Secession, nullification … Is Georgia this crazy?
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A while back, I wrote about an absolutely wacky, downright neoConfederate resolution adopted 43-1 by the Georgia Senate at the end of its most recent session.
Among other nutty things, the resolution resurrected the archaic 19th century claim that states have the power to “nullify” federal laws they don’t like. The resolution also advanced the novel argument that passage of certain kinds of laws — including, but not limited to, “prohibitions of type or quantity of arms or ammunition” — “shall constitute a nullification of the Constitution for the United States of America by the government of the United States of America.”
In other words, if Congress passes a law reinstating the ban on assault weapons or tightening the law against ammunition capable of penetrating bullet-proof vests, it would be like hitting a national “self-destruct” button — the United States of America as we’ve known it ceases to exist, and we become 50 individual nations.
In that first column, I tried to give our state Senate the benefit of the doubt, noting that the measure had been hidden in a bunch of resolutions approved without being read by most senators. I also tried to ignore the findings of a subsequent poll of Georgians sponsored by the Daily Kos site. According to that poll, 43 percent of Georgia Republicans believe our state would be better off as an independent nation than as part of the United States; 32 percent of Georgia Republicans approve of the state seceding from the Union.
I averted my eyes from that poll because frankly, I did not believe those findings and did not want to believe it. But I’m now being forced to reassess that stance because of statements from Georgia Republican leaders, who presumably know their party members better than I do.
Larry Peterson of the Savannah Morning News has advanced the story by polling the six GOP candidates for governor. According to Peterson, four of the six support the resolution, one opposes it and the sixth refused to take a position on whether nullification and secession were are good ideas.
These are people running for the highest office in the state, including the three frontrunners for the GOP nomination. The winner of that nomination would in turn be favored to be our next governor.
More accurately, if events take a turn, I guess that person could become the first president of Georgia.
For example, state Sen. Eric Johnson of Savannah, who voted for the resolution, said he would do so again. “This is not a hollow threat,” he told Peterson. “We are simply reasserting our authority to protect the rights, freedoms and desires of the people we are elected to serve.”
A spokesman for Secretary of State Karen Handel said he assumes that she too would support the resolution.
And Insurance Commissioner John Oxendine says that if he had been a state senator, “not only would I have voted for it, I would have been one of the original sponsors.” Oxendine is the candidate leading in early polls for the GOP nomination; polls also give him a lead over leading Democratic candidates.
And as Creative Loafing recently reported, Oxendine is also the man who sent out the following update on Twitter about how he and his wife, Ivy, had spent last Saturday:
Is this truly what Georgia has come to? I don’t know whether to laugh or cry.
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267 comments Add your comment
Disgusted
May 14th, 2009
2:13 pm
This is absolutely disgusting. I am a conservative Christian. I am also a patriotic American. No politician who rejects the American flag and the American Constitution will ever get my vote. Talk of secession is treason.
I Report :-)/ You Whine :-(
May 14th, 2009
2:19 pm
I believe it is up to We The People to decide, not the socialists nor the urinalists.
Other than that, I say let’s go for it.
bwa
I Report :-)/ You Whine :-(
May 14th, 2009
2:21 pm
Acorn, the failed major cities of the US and some crank northern states all voted for “change” and now they are gonna get their very own country to change.
The rest of us like the country the way it has been for 233 years.
We just need a new Declaration of Independence from our little king.
Goldie
May 14th, 2009
2:21 pm
Yes, Jay — I was born in Atlanta, I’ve lived in other places around the U.S. as an adult, and I’ve pretty much given up hope for the state of GA to ever come out of the 19th century, much less the 20th century. You have to laugh to keep from cryin’… but, this state is really a big mess.
Truth
May 14th, 2009
2:24 pm
19th century??? How?
Dave R
May 14th, 2009
2:24 pm
Sorry, disgusted, but talking about secession is NOT treason.
And while I don’t think that any serious talking about secession will ever come about, I think the thought that states CAN decide whether or not a law is detrimental to their state and simply ignore it is certainly something that should be discussed.
This country was founded on the notion that individuals have rights first and foremost, states getting second crack at them, and finally the Federal government. We have grown too far away from that notion, and in fact, have reversed that process to where the Federal government now controls most of the power in this country, drives unfunded mandates to the states, and expects the individual to just go along.
You want treasonous activity, look no farther than your elected U.S. Representative as he or she votes to increase federal power over the state and the individual.
Taxpayer
May 14th, 2009
2:25 pm
I’m with you, Jay. These guys get paid! With taxpayer money! To reenact the Civil War! What next. Will Oxendine start off his campaign by sending out Confederate currency with his picture on it? Talk about your party re-branding — something that starts with a big bold capital “L” sounds fitting.
jt
May 14th, 2009
2:26 pm
YEEEEEE HAWWWWWWW
Doggone/GA
May 14th, 2009
2:26 pm
It’s better than a soap opera! Get out the popcorn, prop up your feet, lean back and have fun watching.
jt
May 14th, 2009
2:27 pm
NEOconfederate. WTF?
Joe Matarotz
May 14th, 2009
2:29 pm
What are you talking about, Jay? I read your article. There was no benefit of the doubt. You pointed out that they were basically idiots, and (gasp!) you were right. So why backpedal now? Is this to give the impression that you are becoming a fair and balanced reporter? You’re not, so you can stop pretending. On this topic, you were right then and you’re right now. Then again, even a broken watch is right twice a day.
Bennett
May 14th, 2009
2:29 pm
Georgia is a welfare state, i.e. it gets more money from DC than it pays in.
By all means, secede. The US will certainly send aid when you come begging.
Doggone/GA
May 14th, 2009
2:31 pm
“NEOconfederate. WTF?”
“neo” means “new” – there can’t be any OLD confederates, they’ve all died. All we have now is the “new” confederates who never gave up on the possibility of winning the rebellion and restoring a “nation” that never was.
Susan Myers
May 14th, 2009
2:36 pm
Yes, Georgia is this crazy.
http://blogs.creativeloafing.com/freshloaf/2009/05/01/ga-governor-candidate-hates-abortion-loved-animals/
Next question?
Susan Myers
May 14th, 2009
2:38 pm
irrelevant one @ 2:24,
Watch your blood pressure, sweetie, I want a good time tonight.
getalife
May 14th, 2009
2:40 pm
cons are not patriotic and are free to leave our country.
Get out.
Truth
May 14th, 2009
2:40 pm
The Southern Anthem… Also the greatest song EVER!!!
Elvis “An American Trilogy”
Oh I wish I was in the land of cotton
Old things they are not forgotten
Look away, look away, look away dixieland
Oh I wish I was in dixie, away, away
In dixieland I take my stand to live and die in dixie
Cause dixieland, thats where I was born
Early lord one frosty morning
Look away, look away, look away dixieland
Glory, glory hallelujah
Glory, glory hallelujah
Glory, glory hallelujah
His truth is marching on
So hush little baby
Dont you cry
You know your daddys bound to die
But all my trials, lord will soon be over
Glory, glory hallelujah
His truth is marching on
His truth is marching on
ty webb
May 14th, 2009
2:43 pm
getalife,
Jay’s blog entry doesn’t mention Conservatives. It only mentions Republicans. There is a difference.
I Report :-)/ You Whine :-(
May 14th, 2009
2:43 pm
Georgia is a welfare state, i.e. it gets more money from DC than it pays in.
The per capita income for the City of Atlanta in 2005 real dollars is $25,254.
For the rest of the State of Georgia it is $40,155.
Anybody care to take a stab at why Georgia is a “welfare” state?
This doesn’t even take into account the confiscatory sales and business taxes that Atlanta charges outsiders just to keep their nasty little berg afloat.
Why do you think we want to shed our little Obozo voters, to get rid of our primary source of income, bwahahahahahahahaha, clown.
T
May 14th, 2009
2:55 pm
I don’t get it.
Susan Myers
May 14th, 2009
2:56 pm
irrelevant one @ 2:53,
Well, I would, honeypie, but the last time you used it you got it all sticky and messy. Will you buy me one for my very own?
jt
May 14th, 2009
2:57 pm
You heard it here first.
The adherents of the R & D party are hereby called NEO-TARDS.
Someone complained earlier about sheeple.
Dennis
May 14th, 2009
3:03 pm
I sort of like this possibility.
Georgia becomes an independent country, the US Army invades, quickly captures Georgia’a Rulers, and confines them in the brand new Combatant Holding Facility located in Maine or Pennsylvania or Nevada.
Next the US military oversees Georgia’s reconstruction. Spending Billions of Dollars. High Speed Rail is constructed from Atl to DC. Eventualy Georgia is allowed to hold free elections wherein no person, Democrat or Republican, who was ever elected to state office is allowed to run.
Net gain for Georgia.
Dave R
May 14th, 2009
3:03 pm
One day soon, Susan Myers is actually going to post something on-topic, and thoughtful.
OK, maybe not soon . . . but one day.
mike
May 14th, 2009
3:05 pm
I have thought that the rhetoric about the death (and insanity) of the GOP was vastly overstated. Apparently it was not. What planet are these guys living on?
Wyld Byll Hyltnyr
May 14th, 2009
3:06 pm
Secession is not the answer as we love the United States and the constitution is, apart from Jesus’ sacrifice, the greatest achievement by mankind, ever. Rather, the answer is excising Jew York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Michigan, Ohio, Iowa, California-cation along with providing a free train ticket to those debauched locales to every welfare mama with three or four suckers under their arms, the hmos, pacifists, liberal, and other similar moral degenerates.
We, then, in great states like Georgia, Louisiana, Mississippi, Texas, Oklahoma, and Virginia can get back to a society based on traditional Judeo-Christian values where our families won’t have to be subject to the immoral rants of the liberals (see Bill Mohron, Jeanine Garanimal, and Kerry (never) Wirght) or the filth put out by the Hollywierdos. Our tax dollars, if we have to pay ‘em at all, won’t have to support the rotten Acorn, or to screw secured creditors as was done in the Chrysler bankruptcy, and to fund baby-cide.
We could even make George Bush or Dick Cheney our new president. Our version of “don’t ask – don’t tell” would be that we won’t ask the liberal sheople what they are thinking and they won’t be able to tell us anything at all.
To all the liberals, hmos and
Taxpayer
May 14th, 2009
3:06 pm
The only certainty I see from the GOP is that they are indeed null…and devoid…of functioning brains. What are they down to now, 17 percent. Less. By the way, keep up the good work, GOPers. The DoDo will finally be re-united with its off-spring.
mike
May 14th, 2009
3:10 pm
Dave R –
“I think the thought that states CAN decide whether or not a law is detrimental to their state and simply ignore it is certainly something that should be discussed.”
It was discussed (and settled) a long time ago. The question as to whether states can nullify federal laws was probably the most debated question in the first half of the 19th century. There is a mountain of precedent to say that they can’t. The decision is a good one, as we never would have gotten to where we are without it and such an arrangement would at best leaves us as impotent as the EU and at worst at war with each other.
I agree with you on most matters, but this talk from our state officials is insane.
Bennett
May 14th, 2009
3:10 pm
@2:43: Your straw men don’t change reality: Georgia depends on the federal government. We’ll be glad to keep Atlanta, though it only means that the Republic of Georgia will go downhill that much sooner and we’ll have to beef up the border patrol to keep your refugees out of the US. Though of course we wouldn’t do that.
You’ve got your little resolution. Time for the next step. Put up or shut up.
Dave R
May 14th, 2009
3:14 pm
C’mon, Taxpayer, you can do better than your usual rant against Republicans, can’t you?
Now, be a good boy and argue the merits of the initial post, or argue against it – with something other than rhetoric.
For instance, why shouldn’t states simply ignore those programs the Federal government passes but refuses to fully fund? Isn’t an unfunded mandate a good place to start this discussion?
Dave R
May 14th, 2009
3:16 pm
Bennett, that number is not significant. Something on the order of 3% or so. I think we could make that up very quickly, especially if we no longer have to fund Federal mandates we do not agree with.
DB, Gwinnettian
May 14th, 2009
3:17 pm
To all the liberals, hmos and
[clunk]
Wyld? you still there? Or was the over-stimulation from all that exciting SEE-cession talk enough to make you pass out? Or worse?
hellooooo?
Susan Myers
May 14th, 2009
3:17 pm
irrelevant one @ 3:03,
It’d be mighty thoughtful of you to buy me one of my own, and keep your, ummm, body parts away from it. Will ya, babe?
Dave R
May 14th, 2009
3:18 pm
Looks like today will not be the day for Susan.
Dave R
May 14th, 2009
3:20 pm
Mike, how about unfunded mandates? Isn’t that a good place to start? Refuse to implement, bring the case to court, and let’s see how it goes.
Susan Myers
May 14th, 2009
3:21 pm
This nutball talk and kinky teabagging is the dying gasps of old conservative (Southern) white men angered and disappointed because their time has finally passed. It’s actually quite enjoyable seeing them suffer.
WhoCares
May 14th, 2009
3:21 pm
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. If the republican party is so dead and irrelevant why do y’all pay so much attention to them. Could it be that the ten or so loyal libs that hang out on this blog have a sinking feeling that they are not really the majority even if they do see their name in print?
getalife
May 14th, 2009
3:23 pm
ty,
cons are the gop base silly.
Do not engage me with your bs.
Truth
May 14th, 2009
3:25 pm
I think Susan just soiled her Depends
Susan Myers
May 14th, 2009
3:25 pm
irrelevant one @ 3:18,
Not my day! But you promised! My precious luvuhboy, they’re even giving Viagra away now. You won’t even have to pay for it. Please, pretty, pretty please?
Get Real
May 14th, 2009
3:25 pm
It was unpatriotic in 2003 to be opposed to the Iraq war. Either you were for BushCo, or with the terrorists. In 2009, it’s quite alright though to speak of seceding from the Union. Go figure.
RetLTC
May 14th, 2009
3:25 pm
Let’s see Dave R. What would the tax rate be for the citizenry of a seceding state once they lost all funding from their former federal benefactor? Texas is probably the only state that could hold it’s head above water for more than a year or 2. A state like Georgia would sink like a rock. It also boggles the imagination to think of a “sovereign” Georgia run by this present group of bubbas. LMAO!
mike
May 14th, 2009
3:26 pm
Mike:
“Mike, how about unfunded mandates? Isn’t that a good place to start?”
Unfunded mandates are big problem, but the states don’t have the right to ignore them. The answer is to get the Republicans in Congress and at the state level to make cogent arguments about their damaging effects than have them talking about secession, which in my conservative mind is treasonous.
getalife
May 14th, 2009
3:26 pm
The solution is simple.
Those who voted to secede, leave the country.
Get out.
Our country will be much better without the cons.
Love it or leave it.
EJ Moosa
May 14th, 2009
3:26 pm
It’s no surprise that the states that love the Federal government the most are the ones with the greatest problems today: California, New York, Maryland, Michigan.
So how many of you are better off today than you were a year ago? We swapped a crappy President for a socialist/marxist one, and everyone seems surprised that the private sector economy is not recovering. The private sector produces while the government sector seduces with promises of fairness.
To think that all fifty states are going to sit back and endure more and more of the shovel fulls of mandates such as unemployment for people receiving Pell grants so they can go to the already overcrowded universities is a laugh. Some will take decisive action away from the idiotcratic leadership we are seeing by Obama, Pelosi, Reid, and friends.
Get Real
May 14th, 2009
3:28 pm
While driving up GA 400, a conservative republican wondered why he had to pay taxes. He hit a pothole and blew a tire, then wondered why that part of the road wasn’t fixed.
mike
May 14th, 2009
3:29 pm
Get Real –
“It was unpatriotic in 2003 to be opposed to the Iraq war.”
Oh please. Many folks like to make this silly claim, but it doesn’t have much basis in fact. I’ve seen liberals on this board accuse conservatives of being unpatriotic more times than I can count and Wanda Sykes called Rush Limbaugh the 20th hijacker in front of an applauding press corps, so spare me.
Susan Myers
May 14th, 2009
3:29 pm
Individual rights certainly gives each of us the right to choose what government to which we will submit, but at what point do I have to leave my state to get to property that is not controlled by a “government” which declares my federal government its enemy. I expect my federal government to protect my right to be a citizen of the United States even if the state government attempts to go to war with America. Many Georgians cherish a history of treason and treachery. Will loyal Americans have to flee a government which sets the Stars and Stripes as their enemy, abandoning their home and property, or will the United States of America protect the rights of its citizens from leadership that abandons our nation to create their own power? America allows a great deal of freedom for states, even those states which persecute their own citizens, however, if those states insist on drawing a line in the sand, I choose the land of my forefathers as opposed to those who tried to destroy the United States of America. Republicans are insane, but the glory of our Republic, and the freedom of our Democracy isn’t up for grabs by any party. Prosecute those in government who seek to overthrow it. If “we the people” want to change things, we will do it without their guns, thank you.
Taxpayer
May 14th, 2009
3:29 pm
It is amusing to pick on the wannabe seceded ones and watch them Puff’NStuff.
Susan Myers
May 14th, 2009
3:30 pm
Lies @ 3:25,
How would you know? What are you doing in my drawers?