Ga. legislators take ownership of nuke plants

You know who’s going to own those nuclear reactors that Georgia Power and other utilities want to build near Augusta?

In a legal sense, the utilities would own them. But in a political sense, state Sen. Don Balfour would own a good piece of them too, at least if Senate Bill 31 becomes law.

Written at the behest of Georgia Power, SB 31 would strip authority from the Public Service Commission, the body created to regulate utilities and make highly technical decisions about how to finance complex multibillion-dollar projects such as nuclear plants. Balfour, the sponsor of the bill, apparently believes that the interests of Georgia would be best served if such technical decisions are made by Waffle House executives, insurance salesmen, retired farmers and others serving in the state Legislature. Such people do have wisdom, of course. It just doesn’t generally extend to the intricacies of utility regulation.

The bill would also require Georgia Power customers to start paying interest and profits to Georgia Power shareholders long before the plants are built, and long before they produce a single kilowatt of electricity. And the bill curtails the ability of the PSC to protect Georgia Power customers in case the cost of the plants should increase substantially beyond current estimates.

By supporting passage of SB 31, Lt. Gov. Casey Cagle and a majority of the state Senate have already joined Balfour in taking political ownership of those plants.

If Georgia Power’s costs —- now estimated at $6.4 billion —- do soar beyond expectations, jacking up electricity rates for Georgia families, Balfour, Cagle and others will get and deserve a good chunk of the blame.

Of course, Georgia Power has reassured legislators and the public that the huge cost overruns of the ’70s will not recur. Yes, they admit, a new nuclear plant being built in Finland is already 50 percent over budget and three years behind schedule, suggesting things haven’t changed much at all.

But they nonetheless argue that the risk of runaway costs is minimal thanks to changes in nuclear technology and regulation.

Yet when asked whether the company is willing to share in that supposedly minimal risk, even in return for potentially higher profit, the answer is a stern “no.” Georgia Power has said it will walk away from the project altogether if its shareholders are required to share in any of the risk of cost overruns.

That should raise a question among members of the House of Representatives, who vote next on SB 31. If they pass it, they too take political ownership of the plants, including the risk of substantial cost overruns. If things go wrong, the voters back home will want to know why they supported a bill that gave Georgia Power all the advantages, and their customers all the risk.

House members ought to ask themselves something else as well. The staff of the PSC has put out a technical assessment of SB 31 and its impact. Among other things, it warns —- stick with me here —- that “even if the Company has overearned on its revenue requirement, the Commission could not use those over-earnings to offset any under-recovery of the finance costs and would still have to allow ratepayers to be charged the full true-up amount.”

Did you follow that?

State legislators ought to read every word of that analysis before voting. If they comprehend it and still believe the bill is a good idea, they can vote with confidence that they are qualified to decide such matters.

However, if talk of overearnings being applied to under-recovery is outside their comfort zone, legislators ought to question the wisdom of substituting their judgment for that of the professionals and full-timers at the PSC. In the immortal words of Dirty Harry Callahan, “A man’s got to know his limitations.”

101 comments Add your comment

AJC/DNC Management

February 26th, 2009
7:01 am

If Georgia Power’s costs —- now estimated at $6.4 billion —- do soar beyond expectations, jacking up electricity rates for Georgia families, Balfour, Cagle and others will get and deserve a good chunk of the blame.

Gee, I wonder what “cap and trade” will cost those Georgia families that you “love” so much.

AJC/DNC Management

February 26th, 2009
7:12 am

Man, I miss the old whiny Gloom and Doom Urinal, they used to moan about the Bush boom times but now all they have is unbridled optimism about the distant future-

2011 turnaround seen for Georgia

Yay, an economic turnaround in 2011, hooooray, uh, wait a minute, that’s two freaking years away.

What happened to hopeandchange?

GSU expert: Expect double-digit unemployment rate

I guess that was all just meaningless promises, as usual.

G

February 26th, 2009
7:38 am

Nuclear power is simply too expensive.

Wind, wave, solar power, electric cars, and geothermal heat pumps will do the job at a price we can afford and reverse global climate change.

And at the same time revive the DOA United States manufacturing sector.

Bud Wiser

February 26th, 2009
7:39 am

Taking their cue from Obama’s socialism stamp that he is putting on the banking, trading, and mortgage institutions, systematically absorbing each and every free enterprise system in this nation, in order to make us a ‘more perfect soviet socialist republic’, I suppose.

And it aint comin’ cheap. either: WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama is sending Congress a budget Thursday that projects the government’s deficit for this year will soar to $1.75 trillion, reflecting efforts to pull the nation out of a deep recession and a severe financial crisis.

A senior administration official told The Associated Press that Obama’s $3 trillion-plus spending blueprint also asks Congress to raise taxes on the wealthy in 2011 and cut Medicare costs to provide health care for the uninsured.

So it also becomes time for the old folks, the ones who worked and paid taxes, paid into Medicare, their whole lives, to die, so that the young, the new, the ‘octamoms’ and her illegal pals who come to America for the freedom of registering as Democrats, to reap the socialistic rewards from a system to which they never have contributed, only taken.

Yes, this is truly the change we can count on for dam sure; its back to the days of slavery, only I have read considerably about Abraham Lincoln (who initially opposed freeing the slaves actually, but for argumentative and entertainment purposes, plus the fact that all the moonbats believe he was Messiah I), and Hussein Obama is no Abe Lincoln.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
8:04 am

Waffle House executives, insurance salesmen, retired farmers and others serving in the state Legislature. Such people do have wisdom, of course.

Cite, please.

Oh, and Jay–could you add “Urinal” to the Official List of Words What Gets Your Post Eated?

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
8:07 am

Well, Jay, some of these elected ones [insert Republican name here] may not have a clue what they’re voting for or against but that little detail has not stopped them in the past. Besides, they probably figure that their faith and their family values will fill any voids in their knowledge base and see them through regardless of the decisions they make on behalf of we the people. Why else would you want a preacher to bless a doorway or other such silliness. (The exorcist was just a movie. It’s time to come out of the dark ages. We even have microscopes that allow us to “see” those pesky little killer bacteria and such — honest.) Anyway, upon further reflection, perhaps the Republicans in the US Congress are actually doing us all a favor by doing nothing. The next thing you know, they’ll be voting on the qualifications needed for the welders that assemble the stainless steel plumbing in these nuclear facilities. By the way, I wonder if the latest cost projections include new requirements for sustaining a hit from an airplane. It probably depends on the definition of “airplane” but it’s not a comedy.

GodHatesTrash, Superstar

February 26th, 2009
8:13 am

Georgia legislators let people poop in peanuts with impunity. (Say that 3 times fast). Now they are gonna administer nukular plants?

Good luck with that!

GodHatesTrash, Superstar

February 26th, 2009
8:18 am

Georgia Power knows that the folks under the gold dome can be bought real cheap, which is good for bizness.

(Stupid people work cheap.)

GodHatesTrash, Superstar

February 26th, 2009
8:24 am

In the interest of streamlining gummint administration and cutting costs, why doesn’t Southron Company stop running Georgia state gummint as a separate entity?

Brad Steal

February 26th, 2009
8:33 am

This seems to defy logic. That may be an understatement. It is dumfounding that our representatives would have any interest in pursuing this issue. It seems to be nothing but a job-securing power grab.

Thank you, Jay, for helping bring this to the public’s attention. Too bad the WING NUT MORONS who live to cast aspersions at Jay, the lib’rl media, gov’mt and the lib’rls, will dilute a real issue with tired hackneyed, humorless, worthless drivel.

Using the words “Oblahmi,” “urinal,” “Hussien” is not clever, ironic, novel and sure as hell not funny. They only identify the poster as a MORON. But these guys dispaly of stupidity make them the democrat’s secret weapon. When the wingnuts, morons, and AM radio types are the loudest, the current administration is the strongest.
B. Steal

Bud Wiser

February 26th, 2009
8:38 am

The democrats, drunk beyond reason now with power, and feeling above and beyond the zone of accountability, are showing their true feelings for their ‘fellow man’.

Obama appoints a string of tax cheats to Cabinet positions, one of whom actually gets confirmed.

Roland Burris, appointed to take Obama’s senate seat, now being looked at for possible connections and dealings with Blago’s brother, asked to resign by Dirty Dick Durbin, and refuses.

Eric Holder calls out America as “racial cowards.”

Labor Secretary Robert Reich (yes, as in 3rd Reich), puts in writing that new construction jobs coming from the stimulus package “should not go to white, male construction workers.” Normally a statement like that would get media coverage, an investigation and/or prosecution…..at least getting one’s arse fired…but no, not here.

And the Changling Master himself, Obama, ridicules all Republicans, by accusing them of taking their cues from Rush Limbaugh, as bombastic a self-promoter as there is, on the radio.

This is constructive?

This is bi-partisanship?

This is healing?

What a liar, and what a sad sackful of idiots that still support this inexperienced, socialistic, fraudulent shell of a man, a politician in the mold of modus operandi of party politics as usual. You should be shocked and ashamed of what you are seeing this man become, but you are not. You stupidity and rigidity do not allow you to admit you have made the most horrendous mistake in your lifetime, and that your children and grandchildren and possibly beyond will pay the price of your lack of vision.

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
8:42 am

DB Nanny,

You may not have noticed but the pet name for Republicans that Jay told us was banned still comes shining through. Why don’t you just try to contribute rather than act as Jay’s w-wordy enforcer? Granted it’s difficult since I believe this is about the 18th time we’ve been given this exact same recycled article.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
8:45 am

Labor Secretary Robert Reich (yes, as in 3rd Reich)

guess I can add “closet anti-Semite” to your list of character flaws, Bud.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
8:46 am

I just love watching a Republican squirm. The only thing more entertaining is a whole bunch of squirming Republicans. Squirming and worrying about the reality that wars cost people and money and no regulations result in dead people and destruction of people’s lives. Dang, I sure am glad that I voted for Obama.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
8:46 am

You may not have noticed but the pet name for Republicans that Jay told us was banned still comes shining through.

Actually, I noticed that “shit” was still coming through loud and clear. Not sure why.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
8:48 am

yep. Still coming through. (Sorry for the vulgarity, Jay, actually you should probably delete it; I’d report it, but frankly the “Report this comment” function is pretty FUBAR, and I’ve already griped about the inability to link to an individual comment.)

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
8:50 am

“Why don’t you just try to contribute rather than act as Jay’s w-wordy enforcer?”

RW complainer, heal thyself. At least I did comment on the topic at hand already. You?

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
8:50 am

DB,

That’s a different word, but since you fancy yourself as being somewhat net savvy you might have noticed they don’t have any censors for garden variety vulgarity and you should show the self discipline not to use it, especially since you’re crying to the host to ban words that someone else uses.

gttim

February 26th, 2009
8:51 am

Again, here you have stockholders trying to socialize risks and privatize profits. If a nuclear plant is such a good idea, GA Power stockholders should be willing to take the risk of investing in it. If it is not, don’t build it. The GOP is trying to ram through this huge giveaway of normal folks money to corporate interests again. How long do we have to allow this? Well, as long as idiots keep electing Republicans and DLC Democrats.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
8:53 am

“you fancy yourself as being somewhat net savvy”

Cite, please.

(j/k)

gotta run, later, all.

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
8:55 am

RW complainer, heal thyself. At least I did comment on the topic at hand already. You?

Your comment was Cite, please. My comment was that Jay was recycling old columns. Not much difference there.

By the way, if you want to test whether some word makes it to publication, but then ask to have it removed you might want to test it on a dead thread.

rcs

February 26th, 2009
8:58 am

“State legislators ought to read every word of that analysis before voting. If they comprehend it and still believe the bill is a good idea, they can vote with confidence that they are qualified to decide such matters.”

Jay, are you know proposing legislators read the bills before they pass? When I made that point about the Stimulus Bill, you said it was business as usual for them NOT to read the bills.

Why the sudden turn around?

Dave R

February 26th, 2009
9:13 am

First of all, I have to agree with Jay on this one (I’ll be throwing up later on).

However, Jay also does journalistic integrity a dishonest turn by not telling the whole story, and shading his text against Republicans. Since he only mentions two people involved with this bill, even if he doesn’t mention that they are both Republicans, he leads the reader to think that only Republicans were the bad guys on this.

Which I’m sure was his intention all along.

That attempt couldn’t be further from the truth.

In fact, 6 Democrats also voted for this idiocy, with two Democrats not voting at all. That means that 30% of available Democrat votes supported this bill as well. Sadly, it appears that only 2 Republican senators voted against this.

So before all you Kool-aid drinkers out there shout down the GOP side for this, save a little of that “love” for the 6 Dems that aided and abetted their Republican colleagues.

A pox on BOTH their houses.

Jay

February 26th, 2009
9:16 am

To RCS:
The difference is the difference between a three- or four-page analysis of policy and 1,000-plus pages of appropriations.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
9:20 am

Then again, Jay, given that Republicans are in the pocket of big business, perhaps these Republicans know precisely what they’re doing without reading the first word — a little self-preservation at the expense of we the people, business as usual for the family values Republicans. If only we could just get them to value all families equally. This case is really no different from the US Republican representatives and their decision to vote no on the stimulus without even knowing, so they said, what was in the bill. They knew precisely what they were doing and it was, again, not a matter of looking out for we the people’s best interests.

Jay

February 26th, 2009
9:22 am

BUD, I don’t know who your source is for that bit about Robert Reich, but you might want to pass along the news that Reich was Labor secretary back in the CLINTON administration, which makes the suggestion that Obama ought to fire him rather difficult, wouldn’t you say?

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
9:23 am

There was also bi-partisan acceptance of the stimulus bill.

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
9:26 am

To RCS:
The difference is the difference between a three- or four-page analysis of policy and 1,000-plus pages of appropriations.

So if the bill is bill is long enough and only deals with doling out $800,000,000,000.00 of our tax dollars then there’s no reason to read it???

If that’s Change We Can Believe In then every bill from here to eternity will be over a thousand pages.

Just heard that so far PresBO has spent 26 billion of our dollars every single day since he took office and that doesn’t take into account the nearly 4 trillion dollar budget he’s turning in today.

Say goodbye to America. We had a nice run.

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
9:28 am

There was also bi-partisan acceptance of the stimulus bill.

There was more bipartisan denial of the porkulous bill than there was acceptance of it.

rcs

February 26th, 2009
9:30 am

It’s a matter of principle, not the number of pages. No legislator should vote on any bill unless they read and comprehend what they are voting for.

fearless fosdick

February 26th, 2009
9:34 am

Bud Wiser @ 8:38

Bud … Robert Reich WAS the scty of labor! For your information Hilda Solis is Obamas scty of labor.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
9:36 am

I did not set the blog precedent for bi-partisan support. I’m simply going with the flow. Also, I find it odd that these Republicans did not read and/or were utterly ignorant of the content of the stimulus bill, apparently even to this date, yet they were able to pump out a list of needle in the haystack “pork” that surely had not simply risen to the top of those 1000 pages as though it were floating on water. I don’t need a clearer picture of the Republican’s game — sore losers.

sd

February 26th, 2009
9:38 am

What if we just used less power? I mean, maybe if we just turned off anything that we didn’t need. We could start by unplugging Vegas.

Real

February 26th, 2009
9:38 am

“Wind, wave, solar power, electric cars, and geothermal heat pumps will do the job at a price we can afford and reverse global climate change.”.

Spoken like a true bunny/tree hugger, green lib, NIMBY who will not accept science over perception!!!! This is the same mentality and ignorance that got PresBO selected and keeps Gore in the public limelight!!!

Redneck

February 26th, 2009
9:40 am

Not that I would crittersize a bunch of godly Republicans, mind you, but if I’m going to help pay for a power plant while it’s being built I want some stock in the co. that’s building it. Private cos. don’t ask customers to pay for their stores in advance. Well, neither should power cos. And after this atomic plant starts running I won’t own a penny’s worth of it. Where’s the Private Innerprize in that? You’re suppose to start robbing the customers after you’re set up and running, not before.

It’s just my idea but it’s very true. Have a good day everybody.

fed up

February 26th, 2009
9:41 am

The argument about the size of what is being read (the policy or the legislation) is lame. This president has spent/is spending more than Bush did in 8 years. Where’s the outrage?

cranky old man

February 26th, 2009
9:41 am

So what happens if I pay extra on my utility bills for however many years it takes to pay for this plant in advance, and then my employer transfers me to another state just before it is completed? Do I get a refund when I leave the state?

Observer

February 26th, 2009
9:44 am

Taxpayer – You’re actually buying into the notion that the (lack of) stimulus bill was bi-partisan?

Not a single Republican representative voted for it and only three Republican senators did. NOT A SINGLE Republican was invited into the conference committee debate on the final version of the bill. If you call that bi-partisanship, you are either truly ignorant or so blindly partisan that you will say and do anything that supports the cause of your party.

Hmmmm, upon further consideration, maybe you’re both ignorant AND blindly partisan.

Time to go back to work. Somebody has to pay for you to be able to sit in front of this blog all day.

GodHatesTrash, Superstar

February 26th, 2009
9:52 am

A big German “hail” and salute to our little buddy Herr Viser!

His comments waft through Bookman’s blog like a big storm front, reminding us of the true nature of GOP “conservatism”.

(holding my nose…)

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
9:54 am

Observer,

You cannot even handle basic math. So, manual labor is definitely where you should be. Now, run along little fella.

fearless fosdick

February 26th, 2009
9:54 am

BRAD–It wasn’t DB who made that ill-informed comment concerning Robert Reich..It was BUD WISER…..

Just clearing the air!

Brad Steal

February 26th, 2009
10:01 am

1000 apologies, DB. I got distracted during my rant and referenced you wildly incorrectly.

Observer

February 26th, 2009
10:06 am

I love it. I have an MBA in finance and I’m being lectured on basic math by an idiot who thinks the cost of the the $787 billion stimulus bill with 10% interest is only $866 billion.

Even using the discounted net present value argument presented yesterday, the cost is well north of a trillion dollars.

Face it – you are one of those people who likes to hold him or herself (sorry, I don’t which applies) out as an expert on all subjects but whose arguments rarely stand up to factual scrutiny.

TnGelding

February 26th, 2009
10:09 am

fed up

February 26th, 2009
9:41 am

He’s spending it here in the good ol’ USA. I don’t like it that much either, but since big business is teetering on bankruptcy what’s the alternative?

Bush submitted the first $2 trillion and the first $3 trillion budgets. The Gypper took the honors for the first trillion dollar one.

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
10:10 am

Speaking of people that can’t handle simple math. After Obama got in the obligatory w-word about how he “inherited” a trillion dollar deficit he said he had identified two trillion in “savings” that would help cut the deficit in half in just four years.

God help us!

And Mr. President, please get over this “inherited” BS. You asked us for the job and we gave it to you. You were also a Senator in a Democrat run Congress while that deficit was being rung up and the biggest item contributing to it was TARP that you and your tax cheat Treasury Secretary were fully in favor of.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
10:12 am

NRC proposes to amend its regulations with a new rule that would require
newly designed power reactor facilities to take into account the potential effects of
the impact of a large, commercial aircraft. The proposed rule would only affect
new reactor designs not previously certified by NRC. Westinghouse submitted
changes in the design of its AP1000 reactor to NRC on May 29, 2007, proposing to
line the inside and outside of the reactor’s concrete containment structure with steel
plates to increase resistance to aircraft penetration.

Designs that are intended to protect we the people cost money — big money — and someone has to pay. Why should it be private enterprise when Republicans can get we the people to pay upfront, way up front, even preemptive payments way upfront.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
10:14 am

Well, I love it too. You want to compare your MBA to my three degrees. Let’s go for it, dude.

TnGelding

February 26th, 2009
10:15 am

Ga. Power is being unreasonable. Why not just let us pay the entire cost as construction progresses and issue us stock or credits for future bills when it comes online? To expect us to pay shareholder dividends is absurd.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
10:19 am

Further, Idiot Observer, if you still cannot figure out how to multiply 787 by 1.1, then you need to go ask for a refund from whatever “college” sold you that bill of goods. Now, go toss your childish name-calling out somewhere else because you are not the only capable of that crap, Idiot.

Sorry, Jay.

TnGelding

February 26th, 2009
10:23 am

I must be the only uneducated one that drops in here occasionally.

AJC/DNC Management

February 26th, 2009
10:26 am

Users of any utility, be it natural gas or electrical, pay for the construction and for the financing of construction of any generating facility, no matter if it is coal, wind or fart powered. To think that these energy companies are building power generation plants and not passing the costs on to consumers is insane, after all, this is not a socialist governmental function we are discussing.

Not yet, anyway.

What the real issue is here, buried amongst the crocodile tears for “Georgia families,” is the nuclear power and the junk science environmental terrorist’s perpetual lunatic struggle against science and progress.

They would rather have us burning smog producing coal, killing the miners that produce it and wasting energy to transport it to it’s final location of use.

Really nice, isn’t it?

These flat earthers have left the United States back in the thirteenth century, stupidly burning fossil fuels to accomplish what France and other advanced countries are doing with uranium, an emission free, cheap and reliable alternative fuel.

Why, you ask?

Because they cannot impose a “carbon” tax on nuclear power generation.

Which is all these goons really care about.

So hundreds of thousands of infants and the elderly and coal miners needlessly die so that these savage liberals can exact their pound of flesh.

Wonderful, isn’t it?

Paul

February 26th, 2009
10:28 am

RW-(the original) 10:10

Off topic of the thread, on topic for the meanderings:

Saw a headline this morning – Pres Obama’s budget equates to $10,000 spent for every man, woman and child in the US. Not household, not income tax payer. Person.

I’d imagine a number of people are feeling like the guy who managed to marry the stunning, intelligent, engaging, conversational, ‘never gonna find one like her in a million years’ woman.

Then he gets his first credit card statement.

AmVet

February 26th, 2009
10:35 am

I personally believe nuclear should be part of the energy mix int his country. It has its risks, certainly, but the rewards are great.

But this Balfour lunacy stinks to high heaven. Letting the feckless idiots in our state legislature try to pull this hijinks off is intolerable. Is there no end to these fraud conservatives love of corporate welfare?

To the surreal poster at 9:38. Let me guess. For years and years and years you denied global warming was even occurring. Now that the evidence is overwhelming and undeniable, you ostriches are desperately looking to sunspots, volcanoes, cow flatulence, etc. as the explanation.

How in the name of (your favorite superstition here) do you expect people to take you seriously? A pitiful lot.

Bud, can you not go more than a couple of days without sticking your Anglo-Saxon feet in your mouth? But to your point, about the new president, I am not a fan either yet. And likely will never be. But ANYONE who voted for Less than Curious George even once, should probably just put a sock in it and remember you have NO credibility to assess candidates for their competency…

Observer

February 26th, 2009
10:36 am

The question is not one of ability but rather, accuracy. To suggest that multiplying 787 by 1.1 results in the cost of the stimulus bill suggests that you think that bill is financed for only one year. If that were the case, your calculation would be correct. Unfortunately for you (and others who are similarly misinformed), that bill will be financed through the sale of 30-year treasury bonds at a rate of 3.67% (today’s rate).

Why don’t you go get your calculator and, using the FACTUAL figures referenced above, show me the calculation that results in a cost to the American taxpayers of less than $1 trillion for the $787 billion stimulus bill.

Now, run along and play with your calculator for awhile. I have to get back to work.

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
10:39 am

Paul,

I’m the guy that married that woman and she doesn’t even use a credit card, although if I had known I could run a trillion dollar deficit and then use two trillion dollars to pay off half of it in the next four years I’d give her a few platinum cards.

Paul

February 26th, 2009
10:43 am

Observer – Taxpayer

Is this one of those cases where accuracy to the nth degree is rather meaningless? To most of us it seems we’re in a world of hurt, gov’t intervention was required, we said ‘go for it’ and then we got the repeated shocks of the size of the various bills. Now we’re arguing was it one gazillion dollars or 1.3 gazillion dollars?

It’s unfathomable either way.

TnGelding

February 26th, 2009
10:44 am

Observer

February 26th, 2009
10:36 am

Thanks for explaining it so civilly. Remember when Clinton left the treasury in such good shape the 30-year was discontinued?

Paul

February 26th, 2009
10:44 am

RW-(the original)

I have a card she can use. Please?

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
10:48 am

Paul,

She might be too young for you.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
10:48 am

There’s no doubt about the fact that this country is screwed up, economically speaking as well as in other ways. Another bleak jobs report out today does little to build up one’s hope and looking at the huge amounts of money that our government is forking out in order to try and right this listing ship while either staring at a pink slip or the person in front of you in the unemployment line just adds to the misery index. Now, on top of the bleak jobs reports, state budget shortfalls, huge federal deficits, etc., we the people can look forward to forking over even more to private enterprise so they are not the ones saddled with the risk — only the rewards. Sounds like trickle down yellow rain Reaganomics at its finest. How can anyone not understand the need to create jobs, with paychecks, and tax withholdings, and mortgage payments, and clothing purchases. I’m not talking about faux jobs that trickle down from a panderer’s perch and I’m not talking about jobs to build more FU-2 Raptures. I’m talking about real work that helps people live a decent life and it doesn’t matter if the work is only for a year or two as long as businesses see the light and start re-hiring by then.

Paul

February 26th, 2009
10:49 am

TNGelding 10:23

[[I must be the only uneducated one that drops in here occasionally.]]

Given how successful the educated, rich lawyers have been, ever thought of running for Congress?

Paul

February 26th, 2009
10:50 am

RW-(the original) 10:38

Hey, just because I have a grandkid, I could still be 42!

Thbppptt.

“Age is mind over matter. If you don’t mind, it don’t matter.”

Observer

February 26th, 2009
10:51 am

TnGelding – What Clinton did was take advantage of a favorable interest rate curve by refinancing 30-year debt into 10-year debt. In hindsight, it proved to be a brilliant move and I applaud his financial advisors accordingly. It was, however, incredibly risky because had the rate curve turned against him it could have literally bankrupted the country.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
11:00 am

Observer, as I stated before, you (I believe) made a post regarding the size of the stimulus package and how it, with interest, would break the trillion dollar level and that was relative to the discussion regarding Bush’s trillion dollar deficit, as in annual net dollars borrowed (which also should include the annual debt service which was over 400 billion before the financial collapse but I’d have to check to see if “Honest Abe Bush” thought to include it in his budget). I pointed out that even if we paid an outrageous 10% APR (and I was VERY clear on what I was talking about, as in APR for example), the deficit (the annual amount borrowed) would not reach one trillion. If you still cannot understand what I said, then clearly you do not wish to understand — you only want to argue. Now, go play with yourself some more. I’ve got to get back to my retirement entertainment and you are a bore.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
11:14 am

Then, there’s the cost associated with something as seemingly trivial as spent fuel rods:

The National Academy of Sciences (NAS) released a report in April 2005 that
found that “successful terrorist attacks on spent fuel pools, though difficult, are
possible,” and that “if an attack leads to a propagating zirconium cladding fire, it
could result in the release of large amounts of radioactive material.” NAS
recommended that the hottest spent fuel be interspersed with cooler spent fuel to
reduce the likelihood of fire, and that water-spray systems be installed to cool spent
fuel if pool water were lost.

I wonder if those numbers were included up front. After all, there are true cost overruns and then there are the did I forget to mention that cost overruns.

Hillbilly Deluxe

February 26th, 2009
11:18 am

First off I’m not opposed to a nuclear power plant. Second, I am an EMC customer and not a GA Power customer. GA Power and most GA EMCs do purchase their power from Oglethorpe Power though. How does Oglethorpe figure into this? It would be my guess that most of the state will wind up paying for this.

What I am opposed to is the pay in advance plan. It’s not my analogy but someone said, you don’t go to GM and pay now for a car that you might receive in 10 years. And oh by the way it may cost more when you take delivery. It’s a 100% certain that the cost of the plant will be passed on to the customers no matter what happens, so why does it have to be paid in advance? We all know there will be cost overruns and they’ll want more money when it’s finished anyway.

This is not a Republican or Democratic thing by the way. Us native Georgians know that this has always been the way things work. When the Legislature was overwhelmingly made up of Democrats it operated the same way. Remember all those state officials that had vacation cottages at Lake Rabun on lots donated to them by GA Power? That was in the 70’s if my memory is right.

getalife

February 26th, 2009
11:18 am

Socializing a nuke plant like Iran?

w should have never opened that door.

Geez.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
11:22 am

TNGelding 10:23

I must be the only uneducated one that drops in here occasionally.

I would never accuse you of being uneducated, TNGelding.

TnGelding

February 26th, 2009
11:29 am

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
11:22 am

Everyone else was brandishing their degrees.

I couldn’t get elected dog catcher.

Paul

February 26th, 2009
11:39 am

TNGelding

Like I said earlier, it was people with degrees got us into this mess.

Lots of times common sense counts more than a degree.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
11:40 am

We might need a hefty tax or something, such as a cost overrun, to cover the cost of protecting those spent fuel rods as well.

The National Academy of Sciences (NAS) released a report in April 2005 that
found that “successful terrorist attacks on spent fuel pools, though difficult, are
possible,” and that “if an attack leads to a propagating zirconium cladding fire, it
could result in the release of large amounts of radioactive material.” NAS
recommended that the hottest spent fuel be interspersed with cooler spent fuel to
reduce the likelihood of fire, and that water-spray systems be installed to cool spent
fuel if pool water were lost.

The sad reality is that cost overruns on a project such as this are almost guaranteed. So, yet another question should be regarding how much allowance is in the numbers or have they been scrubbed down to perfection to make the sales pitch easier.

Night Train

February 26th, 2009
11:43 am

I find it real interesting that those that voted against the stimulus bill are ‘morons’ for voting against something without reading it first. But those that voted for it, without reading it, are somehow perceived as intelligent and caring.

Those that voted for it, voted only because they either knew that their pork was still intact or they blindly followed the anointed one.

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
11:45 am

TnGelding,

Recently and accidentally I busted one of these posters that is always trotting out their degrees as a fraud. Decency compels me not to out the culprit, but rest assured what you read on an anonymous blog is often not the truth.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
12:01 pm

Night Train @ 11.46 and others who’ve pondered the whole “why don’t they read the entire appropriations bill(s) prior to voting” question, just some food for thought.

Isn’t it fairly likely that these reps/senators, both GOP and Dem, have trusted staffers who do just that, to check on the work of those who are drafting the legislation? Obviously it’d be preferable to have these elected officials go through each bill line by line to ensure that nothing illegal, immoral or fattening is in there, every single time, but is that realistic?

I guess the business analogy would be a lengthy contract, say that concerning a merger or acquisition, that a CEO might be called upon to approve. Does he/she actually read and understand the whole thing prior to letting ‘er rip? I have my doubts.

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
12:09 pm

Isn’t it fairly likely that these reps/senators, both GOP and Dem, have trusted staffers who do just that, to check on the work of those who are drafting the legislation?

DB,

Normally yes, but I rather doubt it with Porkulous I since it wasn’t even available to be read until a few hours before the vote and was 1,100 odd pages of Congraspeak.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
12:13 pm

“1,100 odd pages of Congraspeak.”

Wasn’t most of it a rehashing of existing legislation? How surprising was the resulting conference committee bill likely to be?

And thought of another way, how long does it take (say) 20 people to go through a 1100 page document if they divvy it up into relatively equal chunks?

Obviously in a perfect world everyone takes the bill home at least for over the weekend, has a couple of days’ worth of quiet time with it, they make calls and email colleagues and such to clear up questions. Don’t know how often that happens in the real world.

demwit

February 26th, 2009
12:19 pm

We don’t need no stinking nuclear power plant!

By 2011 Georgia will be able to run on all those new high tech American made battaries Nancy and Harry paid 150 billion for in the stimulus bill!!

RW-(the original)

February 26th, 2009
12:21 pm

DB,

Apparently it was a collection of pork projects that hadn’t been able find there way into our wallets yet, but all got tossed in because the President was running around trying to scare the beejezus out of everyone. In that regard maybe you have a point.

Night Train

February 26th, 2009
12:26 pm

DB, I don’t know how things work in other companies, but where I work, we have a legal department and before I can sign any agreement binding my company to anything, they review it completely. I’ve received documents back and had to have the vendor add a period to a sentence before legal signed off on it and I was authorized to sign the agreement.

Also, I did not elect their ‘trusted staffers’ to pass laws, bills or the potatoes.

Realistic or not, that is their job for which they are overly compensative.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
12:31 pm

we have a legal department and before I can sign any agreement binding my company to anything, they review it completely.

Mr. Train, that’s kind of my point–you have a legal department. You don’t try to grok every semicolon yourself.

And to carry our private enterprise analogy a bit (too much?) further–if it’s a “take it or leave it” deal that’s got an unreasonable deadline but an irresistible opportunity, do you take as much time as you’d like with it to review, or do you figure the 0.001% advantage you might manage to gain by sending back another version without the semicolon… well, you get the idea.

There’s clean sheets upstairs, by the way.

tcoach

February 26th, 2009
12:33 pm

1,100+ pages turns into more when you consider each and every page has language in it that must be reviewed and understood as well, usually it is in regards to old, cases, laws, actions or referendums. Sometimes from individual states, making it virtually impossible for a staff to read, research and understand in anything less than a 72 hour period nearly working around the clock.

It was a wise political move by the democrats in the house and senate to place as much congressional language in tot eh bill and also offer only a limited time to review it.

Curious Observer

February 26th, 2009
12:33 pm

Oh, come on! An annual appropriations bill is five times longer than the stimulus bill, and you can bet nobody takes the time to read either. This “didn’t have time to read it” ploy is just another arrow in the quiver of the whining Republican obstructionists. They have no solutions of their own, or else they’d be advancing them. Well, they had better pray that the stimulus utterly fails, or else their current wilderness will become a desert.

DB, Gwinnettian

February 26th, 2009
12:36 pm

Mr. Train is meaningful on many levels, and posted:

I did not elect their ‘trusted staffers’ to pass laws, bills or the potatoes.

Nor did I. And to show that this concern you’ve expressed does cut both ways, Dennis Kucinich had a winning line when the topic of the PATRIOT act came up. Paraphrasing, it went: “They ask me why I voted against it–I tell them it’s because I actually read it!”

Realistic or not, that is their job for which they are overly compensative.

Overly? If you’re talking actual salaries, I beg to differ. If you count the kickbacks, board-of-director gigs and such…

Red

February 26th, 2009
1:03 pm

The only reason we’re even aware of this proposed scheme is because they are a regulated utility. If the utilities were completely deregulated like the wack jobs get light headed just thinking about, my power bill would continue to inexplicably rise and you’d be able to see Augusta from Conyers since it would be glowing so brightly.

Night Train

February 26th, 2009
1:05 pm

Legal only gets the document after I have read it and it provides what I am needing.
I read it to make sure I get what I need. Legal reads it to protect the company.

Overly compensated encompasses salaries but more importantly, health care, retirement, free transportation and such that I am forced to pay for.

I try to overlook the kickbacks and other illegal activities that a number of elected official’s engage in. It is not good for my anger management issues or my blood pressure. :)

Anyone who actually reads a bill front to back is a rare politician.

Taxpayer

February 26th, 2009
1:20 pm

Anything interesting happen whilst my wife and I were away stimulating the economy.

I see RW has outed someone. Interesting. A private outing.

Paul,

Granted an education is no substitute for common sense… and vice versa. Preferably, we get people in office with some minimum level of education, for the given job description, as well as some common sense and even a little wisdom thrown in for good measure.

TnGelding 11:29, I think you are too modest.

@@

February 26th, 2009
1:26 pm

I don’t know why you find this so offensive, jay. I’m still waiting to hear what it was Obama and our northern neighbor, Harper, agreed to on Canada’s Oil Sands. Your president Obama said he was looking forward to a joint venture between the U.S. and Canada’s nasty oil business.

The ol’ carbon offsets scam for allowing pollution.

Last I heard, they were finding it difficult to round up investors. Maybe Obama found some in his “stimulus” package?

fed up

February 26th, 2009
1:32 pm

TN-you know some people are educated above their own intelligence, right? There are a few of those on this blog. I understand what Bush did as far as spending $$. Regardless add’l $$ shouldn’t be spent at this rate with the excuse that’s what Bush did. It’s time to put a stop to this. This spending might work in the short term I’m worried about the long term effect.

Observer

February 26th, 2009
2:26 pm

Since this blog has morphed from Nuke plants to wasteful spending (sorry, I guess I helped with that), I have a question. Has anyone seen Obama’s scalpel? During the campaign, he accused McCain of wanting to attack the budget with a chain saw and suggested that instead, he would go line by line through every spending bill with a scalpel. So far, I’ve seen no evidence of a scalpel unless you count that gash across the throat of the American taxpayers. Instead, it appears he just poured “Miracle Grow” on every line item of the federal budget.

Just once, I’d like to see a president – from either party – that even remotely resembled himself as a candidate.

Yankee

February 26th, 2009
2:59 pm

TnGelding,A lot of us do, we also don’t waste time posting.

kitty

February 26th, 2009
3:25 pm

Anyone notice how none of the right wingers on here are addressing the fact that GA Power will be charging THEM for a plant not even built and if the money paid by customers is more than the plant they do not have to refund it…I think that is what that comment by the PSC meant. Not likely that a refund would happen, but still…my guess is they will go back to the GOP for more if that happens and it will since the GOP just killed any oversight on GA Power by making the PSC powerless.

GodHatesTrash, Superstar

February 26th, 2009
3:26 pm

Shouldn’t y’all get some water first, clean the poop out of your peanuts, and THEN figger out if’n you wanna build another nukular plant??

Of course, we’re beggin’ the real question here – if y’all ain’t smart enough to get you some water, and stop poopin’ in your peanuts, should y’all be buildin’ them thar nukular power plants?

Bud Wiser

February 26th, 2009
4:09 pm

DB, you are a complete idiot, assuming I am anti-Semite. Where the hell did that presumption come from, or are you too stupid and bigoted in your own right to know? Your imbecilic rants obviously come from a complete and total inability to read and cmprehend basic English; what are you anyway, a product of Atlanta public schools?

You can label me or add me to any list you chose to compartmentalize in that small brain you possess, I really do not care. Your opinions of me or anyone else are as irrelevant as you have become. I obviously pull some trigger that sets you off, because you cannot counter one single thing I say without sprinkling some confetti, cursing, or trying to insult anyone. Staying on topic is beyond your feeble, idiotic capacity, I suppose. Certainly discussing anything like an adult, or even a political adversary, is light years beyond the mushroom you having growing between your ears.

Red Foreman

February 26th, 2009
4:54 pm

Hey Jay, lets do away with electricity all together and start using kerosene lamps again…but without power, your hair dryer would not work and that 70’s hairdo would be a mess!

John Galt Jr.

February 26th, 2009
6:01 pm

Off topic but it is funny. Now where is the Obama lied crowd?

Senate Democrats expressed discontent Thursday with plans from the Pentagon to leave a residual force of up to 50,000 troops in Iraq, even as the military pursues a substantial drawdown.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., told reporters that he is heading to the White House later in the day to hear an explanation.

“I have been one who has called for significant cutbacks in Iraq for some time. And I am happy to listen to the secretary of defense, the president, but when they talk about 50,000, that’s a little higher number than I had anticipated,” Reid said.

Sen. Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., also said he’s waiting for hear a “justification” for why so many troops would stay behind.

“It has to be done responsibly, we all agree, but 50,000 is more than I would have thought,” he said.

Sen. Patty Murray, D-Wash, who voted against the Iraq war, unlike Reid and Schumer, took a more reserved tone, saying, “I want to hear what the president has to say … but I do think we have to look carefully at the number that are there and do it as quickly as we can.”

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., voiced strong concern on Wednesday on an MSNBC show, calling the 50,000 residual force “an awful lot,” though she noted that the president has not made an official statement on the plan, so “I don’t know what the justification is for 50,000.”

danjonglee

February 26th, 2009
6:46 pm

Work less….make less…..pay less taxes…..

Steve

February 26th, 2009
7:05 pm

Georgia Power is a public untility. If the cost come in way under budget they have nothing to gain. You can’t regulate their profits and expect them to take a high risk.

Mel

February 27th, 2009
7:20 am

AJC! Post a list of all the legislators who have taken campaign cash from Georgia Power and Southern Company lobbyists and PACs and list how they voted on this bill.

Huh?

February 27th, 2009
8:15 am

“Wind, wave, solar power, electric cars, and geothermal heat pumps will do the job at a price we can afford and reverse global climate change. ”

So where will the electric cars get there electicity from, when cap and trade kills all the coal plants and we don’t build nuclear?

Joe Matarotz

February 27th, 2009
9:17 am

Jay

You writing is so much better when you keep politics out of it and actually focus on the issues. Stop bashing Republicans and start bashing the scumbags who are ruining our country. They’re not always one in the same.