9:59 am
N-GA
Oooooohhh!! The funny thing about my assessment was that the total was about $5-$10 less than in 2008. However, because of no hometead exemption, I ended up paying about $300 more. I’m always watching the millage rates making sure to track them year by year. If the Gov’t is gonna screw me, which I know somehow they will, I’d hope that they would at least follow Gunnery Sgt. Hartman’s advice and give me a reach around.
Nothing Is Free
October 13th, 2009
9:59 am
Finn McCool
I’m not talking about now. I’m talking about if they pass this bill.
But think about it. Only the high dollar, private plans have good preventative care. And that costs an incredible amount of money a month, probably much more than any meds.
It is idiotic to think that anyone is going to pay every month for something they really don’t need.
Finn McCool
October 13th, 2009
10:00 am
thomas, you are confusing greedy with immoral business practices.
You might want to check out some of the misdirection, misinformation, and flat out lying that many of those mortgage companies were using to get people – anybody – into a loan that they could sell off to another company to eat the losses on. The whole thing was one big scam engineered by unscrupulous business people looking for the quick dollar.
Taxpayer
October 13th, 2009
10:00 am
Nothing Is Free
October 13th, 2009
9:54 am
Taxpayer
As usual, another incredibly intelligent and detailed discussion. I expected no more
And you will receive no less from me for you have earned every bit if not even more.
Turd Ferguson
October 13th, 2009
10:01 am
FinnMcCool
October 13th, 2009
8:32 am
Do you even have a 401K? Do you even know what one is? Your post is so ill-informed, oh yea of mustard seed sized brain. Not gonna give you the exact numbers, however, my 401K is up 62% from a year ago and all losses have now been made back and then some.
Get educated Finnius and stop with the dripping Horse feces from your lips.
Left wing management
October 13th, 2009
10:02 am
Some hack up there belched: ‘You know, all those things they whined about while Bush was in power and no such conditions existed?’
Can you believe that? Man. Get some pepto bismal. You’re stinking up the place.
Donovan
October 13th, 2009
10:04 am
Thanks, once again for the heart felt liberal essay on vitimization and poor working stiff doldrums. Let’s cut to the chase…although it is unfortunate that people suffer in bad economic times, the lesson learned in this exercise is this: DON’T BUY SOMETHING THAT YOU CANNOT AFFORD. When Bookman’s buddies in Congress forced the banking industry to lower the standards of vetting loan applications, the seeds of the housing destruction were sown. Barney Frank and Chris Dodd were the black knights of that ruinous vote-getting motive. Being a capitalist society, the banking industry and Wall Street countered with an alternative avenue to make a profit. People living in a capitalist society must learn very early in life the meaning of “buyer beware”. Self-responsibility and survival has become less emphasized in a growing liberal society. Europe we ain’t…yet!
cas
October 13th, 2009
10:05 am
Nobody seems to get it. All are integrated. Those people whose jobs were trying to anticipate housing markets built what they thought were salable houses built by people who were paid and supporting their families. And they risk their savings with the anticipation they would make money so they could live in those houses themselves. Again built by people and small businesses making a living in that industry. And rather than put their earnings under their pillows they spend, they donate, and save which creates lending for companies to create other jobs. And the norm is the more they make the more they spend creating jobs along the way. There are greedy mean spirited individuals but to decree that as the norm reflects a deeper problem that exists. High income houses vacant represents unemployment across all levels and the accompanying pain to all.