George Will rooting for failure
I’ve long admired the craftsmanship in many of George Will’s columns, even if I disagree with the opinions expressed therein. But in his latest effort, he basically announces that he wants GM and Chrysler to fail, at the cost of tens of billions of dollars to the taxpayer, and many thousands of jobs filled by his fellow Americans.
He’s not only rooting for that outcome, he wants his readers to help make it happen by buying from Ford and avoiding — for political reasons — GM and Chrysler produc ts:
“This is so because Ford has, so far, avoided becoming an appendage of the government. And because the national interest will not be served by GM and Chrysler flourishing. It might cost taxpayers more in the short run, but in the long run it will be less costly for the country if the government finds its confident plunge into industrial policy so unpleasant that, sadder but wiser, the incumbent professors and others will flee from such adventures in extracting sunbeams from cucumbers.”
Apparently, it would rock Will’s world if GM and Chrysler survive and even thrive and manage to pay back billions in government loans. There’s something fundamentally cynical and smug about that attitude.
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210 comments Add your comment
Hillbilly Deluxe
May 7th, 2009
3:15 pm
I’m a Ford man but not for his reasons. I’d like to see all three survive and proper. It would be good for the country over the long haul, I think.
Copyleft
May 7th, 2009
3:20 pm
Nothing new there, Jay. It’s the same sentiment as we’ve been hearing from the secessionists–”If we can’t run the country, the country must be destroyed. Waaaaaahhhh!”
Mike
May 7th, 2009
3:29 pm
Wow! Jay attacking a conservative pundit? Didn’t see that coming.
George Will actually writes columns about ideas, as opposed to Jay who just exists to bash people who aren’t on “his side”. We need more thinking pundits like Will and Nicholas Kristof and less tedious partisans like Bookman and Hannity who have no purpose beyond partisan warfare.
Wes
May 7th, 2009
3:30 pm
Jay,
Think about what success for the government means. That we as individuals or as private companies are not as successful at handling our own business as government is.
You may feel that some of us are being malicious. I personally like a certain level of freedom. I’d like to believe that in the vast majority of cases I can handle life without government intrusion.
There is also the issue of rule of law. Financing works because of property law. If bankruptcy is overturned whenever the government feels like it how many people will commit to financing?
Hillbilly Deluxe
May 7th, 2009
3:30 pm
That should have, of course, said “survive and prosper”.
Susan Myers
May 7th, 2009
3:33 pm
Don’t be fooled by these Republican snake-oil salesmen. There’s only one reason they want the Big 3 to fail, and it’s all about destroying one of the most powerful labor unions in the country. Then they’ll blame the failure on those outrageous living wages the union demanded and use the propaganda to go after the rest of the labor movement.
Kamchak
May 7th, 2009
3:34 pm
Play the ad hominem attack card. Nobody will see that coming either
Midori
May 7th, 2009
3:39 pm
LOL, Kamchak!!!
took the words out of my mouth
Brian
May 7th, 2009
3:40 pm
How many are aware that Crysler will no longer have to pay pack the tax payer money due to their bankruptcy filing?
md
May 7th, 2009
3:44 pm
Ever been in a union Susan? They need overhauling too, just as management compensation needs overhauling. Neither does the company they represent any good. And more often than not, you are I are that company.
And the article stated 2, not 3.
Mrs. Godzilla
May 7th, 2009
3:44 pm
George Will….lost me in that last little climate denial dust up at the NYT.
He is an elitist idealogue and mightily uptight to boot.
DebbieDoRight
May 7th, 2009
3:56 pm
Think about what success for the government means. That we as individuals or as private companies are not as successful at handling our own business as government is.
We the people of the United States ARE the government. We don’t live in a kingdom or Nazi society.
MD: And more often than not, you are I are that company.
Huh?
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
3:59 pm
Debbie,
“We the people of the United States ARE the government. We don’t live in a kingdom or Nazi society.”
Funny. Good one.
Dave R
May 7th, 2009
4:00 pm
I think George Will has a great idea going. Let’s show the world that Socialist programs don’t work. Kill two car companies that can’t compete in the free market and put a big ol’ stake in the heart of the UAW at the same time. (BTW, Chrysler does great when selling Jeeps, muscle cars, minivans and trucks. Where do they LOSE money? On Government-mandated, fuel-efficient sedans)
How’s that workin’ fer ya, libs?
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
4:05 pm
Dave R.,
“Chrysler does great when selling Jeeps, muscle cars, minivans and trucks”
I’m no economist, nor do I play one on TV, but if they does so great selling those cars – then why the hell are they in the financial trouble they are?
And can you for the books please explain to me how any of the dealings at Chyrsler is Socialist – has Obama announced that he plans for the US government to own the company for eternity and I missed it all while I was out just now? Do I need to turn on the news?
md
May 7th, 2009
4:06 pm
Deb,
“MD: And more often than not, you are I are that company.
Huh?”
We the people own the gov’t and we the people also own many companys – Stockholders.
And many people do not even know which companys they own. Pension plans of teachers, police, firefighters, everyday americans, etc.
We.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
4:06 pm
Oh and Dave R.,
“On Government-mandated, fuel-efficient sedans”
And is this also a news flash I haven’t heard of yet? Will they be discussing this on the evening news later?
md
May 7th, 2009
4:08 pm
and “you and I” would make more sense, wouldn’t it.
ty webb
May 7th, 2009
4:09 pm
Bosch,
I liked your 3:59 post directed at debbie. Just to clear something up, that was sarcasm, right? Sometimes it’s hard to tell on this board.
Dave R
May 7th, 2009
4:17 pm
Let’s see, Bosch. Maybe it is the government giving taxpayer funds to a private enterprise that cannot make it in the free marketplace.
Maybe it is the re-writing of legal contracts to put the unsecured UAW pension plan ahead of secured creditors.
Maybe it is the government forcing the current CEO out at GM and picking their own man at the helm.
Maybe it is finally proof that Government-mandated fuel-efficient programs cannot make a car company a viable concern.
N.J,
May 7th, 2009
4:23 pm
Again its a proof that when Americans do something it does not work because of Republican efforts to hamstring them, and when Europeans do so it works fine. The reason that everyone drives European and Japanese cars is basically that both those nations had social welfare type conditions when their car companies started their boom, and American car companies had to face Republican style economics.
When Toyota and Nissan were starting to invade the American market, their corporations had government mandated cradle to grave job benefits for their employees. Europe had its social welfare state. America had its Republican tax cuts. Didnt work. Both Europe and Japan’s governments backed their auto industries to the hilt and backed employee benefits to the hilt as well.
The heyday of the American auto industry was of course in the pre-Reaganomics years. And American autos were the best in the world.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
4:24 pm
Dave R.,
Chrysler isn’t a private enterprise anymore? When did that happen?
Number 2 and Number 3 on your list isn’t Socialism
Number 4 – are you a Seer now? Do you have a crystal ball? LOL!!!
ty,
I thought it was funny. I just envisioned Shrek for a moment and got a chuckle.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
4:30 pm
ty,
In other words – nope, no sarcasm – sorry bud – I agree with her.
DebbieDoRight
May 7th, 2009
4:30 pm
Bosch:
Paul
May 7th, 2009
4:33 pm
I return, and oh, what fun!
If Jay and the Southern Baptists can agree on something, then it’s high time for Democrats and Republicans to get their act together.
My thought on this: we’ve heard the administration say one reason for the financial bailout was because we let certain companies get ‘too big to fail’ and we must not get into that trap again. The “too big to fail” was also used for GM; Chrysler, not so much. So I’m wondering what’s in store, not just for the financial industry but for GM. Are they going to remain too big to fail or is something else in the planning stages for them?
Taxpayer: unfinished from down below. I do not really think you want me to tell you how much it costs to buy silverware at Gitmo. Your original question was, given all the $$$ DoD has, why not just fly the detainees out and be done with it? I replied DoD isn’t free to spend on whatever they want. Fed Appropriation Law holds funds are available only to the extent specifically authorized by law. That’s when you came in with the silverware question. I referred you to a brief that explained some of the concepts. I never said I could provide detail to the nth degree. But if you really want to know, in brief (I have this on pretty good authority):
- The Defense Appropriation becomes law.
- Navy, AF, Army, Marines get their budget
Congress gives them the money in different appropriations: construction, pay, operations and maintenance, etc.
Money from one appropriation cannot be used for purposes covered by another appropriation.
Within appropriations, Congress sets specifics. Each and every building built is specifically authorized by Congress. Each one. Each major weapons system is authorized at each stage of development. Once developed and in the pipeline, limits on numbers that can be bought are set.
Within appropriation, Congress sets limits. Take your silverware appropriation, Operations and Maintenance. General guidelines are given (they don’t specify copy paper, laser paper, pens, etc). But there are “shalt nots” like: no going away presents. No bottled water. Taxpayers don’t pay taxes so government employees can give each other presents and food.
Then there are a whole bunch of subdivisions to track expenses to the nth degree. Thank Robert McNamara for that. So you can know what it costs to run an organization, like Gitmo. Or if something unusual, nonstandard, comes up, they can use a special tracking code to track all the expenses. Which is why reporters tell us it costs more to feed the detainees than our soldiers in combat zones.
But an organization can’t take money they’ve been given to build a building or maintain airplanes or send guards to training and use it to transport, feed and house detainees. Which is why Congress was even talking about a separate line item for moving detainees out of Gitmo.
And why the brave Democrats cut it.
Trust me on this.
DebbieDoRight
May 7th, 2009
4:34 pm
Maybe it is the re-writing of legal contracts to put the unsecured UAW pension plan ahead of secured creditors.
Huh? When did that happen? Got a link for that one?
Maybe it is the government forcing the current CEO out at GM and picking their own man at the helm.
Isn’t that what all the Republicans SAID they wanted? I remember distinctly the republicans stating that “Whichever CEO of a company gets a bailout, that CEO should forfeit his job”. Not verbatim, but isn’t that what the Always Right wanted? So, if you got what you wanted, then WHY are you still crying about it?
Taxpayer
May 7th, 2009
4:34 pm
So, has Mr Will been courageous enough to openly profess a desire to see a similar fate for every other person that received financial assistance during this credit crisis/recession. I mean, if AIG had failed, for example, and none of those CDS’s had been covered and the domino effect from that had been left to run its global course and if Freddie and Fannie had not been bailed out and… well, I wonder how he would feel about deposits not being insured for the increased amount and what if a few money market funds were left alone to break the buck and what about the impact on the PBGC and all the pensions they cover. I wonder if Mr. Will has really thought this thing through. Then again, I wonder if some of these people are even capable of a thought process at all….
md
May 7th, 2009
4:35 pm
First car produced by Gov’t Motors:
http://tr.youtube.com/watch?v=2yNJIsbzAHc
N.J,
May 7th, 2009
4:36 pm
and lets look at the current affairs in the Japanese auto industry:
Is this Fair? Japanese Government To Step In And Help Pay Idled Auto Workers
Thousands of Japanese car workers will soon draw part of their pay from the government under a scheme to prevent redundancies at companies hit by production cuts.
Mazda and Mitsubishi Motors, respectively Japan’s fifth and sixth biggest carmakers, have applied for the employment adjustment grants, according to industry officials, and others may follow soon.
The grants are available to struggling manufacturers of all types but the particularly sharp downturn in the car sector, combined with a recent expansion of the programme, has made carmakers eligible for large levels of support.
Mitsubishi, for example, plans to build passenger cars at its main plant in Okayama prefecture on just seven days next month. On the other 14 weekdays, the plant’s 3,000 full-time workers will stay at home but receive 85 per cent of their wages, half of which will be paid by the government.
http://www.autospies.com/news/Is-this-Fair-Japanese-Government-To-Step-In-And-Help-Pay-Idled-Auto-Workers-40324/
mike
May 7th, 2009
4:36 pm
“Play the ad hominem attack card. Nobody will see that coming either”
You don’t seem to know what an ad-hominem attack is (although you employ them frequently). Criticizing Jay’s writing as tedious is not an ad-hominem attack.
Got a cackle out of Midori though. So kudos for you.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
4:37 pm
Dave R.,
Yeah, and what Debbie said at 4:34.
jasper
May 7th, 2009
4:37 pm
At the end of the day, GM and Chrysler can not make a product that is comparable to non-union car manufacturers in quality or price. And we don’t hear these workers at non-union car companies screaming of management mis-treatment or lack of job security.
At what point will our government start tilting the field toward its dependents in the form of purchase incentives and tax credits as additional effort to prop up these companies.
Let the UAW have GM and Chrysler. Would love to see how long that lasts. Its no coincidence that GM, Chrysler, and the UAW can not exist on their own merit. They know this, and have to rely upon tax payer handouts, and lobbying for unfair legislation.
Don’t buy Union!
N.J,
May 7th, 2009
4:37 pm
The above is pretty much how Japanese and European automakers remain “profitable”
ty webb
May 7th, 2009
4:37 pm
Oh well, That’s okay. Wishful thinking on my part. Ha!
N.J,
May 7th, 2009
4:39 pm
Good, for the first time in a long time, the government is putting the real engine of the American economy, the worker, ahead of the investor.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
4:40 pm
ty,
Sorry. Ya’ know – I try, I really do.
Hillbilly Deluxe
May 7th, 2009
4:42 pm
Maybe it is the re-writing of legal contracts to put the unsecured UAW pension plan ahead of secured creditors.
My question is why have companies been allowed to make pension promises to their workers for decades without funding them?
I Report :-) / You Whine :-(
May 7th, 2009
4:43 pm
Of course bookman leaves out the reasoning and whines only about the solution-
The UAW will own 55 percent of Chrysler, so perhaps the union will sit on both sides of the table in negotiations. They should go smoothly, although the UAW may think it has made sufficient concessions, such as the one that says henceforth overtime pay will not begin until the worker has toiled 40 hours in a week.
At one time, the consensus would have been for a car company, who’s ownership was set up specifically to reward a politician’s contributors, to fail, so that it would not be tried again, but that time was before the socialists and their media lap dogs became kings of their little fiefdom America.
Now, in this day and age, common sense is routinely demonized without good explanation.
Goebbels would be so proud.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
4:44 pm
NJ,
@ 4:39 -
Dang. I wish I’d wrote that. Good point.
Tom
May 7th, 2009
4:47 pm
Ahh, George Will. Another Republigoon long time “hero-of-hatred.” Another dull uncompromising zealot of the middle-right. Another
patriotic Murcuhn clothed in the flag of dishonor. You go guy!
Taxpayer
May 7th, 2009
4:53 pm
Paul,
As I recall, we were heading down the course of determining exactly what Congress approves regarding budgetary items, line by line sort of stuff. You know, if the Congress has to approve the funding for transporting these guys to the state, then they must have to go line by line and approve funding for every single item unless I’m missing something from your posts. I can go back and do a little digging through the earlier posts just to make sure if you need me to do so. I just don’t want to pick up the matter and take it in some different direction than where we were originally going since that would be a whole different line of thought. You know what I mean.
Paul
May 7th, 2009
4:58 pm
Taxpayer
Sure. And it’s really not that big a deal. I was trying to keep it to the ‘big picture’ in the last post.
You are correct. Congress does go item by item with some things, which I tried to illustrate. Building buildings. Buying big weapons, even developing them. Amount that can be paid for salaries – number of military authorized. As I said, a matter of law is DoD can’t just take money and say “well, no one said I COULDN’T spend it on this…” The law is, they get the money and ask “Is this authorized?” (It’s a two-step process, something gets authorized – Congress says they can do it or buy it, then they vote the money for it).
On some things, office supplies, it’s more like “yeah, reasonable items to do your mission. But not food. Or things inherently personal, like uniforms.” But they can’t get money for running their own organization, say the Gitmo food hall or personnel office, and use it to pay travel expenses for people who aren’t part of their organization.
So it’s a mix. Trust me.
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
4:59 pm
People don’t buy small Chryslers because liberals force companies to comply with environmentally friendy fuel standards?
Then why do people buy fuel efficient Hondas?
Kamchak
May 7th, 2009
5:01 pm
Mike @ 4:36p.m.
“Criticizing Jay’s writing as tedious is not an ad-hominem attack.”
Didn’t say it was. You pull that card out everyday that you post on this site. It’s a passive/aggressive way of crying “boo-hoo you are picking on me ’cause you don’t like me.”
Paul
May 7th, 2009
5:01 pm
Taxpayer
Oh, and trust me on this: there are plenty of people at some high levels in DoD with a lot of years in who don’t have a clue about what I just wrote. That brief I referenced you to? It appears it was prepared for the COMMANDERS – probably full colonels and generals, on just what the rules were on how they could spend ‘their’ money.
Amazing, yes?
I Report :-) / You Whine :-(
May 7th, 2009
5:06 pm
PITTSBURGH (AP) – Authorities in western Pennsylvania have accused seven people who worked for the community group ACORN of falsifying voter-registration forms.
The seven have been charged with either forging, illegally soliciting or illegally filling out voter-registration cards in the lead-up to the 2008 election.
Told ya.
How about we carefully check Minnesota’s voter registration records, now that would be interesting.
eewwwww
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
5:07 pm
Another Republican who says he loves America, but really just hates Americans.
Taxpayer
May 7th, 2009
5:08 pm
As I recall, Waffle House, another fine southern tradition, is one of those employee ownership companies. Wal-Mart pushes their employees to be partners through employee ownership of shares. I think one of the airlines, maybe Delta?, worked out some sort of stock ownership agreement with the pilot’s union while they were in bankruptcy. Speaking of bankruptcy, does anyone really believe that something magically different, other than expediency and a minimization of negative impact on employees, suppliers, creditors, etc., would have happened with Chrysler if the Obama administration had not stepped in and they were left to go through the regular proceedings. Just curious, in the end what would be different. For example, wouldn’t the government have been out just as much revenues as a result of the extra losses in jobs, court costs, etc.
ty webb
May 7th, 2009
5:10 pm
jewcowboy,
your 5:07 was profound, are you in the bumper sticker business?
GOP is gone
May 7th, 2009
5:13 pm
Well Jay, if it is any consolation my very wealthy Republican brother told me last night he was going out to buy a GM car for his wife. My response to him was “your brave”. He then pointed out that Obama had given him a warranty. He was not a fan of Obama, plenty of debate at get togethers.
Billy Bob the anti-THUG
May 7th, 2009
5:14 pm
Rosa Park’s arrest initiated the Montgomery Bus Boycott in December 1955. This act of defiance cast Parks in the forefront of the civil rights movement but could have led to the demise of the Montgomery bus system since 75% of its ridership was black. The kind of activism espoused by George Will is as American as apple pie.
Get on board the train, Jay, it’s leaving the station (in the background are heard chants of Ford, Ford, Ford…).
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
5:16 pm
Ty,
No, I like to regurgitate stale Republican lines by calling peoples patriotism into question if they disagree with my ideas.
But seriously, why would any American want an American company to fail if there is a chance of success? I just don’t get it, unless you just have so much contempt for your fellow country men.
These are the same people who bleet on about flag pins, yet wouldn’t deign to even test drive a domestic car. Just dismissing out of hand as “beneath” them.
Paul
May 7th, 2009
5:18 pm
Report/Whine 5:06
That’s gotta be from the vast right-wing attack machine – something put out to make people fearful. And as far as checking Minnesota ballots, why bother? If you had your ballot considered at one time, it was counted. Considered at another time, not voted. Absentee? Gotta have a candidate prove it should be counted.
I love democracy.
BTW – King Tut exhibit yesterday. They had a very small sarcophagus. Beautiful, decorated gold. It was for the five-month old fetus, preemie, from Tut’s wife. I saw that and thought ‘wow, I wonder what Report/Whine would make of this. 3500 years ago. Miscarriage or preemie and it dies. Yet the Egyptian royalty treated ‘it’ as… a person? With full royal burial rites, ceremonies and honors?”
I went to a spectacular King Tut exhibit and thought of you and Bosch from some of the items.
Man, I gotta get out more and expand my circle of acquaintances….
DebbieDoRight
May 7th, 2009
5:21 pm
People buy fuel efficient Hondas ’cause it’s foreign and it makes them look Cooooolllllll
Also, they get to complain about the “lazy American Worker”, while their jobs get downsized and sent to Japan!! How cool is that?!?!
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
5:28 pm
Debbie,
Meanwhile Mercedes comes in last in initial quality, but they sell like hotcakes.
ty webb
May 7th, 2009
5:29 pm
Jewcowboy,
Oh so it’s payback. How progressive. I didn’t take it the way Jay presented the article. Will, says that he wants Ford to succeed. Is Ford not an American company? Are Ford’s workers not Americans? How is this “hating Americans”?
GOP is gone
May 7th, 2009
5:29 pm
Debbie, Do you honestly think people buy a Honda to be “cool”? I drive a car until it does not run any more because it is paid for and cars do nothing for me, therefor I buy what ever car suits my needs (for a very long time) and get a good consumer report review. It is ALL about a car being reliable to me. I could care less about what someone else thinks about my car.
DebbieDoRight
May 7th, 2009
5:32 pm
Whine: You only reported HALF of the story. For those who don’t scratch below the surface, I have very kindly provided some of the more pertinent tidbits that Mr. Whine left out:
Zappala said no local ACORN supervisors or officials are charged yet, because police need additional evidence. Complicating matters is that some canvassers may have been hired through subcontractors, he said.
Oh and here’s the best part:
There’s no evidence anybody voted illegally or was denied a vote because of the scam, Zappala said.
See, Told ya!!!
http://www.kfsm.com/news/nationworld/sns-ap-us-voter-registration-probe,0,1704514.story
booger
May 7th, 2009
5:32 pm
It would be amazing if they do not florish. With the backing of unlimited taxpayer dollars, and a congress willing to pass laws forcing americans to buy the kind of cars they wish them to drive, how could they fail.
DebbieDoRight
May 7th, 2009
5:34 pm
GOP — I was practicing my sarcasm. However, upon second thought, people in my age group and younger actually DO purchase items because of the cool factor. Sorry.
DebbieDoRight
May 7th, 2009
5:36 pm
and a congress willing to pass laws forcing americans to buy the kind of cars they wish them to drive
How exactly is congress FORCING them?
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
5:37 pm
Gop is gone,
Buick tied with jaguar for. #1 intial quality, both surpassing Lexus.
Let’s see a GM product and a product that benefited by Fords former ownership tied for best quality
But Americans just build cr*p.
Obozo
May 7th, 2009
5:38 pm
As Steve Chaggaris noted in Hotsheet’s morning bulletin today, the news that the cuts totaled $17 billion “landed with a bit of a thud” in the media. Reporters stressed that the cuts made up “a tiny fraction” of the total budget and that they would be hard to push through; USA Today noted that the “proposed cuts are about one-fiftieth the size of this year’s $787 billion economic stimulus package — all of which was added to the deficit.”
In his remarks today, the president sought to change that tenor of that coverage. He mocked the notion that smaller savings are considered “trivial” in Washington and stressed that “these savings, large and small, add up.”
And he told journalists directly that they should stress the fact that the cuts are “significant” – a surprisingly direct appeal to reporters concerning which angle they should take in their coverage.
“It is important, though, for all of you, as you’re writing up these stories, to recognize that $17 billion taken out of our discretionary, non-defense budget, as well as portions of our defense budget, are significant,” he said. “They mean something.”
“Sit up and fetch, Urinal.”
Obama to propose budget reductions- After a line-by-line scrub of the federal budget, President Barack Obama has signed off on a roster of 121 budget cuts to save taxpayers $17 billion, a senior White House official said.
“Good Urinal. Here’s your biscuit.”
“Allah Akbar!”
“Yes I can!”
Brad Steel
May 7th, 2009
5:41 pm
For the past +/-25 years, GM and Chrysler have been making cars that most people do not want to buy. The car industry is not essential to the US economy or national security.
There is no legitimate reason for rescuing these companies. Without radical changes form the past 25 years of their entrenched culture, they will fail and that’s actually good for the overall economy of country.
Let the stupid counties subsidize their industries with tax dollars. Saving business losers is bad policy.
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
5:41 pm
Cafe standards for China are more rigid than for us auto manufactures. People do not avoid American cars because of fuel economy, rather they buy foreign cars for fuel economy.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
5:48 pm
Paul (or anyone else – I just happen to know Paul has grown sons)
Hehehehehe. Sometimes I worry about myself – truly I do.
Is this normal?
Just got off the phone with my oldest son – freshman in college, well, technically just finished his freshman year – literally – took his last exam today.
Called him up, asked him “Hey, what’s up?” His reply, “I’m drunk as hell, what’s up with you?” I said, “well, I’m not drunk” He says, “Well, I am, hahhaha!”
Asked him how his exams went – he said he made the Dean’s List again this semester (two in a row – not bad for a Bosch).
I thought it was funny. So, is that normal?
catlady
May 7th, 2009
5:48 pm
I think I may agree with Mr. Will on this one. Not rooting for GM/Chrysler to fail, but accepting that there would be a great deal learned if they did. It might prevent some bad behavior down the road (heh heh heh).
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
5:50 pm
Brad,
I guess ghostly paper profits are better than actually producing something?
I would think that idea might be one of the reasons we are in the mess we are now.
What is your basis that auto manufacturing is not needed for national security? Do you remember WWII? Not only did auto manufacturers produce road vehicles, but were also retooled to produce tanks, planes, munitions, parts, etc.
I would say that was essential, unless you think that sovereignty is not essential.
Joey
May 7th, 2009
5:51 pm
Well one thing is sure, Jay is highly qualified to recognize a cynical and smug commentator. Jay, the UAW and the Obama Team are just pissed at Ford because Ford avoided that very clever Nationalization trap.
Is there a limit as to how much money is to much to “invest” in assuring that neither GM or Chrysler fail?
Taxpayer
May 7th, 2009
5:53 pm
How quickly Andy conveniently, perhaps, forgets the yapping from his fellow fringe right wingers about the significance of, what was it, about one percent of that stimulus package. Now, exactly how much was that huge amount that they complained about.
I Report :-) / You Whine :-(
May 7th, 2009
5:55 pm
For the past +/-25 years, GM and Chrysler have been making cars that most people do not want to buy.
B Weal- Perhaps you could pull your thumb out of your mouth and tell all of us how GM sold more cars than any other company if “no one wants to buy them.”
bozo
Redneck Convert
May 7th, 2009
5:56 pm
Well, I saw a poll that said us Southreners were the least patriotic Americans because lots of us wanted to break off from the U.S. of A. Last I checked, this George Will ain’t a Southrener. So it’s not just us that want the U.S. of A. to fail. Have a good night everybody. I stocked plenty of beer for you.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
6:00 pm
Thanks Redneck! Your services are invaluable.
N-GA
May 7th, 2009
6:02 pm
Not so long ago I read a web article about 8 (I think) vehicles that you can expect to easily go 250,000 miles without any major repairs. I looked in my driveway and noted that both of my vehicles were in that group….none of the vehicles were USA brands. One has 135,000 miles and the other has 240,000 miles.
That said, I don’t think George Will is really hoping that any American auto companies fail. He seems to support free-market capitalism. If things play out as I suspect they will, Chrysler will fail (not as a company….but as a brand) just like it should have years ago when the government last bailed them out. Assembly plants will close and there really will not be much left. Fiat will get rid of non-profitable models and retain those that make money (certain Jeep models?). GM will become a smaller, but smarter company.
And bankruptcy is not always the first stop to non-existence. Look at Delta…although I’m still pi$$ed that they paid over $100 million in “retention” bonuses to executives and claiming that was the only way to keep the talent. Then all but one of those executives jumped ship within 14 months!
Paul
May 7th, 2009
6:03 pm
Bosch
No, it’s not normal. And you can thank your lucky stars.
Most sons wouldn’t tell their dad anything like that at that age. They’d either hide it, or be ashamed, or do anything but engage. So I think that’s really great.
And making the dean’s list and how to study as a freshman? Heck no, entirely abnormal.
But getting blitzed after taking the last exam and celebrating.
Entirely too normal.
Nope, you should thank your luck stars.
And be proud.
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
6:05 pm
Ty,
I never said I couldn’t be petty. I just try to keep it to a minimum.
Ford is an American, but why would we want to diminish our manufacturing base even further if there is a chance of success?
Most of the thought of let them die, stems from the late 70 to the 90’s when US auto manufacturers showed so much contempt for the consumer. It seems consumers are still hell bent on punishing them even thought they are showing more promise in the product they are turning out than at any time since the 60’s.
getalife
May 7th, 2009
6:07 pm
“Hendrik Hertzberg flags a Georgia state Senate resolution, which I also missed, that appears aimed at opening the door for secession.”
Pathetic.
Just leave.
jon
May 7th, 2009
6:07 pm
You will buy the car the car the government makes for you. No more SUVs, no more big luxury cars, no more pickup trucks. And you will like it!
The government controlled companies will crush Ford out of existence to assure that they are successful because they have the power of the gun.
Paul
May 7th, 2009
6:12 pm
Hey, N-GA
Good to hear someone understands the concept of a depreciating asset!
Fiat’s making some big moves… gobble, gobble!
jon
[[No more SUVs, no more big luxury cars, no more pickup trucks.]]
Oh, I’m not so sure. Just not with the same power plants and technology we now have. My neighbor has a flexfuel Tahoe – decent around-town mileage. Hybrid technology will be adapted.
But given no new technologies, if that’s the price (no move 2.5 ton, 14 mpg commuter vehicles) we have to pay to offset middle east imports and cut out our presence there, then I’m for it.
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
6:12 pm
Paul,
Yeah, I was being sarcastic (shocking I know – ty, see I can be sarcastic, just not all the time). I am proud of him.
I used to get blitzed and THEN go take my exams – not always the best plan, so the boy has learned a thing or two!!!
N-GA
May 7th, 2009
6:13 pm
Hello Paul,
So there is a King Tut exhibit in Dallas. There is a small exhibit here at Emory with some Tut artifacts exhibited with artifacts from many other pharoahs. I intend to go sometime soon.
I did go to the Atlanta Car Show a few weeks ago. IMO, Ford definitely had better designs than Chevrolet (or Chrysler). Chevy’s new Camaro was awful!
We’re opening a 2007 Domaine Guy Mousset Rose tonight to go with Thai (I know….drink beer with Thai!). Lemongrass & Ginger Chicken…..
I Report :-) / You Whine :-(
May 7th, 2009
6:15 pm
I know what the liberals are all excited about, Fiat sells cars that look like something a homo couple would buy.
eewwww
Bosch
May 7th, 2009
6:15 pm
I love my Toyota truck – 150,000 miles on the old girl give or take. Runs like a kitten. I had a Dodge once – worst piece of crap junk I’ve ever bought. Sold it to my neighbor for a buck just to get the trash off my lawn.
N-GA
May 7th, 2009
6:16 pm
Paul,
Wells Fargo is issuing some new common stock Friday priced below market. Probably a good opportunity, me thinks!
N-GA
May 7th, 2009
6:17 pm
I can’t believe that there are homophobes posting on this blog!
Scooter
May 7th, 2009
6:20 pm
Bosch,
I for one think it is normal. I think it is great that you have such a good relationship with him and he did’nt lie to you!
SuperDave
May 7th, 2009
6:20 pm
I worked for Ford for over 11 years mostly during the 90’s. I recall about 13 years ago sitting in a meeting with one of the vice presidents who made the following statement in answer to a question, “We make all our money on full size trucks and SUV’s. We are not competitive in the car market, especially in small cars. If gas ever goes over $2.00 a gallon, we are going to be in serious trouble.”
I never forgot that. It was about 1996. Today I wonder how they could know back then, and not do anything about it. It really is a failure of management. Everyone wants to blame the UAW, but when the plants ran at full capacity, they made boatloads of money, even with the union contracts.
Paul
May 7th, 2009
6:24 pm
N-GA
It’s quite the exhibit at the Dallas Museum of Art. Spectatular, in fact. Limited sites, quite an opportunity.
LOL, I was closing up the other night, thinking of dinner and wondering “what would N-GA have…” But I’m for the Rose with Thai. Definitely.
I’ve a number of accounts with Wells Fargo… I understand they’ve weathered this storm pretty well… I’ll have to check it out, thanks.
Ford’s Fusion sales numbers are great, their hybrid’s getting acclaim and I heard they’re coming out soon with an all-electric Focus.
Homophobes on the blog? I dunno… some of ‘em sure have a crusade against pasteurizing, but didn’t know people got up in arms about homogenizing!
Bosch
You have an easy 50-100k left in the truck -
Taxpayer
May 7th, 2009
6:25 pm
Yes, Andie, Fiat engineers design their cars around the features of the average homo sapien. We know how much trouble that presents you with — given your longer arms, etc. Buy a GM or two or three….
N-GA
May 7th, 2009
6:29 pm
Jay….BTW, this opinion piece you penned is WAYYYYYYYYYY off base. I have issues with a lot of what George Will says, but I think you are being disingenuous by suggesting he is ROOTING for our American Automobile manufacturers to fail. Perhaps you thought you were writing for the National Inquirer?
N-GA
May 7th, 2009
6:32 pm
Taxpayer….knuckle-draggers need a Hummer to keep themselves from scraping the pavement!
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
6:35 pm
I report/you whine,
Nice derogatory comment. I normally do not like call people names, but you are truly a piece of trash.
TnGelding
May 7th, 2009
6:36 pm
The conservative mind works in mysterious ways. Sounds like the self-described small businessmen that were hanging out here that closed down rather than pay the “massive” tax increases.
GM, Ford and Chrysler should have merged years ago. Combining the best features of each and hiring Consumer Reports as a consultant could have produced superior vehicles. Antitrust laws could have been waived.
I’m afraid the Obama administration is wrong about what consumer’s want, tho. They want the big, gas-guzzling SUVs. but can’t afford them.
I Report :-) / You Whine :-(
May 7th, 2009
6:37 pm
Actually, it’s an Escalade.
I don’t f around.
I eat Fiats.
Next question?
TnGelding
May 7th, 2009
6:39 pm
Money well spent?
http://www.reuters.com/article/pressReleasesMolt/idUSTRE5464DP20090507
Taxpayer
May 7th, 2009
6:40 pm
There’s clearly only one solution. We need to clean up this Industrial mess. It’s diseased.
Kamchak
May 7th, 2009
6:44 pm
jewcowboy
Welcome back. How was the trip?
There really is no excuse for Andy, but he hates all people indiscriminately. It is hard for one to love others when one can’t love himself.
jewcowboy
May 7th, 2009
6:49 pm
TnGelding,
You are right about many Americans wanting their large cars and not being able to afford them.
What cracks me up is their very short memory. Gas may be cheaper now, but it will not last. Its simple supply and demand. If the economy hadn’t tanked we would be looking at $5 a gallon gas. But its relatively cheap now so let’s by the escalade!
Susan Myers
May 7th, 2009
6:49 pm
md @ 3:44,
As a matter of fact, yes, I have belonged to a union, and I loved it. Many members of my family have belonged and still belong, and they wouldn’t have it any other way.
FYI – I don’t care how many companies the article mentioned. I’m talking about the big 3.
Paul
May 7th, 2009
6:54 pm
jewcowboy
I live near a large Cadillac-Saab dealer. Was talking to one of the salesmen, said not too long ago over half the Caddy sales were Escalades and most of them were leased.
GM took a bath with residuals and pretty much dropped leasing. Or upped the rates. So people come in for a new lease and it isn’t available or they don’t qualify. Their payments go up about 80 percent to finance vs lease. The people are dumbstruck – “but I’ve always driven a Cadillac or Escalade.”
BTW – they are a great ride. But not as many people who leased’em can afford to buy’em.
Oh, and when gas was four bucks a gallon, a lot of those vehicles got parked. So gas prices do affect demand.