Obama sets a new foreign policy course
Well, he did it again.
In a speech yesterday in Moscow to graduates of the New Economic School, which teaches Western-style market theory, Obama once again acknowledged to a foreign audience that the United States isn’t perfect and that it can’t run the world single-handedly.
Shocking, I know. Here are excerpts from the speech:
In 2009, a great power does not show strength by dominating or demonizing other countries. The days when empires could treat sovereign states as pieces on a chess board are over. As I said in Cairo, … given our interdependence, any world order that tries to elevate one nation or one group of people over another will inevitably fail. The pursuit of power is no longer a zero-sum game — progress must be shared ….
By no means is America perfect. But it is our commitment to certain universal values which allows us to correct our imperfections, to improve constantly, and to grow stronger over time. Freedom of speech and assembly has allowed women and minorities and workers to protest for full and equal rights at a time when they were denied. The rule of law and equal administration of justice has busted monopolies, shut down political machines that were corrupt, ended abuses of power. Independent media have exposed corruption at all levels of business and government. Competitive elections allow us to change course and hold our leaders accountable….
So around the world, America supports these values because they are moral, but also because they work. The arc of history shows that governments which serve their own people survive and thrive; governments which serve only their own power do not. Governments that represent the will of their people are far less likely to descend into failed states, to terrorize their citizens, or to wage war on others. Governments that promote the rule of law, subject their actions to oversight, and allow for independent institutions are more dependable trading partners….
Now let me be clear: America cannot and should not seek to impose any system of government on any other country, nor would we presume to choose which party or individual should run a country. And we haven’t always done what we should have on that front. Even as we meet here today, America supports now the restoration of the democratically elected president of Honduras, even though he has strongly opposed American policies. We do so not because we agree with him. We do so because we respect the universal principle that people should choose their own leaders, whether they are leaders we agree with or not.
As president of the United States, I will work tirelessly to protect America’s security and to advance our interests. But no one nation can meet the challenges of the 21st century on its own, nor dictate its terms to the world. That is something that America now understands, just as Russia understands. That’s why America seeks an international system that lets nations pursue their interests peacefully, especially when those interests diverge; a system where the universal rights of human beings are respected, and violations of those rights are opposed; a system where we hold ourselves to the same standards that we apply to other nations, with clear rights and responsibilities for all.
Those who have claimed that Obama’s foreign policy is a rehash of that of George W. Bush are very much wrong. In the wake of Sept. 11, you may recall, Bush instructed the world that “a coalition partner must do more than just express sympathy, a coalition partner must perform.”
“Over time it’s going to be important for nations to know they will be held accountable for inactivity,” Bush said. “You’re either with us or against us in the fight against terror.”
Obama is explicitly rejecting that unilateralist approach in favor of an approach in which the United States leads by example and moral authority rather than by dictate. It is a very different message delivered by a very different American president, and it’s going to be fascinating to see what effect it has on the rest of the world.
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236 comments Add your comment
RealityKing
July 7th, 2009
4:16 pm
Nope.., theres nothing Reaganesk about this progessive liberal.
RealityKing
July 7th, 2009
4:17 pm
Meanwhile.., in the spirit of leading by example, our 111th Congress opens the door to another non-job stimulating government spending package.
S GA dem
July 7th, 2009
4:18 pm
And that’s why I voted for President Barack Obama.
WhoCares
July 7th, 2009
4:33 pm
now let’s all hold hands and sing kumbaya cuz I’m sure the rest of the world loves us now.
WhoCares
July 7th, 2009
4:36 pm
and that’s why I didn’t vote for Obama.
ByteMe
July 7th, 2009
4:36 pm
Obama is explicitly rejecting that unilateralist approach in favor of an approach in which the United States leads by example and moral authority rather than by dictate.
Not to be too much of a cynic, but so far Obama has the luxury of pursuing this course. Let’s see what happens if NK misfires a missle into the middle of Japan.
Joey
July 7th, 2009
4:37 pm
“Fascinating to see” the effect. I sincerely hope that Jay is right and I am wrong about this one.
But I believe words less complimentary than fascinating will be chosen, even by an honest Jay, to describe the effect in the near future. The too near future.
George American
July 7th, 2009
4:43 pm
George Bush was right. B. Hussane O is wrong. Your either for us or against us.
Enough of this weak chicken-chick negotiating with the enemy. It is treason!
Paul
July 7th, 2009
4:43 pm
What he was saying to the Moscow audience was also, under the surface, a message to the Russians about Russia and the course they’re on. Phrasing things in such a way is known as ‘diplomatic’ language.
I don’t read this entire speech so much as applicable to events after 9-11. Bush’s approach was different from the past – identifying an enemy, calling for action. The Taliban refused, their government fell. I will submit there was doubt we would act. (Saddam also said, right up until the invasion, he did not think we would follow through). Such actions were a departure from the recent past and were a call to our allies that talk is cheap, the situation was grave and action was needed. Many did cooperate, on military and nonmilitary fronts. It’s been well documented the changes in tracking movement of funds in support of AQ, for example.
Pres Obama was also reiterating, a couple days after July 4, the principles that do, in fact, transcend America. It gets back to the “we hold these truths to be self evident” idea. They may transcend us, but we are their leading advocate. This is a message to the world, be they allies, opponents or background observers.
Pres Bush’s tone after 9-11was undoubtedly stronger than what we, or the Europeans, were used to. Pres Obama’s tone is different. But it’s a tone tempered by a situation where an enemy has in many cases been effectively stymied and disrupted, not an enemy who has just conducted a successful, massive attack on our homeland.
What’s about the same is the level of support given by our allies. Some things won’t change much, regardless of tone.
RealityKing
July 7th, 2009
4:43 pm
“no one nation can meet the challenges of the 21st century on its own”
“an international system that lets nations pursue their interests peacefully”
“a system where the universal rights of human beings are respected, and violations of those rights are opposed” (without force)
This is the same ole liberal pipe dream that failed in 70’s. Paramount to an Obama green light for Iran, and other Middle Eastern nations, to go Nuclear.., while being opposed(without force).
Mrs. Godzilla
July 7th, 2009
4:44 pm
Damn I’m glad I voted for Obama.
Dusty
July 7th, 2009
4:48 pm
Well, I read the first sentence and I think that will do for a long time. I am getting a little tired of Obama putting down the USA so we will look “good” in Asia. And I certainly don’t want to hear Bookman telling us how great it is. Or somebody else mewling about; we don’t want to be “dominant”.
How about acitng like you like the USA? Wouldn’t that be nice too.?
I’m leaving to get busy. If I goof off any more someone might think I am a liberal! OOOwwww No!.
RealityKing
July 7th, 2009
4:49 pm
ie.., the oppression of the weak will bring only meaningless gestures from America under the Obama administration.
Brad Steel
July 7th, 2009
4:49 pm
Ah yes, what lovely relief form the hegemony of the anachronistic cold warriors.
It’s refreshing to have a president that has the prescience to realize that Gun Smoke is not the best show on TV.
TUESDAY VANDY GIRL
July 7th, 2009
4:50 pm
We now join the kenyan village idiot in progress, “Uh Uh Voldomort Putin , Brother, You are uh uh a great uh uh President of uh the soviet Union. Oh My bad Brother..haha how do you like my usage of brother instead of brotha..very white of me haha haha uh uh..you uh uh are not President uh uh and it is uh uh Russia now..It isn’t my fault, uh uh, America is not perfect it is Americas fault. ”
OBAMA, YOU ARE AN ASS!!! YOU ARE NOT MY PRESIDENT!!!
Brad Steel
July 7th, 2009
4:51 pm
RealtyKing and Dusty,
Isn’t Gun Smoke on now?
RealityKing
July 7th, 2009
4:51 pm
Can you hear that?? Putin and the Mullahs are laughing at Obama’s naivety..
Brad Steel
July 7th, 2009
4:52 pm
Enter your comments here
Enter your comments here
July 7th, 2009
4:54 pm
VANDY GIRL,
You are a bigot. Please quit holding back. Go ahead and say it. The code language is all too transparent. Quit tap-dancing around the epithets.
George American
July 7th, 2009
4:56 pm
When will the ASS learn that:
USA is #1 !!!!!!
TUESDAY VANDY GIRL
July 7th, 2009
5:00 pm
Enter, I obey the rules of the JayJay
Paul
July 7th, 2009
5:01 pm
Vandy
It’s “Voldemort.” With an ‘e.’
RealityKing
[[This is the same ole liberal pipe dream that failed in 70’s. Paramount to an Obama green light for Iran, and other Middle Eastern nations, to go Nuclear.., while being opposed(without force).]]
“Liberal Pipe Dream?” Like the Declaration of Independence? And what’s that green light for all the nations in the ME to go nuclear? I must be color blind, or deaf.
Dusty
Don’t you think it’s possible that in that first sentence he was speaking to the Russians, about themselves?
RealityKing
[[the oppression of the weak will bring only meaningless gestures from America under the Obama administration.]]
There’s more than a couple guys on Wall Street who might disagree with that.
Or, if you want to stay on foreign policy, I’ll add ‘in Afghanistan.’
@@
July 7th, 2009
5:01 pm
Well I’m just hopin’ he can get all those new found “friends” to join him in his Af/Pak-age.
Poland is to Russia what Iran is to the United States. He’s left the heavy-lifting on BMD to Hillary — further negotiations to take place in the fall.
Stratfor (croak Kamchak croak) has a view of the summit from China’s, Iran’s, Germany’s, Poland’s and Turkey’s perspective. Who’s goin’ under the bus?
Scooter
July 7th, 2009
5:03 pm
Dusty @ 4:48 pm,
I agree that turn the the other cheek stuff didn’t work for Carter but maybe it will work for Obama. ?????
WhoCares
July 7th, 2009
5:08 pm
Every time I start to think maybe the republicans are in trouble Obama makes a speech like this and I realize it’s just a matter of waiting till 2012.
getalife
July 7th, 2009
5:11 pm
“The Supreme Court is ready to undo the ban on corporate spending in elections for president and Congress”
I think they should go ahead and move government into corporate establishment buildings.
Geez.
jt
July 7th, 2009
5:14 pm
“The rule of law and equal administration of justice has busted monopolies, shut down political machines that were corrupt, ended abuses of power.”
Not nearly enough.
“. Independent media have exposed corruption at all levels of business and government”
To no avail.
“Competitive elections allow us to change course and hold our leaders accountable….”
Unless you torture. And you want to CYA on the next election.
Scooter
July 7th, 2009
5:18 pm
WhoCares @ 5:08 pm,
When the lower income folks don’t see the “hope & change” they expected they won’t vote for him again. It’ll be interesting!
Paul
July 7th, 2009
5:18 pm
@@
Interesting, seeing things from another’s perspective. Right after I read your post this popped up. In the context of this thread, the Russian PM’s perspective is worthy of consideration:
“Russia’s Prime Minister Vladimir Putin praised the hospitality and openness of U.S. former President George W. Bush in a telegramme sent hours before meeting his successor Barack Obama.
“During the last years we have been working on strengthening Russia-U.S. cooperation. Although there were differences between our countries, I always valued your openness and sincerity,” Putin said, congratulating Bush on his 63rd birthday on July 6.
“With special warmth I recall your hospitality in the Crawford ranch and your family estate in Kennebunkport,” Putin wrote”
RealityKing
July 7th, 2009
5:22 pm
Joe Biden was wrong about other countries needing to test Obama’s sand.., he has just proven his incompetent leadership abilities all by himself.
pat
July 7th, 2009
5:23 pm
He’s an idiot. It’s all a dog and pony show. Grand standing and self aggrandization while appearing to accomplish much, but doing very little. He can make speaches though. I want to see something of substance come from this administration, instead of a long line of failing do nothing policies.
Whooptie do, we both aggree to disarm our most outdated and least effective nukes. Big deal. I’ll have a big yawn over this one.
I Report (-: You Whine )-:
July 7th, 2009
5:25 pm
governments which serve only their own power do not (survive.)
So who’s he talking about, us or them?
If it is us, hail the very first time that Obozo has made any sense, and here I thought it would never happen.
Silly me
~~~~~
But then, because you just can’t help yourself, you go here:
“liberals are just the sickest, most disgusting filth that has ever roamed the face of the earth, gross, eewww.”
So now we have a problem. A problem with a simple solution: Go there again, and you’re gone. No comeback. You’re gone, permanently, like GodHatesTrash and CommieAJC and others on the list. Sayonara forever.
Tom
July 7th, 2009
12:23 pm
These weak, pathetic NeoCon goons know not the meaning of the word, “conservative.” For them, it merely coincides with hatred, bitterness, jealousy, intolerance, ignorance, and sooo much more.
The disgrace of a nation. It is not at all unusual for the weak and endangered to chew each other up!
And sure enough, there it still sits, unmolested.
jt
July 7th, 2009
5:27 pm
T]he Central American country was being pressured to restore the authoritarian Mr. Zelaya by the likes of Fidel Castro, Daniel Ortega, Hillary Clinton and, of course, Hugo himself. The Organization of American States, having ignored Mr. Zelaya’s abuses, also wants him back in power. It will be a miracle if Honduran patriots can hold their ground. … [Hillary Clinton] accused Honduras of violating ‘the precepts of the Interamerican Democratic Charter’ and said it ’should be condemned by all.’ Fidel Castro did just that. Mr. Chávez pledged to overthrow the new government. Honduras is fighting back by strictly following the constitution. … The struggle against chavismo has never been about left-right politics. It is about defending the independence of institutions that keep presidents from becoming dictators. This crisis clearly delineates the problem. In failing to come to the aid of checks and balances, Mrs. Clinton and [OAS Secretary General José Miguel] Insulza expose their true colors.” –columnist Mary Anastasia O’Grady
Birds of a feather.
I Report (-: You Whine )-:
July 7th, 2009
5:32 pm
Cue the Kremlin licking their chops.
jt
July 7th, 2009
5:32 pm
“governments which serve only their own power do not (survive.)”
I guess their is hope.
Right before the Soviet Union collasped, it was estimated that the strong centralized goverment was seizing 95% of every citizen’s wealth.
(of course everything was free).
I guess we have about 45% to go.
Hopefully this cap and tax, healthcare, and other taxes will speed the process.
Normal
July 7th, 2009
5:40 pm
Whiner, there you are! Bless your heart…
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
5:41 pm
The speeches for public relations are one thing. I’m far more interested in what deals were cut in the back room. This is a KGB operative’s front man and a Chicago politician we’re talking about here.
Pogo
July 7th, 2009
5:41 pm
You forget one thing comrade Jaybird; the rest of the world is just as interested (if not more so)in promoting their political, religious and economical agendas on everybody else as we Americans are. Most of the world’s powers would like nothing more than to bring America down to their standard of living and to weaken it because quite frankly, they are jealous of our system’s success and will use absolutely anything, whether it be global warming legislation (which they will not adhere to themselves) to further weaken us. It doesn’t help us at all that we have a leader who apologizes for our success day in and day out. Yes we have our problems but, historically, the American system has provided a better standard of living for more people than any other system in the history of the world. Just why is it people from other countries want to come here you think? Obamas international “confessionals” only re-enforce the world powers belief that America now has a capitulative leader they can manipulate and they are exactly right. Putin must have been laughing when he heard the words of the naive Obama. Much to the shagrin of you liberals, Shangri-la does not exist no matter how much you and your liberal friends want it. You want to believe that if we apologize enough, if we spend enough and that if we bow to international input into the way we run our country enough, that peace and harmony will exist. You are just as naive as Obama Jay. The world is a good place but man is a predator and he is greedy for power and it doesn’t matter if he is American, French, Iranian, Russian or anything else. Power is the corruptor and it happens to all but the best of men. Obama has certainly fell for its enticements more than any American president has in a long time. Obama makes himself look more the fool everyday he is in office with his self adorement. He is absolutely taken with himself to the point that he thinks just his words and their delivery can make everything great. What an idiot.
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
5:42 pm
NORMAL–Ain’t it good to see him? I cast my vote this a.m. to keep him.
getalife
July 7th, 2009
5:42 pm
The Iraq disaster was anything but perfect.
Other countries will have to rule the world now.
We are in recovery from the w destruction.
@@
July 7th, 2009
5:48 pm
Obama, for a second time — once here and now in Russia has verbally dismissed Putin as irrelevant. Putin can still play the Iranian card.
Whoops! He just did…
Russian government office Deputy Head Yury Ushakov on July 7 said, “Obama said emphatically that Russia and the United States could cooperate more intensively on Iran, that Russia’s role is extremely important there and that America is interested in stronger cooperation,” Interfax reported. Ushakov was speaking to reporters after a meeting between U.S. President Barack Obama and Russia Prime Minister Vladimir Putin.
Kinda like Putin calling out to Obama. “Did you drop (lose) something?”
Swami Dave
July 7th, 2009
5:49 pm
Such interaction and expectation might have merit if many of the world leaders whom we could name were worthy of trust and could be counted upon to act in an above-board, transparent fashion. As it is, this philosophical vision operates under what I would be consider to be unlikely circumstances. It also operates under the relativist perspective that “all ideas are equally valid”.
They are not. In a universe governed by physical laws and a largely boolean existence (true & false), the likelihood that such a naive perspective predicated on “Well, we want you to like us – so let’s be friends” would lead to effective governance is low. Most rational people accepted that this 1970s era feel-good utopianism was a recipe for failure a long time ago.
Of course, when the leader is a throw back to the failed policies of 70s era appeasement internationally and collectivist redistributionism domestically, one should not be surprised at their adherence to a historically-discredited, globally-disproven, and fiscally-irresponsible philosophy based on how things “should be”.
Here’s to continued opposition to the failed direction that he and his charlatan band are attempting to lead this nation.
-Swami Dave
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
5:50 pm
“…and when Joe the Georgian gets here,
well dance, dance, dance…”
–Al Stewart
Jus’ sayin’
I Report (-: You Whine )-:
July 7th, 2009
5:54 pm
So anybody want to bet which country will be first to produce some new sociopath who kills millions of innocent people because the world no longer has a moral authority to protect them?
I got Zimbabwe, what a marvelous way to eliminate inflation.
jt
July 7th, 2009
5:57 pm
This is from some chick in Honduras-
For a long time, Honduras has been seen by the eyes of the international community as a small, impoverished country that survives on the handouts of the economic powers. To a certain extent this is true. We do depend on U.S. and European economies. We have no oil. We do not produce goods, and we do not export technology. Our main income comes from tourism. As of this moment, our country faces a challenge that may change our history for years or even decades to come. We have two choices. We can choose to bow our heads, bend our knees, be silent and let ex-president Zelaya come back to the presidential seat, and fall further down the spiral on which he has led us so far. We can let him take power and become another stronghold for Chavez’s led socialism. We can choose to let Zelaya become one more dictator in the same fashion as Evo Morales, Daniel Ortega, Rafael Correa, and the masterminds behind this all — Hugo Chavez and Fidel Castro. Our second choice is to take a stand. What we did was to defend and uphold our constitution. We said no to tyranny. That was our choice. We chose to live in freedom. To President Obama, to the UN, to the OAS, to the European Union, to The World Bank, The International Monetary Fund, to the world, we say: We are a free, sovereign and independent country, and we choose to take a stand. We take a stand, even if we have to stand alone.” –Tegucigalpa, Honduas
Obama reacts to a constitution, not unlike a vampire to a cross. Even foreign constitutions.
AmVet
July 7th, 2009
6:08 pm
“Nope.., theres (sic) nothing Reaganesk about this progessive (sic) liberal.”
(I wonder if that is similar to Reaganesque? No matter.)
The bottom line, thank gawd!
Other wise the Uppity One would be arming, aiding and abetting (often illegally, but hey what’s the law of the land when you’re a Republican?) every puppet dictator from:
Salvador (where he empowered and enabled murderous brutes and thugs in the name of anti-Sovietism) to
South America (when Republicans and Democrats joined together in Congress to impose economic sanctions on the government of South Africa, Reagan vetoed the measure.)
to Nicaragua (we all know about the lying before Congress Ollie illegally selling arms to Iran to raise money for those central American murderers without the Senile One supposedly knowing about it)
to the the Philippines (where George H.W. Bush, toasted Marcos’ “adherence to democratic principles.”)
to Chile’s Pinochet ( a real Republican at heart, that one)
to the fascistic and anti-Semitic junta of Argentina, which tortured, slaughtered and disappeared its political opponents to our old, former buddy Saddam Hussein.
The irrefutable fact is that the train wreck and faux conservative Reagan embolden torturers and murderers around the globe and gave many of them arms and money.
No matter how brutal and tyrannical, if they weren’t red they were good enough for Ronnie.
But shhhh! Don’t tell the conned. They think he was just a really good guy and a really great prez…
Wyld Byll Hyltnyr
July 7th, 2009
6:09 pm
The only way Obumbler could be any more submissive is if he were to beg Medvedev and Putin to give him a golden shower. With this callow, inexperienced mental midget in command it is no wonder that foreign leaders are “smiling like a retard* looking at an ice cream truck” when they see him coming.
* – nothing demeaning is intended through the use of this Alabama colloquialism.
getalife
July 7th, 2009
6:09 pm
Two have stepped up to the plate:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/nicolas-sarkozy/alliance-for-change_b_227049.html
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:12 pm
“The days when empires could treat sovereign nations as pieces on a chess board are over.”
Wonder how that went over in Tblisi?
Normal
July 7th, 2009
6:14 pm
Josef; I cast my vote this a.m. to keep him.
-
Geeze, I did too, ain’t we a pair
———–
Does anyone know if George American and Vandy Girl are dating? Just askin’
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:15 pm
I Report (-: You Whine )-:
Zimbabwe is a contender, but I’d keep my eyes on the Uigurs.
jt
July 7th, 2009
6:15 pm
AmVet- you commented. . “They think he was just a really good guy and a really great prez…”
He was a really good guy surrouded by crooks and scoundrels.
Just like Jimmy C., he was too DECENT to be involved with the presidency.
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:19 pm
NORMAL–well, I thought he did make a valid point about some of the other outrageous and vulgar comments…
Vandy Girl and George—hmm, are you suggesting their sharing a sheet? Jus’ askin’
Normal
July 7th, 2009
6:20 pm
History tells us that it takes a crook to run our country. Look at Nixon, Reagan, Both Bushes…Wait, They are all Republicans…Go figure.
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
July 7th, 2009
6:23 pm
It amazes me that the conservatives on this blog think that talking tough means you are tough and will keep folks in line. The toughest guys I ever knew never talked about how tough they were but they could more than take care of themselves if they had to. To say America is not perfect is not a put down. No one responds positively to arrogance. To say America admits to imperfection and reflects on it and is always changing in a positive way is true and something that all people can respect.
Before WWI and two the U.S. did not run around the world dictating to other countries and talk tough. Remember “walk softly but carry a big stick”?
Conservatives have it so wrong on how this country should conduct foreign policy that it is mindboggeling.
jt
July 7th, 2009
6:24 pm
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:12 pm
“The days when empires could treat sovereign nations as pieces on a chess board are over.”
Yeah, now it’s more like Monopoly as China buys one slice of California after another.
mike
July 7th, 2009
6:24 pm
” In the wake of Sept. 11, you may recall, Bush instructed the world that “a coalition partner must do more than just express sympathy, a coalition partner must perform.””
Is this not true today? Has Obama not admonished Europeans to send troops to Afghanistan? Are Russia and China not needed to deal with Iran and North Korea?
“You’re either with us or against us in the fight against terror.”
This was specifically directed at countries like Pakistan who Bush insisted stop playing a double game. Again, Obama has been quite clear that he expects the same from Pakistan.
“Obama is explicitly rejecting that unilateralist approach in favor of an approach in which the United States leads by example and moral authority rather than by dictate.”
Nonsense. He is still telling NK and Iran that their weapons programs are unacceptable, still escalating the Afghan war with limited support from allies, and is telling Israel what to do about settlements.
Obama’s rhetoric made be more self-effacing in speeches, but the polices are still the same. Jay and the rest of the Bush haters/Obama puffers will never admit it, but it is clearly the case.
TUESDAY VANDY GIRL
July 7th, 2009
6:25 pm
World Power is a zero sum gain, someone gains power,someonehas to lose power..there is NOTHING wrong in wanting the power to reside here. i don;t give a damn about other countries..and beleive me they do not give a damn about us(you). Altruism is for fools and fables.
Normal
July 7th, 2009
6:26 pm
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:19 pm
Vandy Girl and George—hmm, are you suggesting their sharing a sheet? Jus’ askin’
–
Scaring me to death
Normal
July 7th, 2009
6:29 pm
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
July 7th, 2009
6:23 pm
-
Only the weak have to posture and shout. The strong have no need to…Just sayin’
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:30 pm
jt–
“Yeah, now it’s more like Monopoly as China buys one slice of California after another.”
I couldn’t agree more.
jt
July 7th, 2009
6:30 pm
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia – You commented.
“Before WWI and two the U.S. did not run around the world dictating to other countries and talk tough. Remember “walk softly but carry a big stick”?”
You are a victim of revisionist history or ignorant of the same. Respectfully.
I understand your distaste for armchair chickenhawks. They are not conservatives. Maybe GOPers, but not conservatives.
@@
July 7th, 2009
6:32 pm
AmVet:
(I wonder if that is similar to Reaganesque? No matter.)
Then why mention it at all? Since you did…
Other wise!!?!!
Are you ^^^ self-proclaiming?
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:33 pm
“Before WWI and two the U.S. did not run around the world dictating…?”
Clemenceau to Lloyd George on Wilson’s 14 Points: “but G-d H-mself had only 10.”
As the GOP Churns
July 7th, 2009
6:33 pm
Well, Tuesday’s Girl, why have you not picked up some big guns and went about acquiring you some power with them, if power is what you really want.
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:35 pm
Is there anything happening in the world besides MJ? I’m a fan of his music, too, but for G-d’s sake plant him and be done with it…!
DoggoneGA
July 7th, 2009
6:38 pm
“as China buys one slice of California after another.”
Let ‘em buy. It doesn’t buy them votes, only land and buildings. I said the same thing when the big bugaboo “buying up America” was the A-rabs.
As the GOP Churns
July 7th, 2009
6:41 pm
Let ‘em buy. It doesn’t buy them votes, only land and buildings. I said the same thing when the big bugaboo “buying up America” was the A-rabs.
Step 1: Buy land… .
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:43 pm
Of course when Vandy Girl goes to posting in German, I gets a little nervous myself, but whether or not we’ll admit it, she just says what, scatch many of us posting here, right and left, lies right beneath our own sheets…
Normal
July 7th, 2009
6:45 pm
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:35 pm
-
Maybe they are afraid he’ll grow back if they plant him…heh,heh
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:48 pm
NORMAL–EPA said they couldn’t. He’s not biodegradable.
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
July 7th, 2009
6:48 pm
JT not sure what history I revised but I can’t tell the difference in the GOP and a conservative. They are all led by Rush three times married drug addict Limbaugh and Newt three marriges Gingrich. Their answer to every problem is to “cut taxes.” They are all pro-life and pro-war. Maybe you can illuminate me on the differences.
Paul
July 7th, 2009
6:50 pm
DoggoneGA 6:38
And the Japanese -
AmVet
July 7th, 2009
6:50 pm
jt, perhaps so. In some ways I kinda liked Ronnie and even voted for him once. (The evil of the two lessers?) And over the years I have softened my view of him quite a bit. At the time I thought he was completely abysmal.
But I think the points I’ve made indicate his foreign policy was in way too many cases horrific.
And in reality, he did do some good stuff, but IMHO the bad still (far?) outweighed it.
Oh well, no one’s perfect. And ironically in comparison to the debacle we were to see twelve years later a saint. No wonder the “faithful” adore him. And see no warts or failures. At all.
Yet his “inattention” (which I never thought was the case – he REALLY had no clue?) was nonetheless no excuse for criminals running clandestine and illegal operations out of the White House basement. My gawd! A scandalous and unforgivable betrayal of the American people’s trust.
And Ollie got out of doing prison time simply by standing before Congress and saying over and over he couldn’t remember dick. And now the inveterate liar is a long standing darling on the right wing talk circuit. Ironic, huh?
Speaking of which I read earlier where somebody referenced a qiuote form Kneel Boartz.
Zounds! People not forced to listen to that tripe do so voluntarily???
You know @@ that is why you are so valuable here.
Rather than find some teeny weeny little inane point to make, you dissect those many points I make and offer sound refutations and counter arguments. You carefully weigh the positions and countermand them with superior alternative explanations.
OH WAIT! That’s not the case at all!
And really never is…
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:53 pm
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
Well, if you can’t tell the difference between a conservative and the GOP it stands to reason you can’t tell the difference between a liberal and the Dems. With all due respect, you’re taking a rather parochial and provencial view of what the terms refer to. I’d suggest a little REP and you might want to start with “Outline of History.”
Normal
July 7th, 2009
6:56 pm
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:48 pm
NORMAL–EPA said they couldn’t. He’s not biodegradable.
—————
No wonder, what with all that plastic and all…
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:56 pm
Am Vet–Kneel Boartz? Oy, gevalt! I can’t bear to listen to him even when I agree with him! And, yes, sometimes I do….and I’m expecting a Spanish Iquisition…
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
6:58 pm
NORMAL–according to the Unmentionable, “for the love of G-d, even the Choctaw don’t leave ‘em layin’ around that long! Stinks up the teepee!”
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
July 7th, 2009
6:59 pm
Vandy Girl, interesting perspective. Sounds like something Saddam Hussain would have said or maybe Vladimir Putin or maybe Kim Jung Ill. The power does lie here but not because we say it lies here or because we attempt to dominate. As I said before talking tough is a sign of insecurity. It is not a sign of strength. You don’t give a damn about other countries. My guess is you probably don’t give a damn about anybody that is not like you.
Normal
July 7th, 2009
7:01 pm
Tell your unmentionable he has a point, but I must point out that MJ is mostly plastic…like a Ken doll.
getalife
July 7th, 2009
7:02 pm
Senator Franken sworn in and:
“Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) on Tuesday ordered Finance Chairman Max Baucus (D-Mont.) to drop a proposal to tax health benefits and stop chasing Republican votes on a massive health care reform bill.”
Reid grows a spine.
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
July 7th, 2009
7:04 pm
Josef Nix, please explain the difference between a conservative and a GOP’er. Just give me two examples and then maybe I’ll get it.
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
7:05 pm
NORMAL–Ken didn’t have a you-know-what. I checked. Remember the Gay Bob?
DoggoneGA
July 7th, 2009
7:05 pm
“And the Japanese ”
Yep, them too
getalife
July 7th, 2009
7:06 pm
Yeah, it was very sad:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/07/07/michael-jacksons-daughter_n_227257.html
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
7:09 pm
Senator Franken is sworn in and one more liberal homophobe takes his place in the halls of power. I’m so happy I could, well…it ain’t sing and dance and be colorful witty and just ever so tasteful and witty…sorry, but this is not oh-happy-day…jus’ sayin’
getalife
July 7th, 2009
7:15 pm
joseph,
How many times are you going to play the gay card?
jus’ sayin’
Normal
July 7th, 2009
7:17 pm
Josef…From what I hear, neither did MJ…
FinnMcCool
July 7th, 2009
7:18 pm
BIASED!
Jay gave more room to the Obama speech than he gave to the Palin speech!
Liberal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Normal
July 7th, 2009
7:18 pm
Remember the Gay Bob?
–
No, but I thought my G.I. Joe was..DADT
DoggoneGA
July 7th, 2009
7:20 pm
“one more liberal homophobe takes his place in the halls of power”
And yet another good lie is brought back from the dead.
Normal
July 7th, 2009
7:21 pm
Finn! McCool! Simmer down boy, it’s ok…Jay, a liberal? Who’d thunk it? Anyway, Obama’s speech made sense, Palin’s, on the other hand…
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
7:24 pm
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
One example should suffice. Conservativism as a political ideology owes its origins to the reactions of Chateaubriand and Edmund Burke to the French Revolution, they espousing the ideas of the American Revolution. The GOP owes its origins to the anti-constitutional elements of the Know Nothings of the 1850s.
Normal
July 7th, 2009
7:25 pm
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
I’ll try. A conservative doesn’t want change but is willing to listen.
A GOP’er doesn’t want change and is like the three monkeys..See no change, hear no change, and say no change…got it?
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
7:26 pm
getalife
How many times are you going to play the gay card?
Every day for the rest of my life until such time as I have FULL and EQUAL civil rights.
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
7:28 pm
Do.ggone–like I said below, I like you, but, no, it’s not a lie. He said it and he meant it. Sorry.
josef nix
July 7th, 2009
7:32 pm
NORMAL–DADT? GI Joe? Well, obviously we’re supposed to shut up and go away. Well, I’m not jewcowboy. Jus sayin!
jt
July 7th, 2009
7:32 pm
Conservatism Leads to Paranoia
July 7th, 2009
6:48 pm
JT not sure what history I revised but I can’t tell the difference in the GOP and a conservative. They are all led by Rush three times married drug addict Limbaugh and Newt three marriges Gingrich. Their answer to every problem is to “cut taxes.” They are all pro-life and pro-war. Maybe you can illuminate me on the differences.
I would like to illuminate you but I don’t know where to start. And I don’t know all of the answers. I do know that the terms conservatism and liberalism are being basterdized, and the two ersatz parties have a monopoly on neither.
Don’t fall for the two party scam. Both parties are one and the same. It is the party of incumbants.
FREE your mind. The rest will follow.
http://www.lpgeorgia.com/
Also, a good place to start as far as our history is the Spanish/American War. This was way before your WW1 reference.
DoggoneGA
July 7th, 2009
7:33 pm
“He said it and he meant it. Sorry.”
No you’re not sorry. You’re going to repeat that lie until the cows come home. It’s one thing I hate about a “conservative” mindset…there’s not allowance for the abiltiy of a person to grow and to CHANGE THEIR MINDS. But one of the main rules of a “conservative” is: never let a good lie die.
getalife
July 7th, 2009
7:33 pm
joseph,
Fight the power but the establishment will always be treated as betters since they own government.
When my people came off the boats from Sicily, they did not demand civil rights.
They just took over NY City and spread to the rest of the big cities.