It doesn’t take Stephen Hawking to figure this one out
The conservative opinion magazine Human Events was reputedly Ronald Reagan’s favorite read, and to this day fancies itself the house organ for the hard-right intelligentsia. Among those published regularly in its pages are such luminaries as Newt Gingrich and Ann Coulter.
In my email this morning is a message from Human Events regarding the health-reform debate, warning of “government-forced extermination” of unborn children, grandmothers and grandfathers:
Grandmas and Unborn Babies Face Extermination by Obama’s “Health” Care Plan
Investors Business Daily has just exposed the Achilles’ heel of Obamacare, that hostile, socialist government takeover of your hospital, doctors, children, and grandparents. In an editorial entitled, “How House Bill Runs Over Grandma,” the editors report how President Obama was personally confronted by a North Carolina woman asking if “everyone that’s Medicare age will be visited and told they have to decide how they wish to die.”
In response Obama joked that he hadn’t yet hired enough bureaucrats to conduct such an operation, yet he could not deny the New York Post’s discovery the House bill “compels seniors to submit to a counseling session every five years (and more often if they become sick or go into a nursing home) about alternatives for end-of-life care” (pages 425-430). In other words, your grandmother will be told, when insufficient resources are rationed to young people, that her duty to die begins with mandatory “end-of-life counseling,” or as Obama explained, “encourage the use of living wills” that terminate otherwise salvageable lives prematurely through signed “do not resuscitate” (DNR) legal releases.”
In other words, these people have gone full-blown lunatic on us. Curious, I also looked up the Investors Business Daily editorial cited by Human Events. Published a week ago Friday, it is chock full of lies, distortions and other foolishness, such as the claim that the House bill would compel senior citizens to undergo mandatory euthanasia counseling every five years.
But my favorite part of the editorial deals with the British health-care system, which if you believe IBD is basically condemning the old and disabled to die.
“People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn’t have a chance in the U.K., where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless,” the editorial claims.
Of course, that same Stephen Hawking who wouldn’t have a chance in the United Kingdom was in fact born in the United Kingdom, has lived his entire life in the United Kingdom and lives there still today, at the ripe old age of 67. (He was in fact hospitalized earlier this month.) Hawking is, you might say, living, breathing proof that these people are first-class fools.
UPDATE: Investors Business Daily has corrected its editorial, removing all mention of Stephen Hawking. And Hawking himself has responded, telling the UK’s Guardian:
“I wouldn’t be here today if it were not for the NHS. I have received a large amount of high-quality treatment without which I would not have survived.”
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555 comments Add your comment
@@
August 10th, 2009
1:33 pm
Good grief! As is always the case, Mrs. Robinson claims:
“There’s a lot of bullying by certain elements of the Jewish community”
Damn those Jewish mobs.
Good Thing Stephen Hawking Doesn’t Live In The U.K. – Except He Does : Delaware Liberal
August 10th, 2009
1:34 pm
[...] is really becoming tiresome. (Via TPM) AJC columnist Jay Bookman noticed that in the latest Investors Business Daily editorial about how the ‘death panel’ will [...]
Doggone/GA
August 10th, 2009
1:34 pm
“That’s only if he lived here in the USofA, dude. Try to keep up”
and for quite a goodly portion of his life, he didn’t HAVE “millions”
Normal
August 10th, 2009
1:34 pm
WHO CARES: you said, Today, Nancy Pelosi and Steny Hoyer, in an article in USA Today, called the right wing protests “un-American.”
They are not “un-American” any more than we are “un-American.”
The right wing is right to seek to defeat Obamacare — with non violent civil disobendience, if necessary.
…And you are right, but why can’t it be with reasoned debate, with civility, instead of just plain bad manners? Non violent civil disobedence has it uses as with sit ins, marches, slogan shouting but
these people don’t want to reason and the hatred on their faces is scarey. One day someone will hurt someone else and it could turn on the Republicans, or special internests, etc.
stands for decibels
August 10th, 2009
1:35 pm
Y’know, maybe if they didn’t try to go for a 15-course banquet right from the start, but just passed some basic reforms that the folks could try and then say “y’know, this is really pretty good” then we’d make some progress.
Well, one man’s 15-course banquet is another man’s watered-down slop, of course. I look at what’s been proposed via HR 3200 and I lean more toward deeming it the latter, but figure that’s what the legislative process gets you in a representative democratic republic like ours.
AmVet
August 10th, 2009
1:35 pm
josef, in spite of his many pluses, was a tad thin-skinned.
And in this zoo, that ain’t gonna work.
With that said, I’d like to see him back.
jconservative
August 10th, 2009
1:36 pm
I say again – the House version of health care reform is DEAD.
The question on the table is what will pass the Senate, if anything, and what will go through the conference committee.
Yesterday felloe blogger Michael H Smith made a strong case that the co-op plan coming out of the Senate has a real shot of getting to Obama’s desk. I am not in favor of any new government healthcare plan – we have enough government healthcare plans now. But if I had to make a bet, I would put my $$ on the co-op plan being signed into law.
So while a bunch of protesters holler & scream about the House plan and go to congressional town halls – behind the scene the co-op plan is pregnant & about to give birth.
Chris Salzmann
August 10th, 2009
1:37 pm
People just need to go on http://www.factcheck.org and find out for themselves regarding the lies and distortion spread by industry hacks. Yeah, like Sarah Palin and “Obama’s Death Panel”, which BTW, was rebutted by the likes of Rep. Jack Kingston (R) of Georgia, who no one has ever considered a moderate, told Bill Maher there’s nothing to Palin’s attack. “It’s a scare tactic,” Kingston said. “No question about it.”
Yeah, scare tactics from folks who make a living preaching to the ignorant “Joe the plumber” masses.
Stephen Hawking wouldn’t stand a chance in the UK? | stelpavlou.com
August 10th, 2009
1:37 pm
[...] hat tip: Jay Bookman. [...]
WHY ARE WE BANKRUPT
August 10th, 2009
1:37 pm
By Charlie Reese
Politicians are the only people in the world who create problems and then campaign against them.
Have you ever wondered, if both the Democrats and the Republicans are against deficits, WHY do we have deficits?
Have you ever wondered, if all the politicians are against inflation and high taxes, WHY do we have inflation and high taxes?
You and I don’t propose a federal budget. The president does.
You and I don’t have the Constitutional authority to vote on appropriations. The House of Representatives does.
You and I don’t write the tax code, Congress does.
You and I don’t set fiscal policy, Congress does.
You and I don’t control monetary policy, the Federal Reserve Bank does.
One hundred senators, 435 congressmen, one president, and nine Supreme Court justices equates to 545 human beings out of the 300 million are directly, legally, morally, and individually responsible for the domestic problems that plague this country.
I excluded the members of the Federal Reserve Board because that problem was created by the Congress. In 1913, Congress delegated its Constitutional duty to provide a sound currency to a federally chartered, but private, central bank.
I excluded all the special interests and lobbyists for a sound reason.. They have no legal authority. They have no ability to coerce a senator, a congressman, or a president to do one cotton-pickingthing. I don’t care if they offer a politician $1 million dollars in cash. The politician has the power to accept or reject it. No matter what the lobbyist promises, it is the legislator’s responsibility to determine how he votes.
Those 545 human beings spend much of their energy convincing you that what they did is not their fault. They cooperate in this common con regardless of party.
What separates a politician from a normal human being is an excessive amount of gall. No normal human being would have the gall of a Speaker, who stood up and criticized the President for creating deficits.. The president can only propose a budget. He cannot force the Congress to accept it.
TheConstitution, which is the supreme law of the land, gives sole responsibility to the House of Representatives for originating and approving appropriations and taxes. Who is the speaker of the House? Nancy Pelosi. She is the leader of the majority party. She and fellow House members, not the president, can approve any budget they want. If the president vetoes it, they can pass it over his veto if they agree to.
It seems inconceivable to me that a nation of 300 million can not replace 545 people who stand convicted — by present facts — of incompetence and irresponsibility. I can’t think of a single domestic problem that is not traceable directly to those 545 people. When you fully grasp the plain truth that 545 people exercise the power of the federal government, then it must follow that what exists is what they want to exist.
If the tax code is unfair, it’s because they want it unfair.
If the budget is in the red, it’s because they want it in the red ..
If the Army &Marines are in IRAQ, it’s because they want them in IRAQ
If they do not receive social security but are on an elite retirement plan not available to the people, it’s because they want it that way.
There are no insoluble government problems.
Do not let these 545 people shift the blame to bureaucrats, whom they hire and whose jobs they can abolish; to lobbyists, whose gifts and advice they can reject; to regulators, to whom they give the power to regulate and from whom they can take this power. Above all, do not let them con you into the belief that there exists disembodied mystical forces like “the economy,” “inflation,” or “politics” that prevent them from doing what they take an oath to do.
Those 545 people, and they alone, are responsible.
They, and they alone, have the power.
They, and they alone, should be held accountable by the people who are their bosses.
Provided the voters have the gumption to manage their own employees.
We should vote all of them out of office and clean up their mess!
Charlie Reese is a former columnist of theOrlando Sentinel Newspaper.
What you do with this article now that you have read it……….. Is up to you.
Goldie
August 10th, 2009
1:38 pm
It’s really too bad that the Repug Party is so entrenched with the insurance industry that they will do or say anything to promote FEAR of healthcare reform… so, who stands to lose if there’s a public option allowed for healthcare coverage, other than the current health insurance profit $$$? First, they tried the “killing our old people” as their anti-Dem rhetoric, and now we hear it’s all about equating President Obama with Nazism.
Fear, fear, fear — is that all you right-wingnuts got???
Turd Ferguson
August 10th, 2009
1:41 pm
Agreed SalzBerger…Obama’s death/hit squad worrys me also. Whoever heard of such…a panel of illustrious, high falooting, smart-aces deciding who lives and who dies.
For once we can agree!!
Normal
August 10th, 2009
1:42 pm
Normal Your comment is awaiting moderation.
August 10th, 2009
1:41 pm
Jay, I read what Josef was trying to get posted and I could find absolutely nothing wrong with the content. We were discussing the War of Northern Aggression with Hill Billy and a couple of other posters a
few floors back. It was a testimony of Nathan B. Forrest and his standing up for the southern Black man in spite of being labeled the founder of the Klan… What could possibly be wrong with that?
Normal
August 10th, 2009
1:45 pm
Jay compare my 10:41 to my 10:42. That, my friend, is wrong and diminishes what I thought you were trying to accomplish here. Open minded discussions with good manners included is what it is all about, right?
AmVet
August 10th, 2009
1:46 pm
Hey take tomorrow off conned!
It’s a national holiday for you American Talibaptists!
Born on August 11, 1933 – Jerry Lamon Falwell, Sr.
Repeat after me, “..one nation, under our angry and Baptist God, indivisible…”
Denny
August 10th, 2009
1:47 pm
Any chance that Josef is diverted because of his name. The equivalent of a No-Fly list for the AJC blogs.
Bosch
August 10th, 2009
1:52 pm
Turd,
I got a letter today asking me to serve on Obama’s death squad – so
[cue scary laugh and music]
BWAAAAA HAAAAA HAAAAAA HAAAAA
and
BOOO!!!
Kamchak
August 10th, 2009
1:52 pm
Any chance that Josef is diverted because of his name. The equivalent of a No-Fly list for the AJC blogs.
No. It is merely a unthinking program designed to tag certain combination of letters.
Normal
August 10th, 2009
1:53 pm
Jay that was supposed to be NCCAP, so it must have been the other that keyed the moderation. why? political correctness.
RealityKing
August 10th, 2009
1:53 pm
Jay is sooo funny. He’s obviously one of those blind progressive morons that believe America could never go broke, not even if we spend trillions and trillions to build a legacy. My how an agenda changes some peoples perspective on debt.
Bosch
August 10th, 2009
1:55 pm
People, people –
The blog monitor is a computer program that sometimes has a computer fart and tags something it doesn’t like – it’s not Jay – it’s the program.
I’ve had posts moderated that were perfectly normal – it’s no big deal, just re-type your thought and move some words around.
Good lord – chill.
Night Train
August 10th, 2009
1:55 pm
Until Congress is required to join or be part of the single payer health care plan, it should not be passed.
f it is not good enough for our elected officials then it is not good enough for the masses.
Kamchak
August 10th, 2009
1:56 pm
Bosch
The Blues won the FA Community Shield. Sir Alex is miffed. It’s gonna be a contentious season between Evra and Ballack. Life was good this weekend.
Conservatives Are Stupid, Continued « The Good Democrat
August 10th, 2009
1:56 pm
[...] as others have pointed out, Stephen Hawking is a British citizen, lived in Britain his whole life. It seems he did indeed [...]
AmVet
August 10th, 2009
1:57 pm
Bosch, maybe the three or four scaredy cats here can all get a room together and blog from under a king sized bed.
Clearly, it’s much too dangerous for them to be out and about!
And they wonder why they keep getting decimated at the polls…
stands for decibels
August 10th, 2009
1:57 pm
I got a letter today asking me to serve on Obama’s death squad
Please. It’s a death PANEL.
And it’s true, because Sarah Palin put the words in between quotation marks.
Joey
August 10th, 2009
1:58 pm
Since the book is open on labeling Jay today:
How is Jay any different from Beck or Levin or Malkin or Ingram or Buchanan? Probably not at all except that he is vigorous in pushing Progressive issues and attacking Conservatives and Republicans, while they push Conservative issues and attack Progressives, Liberals and Democrats.
Mustafo
August 10th, 2009
1:58 pm
Your President Obama is now a liability to the democratic party. Everything is proceeding just as I have forseen.
Bosch
August 10th, 2009
1:59 pm
DB,
“Please. It’s a death PANEL.”
Ha ha – that’s what all of YOU think, I know better.
BWAAAAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!!
Boo wingnuts. You’ll be going before ME !!! Scared now? Uh huh. That’s what I thought!
Bosch
August 10th, 2009
2:00 pm
Hi ya’ Kamchak!
I’m soccer stupid right now – been working on the house. Keep me posted. Thanks!
AmVet –
Don’g wingnuts just make ya’ smile sometimes.
Hey wingnuts –
BOOOO!!!
Lil Kiley
August 10th, 2009
2:01 pm
Mommy…I dont wanna die, dont let mr obama and his death squad kill me just because I have 7 toes and a extra head the size of a baseball.
Normal
August 10th, 2009
2:01 pm
Am Vet Josef is an educator, and he loves what he does, and he was just trying to tell us a thing or two about Nathan B. Forrest that wasn’t in most history books. He used the triple K in making a point, and as I just found out, that was why he was moderated. This political correctness BS is…I don’t know. I know I preach good manners but General N. B. Forrest had a history with the triple k and all Josef was trying to point out to us was the Generals later work with/for the southern black man. I’d be a little thin skinned too.
I’ll tell him you’d like him back too. Maybe I can teach him the codewords I’m learning;>)
Davo
August 10th, 2009
2:01 pm
“The blog monitor is a computer program that sometimes has a computer fart and tags something it doesn’t like – it’s not Jay – it’s the program.”
Why even use it? I’ve never heard of anyone blushing to death from reading a provocative word.
I would rather have the ability (on my end) to just block certain members comments altogether…like Bosch’s for example.
Horst Wessel
August 10th, 2009
2:01 pm
The Horst Wessel Song (literal translation from the original German
Flag high, ranks closed,
The S.A. marches with silent solid steps.
Comrades shot by the red front and reaction
march in spirit with us in our ranks.
The street free for the brown battalions,
The street free for the Storm Troopers.
Millions, full of hope, look up at the swastika;
The day breaks for freedom and for bread.
For the last time the call will now be blown;
For the struggle now we all stand ready.
Soon will fly Hitler-flags over every street;
Slavery will last only a short time longer.
Flag high, ranks closed,
The S.A. marches with silent solid steps.
Comrades shot by the red front and reaction
march in spirit with us in our ranks.
AmVet
August 10th, 2009
2:01 pm
Yeah, the evil blog monitor robot blows.
And from experience, I can assure you that the phrase, “Parading around like a pavo”, though much less clear, will get through…
stands for decibels
August 10th, 2009
2:03 pm
He used the triple K in making a point, and as I just found out, that was why he was moderated. This political correctness BS is…I don’t know.
Normal, I’m pretty sure you have Whiner to thank for that bit of filtering. The little man-child was, once upon a time, fond of inserting those initials into the President’s first name. About a hundred times, give or take a thousand. Guess Jay got tired of it. Can’t say I blame him.
Why Use Facts When You Can Get Away with Outrageous Fabrications? • CrazyDrumGuy
August 10th, 2009
2:04 pm
[...] was the British National Health Service able to murder noted physicist Stephen Hawking and only the far-right Human Events magazine noticed? (Atlanta [...]
Peter Principle
August 10th, 2009
2:04 pm
“But for his personal wealth, Hawking would have long ago been pushing up daisies.”
Hawking first came down with the symptoms of amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (Lou Gehrig’s Disease) in the early ’60s when he was a graduate student at Cambridge. His family was not wealthy (his dad was a medical reseacher at . . . wait for it . . . a government-funded — i.e. socialist — research institute).
Grad students not generally being known for their great wealth, it seems safe to assume that Hawking spent many years as an ALS patient under the care of the National Health Service. Yet somehow he managed not only to survive but emerge as one of the world’s leading theoretical physicists — Britain’s wholly mythical “death boards” not withstanding.
In any case, leaving Hawking aside, if the British government really was denying care to ALS patients in a systematic way, something tells me we would have heard about it by now — not least from conservatives desperate to save American from the socialist nightmare of quasi-universal health care coverage.
I really do wish the wing nuts would think for at least a few seconds before throwing up these ridiculous arguments. It would save a lot of time.
Bosch
August 10th, 2009
2:04 pm
Davo,
It doesn’t necessarily block posts that have bad words in them, it just randomly blocks things sometimes – it’s no big whoop – it happens to us all.
Chill peeps.
Doggone/GA
August 10th, 2009
2:05 pm
“Why even use it? I’ve never heard of anyone blushing to death from reading a provocative word”
Because totally open forums get overrun in quick order by some really UGLY, NASTY, foulmouthed trolls and make it impossible to have anything approaching a decent conversation. Unmoderated forums are NOT FUN.
david wayne osedach
August 10th, 2009
2:05 pm
I lived in London and worked for three years. When I became sick NHS hospitalized me and then put me in a B&B until I recovered. Not bad for an illegal immigrant.
Davo
August 10th, 2009
2:06 pm
Why I’m a Radical Conservativeby
Jack Hunter on August 09, 2009
http://www.takimag.com/article/why_im_a_radical_conservative/
“Grandiose liberal efforts do not work, not because they are simply led by the wrong kind of men, but because they are led by men, period. “
Curious Observer
August 10th, 2009
2:06 pm
People who think that co-ops are the way to go in healthcare reform are delusional. Maybe you should give some thought to Blue Cross, which started as a co-op. The truth is that politicians have always been in bed with traditional healthcare insurance companies. The co-op that eventually became Blue Cross learned that painful lesson, as laws changed to favor traditional insurance companies. That co-op had no choice but to become a tradtional insurance company if it was to survive.
Moreover, neither state-based nor regional co-ops have the enormous leverage of any of the big seven health insurance companies. Just imagine being a co-op trying to strike a favorable deal with a network of hospitals and doctors after a giant like United Healthcare has told those hospitals and doctors that their own arrangement will become null and void if they give rates just as favorable to a co-op.
The opponents of a truly public plan won’t tell you the truth. I just did.
Terri/Terry
August 10th, 2009
2:12 pm
Will ObamaCare allow me to obtain the breast implants, female hormones and penis amputation in which Im so in need?
Chris
August 10th, 2009
2:12 pm
To Jay Bookman,
I believe you miss the point about Stephen Hawking, Yes he is a United Kingdom citzen, and yes he has lived there his whole life. When he was born and throughout a large portion of his adult life, the UK did not have their current universal healthcare in place. Now in his adult life, he has the financial resources to pay for his medical costs. He ODES NOT receive all his medical care via the current UK healthcare system. If a person was born TODAY under the UK’s current healthcare system, a good chance that person would not the care needed to rationing. This is the point they were.
bartkid
August 10th, 2009
2:13 pm
>Hawking, by virtue of his extreme personal wealth, has access to healthcare far beyond that of most with the same physical infirmities.
Mr. Hawking had Lou Gehrig’s disease before he was wealthy.
So, Mr. Hawking, by virtue of living in a country with nationalized medicine had been able to work and contribute to society, eventually his work has been able to earn him some personal wealth. (By the way, he did have a LOT of help from his wife who was his primary caregiver for decades. I’m just giving credit where it is due.)
Kileys Mom
August 10th, 2009
2:15 pm
Kiley, Im sorry honey but under mister obamas plan you will soon be taken from us. Probaby on some dark cold lonely night the storm troopers will kick in the door arrest us all except for your father who will be taken out back and shot.
After an intense interrogation we all will be set free except for you. Im afraid Kiley you, my dear, under the cover of darkness will be wisked away to live out your life as a mutant sideshow act much like the elephant men.
Im sorry honey.
Davo
August 10th, 2009
2:17 pm
” (By the way, he did have a LOT of help from his wife who was his primary caregiver for decades. I’m just giving credit where it is due.)”
Whom he divorced.
You gotta ask yourself….wtf is that all about?
stands for decibels
August 10th, 2009
2:19 pm
When he was born and throughout a large portion of his adult life, the UK did not have their current universal healthcare in place.
Steven Hawking: b. 1942
National Health Service: b. 1948.
Try again.
Doggone/GA
August 10th, 2009
2:19 pm
““Grandiose liberal efforts do not work, not because they are simply led by the wrong kind of men, but because they are led by men, period. “”
Same problem as with grandiose conservative efforst…reference the Iraq war for proof.
@@
August 10th, 2009
2:19 pm
behind the scene the co-op plan is pregnant & about to give birth.
Bundle that baby up. I’d welcome it with open arms.
Greg Mendel
August 10th, 2009
2:20 pm
“The blog monitor is a computer program that sometimes has a computer fart and tags something it doesn’t like – it’s not Jay – it’s the program.” — Bosch
Noooo!!! It’s a clear sign of DEATH PANEL activity!! Be afraid!
(First, they came for the geezers…)
Kamchak
August 10th, 2009
2:20 pm
Bosch
A hard fought game between Chelsea and Man. U. A little controversy on Chelsea’s second goal. Michael Ballack body checked Patrice Evra away from the play–no call. Evra fouled Ballack later–yellow card. There was no over time—went straight to penalty kicks—4-1.
I’ve been keeping up with your updates on your home. I was/am in the home construction biz and have some contacts, but I’m sure your insurance co. has plenty of referrals. Besides—an open forum is no place to discuss specific details of major transactions—like home repair or automobile purchases.
RealityKing
August 10th, 2009
2:22 pm
I pay $3200 a year for my family plan.., dental included. Thats 1/3 of the total premium. Which means that my company pays approx $9000 in tax deductable premiums.
Now it doesn’t take Stephen Hawkings to figure out what private companys are going to if a government option is passed that only fines them $1000 per employee if they drop healthcare that is no longer tax deductable. And it doesn’t take Stephen Hawkings to figure out that this will become most companies normal benefits packages as long as employees have a government option, especially in this job market. Nope.., even silly ole Jay should be able to figure out that our slightly reduced government option premiums will cost closer to $10,000 than my current $3200.
Now I don’t know about you, but I’m not willing to accept Obama’s progressive word on what private companies are going to do in the name of saving a buck or two.
AmVet
August 10th, 2009
2:22 pm
Davo, not being personal here, but you didn’t see that “commentary” as say-nothing drivel?
I’m not saying he doesn’t deserve to live, but this Hawking guy is a way out there science-loving loon isn’t he?
I believe he subscribes to the theory that the earth is NOT at the center of the universe and worse, warned that we must recognize the catastrophic dangers of climate change???!!!
What a Gore-led fool…
nowretired
August 10th, 2009
2:23 pm
AmVet
August 10th, 2009
1:29 pm
Excellent summary of the healthcare industry in the US.
Personal story from before I retired. My wife fell & fractured her pelvis. Needed physical therapy, insurance said 20 days of therapy only. Therapists’ said she needed 30 days. Insurance company would not budge. I paid for the extra 10 days out of pocket. (Could have bought a nice car for that amount.) Turns out the insurance company was wrong. After the extra 10 days she recovered completely.
She is younger than I & her insurance is now through COBRA from the company I retired from. It will lapse in a few months. I called the insurance agent who sold the policy to my old company asked them to find a policy for my wife. First question – Is she insurable, does she have a pre-existing condition?
I am on Medicare now Parts A, B & D. I have been to doctors several times. Seems like half the patients are Medicare patients. No one complains about Medicare including the doctors. (I am a nosy fellow & ask.) I know of no one who is eligible for Medicare who is not on that program.
For those of you concerned about Socialism – Medicard Part D comes courtesy of that famous Socialist president Bush 43. A lot of the guts in Part B comes from that other famous Socialist president Reagan (part of the deal he made with Tip O’Neill – remember no one reads the bills).
Have a nice day.
Turd Ferguson
August 10th, 2009
2:24 pm
Enough with the Bushisms…Its Obama mess now. He owns it!
blaze
August 10th, 2009
2:24 pm
Hey Class of ‘98…
Your jaw must have dropped when you heard Sarah Palin say that she supports Cap and Trade during the Vice Presidential debates. Either we take her at her word during a debate, or we just sit back and watch her position change like a kaleidescope.
Chet
August 10th, 2009
2:26 pm
Health care will get done. It will include a public option. And in a generation it will be as popular as Medicare and Social Security are today.
Chris
August 10th, 2009
2:27 pm
Bad typing on my part…Meant to typ…
“He DOES NOT receive all his medical care via the current UK healthcare system, he privately pays for it. If a person was born TODAY under the UK’s current healthcare system, a good chance that person would not the care needed to rationing. This is the point they were making.”
Turd Ferguson
August 10th, 2009
2:27 pm
Hmmm…a girl with kaliedescope eyes vs a girl with far-away eyes.
blaze
August 10th, 2009
2:28 pm
The worst think about these lies is that now seniors are less likely to get living wills or DNR orders. I am a firefighter and I resusitated many people over 90 years old with frail bodies. Imagine having firefighter separating your sternum with deep chest compressions and then having 300 joules shot through your body in the defibrillation process… especially right about the time you are “moving toward the light”. A living will or DNR order will let our very old parents die with dignity rather than awakening in the hospital with a separated sternum and burns on their heart (usually only to day days later anyway).
Nancy Pelosi
August 10th, 2009
2:28 pm
George, we’ve got a planet to save.
RealityKing
August 10th, 2009
2:28 pm
And only progressive fools believe that the government option network of doctors and hospitals will be the same size and quality as the one I currently get for $3200 a year.., dental included.
AmVet
August 10th, 2009
2:30 pm
“Enough with the Bushisms…”
I agree, the quicker we forget about the gigantic, stinking cesspool of problems BushCo orchestrated and left behind the quicker we can absolve them of culpability.
nowretired, I am sorry to hear about that. I am sure it gets repeated every single day for untold numbers of other decent, hard-working, contributing Americans, who don’t deserve to get shafted from this now corporate controlled country.
Had it not been for the stellar care I got from the VA, I would personally either be destitute or taking the long dirt nap…
Varius
August 10th, 2009
2:32 pm
Someone said that Hawkins has the cash to pay for the best care available in the UK. It’s not working like that. The thing is, and that need to be understood, is that the best care is available to everyone without paying anything directly. You get in and out, not calls to your insurance or “pre-existing whatever”. Sure you will wait for a scratch to your hand if a car crash victim enters.
People ask why so many Democrats are resisting the plan. Don’t you know? Millions of dollars…
But you guys in the Sates are so entrenched in that insurance oligopole that I’m not sure if that plan will be enough. Sad situation you guys are in..
peorgie tirebiter
August 10th, 2009
2:33 pm
How many millions will Barrycare kill? Will future generations compare him to Stalin or Hitler? This is real and Jay doesn’t believe it. Kill the old folks, force abortions! Kill kill kill the unfit!
Holy mackerel. Who opened up the insane asylum?
GOP is gone
August 10th, 2009
2:34 pm
What some people continue to fail to recognize is that all tax paying Americans are already paying for
the uninsured every time they show up in the ER for their health care. Hospitals do write off large amounts, but inevitably have to raise the rates they charge for services, thus increasing the cost of premiums to the insured.
And please everyone, do the research as to the pay packages given the top execs at the big health insurance companies. These people make the kind of money the Wall Streeters make. That money is generated by YOU premium payers and every person denied a procedure adds to the bonus money at the end of the year. They also employ a lot of people to make sure the fine print gives them an out if you do get sick and actually need the plan you have been paying for all those healthy years.
If you ask almost anyone who works in health care whether they think having a living will is a good thing, even if they are named Billie Bob and watch FOX 24/7, the answer would be a resounding yes. Leaving difficult decisions unmade because it is an uncomfortable topic is just plain stupid.
Maybe if Hawkings computer voice had a British accent the GOP might get a clue as to wear he lives.
mike
August 10th, 2009
2:35 pm
Hey, what do you know! Jay is spending another column telling us what his hyper-partisan peers on the right are doing. Big shocker. What do you expect? Jay to take a position and argue for it? Nah. Jay is here to attack Republicans, not to make any relevant point.
The reaction of the hyper-partisans on the left to the hyper-partisans on the right is not helpful to their cause. Voters have decided they are concerned about the bill primarily to issues of health quality and expense. The left hyper-ventilating about the hyper-ventilation on the right does nothing to move the needle. The Dems will be able to pass some kind of health care bill, but it won’t be anything near what they want it to be because they are utterly unwilling to make the case for it other than bleating about how evil Republicans are.
Chris
August 10th, 2009
2:37 pm
To Stands for Decibels..
UK’s National Health Service created in 1948 was NOT the Universal Healthcare system as we now know it to be. It had completely different policies as compared to current UK Healthcare Service
RealityKing
August 10th, 2009
2:37 pm
Massachusetts current bankrupt government option is already proving that people with rationed healthcare end up back in the ER rather than waiting in line for days on end.
stands for decibels
August 10th, 2009
2:41 pm
And only progressive fools believe that the government option network of doctors and hospitals will be the same size and quality as the one I currently get for $3200 a year.., dental included.
RK, I was going to let it go but since you insisted on posting twice about the same point–
You’re not getting that coverage for “3200/year.” You AND YOUR EMPLOYER are, by your estimation, shelling out nine grand per year. That’s what any public plan’s cost should be compared to; certainly it’s what the bean counters in your company are going to compare it to.
I suspect you’ll find, if you give ‘em a chance, the “progressive fools” in your midst have been studying this sucker a lot longer than you credit.
jconservative
August 10th, 2009
2:44 pm
WHY ARE WE BANKRUPT
Answer – because the voters go to the polls & elect the same people over & over. All the voters require is that the person on the ballot have the correct letter (R or D) after their name. People really believe in the labels: Republicans are Conservative; Democrats are Liberal.
The truth is that of the 535 members of congress there are exactly 0 conservatives. That’s correct – ZERO. All are career Big Government Liberals.
Supreme Court? Conservatives “interpreting” the Constitution? Take the New Haven firemen case. 5 to 4 decision written by the “conservative” Mr. Justice Scalia. What did he do? He created a new law – now any entity that believes it discriminated against a person must show that not only will they be sued but that they will lose the suit. New law on the books. Written by 5 men, legislating from the bench. Everybody that voted for Scalia raise you hand!
Over the years Scalia, with help from at least 4 other justices, has become the Number 1 rated Legislator in Washington, DC.
Ya’ll keep sending them same people up there year after year.
Doggone/GA
August 10th, 2009
2:44 pm
“UK’s National Health Service created in 1948 was NOT the Universal Healthcare system as we now know it to be. It had completely different policies as compared to current UK Healthcare Service”
So when did the current system go into effect? Because Hawkings physical problems did not begin to be apparent until he was in his 20’s…which would bring it to roughly the early 60’s.
USinUK
August 10th, 2009
2:46 pm
Bosch –
“I got a letter today asking me to serve on Obama’s death squad – so
[cue scary laugh and music]
BWAAAAA HAAAAA HAAAAAA HAAAAA”
you’re on the death panel???
I only got on the death wainscoting …
damn.
GOP is gone
August 10th, 2009
2:49 pm
Why are we Bankrupt?
Iraq, no regulation on Wall Street, many greedy lending companies and irresponsible borrowers.
USinUK
August 10th, 2009
2:51 pm
doggone (and chris)
“So when did the current system go into effect?”
I beg to differ with Chris – the NHS, when it was created, was meant to first of all, knit together all the disparate health services that were more locally provided and, secondly, make sure that everyone had access, regardless of their ability to pay.
as far as specific services, that may have changed over time, but if you look at the basic principles, that’s what NHS does now.
Mac
August 10th, 2009
2:53 pm
I tried to use a word to describe a bird with with spectacular plummage and a loud, screeching call on an AJC blog, but it would go because of the last four letters of the name pea—-. Stupid, huh?
USinUK
August 10th, 2009
2:53 pm
TF –
“a girl with far-away eyes”
how far away can the be?? are they on opposide sides of her head, like a fish??
mike
August 10th, 2009
2:54 pm
“But the general public is increasingly concerned about the possible costs of new health legislation. This may be particularly true of independent voters. In a recent Quinnipiac University survey, a whopping 77 percent of independents said they did not believe President Obama would be able to keep his promise that health insurance reform would not add to the deficit.
“These are the voters who broke strongly for the president last November and who were in his corner during the first months of his administration,” said Peter Brown, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University Polling Institute in a statement. “But on these key healthcare questions they are siding with critics who question whether healthcare reform is worth the projected cost.”
For the Obama administration and its Democratic legislative allies, one big concern is that as the health effort reaches a defining point, polls show that voter doubts on the subject may be growing.
A recent Wall Street Journal/NBC survey found that 42 percent of respondents thought Mr. Obama’s health plan to be a bad idea, while 36 percent considered it a positive move. Earlier this summer, that same poll found voters evenly split on that question.
Quinnipiac’s poll, released Aug. 5, found that 52 percent of respondents disapproved of Obama’s handling of the healthcare issue, while 39 percent approved. That marked a reversal of fortune from the organization’s July 1 poll, which found Obama’s rating on the question to be 46 percent approval and 42 percent disapproval.”
http://features.csmonitor.com/politics/2009/08/07/do-americans-agree-with-town-hall-protesters-on-healthcare/
Just remember, all of those majorities of Americans are all evil, stupid or evil and stupid, just like Jay and the rest of the left says. LOL
The tone deafness of the left on this one is pretty remarkable. If you guys want reform, you need to change minds and questioning the morality, intelligence and patriotism of the majority of Americans is a bad way to go about it.
Normal
August 10th, 2009
2:54 pm
Turd Ferguson
August 10th, 2009
2:24 pm
Enough with the Bushisms…Its Obama mess now. He owns it!
eah Turd, never accept responsibility for mistakes and always point the finger at someone else, even though common sense says another thing…Let’s see, Bush- eight years, Obama- not quite eight months.
But ya know what? President Obama has taken ownership and he will fix it. Help or get out of the way…just sayin’
Henk
August 10th, 2009
2:54 pm
So how were they to know he was from the UK, his voice simulator has an American accent.
lyle
August 10th, 2009
2:57 pm
And you can prove he’s been in the UK all his life, how? Do you have his birth certificate proving it? Didn’t think so. You fail!
USA!!! USA!!! USA!!!!
getalife
August 10th, 2009
2:59 pm
The cons are members of the me generation that feels no shame or empathy.
Debating these Americans is a waste of time but lots of fun watching them go off.
Kamchak
August 10th, 2009
3:01 pm
I only got on the death wainscoting…
damn.
Well show no empathy at all, and you can be on the death judge’s panel
mike
August 10th, 2009
3:04 pm
I am starting to wonder if the absurd and inflammatory speech from conservative partisans to keep liberal pundits from addressing any of the actual concerns of voters regarding health care. People like Jay and Nancy Pelosi cant help but obsess over the most controversial statements of the partisan right. Maybe Palin and Rush and the like have made incendiary comments about issues that the American people don’t care about to get the pavlovian left talking about things that the American people don’t care about. The left needs to be making a case that this bill will not bankrupt America. Instead they are running around talking about Palin’s calling the plan “evil”. Who comes out ahead on that one?
stands for decibels
August 10th, 2009
3:04 pm
Mike, you seem to have neglected to include this from your own linked story:
The good news for the White House is that polls show support for specific elements of its health insurance reform effort – including some of the most controversial ones.
For instance, Americans favor the establishment of a public health insurance plan to compete with private insurance providers, according to many polls. Majorities favor government subsidies to help lower-income Americans buy insurance.
Also, there’s the little problem of polling people about a non-existent “Obama plan” (as opposed to actual bills being worked out and voted on by congressional committees so far) but I figured I’d let that slide for now.
Say Rah
August 10th, 2009
3:05 pm
If all of you no good evil rotten Democrats would just act civil, us God-fearing Christians that know what you need and gonna give it to you whether you want it or not, could just commence with giving you what for. But, NOOOOO! You had to go and get all in our faces and get uppity. You done got some of our folks so upset that they done gone and dropped a gun. By the way, if a gun happens to turn up at a town hall meeting, just forward it to your nearest GOP headquarters and we’ll see to it that it gets returned to its rightful law-abiding owner. And, be civil about it. After all, it’s not like folks are pallin’ around with terrorists or worse.
mike
August 10th, 2009
3:05 pm
getalife –
“The cons are members of the me generation that feels no shame or empathy.”
Just curious. Which generation do you belong to? I am Gen X myself.
Turd Ferguson
August 10th, 2009
3:05 pm
LOL…The SS ObamaCare is taking on water and he bilge pumps are so flooded they cant keep up with the pace. Obama is in so far over his head it would be funny if it wasnt so scary. He will fix much of nothing and that you can take to the bank.
stands for decibels
August 10th, 2009
3:09 pm
The left needs to be making a case that this bill will not bankrupt America. Instead they are running around talking about Palin’s calling the plan “evil”.
mike, people are making the case. Media are hyping the food fight.
It’s what happens at any time, but more so during the silly season.
mitch
August 10th, 2009
3:09 pm
Hawking HAD to write his own book to come up with HIS OWN finances to GET the health care that keeps him alive today. It is HIS OWN MONEY the keeps him alive NOT the crappy NHS!!! You guys need to get the facts straight before you write these articles. This is why most Americans (the real America not the “expert polls”) is against national health care, we know the true facts.
mike
August 10th, 2009
3:11 pm
stands for decibels –
You missed my point altogether in your rush to a partisan knee-jerk reaction. I nver said that there was not support for some of his ideas. I was saying that polls show that the primary concern of voters is fiscal, not what Sarach Palin or anyone else said about “death boards”. If you want the public to get behind the plan, you need to talk to them about what they care about, not what you care about.
You know, listen to what people say instead of make assumptions based on which side of the fence they sit.
“Also, there’s the little problem of polling people about a non-existent “Obama plan””
Well, only one of the three polls cited mentions an Obama plan. Regardless, most voters know what the general contours of the plan will be including a public option, massive new expenditures, new regulations and expanded coverage.
mike
August 10th, 2009
3:13 pm
sfb –
“mike, people are making the case. Media are hyping the food fight.”
Right. The question is who are people listening to? “People” or the media.
Let;s also not forget that the Democrat leadership is jumping right into this nonsense:
http://blogs.usatoday.com/oped/2009/08/unamerican-attacks-cant-derail-health-care-debate-.html
bob k
August 10th, 2009
3:14 pm
Uh, Stephen Hawking was born in the U.K., is a citizen of the U.K., and has lived their his entire life. But why let the facts get in the way of a good argument?
j$
August 10th, 2009
3:15 pm
Obama ruined any chance for obamacare with his lame press conference regarding health care reform.
Obama, with his poor non-teleprompter speaking ability, along with the left wing radicals who are supporting whatever is thrown on the table, started the fire that will lead to nothing substantial in the way of health care reform.
horrible leadership.
RickD
August 10th, 2009
3:18 pm
“But for his personal wealth, Hawking would have long ago been pushing up daisies. As would those similarly afflicted but without such resources in America were Obamacare to pass.”
It’s noteworthy that opponents of health care reform have given up trying to defeat it by attacking it using conservative arguments, and are now (incredibly enough), trying to defeat it by using left-wing arguments! Obama’s health care isn’t comprehensive enough! It doesn’t cover the elderly! It’ll kill your grandma!
I would hope that intelligent people on all sides of the debate would concede that this latest tactic is good old-fashioned intellectual dishonesty. The people making this argument are not describing how health care would be under Obama’s plan, but rather how it _is_ currently.
It’s a style of argument based entirely on bamboozlement. They are trying to win the argument not by claiming that _their_ argument is better, but by claiming that _their_ argument is weaker, but it’s really Obama and the Democrats who are making it!
It’s a sign that they are losing. Certainly they’ve lost this argument with pretty much everybody except the media who, as is often the case, are at least a decade behind current affairs.
TnGelding
August 10th, 2009
3:19 pm
Turd Ferguson
August 10th, 2009
1:32 pm
Where would a consumer dependent economy be without the bunch of ungrateful lazy degenerates who do basically not much of anything except complain about wanting more? That’s one reason we’re in this mess. The super-rich accumulated so much they couldn’t manage it productively and resorted to investing in Ponzi schemes. Heaven help them if they had to buy U.S. treasuries; they might have to pay a dollar or two in taxes. Maybe we should make them tax exempt like the munies? Or better yet, start taxing the munies?
pat
August 10th, 2009
3:23 pm
AmVet
August 10th, 2009
1:29 pm
Irrefutable facts need backing, otherwise it’s all hearsay, and very refutable line by line…
Now quit standing there with your hand out waiting for obama to put something in it.
El Jefe
August 10th, 2009
3:24 pm
Isn’t it intersting that the demoncrats are calling the protest of ObamaCare unpatriotic. What was it when they were saying the surge in Iraq wasn’t working and the war was lost.