The morning after the big health-care speech
Joe Wilson, the Republican congressman who very briefly turned President Obama’s speech into a raucous townhall meeting, has apologized for his ““inappropriate and regrettable” outburst. And according to CNN’s instant poll, the speech was a political success.
“”Going into the speech, a bare majority of his audience — 53 percent — favored his proposals. Immediately after the speech, that figure rose to 67 percent,” says CNN Polling Director Keating Holland.”
However, that result comes with two important caveats. One, a similar speech by President Bill Clinton briefly lifted support as well, but over time his reform effort crashed and burned anyway. Two, CNN’s polling universe included only those who watched the speech, and since Republicans weren’t that interested, the audience was heavily weighted toward Democrats. That means the people polled also tended to lean Democratic, a problem CNN acknowledges may exaggerate the real impact of the speech.
In the speech and in the post-speech analysis, a lot of attention has been paid to the issue of a public option, so I want to resurrect a conversation that occurred deep in the comments yesterday, because I think it might clear up some confusion.
Under the public option, a public corporation would be established to sell health care insurance to consumers in competition with private companies. The public option is considered important because in some parts of the country, one or two insurance companies so dominate the market that no real competition exists.
Conservatives generally make two critiques of the public option:
1.) Government is inherently inefficient and incompetent, so a public plan would also be inefficient and incompetently run.
2.) The public plan is secretly designed to run private insurance out of business over time, leaving only government to provide health insurance, the dreaded “single-payer” outcome that allegedly denies consumer choice.
3.) The public plan will cost taxpayers hundreds of billions of dollars we cannot afford.
Now, points one and two raise an obvious question. How could an inherently inefficient and sloppily run public plan drive presumably well-run, efficient private insurance companies out of business?
That’s apparently where Point Three comes in. The fear is that the public option would be given unfair advantages over its private competitors and would be subsidized with billions of dollars in federal money, allowing it to sell insurance at an artificially lower price that private firms can’t match.
However, House Bill 3200 explicitly rules that out. It states that the public option cannot run a deficit and must pay benefits and operating expenses only from the premiums it collects from its customers.
Here’s the language in the bill (NOTE: “Exchange-participating health benefit plans” means private plans):
(1) IN GENERAL- The Secretary shall establish geographically adjusted premium rates for the public health insurance option in a manner–
(A) that complies with the premium rules established by the Commissioner under section 113 for Exchange-participating health benefit plans; and
(B) at a level sufficient to fully finance the costs of–
(i) health benefits provided by the public health insurance option; and
(ii) administrative costs related to operating the public health insurance option.
Get that? By law, the premiums charged under the public option would have to FULLY cover both health benefits and administrative costs. No tax subsidy allowed.
The bill also states explicitly that the public option plan must abide by the same operating rules as private plans. That language is here:
“(2) ENSURING A LEVEL PLAYING FIELD- Consistent with this subtitle, the public health insurance option shall comply with requirements that are applicable under this title to an Exchange-participating health benefits plan, including requirements related to benefits, benefit levels, provider networks, notices, consumer protections, and cost sharing.”
So again, how could a public option that is inherently inefficient and sloppily run turn around and outcompete more efficient private firms? Logic and House Bill 3200 dictate that it could not.
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402 comments Add your comment
N-GA
September 10th, 2009
7:42 am
I look forward to the administration addressing the lies and distortions offered by the opposition. Obama said he would “call them out”. I really hope he does.
stands for decibels
September 10th, 2009
7:48 am
RW, downstairs, asks something that speaks to Jay’s topic, to wit:
How about proving you can do these things before we give you even more power to abuse.
I answer with a question:
How about your side acknowledge that our side won in a rather decisive 2008 mandate, based mostly on a promise to deliver healthcare reforms? That our side won that power legitimately? How about you stop using terms like “abuse” instead of “legislate?”
That would be kinda nice.
Peadawg
September 10th, 2009
7:49 am
I just don’t understand how all this is ONLY going to cost $980 billion and cost nothing to tax payers. It seems waaaaaay too good to be true.
Mrs. Godzilla
September 10th, 2009
7:51 am
Peadawg
I understand your concern. I was always suspicious we’d be in Iraq longer than 6 days, 6 weeks or 6 months….
The difference is the character of the individual making the statement.
N-GA
September 10th, 2009
7:52 am
Peadawg….Bush’s tax cuts were waaaaaay too good to be true!
I Report/ Vast White Wing Conspirator (-: You Whine )-:
September 10th, 2009
7:53 am
Yeah, ok, ignore the tax credits that will be used to pay the premiums for the public option.
And then cover your eyes, hold your hands over your ears and get ready for the very first government program that has EVER operated in the black.
What moon do you orbit, bookman?
Peadawg
September 10th, 2009
7:53 am
“The difference is the character of the individual making the statement.”
Ya, Obama sounded and looked pretty good last. But, you put a nice suit and on a politician and give him a very well written speech…..he’s still a politician. Republican, Democrat, Libertarian, it doesn’t matter. A politician is a politician….if you catch my drift.
stands for decibels
September 10th, 2009
7:56 am
the very first government program that has EVER operated in the black.
SS has always operated in the black.
Road Scholar
September 10th, 2009
7:57 am
Jay, how do the coops in agriculture and others work? Have any been subsidized? It is obvious (at least to some) that the buying power of a few can be enhanced by joining forces to buy for a group. I’d like to see coops first and then if they fail to do the job, then consider a government option. I don’t know what the evaluation and trigger criteria would be but this seems to adress most concerns regarding the government option. Wouldn’t a coop encourage “free market” ideals also ?
Obama wanted to stomp on the SC congressman, but thought otherwise. The President showed class; something we can learn. The congressman has apologized, so let it go. He’s probably cleaning urinals for the Republican camp now anyway!
Lord Help Us
September 10th, 2009
7:57 am
Palin got a wicked smackdown last night, without even mentioning her name. Let’s see if she sticks to her ‘death panel’ accusation or continues to walk it back…
It is amazing over the years to look upon the opposing sides of the aisle in Congress and see the distinction between the Left and Right.
Old white guys on the Right and a reasonable representation of all of America on the Left.
And one side will be growing over the next few decades…get used to it…
TW
September 10th, 2009
7:57 am
There you go again, Jay, basing your conclusions on ‘logic?’
Trying to reach the irrational with a rational argument is like expecting a House Republican not to show his bottom on national television…
At least the old white racists had the stones to use the n* word. This latest batch, what with their hiding behind language like ‘liberal’ and ’socialist’ would do themselves well to…grow a pair?
But then, what would you expect from a group that shuns the idea of American heart and character? Taliban much?
I always thought watching the rightwing gurgle about the drain would be rather humorous…didn’t expect it to be so pathetic.
Nobody likes a loser…nobody likes a loud loser
Doggone/GA
September 10th, 2009
8:00 am
“Conservatives generally make two critiques of the public option:”
Ummm…there are 3 kinds of people in the world: those who can count and those who can’t
USinUK
September 10th, 2009
8:01 am
“SS has always operated in the black”
the IRS has always operated in the black
Jay
September 10th, 2009
8:01 am
Subsidies to help lower-income Americans buy health insurance could be used to purchase EITHER the public option plan or any of the private plans available through the exchange, Whiner. No advantage either way.
Not that such facts will matter an iota to you.
Peadawg
September 10th, 2009
8:02 am
LOL Doggone!!!
NRB
September 10th, 2009
8:02 am
Like I said last night, Obama IS lying. Maybe not outright but he is.
The dems plan on granting amnesty to illegals in 2010. Obama said so in his speech while he was in Mexico last month. His own words.
So thats why the dems are willing to write into this health bill that illegals won’t be covered.
Because in 2010, all 15 million illegals will become citizens (albeit basterdized versions) overnight…and ta-da! Instantly eligible for guvmint healthcare.
And there’s the loophole for you folks…explained in a crystal clear manner that even a dumb liberal could understand (but will still deny).
Mrs. Godzilla
September 10th, 2009
8:04 am
“The dems plan on granting amnesty to illegals in 2010″……there’s your sign!
TaxPayer
September 10th, 2009
8:05 am
In other words, if private health plans are entitled to government subsidies then so is a public plan.
stands for decibels
September 10th, 2009
8:06 am
Shorter NRB @ 8.02: “We can’t pass OsamaKare ‘cuz they’ll legalize the Messicans next.”
I smell a Reichsmarshall Limbaugh talking point!
Well, this could be fun, but I gotta pay for all the insurance overhead and free-market system-gaming. Later, all.
USinUK
September 10th, 2009
8:08 am
NRB –
criminey – even your own FOX news disputes your version of amnesty.
Mrs. Godzilla
September 10th, 2009
8:09 am
oh and Peadawg
Yes, a politician is a politician. Just like a plumber is a plumber, a lawyer is a lawyer and a baker is a baker.
Some of each profession are rotten apples.
Obama remains a good guy.
Peadawg
September 10th, 2009
8:11 am
So Obama is the first HONEST politician? Wow get off the kool-aid. Please. I’ll believe it when I see it.
Gale
September 10th, 2009
8:11 am
I’m sorry to say I don’t trust Obama’s promises any more than I trust any politician’s promises. I do trust him marginally more than I trusted W. It is when the speech most moves me that I become suspicious of the content. At the end of the day, this deed is Congress’ to do. What the people are most tired of is partisan politics. We want congress to work together to solve the people’s problems.
And the cost? I have no illusions that it will not cost tax dollars. The money will come from somewhere. I work with accountants and I know how accounts can be juggled.
Road Scholar
September 10th, 2009
8:12 am
I watched the Repub response and didn’t get anything new out of it beyond what Obama said, except the dislike of a public option. Anything I missed? Why did the Congressman stop practicing medicine and go into politics? I guess the only Repubs they can get to speak are from Louisianna!
I also thought it was interesting that they selected as their rebuttal rep someone who’s political carreer would not be “damaged” by what/how he spoke (as reported on one station). I guess Jindal’s performance reduced the number of volunteers. Where was Sister Sarah? Was she available? Asked? This AM, Senator McCain said that she was wrong concerning the “death squads” ascertion.
Finally, “Two, CNN’s polling universe included only those who watched the speech, and since Republicans weren’t that interested…”: an interesting interpretation. Why listen to the original; you may actually hear the facts beyond having them twisted and shoved in your brain by Fox and the conserve talk show hosts.
TaxPayer
September 10th, 2009
8:12 am
If all the illegal immigrants choose to become taxpaying citizens if given the chance, great. I wonder how their current employers will handle the news.
Mrs. Godzilla
September 10th, 2009
8:15 am
Peadawg
Never did kool-aid. Ever read the ingredients? Never even had it in the house.
Obama is most certainly not the first……and I pray he won’t be the last!
TnGelding
September 10th, 2009
8:15 am
Apologies to Reporter. I was feeling a little frisky last night. At least he’s superior to me. (Not so frisky this morning, tho. I think that Mack truck passed through again during the night.)
Peadawg
September 10th, 2009
8:16 am
Mrs. Godzilla, you’ve been drinking something then. An honest politician is like a honest lawyer or a honest poker player….they don’t exist.
Doggone/GA
September 10th, 2009
8:17 am
“The dems plan on granting amnesty to illegals in 2010. ”
And your problem with that is? If they are granted “amnesty” they then cease to be illegal, don’t they?
Curious Observer
September 10th, 2009
8:18 am
There will be no public option in whatever bill emerges from Congress. Snowe and other moderate Republicans say it has to go, and even Blue Dogs won’t go for it. We’ll end up with a weak co-op provision, and the insurance companies will drive the co-ops out of business in less than three years. The insurance companies have bought the votes to defeat a public option and defeat effective reform as well. And just wait until you see how your group insurance premiums rise to accommodate the no-prexisting-conditions and no-cancellations provisions. Oh, there may very well be no projected increase in the deficit to bring insurance to the currently uninsured. But this so-called reform will be extremely costly–to the currently insured.
With no public option there can be no true reform. And there won’t be a public option. Did any of you notice all the anti-reform TV ads that ran after Obama’s speech? If you think what emerges from Congress will be real reform, then as Mrs. G would say, there’s your sign!
Cherokee
September 10th, 2009
8:18 am
NRB still thinks that Obama can magically grant amnesty to millions of people. How do you argue with someone who is so willlingly ignorant of how our system works?
Say anything
September 10th, 2009
8:19 am
With the Western Democracies teetering on the edge of bankruptcy, starvation and collapse, all due to their wildly unpopular, government-run, universal health-care bureaucracies, why would the President wish to doom our nation to failure by going down the same path?
Gale
September 10th, 2009
8:20 am
Now, Peadawg, everyone claims Jimmy Carter was an honest man. Yet he is widely criticised as a poor leader. I think in both cases, they are well-meaning people.
joe matarotz
September 10th, 2009
8:22 am
Obama made a better than average speech. He actually had some specifics for a change. I have no love for health insurance companies, so I have no burning desire to see things continue as they are. On the other hand, I think Obama is naive if he thinks this would work exactly how he envisions it.
The godernment has a proven track record of passing legislature that backfires once put in place. Just take a look at the various bills that have tried to ‘fix’ Wall Street over the last 20 years.
I don’t see how his concept of small businesses pooling together to negotiate lower rates would work. I work for a large international company and our negotiated rate still stinks. Our company is pretty generous in absorbing part of the cost, but it’s still a hefty chunk of my pay.
I wish our elected nitwits would actually put their minds to making this work instead of tearing it down. I’m pretty sick of partisan politics.
Now that Obama has spoken, let the idiotic comments flow in from both sides.
Just Say No
September 10th, 2009
8:22 am
You libs think you are so mainstream but the polls are showing that Americans do not approve of the way Obama is handling this healthcare deal.That oughta tell you how mainstream you are. Also Obama promised he will not sign a bill if it raises the deficit one dime.Which means we are not going to get a healthcare bill.HE PROMISED I WILL NOT SIGN A BILL IF IT RAISES THE DEFICIT ONE DIME. Remember these words.
TW
September 10th, 2009
8:23 am
What’s up with America not wanting to help pay for those who need help?
I know ‘w’ wiped his backside with The Bible, but I didn’t think we’d thrown it out…
And is paying Wilson’s ’salary’ really less an affront to the tax payer than throwing a hard working immigrant some medical attention when he needs it?
Ever notice those who question another’s work ethic are usually attepting to fill the silver spoon carved void in themselves?
USinUK
September 10th, 2009
8:23 am
Doggone –
“And your problem with that is? ”
my £££ is on: he thinks that there is going to be some guy hanging out at Home Depot handing out citizenship papers
GEORGE AMERICAN
September 10th, 2009
8:23 am
WHY WAS JOE WILSON THE ONLY PERSON THERE WITH THE GUTS TO CALL THE OBARMA WHAT HE IS:
A LIAR!!!
WILSON SHOULD BE GIVEN THE MEDAL OF HONOR FOR HIS HEROISM!!!
Old White Guy
September 10th, 2009
8:23 am
Lord Help Us
September 10th, 2009
7:57 am
“Old white guys on the Right”
That statement is stupid. Not all old white guys are on the right. I’m an old white guy who is definitely on the left! Being on the left keeps me young. Just the thought of being on the right…eeewwwwww!
Ma, where’s my Viagra? Come’re you little hippie chick, you…yummers…YAHOOO!!!
Gale
September 10th, 2009
8:23 am
Doggone, if you grant someone a pardon for a crime, it does not mean they were not guilty of a crime. Amnesty would give illegals a path in, but it won’t change the issue of their arrival.
Mrs. Godzilla
September 10th, 2009
8:24 am
Peadawg
I guess all bloggers are bat poop crazy?
All cops are on the take?
All lawyers are ambulance chasers?
All husbands cheat?
All wives get fat and sloppy?
All Republicans are Racists?
I suspect you are the one guilty of “Absolut” ism…..
USinUK
September 10th, 2009
8:27 am
JSN –
“You libs think you are so mainstream but the polls are showing that Americans do not approve of the way Obama is handling this healthcare deal.That oughta tell you how mainstream you are”
oh, dear. doncha hate it when people don’t know how to read polls???
not approving how Obama is handling the healthcare deal doesn’t mean that people don’t approve for the same reasons. Republicans will disapprove of him for even proposing it. Dems will disapprove for it not going far enough. Other people (like me) will disapprove for his total lack of grabbing the reins on this …
so, sorry, bubba, but that poll doesn’t mean what you think it means …
Road Scholar
September 10th, 2009
8:28 am
If you are against amnesty (probably with gaining citizenship requirements), then I assume you are for enforcing the present law and prosecuting the businesses who employ them? Oh, you’d probably want to give businesses a tax cut as punishment?
We not only can’t afford to round up ALL illegals, nor to ship them “home”. Why not devise a plan where they must obtain citizenship or be prosecuted, as well as prosecute any business or person who employs them. We can afford that!
Normal
September 10th, 2009
8:28 am
PEADAWG, can’t speak for lawyers or politicians, but the best poker players are the honest ones. If you’re good, you don’t have to cheat…just sayin’
NRB
September 10th, 2009
8:28 am
“there’s your sign!”
—————————–
Let me guess….oh medicated welfare-queen….complaining about illegal aliens is….is….ready for it? Raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaacist.
USinUK
September 10th, 2009
8:29 am
““Absolut” ism”
I prefer Grey Goose-ism … but that’s just me …
Peadawg
September 10th, 2009
8:29 am
Mrs. Godzilla…drama queen much? LOL. Talk about exaggerating…..
Mrs. Godzilla
September 10th, 2009
8:31 am
medicated welfare queen?
I am wounded….I weep…..I mourn……
te hee hee hee
USinUK
September 10th, 2009
8:32 am
Mrs G –
“I am wounded….I weep…..I mourn……”
I think there’s something you can take for that …
Mrs. Godzilla
September 10th, 2009
8:32 am
Peadawg….
drama queen I guess is better than medicated welfare queen…..
Never been a queen…..but my Pop still calls me his lil’ princess!