Neda Soltani, the martyr of Tehran
The young woman above is reportedly Neda Soltani, the 16-year-old student martyred Saturday by pro-government militia in Iran. (In some accounts, she has also been identified as being 26 or 27.)The event was captured in horrifying detail in a Youtube posting that has since become one of the most important pieces of video in recent history.
Someday, if the world is just, a shrine to Neda’s memory will be erected in a place of honor in Tehran, a monument not just to her sacrifice but to the bravery of the many thousands of her fellow Iranians who have taken to the streets in recent days. They are trying to redeem their country, trying to wrest it from those who claim the holy right to control its citizens and its future, and they are risking everything to do so.
In a sense, I guess you could argue that Neda Soltani didn’t do anything particularly heroic. She was simply there, in the streets of Tehran with her father along with many others. Yet being there mattered. It mattered a lot. Simply by being there, Neda posed such a threat to the tyrants in Iran that a Basiji sniper on a rooftop chose her as his victim and pulled the trigger.
The single rifle shot struck Neda in the chest, shattering her heart. But it did not make her disappear as a threat. Death transformed her into something far more dangerous to the regime than she could ever have been alive.
Here in this country, we continue to debate our own national response to events in Iran. Personally, I thought former U.S. Sen. Sam Nunn put it well over the weekend, reminding the American people that “we are not the story” and that the history of U.S. involvement in Iran makes us a poor champion of democracy in that country. Events of 1953 may be ancient or even unknown history to Americans, but Iranians have not forgotten it. They know quite well our role in overthrowing their last democratically elected government, and in replacing it with the brutally repressive Shah.
“We have been the “great Satan” over there for the last 30 years,” Nunn said on a Sunday talk show. “We’re not the story. Freedom, liberty is the story; the repression of the regime is the story.”
The ruling mullahs understand that as well. They want desperately to drag us into the spotlight to once again play our recurring role as villain in their national narrative. They know that if they can somehow turn the crisis into a confrontation inspired by and driven by the United States, they will again swing the people to their side.
But if the struggle is perceived as it truly is, as a confrontation pitting cruel old men against their own people, against Neda Soltani and many others, they will lose. In the long run, they will lose and they know it.
Nonetheless, some in this country still argue for playing into the mullahs’ hands. They demand that American leaders take a more aggressive role toward Iran, if only rhetorically. Why? Because, they say, it is important that we express American democratic values. It is important that we are seen as strong and brave, not “timid and passive,” as U.S. Sen. Lindsay Graham described the approach taken by President Obama.
Confrontation — confrontation in which they personally, as individuals, place absolutely nothing on the line — apparently provides some people with an emotional gratification that is very important to them. In their eyes, in their guts, appearing strong is more important than being wise. They seem to believe that if their country is seen as “strong” and “brave,” then by extension they too must be strong and brave. They seem to need that reassurance.
Well, sorry guys. It doesn’t work like that. It takes no special strength or courage to bray at a militarily inferior country thousands of miles away. A weakling or coward could do that just as easily as a hero, as too many have demonstrated.
The bravery that matters is that of the people of Iran, in the faces of heros such as Neda Soltani.
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184 comments Add your comment
Paul
June 22nd, 2009
6:55 pm
She may become the symbol the resistance needs. She’s also one of them – young, educated, looking to the future.
May she not have died in vain.
Angry Black Man
June 22nd, 2009
6:59 pm
My sentiments too… Hopefully her blood, and the blood of the others have not been spilled in vain.
josef nix
June 22nd, 2009
7:00 pm
JAY–If you read my earlier posts, you know that this is something I FEEL very strongly about. Please allow me the opportunity to thank you for keeping this before our eyes to keep reminding us that the situation in Iran has a human face.
jt
June 22nd, 2009
7:06 pm
As far as decency is concerned,
100,000 Neda Soltanis = 1/4 Eric Cantor
DebbieDoRight
June 22nd, 2009
7:11 pm
Wow!! She was just a kid!! RIP Neda.
@@
June 22nd, 2009
7:12 pm
I wonder if that “emotional gratification” applies to Israel’s Netanyahu — can’t say Israeli’s butts aren’t on the line everyday, jay.
Netanyahu, asked on NBC’s Meet the Press about what Israeli intelligence had to say about the Islamic regime’s weakness, responded that its “real nature has been unmasked, and it’s been unmasked by incredible acts of courage by Iran citizens.
“They go into the streets, they face bullets and, I tell you, as somebody who believes deeply in democracy, that you see the Iranian lack of democracy at work, and I think this better explains and best explains to the entire world what this regime is truly about,” the prime minister said.
…and NOPE, he did not try to FORCE Obama on the issue.
“I’m not going to second-guess the president of the United States,” Netanyahu said. “I know President Obama wants the people of Iran to be free.
The thing about this situation is that Obama’s NOT not saying anything could have the same negative impact.
jt
June 22nd, 2009
7:18 pm
I meant to say something like 100,000 Eric Cantors wouldn’t equate to one Neda Soltanis.
Or something like that.
One Bass over the line. Must get downn………..
josef nix
June 22nd, 2009
7:19 pm
jt–thanks for clearing it up, you had me worried!
DebbieDoRight
June 22nd, 2009
7:21 pm
Jay — only the warmongering, insanely ridiculous, illiterate want Obama to join in the fray. Any person with a computer can google, Iran/Contra or Iran/Shah/USA and pull up the recent history of Iran and the US. That they choose not to while condemning Obama, is just another reason to drown out their whiny little voices.
That any legitimate “news” organization(s) would continue to put them on the air to sprout their uninformed ignorance without at least CHALLENGING their drivel; is just another reason that some journalists in America are slowly turning into hacks and not true journalists who wish to seek the truth. I read once that the reason why the Watergate reporters made such an impression was because “modern” journalists usually don’t go out of their way to uncover the truth. The old “what, when, where, why and how”; went out of fashion with Nelly Bly.
Angry Black Man
June 22nd, 2009
7:25 pm
jt
Thanks for clearing that up. I was sitting here scratching my head and wondering what I had missed in my Calculus class.
clyde
June 22nd, 2009
7:32 pm
I have read the Neda means “voice”in Farsi.This is fitting if it’s true.
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
7:58 pm
The ruling mullahs understand that as well. They want desperately to drag us into the spotlight to once again play our recurring role as villain in their national narrative. They know that if they can somehow turn the crisis into a confrontation inspired by and driven by the United States, they will again swing the people to their side.
What totally childish commentary, although also totally expected.
When you are a spineless koward you seek refuge in words, not actions, so at least bookman is correct to say that the young lady, one of many who have brutally died at the hands of this menace and the first one the libs have noticed, was brave.
Obozo, not so much.
We don’t have to bomb and strafe as kindergarten teach has assumed we want to, and in case no one understands what I am talking about, see the Fall Of Communism, Reagan/ Thatcher.
I challenge anyone one of you to name one positive contribution the Iranian Regime has made to the world in the last 50 years or so, try it bozos, name just one.
They antagonize Israel by proxy, they kill American soldiers, they take Americans hostage, they threaten nuclear holocaust.
It ain’t your problem, right bookman, no skin off your back if a bunch of Jews get toasted, whatever, huh?
Nena is nothing without us.
No monument, no legacy.
Nothing with out us.
So, knowing who is in charge of us, she is nothing.
What a shame.
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
8:03 pm
How about Obozo’s commitment to the Iraqi Freedom Movement, We will mourn each and every corpse.
Gosh, how inspiring.
@@
June 22nd, 2009
8:07 pm
Friedman’s June 22 perspective is always an interesting one — totally void of emotion. That’s why they call his strategic forecasting.
<a href=”Now, as we saw after Tiananmen Square, we will see a reshuffling among the elite. Those who backed Mousavi will be on the defensive. By contrast, those who supported Ahmadinejad are in a powerful position. There is a massive crisis in the elite, but this crisis has nothing to do with liberalization: It has to do with power and prerogatives among the elite. Having been forced by the election and Khamenei to live with Ahmadinejad, some will make deals while some will fight – but Ahmadinejad is well-positioned to win this battle
Doesn’t in any way diminish Neda’s courage. As you say, jay, it lives on.
getalife
June 22nd, 2009
8:08 pm
When Jay posted that video, I started looking at the blogs and twitter.
The story exploded world wide.
Idiots like Graham and McCain are feeding the Iranian regime an excuse to blame it on the west undermining our President’s message.
Pathetic as usual.
@@
June 22nd, 2009
8:10 pm
Sorry! dropped the imbedded link.
@@
June 22nd, 2009
8:13 pm
One more time
@@
June 22nd, 2009
8:14 pm
Thppbbttt.
http://www.rightsidenews.com/200906225216/global-terrorism/the-iranian-election-and-the-revolution-test.html
Tom
June 22nd, 2009
8:20 pm
Just to be clear, according to the most accurate reports, Neda Agha-Soltan (or Soltani, using the Farsi feminine ending) was approx. 26 (b. 1982), not 16. Which in no way alters of diminishes the human tragedy.
Kayaker 71
June 22nd, 2009
8:21 pm
Off subject….. If I hear one more thing about Chris Brown beating up his girlfriend…. happens every day,in one form or another, sometimes worse than was reported. We are tired of this and wish this useless information WOULD STOP!! Enough already.
AmVet
June 22nd, 2009
8:23 pm
“Confrontation — confrontation in which they personally, as individuals, place absolutely nothing on the line — apparently provides some people with an emotional gratification that is very important to them. In their eyes, in their guts, appearing strong is more important than being wise. They seem to believe that if their country is seen as “strong” and “brave,” then by extension they too must be strong and brave. They seem to need that reassurance.”
“Well, sorry guys. It doesn’t work like that. It takes no special strength or courage to bray at a militarily inferior country thousands of miles away. A weakling or coward could do that just as easily as a hero, as too many have demonstrated.”
And as we all know, several of whom demonstrate it regularly on this blog, Mr. Bookman…
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
8:27 pm
Anybody else notice how when Obozo busts a couple of worthless Somalian punks in the head, piracy dropped off the radar?
The Thugacracy in Iran knows that regime change is not an option, so they slaughter with impunity.
That girl’s blood is on your hands, liberals.
TnGelding
June 22nd, 2009
8:35 pm
It’s pure speculation on who killed her and why, and we’ll probably never know. But it was irresponsible of her father to allow her to be there. It was a tragic death, but martyr? I don’t think so, but time will tell.
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
8:36 pm
How about it, Bushie called out the Axis of Evil and the kowards sneered at him, lucky for them he took Saddam out of the picture or the liberals would have three countries dogging them out, hahahahaha.
bozos
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
8:43 pm
TN- Good call on “martyred,” I thought the same thing when I first read it, but other points quickly overcame me. Martyrdom is an Islamic concept, not surprising that al-Bookman would use it.
My drill sergeants told me that I didn’t have permission to die, which is the absolutely correct way of seeing things, the number one and sole priority is to eliminate the bad guys. Get that job done and you won’t need dead people to motivate you.
GayGrayGeek
June 22nd, 2009
8:56 pm
Andy, have you thought about going to Tehran to add your “wisdom” to their fight? Or will you remain a solid member of the 101st Chairborn? (Hattip to AmVet, I b’leeve…)
@@
June 22nd, 2009
8:57 pm
…and the media’s “wisdom” in all things may have cost some Iranian protesters their lives.
The media has been embellishing on the protests when further evidence would indicate it’s not the widespread Revolution “they’ve been claiming.”
N-GA
June 22nd, 2009
8:59 pm
Jay,
I’m not sure what the facts are. I’ve read elsewhere that she was a 27 year old college student.
Unfortunately, I suspect President Obama won’t respond as forcefully as George W. Bush did in response to the Tiananmen Square incident. {sarc}
Fly-On-The-Wall
June 22nd, 2009
9:02 pm
IR/YW – how dare you try to place the blame of this woman’s death on ‘liberals’. You’ve stooped to a totally new low.
@@
June 22nd, 2009
9:12 pm
…in essence, spurring the protesters on while ignoring the negotiations taking place among Iran’s powerful elite.
On a brighter note:
Iran: Amendments Will Eliminate Stoning As Punishment – June 22, 2009 1604 GMT
Iranian lawmakers are working to outlaw stoning and some other traditional Islamic punishments, Deutsche Presse-Agentur reported June 22, citing a report from Iran’s official IRNA news agency. Iranian parliamentary judiciary commission head Ali Shahrokhi told IRNA that amendments to current laws will eliminate stoning and cutting off hands, a traditional Islamic punishment for thieves.
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
9:14 pm
GayGrayGeek
June 22nd, 2009
8:56 pm
Andy, have you thought about going to Tehran to add your “wisdom” to their fight? Or will you remain a solid member of the 101st Chairborn? (Hattip to AmVet, I b’leeve…)
GayGrayFreak- You may have missed it but bookman is calling for an uprising, a holy war, monuments that must be built by victorious armies, a fallen leader who will cause others to rise up and throw off the shackles of enslavement, am I missing something here?
See, the difference being that bookman knows his uprising is non existent, it’s a virtual pipe dream, hahaha, but it does buy some time for his Master, his owner, thee Obozo, he knows full well that nobody will remember Nena’s name next week, after the protests have been smashed.
It’s funny that you would come down against me, almost robotic like, if you read bookman’s words, it would seem as though both him and I want the same thing for the Iranian people and Nena’s memory.
Only thing is, one path is a totally fake one and we both know it.
And I’m the bad guy.
What a farce.
I challenge you coward liberals to tell me that the world wouldn’t be a better place with the Thugs and Killers gone from Iran.
WTF, man?
And the door is wide open.
The people of Iran WANT it.
Opportunities like this……..
AmVet
June 22nd, 2009
9:21 pm
GGG, as you know I’ve got lots of adjectives and apropos names for the right-wing’s yellow bellied sapsuckers that frequent here.
But honesty compels me to admit that the 101st Chariborne is not my creation.
Though I wish it was!
Fly-On-The-Wall
June 22nd, 2009
9:23 pm
IR/YW – dude, they don’t want to overthrow their government, they want to change it. Get over the idea that they’ll greet us with flowers.
Neda Soltani, the martyr of Tehran | Jay Bookman
June 22nd, 2009
9:24 pm
[...] original post here: Neda Soltani, the martyr of Tehran | Jay Bookman Share and [...]
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
9:26 pm
I stood on the line for the people of Nicaragua, fully loaded and ready for anything, my Commander in Chief Ronald Reagan put me there.
He didn’t appease Communism, he fought it in every corner of the world that it reared it’s ugly head.
Without a shot being fired.
Heard from them lately?
Hahahahahaha, I rule.
Fly-On-The-Wall
June 22nd, 2009
9:29 pm
IR/YW – again dude, get over Ronald Raygun too. He outspent the Soviets and look where it got us. Are we any safer? Bush tried that and how much safer are we for his debacle?
ByteMe
June 22nd, 2009
9:30 pm
In their eyes, in their guts, appearing strong is more important than being wise.
What guts??
ByteMe
June 22nd, 2009
9:31 pm
Whiner: you forget who is currently the President of Nicaragua?
I rule Andy
June 22nd, 2009
9:39 pm
Andy, you’re an idiot but we already know that…
It’s Neda, moron, not Nena… Nice diatribe… and what pray tell are you doing to help “democracy” in Iran???
Anonomously posting on a liberal blog? Oh yeah, that’s gonna change the world…
ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
9:41 pm
Byte Me- Are the Soviets there?
~~~~~
I’ll never forget that first night, the giant mosquitos were one thing, the gunshots and people screaming were something entirely different. My First Sergeant came around, almost frantic, checking every foxhole, saying that if anyone sent a round downrange he would article 15 their as-ses. When he got to my hole, I told him that if anyone came up this hill, he might as well start the paperwork. Man, did we share a good laugh over that. I think I calmed him down.
I rule Andy
June 22nd, 2009
9:42 pm
Oh I see, you bravely fought in a fight that wasn’t really a fight, but more of an evacuation, what did you earn in that battle the Silver Star???
Please…
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ByteMe
June 22nd, 2009
9:46 pm
Whiner: you said “Communists”, not “Soviets”. Communists are still in charge of China. Arguably, also Venezuela and Nicaragua. Russia imploded under its own debt, their creditors fired the only shots.
And you got stuck in a jungle for no particular purpose it seems. It seems it gave you some good stories to tell and sometimes that makes the passing of time more fun.
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
9:46 pm
I’m ruled by Andy- It sure has you totally freaked out, don’t it?
I rule.
I Report :-) You Whine :-(
June 22nd, 2009
9:48 pm
Byte- Sorry, you are correct, I meant Soviets.
@@
June 22nd, 2009
9:49 pm
and what pray tell are you doing to help “democracy” in Iran???
Pardon the interruption but should Andy be “twittering” from the U.S. /SNARK/
AmVet
June 22nd, 2009
9:50 pm
I wonder if the welcher saw Bill O’Reilly in any firefights…
DebbieDoRight
June 22nd, 2009
9:51 pm
Iranian lawmakers are working to outlaw stoning and some other traditional Islamic punishments,
They also need to get rid of a Shia Law called “Crimes Against Chastity” that only the WOMEN are prosecuted for. (WTF!!
)
I remember this article from a couple of years ago and I saw the BBC special about it. To think, things like this are STILL happening in Iran with the “religious” leaders blessings. Women, who are the keepers of the world, are also the ones carrying the biggest burdens of the world.
Article:
At the time of Atefah’s execution in Neka, journalist Asieh Amini heard rumours the girl was just 16 years old and so began to ask questions. So why was such a young girl executed? And how could she have been accused of adultery when she was not even married?
Disturbed by the death of her mother when she was only four or five years old, and her distraught father’s subsequent drug addiction, Atefah had a difficult childhood.
She was also left to care for her elderly grandparents, but they are said to have shown her no affection.
In a town like Neka, heavily under the control of religious authorities, Atefah – often seen wandering around on her own – was conspicuous.
It was just a matter of time before she came to the attention of the “moral police”, a branch of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard, whose job it is to enforce the Islamic code of behaviour on Iran’s streets.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/5217424.stm
@@
June 22nd, 2009
9:55 pm
MOSCOW (Reuters) – Russia said on Monday it views all issues linked to Iran’s presidential election as the Islamic Republic’s internal affair.
Kinda like Obama.
Red Foreman
June 22nd, 2009
9:58 pm
I think this needs to take its own natural course..we may be in for a pleasant surprise…then again, they may nuke us:)
I rule Andy
June 22nd, 2009
10:05 pm
I see @@ is working to sow the seeds of democracy in Iran by trolling the liberal blogs as well…
ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
ByteMe
June 22nd, 2009
10:12 pm
Darn… and I forgot Cooooo-bah! Commies still in charge there after 50-something years.
It’s still rock and roll to me….
@@
June 22nd, 2009
10:17 pm
Taliban Supreme Leader Mullah Omar appears to be asserting more direct control over operations and fighters in Afghanistan, the Wall Street Journal reported June 22, citing U.S. officials and insurgents in Afghanistan. Throughout much of the war, Mullah Omar’s leadership has been indirect, using the Quetta shura to funnel money and choose insurgent leaders. But since January, sources said, he has issued orders through his direct lieutenants for suicide bombings and assassinations in southern and eastern Afghanistan, and has been replacing field commanders and “shadow governors” in the provinces, in preparation for a surge of U.S. troops. Defense officials say the shura also has been depositing weapons caches throughout eastern and southern Afghanistan, recruiting more fighters and appointing new local commanders in the region.
THAT ^^^ one is gonna belong to Obama and the liberals who kept egging him on during the campaign.
~~~~~OO~~~~~
IRA:
Not sure what liberal blogs you’re talkin’ bout.
I don’t twitter either.
@@
June 22nd, 2009
10:20 pm
‘Ya know jay, if your intent was to put a face to “this revolution”, the impact is lost since Neda’s image disappears leaving only your blog hits.
I’m outta here.
DoggoneGA
June 22nd, 2009
10:20 pm
Debbie,
“They also need to get rid of a Shia Law”
You mean Sharia Law, not Shia.
RLJ
June 22nd, 2009
10:27 pm
Jay, my problem is not with your point. I agree with both you and Sam Nunn. I disagree with the straw man attack on the right as if they are the only ones saying a tougher statement should be made. Several people from across the political spectrum have spoken of the need for a more vocal response for the Obama administration. Vocal does not necessarily mean bellicose. It just means support in a clear fashion.
Nicaraguan Mosquito
June 22nd, 2009
10:38 pm
After all these years, at least I know what left that rank taste in my mouth.
getalife
June 22nd, 2009
10:43 pm
Tied up in the top of the tenth.
Bases loaded for LSU.
One out.
RW-(the original)
June 22nd, 2009
10:58 pm
This ridiculous notion that Obama is doing the right thing by silently watching the world go by should have ended when the US got blamed for it even in the face of his silence, but once Neda was senselessly murdered you would think even the most brainwashed cultists like Jay B would have seen that one should stand on the side of liberty and freedom rather that just wait to support the winner.
RW-(the original)
June 22nd, 2009
10:59 pm
I’d really love to know what word in my 10:58 has sent it to moderation.
getalife
June 22nd, 2009
11:14 pm
Bottom of the 11th.
LSU by 1.
What a game played in 104 degree global warming.
They need IV’s for game two.
Going to be hotter .
I rule Andy
June 22nd, 2009
11:14 pm
Why is it any of our business??? I mean really, why is it our business anyway? Look at Iraq? Anybody? Bueller… bueller…
What happened when we meddled in Iran’s politics before? Why do we need to be the policeman of the world? Why is it our responsibility to ensure Israel’s survival and why should we endeavour to sow the seeds of democracy in the middle east? Talking about brainwashed cultists…
ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
RW-(the original)
June 22nd, 2009
11:15 pm
Now I see…it must have been my incoherently using “that” instead of “than”…I really need better lighting or better specs.
getalife
June 22nd, 2009
11:20 pm
LSU wins in a classic.
TnGelding
June 22nd, 2009
11:20 pm
Iran and Iraq at one time were functioning republics.
RW-(the original)
June 22nd, 2009
11:21 pm
11:14,
One needs not intervene to vocally support the side that promotes freedom, but if it’s really none of our business why do you suppose Jay B is trying to keep Neda’s face and the story in front of us?
You libs should really get a network prime time slot so the rest of us could watch you straddling your various fences. It might be as good as Wipeout.
jaypat
June 22nd, 2009
11:22 pm
It’s terrible that anyone gets killed because of their convictions. She was obviously in the right protesting the inaccurate vote count. There was no reason for her to die. It is a great shame.
What gets me, though, is that just a few years ago, a very similar situation occurred in the Middle East. A young woman was protesting injustice, and a bulldozer ran over her. She, too, was in the right, because she had the strength of several UN Resolutions behind her…yet her death passed with only a whimper. She wasn’t lionized as a heroine, although she surely is one. In fact the media hardly noticed her death, and quickly shut up about it when the predominant political lobby protested.
That young woman was Rachel Corrie, and an Israeli bulldozer ran over her and killed her. She was protesting the continued Israeli occupation of the Gaza Territory.. If there was any outrage over that death, then I missed it. (Some radical Zionist groups made urinal strainers with her face on it, so that they could void in her face.)
http://www.rachelcorrie.org/
Then just a few months ago, the Israelis again decided that the Palestinians in Gaza needed some more killing and they told the media to leave, and the media quietly left. I don’t recall any outrage over the proscription over coverage beyond a muffled complaint, because there was none–the media did as they were told..
Then the Israelis, using US -supplied weapons and aircraft and artillery proceeded to kill over 1,300 Palestinians. Not one or two pretty women, but 1300 people…,little children, young girls and boys, women, men…all slaughtered–with our help.
Was there an outcry in the US over this egregious, excessive use of force? Nope. In a matter of a few days the entire episode disappeared into the blackness.
Maybe some day some of this outrage will spill over into areas where our interests really lay.
the evil rich
June 22nd, 2009
11:26 pm
Jay, does she LOOK 16 or 17???? Come one, what does she seem more of a martyr if she’s younger?
TnGelding
June 22nd, 2009
11:31 pm
jaypat
June 22nd, 2009
11:22 pm
Shh!
RW-(the original)
June 22nd, 2009
11:42 pm
Rachel Corrie was a foreigner that traveled to Gaza to promote terrorism against Israel. She was at least committed enough to jump in front of a bulldozer, but she hardly compares to an Iranian woman speaking out for freedom in Iran that gets gunned down from a distance.
There was plenty of “outrage” though and it’s pretty easy to find here in the tubes.
I rule Andy
June 22nd, 2009
11:57 pm
You reap what ye sow… Are we now reaping, or are we still sowing???
I wish the Iranian people all the best, as do I wish the Israelis all the best, but I got mouths to feed in my own house. I have no wish for Armageddon to begin yet, and I don’t care if the sheeples of the middle East let themselves be ruled by religious extremists, I worry more about our domestic religious extremists and those who support them, you know like Koresh and people who apologize for him… and Andy, the most pious one amongst us who’s good for a good GFY or POS from time to time…and if the sheeples of the mid east should tire of religious theocracy, then let them throw them off like our forefathers did the British, anybody here remember US history or have you at least seen “The Patriot” (since I know you wouldn’t know anything about actual American history), who helped us throw the British off??? The French, that’s right, and how do we treat the French now??? Do we greet them with flowers???
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jaypat
June 23rd, 2009
12:24 am
RW-(the original)
June 22nd, 2009
11:42 pm
“Rachel Corrie was a foreigner that traveled to Gaza to promote terrorism against Israel. She was at least committed enough to jump in front of a bulldozer, but she hardly compares to an Iranian woman speaking out for freedom in Iran that gets gunned down from a distance.”
What a total load of bollocks–something straight out of the playbook of the Natanyahu government. TO Wit: “
jaypat
June 23rd, 2009
12:41 am
Let me try that one again. Somehow I hit the wrong button on this keyboard and it sent the message before I was ready to send it. But anyway…You’ve already seen the quoted material above, right?
RW(the orgiinal) wishes to whitewash the entire episode by claiming that the dead person was a terrorist. That is straight out of the Netanyahu playbook.
But to claim that the decedent “jumped” in front of a bulldozer requires us to believe that the person is suicidal, not something known to be prevalent amongst Westerners. A much more likely scenario is that she stood in front of the bulldozer and it ran over her, like contemporaneous reports say.
This doesn’t fit RW’s ideology, so he invents other explanations, like “she’s a terrorist”. A “terrorist” being anyone who disagrees with his particularly disjointed version of reality. (It’s worth noting that the Iranian authorities are calling the protesters”criminals”.There really isn’t that much difference between the antics of the right wing there and here., as is evidenced by RW’s claim.)
jt
June 23rd, 2009
3:11 am
wtf….
Sleep posting again.
James Meredith
June 23rd, 2009
4:21 am
It’s after viewing insane acts like the killing of Neda that make me so thankful that I live in America. I hope the protestors can change the corrupt and vile leaders in their country. I hope it doesn’t come to that here in the U.S. God Bless you Neda. I hope the killer rots in hell.
clyde
June 23rd, 2009
5:17 am
If Neda is indeed their martyr,that is apparently all they’ve gained at the moment.The chants from the rooftops ,though,is “Allah O Akbar”,not Neda,Neda,Neda.
I'm attached to Andy's leg, ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
June 23rd, 2009
5:53 am
As Walpin told me, when any group misuses AmeriCorps money for a political campaign or to get a free car wash, “That’s like stealing a welfare check from a single mother.” And Obamaland thinks he’s confused.
eewwww
I'm attached to Andy's leg, ewwwwwwwwwwwww
June 23rd, 2009
5:54 am
As Walpin told me, when any group misuses AmeriCorps money for a political campaign or to get a free car wash, “That’s like stealing a welfare check from a single mother.” And Obamaland thinks he’s confused.-Saunders
eewwww
Bud Wiser
June 23rd, 2009
6:08 am
Obowo is probably chain smoking under the covers right now, quivering like the koward that he is, waiting, just waiting for George Soros to tell him what to do.
JFK never was led on a leash like Obowo.
I liked JFK.
At least he didn’t leave some poor girl to die trapped in his car in a canal somewhere at night that he drove off drunk into, like his younger brother.
Hairplugs Biden Is most likely tied up and gagged, being watched over by the Obowo SS in a WH basement room.
josef nix
June 23rd, 2009
6:33 am
JAY–well will wonders never cease! Only some 95 posts, but most on topic…her death obviously has its impact even here…
josef nix
June 23rd, 2009
6:35 am
OOPS–make that 75 posts…it’s still too early…
Caveman
June 23rd, 2009
6:44 am
Whiner – Iran did one thing I’m sure you would think of as good. They held on to the American hostages longer than they would have in 1979 in exchange for millions of dollars in military weapons that were promised by the GOP to help Reagan get elected.
Doggone/GA
June 23rd, 2009
6:48 am
“I hope it doesn’t come to that here in the U.S. ”
Ever heard of Kent State?
Nicaraguan Mosquito
June 23rd, 2009
6:52 am
WASHINGTON – The discovery of suicide martyr videos seemed certain proof that Abd al Rahim Abdul Rassak was part of al-Qaida. A closer look at his video, though, showed he was actually being tortured by al-Qaida.
The confusion over the video collection found in an al-Qaida safehouse is one of the stranger twists in the unusual case of Rassak, a Guantanamo detainee. On Monday, a federal judge ordered Rassak released, chastising the government for claiming he was still part of the same terror network that tortured, imprisoned and abandoned him.
Well, maybe the Iranians don’t need our kind of “help”.
DB, Gwinnettian
June 23rd, 2009
7:09 am
Ever heard of Kent State?
What if you knew her
And found her dead on the ground
How can you run when you know?
Bubba
June 23rd, 2009
7:12 am
So what you’re saying, Jay, is that we should remain silent whenever our statements could have negative consequences, right? That’s what you’re all saying, right?
DB, Gwinnettian
June 23rd, 2009
7:14 am
Anybody else notice how when Obozo busts a couple of worthless Somalian punks in the head, I haven’t heard anything about it from my usual sources of conservative idiocy?
Fixed Andy’s typo.
Doggone/GA
June 23rd, 2009
7:15 am
“So what you’re saying, Jay, is that we should remain silent whenever our statements could have negative consequences, right?”
If you can’t say anything good…then say nothing at all. However, our President has NOT been silent on the subject of Iran’s election and protests.
Doggone/GA
June 23rd, 2009
7:17 am
“What if you knew her
And found her dead on the ground”
That’s right. I “lost my innocence” about our government’s good intentions when Kent State happened. Now I have no expectations at all. Whatever happens, happens. They’re going to do whatever they feel like doing.
Normal
June 23rd, 2009
7:19 am
Good morning, all… That picture of Nada reveals a beautiful young woman who represented and would have been the future of Iran…It is ironic that the sniper, in chosing her, made her her a bigger and more holy symbol of a Nation in turmoil. By killing her and others like her, they are killing their future. It is sad that there is nothing we can do but spout words of concern and/or threats; they don’t need that.
The people of Iran who want change need our prayers to whatever God you believe in to give them the strength to carry on until the end so this young womans death was not in vain. Just hopin’…
Joey
June 23rd, 2009
7:24 am
Jay;
It is interesting. I mean the amount of detailed information that you can provide about a story or event; When you want too.
Normal
June 23rd, 2009
7:29 am
Doggone, Kent State happened in April, 1970, didn’t it?
I remember I was in Transit Barracks, awaiting my discharge, when I saw the newscasts. I was already an”angry young man” and a member of “viet Nam veterans against the war”. I remember the Nixonites saying that they would do whatever it took to prevent a “Revolution”.I thought, do you really want to go there? There are thousands of angry young men just like me, who knew how to fight, and had survived the biggest jungle fighting school in the world. It was close, all we needed was a leader which never happened…CSN&N not withstanding…Just sayin…
Doggone/GA
June 23rd, 2009
7:36 am
“Kent State happened in April, 1970, didn’t it?”
May 4th, 1970…yes.
” I remember the Nixonites saying that they would do whatever it took to prevent a “Revolution”.I thought, do you really want to go there? There are thousands of angry young men just like me, who knew how to fight, and had survived the biggest jungle fighting school in the world. It was close, all we needed was a leader which never happened”
Yes, it could have been bad…there’s no doubt. But the Kent State protestors were not part of a revolution of THAT kind. They were peacefully demonstrating and they were half-a-mile away from the National Guard unit when they were shot.
Even if they had been rioting, NO ONE can throw a rock a half-a-mile. The Guardsman who shot them were in no danger whatsever at the time they fired their guns.
I was only JUST too young to be an active protestor through most of the Vietnam war, but what happened at Kent State was a shock to me…and to some extent I’ve never gotten over it.
DB, Gwinnettian
June 23rd, 2009
7:37 am
CSN&N not withstanding…Just sayin…
Crosby, Stills, Nash and Nixon?
We’re finally on our own…
Doggone/GA
June 23rd, 2009
7:39 am
Normal…do you remember the song “19″? “The average age of the Vietnam Veteran was 19″
I had a cousing killed in Vietnam. He was 19, and at the time he died he was not even eligble to vote in PA.
SP
June 23rd, 2009
7:48 am
Here’s something you probably have not heard:
“What you’re seeing in Iran are hundreds of thousands of people who believe their voices were not heard and who are peacefully protesting and–and seeking justice. And the world is watching. And we stand behind those who are seeking justice in a peaceful way. And, you know, already we’ve seen violence out there. I think I’ve said this throughout the week. I want to repeat it that we stand with those who would look to peaceful resolution of conflict, and we believe that the voices of people have to be heard, that that’s a universal value that the American people stand for and this administration stands for.”
And:
“But the last point I want to make on this–this is not an issue of the United States or the West versus Iran. This is an issue of the Iranian people. The fact that they are on the streets under pretty severe duress, at great risk to themselves, is a sign that there’s something in that society that wants to open up.”
Yes, Obozo made those statements, but you probably didn’t hear it because CBS cut them out of the interview.
Joey
June 23rd, 2009
7:52 am
Just to be factual:
Nixon did not order troops into Kent. That was Ohio Governor Rhodes, a Republican. And Rhodes did not order the troops to fire their weapons.
Rather that relying on the 25-year-old memory of a poster to this blog, or what you were taught in school; I suggest that you read about Kent State. Wikipedia is one option.
It was a terrible tragedy, but reach your own conclusions using information from multiple sources.
Normal
June 23rd, 2009
7:52 am
Doggone: The average age of the Vietnam Veteran was 19″
—————–
I was nineteen when I joined…I aged rapidly after that, tho’…
No, none of us could vote, buy a drink, or even get into a girlie show, but we could die, oh yeah…
————-
DB, say my typo afer I posted…Just think, to confuse Neil Young for Nixon…Oy!
Doggone/GA
June 23rd, 2009
7:54 am
“Yes, Obozo made those statements, but you probably didn’t hear it because CBS cut them out of the interview.”
Well, *I* wouldn’t have heard them anyway. I don’t watch network TV news. I *did* hear some of his statements about Iran that were broadcast on NPR news…which I listen to mornings and evenings during my commute.
Nicaraguan Mosquito
June 23rd, 2009
7:56 am
The Reagan administration’s support for the Contras continued to stir controversy well into the 1990s. In August 1996, San Jose Mercury News reporter Gary Webb published a series titled Dark Alliance, alleging that the contras contributed to the rise of crack cocaine in California. Webb’s controversial and highly damaging revelations were disputed at the time, but later revelations confirmed some of his findings.”
Just be careful what you ask for because you just might get it. And, remember. Just Say No to Drugs.
Normal
June 23rd, 2009
7:57 am
Joey: You are right, of course, but the fact still remains that it was a loss of four lives for no reason. That was the tragedy.