Europeans balk, and who can blame them?
I can’t blame them in the least. If we Americans are too chicken to step up and help solve the problem, why should they?
BERLIN, May 28 — The Obama administration’s push to resettle at least 50 Guantanamo Bay prisoners in Europe is meeting fresh resistance as European officials demand that the United States first give asylum to some inmates before they will do the same.
Rising opposition in the U.S. Congress to allowing Guantanamo prisoners on American soil has not gone over well in Europe. Officials from countries that previously indicated they were willing to accept inmates now say it may be politically impossible for them to do so if the United States does not reciprocate.
“If the U.S. refuses to take these people, why should we?” said Thomas Silberhorn, a member of the German Parliament from Bavaria, where the White House wants to relocate nine Chinese Uighur prisoners. “If all 50 states in America say, ‘Sorry, we can’t take them,’ this is not very convincing.”
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
140 comments Add your comment
mike
May 29th, 2009
2:45 pm
“The Geneva Convention states that prisoners of war will be interred in the same geographic conditions that they were captured in”
Interesting, if true.
However these guys were picked up mostly in Pakistan and Afghanistan. Neither of which have much in common with Arizona.
md
May 29th, 2009
2:47 pm
Those here (NJ) that think the US didn’t look bad under democrats need to take a stroll through some european blog sites and see what they have to say about Clinton and the balkans.
And just the other day, we went to war in Iraq for oil. Please tell us why 50 other countries are exploring/drilling/producing Iraq’s oil if the big bad US went there for oil and still have 100k troops on the ground. Shouldn’t we be kicking some foreign booty out of the oil fields.
getalife
May 29th, 2009
2:48 pm
mike,
You first gullible mistake is believing a politician.
Number one rule in politics son is never, ever trust a politician.
They have not earned it.
Not even close.
Use that premise in your arguments and I might engage again but now you are just a gullible fool.
md
May 29th, 2009
2:49 pm
Close gitmo, open a prisoner of war facility in afghanistan, ship them all over there. With luck, collateral damage will occur when they are rescued by their brethren.
josef nix
May 29th, 2009
2:50 pm
Normal…heh, heh!
Getalife–G-d alone knows what he’s covering up, but, well, don’t ask, don’t tell, eh?
Mike–Is Obama a liar, too? Out of both sides of his mouth.
BTW I’m no Republican and was glad to see the Bush lot go, but I didn’t jump on the Obama band wagon either.
mike
May 29th, 2009
2:51 pm
getalife –
That’s fine and dandy, but do you ever base your beliefs on any evidence? Or do you just make stuff up in your head and call it fact?
All the name calling in the world doesn’t overcome your complete inabilty to provide any basis for your claims.
TnGelding
May 29th, 2009
2:54 pm
josef nix
May 29th, 2009
2:31 pm
Every one of them said we had gotten off track.
mike
May 29th, 2009
2:37 pm
It wasn’t just the recession. It was Iraq, illegal spying, debt, deficits, oil, education, crumbling infrastructure, jobs, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran, N. Korea, etc. The others had one main theme. As I recall, Bush wanted to restore dignity to the WH. Mission NOT accomplished! With Clinton it “was the economy stupid.”
Midori
May 29th, 2009
2:24 pm
Bush should have pardoned OJ so he could have somebody to play golf with.
mike
May 29th, 2009
2:56 pm
josef nix –
I recognize that all politicians lie on occasion. getalife has just taken that as an excuse to make up whatever absurd nonsense he wants and then call folks names for not being in lockstep with his baseless allegations.
Turd Fergusen
May 29th, 2009
2:57 pm
All you whiners, crybabys and PeaceMongers should volunteer to house some of these poor souls lost in the Gitmo Shuffle, as it were. Cmon all you mollycoddling democrats!! Its time to stand up for what you believe. Why do we not see the PeaceMongers demonstrating and offering their humble abode as shelter for these weary war hero’s.
All talk, bluster and hot air just like your messiah Al Goron and/or your Lord and saviour, Jesus Christ Obama. Johnny Milktoasts everyone of ya. Cmon…stand up and be counted for your silly and ignorant beliefs.
We are awaiting…and while we are waiting smell this —> *POOT*
Com
getalife
May 29th, 2009
2:58 pm
Yes mike.
There is a very long list of lies to cause distrust in history but you still choose to believe them.
Poor mike, so gullible.
I rest my case.
TnGelding
May 29th, 2009
3:03 pm
Turd Fergusen
May 29th, 2009
2:57 pm
Believe me, you don’t want to get into a pootin’ contest.
My house is my abode. We have facilities to hold and process suspects. If they can’t be convicted, then they should bee freed back to there homeland.
mike
May 29th, 2009
3:05 pm
TnGelding –
Oh please. Every candidate running against the incumbent party runs on “change”. The issues might be different, but the message is the same.
Also, don’t know if you notice but most of the items you want to pin on Bush as issues for change are not great examples –
illegal spying – Actually the spying was ruled legal and Obama is keeping the programs in place
Debt – Bush ran up a lot fo debt, but nothing like Obama has
Deficits – see above
Oil – An issue that goes back to the 70s
Education – Bush’s educational record is pretty good and NCLB was a bi-partisan success
Crumbling infrastrcuture – Obama’s stimulus has very little infrastructure spending
Jobs – Unemployment rate under Bush was very low until the end.
Afghanistan – Obama is proud to say that he supported it from the beginning
Pakistan – Obama continuing Bush’s policies exactly
Iran – Been a problem since the 70s and no change in sight
N Korea – Is this going better under Obama?
mike
May 29th, 2009
3:07 pm
getalife –
“I rest my case.”
You did nothing of the sort. As usual, you avoid the question which is:
“Do you ever base your beliefs on any evidence? Or do you just make stuff up in your head and call it fact?”
mike
May 29th, 2009
3:08 pm
getalife -
One other question, since you are so big on bravery.
Do you call people names to their face? Or do you just do it when anonymous?
It’s one or the other and I am just curious which.
getalife
May 29th, 2009
3:09 pm
Hump somebody else’s leg mike.
I am done with you.
Normal
May 29th, 2009
3:10 pm
Mike: It’s true…That’s why we had german WWII prisoners all over
this country. Some even escaped, most were captured, some were never
heard from again. Maybe a sidewinder got ‘em ;>)
—————
Let’s take that first step so the Europeans will come on board.
Actually, you could re-open Alcatraz. Big rock, large body of water,
sharks…problem solved!
josef nix
May 29th, 2009
3:11 pm
TnGelding–yes because that’s what we wanted to hear not because they had any clear plan for putting us back on track, whatever that track was or is…
Mike–yeah, whenever the occasion presents itself!
Copyleft
May 29th, 2009
3:14 pm
I see Jake is still confused…
“When they get those hearings thanks to that horrendous SC 5-4 decision subverting the will of the people that you referred to earlier, they’ll be released from that SuperMax prison. At which point they will get back to killing Americans.”
Gosh, that would be a troubling scenario… IF THEY WERE ACTUALLY GUILTY OF ANYTHING.
You see, we don’t have any of that pesky old “evidence” that has to be examined and judged in a “trial” in order to convict them of actual wrongdoing.
Believe me, if the Bushies HAD enough evidence to actually prove these guys were evildoers, they would’ve been screaming it from the rooftops and conducting media-friendly show trials around the clock.
The snag is, there’s NO PROOF THEY DID ANYTHING. That’s why so many have already had to be released.
See how it works? It’s called ‘justice,’ and it’s something that matters to real Americans.
Are you a real American, Jake?
josef nix
May 29th, 2009
3:16 pm
Mike–hate to disagree with you, but NCLB was a bipartisan FAILURE. Among other things, I teach and have to deal with NCLB in other than the theory. A curese on them all for this particular travesty and, no, I’m not a teacher union activist, educator or what have you. I’m an old-fashioned school TEACHER. Get the government the hell out of my classroom!
josef nix
May 29th, 2009
3:22 pm
oops…a CURSE on them! I’m a teacher, I ain’t expected to spell very good!
mike
May 29th, 2009
3:31 pm
getalife –
Way to duck the question. You are truly brave! LOL
n22s
May 29th, 2009
3:38 pm
You want to know why I’m not an Obama fan? The way in which this whole Gitmo affair has been handled.
First; false concern about the rights of the Gitmo detainees. Some will be tried, some through tribunals. Some will be released. Some who are so dangerous they cannot be tried in any way or released.
In other words, we are giving rights to some but not to others. If detaining a non-uniformed combatant is wrong for one it is wrong for every one of them.
Those who are to be detained indefinitely are judged guilty until proven innocent.
You applaud Obama for “closing” Gitmo and giving some detainees some hope of trial or tribunal but close your eyes to his denial of the right to trial for others.
Translation; anything Obama does is quite alright with you.
You, oh intelligent liberal, fail to ask yourself one simple question; what if Bush did it?
What if Bush gave rights to some but not others? What if Bush nationalized banks and car companies? What if the Bush administration had flown Air Force 1 over NY for a photo op?
Would you ask if anyone besides essential personnel were on AF1?
No…you pride yourself on your “open mind”, “compassion” and “intelligence” while you question NOTHING coming out of the Obama administration.
You ignore the tick…tick…tick…of impending economic doom because a Peter Griffin look-alike said something about green jobs. You condemn Bush’s spending but applaud spending at a rate 4 times Bush’s worst.
And the best defense your ignorant mind can arrive at is; “Bush was worse” or “It’s Bush’s fault”. You wouldn’t let your 15 yr old get away with it after denting the car but you’ll swallow anything out of the mouth of Obama’s corpulent mouthpiece.
Jake
May 29th, 2009
3:44 pm
Copyleft – I believe in the ‘provide for the common defense’ part of the Preamble, but I most have overlooked the ‘let sworn, known, and proven enemies of the people go free’ part, probably because that part isn’t in the Constitution! I think most of the innocent little wrong place wrong time stopped at a roadblock guys have already been released. There might be a few innocents mixed in but most of these guys are terorists. They haven’t been convicted because the liberal members of the SC subverted the will of the people effectively ending the trials by military tribunal, which is all they deserve as prisoners of war. Here’s a link listing the scumbags you claim aren’t guilty of anything, and some of the evidence against them. http://wid.ap.org/documents/detainees/list.html
BTW, thirty eight years ago today I was with the 101st, B Company 2/506 in the middle of a 114 day stay on a lovely little mountain in Vietnam known as FSB Ripcord so, unlike a traitorous little coward like you, I believe I’ve earned the right to call myself an American.
N.J,
May 29th, 2009
3:45 pm
I traveled to Europe at least once during every presidency since Nixons and it pretty definite. The United States was ALWAYS more highly thought of when Democrats were in office, and not much liked when people like Reagan and his “cowboy diplomacy” was the U.S. Foreign policy. You could easily tell, because whenever a Republican was in office, some sort of appellation that had a negative connotation was invented by other countries to describe the new president’s policies.
Last time I was in Ireland, a few years back, Bush was ill thought of, but Clinton was still loved, right up there with JFK and the painting of JFK that hung in almost every Irish home. Last trip I was given a one of a families precious JFK paintings which had been on the wall of their living room since 1960. They loved Clinton, they loved Carter but there was no love lost between them and Nixon, Reagan or either Bush president. They were very happy to find out that John McCain really wasnt Irish.
n22s
May 29th, 2009
3:49 pm
And what else do you swallow? Rendition started by the Clinton administration. Abducting people and bringing them to a third country where they can be tortured and detained without trial. Your lovable President from Arkansas started that one.
When will you ask for Clinton’s war trial or his participation in a “truth commission”? Try never because show trials are only important when they embarass Repbulicans.
How many of you ever heard of Miguel Estrada? Or heard of the memo expressing concern of his nomination to a court because the Dems can’t allow a Republican Hispanic to be confirmed? He was filibustered by the same Charles Schumer who says Republicans deny Sotomayor at their own peril.
You, my liberal friend, expressed your empathy for a Hispanic from a disadvantaged background by saying nothing.
And what of the wiretaps on overseas calls to terrorists you claim the Bush admin was using to listen to you? As if you all don’t think alike. You need only listen to one liberal to know what they ALL think.
Now that the Obama adminstration continues this practice we don’t hear a peep from you. You’re all about rights and justice and whatever until your pal denies them…then you turn a blind eye to his abuses, muttering to yourself “Bush was worse”.
Jake
May 29th, 2009
4:03 pm
Copyleft – I’m all for justice. Unfortunately, it’s only mentioned once in the Constitution in the phrase “fleeing from justice” in regard to extradition. That’s actually been one of my points. There is no right or guarantee of justice anywhere in the Constitution, and, perhaps consequently, our legal system does a pretty poor job of administering it. What we get instead is a guarantee of due process. I’ll tell you again OJ got due process, but do you think that was justice for Nicole and Goldman? Justice for the terrorists is not be convicted or be released. We are at war and these are combatants that can be held without trial as long as the war is going on. True Americans have a right and a duty to protect ourselves from enemies in a time of war, to protect the innocent from the cowardly terrorists. That’s justice.
n22s
May 29th, 2009
4:03 pm
NJ – Why is it we attach so much weight to the opinions of the Europeans? I’m not implying that we should ignore it but, instead, view it with a bit of perspective.
Why is it a point of view from a white person of European descent is so valuable when spoken abroad but discounted when expressed on our shores? Apparently white people lose intelligence when they are born in Paris, Texas instead of Paris, France.
I remember the appeasement of Hitler, colonialism, ill-fated forays into the Middle East, etc. etc. Yet NOW, when they love Democrats and hate Repbulicans, the white people are to be counseled.
I don’t dismiss European opinion out of hand. I paid attention during history class enough to take it with a grain of salt.
TnGelding
May 29th, 2009
4:08 pm
mike
May 29th, 2009
3:05 pm
I posted a lengthy reply, but it got caught.
Suffice to say we’re paying for the sins of the last 28 years and more, and it’s too early to judge Obama.
n22s
May 29th, 2009
4:16 pm
NJ, you spoke of one reason for European approval of Democrats over Republicans is the formers’ closer adherence to treaties. You mean the same Europeans guilty in the oil for food fraud? The Europeans who jump right in to enforce stern warnings and really, really strongly worded resolutions? THOSE Europeans?
Have you ever considered that Europeans love Democrats because they are more closely aligned in goals? Has it ever crossed your mind that the real debate should be whether the policies of Europeans/Democrats or Republicans are correct?
Perhaps the world would be different if Europeans took more responsibility for their defense, the care and feeding of the world, etc.?
N.J, is a Nitwit
May 29th, 2009
4:17 pm
Why do we even need a President? Why can’t we just let the Eurotrash and the U.N. tell us what to do? They’re so wise and wonderful they only needed us to preserve their liberty twice last century. 90% of the world views us with some combination of fear, hatred and envy, no matter which party is in the WH. But I am surprisd to learn the Irish liked Kennedy; who would have thought they would have liked an Irish, Catholic President. You sir, are a moron.
n22s
May 29th, 2009
4:28 pm
TNGelding – you speak of the sins of the last 28 years. Yet you ignore the experience of the last 200 years when it comes to socialism, fascism, profligate spending and the denial of human rights.
Please show me where socialism and economic fascism has fed, clothed and housed as many people and as well as has capitalism?
Bush spent too much but we should ignore spending that is four times Bush’s worst year?
Bush and Obama threw money down a car company rat hole to delay bankruptcy, what, five months? And only Bush is to blame?
Fiduciary responsibilities to bondholders in car companies are pushed aside to save unions and you’re okay with that concept? In the future, when credit isn’t extended to companies because of concerns over being screwed by the government, you’re going to blame Bush?
And when inflation skyrockets because we have monetized the debt, you’re going to blame Bush?
We have piled on so much debt that our Secretary of State has stated she won’t discuss human rights with the Chinese because we need them to buy our debt. And that is Bush’s fault?
What, pray tell, is Obama’s responsibility, if anything?
n22s
May 29th, 2009
4:30 pm
Enter your comments here
md
May 29th, 2009
4:57 pm
tn,
“If they can’t be convicted, then they should bee freed back to there homeland.”"
And there in lies the problem for their “homeland” wants nothing to do with them and will not take them back.
Best solution if they claim to have been sightseeing – give them some spending money and put them back in the afghan mountains with their cameras. Problem solved.
md
May 29th, 2009
5:01 pm
NJ, I would think that common sense dictates that socialist leaning european countries would prefer socialist leaning american presidents.
And no, Clinton was not liked for his actions in the balkans as europeans tend to be weenies and believe there is no evil in the world and the military is a waste of money. Again, visit the blog sites over there and watch the comments on clinton/nato and the balkans. We were not looked at lovingly.
catlady
May 29th, 2009
9:32 pm
I understand what the Europeans are saying. However, some would argue that we have saved their azzes a lot of times and they owe us a few hundred favors.
Coplyleft
May 30th, 2009
8:24 am
Jake: That’s encouraging, to see that you understand at least some of the ideas that make up America.
Now, if we’re going to protect the innocent and punish the guilty… don’t you think we should try to find out which is which?
You’ve already admitted that many Gitmo detainees have been released because they were, in fact, innocent… and you know that many of the others haven’t had any kind of hearing at all. So how do you KNOW that they’re “probably” “mostly” terrorists? You casually label them all sworn enemies of America… but there are MILLIONS of those around the world, and we don’t have the right to lock them up for life either, much less shoot them (or torture them).
That’s because we’re a nation of LAWS that we continue to obey, even when our enemies do bad, awful things that scare us and make us pee our pants. We don’t abandon those laws and turn into bloodthirsty bullies out for revenge… at least, the REAL Americans don’t. The cowards always resort to that kind of crap, but we can ignore them.
So again, I’ll ask: What kind of American are you? Do you believe in our laws, or do you just want to feel “safe” by breaking our own laws in the name of national security?
N.J,
May 30th, 2009
10:41 pm
My favorite quote was:
When the Spanish PM Jose Maria Aznar told Bush that in Europe he was “nearly as unpopular as Ronald Reagan” Bush replied, “I’m keeping pretty good company”.
http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=2148
N.J,
May 30th, 2009
10:45 pm
ACtually that statement that Americans saves European azzes is again another American myth. The Russians had swept clear across Europe and it was only fear that they would sweep across the rest that got the Americans to jump in. As it was, the Allies in the west only faced 10 percent of what the Nazi Army was at its full strength and odds are that the British and the other groups in exile could have done the job just as well. General Montgomery was no slouch when it came to battle and probably the job could have been done without American assistance.
Roberto Heffe
May 31st, 2009
2:51 pm
I actually don’t mind if the prisoners are brought to a Supermax. What confuses me is that the left is outraged at the waterboarding and sleep deprivation at Gitmo but has no issue sending them to a Supermax where they will be “violated” beyond belief. But the left will then say “No, they will be isolated from the general population so it is OK” at which point it will be very clear that the left does not mind the horrid treatment of regular US inmates and the nightmares they encounter as long as the foriegn inmates who have no US legal ties are treated with bouqets of chocolate and hourly back massages.
It is not we “neo-cons” are scared, we are just amazed at the amount of naive people out there….
William H. in Lithonia
June 1st, 2009
5:34 pm
Those people in guantanamo have not been proven guilty of anything because we have denied them habeas corpus and a fair trial.
On the other hand, Dick Cheney has admitted to the War Crime of torture in his continuing tortuous speeches supporting torture and bragging about his torturous days as Vice President. I think he needs to be arrested for this admission of guilt and given his day in court.