Things have changed a bit for Madoff….
He’s in prison, and he should never see another day as a free man. But this does seem a bit much…
“On 10 South, the 70-year-old Madoff is treated more like a lab rat than a vaunted Wall Street financier once entrusted with billions of investment dollars.
The lights burn 24 hours a day, and an inmate’s every move is caught on video. Madoff gets just 60 minutes a day outside his 8-by-8-foot cell – in wrist shackles.
Windows are blacked out so disoriented inmates can’t catch even a glimpse of the world outside.
What passes for food is slipped through a narrow slit in a stainless steel door that fronts a spartan cell – cold in winter, scorching hot in summer.
No interaction is permitted between inmates or guards. Only a ranking officer is allowed to remove a prisoner from his tiny cell.
Lawyer visits are few and far between. Reading material is almost nonexistent.
The squalid conditions are enough to make blood-stained tough guys cry – never mind a pampered ex-billionaire.
Bonanno crime family capo Vincent (Vinny Gorgeous) Basciano was moved off 10 South in 2005 after his lawyer complained of “subhuman” conditions.
Junior Gotti said his hard time in the MCC’s most infamous section was brutal.
“I was in 10 South, and it almost broke me,” Gotti famously roared.
Imagine its impact on a first-time offender used to a $7 million East Side penthouse with a bedroom drawer filled with cuff links and a $39,000 Steinway piano in the living room.
“I had a guy in there who went bonkers,” said one veteran defense lawyer. “They had to take him out of there and give him sedatives.”
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174 comments Add your comment
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
10:01 am
Nope. You do the crime you do the time.
In many ways, his living conditions are not as harsh as our infantry soldiers in Iraq or Afghanistan and even some of our sailors on ships at sea.
Part of punishment (in my opinion) should be deterrence to others …. and believe me many just like him are shaking in their boots.
jt
March 21st, 2009
10:03 am
meanwhile, the world’s most deadliest spider found in a
Whole Foods. I once heard a mexican-barking-spider in a asiaworld mart on buford highway one time.
i swear.
ByteMe
March 21st, 2009
10:08 am
Now you say you’re lonely
You cry the whole night through
Well, you can cry me a river
Cry me a river
I cried a river over you
Now you say you’re sorry
For being so untrue
Well, you can cry me a river
Cry me a river
I cried a river over you
Taxpayer
March 21st, 2009
10:11 am
Maybe someone wants to send him a message. I’d say that looks like an effective way to do it and best of all — it’s not torture.
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
10:19 am
Taxpayer:
Hopefully, they are not “waterboarding” him to find out his who his cohorts were ……….
He pled guilty ONLY to protect a lot of people. He’s NOT cooperating. He made his own bed.
By the way, continuing from yesterday:
I assume from your “handle” that you may be an accountant. Let’s say we are debating the World Court, our military serving under U.N. command, a “world currency”, the metric system, etc, etc. I then discover that in 2015 the U.S. is adopting the “international accounting method” (supposedly true). Now, as a conservative I am already not happy with all of the “world” stuff and now this. However, if I know you are an accountant, I will add more weight to your viewpoint even if I later disagree. Just common sense. I may learn something.
Another one. Let’s say PETA has the Georgia Legislature on the run over “fishing” (I know it sounds far fetched but give it a few years). The legislature is getting ready to pass a bill outlawing hooks because fish feel pain (similar to unborn babies being aborted – but that’s another story and I digress). Anyway, this time you are a “biologist”. I will give your opinion more weight since you have experience in that area.
Now, what’s wrong with that?
Taxpayer
March 21st, 2009
10:26 am
Corporal,
I do handle the household finances, I had numerous courses in college on economics, and I had a budget while I was employed at a major US corporation but I am not an accountant nor have I ever been. Now, don’t you just love the suspense and intrigue. By the way, you might actually present something credible if you started with a hypothesis and developed a rational argument for or against your stated position with supporting documentation. Then again, it also helps to have a worthwhile hypothesis and argument – something other than “The president is not qualified because I have not seen his original birth certificate.” But, you feel free to pursue those thoughts to your heart’s desire. After all, I’m sure it gives you something to do.
Richard F
March 21st, 2009
10:27 am
Does the author of this article think we should feel sorry for the man who destroyed thousands of lives? There is no punishment too severe for this poor excuse of a person. Since he knew this day would come, don’t ya think that maybe he would have ended it sooner, or did he just enjoy it so much that he thought his “deal with the devil” would never have to be repaid? As I said on CNN, “I wish Bernard Madoff a very long life.”
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
10:31 am
Taxpayer:
Now see, I try to be nice this morning and put out an olive branch and what do you do? You have hurt my feelings and ruined my day. Oh, woe is me. Yawn.
By the way, your “real world” experience level does astound me. I will pay more attention to your wisdom in the future.
To All:
WOW!
HEADLINE: “First Tourists Visit Iraq Since War Began in 2003 …”
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,510005,00.html
But you know … the truly sad thing is that they are safer there than in many of our cities ?
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
10:34 am
To Richard F:
Very good points.
Think about this. Many states have laws now that if someone dies during your commission of a felony (i.e., you rob a bank with a water pistol and someone has a heart attack because they think it’s real) you can be charged with murder and get the death penalty.
Well, I wonder if anyone died (i.e., heart attack) after learning their entire life savings was gone?
Hummmmm …………….
lwwmm7
March 21st, 2009
10:45 am
Free Bernie! It was Bush’s fault, throw him in the cell.
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
10:45 am
Corporal, my boxer (don’t you just love it), has been a very good Marine this week so we are off to the park. I ‘ll check in when I get back.
Hopefully, the Israeli Air Force will not take out the Iranian nuclear sites while I am gone. If they do, text me right away ………..
Taxpayer
March 21st, 2009
10:49 am
Corporal,
I was simply providing a little critique interspersed with an opinion regarding the birth certificate. I too receive many snide comments from different bloggers and I let the bulk of them slide right on by. Sometimes, I rail against a particular blogger but usually I just rail against the Republican Party as a whole because I have a lot of concern over the negative impacts of so many Republican philosophies and policies. Further, there are plenty of others that handle the Democrats. So, maybe overall, this site is pretty fair and balanced for the bulk of the population. And, we don’t even have to shoot one another to get our points across.
Hillbilly Deluxe
March 21st, 2009
11:04 am
He made his choices; now he gets to live with them. Ain’t that just too damn bad.
Redneck Convert
March 21st, 2009
11:10 am
Well, I spent a couple days in the Roswell jail a couple years ago. You all probly recall I give this geek that was crowding my lane at the bowling alley a little push. Let me tell you, jail is no fun. Specially if you are a god-fearing Christian like me. You don’t get much to eat and they even make you clean the place up. And they turn off the lights and make you stay in the dark at night.
Anyhow, this Madoff done Madoff with about $50 billion of peoples money and deserves what he gets. If he was smart he would of been a AIG honcho and got a bonus and a bailout too. You can cure bad acts but you can’t cure stupid.
I wonder how Bookman is handling Hard Labor Creek. Me and Jim Earl and Joe Bill played it a few years ago. It was pretty bare bones. They had a driving range but no range balls. The fairways looked about like my yard in front of the trailer. The raised greens were tough. We were lucky we were playing gimmes from putter length and used Joe Bill’s long putter to do the measuring. Anything inside 5 feet was good. The good news is they wasn’t using our tax money to do much for the course. That’s the way it should be. Cut taxes and lay off teachers and state workers and such. Starve guvmint till it says uncle. That’s the Conservative way of doing things.
Have a good weekend everybody.
I Report/ You Whine
March 21st, 2009
11:44 am
Meanwhile, the libs turn al Qaeda cut throats loose in American cities.
RW-(the original)
March 21st, 2009
11:59 am
At least Madoff’s victims share some of the blame since they chose to invest in a too good to be true scheme. When can we send Congress and PresBO to 10 South for stealing 50 times more from us than Madoff ever took his investors for?
Dave R
March 21st, 2009
12:06 pm
Corp, you’re not going to get anything intelligent out of Mr. “Three Degrees” (taxpayer).
He never answers direct questions posed to him. He never backs up his “opinions” with pertinent facts. He specializes in the liberal tactic of changing the argument when he doesn’t have the facts to back up his “opinions”.
To your 10:34 post: I’d say this is probably a good overall thought for future criminal behavior, but in Madoff’s instance, he’ll never see the light of day again as it is. I don’t believe that NY has the death penalty any longer, so a harsher punishment wouldn’t matter.
Does anyone else see the irony in Jay Bookman playing a golf course named “Hard Labor” Creek?
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
12:19 pm
CAN YOU BELIEVE THIS ?? !!
HEADLINE: “Steelers to Loose Three Super Bowl Trophies …”
Pittsburgh, PA. The Super Bowl XLIII Champion Pittsburgh Steelers, the only team to win six titles, will soon be loosing half of those trophies. After a meeting between NFL Commissioner Rodger Gadel and President Barack “Did I say that” Obama, Obama decided to redistribute half of their Steeler Super Bowl victories and trophies to less fortunate teams in the league including the Detroit Lions (0-16).
superbowlchange09.pdf (347KB)
Sad, sad, sad ……………..
RW-(the original)
March 21st, 2009
12:22 pm
Dave R,
Don’t let the name of the course fool you. It’s a state park so Jay B gets to play on a course where his greens fees are subsidized by our tax dollars.
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
12:36 pm
To Dave R:
I know, but I like “messin” with him.
I have no sympathy for Madoff. He’ll love that lukewarm, tasteless prison food. I hope he is soon joined by his family (including his wife – separate cells of course) and his cohorts in crime including his auditor.
The REAL GodHatesTrash, Superstar
March 21st, 2009
12:42 pm
Part of Bernie pleading guilty was probably the thought that he would get lifetime imprisonment in some cushy minimum security prison and his family could squirrel away his fortune.
This kind of confinement is not white-collar criminals expect, and just might lead him to be way more forthcoming about where he and his lovely family are hiding their booty. Or it might not, then the taxpayers will be spared paying for a long incarceration when he offs himself.
A win/win.
RW-(the original)
March 21st, 2009
12:42 pm
Just a thought as I’m heading out into this beautiful spring day, but since Congress is passing retroactive laws to claw back bonus money when do they get our Fannie/Freddie money back from Franklin Raines, Jamie Gorelick and so forth. Why no outrage over those bonuses?
Paul
March 21st, 2009
12:43 pm
I agree, it’s a bit much. 24 hour a day lights while under video surveillance in a solitary cell with the windows blacked out? This goes past even justification for protection from other prisoners.
Still, it’s not as harsh as one of the Supermax prisons. Those’ll really drive you insane.
Gotta say it, gotta say it… and I’d love to hear a justification for it – if Madoff were an AQ prisoner he’d have better treatment. The 24-hour a day lighting is a problem. Isolation from other prisoners is another. Yet Americans, with full Constitutional protections, are subject to harsher conditions.
Any takers?
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
12:43 pm
SERIOUS WAKE-UP CALL:
Well, well ….
HEADLINE: “Obama will call for increased oversight of ‘executive pay at all banks, Wall Street firms and possibly other companies’ as part of sweeping plan to ‘overhaul financial regulation’, NY TIMES reporting Sunday …”
We all knew it was just a matter of time didn’t we? His true colors are starting to show now and it’s much worse than mere “socialism”. I have asked many of you liberals (and no one ever replies), have you read “Dreams of My Father”? I am CONVINCED that if every American had read that book, Obama would not have come close to being elected. It’s a scary book ……… and now he’s in the White House.
By the way, some of my personal liberal friends are starting to admit they made a very serious mistake …………
Stay tuned ……..
Dave R
March 21st, 2009
12:45 pm
I do find it ironic that instead of punishing all the folks associated with the AIG failure (corporate AND investor alike) the libs on this site would rather bail them out of their mess with tax dollars we don’t have.
But punishment is OK if you’re a bag, bad, mean, Madoff, but punishment isn’t OK if you do something stupid and did so knowingly.
The typical liberal double-standard we’re used to.
And Corp, if I haven’t done so in the past, thanks for your service. I did my four-years in Air Force blue a few decades ago. Nothing near as tough as what you did, though.
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
12:45 pm
Paul:
Sure. Send him to Gitmo and put him in with AQ.
The REAL GodHatesTrash, Superstar: For once you are right.
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
12:47 pm
To Dave R:
Maybe so, but you guys saved my behind (much to the chagrin of my liberal friends on these threads) with a couple of well placed “close air support” strikes over 40 years ago.
Ooo Rah!
Dave R
March 21st, 2009
12:57 pm
RW, I just find it ironic that a “journalist” like Bookman would have anything to do with something called “Hard Labor”. I’m guessing that hard labor is as foreign to him as logic is to liberals.
Dave R
March 21st, 2009
12:59 pm
Glad we could help, and glad you’re still around to enjoy the sweet life of liberty, Corp.
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
1:01 pm
CAN YOU BELIEVE THIS GUY?
HEADLINE: Obama weighs in on ACC upsets
Posted: 12:49 PM ET
(CNN) – President Obama turned commentator-in-chief Saturday as he addressed the performance of basketball teams from the Atlantic Coast Conference.
As he and first lady Michelle Obama were leaving the White House for Camp David, a reporter shouted out, ““Is the ACC overrated?”
“Apparently so,” Obama replied with a grin.
Wow! Does he not have something better to do ….. like being President or something? Oh no, what am I saying …. this is probably better. Don’t miss a game Mr. President ….. we’re safer for it!!
P.S. I think he just lost a lot of support from ACC Democrats ….
)
Civilian/Private/Corporal
March 21st, 2009
1:03 pm
Dave R:
Save this and use it sometime:
“For those who fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know.” Author Unknown
Dave R
March 21st, 2009
1:05 pm
Excellent!
RW-(the original)
March 21st, 2009
1:05 pm
Dave R,
Bookman probably thinks golf IS hard labor. The way he talks about how bad his scores are maybe it is, but as short a course as HLC is it shouldn’t hurt him too bad.
Dave R
March 21st, 2009
1:10 pm
RW, not that I’d ever agree with Jay (OK – almost never), but sometimes my golf game reminds me of hard labor. There are days when the driver feels like a 10 lb sledgehammer (and is used in a similar fashion) and the golf ball seems like a rock or two.
Maybe I’ll hit the driving range this afternoon . . .:)
College Professor
March 21st, 2009
2:07 pm
Jay, please tell us why you believe so ardently that any punishment of any criminal is automatically cruel and unusual punishment.
Jay
March 21st, 2009
2:32 pm
I find it hard to believe that a college professor would ask such a strange, foolish, even downright silly question. Nothing I have ever said, written or even thought would begin to justify such an assessment of my position.
I argued months ago that Madoff should have been in prison rather than sit in his penthouse, because he had forfeited his right to freedom by trying to ship assets to friends and family. I said in the very post you cite that he ought to never see another day of freedom.
On the other hand, the prison conditions described above were designed to handle inmates who pose a security or escape threat or a threat to the safety of prison personnel. The 70-year-old Madoff meets none of those conditions. He is getting an extra-legal, extra-constitutional punishment, well beyond that mandated by the courts and American law and driven largely by the publicity his case has gotten. In the long term, authority does not engender respect for the law by going beyond the law.
The Corporal
March 21st, 2009
2:39 pm
1) HEADLINE: “Iran’s Rebuff to Obama Provides Eye Into Theocracy’s Mind-Set …”
Dear President Obama: This is a “religious war”. Take note …
2) HEADLINE: “Bailout for the Bailout? Geithner May Tap Fed, FDIC …”
How much longer can this insanity go on? This tax cheat needs to go …”
3) HEADLINE: “Alaska, Fla. consider bans on bestiality …”
And pray tell why? It may be genetic …”
The Corporal
March 21st, 2009
2:42 pm
Jay:
What do you think about the way old Sheriff Arpaio does things down there in Maricopa County, Arizona? Is living in tents, wearing stripes and sandwiches for lunch unconstitutional ?
Like his sign says, “If you don’t like it here – don’t come back”!
Jay
March 21st, 2009
2:56 pm
I don’t know, corporal. My first question would be, does it work? Does it reduce recidivism? Do those incarcerated there commit more or less crime after their release than criminals held under different circumstances?
If it doesn’t work, then all it’s doing is making Arpaio more popular with certain folks.
I’d also note that Arpaio has an extensive history of abusing his power in violation of the law, and that the county has been forced to pay more than $40 million in settlements to inmates and to families of inmates who were killed under Arpaio’s jurisdiction.
Quite the law-abider, that Arpaio.
The Corporal
March 21st, 2009
2:58 pm
Jay:
Let me tell you what is going on here with Madoff ………
By the time I retired from my agency we rarely got anything from an arrest interview. The perpetrator would just lawyer up and say “take me to Federal custody a**hole, I’m hungry”.
When I first started in the 1970’s, we would bring an “arrestee” into the office and if they were uncooperative (which was their right of course) we would finally say, “Fine. If you don’t want this to go federal, we’ll just call Detective “so and so” at APD, turn this over to him for state charges, and you can spend a few days in the Atlanta City Jail.
They would usually start crying and then begin by handing up their mother ………………
Oh, for the good old days ……………..
Bottom line: They’re just trying to get Madoff to “roll”. Unless he can get a “hot shot” attorney and a wimpy judge to get him out of there it will be just a matter of time.
Don’t forget …. an arrest/incarceration is a great “investigative tool”.
The Corporal
March 21st, 2009
3:00 pm
Jay:
You know as well as I do that states, counties, cities and even the feds often “settle” with someone rather than fight the more expensive court/litigation costs. It’s wrong but it’s cheaper under our runaway system. I’ve seen it happen many times. Makes me sick.
Jay
March 21st, 2009
3:09 pm
$40 million is a lot of “court/litigation” costs, corporal.
Curious Observer
March 21st, 2009
3:19 pm
It makes me sick to see anyone celebrate the abuse of anyone in custody. You’re not part of any Marine Corps I knew, corporal. You’re just a g_d_n coward, a gutless one at that. I’m ashamed that the Corps apparently lowered its standards to let you in.
Dave R
March 21st, 2009
3:29 pm
Curious Observer, please define “celebrating abuse”.
getalife
March 21st, 2009
3:34 pm
Good thing he did not do this in China but the establishment were upset with one of their own.
Set another example for exposing their fraud.
Funny how both billion fraudsters failed to cooperate .
I guess they are lucky to be alive because if they cooperated the establishment would fall.
I think they should fall.
Taxpayer
March 21st, 2009
3:43 pm
Well, I’m all for Corporal punishment. After all, just look at some those posts that he has subjected us to. Turn about is fair play. And the same goes for Madoff. Leave him there until he spills everything about where that money went. Put videos of him on the Internet and e-mail the web site to all his victims and family members. Play I Love Lucy re-runs and Liberace songs 24/7. He’ll snap like a twig.
The Corporal
March 21st, 2009
3:44 pm
To Jay:
Of course it is thanks to the likes of the ACLU, etc. You can wind up settling for $10M on just one case. I know personally of a case in a county near here where they settled for about $10M because the police had just “started” to chase someone when the perp. killed another driver.
He’s been Sheriff there since 1992 ! Re-elected three times I think.
On a personal note: I am so THANKFUL my former agency has chosen to FIGHT on a particular lawsuit (it’s been in your paper many times) instead of caving in (that may change with the new administration). All they want to do is get it into court in front of an impartial jury but of course the other side doesn’t want that …….
To Dave R:
Thank you. Let’s see how he defines it ….. non gourmet food? hard bed? small space? no color t.v.? no conjugal visits with the “trophy” wife? Boo hoo hoo !
The Corporal
March 21st, 2009
3:47 pm
Taxpayer:
Good pun ! No, play Slim Whitman and Boxcar Willie records non-stop.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4a28EBGEkCs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYaLVs-gHVI&feature=related
The Amazing GodHatesTrash
March 21st, 2009
4:06 pm
Bookman, I disagree. There are a lot of burglars, car thieves, forgers, bad-check writers, etc. incarcerated in maximum security prisons who have never threatened anyone, and are no more threat to escape than Madoff. If it is “justice” to put anyone in the rat-holes we call prisons in the United States, it is especially just to put someone like Madoff, who went to prison to protect his personal fortune, in one of these rat-holes.
White-collar crime is crime, white-collar thievery is thievery. The magnitude of Madoff’s crimes do make a difference – he’s convicted of stealing $50B. And I applaud the judge for putting Madoff somewhere where he’ll be more likely to cooperate with the ongoing search for his and his family’s ill-gotten gains.
People commit white-collar crimes because 1) they are poorly enforced, and 2) the punishment is often a slap on the wrist. I had a great-uncle-in-law who served 18 months in a minimum security prison in CT for tax evasion – he owned several dry-cleaning establishments in the metro NY area, back in the 50s and 60s these were cash businesses, and he consistently under-reported his income for over a decade.
He got caught, as he said, “finally.” He paid a $25,000 fine, and went to prison. They let him out for a sister’s funeral, and for an operation on my great-aunt. He bragged that he had saved over $1M in taxes, “not bad for eighteen months in a minimum security facility.”
Madoff, figuring the jig was up, plead guilty to protect his family fortune, he “took one for the (Madoff) team”. I’m sure he thought that minimum security was where he would end up. As a psychopath, he probably figured this was one more time he was proving that he was so smart that he could hoodwink everyone, especially when the judge allowed him house arrest before his plea. He figured the judge was a softie. Surprise, surprise, Bernie. I hope he’s rethinking his strategery.
Besides, with the amount of money at his family’s disposal, guards and wardens can be bought off, so Bernie is much more an escape risk than your average Joe the Prisoner. People don’t walk out of maximum security prisons no matter who they pay off. So, keep him in, isolated, and the cuffs on.
The Corporal
March 21st, 2009
4:14 pm
The Amazing GodHatesTrash:
Excellent expose’ !!