Birthers aren’t conservative, they’re just nutty

It’s a cool, cloudy Saturday, with more rain in the forecast for the ATL, so let’s throw out a little more playful topic.

Can we all agree, or mostly agree, that the full-blown birthers are nuts?

They aren’t conservative, they aren’t Republican, and they don’t tell us anything about conservatives or Republicans in general. They’re just nuts, but they’re nuts in a very special, entertaining and almost endearing way.

Here, for example, are excerpts from a late-night “birthermercial” airing on a few stations around the country, compiled by Talking Points Memo:

Once we get consensus that these folks are a little crazy – once conservatives no longer have to worry about being tarnished by the craziness — maybe liberals and conservatives can sit back and enjoy the circus together. Because really, the mental contortions and conspiracy theories needed to hold the whole birther thing together can be a wonder to behold.

For example, you may recall that last summer, BirtherWorld was all atwitter at the discovery of a Kenyan birth certificate in the name of one Barack Hussein Obama. The news was greeted with hallelujahs. Finally, that Rat Usurper SIAP (”Suspected Illegal Alien President” for you uninitiated) was exposed!! Off with his head!! Redemption!!

All of a sudden, other dots began to be connected. For example, why was Hillary Clinton traveling to Kenya? Because she had been sent on a secret mission to bottle up the truth about the Kenyan birth certificate, that why!!

Sadly for the birthers, that Kenyan birth certificate was exposed as a transparent forgery within 48 hours. Such humiliation, such disappointment. How could the birther cause ever recover?

Well, fear not, for human imagination will always provide.

You see, according to “The Right Perspective,” the fake document “may have been leaked to lawyer Orly Taitz by a special Obama Administration team, who created the document to discredit the so-called “Birther” movement.”

That’s right, it wasn’t the birthers’ fault after all! In fact, Obama is so worried about the birthers that he dispatched a special team to discredit them!! And according the The Right Perspective, they even have proof for that assertion, in the form of “an overlooked Internet posting from the conspiracy website Repubx.”

In a post dated April 19, months before the discovery of the Kenyan birth certificate, someone at RepubX reported the following:

“Don’t know about 9/11 conspiracy, but do know from DC source that an Administration team is working on perfecting a forgery of the long-form birth certificate. They plan on presenting it in a a month or so. The source is FBI agent who has drinking buddy from University of Illinois now in the Administration. Its second hand, but the source is supposed to be solid.

They have already prepared the forgery with special paper and ink. The document was printed on a fully functional 1960 Heidelberger printing press located at a print museum in Toronto. Access was arranged by a trustee of the museum who is connected to a large Canadian banking/investment firm with major US interests.

The blanks in the forged form were filled in with an old Underwood Manual typewriter bought at an estate sale in Skokie, IL. The raised seal was the easiest piece to fake, since you can by a special order corporate seal from just about any online office supply store.

The only reason they haven’t rolled out the foregery yet is that it is “seasoning” under mild UV light and a back and forth rotation between between a humidifier and a sauna. Get ready….one to two months tops.”

You know, you can’t make stuff like that up. Except that somebody did.

Now, if you want to fall still deeper down the rabbit hole, go to that RepubX site, where you find the following conjecture about the alleged “DC source” quoted above:

“Hopefully his friend in the administration is not the young Federal witness they just found dead who was going to testify in the passport and credit card fraud case. This kinda smacks of the Whitewater investigations where folks who knew something damaging simply ended up dead. If it is I pray we do a better job of connecting crimes to the source than we did with the Clintons. Where’s Clint Eastwood when you need someone to protect a witness?”

228 comments Add your comment

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
9:31 am

See what I mean, TaxPayer^^-

TaxPayer- I am assuming that you are a consumer of wild eyed liberal media paranoia about capitalist greed, as witnessed here at the bookman blog on a daily basis.

Can I at least work with this assumption or is there something about you that I am not aware of?

There are two kinds of people in America, those who worry about what other people have and those who worry about what other people don’t have.

The first group, known as democrats, wants it all for themselves, see Gore, al-, Freidman, Tom, et al, etc, etc, etc.

Would you care to dispute the facts that I have proof of in multitude archived bookman columns and legion pinko media blatherings?

And then there are Conservatives, the second group, which deem responsibility to mean not only to their own but to others, and need no government entity to move them to giving freely of themselves.

I would not expect you to know these things, living in your divisive world of political paranoia and grievances, seeing white sheets and pointy hats in every unfamiliar corner.

Me, I don’t have such illnesses to deal with.

I still can’t believe the Lord used the Urinal to move me to do His Will, what a truly awesome Savior I have.

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
9:36 am

For those who are unable to comprehend what a bookman column on “Birthers” has to do with 9:31, imagine Jay getting out his gallon of Birther Latex and his political brush and painting a whole group of good people to suit his ideological colors.

Back into your corners, y’all.

mike

September 26th, 2009
9:48 am

“They aren’t conservative, they aren’t Republican, and they don’t tell us anything about conservatives or Republicans in general”

Holy cow! Intellectual honesty from Jay Bookman! Kudos!!!

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
9:49 am

Now, obviously, the AJC thinks the following is some heroic measure and that those who see it as reckless abandonment of fiscal responsibility are racists and/or birthers-

With the Sept. 30 end of the government’s fiscal year looming, the chamber voted 217-190 to keep most agencies at current budget levels through Oct. 31.

The bill includes provisions allowing the Postal Service to fill a budget hole by deferring $4 billion in payments due at the end of this month to an employee benefits trust fund. The agency requested the change to help it contend with the recession and declining use of the mail.-Urinal

I don’t use typewriters anymore but I do buy a new one every year just in case, hahahaha.

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
9:50 am

mike- Read the whole column, please.

Now, if you want to fall still deeper down the rabbit hole, go to that RepubX site,

Taxpayer

September 26th, 2009
9:51 am

Andy,

I find no need to start worrying about anything just yet since you still make no sense whatsoever to me. However, you can be certain that I will be forever vigilant.

By the way, there is one aspect regarding the poll that uncovered the more charitable nature of conservatives relative to liberals. Did those results factor in tax deductions. Oh wait, never mind. I think we already have that answer in the form of all the whining from the ‘conservatives’ when Obama mentioned reducing some of those tax deductions.

Regarding your movements at the ‘Urinal’, you might want to compare notes with Dave R. He also likes to discuss constitutionals.

Now, you have a nice, giving day, ya hear and try not to worry too much about what sort of tax write off your generosity might bring your way. Anyway, cheer up and let’s talk conspiracies. 8>0

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
9:52 am

Jay, presumably you meant to embed this youtube video:

http://www.youtube.com/v/u_jZdkCFAUw

In Firefox, at least, we’re not seeing it.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
9:53 am

From the video:

“Send a fax–for only THIRTY DOLLARS!”

I have to admit, it is tempting to ride some of this Birther gravy train. Presumably it’s pretty easy to part these fools from their money.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
9:55 am

From the Birther video host’s webpage:

As part of Bill Keller Ministries, a 501(c)(3) organization, all donations to Liveprayer.Com are tax deductible.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
9:56 am

And when you hear this or that online conservative claim that their lot are more likely to contribute to “charity” than those mean-spirited libruls, remember: in the eyes of the IRS, the “Bill Keller Ministries” are one such “charity.”

N-GA

September 26th, 2009
9:56 am

Jay,

At the risk of raising the ire of those whose brains are already sizzling with anger, I believe that the “birther” movement has the highest population of (closet) racists of any of the opposition groups. Now I expect those “birthers” who disagree with that opinion to begin yelling that most of them are not racists. I’ll answer them now by observing that I never said “most”, or used the term “majority” or any such descriptive to suggest that most are racists.

The other opposition groups may be sincere in their desire to have our government represent corporate America instead of the voters. They actually believe that if the government represents the People, then we will certainly become a communist nation with a socialist society.

With corporate America in the driver’s seat, we need not worry about corporate oversight, pollution control, global warming, healthcare, etc. Our government can focus on the things that matter most: war, profits, wealth, profits, greed, profits, and widening the gap between the haves and the have-nots.

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
10:05 am

By the way, there is one aspect regarding the poll that uncovered the more charitable nature of conservatives relative to liberals. Did those results factor in tax deductions. Oh wait, never mind. I think we already have that answer in the form of all the whining from the ‘conservatives’ when Obama mentioned reducing some of those tax deductions.

Anybody else notice that the liberals have all of the tax deductions memorized even though taxes are “patriotic?”

And let’s check this out, now that the subject has been broached- Let’s say that your annual charitable givings are around $20,000 or so, which means you are not a leading democrat politician and that you probably file your taxes. For this patriotic duty, you can expect the IRS to return to you a sum of about $400 for your efforts.

That leaves what, $19,600?

Am I missing something here?

Jay

September 26th, 2009
10:09 am

Thanks, SfD. Fixed now

N-GA

September 26th, 2009
10:13 am

Most liberals I know donate something more valuable (and irreplaceable) than money….their time. We have only so much time, and then it’s gone. Conservatives would rather donate money, and spend their time on the golf course, or playing ALTA.

The IRS doesn’t give a tax deduction for the time you donate to Habitat for Humanity, soup kitchens, etc. Even in the Middle Age, wealthy people would pay poor people to perform their penance. They would purchase “indulgences” from the Catholic Church. The rich funded the building of churches, the poor actually built them!

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
10:15 am

Presumably Bill Keller picks up his hair-care product at the same joint that caters to the House Minority Leader’s skin care.

Taxpayer

September 26th, 2009
10:17 am

The bill includes provisions allowing the Postal Service to fill a budget hole by deferring $4 billion in payments due at the end of this month to an employee benefits trust fund.

I just loves me some talk about pension plans. I gets me an update (with a one year time lag) on my pension plan every year. So far so good. The last thing that I would want right now though is for the PBGC to take it over. I’m too young. The PBGC’s maximum monthly guarantee would leave me short-changed for several more years.

RW-(the original)

September 26th, 2009
10:19 am

Enter your comments here–

Remember when Jay B was going to ban anybody that brought up the birthplace issue? You’ll have to go back past about forty times he brought it up himself but it’s back there somewhere and he still gets to post here.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

After all the things we read here about evil right wingers voices that might set a climate for violence why aren’t we reading about the Pittsburgh riots being traceable back to that Macy’s balloon sometimes labeled as Michael Moore?

Assume for the sake of argument that violent rhetoric does beget violence. By this logic, shouldn’t we blame Michael Moore’s vitriolic indictments of investment banks for the brick that was hurled through a PNC Bank window yesterday? And if government aids and abets the evil that is capitalism, aren’t Moore’s words responsible for the bricks that were hurled at riot police in Pittsburgh?

After-Birthers Movement

September 26th, 2009
10:23 am

AS CHAIRMAM OF THE AMERICAN AFTER-BIRTHERS MOVEMENT:

WE DEMAND THAT CONGRESS SUPEONA “PRESIDENT” BARRACK HOOSAIN OBAMA AND DEMAND THAT HE PRODUCE HIS PLACENTA.

Taxpayer

September 26th, 2009
10:24 am

Anybody else notice that the liberals have all of the tax deductions memorized even though taxes are “patriotic?”

That’s because us so-called ‘liberals’ actually try to pay our correct amount of taxes. Further, even if some folks have trouble figuring out the correct amount and get called out for it, at least they tried and they did pay and they did not deliberately conceal their income. Of course, that would be in stark contrast to so many UBS customers, for example (some of that “I got mine” crowd, no doubt), whom I look forward to hearing more about in the near future. What about you, Andy.

Soothsayer

September 26th, 2009
10:25 am

Take this true/false test.

Cholesterol is a poison and I should try to reduce it at all costs.

If I lower my cholesterol, I will live longer.

Having “high” cholesterol means I will die younger.

My Doctor does not have any monetary incentive to prescribe statin drugs to me.

Eating foods that contain cholesterol will raise my cholesterol level.

Eating foods that contain animal fat will raise my cholesterol level.

“High” cholesterol is associated with above-average intelligence.

Each person’s cholesterol level is unique to that individual.

The scientific foundation on which the “lipid hypothesis” and the prescribing of statins is irrefutable and rock solid.

Margarine is better for me than is butter.

Atherosclerosis is a calcification of the artery wall and is the body’s response to injury to the artery wall caused by chemical insult from trans fats contained in hydrogenated oils.

Animal fats should be avoided at all cost.

There will likely not be an epidemic of congestive heart failure when the people taking statins reach old age.

I know all about the Framingham Study. I know what the lipid hypothesis is.

The so-called “Food Pyramid” with its emphasis on grains and grain products has nothing whatsoever to do with the epidemic of diabetes in this country.

High fructose corn syrup is a natural substance and is no different than sugar and has nothing to do whatsoever with the epidemic of obesity in this country.

Statin drugs are completely safe or my Doctor would not prescribe them to me.

Having “high” cholesterol means that I am much more likely to develop heart disease.

Hydrogenated vegetable oils are better for me than animal grease or butter.

Here http://www.health-heart.org and here http://www.westonaprice.org are couple of good places to look for the answers.

mike

September 26th, 2009
10:29 am

stands for decibels –

Read the book “Who Really Cares” which is by the fellow who did the study. (BTW: he too is a liberal and said that he was surprised and disappointed by what he found.)

He is quite clear that even if you only take that charitable giving to churches that could specifically tracked to philanthropy outside the church, that the disparity is still strong.

Folks like the birther fellow you call out represent a distinct minority of churches. I can speak for my church, which is quite large. The overriding message of the church is that it is the highest form of worship to minister to the needy and helpless. I have seen and participated in many initiatives through the church that have had a tremendous impact on the needy, from repairing roofs of poor folks in West End after the tornado a few years back, to collecting and distributing survival essentials for destitute folks in South America.

If your church is not engaging in these activities, you might want to find another church. If you don’t go to church, you might want to go for a day to see what people are saying and doing. It’s not talking about Obama’s birth certificate.

Taxpayer

September 26th, 2009
10:32 am

The rich funded the building of churches, the poor actually built them!

But, think of all the jobs they created.

mike

September 26th, 2009
10:35 am

sfb –

One more point. I do think that the church plays a role in that disparity in charitable contributions in both time and money.

It’s not that the church goers are any more moral or caring than those who don’t. It is that most churches are geared towards charity and provide a comfortable and consistent mechanism for church goers to participate in that. The church organizes and promotes these activities which makes it easy for church goers to donate time and money, particularly if you are doing these things with your friends. More people in red states attend church and hence, the numbers look better for those states.

Taxpayer

September 26th, 2009
10:35 am

Soothsayer,

You better not be trying to bad mouth Crisco. Just lettin’ you know. That’s the sort of talk that set off many of feud. :smile:

Taxpayer

September 26th, 2009
10:36 am

I wonder if Jay really was tryin’ to get folks to lighten up along the lines of a non-partisan birther bashin.

mike

September 26th, 2009
10:42 am

Taxpayer –

“I wonder if Jay really was tryin’ to get folks to lighten up along the lines of a non-partisan birther bashin.”

If this is the way he wants to couch it, I am ready to join in. The birthers are nuts just like the truthers are.

SOUTHERN ATL

September 26th, 2009
10:52 am

Jay,
I just don’t understand why the REPUBLICANS would get Orly Taitz to do their underground dirty work. She is a RUSSIAN and her trickery seems so un-American…Nobody sums up the whole Republican movement more then Stephen Colbert….got to love him!!!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/25/blackwashing-colbert-unve_n_299601.html

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
11:00 am

That’s because us so-called ‘liberals’ actually try to pay our correct amount of taxes.

Hardee, har, har, it was just a random coincidence! that every Obozo democrat cabinet or other governmental nominee forgot to file taxes the last decade or so of their lives, wasn’t it?

Brad Steel

September 26th, 2009
11:05 am

mike,
Thanks for your solipsistic preaching and your fine examples of your moral superiority and omniscience.

Now, do something for us all, go fart in your hand and then smell it.
BS

Soothsayer

September 26th, 2009
11:09 am

Taxpayer

September 26th, 2009
11:14 am

Hardee, har, har, it was just a random coincidence! that every Obozo democrat cabinet or other governmental nominee forgot to file taxes the last decade or so of their lives, wasn’t it?

Would you mind sticking your head up out of that gopher, er, rabbit, hole so I can bop it.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
11:22 am

mike, to your points and questions raised @ 10.29 & 10.35 — I know a fair amount about church activities, given that I not only belong to a church but I had a close family member (who had been a church administrator and who had a good eye for any red flags) review its budget before I joined, to ensure there wasn’t anything fishy going on.

Nowhere in my posts here, or elsewhere, have I asserted that it is wrong for the the federal government to provide a tax break for such contributions. Indeed, many such religious institutions provide invaluable services (disaster relief being among the most obvious).

However, I think it is fair to ask those who are quick to hype the polling you’ve cited, just how charitable that giving really is. And I write this as someone whose own contributions are also, of course, tax deductible. My place of worship does its share of good work for the local and greater community, but a big honkin’ chunk of the dollars, of course, go to ordinary operations and the modest salaries paid to the staffers. And the church is a resource for my family and myself.

Just trying to see this clearly, and not sugar coating it, is all.

jconservative

September 26th, 2009
11:23 am

Wait to you see Sarah Palin’s birth certificate!

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
11:25 am

every Obozo democrat cabinet or other governmental nominee forgot to file taxes

And by “every”, of course, Whiner means some teensy percentage of the massive hiring done at the start of any new Administration, a percentage probably akin to what one would find of any halfway decent vetting process of a random group of Americans.

That we had not heard of similar tales in previous Administrations might just be good luck, or (as I tend to suspect) the vetting wasn’t all that rigorous.

then again, sure. Maybe the current administration is EXTREE EVIL.

getalife

September 26th, 2009
11:30 am

Enter your comments here :

Like truthers, they just can’t let it go.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
11:30 am

The birthers are nuts just like the truthers are.

Indeed, that’s why the birthers are called, well, “birthers.” (as opposed to “The Certifiable” or suchlike.)

There were people on the left who wanted very much to draw a parallel between these nutters on the right, and the nuttiest conspiracy theorists on the left. I like to think I was among the first to promote this usage, at the time I used it for the first time I might’ve even thought I came up with it on my own, but I think mostly it was a matter of bunch of great minds (ok, stupid drones on the InterWebs) thinking alike.

Taxpayer

September 26th, 2009
11:40 am

Well. I just don’t personally see the need to continue this issue regarding the birth certificate. The evidence, or lack thereof, clearly proves that Obama has no birth certificate. Therefore, the real question to be asked should be “Was Obama born?” So, join me, fellow “hatchers” in my campaign to get to the yolk of this matter.

catlady

September 26th, 2009
11:52 am

To quote the title of a children’s book: Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs.

We all know there are a LOT of nuts around. We’ve got a lot of folks with a chip on their shoulders. The chip is from those nuts.

getalife

September 26th, 2009
12:02 pm

Enter your comments here (changed for the refresh problem?)

The text stays in this box when refreshed.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
12:03 pm

The text stays in this box when refreshed.

The text that refreshes.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
12:06 pm

or…

The clause that refreshes.

getalife

September 26th, 2009
12:10 pm

Enter your comments here:

At least they are working on the problem.

RW-(the original)

September 26th, 2009
12:10 pm

Enter your comments here–

Perhaps the largest group of like minded nutjobs are the Halliburtoners.

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
12:11 pm

“That we had not heard of similar tales in previous Administrations might just be good luck, or (as I tend to suspect) the vetting wasn’t all that rigorous”

Or it just flat wasn’t reported.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
12:25 pm

Perhaps the largest group of like minded nutjobs are the Halliburtoners.

hmm. wondering–How would you classify a Halliburtoner?

I only ask because I was wondering how many Americans could even correctly answer the question, “Which former Vice President was once CEO of Halliburton?”, let alone construct conspiracy theories about that connection playing a role in decisions made by the Bush Administration.

Public Option's Doing Swell

September 26th, 2009
12:33 pm

Ah jist wonders why them birther commercials were bought in markets in the South? Could it be the South has the biggest epicenter of poorly educated white hicks? They seem to have flocked here.

Another day and another Repub Congressman federally indicted. Congrats Cong. Doolittle from California. You make us proud. You’re taking back America one federal cell block at a time. Enjoy your cube.

Public Option's Doing Swell

September 26th, 2009
12:34 pm

Which former VP is so brave he dodged the draft 6 times and hunts by shooting at de-winged turkeys and hits old men in the face?

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
12:41 pm

I don’t know, I believe the BlackWaters are right up there with the Halliburtoners, with Obozo being chief nutjob for each both of these little kults, except that now BlackWater rides shotgun for Obozo, to keep his little ass safe.

That’s gotta be worth bonus points, don’t it?

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
12:42 pm

each or both, either way works for me, geez.

RW-(the original)

September 26th, 2009
12:43 pm

Enter your comments here–

sfb,

I love the way moonbats pretend history doesn’t exist. It’s one of your cuter qualities.

I’m going to put in a few miles before the next round of breathless weather people tell me to build an ark.

Later!

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
12:44 pm

“Read the book “Who Really Cares” which is by the fellow who did the study. (BTW: he too is a liberal and said that he was surprised and disappointed by what he found.)”

Yet if you ask any liberal, they are CONVINCED that they are far more compassionate than the average conservative. But then again, why let the facts get in the way of a good story?

What part of Jersey do you hail from, mike? I grew up in South Jersey.

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
12:45 pm

I love the way moonbats pretend history doesn’t exist. It’s one of your cuter qualities.

Does anyone have the foggiest idea of what prompted this?

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
12:47 pm

Anybody else notice that if you become a terrorist the libs will blame it on Bush but if you become a Birther they blame it on you?

And I’m thinking that Obozo has created and/or saved more Birthers than he has jobs.

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
12:48 pm

“I only ask because I was wondering how many Americans could even correctly answer the question, “Which former Vice President was once CEO of Halliburton?”, let alone construct conspiracy theories about that connection playing a role in decisions made by the Bush Administration.”

So what “conspiracy theories” do you have to explain Clinton’s use of Halliburton during the Kosovo conflict? The fact is that there are but a small handful of companies that are ready, willing, and able to enter war-torn areas and undertake massive reconstruction.

Kamchak

September 26th, 2009
12:52 pm

“Which former Vice President was once CEO of Halliburton?”

But, but, but CEO such a lowly position. How could such a person influence the workings of a small mostly local corporation? I think a bigger scandal is a Senator/lawyer advising ACORN–a HUGE multinational organization with ties to a myriad of foreign governments. :roll:

“Independent film-maker” James O’Keefe’s financial backing.

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
12:53 pm

“Anybody else notice that if you become a terrorist the libs will blame it on Bush”

Nope…are you sure it’s not just your voices talking to you?

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
1:02 pm

“explain Clinton’s use of Halliburton during the Kosovo conflict”

And what does Clinton have to do with Cheney’s having been a former CEO of Haliburton?

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
1:04 pm

Here is some additional perspective on Halliburton:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1184989/posts

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
1:09 pm

“And what does Clinton have to do with Cheney’s having been a former CEO of Haliburton?”

Nothing, in the same way that Bush’s decision to use Halliburton had nothing to do with Cheney’s former position. But, once again, why let the facts get in the way of a really great political rant?

stands for decibels

September 26th, 2009
1:13 pm

So what “conspiracy theories” do you have to explain Clinton’s use of Halliburton during the Kosovo conflict? The fact is that there are but a small handful of companies that are ready, willing, and able to enter war-torn areas and undertake massive reconstruction.

I’m not sure why it’s presumed that I was here to dredge up such allegations; I was more interested in just how much influence, and how much of a mark was left by what RW referred to as — what was, it, “Halliboners” ? Something like that.

Out for awhile…

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
1:18 pm

“Nothing, in the same way that Bush’s decision to use Halliburton had nothing to do with Cheney’s former position. But, once again, why let the facts get in the way of a really great political rant?”

Ever heard of “avoiding the appearance of evil”? The problem is that we have too few politicians who think that’s necessary anymore…because we have too few “news reporters” who will call them on it.

Kamchak

September 26th, 2009
1:28 pm

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
1:33 pm

Do you have an actual point, Kamchak? Are you defending ACORN?

Soothsayer

September 26th, 2009
1:46 pm

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
1:56 pm

Soothsayer–Keep up the good work. It astounds me that no one wants to address the REAL reason we have a health care “crisis”: waste and fraud. Here’s a link from the site you referenced which estimates that around 50% of all health care dollars spent are unnecessary.

Obama’s plan does nothing to address these problems, it merely expands the pool of those paying for the waste and fraud through a “mandate”. For the first time in my life, I have lost all faith in my government, and view them as my enemy.

Barry

September 26th, 2009
1:56 pm

Sorry, your Alanskies rules for radicals no longer work. Go ahead ridicule. Your worried your Messiah is going to take a fall. Obama himself said his Father wasn’t American. Our Constitution demands both parents be American.

You all made a big deal about McCains birth certificate. why not Obama’s?

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
1:57 pm

Ken Berwitz

September 26th, 2009
2:00 pm

I question whether or not Barack Obama is a natural citizen….and I’m not nuts, nor am I a “birther”: i.e. the name given to anyone who dares wonder about this, which is supposed to stereotype and demonize us all.

Barack Obama has spent upwards of a million dollars fighting to keep his birth certificate under wraps. And he has refused to make his passport and his school records public. In short, he has dilligently worked to hide everything that might provide any tangible information about where he was born, which country/countries gave him financial aid and which nationality he traveled under.

And you think people who wonder about this are nuts? Tell you what: I think anyone who DOESN’T wonder about it is nuts.

A five minute telephone call to the proper department in Hawaii and a processing fee of probably under $20, gets him a copy of the real birth certificate. He shows it and that largely ends the controversy. Instead he spends something like a million bucks to hide it. You don’t have to be Sherlock Holmes to deduce that it is likely there are things on that birth certificate he does not want us to see.

So keep calling people names – that arrogance and dismissiveness apparently is acceptable to you. Me? I’ll stay suspicious.

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:07 pm

“Our Constitution demands both parents be American. ”

You’re so full of sh!t. Here’s what the Constitution says: “No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States”

Please provide the quote that you IMAGINE demands both parents be American.

Kamchak

September 26th, 2009
2:07 pm

Do you have an actual point, Kamchak? Are you defending ACORN?

Well since this is a thread about reactionary-ism and someone brought up Halliburton, I was comparing the efficacy of a corporate CEO vs. an adviser–and comparing a multinational corporation to a community organizing group.

I brought up ACORN so I could take another shot at “independent film-maker” James O’Keefe. :wink:

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:10 pm

“Barack Obama has spent upwards of a million dollars fighting to keep his birth certificate under wraps”

Posting it on a public website is keeping it hidden? It what universe? It took me about 3 seconds to find it. Yeah that’s REALLY hidden all right.

http://fightthesmears.com/articles/5/birthcertificate.html?source=SEM-RR-google-search-birth&gclid=CL-Snczvj50CFSkHswod2jJm2A

Normal

September 26th, 2009
2:11 pm

Man, I just get back from spending the morning with my Grandson, feeling pretty happy, and ready to debate :D with Mike again, and what do I see up. The Birther crapola again. These people are better ignored and maybe they will go away. And that is exactly what I am going to do until the next subject. It’s a rainy day, football is on, and I don’t have time for this.

anotherJay

September 26th, 2009
2:11 pm

More importantly and actually more relevant to the job function as President is an example of Obama’s supposedly high IQ. We’ve been shown nothing,zip. He didn’t even write his own books and he is failing miserably at everything he touches.The man can’t lead,he is hapless follower who happens to be half Black. I don’t give a flying &*^% where he was born or when.I want to see what makes him qualified for the position without the “historic first Black President” mantle attached.Otherwise he’s just another brother who happens to be a good tap dancer. I love being a racist,don’t you?

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:12 pm

“A five minute telephone call to the proper department in Hawaii and a processing fee of probably under $20, gets him a copy of the real birth certificate”

See the link I posted. You have now outed yourself as a birther…denials of such not withstanding…by simply repeating the lies on which birthers base their denials of his citizenship. Live with it.

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
2:13 pm

“I brought up ACORN so I could take another shot at “independent film-maker” James O’Keefe.”

That’s what I thought, since you don’t seem able to rebut the content of his videos.

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
2:15 pm

Oh good, here we go again with the downpours.

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:15 pm

“These people are better ignored and maybe they will go away”

The only thing wrong with ignoring such people is what John Kerry learned to his detriment: they will take “no response” as PROOF they are correct.

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
2:17 pm

Barry- The Conservatives were the ones who made a big deal out of McCain’s birth certificate, not the libs.

Hell, the libs were the ones who got him enough votes to win the primaries.

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:18 pm

“He didn’t even write his own books”
Proof please

” and he is failing miserably at everything he touches.”
Proof please

“The man can’t lead,he is hapless follower who happens to be half Black.”
Self outed as a bigot

“I love being a racist”
That’s obvious.

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
2:19 pm

“The Birther crapola again. These people are better ignored and maybe they will go away.”

Personally, I have to question Jay’s motivation in bringing it up once again. Why don’t we discuss the fact that more than 50% of all health care dollars are spent unnecessarily.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/08/10/news/economy/healthcare_money_wasters/index.htm/

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:20 pm

“Why don’t we discuss the fact that more than 50% of all health care dollars are spent unnecessarily”

So discuss it. What’s stopping you? Jay has shown no signs of insisting that discussions be kept to the subject of his blog entry.

Ken Berwitz

September 26th, 2009
2:21 pm

This is a classic example of someone who “knows” something he does not know.

Barack Obama did not post his birth certificate. He posted a Certification Of Live Birth” (COLB), which is not the birth certificate, but has some (not all) of a birth certificate’s information on it.

Do yourself a favor and look at your own birth certificate. Do you notice that there is a hospital listed? The doctor who delivered you? The reason you cannot show me that on what Barack Obama provided is because it is not there. And the reason it is not there is because that is not his birth certificate.

The misinformation and ignorance regarding this issue is staggering.

AmVet

September 26th, 2009
2:25 pm

Bruno, as always you are the man of Friday nights.

That Tull piece was great. I remember when I first bought Stand Up and what a surprise opening the album jacket.

I’m not sure what in the hell got the regulars going down the vapid and vacuous diva lane last night. Those chicks by and large couldn’t find middle C with a diagram.

Here’s one comment on the state of modern black music. And if you wanna be a star, just grab your crotch and squeeze it hard…:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvO3gMw5XqI&feature=PlayList&p=BE607A55619EA8A3&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=23

and a tribute to all the foxes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tq39zIWJaeU

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:30 pm

“Barack Obama did not post his birth certificate. He posted a Certification Of Live Birth” (COLB), which is not the birth certificate, but has some (not all) of a birth certificate’s information on it. ”

How often does it have to be said: you NEVER get your original birth certificate. You ALWAYS get an official copy….which may or may not be an exact copy of the original – it depends on the state. The states do not send out the originals because they are the official record of your birth in that state, and it a lot of states (maybe even all by now) the original no longer exists. Once they are converted to electronic copies the originals can be destroyed.

The STATE OF HAWAII has certified the certificate posted on that website as the authentic record of his birth IN HAWAII.
“Do yourself a favor and look at your own birth certificate. Do you notice that there is a hospital listed? The doctor who delivered you? ”

No, neither is on MY COPY of my birth certificate. I do have a copy of the HOSPITAL RECORD OF MY BIRTH that does show that information, but the state copy does NOT.

“The reason you cannot show me that on what Barack Obama provided is because it is not there. And the reason it is not there is because that is not his birth certificate.”

The reason it is not there is because Hawaii does not put that information on the OFFICIAL CERTIFICATE they send out when you request a copy of your state record of birth.

“The misinformation and ignorance regarding this issue is staggering”

You should know…you are repeating virutally ALL of it.

jenne

September 26th, 2009
2:30 pm

But people who believe that George Bush took down the twin towers with bombs in the basement are just seeking the truth.

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
2:31 pm

“So discuss it. What’s stopping you? Jay has shown no signs of insisting that discussions be kept to the subject of his blog entry.”

I’ve been doing my best to shine the spotlight on this, Doggone, since it is the reason that I think Obama’s proposed mandatory purchase of health care “insurance” is whack. If we could cut out all of the waste and fraud, then there would be plenty of money available to care for everyone without any mandates or government involvement.

I think the reason no one is discussing HOW to reduce the waste and fraud is that it ultimately goes back to each individual taking responsibility for their won health and health care decisions. Not a sexy topic for most people.

david wayne osedach

September 26th, 2009
2:32 pm

If Obama had been born in Africa – his enemies would have proved it by now. The birthers or Birchers don’t count.

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:35 pm

“I’ve been doing my best to shine the spotlight on this”

Then why are you complaining that you can’t discuss it? if you are getting no responses, maybe it’s because everyone agrees with you…or no one WANTS to discuss it…but that doesn’t mean you CAN’T discuss it.

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
2:36 pm

“That Tull piece was great. I remember when I first bought Stand Up and what a surprise opening the album jacket.”

Howdy, fellow music connoiseur! Benefit and Stand Up are two of my favorite albums.

AmVet

September 26th, 2009
2:36 pm

Forget the lame video, but boy does he love to play…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsVljVL7RzY

and from that stellar debut record

http://listen.grooveshark.com/#/song/Red_Neck_Friend/3589333

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:37 pm

“If Obama had been born in Africa – his enemies would have proved it by now”

Absolutely. That they cling to lies and fraudulantly produced “evidence” simply PROVES how baseless their assertions are. But like all good conned they MUST OBEY the first rule of the conned: never let a good lie die.

Kamchak

September 26th, 2009
2:43 pm

Bruno

The content of the videos pretty much speaks for itself. The “guilty” parties at ACORN of been fired and policy has been set–the back story, however, is not getting any attention. This same “independent film-maker” James O’Keefe punked Planned Parenthood two and a half years ago. He has since found a sugar-daddy willing to finance his Ashton Kucher enterprise, and he had to travel across country in order to find just a couple of employees he could punk.

The irony is that Maryland is a “two-party” State–meaning his undercover videos are an inadmissible investigative tool.

Ken Berwitz

September 26th, 2009
2:43 pm

Oh brother.

Hawaii first said they didn’t have the original, and then days later reversed it and said they did.

And even if they did have it only on file, the file would contain all the information on file, including the hospital and the doctor — which, again, are could be used to try and validate where he was born.

No matter how many ways this information is removed and withheld, so no one can check, you can’t find a reason to wonder why. Your lack of curiosity is astonishing.

But since the wipeout of checkable information doesn’t give you pause, how about this: Why isn’t there a statement from the hospital – maybe even a plaque on the wall of its lobby, proudly proclaiming “Birthplace of our 44th President, Barack Obama”. Wouldn’t a hospital be eager to acknowledge this is where he started his life?

It could be because Mr. Obama has, at one time or another cited two different hospitals as being his birthplace. Based on their lack of any confirmation, neither of the hospitals seems to agree.

And how come not one person has come forth to say “I was there”? Barack Obama is only 48 years old. If the doctor were, say, 35, he would be 83 today. If the nurses in attendance averaged, say, 25 years of age, they would average in their early 70’s today. A teenage candy-striper then would be in his/her 60’s today. Did every one of them die?

And before you tell me that they wouldn’t remember because the birth was inconsequential at the time, let’s remember that this was an interracial marriage and birth in 1961, when it was a rarity — and that Hawaii had almost no Black population (even as late as the 2002 census the Black population of Hawaii was only 1.8%). So the truth is, this would have been a very unusual, thus very memorable birth.

But that’s ok. Don’t you wonder about a thing. That’s the safe position to take here – certainly with Jay Bookman running interference for you.

AmVet

September 26th, 2009
2:44 pm

They were the second band I ever saw live, Bruno (after Alice).

There would be these sweet little acoustic and flute-laden interludes and then all of a sudden, WHAM! Explosive rock crescendos. A helluva ride.

From that aforementioned LP, but it’s an old day now…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CH9YwZ60Mhs

and the one and only Ms. Cooper

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQwJaAhtCi8&feature=related

I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:

September 26th, 2009
2:47 pm

Mary Ruth Aull (one of many whackjobs at the G20 protests,) a retired nurse who has protested since the Vietnam War, cried the moment I asked why she decided to take to the streets. “I’m so appalled at the devastation of our mother Earth,” she said. “Mother Earth is crying out to us.” Her solution? “I would give up everything and live in a cave if I could, if doing that would save the Earth.”-WallStreetJournal

ew, an Earther.

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
2:47 pm

“Then why are you complaining that you can’t discuss it? if you are getting no responses, maybe it’s because everyone agrees with you…or no one WANTS to discuss it…but that doesn’t mean you CAN’T discuss it.”

I never said I CAN’T discuss it. If you reread my original post, I was more questioning Jay’s motivation in beating the birth certificate drum once again when there are far more important issues to discuss. Jay did run a piece a few weeks ago “explaining” why he thought the mandate was a good idea, but I was working and couldn’t participate.

I doubt that many people are quiet because they agree with me, though. Why? Because the solution to our “crisis” is to restore insurance to its rightful place as protection against catastrophic loss (i.e. $10,000 deductible or more). Only when people begin paying out-of-pocket again for routine medical care will the costs ever come down.

Ken Berwitz

September 26th, 2009
2:47 pm

Sorry for the several typos in my post. I’m writing a report and trying to debate this at the same time. (I’ve found a couple on the report too but, fortunately, I have the luxury of being able to fix them afterwards, which I don’t have here).

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:49 pm

“No matter how many ways this information is removed and withheld, so no one can check, you can’t find a reason to wonder why. Your lack of curiosity is astonishing”

And your lack of proof is just AWESOME. Hawaii has verified that the certificate posted is authentic and an official record of his birth in that state. Where is your PROOF that they are lying about it?

DoggoneGA

September 26th, 2009
2:52 pm

“trying to debate this at the same time.”

Repeating questions and assertions that have been repeatedly and officially debunked does not constitute “debate” – you’re doing nothing but repeating the lies.

Bruno

September 26th, 2009
2:56 pm

AmVet–I saw Tull for the first time out in LA in 1978, awesome show.

Never was a huge Foreigner fan, though their live show is entertaining. I do like the song “Starrider” from their first album.

Gotta envy you for the Alice shows–I missed him while he was in his prime.