Could Byfuglien back on blueline be bad news for Kulda?
One of the more interesting things that came from Chris Vivlamore’s recent chat with Rick Dudley was the suggestion that Dustin Byfuglien could wind up playing defense.
“It’s a position that he likes to play”, Dudley told Vivlamore. “It’s a position that I thought he was well on his way to being a top, top defenseman in Chicago”.
Roberto Luongo and other goalies around the NHL certainly wouldn't mind seeing the large frame of Dustin Byfuglien moving to defense (AP photo)
Continuing the Thrashers GM added, “We moved him to forward because we had no size up front. Obviously, he proved to be a very effective forward but that doesn’t mean he’s not an effective defenseman. Ultimately, if [coach] Craig [Ramsay] says he doesn’t want to play him at defense, it’s unlikely he’ll play on defense. Truthfully, I want to see [him switch]. He can score. He can score 15 goals as a defenseman. He’s got one of the hardest shots in the game”.
The 6’-4” 257 lb Byfuglien was the Blackhawks 245th pick back in the 2003 draft.
Now I must confess, the discussion of such a move is puzzling given the fact that Byfuglien’s size and abilities are just what this team needs in front of opposing goalies. And, if he does take up a spot on the defensive corps that means another player will be denied one. That person most likely would be Arturs Kulda, whom I am really looking forward to seeing on the team this season.
So if Duds gets his wish, the Thrashers D-men would consist of Hainsey, Enstrom, Oduya, Bogosian, Sopel and Buff in back with Valabik left to sample the press box buffet. This is barring any further trades/signings, of course.
What are your thoughts on moving Byfuglien to defense?
- All for it. They need help back there (4%, 6 Votes)
- Not a fan. We need that size up front (72%, 96 Votes)
- Wait...the Thrashers have a forward that knows how to play defense? (24%, 32 Votes)
Total Voters: 134
Loading ...But then let’s also consider the forward lines. The way I see things, Antropov, Peverley, Kane, Little and Bergfors, (when signed), make up five of your top-six forwards. Boulton and Thorburn are fourth liners, possibly centered by Patrice Cormier, and Slater could skate between Eager and Ladd for line three. Then add in, say, Rissmiller as a healthy scratch. But there’s still that one open RW spot on the first or second line to round out the lineup.
This is where Spencer Machacek could possibly find his opening to crack the roster. Dudley has made it clear he wants to make sure there are some spots available for prospects to compete for. So if Buff finds his way onto the defensive corps then that creates an opening for Machacek to fill.
Again, this assumes a trade or signing isn’t in the offing.
Speaking of which, keep in mind we’ve heard rumblings that Dudley and Co. have shown some interest in forward Lee Stempniak. If he were to be brought in, one would think he’s got the inside track to that final top-six spot with Buff on defense.
And that would probably mean Spencer back in Chicago with Arturs.
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156 comments Add your comment
HookyBob
August 26th, 2010
11:57 pm
Methinks this might be just a bit of the annual pre-season marketing hype.
lemon drop the gloves
August 27th, 2010
12:25 am
as i have said before, buff can’t skate backwards and is not the d-man to get thrashers to the playoffs. ok if he score 15 – he will give up 25. he is a helluva a forward with a great reach, shot, and forechecking abilities. this is utter bull to talk of him on defence when he is such a force on the offensive end. artie and spencer have worked their tails off in chicago and have nothing left to prove in the ahl. they deserve the opportunity now. it is time for the thrash to go with the youth that has earned the right to play in the show. two solid years for each of these guys and their futures depend on big buff playing d. give me a break.
Wayne stuck in AL
August 27th, 2010
12:54 am
Sorry, Duds, I’m against it. We need that muscle on the top 2 lines…Besides, we know you’re looking to get rid of Bergfors, where are the goals coming from?
Oh, I get it now, Atlanta Spirit has told you to put out a defense-first team; so that way, they won’t ask for big numbers come salary time…very sneaky!
cousin Eddie
August 27th, 2010
12:57 am
I agree with lemon drop.
Brendan
August 27th, 2010
1:42 am
I’d rather see Kulda here. Or whomever earns that 6th and 7th d-man slot. What an utter waste to put Byfuglien there. Big Buff will score 20 goals as a forward. No doubt about it. To expect him to pot 15 as a blueliner … is asking a lot. And, it’s hurting the overall benefit to the team to play him on defense. I have no problem with Byfuglien playing defense, if our blueliners suffer some injuries. But if we’re healthy, this move doesn’t make sense.
Look, I’m as frustrated as anyone that Don Waddell is still here, after having done nothing to justify his paycheck, after a decade’s worth of seasons. But we can’t just sit here and say any good move is Dudley’s move and any stupid idea must be Waddell’s. Dudley is going to make both good and bad moves. And even Waddell sometimes got various moves correctly. All I can do … is pray that things work out.
Heck, I know that in the big scheme of things, this is Year 4 of a 4 year building project. I get it. And I’m not a fan that demands the Stanley Cup every year, or even playoffs every year. All I ask … all I’ve EVER ASKED … is that our franchise conduct itself with an HONEST ATTEMPT to do the best it can, given its set of circumstance. I don’t believe that’s happened to the extent that it should. But “it is what it is.” And with that in mind, our team plucked a fine asset in Byfuglien. The very least we can do … is utilize it properly. Gracious. I’m trying to give Dudley every confidence. But if Byfuglien plays defense this season, we’d better get the desired result of that. I’m a huge proponent of ‘accountability.’ I always have been. Dudley said, when he got the job, “I like to think that I can do this job as well, if not better, than anybody.” Loved the swagger. Prove it! If this is Dudley’s idea of what will work, and it does, I’ll be back to congratulate him … for doing the job of GM better than anyone else can. I promise.
Wayne stuck in AL
August 27th, 2010
1:55 am
The more Dudley opens his mouth, the more I’m beginning to dislike/distrust him.
Thrashers27
August 27th, 2010
2:13 am
A player that I keep forgettign about is Pettersson. If he is as advertised, he may contend for a RW spot.
Cornbread
August 27th, 2010
3:08 am
Dudley’s floating a trial baloon or throwing it out there to see if anything sticks.
World Be Free
August 27th, 2010
5:56 am
Dudley and Ramsay have successfully emassed a combined 80 years experience in pro hockey. I am not for the idea just yet, but let the guys discuss options and be happy they are sharing them with us. All we are asking for is this team to win on a consistent basis, how they do it is up to the.
Remember folks, this team STILL does not have a physical precense on the blueline. So if it happens, it is not all bad. I still say Buff will be a forward for this team at some point this season, I hope it is from day one.
Budder
August 27th, 2010
6:09 am
Over on C-Viv’s Blog it was put forth that Buff might be a D-Man 5-on-5, but on the PP, drop him to the front of the net. I agree with WBF about needing a stopper at the blueline, and while some have derided his backwards skating ability, when it comes to breaking out Buff would look like Big Daddy Don Garlits coming out of the chute (read PDQ!).
The prospect of Bogo and Tobe firing low lasers from the point, with the Manster harassing the goalie down low sounds pretty sweet. Let’s get it started!
Smitty
August 27th, 2010
6:41 am
I do not think there are too many on this blog that have more knowledge of hockey personnel than Dudley. Duds has his reasons for making this statement. Maybe he is trying to stir the pot and create some excitement.
Rawhide, How many times in past summers have there been over 200 responses to your blogs? All I know there has been a lot more excitement regarding the Thrashers this past summer than in the past. I think it is way too early to start questioning Dudley given the personnel moves he has made.
I am thinking Dudley is letting everyone on the Thrashers know that not every position is set including the top 6 defensemen. Dudley has said Kulda should be playing in ATL this year. If he says Buff might play defense that means there are 8 or 9 guys competing for 6 spots. That should be interesting. And if Buff does indeed play on defense that opens up another forward spot. A message to the prospects that if they work hard enough they could earn a spot or he could be setting up a trade for that 20 goal scorer that some feel that we need.
As I said, I think he is just stirring the pot.
VAThrasher
August 27th, 2010
6:43 am
Agree, we need to trust the braintrust – it’s hard for us though. Also agree it could just be preseason hype posturing. Lastly, if left to me, I’d also put him at forward as we have enough NHL/high level AHL defensemen in camp to field almost 2 entire teams: 1bogo 2enstrom 3oduya 4hainsey 5sopel 6valabik 7kulda 8meyer 9postma 10mclaren.
kracker
August 27th, 2010
7:20 am
All I am sure of is there are five more dog days of August. Camp…we need camp to start soon. I agree w/ the onlookers that there is probably another move(s) coming.
CHIEF OF SMOKE
August 27th, 2010
7:26 am
I like the Buff move to defense, if we sign Stempniak.
Nate
August 27th, 2010
8:01 am
I reiterate…moving Byfuglien to defense (in any situation) wastes the valuable assets we traded to Chicago to obtain him. He’s not a particularly good skater which is exactly what you HAVE to be in order to be an effective defenseman. I pray this doesn’t come true. Our G/A will again be near the bottom of the league which this particular set of Thrashers can’t afford with the lack of reliable goal scoring.
Dwayne
August 27th, 2010
8:10 am
Could not afford Doris and Buff on D. Two bad skaters.
kracker
August 27th, 2010
8:13 am
Unsigned RFAs — Ducks winger Bobby Ryan, Rangers defenseman Marc Staal, Canadiens goalie Carey Price, Oilers forwards Sam Gagner and Andrew Cogliano, Thrashers forward Niclas Bergfors, Avalanche forwards Chris Stewart and Peter Mueller and Stars forward James Neal still haven’t signed new contracts.
It ain’t just us….
GaVaHokie
August 27th, 2010
8:26 am
I could understand if we didn’t have suitable options at Defense, but we do… Kulda and Valabik can fill those spots easily.
Now, if you want to use Buff as a hybrid, I’m fine with that.
For instance, playing Buff on D and have him sneak up to the front of the net and have Thorburn (for example) drop back to cover the D spot.
Just saying, just because he’s on D, doesn’t mean there isn’t a way to get him in front of the net.
GaVaHokie
August 27th, 2010
8:30 am
It could be a case where Dudley wants to give Cormier, Mahachek and Burmistrov a solid chance to play to start the season. Keep Buff back at Defense.
If those guys can’t hold a spot, send them to minors/juniors and move Buff back to forward and then give Kulda, Meyers or Postma a shot at the roster.
So… translation… Dudley seems to want to give the forward prospects more of an initial chance than the defensive prospects.
World Be Free
August 27th, 2010
8:31 am
I think Budder made some great points. Let’s just wait till camp and see what happens. If Dudley, Ramsay and Torch think something is a good idea and they can make work then I am all for it.
TableHockey
August 27th, 2010
8:54 am
Hockey 101 question here – can one of you guys enlighten me on RFA rules? If we don’t come to terms with Bergfors how does that impact him skating for us in 2010-2011?
kracker
August 27th, 2010
9:08 am
In order for Bergfors to play for the Thrashers this season, he must sign a contract. Bergfors can hold out indefinitely and sit at home or try to play in Europe or Russia. Or he could receive a contract offer from another team that the Thrashers would then have to match if they want to keep him for the terms of that offer. As an RFA I do not think the Thrashers can trade him as he is not under contract with the Thrashers at this time.
TableHockey
August 27th, 2010
9:10 am
Thanks Kracker!
Sara
August 27th, 2010
9:13 am
TableHockey – no contract, no play. Same thing we went through with Kovy during his last contract negotiations as an RFA. He held out until he got the deal he wanted, missed I think 2 or 3 games to start that season.
Sara
August 27th, 2010
9:14 am
Kracker – Dudley could trade his rights to another team. Remember Ladd was an RFA without a contract we we traded for him.
Rhythmpenguin
August 27th, 2010
9:16 am
GaVaHokie, Great thoughts! Just to add to them, Duds might also be trying to motivate the prospects (Cormier, Burmistrov, Kulda, etc.) and/or some of the other guys trying to make the team.
Random thought: More fans might come out to see a team that frequently hits big, even if they are not the best at wining.
Red Light
August 27th, 2010
9:17 am
Table Hockey: It’s a great question and I think the CBA has some ambiguity as it concerns RFAs. To the best of my knowledge, here’s the deal.
Any Group 2 player is free to negotiate and sign an Standard Player Contract with any club, and any club shall be completely free to negotiate and sign a SPC with any such player, subject to the provisions set forth in this section.
If the player elects arbitration, or if the team elects arbitration, the player can’t negotiate freely. If the player was offered a qualifying offer, and Bergfors was, the offer automatically expires at 5 pm on July 15, but the club can elect to extend and put forth an offer acceptance date
Red Light
August 27th, 2010
9:18 am
Ooops
…determined in its sole discretion.
Red Light
August 27th, 2010
9:20 am
A Club which makes this qualifying offer will have the exclusive right to negotiate with the player.
Brendan
August 27th, 2010
9:22 am
TableHockey, if the RFA does not come to terms with the team for which he is under contract, he becomes ineligible for the NHL season after December 1, 2010. Likewise, he becomes “ineligible” for the NHL season if his skate touches European ice, while getting paid for it. The team holding the RFA rights has the power. All the player can do … is refuse to sign, and play elsewhere, like European leagues. With the NBA Hawks, Josh Childress opted to go play in Greece for 3 years instead of re-signing with the Atlanta Hawks. The rights holding NHL team can trade the player’s rights, if they choose. Had the Thrashers not made Bergfors a qualifying offer, things would different. But they did, as far as I know. And neither side elected for arbitration. I think someone once said that Bergsfors wasn’t eligible for arbitration, either due to age or draft position. I cannot recall at this precise moment. Basically, folks, the light will illuminate that Bergsfors, if he wishes to play in the NHL, will have to sign his qualifying offer, for a 10-percent raise over last season.
Okay, someone just screamed, “RFA offersheet!” Well, that’s another possibility. Nothing prevents Bergfors from signing an RFA offersheet from another team. However, to the best of my knowledge, no such offersheet has materialized. But per RFA rules, Atlanta would have the right to match any offersheet that might come Bergfors’ way. One last time, if Bergsfors doesn’t want to be here, which isn’t a certainty, then Atlanta should consider trading him. I remain confident that Dudley could find suitable replacement for Bergfors. I really, really don’t like the idea of TRAPPING a player here, against his will. Nobody, I don’t care WHO you are, does their BEST WORK while demoralized. If Bergfors finds himself demoralized, we won’t like the results anyway. Might as well trade him. I have nothing against Bergfors. They guy came here and played capably for us. That’s all we can ask of him.
kracker
August 27th, 2010
9:23 am
You’re welcome. I think that is the situation. I’m sure the posters will add more if there are other options for either party.
You probably know this but to keep the conversation going: If Bergfors does receive a contract offer from another team, the Thrashers would receive compensation in future draft picks. The larger the contract Bergfors is offered, the more and better draft picks the other team would have to give to the Thrashers. Because the compensation scale in draft picks is regarded as rather high, not many GMs elect to raid another teams player.
I get the impression that Dudley would not be inclined to overpay for an RFA by matching an offer, so he might well decide to take the draft picks.
Red Light
August 27th, 2010
9:25 am
In Article 11, Section 11.4 on Rules and Procedures Governing SPC’s, it says the following…
SPC for a Group 2 Free Agent will be rejected and will be null and void ab inition (ie. the Players Free Agency and contractual status shall revert to the status he held prior to signing his SPC), if it is not signed and filed with Central Registry by 5 pm on Dec. 1 in the then current NHL season.
Brendan
August 27th, 2010
9:28 am
Sorry, I misspoke. Bergfors is NOT under contract, but Atlanta does hold his rights, as Sara posted above. Any team that holds a player’s rights can trade them. Even for something as little or inconsequential as “Future Considerations.” Whatever the heck that means.
One of the best deals the Thrashers ever made was trading the RIGHTS to Ruslan Zainullin to Calgary, in exchange for center Marc Savard. Yes, that Marc Savard. Zainullin, to the best of my knowledge, has never set foot in the NHL.
kracker
August 27th, 2010
9:29 am
My eyes glaze over and begin rolling up in my head when portions of the CBA are posted….
Brendan
August 27th, 2010
9:35 am
TableHockey, I think Kracker is right. Dudley is NOT apt to overpay for a player by matching. I think he’d opt for the draft picks. Of course, Dudley can then use those very draft picks to trade with NJ for Travis Zajack, if the Devils re-sign Kovy, and are forced to move players.
Zombie Steve
August 27th, 2010
9:39 am
No doubt, rythempenguin. I always like watching Flyers games for that reason; they smack the crap out of other teams.
kracker
August 27th, 2010
9:42 am
New C Viv blog — ajcthrashers New Thrashers blog posted. Nik Antropov progressing after offseason hip surgery. http://bit.ly/9s2KvG
Brendan
August 27th, 2010
9:45 am
Red Light, or whomever, what’s the very latest draft pick compensation for RFAs? I can’t remember how it breaks down. It used to be that for a $1 million or less, you got like a 3rd round pick. And $2.5 million got you a 1st and a 3rd. And if the contract was over $5 million-a-year, you got 4 first round draft picks. I know, that in theory, that sounds ridiculous. Who, in their right mind, would cough up 4 first round picks! But if you’re a contender, those are ‘throw-away’ picks at #28, #29, #30 … that aren’t likely to materialize into anything anyway. So, why not do it?, if you really think the rights holding team won’t match it. Now, that wouldn’t apply to Bergsfors, who is nowhere near a $5 million-a-year type player. But I’m kinda thinking we’d get a 1st and 3rd, maybe … maybe a 2nd rounder, if the offer-making team lost their head about Bergfors’ salary.
Brendan
August 27th, 2010
9:47 am
Trixie, my post about RFA compensation is in the SPAM filters. Basically, I ask the bloggers if they know what the current rate of RFA compensation is, for salary tendered, to the rights holding team.
Rhythmpenguin
August 27th, 2010
9:48 am
Since we now have Buff (and they still have Pronger) the Thrashers Flyers rivalry is going to be even better! =)
Smoothie
August 27th, 2010
9:48 am
Some really good stuff here from many of our regulars, but I think any talk of Bergy not wanting to be here is waaay premature. We have not heard anything from him nor his agent about being unsatisfied w/ ATL.
He knows that he is going to be a key, integral piece going forward and his agent is simply doing his “due diligence” in a fickle marketplace in which several good young RFAs have yet to sign the dotted line.
I think worse case scenario is that he ends up signing a 2-yr deal rather than 3 if he can’t get the $ he wants which is probably in the realm of $2.5 to $3 M per annum. Dudley is a stubborn SOB and will not overpay a young, unproven player.
His 2 year deal will likely be for $2.25 to $2.5M. This may just take a little while longer since he is a traded asset and doesn’t feel the same loyalty he would to New Jersey since they drafted him. He has a little more leverag than Duds would like to admit and is simply trying to use it.
No reason to start worrying, yet. Give it till Labor Day and then hit the panic button.
Sara
August 27th, 2010
9:49 am
Out of curiosity, does anyone know who Bergfors’ agent is?
JPinChi
August 27th, 2010
9:54 am
@GaVaHokie: You like the idea about having a defenseman crash the net while having a forward drop back to cover D? Isn’t that what the last coach tried to do, but none of the players adopted this method?
Red Light
August 27th, 2010
9:54 am
JP Barry
rogan
August 27th, 2010
9:56 am
dudley is f.ck.ng lyar! :@ 05.04.10. in thrashers site’s article “Rick Dudley Q&A- Part 2″ he said:
“Kulda can play in the National Hockey League now(..). We have to give Kulda a chance to do that because he can”.
…
and now we listen, that arturs must return to chicago wolwes.
wtf?!! :@
Rawhide
August 27th, 2010
9:58 am
Rawhide, How many times in past summers have there been over 200 responses to your blogs? All I know there has been a lot more excitement regarding the Thrashers this past summer than in the past.
Smitty – It’s happen a number of times in the past, but last summer I may have only posted 2 or 3 times a week during late July and August. But to answer your question in better perspective, consider that last offseason an average of 376 comments were posted per week. This offseason it’s been right at 510….645 since 7/1. Lot’s of new people posting too, which is a nice thing to see.
Plus the blog’s page view numbers have been at their highest levels ever. I got a call from my online editor a couple weeks back asking just what the heck is going on with the team to cause such numbers in the dead of summer?
There is indeed a buzz around these parts that hasn’t been present since … oh…coming out of the lockout. Not just here and on C-Viv’s blogs, but all over the Thrasherville Blogosphere. From what I understand, ticket sales are up over last year too…so that’s a good thing.
Now, all the team has to do is backup the hype.
Red Light
August 27th, 2010
10:10 am
The same JP Barry who represents Heatley, Malkin, Crosby, P. Kane, E. Johnson, Doan, Streit, the Sedins, Alfredsson, Briere and Toews. CAA has an office in Stockholm!
Rawhide
August 27th, 2010
10:16 am
Speaking of ticket sales, this from KuklasKorner:
“Blackhawks regular season home opener against Wings- Tickets ranging from $122 for standing room to $900. Raise the banner”
Wow…
Smoothie
August 27th, 2010
10:20 am
R/L – phew! Thought you typed “Kane, E.” but I looked at that wrong. So glad its P. Kane and E. Johnson…feel better now. Not that I think we’re in for a holdout, but I don’t like seeing Bergy’s agent the same as the rep for Heatley.
Jim Friendly
August 27th, 2010
10:22 am
Gee, no playoffs again this coming season, sour, sour vibe and nothing to help score goals. Still a ship sinking to the bottom, just has not hit bottom yet. Season opener, Washington 7 Atlanta 1. Sorry
SomaAtl95
August 27th, 2010
10:27 am
… and cue the troll alert…
SomaAtl95
August 27th, 2010
10:30 am
That is really funny Jim Friendly, last season opener against the Caps (oct 10, 2008) we won 7 – 4. Don’t raise the cup in DC quite yet…
Red Light
August 27th, 2010
10:36 am
Don Meehan is Evander Kane’s agent
Dwayne
August 27th, 2010
11:21 am
I thought Don McLean was his agaent.
Dwayne
August 27th, 2010
11:25 am
Smitty, some people just blog to hear themselves… type?
Never add anything important.
GaVaHokie
August 27th, 2010
11:37 am
JPinChi… I know, I know… but get ready. Ramsay said he wants an up-tempo style of play. So, don’t be surprised when the defenseman get the “green light”.
I’m not talking every play… I’m saying “sneak it in” every once in awhile. As long as it’s a designed play, and everyone is aware it’s going to happen, everyone should know what their assignment is.
World Be Free
August 27th, 2010
12:23 pm
Great to listen to the trolls before the 1st puck is dropped. Training camp hasn’t even started yet and some of you are already writing off the season – please. I am not one to tell you people how to think or feel, I am cautious myself though I have seen alotta good things happen this off-season.
The idea of writing off the season as of today is just plain silly.
The “Sports Vent” awaits you guys.
Get The Puck Out
August 27th, 2010
12:43 pm
I just read that Bergfors and the the Thrashers are” far apart” on the contract talks. You think Duds won’t get ‘em signed?
Joe Friday
August 27th, 2010
1:09 pm
“You think Duds won’t get ‘em signed?”
Nah, he’ll get him signed. But I don’t care much for the tenor of what I’m hearing, especially from a club who has plenty of cap room left, I mean how much can he be asking for? Probably $3m per year, make it a 3 year deal worth $8m and be done with it. Dudley sure looks different from Waddell, but he doesn’t sound much different here (we feel the player isn’t worth this much, blah blah blah). To truly change things up here, more needs to changed than rearranging the deck chairs. They need to start DOING BUSINESS differently. Or the revolving door of guys like Bergfors, Ladd, etc. who don’t want to sign long term deals here and are waiting for their UFA year will never change.
We do need more scoring, to bank on every guy we have potting their career high is foolish. We need Bergfors AND we need another scorer.
Tom
August 27th, 2010
1:24 pm
Interesting tidbit from Yahoo Sports on our old friend Ilya:
Dmitry Chesnokov of Yahoo! Sports is reporting that Ilya Kovalchuk and his agent(s) have given the NHL a deadline to approve one of the many contracts the Devils and Kovalchuk have agreed upon. If the NHL does not approve any of them by today or tomorrow, it is very possible Kovalchuk ends up in the KHL.
add this to the hardline stance by the league at NHL.com:
“Obviously he’s a great player, and we want him playing in the National Hockey League, and I believe he wants to play in the National Hockey League,” Daly said.
“During our arbitration on the first contract, he said as much. His priority is to play in the National Hockey League. It’s the best competition in the world, and he wants to be in the League.
“Having said that, I think it’s very, very important to protect our rules and to make decisions based on our rules. If it means losing a player, I’d rather protect our rules than make an exception for an exceptional player.”
and once is drawn to the thought that if Kovy and his agent are playing hardball to this degree we may see him over in Russia playing with Max. My guess is that this will not make NJ’s owners and Sweet Lou very happy.
An interesting saga that gives us a glimmer into the coming union contract negotiations. I think that Dudley is building a team that is sustainable for the long term. The salary cap is not going up much in the near future and the Thrasher’s will have the flexibility to get the marquis player when they become available.
R. Stroz
August 27th, 2010
1:29 pm
I hear the ASG bird outside my window…CHEAP, CHEAP, CHEAP.
Sara
August 27th, 2010
1:33 pm
I dunno – maybe Dudley’s time in an up and coming Original Six franchise made him forget what happens when you’re the GM of a non-traditional, low-attendance, under-performing market. You want players to play here, it takes a little extra financial incentive. Atlanta’s a nice place to live and all whether you’re a young single guy or married with a couple of kids but there are plenty of other nice places to live that come with teams that win more consistently, have better pedigrees, and more fans that put their butts in the seats.
I admire the sentiment of not wanting to give out foolish contracts and Dudley can’t afford to get too stupid with so many young players on the roster that he’d want to retain over time while having to adhere to internal budget constraints. But until this franchise proves on the ice that they can truly hang and compete, he’s going to have to sweeten the pot from time to time at least a bit.
Darren
August 27th, 2010
1:34 pm
I could be wrong, but I think Larry Simmons handles negotiations for RFAs and such, and has for quite some time. I’m sure both Dudley and Waddell have significant input, but Simmons does the bulk of the negotiating.
Besides, Rick Dudley is no Don Waddell. The man was able to trade Todd White.
Smoothie
August 27th, 2010
2:01 pm
Darren brings up a good point about Todd White. That trade only saved us roughly $1.13 M in cash this season ($2.6 M salary less: Rissmiller ($1.0M) and 1/3 of Brashear’s buyout ($.467M)). Assuming that money was earmarked for Bergy, that would bring his salary to $1.95 M (.818 M + 1.13 M). I’m sure they have no problem paying him an avg of $2.25 M or so as that is only an additional $300 K. That means Bergy’s agent is trying to pry another $750 K from ASG’s tight-fisted hands. They’ll probably meet in the middle and Bergy gets slightly more than Little, whose contract averages $2.383 M per annum ($2.625 M or so).
So there you go, 3 years and a total of $7.9 – $8.0 M just like Joe Friday said above. I wouldn’t call that an immovable contract should Bergfors not pan out as a consistent 25 – 30 goal scorer. There are many a player in the NHL making between $2.5 and $3.0 M who are plenty inconsistent or erratic in their play. Since Bergy is only 23, he has 4 or 5 good years before he is at risk of getting cast aside.
Zombie Steve
August 27th, 2010
2:11 pm
“Rome wasn’t built in a day.”
I think we could all excerise a little more patience here. Dud’s is a shrewd businessman; all the moves he’s made thus far show that he knows what he’s doing. Furthermore, he’s operating in the confines of the Octodouches and Boss Wad.
Rhytnmpenguin
August 27th, 2010
2:27 pm
Right on Zombie Steve
Rawhide
August 27th, 2010
2:29 pm
PuckDaddy’s Greg Wyshynski tweeted that a source of his says the NHL will approve the latest contract worked out by Kovalchuk and the Devils.
No word on $$$ or length of deal.
SomaAtl95
August 27th, 2010
2:47 pm
Boo, hiss, was hoping Kovy would play at home in Russia so we could go a season with hearing about him. Oh well, hopefully we kick his rear end when we play the devils. Kovy, meet Buff. Buff, kill Kovy…
Rhytnmpenguin
August 27th, 2010
2:52 pm
Having Kovy in the NHL is good for us in that it creates cap problems for whatever team (NJ) he signs with.
Alan R.
August 27th, 2010
3:17 pm
and 1/3 of Brashear’s buyout ($.467M)
As a 35+ contract, Brashear’s buyout is the full $1.4mil.
Smoothie
August 27th, 2010
3:27 pm
Alan – correct you are! But only in terms of the cap hit. Isn’t the actual cash buy-out 2/3 spread out over 2 years? I don’t think Donald is going to get his full $1.4 M but I could be wrong.
I’ve been known to “almond” before…just like Tom Gulitti (chuckle, snort, chortle). What?
alex
August 27th, 2010
3:32 pm
buff will kill kovy if he able to chase him, wait a second buff bad skater he could fall when chasing. also kovy for sure get his 40 goals and 80 points and i betcha in hj system he is going to be + player. how many goals and point we going to get from buff. big ???. his record so far been around 34 far not enough to thrasher to succeed
Alan R.
August 27th, 2010
3:47 pm
Now that I really think about it, I’m not sure. However, I’m going to go with “full sum, up front” for my answer. And yes, that is my final answer.
kracker
August 27th, 2010
3:54 pm
Approval probably won’t come until tomorrow is what I am reading.
CraigCustance Got confirmation that a new Kovy deal was submitted and awaits approval. @dchesnokov says approval likely: http://bit.ly/9itTX9
Zombie Steve
August 27th, 2010
3:58 pm
We definitely want the Kovie deal to work in NJ so we can pilfer their talent!! Bring on Zajak
Sports Climax
August 27th, 2010
4:08 pm
Put him on D then have him camp out in front of the net on power plays. You get both assets that way.
Smoothie
August 27th, 2010
4:19 pm
Alan – as far as I can determine, the actual salary payout to the player pursuant to a buy-out is not any different for a player over 35 years of age. The CBA is a beast of a document, but I finally found this in subsection 13(d) of Article 50 regarding team payroll:
(d) If the Club elects to terminate this SPC pursuant to this Paragraph 13, it shall be obligated to pay to the Player, in equal semi-monthly installments, to be paid in accordance with the payroll payment schedule applicable to the Club’s Active Roster, over twice the remaining term of the SPC (the “Buy-Out Period”):
(i) if the Player is under 26 years of age at the time the termination is effective, an amount equal to 1/3 of, or
(ii) if the Player is 26 years of age or older at the time the termination is effective, an amount equal to 2/3 of the total fixed amount of the Player’s Paragraph 1 NHL Salary, for the unexpired fixed-term of this SPC, reduced by any advance payment of Paragraph
1 Salary received by the Player prior to the date the termination is effective.
(e) Upon termination, the Player shall immediately be an Unrestricted Free Agent and shall no longer be obligated to perform under this SPC.
(f) Waiver claim of Player by another Club shall pre-empt and relinquish Club’s Buy-Out obligation, due to failure to clear Waivers.
I’m pretty certain that the over-35 clause was only put in to guard against cap circumvention when a team wants to jettison an older, washed-up player. Thus the full cap hit for Brashear, but he don’t get paid his full salary, which seems fair considering its a form of severance and no guaranty of full pay is given.
Wow, that was fun! I’m ready for a nap! Smoothie out!
rob
August 27th, 2010
4:24 pm
If Buff really wants to play D after getting a feel for winning the Cup by putting his talents to use as a forward…..and if we actually use him as D, I would question the sanity of it. That said, this team is as solid top to bottom as it has been. Not top heavy, not weak at the bottom. Solid D and a good goalie. All the neah sayers can go cheer for the Craps and Ovi, or Cindy and the Pens. I am sure they need more band wagon add-ons……and be sure to come cheer for them when they come to town, I will be happy to be one of the Thrasher fans there cheering for the HOME team.
Lord Stanley
August 27th, 2010
4:37 pm
Once Kovy’s deal is approved, you should see more FA signings, and trades occur. Hopefully the fat last is finally sinigng
Hockey Biltong
August 27th, 2010
5:37 pm
Kill the wabbit, kill the wabbit………………
AtlFlamesFan
August 27th, 2010
6:47 pm
“…that Marc Savard…” And then we let him walk out the door for nothing.
Tom (Capital T Tom)
August 27th, 2010
8:02 pm
Sitting in front of the television tonight I just said to my wife. “I can not wait for hockey to start. Television sucks.”
Just sayin’
Rawhide
August 27th, 2010
8:12 pm
Tom (Capital T Tom) – TV sucks indeed. So, take that pretty bride of yours out to dinner.
alex
August 27th, 2010
8:49 pm
ok dud, you already get 5 nhl proven defensmen and you want to convert buff, that means kulda going back to chigaco and moving postma and zub. further from reaching nhl. what if kulda and zub. feel hope is dead and suddenly decide to buy ticket to russia to play for big oligarchs money (radulov, max,) you going to say good luck, but buff. when contract is over like majority ufa going to say bye to levenson, waddell and company. oops dud probably mandy will be available or lure chelios from retairement.
Hokie P. Clisters
August 27th, 2010
9:13 pm
Rammer has his work cut out for him. I can’t remember the last time we had some many guys competing for spots. I hope Rammer gets it figured out by the end of September. I for one cannot complain about the depth of competition. It’s looks to be the best I’ve ever seen in ATL.
I wouldn’t be shocked if Bergie is asking for 4-5 mil a year. If he was asking for 2-3 mil a year then Duds probably would be quiet and the contract process would be working its way out. Hopefully it will get done. Burma, Cormier and Pettersson are going to push for spots. Unfortunately, Machacek could be the odd man out. Then throw in unforeseen injuries to mix it up more.
Our blue line will have to be dominant for Kulda to be sent down. Sopel is going to have to be ready. Boris is going to have to be a beast. I see Zubs pushing also. Rammer could also nix the defense expirement with Buff after 2 weeks of camp or use him as a hybrid.
In summary, I hope Rammer doesn’t retire after 2 weeks of camp!
SomaAtl95
August 27th, 2010
11:23 pm
Nice to see that we have shed the “Kovy” image we had – this is from EA Sports: http://twitpic.com/2itxc0 It’s nice to see something like this so soon – hopefully he continues to be the real deal!
Tony C.
August 28th, 2010
6:48 am
horrible idea.
World Be Free
August 28th, 2010
7:35 am
Hokie-sounds like a pretty good situation for a new coach, doesn’t it?
Darren
August 28th, 2010
8:58 am
Definitely agree Smoothie on what Bergfors’ agent is probably shooting for. As long as he can be a consistent offensive threat, I’m okay with paying him slightly more than Little.
My guess is Stempniak will probably want a multi-year deal, but we will see what the “value of the player” turns out to be. My guess is a one-year deal for Guerin would be more likely, from the standpoint that it would be in the best interest of both parties.
World Be Free
August 28th, 2010
9:16 am
I think a number of us have agreed on Bill Geurin being a good fit here. He’s a Dudley kind of player, mature guy who could fill in a number of spots.
Term seems to a bigger issue with most of the remaining RFAs. They all seem to want a deal that takes them to unrestricted free agencies when they can cash in. I prefer to see Bergfors beyond free ageny and I agree that he will probably get a little more than what Bryan Little received.
Flagstaff
August 28th, 2010
10:16 am
I’d love to see Guerin or any one of the good Devils here, but the reality is that Dudley has said that he is perfectly content going into the season with the team as it is now. I’d be very happy to see a deal like these go down, but something tells me that that’s wishful thinking.
Rhythmpenguin
August 28th, 2010
10:26 am
Smoothie, do you have a life? Reading the CBA on a Friday afternoon? =)
Darkhorse
August 28th, 2010
10:55 am
Moving Buff away from more offensive depth up front and net presence, further pushing back all these supposed highly touted young dmen in the system that maybe ready to contribute in a 6-7th role? Stupid idea in my book, unless he has a deal in the works bringing in some legit forwards.
As far as Guerin is concerned, I do think he could bring a lot of intangibles here, but if he’s the answer to the 15-25 goal guy for Dudley, then I’m not that thrilled. He’s more the type guy to bring in at the trade deadline for that playoff push, if we even happen to be in that spot.
I still would say to Dudley he’s worked hard this offseason to get the roster in much better shape, but why stop now? There will be deals to be made over the next month, and we seem to have more talent and depth in the system as assets to use than ever before. So IF there is a way to bring in a top line forward and not give away the farm, do it. This upcoming season doesn’t appear to be a rebuild year in Dudley’s book, so why give up on rebuilding the roster at this point with filler guys or too many untested rookies?
I really hope a couple of the guys that have been mentioned off Calgary and NJ’s roster can be had.
Red Light
August 28th, 2010
11:20 am
It’s time to fish or cut bait. There are a number of guys in that 21-25 age range in the system and this organization needs to find out if they can play now. Kulda, Machacek and Postma are examples. Give them a good long look at camp. Give them an opportunity to play regularly and see what develops. They all have two-way deals, so nothing ventured, nothing gained. Cormier and Burmistrov, while I’d love to see them here, it’s not vital at this point, so if they are among the best 13 forwards, then great, if not give them another year to develop.
Byfuglien’s case reminds me of taking what could be a good situation, him at forward, and weakening it. If he’s capable of being a top-6 d-man, great, if not we know he’s a top-9 forward. Nothing wrong with the experiment but if Kulda or Postma are better than Buf on D, he goes immediately back to forward.
Wise to remember that there haven’t been these kind of options around here before, and that means this team is hopefully getting deeper.
Nate
August 28th, 2010
11:34 am
Soma – Thanks for sharing the Twitter pic of Evander. I’m pleased we’ve shed that image so quickly as well.
World Be Free
August 28th, 2010
12:45 pm
Red Light-couldn’t agree more on all counts, the kids, Buff and depth. Bill Guerin reminds me alot of Scott Mellanby at the same point in his career. You are not looking to Guerin for goals, you are looking for toughness, character and professionalism. # 13 has alot of all 3 characteristics, he would be a good signing.
Writers in cities around the league keep mentioning ATL as a a possible destination for some the remaining UFAs, either because of cap space or possible rumors that the team is actively looking to add another veteran forward.
Alan R.
August 28th, 2010
1:23 pm
Posted on Twitter by Nick Kypreos
I can confirm the Leafs have signed free agent Clarke MacArthur to a 1-yr/$1.1M contract. 16 minutes ago via Twitter for BlackBerry®
Brendan
August 28th, 2010
1:38 pm
The Leafs saved $1.3 million off of the the $2.4 million arbitration award. http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=331935
Khabibulin will get six months in jail for drunk driving, while speeding in his Ferrari.
Brendan
August 28th, 2010
1:44 pm
Red Light, Smoothie, WBF, do you think the Devils would do Bergfors for Zajac, as a ’straigt-up’ salary cap move? The Devils would be getting their player back, and improving their cap situation.
World Be Free
August 28th, 2010
2:37 pm
MacArthur will be like Colby-slack off and listen to the Leafs fans cut you in half.
Brendan-to answer your question, I would not make the deal. Not because I do not think it would be a bad trade for either team, I just don’t want to be a team that dumps a guy when you can’t make a deal right away. So many players have left here for a variety of reasons and it’s obvious the Bergfors negotiations have hit a rough spot. But we traded for him, Bergie was the centerpiece of the Kovy deal. Let’s get him signed for 3 years and start to show other players that we are commited to some type of future. Cycling players in and out is not the path to stability.
Get The Puck Out
August 28th, 2010
3:40 pm
Agreed 100% WBF. Stability is what will make players want to stay.
Tony C.
August 28th, 2010
4:04 pm
The other thing that really bothers me about this whole Byfuglien-on-D thing; each time Dudley has mentioned it, he’s also quoted as saying something along the lines of “Dustin really likes to play defenCe”…..
…I was hoping the era of placating certain “big-name” players was over in Atlanta…. Not saying that this is definitely the case, but seeing as we just got rid of the world’s most predictable power-play, I had hoped we wouldn’t be going anywhere near that sort of thing anytime soon.
Brendan
August 28th, 2010
4:30 pm
WBF, I liked the way you explained your answer. You’re getting “extra credit” from the Professor.
HookyBob
August 28th, 2010
4:35 pm
Sooooooooo,..is it too soon to make point predictions for the upcoming season??? Call me anxious if you want.
Brendan
August 28th, 2010
4:55 pm
Speaking of anxious, HookyBob, the clock has nearly struck on the 48-hours for the NHL to approve Kovalchuk’s deal. http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=331738. Why is there no reporting on it??
I’d like to make predictions for next year, but rosters aren’t set yet.
Rawhide, did you want to have a “Guess the Opening Night Budget” contest this year? If so, it’s about the time to start submitting guesses and setting a dealine. Opening Night actually isn’t that far away. We’d also need to designate a website’s number, like capgeek or nhlnumbers, to be our “authority” for the contest. And no, there cannot be any leeway for 9-game auditions, retroactive to opening night. It contest would end on Opening night, for whatever the designate website says is our cap figure. Let me know.
Brendan
August 28th, 2010
5:06 pm
HookyBob, we will be doing the “guess the Thrashers point total” contest. But, we haven’t even had training camp yet. Guesses for that should start in a few weeks. All guess would be due by “puck drop” on Opening Night, for the Thrashers. And not, say, for when the NHL starts in Europe. Last year’s (2010) winner was Pam on Weck, with her guess of 83-points, 3rd in SE division, and 11th in the Conference. Good job, Pam on Weck! The 2009 winner, via breakbreaker, was Don. Note: Glovesave29 also had the correct guess of 76-points, but “division rank” gave the edge to Don. I have forgotten who won the 2008 contest.
HookyBob
August 28th, 2010
5:39 pm
So, in so many (gentle) words, I guess Brendan is calling me “anxious.”
I agree. Kracker’s link to “Caps Insider” (on Viv’s blog) got me wondering if we’ll break 90 points this year,…and so I was attempting to gauge what Mr Tiller’s braintrust thought. So,..to be direct,..who sees us making the 90 points in 2010-11?
One other thing on the Caps Insider I liked was Duds comments about us having more “grit” this year. If you know anything about sandpaper,…I’d say we have moved from 180 to 100 on the grit scale. Love it,…. absolutely love it.
When thinking about Big Buf up front, or on D,…. maybe one factor we should consider is who we’d rather see him “crunching.” He couldn’t crunch Mat Cooke, Steve Downie or Dan Carcillo enough for me,.. but I sure have savored his crunch on ole Pronger last spring. Who would you like to see him crunch the most?
I’d forgotten about the total salary on opening night contest. Anyway, folks start formulating your best guesses. Training camp and opening night are rapidly approaching (but still not fast enough).
kracker
August 28th, 2010
5:56 pm
” If you know anything about sandpaper,…I’d say we have moved from 180 to 100 on the grit scale.” — I agree w/ HookyBob there. That alone is probably worth a half-dozen points over last season’s club. That’s assuming that in all other respects we can match last year’s club. Not sure on that yet, the scoring looks thin and who knows how the D will come together.
Hokie P. Clisters
August 28th, 2010
9:14 pm
Zubs signs for 625,000 NHL or 65,000 AHL. That’s a huge paycut if he lands down with the wolves. That seems to be a strange contract for a Russian player. He’s either really good or overly confident. I know he wants to play in the NHL but….. anyway, I like the guy for having the guts to sign a contract like that. Can/will he void his contract if he gets sent down to wolves?
Does anyone know what his KHL salary was?
Rawhide
August 28th, 2010
9:38 pm
Rawhide, did you want to have a “Guess the Opening Night Budget” contest this year?
Bredan – Yes…you have my official Okee-Dokee to start taking predictions. If I may be able to offer a suggestion, though…make gapgeek.com the source for the official cap number on opening day. That’ll be the number that we’ll use to settle the winner.
Sooooooooo,..is it too soon to make point predictions for the upcoming season??? Call me anxious if you want.
HookyBob – OK…you’re anxious.
However, we will do a “Guess the Thrashers Total Points” contest just before the season starts. Gotta see what the final roster is first.
Brendan
August 28th, 2010
11:01 pm
Well, if I’m reading capgeek.com correctly, http://www.capgeek.com/charts.php?Team=7, as of August 28, 2010, the Atlanta Thrashers’ cap hit is sitting at $43,716,666, which includes $4,7000 in potential bonuses (Bogosian, Kane, and would include Burmistrov’s, if he makes the team). There are some other things you should know. This cap reflects 20 signed players. The Thrashers may have a roster of as many as 23 players. So, factor that possibility into your guess.
Note: This figure DOES CONTAIN salaries for Freddy Meyer ($600,000), and Patrick Rissmiller ($1 million), as well as the buyout of Donald Brashear ($1.4 million). It DOES NOT, however, have salaries for Paul Postma, Kulda, or Bergfors, or Klingberg, Machacek or Holzapfel. Per capgeek.com, we have $20,138,334 in cap space. The maximum guess is the cap limit of $54.9 million. The minimum guess is $43.4 million. Again, currently, per capgeek.com, we’re at $43,716,666 in salary cap payroll. And, that’s important to note. If you’re someone who is taking this contest, perhaps, too seriously, and you start adding up ACTUAL PAYROLL, this isn’t a contest about ACTUAL PAYROLL. It is about the salary cap payroll. I can’t stress that enough. Every team in the league has to operate within the same parameters of SALARY CAP PAYROLL. Several teams spend MORE than the salary cap in ACTUAL PAYROLL, in any given year. That is permitted, so long as their salary cap payroll conforms to the CBA. And no, there will NOT be any retroactive 9-game auditions factored into the contest. In other words, whatever capgeek.com says is our cap hit when the puck drops on our season, then that’s what we use. “It is what it is at the TIME that it is.”
A-hem, however … the point of the contest, strangely enough, is NOT to win the contest. If you find yourself in the camp that is ARGUING over whether your guess was the closest, you missed the point, ENTIRELY, of the exercise. So, I shall state the point of the contest, so that you KNOW … BEFORE you ever submit your guess. The whole, entire point of the contest … is to show you what kind of ownership we have and how committed they are to icing a winner. I think it’s fair to say that budget is an indicator of intent, even though we know that, in the past, before the salary cap was ever born, that teams spent $88 million-a-season in payroll while missing the playoffs for seven-straight years (NY Rangers, 1998-2004). If you’re not comfortable submitting a guess to such a contest/exercise, then don’t. Free will applies. This is something we do for fun, as a discussion group that loves the Thrashers, including their foibles, with a good sense of humor. Participation is optional. Even if you hate the ownership, or the management, you should at least feel a sense of optimisim, and new direction, for the upcoming season, playoffs or no playoffs.
Brendan
August 28th, 2010
11:29 pm
Rawhide, how does September 20, 2010, sound for a deadline for guesses? Also, do you want to make this a “one guess, no revisions of the guess” exercise? In other words, you cannot guess $43.9 million, then change it on September 19, 2010, to $49 million, to reflect the latest roster cuts/changes? In the past, we allowed posters to change their guesses as often as they liked, without being ridiculous about it. (4-5 changes.) Want to go with a “one guess, only” approach this year?
Ummn, I guess we should also state that Atlanta Spirit, LLC employees, or anyone else having “unfair, insider advantage” knowledge about the budget is eligible for guesses that count in the contest/exercise.
Oh, and finally, of course, R.Stroztradamus … will be the only poster allowed to make a guess … AFTER … puck drop of Opening Night. But the catch is … he has to be correct with his contest entry. I think R.Strozatradamus would agree to these terms and conditions.
Budder
August 29th, 2010
8:43 am
HookyBob said…Who would you like to see him [Byfuglien] crunch the most?
Let me be first in line to nominate Eight – Alex the Great – Ovechkin, who desperately needs to learn that cheap shots will earn you a target on your back.
Rhythmpenguin
August 29th, 2010
8:56 am
HookyBob said…Who would you like to see him [Byfuglien] crunch the most?
Definitely should be Cindy Crotchby.
Red Light
August 29th, 2010
9:02 am
Brendan: This might come a shock, but the Devils would never make that deal. Zajac is 25, has missed just two games in four NHL seasons, is a fine two-way player, improves every year and is coming off his best season. He is a decent value.
All the Devils have to do for cap relief is the same thing the Rangers and others are likely to do, waive a high-paid vet (Rolston) and send them to the AHL.
Rightshot
August 29th, 2010
9:05 am
Excuse me for chiming in so late. Could Duds be talking with Stepniak incase the negations with Bergy falls though? just curious.
Red Light
August 29th, 2010
9:10 am
Tampa Bay is going to be tough to handle this season barring injuries. I know this blog says it’s all about their poor goaltending, but their roster is very much improved over last season. I look for them to make a huge jump in the standings and for Yzerman to extend Stamkos’ contract (RFA) during the season.
Carolina needs to sign one more forward. Sound familiar?
Red Light
August 29th, 2010
9:31 am
Bergfors will sign. Just a matter of when and for how long.
World Be Free
August 29th, 2010
9:48 am
I agree with R/L, Bergie will be here opening night.
$50M has always been my opening night budget, I stand by this number. Stempniak remains unsigned by everyone, which means value assessment differs from all the GMs around the league.
Rhythmpenguin
August 29th, 2010
10:02 am
Red Light, why do you think Bergfors sighing is a definite?
World Be Free
August 29th, 2010
11:21 am
Rhy-there has been no indication from Bergfors’ camp that he doesn’t want to play here. Term (years) does not seem to be an issue. The issue is the value of the player, whether it be for the lenghth of the deal or on a per season basis. I am certain Dudley does not want to overvalue the player, making it difficult for future negotiations with other players. Overvalue=Brian Campbell. Chicago was lucky to get Seabrooke and Keith in deals, working around the bad contract given to Campbell. Dudley wants to avoid this with Bergfors.
DWTOO
August 29th, 2010
1:16 pm
Rather than waste time doing yard work think I’ll be part of this serious discussion. Outside of holding his breath until he turns blue what options does Bergie have? Overseas? Probably not. Aslo don’t think we’ll see any moves until into training camp. Give the youngs a chance before looking to the outside.
R. Stroz
August 29th, 2010
1:48 pm
Outside of holding his breath until he turns blue
I think we have finally discovered what Believe in Blueland really means.
Brendan
August 29th, 2010
1:53 pm
Red Light, I think you’re right, re: Bergfors for Zajac. But do Rolston, Zubrus, and Elias have “no movement clauses?” If so, they can’t be stashed in the AHL, or “loaned overseas.” If you’re the Devils, you really don’t want to do Zajac for Bergfors. I agree completely. We don’t really know what Kovalchuk just got, in terms of salary. Isn’t the 48 hours up yet????
DWTOO, Bergfors will eventually come to his sense and sign his qualifying offer, unless Atlanta offers more than that. Otherwise, he has to hold out until December 1, 2010. And that hurts not just the Thrashers, it hurts him, too. By that point, he can’t hit his numbers for the year. He’s not playing in any competitive games. In short, he’s got to sign with Atlanta, barring an RFA offersheet. Or, play overseas this season.
Brendan
August 29th, 2010
1:57 pm
R.Stoz, I’m tempted to nominate your latest offering as a “Comment of the Year.” But I won’t, because that one won’t win it. I’m sure you’ll have doozies during the year that top it. Stroz, have you AGREED to the terms and conditions of the Budget contest? You’re required to post your guess, AFTER puck drop, and be accurate about it.
WBF, you’re registered at $50.0 million for the “Opening Night Buget Contest.” I’ll go with … $51.4 million. Even these owners have to get within $8 million of the cap, even if $4,700 of that cap figure is nothing but bonuses for Kane and Bogosian.
R. Stroztradamus
August 29th, 2010
2:41 pm
Brendan – Those are most excellent terms and conditions.
World Be Free
August 29th, 2010
3:02 pm
I really think the Devils are screwed, but I am sure Lou has something up his sleeve. Used to think Lou was the best, but this process of trying to sneak Kovy in the back door sticks. I have lost all respect for Lou-he’s a dirt bag.
kracker
August 29th, 2010
4:14 pm
Bergfors won’t sign anything close to his qualifying offer, nor would he be offered anything like that. A QO, as I understand it, is largely a formality performed by the team by a certain date that serves to say, in essence, that the team has an interest in retaining the negotiating rights with this player. No QO says bye, bye, you may leave now. Nobody expects a player of Bergfors’ caliber to seriously be offered an amount equal to his last season’s salary + 10%. That would be a huge insult and would surely drive him overseas.
I may have it all wrong but any young player that accepts his QO already knows he is a fringe player and knows he will likely always be one. The kind of player that, as a FA, is just happy to play most anywhere as long as it is on a one-way contract. I suppose a late developing D-man or goalie could be an exception….or a very late developing forward.
Just my 2 cents and it may be worth less.
HookyBob
August 29th, 2010
4:39 pm
Many recent articles, and posts, indicate the Devils will be looking for a trading partner if Kovy’s revised contract is approved. Rumors are it will be.
Devils, potentially on the trading block (ranked by age) are as follows:
Rolston, age 37, $5M through June 2012
Arnott, age 35, $4.5M through June 2011
Langenbrunner, age 34, $2.8M through June 2011
Elias, age 34, $5M through June 2013
Salvador, age 34, $2.9M through June 2012
Zubris,age 32, $3.4 through June 2013
White, age 32, $3 M through June 2012
Clarkson, age 26, $3M, through 2013
Zajac, age 25, $4.5M +/-, through 2013
Parise, age 25, is still a RFA at end of contract and not thought to be on the trading block.
If I were Lou,…trading Zajic would be plan “D” at best. So do we have any interest in the others on the list? Would acquiring Salvador allow Buf to play forward? Would Langenbrunner be a good pick up for one year? Langs is cheap, a UFA after the season, and tough (In my opinion,… no soft players come out of the Mesabi area), and could provide great leadership intangibles. Could you see going after these two Devils? Who do we have, that has a low cap hit, that the Devils might be interested in?
World Be Free
August 29th, 2010
5:32 pm
kracker, I believe you are correct especially in your statement about Bergie not signing for anything close to his qualifying offer. I hope he signs soon.
Hooky-makes you wonder why the Devs went out an acquired Arnott. Another old guy past his prime, near the end of the line and overpaid for what he can contribute.
World Be Free
August 29th, 2010
5:38 pm
Oh, almost forgot-if the Thrashers cannot sign Bill Guerin, then sign Scott Walker. Similar kinda player
Thrashers27
August 29th, 2010
6:15 pm
Anybody seen any info on the Traverse City tourney for this year?
kracker
August 29th, 2010
6:24 pm
C Viv said in his blog awhile back that that the Thrashers are not participating in the Traverse City tournament this year. Or maybe there is no rookie tournament there this year, I can’t remember which.
kracker
August 29th, 2010
7:14 pm
Thank you, World. I am sure I am over-simplyfying the RFA QOs as interest in and plans for a young player can vary widely. My main point was that Bergy will sign for a nice amount and tendering QOs are a step the club must take. Wasn’t it last year that the ‘Hawks got into a difficult situation by missing the date for QO filings? Er, make that two points…
World Be Free
August 29th, 2010
8:02 pm
kracker, I just hope he signs for years!
kracker
August 29th, 2010
9:18 pm
Me too!If something is indeed being built here then there is a good chance he will want to stick around.
Brendan
August 29th, 2010
9:32 pm
Look, I’m sure the Thrashers are offering Bergfors more than his qualifying offer. At least, they should. I honestly have no idea what overtures they’ve made, in terms of a firm offer. But if Atlanta simply doesn’t make any contractual overtures beyond that of the qualifying offer, then it sends Bergfors overseas to play, unless he’d actually be willing to ACCEPT his qualifying offer. If that’s what’s really happening, it’s a total embarrassment. But, I don’t think even these owners are behaving this badly. I’m sure there’s some form of legitimate offer that the Thrashers have made to Bergfors. Again, I have NO IDEA what it is … but … apparently … it’s NOT ENOUGH.
Sometimes, though certainly not always, a contractual stumbling block can be immediately overcome by splitting the difference in offers. I’m not sure that would work in this particular case. I have no idea how self-aggrandizing Bergfors’ agent’s expectations are.
Brendan
August 29th, 2010
9:37 pm
I suppose I should add, “or how cheap Dudley is trying to be.”
On the NHL Network, they’ve just aired Game Six of the Flyers vs. Bruins, and are now airing Game Seven. This series was historic in that it reflected only the 3rd time in NHL history that a club overcame a 3-0 series deficit. You might want to record it.
World Be Free
August 29th, 2010
9:52 pm
I still think it’s an example of a player valuing himself different than how his club values him. In addition, Dudley has to gauge this contract up against future deals. What is Bergfors ability to score compared to other players that will come up for contracts on the near future? This is still a low budget team until we can win fans back and raise revenues. That’s how I see it.
World Be Free
August 29th, 2010
9:56 pm
Sam Gagnier resigned with Edmonton for 2 years
Hokie P. Clisters
August 29th, 2010
10:26 pm
Bergfors is in a better situation in ATL (as compared to NJ) and he knows it! He will have plenty of big bodies in front of the net and that should make his goal production increase to 25 +. Bergfors is probably not sold on long term with ATL just like Laddy. Is it more lack of money or our storied history blocking these long term deals? I don’t know – but cycling good players is not a productive recipe.
Duds doesn’t want to overpay for anybody but unfortunately most teams don’t operate that way. You have to be a genuis GM with an expert draft/scouting team to pull that off consistently AND win. However, there are some teams that manage to do this. I wonder if we currently have any players that Duds is willing to overpay for to keep? My guess is NO. Is Duds a genuis GM? We’ll find out soon enough….
js
August 29th, 2010
11:04 pm
The Macarthur signing shows what a farce the arbitration system is. He signs for less than half of what he was awarded?
Hokie P. Clisters
August 29th, 2010
11:10 pm
MacArthur – I shall return to arbitrate again.
R. Stroztradamus
August 30th, 2010
7:19 am
I predict Stempniak will re-sign a two year deal with Phoenix.
kracker
August 30th, 2010
7:30 am
How do you do it, Stroz???
DaveDavisHockey Buffalo native Lee Stempniak signs with Phoenix #Coyotes for 2 years/$3.5M
That is a lot less than was being talked about. Two years at 4-something to come here doesn’t sound too high for him.
kracker
August 30th, 2010
8:10 am
NEW YORK POST: Mark Everson reports “rumors are floating” Travis Zajac could be amongst the players the Devils might sacrifice to get under the salary cap should the latest proposed contract for Ilya Kovalchuk be approved by the league. Everson suggests conventional wisdom suggests defenseman Bryce Salvador and center Dainius Zubrus are the obvious candidates.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: Zajac would be considerably more attractive to rival teams than Zubrus and Salvador but I doubt Devils management intend to move him. If GM Lou Lamoriello is unable to move significant salary via trade he’ll probably go the demotion route. It wouldn’t be the first time he’s done that (hello there, Dan McGillis).
Red Light
August 30th, 2010
8:43 am
Stempniak “settles” for a 2-year deal at $1.75 million per year. At that price, he is much more attractive than the numbers bounced around here. So, the moral of the story is that no team is willing to overpay for anyone at this point, which means there are some great “values” remaining. Gagner’s deal was reportedly for two years with a cap hit of $2.275, which is $108k less than what Bryan Little received.
Bergfors’ cap hit was reportedly $818,333 last season, when he had 21 goals and 23 assists. If logic prevails, he should get twice that amount this year. So, lets say he signs for $1.65 million, $2.35 million and $2.5 million for the next 3 seasons, that would be a $2.166 million cap hit per year, and he’d still be an RFA at the conclusion of the deal. Seems like that might not be enough to appease the Bergfors’ camp, because of the entry level bonuses that are being paid to Kane and Bogo. That’s probably why the deal isn’t quite as easy to complete as we think it should be.
Still, RFA options are limited and he could easily sign another one-year deal and let his season do the talking for him, which is still a gamble unless he puts up similar or better numbers than last season. I think we’re looking at a future arbitration candidate if Dudley can’t get a long-term deal signed.
“rumors are floating” on Zajac. Maybe so, but this won’t strictly be a salary dump kind of deal. The Devils will get a lot in return if he’s dealt.
World Be Free
August 30th, 2010
8:52 am
I just don’t see Lou shopping Zajac. He has an aging team and does not need to get rid of an under 30 year old piece of his future. I think the Devils will deal with their cap issues through demotion. The contract he gave Zubrus was just plain silly.
Stempniak gets the kind of contract he deserves for taking “time off” during the last 3 seasons, concentrating the final 1/3 of last season. I am glad he found a home.
Smoothie
August 30th, 2010
8:58 am
Look, Duds gave Lits $2.38 M per year despite legit questions about his ability to produce consistently. There is very little difference b/w Bergfors and Sam Gagner ($2.25 / year) at this point. Hornqvist was overpaid cuz Poile caved early. Duds probably won’t blink first.
Bergy gets $2.25 M, maybe $2.35 per year or he plays in Russia (doubtful). I’m pretty sure transfer agreements preclude RFAs from playing in other leagues unless granted permission.
Bergy doesn’t have as much leverage as his agent thinks he does. I still think we should slap a RFA on James Neal. Worse case is Dallas matches and Bergy blinks first cuz he’ll see Duds aint’ screwing around with an unproven 23y y/o.
GaVaHokie
August 30th, 2010
9:07 am
While I always had a feeling that Stempniak was giving Phoenix every opportunity to keep him, and that he’d eventually sign there, I can’t believe how cheaply… great for Phoenix.
kracker
August 30th, 2010
9:17 am
I’m pretty sure transfer agreements preclude RFAs from playing in other leagues unless granted permission.
I did not know that. Then that is a part of the “restricted” in being an RFA, if it is so.
kracker
August 30th, 2010
9:28 am
Ya know, Stemp, as a free agent, simply might not have wanted to come here for two or three years only to be outplayed by our kids: Little, Kane, Bergy likely. Buff, Pever, Ladd maybe. And a whole bunch of rooks coming on like Burma, Cormier, Holz, Spenser, Petts, Klinger, Paquette, one or two at least out of that group will step up offensively.
Rhythmpenguin
August 30th, 2010
9:49 am
Hopefully guys will want to come here to be a part of this up and coming young team, otherwise we probably don’t want them.
Rawhide
August 30th, 2010
10:02 am
Wow…it’ll be September in the middle of this week. Looks like we’ve made it through another August Thrasherville.
GaVaHokie
August 30th, 2010
10:06 am
I think Stempniak knows he’s in a great situation in Phoenix. Let’s not forget that Phoenix finished 4th in the League with 107 pts… he played a big role, and probably wants to see what he can do with a full season.
Home town discount for unfinished business.
kracker
August 30th, 2010
10:38 am
Works for me, GaVa….Duds could probably have had Stemp if he had wanted him.