Mason tends to save best when called upon most
OK gang, I have a trivia question for you. Without looking it up, tell me how many seasons have the Atlanta Thrashers finished with a 30.0 SA/G or less since the lockout?
I know, I know…most of you in the Thrasherville blogosphere can respond correctly in about 0.27 seconds…but for those of you that haven’t come up the answer yet, let me help you out. Hold up the total number of fingers that you normal display after you’ve been cut off in traffic. Now, take that finger down.
What you’re left with is the answer today’s quiz. Zero…none…zilch…nada…goose egg.
In fact, there has been exactly one time in the Thrashers’ history in which they have had a sub-30 SA/G for an entire NHL campaign. That came in 2003-04, the last season prior to the work stoppage, when they allowed an average of 29.4 SA/G.
Yes, historically the Thrashers give up a lot of shots.
For this reason, most fans in Thrasherville underline the need for a strong presence in goal. When news broke of the Chris Mason signing, most voiced their approval… even if it was coupled with a statement like, “But let’s see how he holds up when force to endure all the shots he’s gonna have to face”.
That’s not an unfair observation to make given the workout a Thrashers goaltenders can expect to get on any given night. As I like to quip, goalies in Atlanta tend to take more rubber to the face then a possum on a Georgia county road…they see more shots up around the eyes then an aging hollywood starlet.
But let’s see if history can be a guide when it comes to forecasting how Mason might hold up in what has proven to be in the past a very busy Thrashers goal. For this exercise, I’m gonna set the bar at 33 shots…roughly the average SA/G the Thrashers have allowed in the five seasons since the lockout.
Mason has played in 63 regular season games in which the skaters in front of him let 33 or more shots get through on goal. His record in those games is an impressive 38-16-9 with a .931 SV% and 2.50 GAA. Seven of those games were shutout victories, including a 47-save gem over Nashville in November of 2008 while playing for the Blues. After turning aside every shot he faced over 65 minutes of play, he then denied both shootout attempts by the Preds…including one by Rich Peverley…to procure the 1-0 victory.
Last season with the St. Louis Blues Mason was 10-3-4 in such games with a .933 SV% and 2.51 GAA. Four seasons ago while with Nashville, he compiled a record of 16-3-1 with a .940 SV% and 2.18 GAA when face with 33+ SOG.
In comparison, his counterpart Ondrej Pavelec…whom hildymac of BWA has recently posted a very thoughtful blog about…hasn’t faired quite as well as his new teammate. Opie is 11-13-5 with a .912 SV% and 3.48 GAA when he’s faces more than 32 shots in a game.
As I always like to point out, past performance does not necessarily guarantee future returns. Plus when discussing the stats of goaltenders, one has to take into consideration where the shots are coming from, rebound control and other factors. But having a man between the pipes who seemingly thrives when forced to face so many shots can only be a benefit the team.
Also it’s worth noting that, unless and until there is another trade or signing, the current Thrashers blueline closely resembles that of one that finished off last season…minus one Pavel Kubina and plus one Brent Sopel. Certainly there is the hope and expectation that Craig Ramsay and his coaching staff can successfully address the SA/G problem that has plagued the Thrashers for so long. But I think it’s a stretch to assume this current crop of defenseman can tuck that number under 30 this coming season.
And if the numbers of the past do prove to be an accurate indicator of what’s to come, then Rick Dudley’s decision to bring in Chris Mason will look all the much better given his ability to perform at his best when he’s called upon the most.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
115 comments Add your comment
Smoothie
July 26th, 2010
12:30 pm
Let’s hope Rammer can help teach the boys better D so they keep the shots down around 30 / game if not lower. If nothing else, Ramsay has proven he can get a team to drastically alter their style of play both in Tampa and then again in Boston. Look at Boston’s stats the year before Rammer was brought in and you see, well, you see the Thrashers!
GaVaHokie
July 26th, 2010
12:44 pm
Great research Tiller!!
localmouse
July 26th, 2010
12:47 pm
For the record, Pavelec’s write up on BWA was penned by hildymac, not falconer. They’re both good, however.
Rawhide
July 26th, 2010
12:52 pm
localmouse – Ouch! yes…you’re correct, my error. I’ll fix the post accordingly.
Apologies to my good friend hildymac
mrhockey
July 26th, 2010
12:53 pm
4th!
Buzzeng
July 26th, 2010
1:00 pm
I seem to recall the beginning of last season, when we were off to a pretty good start despite a lopsided SA/G metric. There was a lot of debate about whether or not to worry about it, and several said that only the win-loss counts. I can’t help feeling that the SA/G finally caught up to us and eventually kept us out of the playoffs. Hopefully, a boost in the net with a stiffer D will compensate this year. Now…if we could only address the GPD…
Brendan
July 26th, 2010
1:01 pm
Rawhide, we’ve talked about GA before. And certainly Shots Against has a correlation to GA. I was a bit ’shocked’ to learn last year’s GA was 256. While the reaction by someone reading this comment outside of Thrasherville might be, “Wilikers, Batman! That’s awful!,” it’s something like 3rd best in franchise history. I’m so used to us being upwards of 280, I had initially hoped we’d get GA down to 250 this year. But now, 250 from 256 doesn’t look like much of a goal to set for oneself. I have revised the ‘wishful thinking’ figure to 226.
If Ramsay and his assistant coaches can get a team defense concept in place for Atlanta, perhaps 230 really is in sight? And if so, this team becomes viable for the playoffs. Pavelec is just 22, and will only get better in net. And if he has meltdowns, Chris Mason should be expected to carry the load.
My wish is 237 GF with 226 GA for this upcoming season. If we get there, noticeable achievement would have occurred.
Dwayne
July 26th, 2010
1:13 pm
74 days till the puck drops for real!!!
hip czech
July 26th, 2010
1:18 pm
Good read here – http://www.fanfeedr.com/nhl/2010/07/26/goal-differential-what-the-non-playoff-teams-must-do on goal differential.
If the above numbers are correct (the +42 difference between last year and this year) then you need to tweak you wish a little bit Brendan…237/226 would only yield a +33.
So how about 240/220…
Brendan
July 26th, 2010
1:24 pm
Hip Czech, your link suggests a +20 differential is what is needed, in terms of a line of demarcation. So, I’ll revise to 246 GF and 226 goals against. But how are we gonna score 246 goals, without Kovalchuk, or three players who’ll replace Kovalchuk’s numbers. We’d have to get a Frolov in here. And if the Kovalchuk contract holds in NJ, maybe show some interest in Zajac in a trade. The Devils will have some cap issues still left to resolve, moving forward.
Joe Friday
July 26th, 2010
1:36 pm
“I think it’s a stretch to assume this current crop of defenseman can tuck that number under 30 this coming season.”
It’s beyond a stretch, it just ain’t gonna happen unless we bring someone else in. Kubina out and Sopel in weakened our D (but saved money). Mason in and Moose out is a push (meaning Mason will give us similar play to Moose’s last year, which was decent). The changes at forward are going to cost us goals, so I don’t see us a playoff club right now. Coaching did improve, but this lineup is a not a threat right now. Let’s pray that there’s more moves to be made once they know what Ladd’s bill is going to be (is that tomorrow?).
Rawhide
July 26th, 2010
1:46 pm
Meanwhile, on “As The Kovalchuk Turns”….
The National Hockey League Players’ Association (NHLPA) released the following statement today:
“The NHLPA has filed a grievance disputing the NHL’s rejection of the Standard Player Contract between the New Jersey Devils and Ilya Kovalchuk. Under the terms of the CBA, the NHLPA and Mr. Kovalchuk are entitled to an expedited resolution of this matter. The NHLPA will have no further comment until this matter has been resolved by an Arbitrator.”
Joe Friday
July 26th, 2010
1:54 pm
Rawhide, it’s a no brainer that the arbitrator will rule in Kovy’s favor, the league has no leg to stand on rejecting that contract given that they approved, Hossa’s, Luongo’s et al, given that Chelios just played at 48 yrs old and Recchi will play this year at 43, and given that there’s no specific language in the CBA to prevent the contract. He’ll be a Devil this year and probably with that contract as it stands.
hip czech
July 26th, 2010
1:54 pm
Zajac would be a nice pickup…another player I’d love to see here is Tomas Fleischmann, has an arbitration date with the Caps coming up.
Somehow I think Dudley gets another forward here. The Bruins, Devils (if Kovalchuk does eventually wind up there), and Blackhawks (still) are going to have to move some pieces.
I disagree that Mason and Moose are a wash…as good a year as Moose had last year I still think Mason will be better.
glovesave29
July 26th, 2010
2:02 pm
Opie is out of control…flopping about and overcommitting as he comes across. Because of that, many second shots are coming from the danger areas as Pavalec does anything he can to stop the initial shot. A goalie who is calm and quiet can control the rebound and send the puck into the corner…thus fewer shots against. The style of the goalie need not matter, as long as the fundamentals are there…Hasek’s flopping, Brodeur’s classic style or Roy’s butterfly – when the save was made, the goalie was squared and prepared. Think of it like a baseball hitter…there are hundreds of different swings in MLB – some hold the bat high, different stance, have a trigger, etc – but as they swing through the zone, the swings pretty much similar. Same for goalies. A panicky netminder like Pavalec can often create his own disasters. The skills are there – let’s see how he matures.
St. Louis – not St. Luis…cmon Bill!
glovesave29
July 26th, 2010
2:08 pm
JF – I disagree. I can see the arbitrator going either way…but the spirit of the CBA was definately violated, and that language IS in the CBA. You cannot puposely try to subjugate the cap. With 98% of the payment in the first 67% of the contract – and with the cap hit at times is $5.5M less than the actualy salary…then yes, the spirit of the agreement is being violated. No other contract is so front loaded or has such a large discrepancy in the hit vs. salary. Plus, the buyout for the contract over the final 7 seasons can cost NJ just $50k for 14 years to buy him out. My guess is the arbitrator will either shorten the contract of increase the payments in the final seasons. Either way, the cap hit goes up and I see NJ walking away.
kracker
July 26th, 2010
2:35 pm
The other end of the ice is just as important in reducing our SA/G average. Maintaining control of the puck through the neutral zone and in the attacking zone would go a long way toward making our defense look really good. How many times have we seen the opposing goalie face 5 shots or less 3/4 of the way through a period? Frequently it’s the first period.
Dumping all the blame on our defensive corps completely ignores our yearly inability to ice a decent forechecking group that can run the cycle, pass in the zone, etc….which yes, does necessarily also include good play by the defensemen on ice for that shift.
Rawhide
July 26th, 2010
2:44 pm
I seem to recall the beginning of last season, when we were off to a pretty good start despite a lopsided SA/G metric. There was a lot of debate about whether or not to worry about it, and several said that only the win-loss counts.
Buzzeng - You remember correctly. In fact, I believe it was our good friend Joe Friday, (then “Bob”), who was among the first to sound the alarm bell that the SA/G problem would eventually bit us in the butt-ox.
Mason in and Moose out is a push (meaning Mason will give us similar play to Moose’s last year, which was decent).
JF – I’m gonna side with the arguement that this was an upgrade, (keep in mind this is coming from a huge Hedberg fan). I think the consistent overall number back that up. We’ll find out soon enough once the season gets into full swing.
A panicky netminder like Pavalec can often create his own disasters. The skills are there – let’s see how he matures.
GS29 – You and I agree when it comes to Pavelec. All the natural talent in the world, but….
He’s still got age on his side and plenty of time to “mature” into the role. crossing fingers
The other end of the ice is just as important in reducing our SA/G average. Maintaining control of the puck through the neutral zone and in the attacking zone would go a long way toward making our defense look really good
kracker - Spot on.
Great research Tiller!!
gavahokie – awwwwxxx shux…’twernt nuthin’.
Smoothie
July 26th, 2010
3:09 pm
Mason > Moose…no contest. I love Moose, but c’mon.
Problem is the number of times our goalies have to face 35-45 shots. A lot of goalies are better when they face a lot of rubber. But a lot more goalies wear down more quickly if they face so much rubber on a consistent basis.
Just for point of reference, last season our average shots against was just a hair over 33 at 33.02 when adjusted to take out EN goals. If this number can just be reduced down to 30 / game over 82 games, that is 240-250 fewer shots. The league avg for SV % seems to be around .910 sooooo, then we can expect a reduction of 20-25 goals.
To kracker’s point, it’s more about the team playing better as a whole and doing what it takes to limit second-chance opportunities or shots to begin with. More puck possession and fewer turnovers = fewer shots on our goalie. But there is no doubt in my mind that we are better between the pipes now than the end of last season. No offense to Moose.
Joe Friday
July 26th, 2010
3:19 pm
“In fact, I believe it was our good friend Joe Friday, (then “Bob”), who was among the first to sound the alarm bell that the SA/G problem would eventually bit us in the butt-ox.”
Yep many years of hockey have shown me that 10 or 20 game segments that are aberrations always get evened out and the odds get you over the course of the long grind of the season, and even though the usual suspects were all blowing sunshine telling me I was crazy to be concerned about it, the proof was once again in the pudding as dear old Mom used to say.
Keep in my mind my point of reference here re Moose. . . Moose had a great year last year, if you’re expecting Mason to be a significant upgrade over the performance of Moose last year, then I guess you can just wait for that pudding as well . . .
GaVaHokie
July 26th, 2010
3:22 pm
I believe the discussion last year regarding SA/G was that it wouldn’t be a surprise with Anderson’s system, because the Defensemen would be joining the rush more often.
Joe Friday
July 26th, 2010
3:22 pm
I still like having Mason this coming two years over Moose, however, as I don’t expect Moose to be able to keep up that great year he has last, in the future . . . wish we had an upgrade in goal, but at least we didn’t step back like we did at D.
“Dumping all the blame on our defensive corps completely ignores our yearly inability to ice a decent forechecking group that can run the cycle, pass in the zone, etc….which yes, does necessarily also include good play by the defensemen on ice for that shift.”
this is a good point. Just today I read an interview Red Light did with Coach a while ago, and Coach says the same thing about pushing the opposing team’s best players back into their own zone and forcing them to play there. Said Mario hated to play in his zone, but that’s what they made him do, good strategery
Jack
July 26th, 2010
3:29 pm
WOW saying Mason is not an upgrade to Moose. Thats like saying spolied milk tastes better than regular milk. Moose rocked but the Mason Patrol will rock the house.
Joe Friday
July 26th, 2010
3:29 pm
“I believe the discussion last year regarding SA/G was that it wouldn’t be a surprise with Anderson’s system, because the Defensemen would be joining the rush more often.”
You may have talked about that different subject with someone, but what Buzzeng and Rawhide referenced above is exactly what we talked about several games into the season and the usual suspects all poo pooed me when I said “watch out, that will bite us over the long haul” and it did. . .
Zombie Steve
July 26th, 2010
3:30 pm
“goalies in Atlanta tend to take more rubber to the face then a possum on a Georgia county road”
Thanks Rawhide – I just spewed coffee all over my monitor. lol!!
Joe Friday
July 26th, 2010
3:34 pm
Johan Hedberg ‘09-’10 season 21-16-6 record, 2.62 GAA, .915 SA%
Chris Mason ‘09-’10 season 30-22-8 record, 2.53 GAA, .913 SA%
If you think Mason is a significant upgrade over Moose’s performance for us, last year, well, don’t cry when you taste the pudding this winter . . .he’s status quo for us in goal
TableHockey
July 26th, 2010
3:34 pm
Apparently Wheeler and the Bruins are heading to arbitration – depending on what Wheeler is awarded with the B’s may not be able to afford to keep him.
I wonder if Ramsey would consider picking Wheeler up?
kracker
July 26th, 2010
3:35 pm
Same, Smoothie. I love the Moooooose but Mason is hands down the better goalie. He’s in Atlanta and not in St. Louis only because the Blues upgraded with Halak. JF defeats his own argument by continuing to stress that Moose had a much-above average year for him (he did.) Mason’s personal averages for a team that has struggled in recent years is his norm. So unless Mason’s performance drops off significantly, and that is possible, we are considerably better in goal.
And not just because Mason > Moose. Almost as importantly for consistency in goal is now Pavs realizes he does not yet possess the working skills to be a #1 goalie. Realizing that should allow him to properly practice and learn from Mason and (factor #3) also from whoever we hire as a part-time goalie coach that should nonetheless be a better coach than was Weeks.
Cornbread
July 26th, 2010
3:37 pm
“I think it’s a stretch to assume this current crop of defenseman can tuck that number under 30 this coming season.”
What is Mason’s record when the team gave up less than 30 shots a game? That is the real number we should be concerned with.
Cutting shots against has as much to do with team defence and the system played as it does who the D-men are. I’d argue more so. I can’t count the number of games I watched last year where the Thrasher D-men would clear the puck to the winger on the half wall only to have them pressured big time because they had no break-out support from the centerman or weak side wing. Or, in Kovy’s case, was skating into the neutral zone before it was 100% for sure that the puck was going to be cleared. This should go without saying but is the leading cause of turnovers, not clearing the zone, shots against, and ultimately goals against.
The Thrashers have most recently been one of the top offensive teams in the league. Where has that gotten them? There are plenty of teams that score less and play a better all around and more responsible game who make it to the playoffs every year. The Thrashers will play that way under Ramsay.
The D-men that the Thrashers do have, even with out Kubina, are solid. Hainsey, Oduya, Enstrom and Bogosian are all capable number 2 or 3 D-men in the NHL. The Thrashers have never had a better shut-down D-man than Sopel (who was also a solid number 2-3 at one time in his career). Signing him made Kubina expendable, as much as that hurt. Still, it’s arguable if Kubina, as good as he is, is a true number 1, at least in the mold of a Lidstrom or Keith, or a Pronger for that matter. Most importantly, Sopel brings leadership and the experience to mentor the PK units along with Bogosian, Valabik, and Kulda. None of these three have hit their potential and in a year or two will be solid shut-down guys themselves.
The Thrashers may not score as much as they have in the past but they are not going to give up as many either. Signing a high scoring winger would be nice but not just for the sake of signing one to score goals who does not fit into the system that they are clearly building. The Thrashers just signed 5 of the most recent Stanley Cup Champions, a proven number 1 goalie, and a respected Head Coach. When has that ever happened, with any team?
The Thrashers are a better team than they were last year at this time. Others will take them seriously for a change.
Cornbread
July 26th, 2010
3:38 pm
Is Kovalchuk the new Russian spokesperson for Direct TV?
kracker
July 26th, 2010
3:39 pm
Sorry, Joe, I hadn’t read your disclaimer on Moose as I typed the previous comment. I’m still happy to have Mason.
Jack
July 26th, 2010
3:44 pm
Mason’s stats slightly better, but remember he played many more games than Mr.Moose
Smoothie
July 26th, 2010
3:56 pm
Yeah, Moose had a career year last year. He was playing above his head. The chances of him maintaining that level of play is higher in NJ where he will typically face 25-30 shots on goal and not an avg of 33. Actually, Moose typically faced closer to 32 / game where as Opie typically faced closer to 35. Don’t know if the difference was Moose’s stick-handling / ability to read the play, but look at this juxtaposition of stats from the miserable month of December:
Pavelec – SA avg of 37.52; SV % of 85.9; GAA of 5.29; 1 – 6 – 0 record
Moooose – SA avg of 28.22; SV % of 91.4; GAA of 2.44; 3 – 4 – 1 record
Talk about your crazy statistical anomalies!!
Rawhide
July 26th, 2010
3:57 pm
Per Kevin Allen twitter:
“Ryan Parent signs two-year deal with Predators for $1.85 million. Yearly salaries are 850K and 1 million”
Midfield
July 26th, 2010
4:00 pm
Cornbread, correct me if I’m wrong, but weren’t you predicting a cake-walk all the way through the first round of play-offs after Kovy’s trade? I mean, I’m all for healthy optimism, but rational people only pop up champaign when they seat pretty looking at the good looking score board.
Cornbread
July 26th, 2010
4:08 pm
No Midfield you are wrong. I maintain that the number one reason the Thrashers were not in the playoffs last year is because of Ilya Kovalchuk. As far as his record with NJ, let me add that I’m pleased with the outcome. The Thrashers got the better end of that trade.
Midfield
July 26th, 2010
4:25 pm
And you’re saying that while praising the trade you did not say that the team was definitely play-off bound? Hmmm…
Smoothie
July 26th, 2010
4:42 pm
For those who would like to see a statistical comparison of Moose and Mason, I present to thee:
Moose – 272.35 games played; SA avg of 29.33; SV% of .900; GAA of 2.93
Mason – 228.85 games played; SA avg of 29.40; SV% of .914; GAA of 2.53
But don’t let any facts get in the way of a good argument. Mason is not hardly an upgrade over Moose.
I was actually kind of surprised to see that Mason’s avg shots faced was as high as Moose’s for his career. I thought it might be closer to 27 or 27.5 due to the time he spent in Nashville. But alas, if Rammer can get this team to where they’re only giving up 30 SOG / gm, then we may end up very pleased with the results.
glovesave29
July 26th, 2010
4:53 pm
If we average 30 shots against per game x 82 games = 2460 shots against for the season. Take Mason’s 0.014 better SPG and that comes to 34 fewer goals against per season.
We all liked Moose and wish him well. Last year was a career year for him and he parlayed it into a nice contact with the Devils…good for him. Mason is DEFINATELY an upgrade over Moose.
Smoothie
July 26th, 2010
5:01 pm
gs29 – I’d be happy with just a 1% improvement without the 4 thousandths on the .914 as he will likely face a slightly heavier work-load playing for the Thrashers. Even at an avg of 31, that’s a potential improvement of 25 fewer goals. Of course, Pavelec will be playing for 25-30 of these so….who knows?
Barry
July 26th, 2010
6:03 pm
The more I read about Mason the more I’m glad he’s our #1 goalie. We have been needing a solid somewhat veteran goalie for a while who can be a #1. Nothing against Moose but he’s primarily been a career backup. Now I know our defensemen are just about all the same this season I can’t really put the blame on them for the GA/GF differential. For the sake of argument let’s say that Bogosian rebounds and has a good year again. The main issue for a long time has always been the lack of defense from our forwards and the lack of sustained forechecks. If this seasons team along with the knowledge of Rammer and Torchetti can get this team to play a better all around sound defensive team game I think Mason and Pavelec won’t be seeing quite as many shots this year. We can always hope…
Brendan
July 26th, 2010
6:24 pm
I hate to bring this sore subject up again, but Evgeni Nabakov’s cap hit turned out to only be $4.0 million, playing in the KHL. That’s what comes from six years /$24 million. Of course, at 35 years of age, that pays him until he’s 41. I’m not too sure we’d really want to be paying Nabakov much past 39. Looking at the cap space Atlanta has … that contract was “doable.” We had the room. Bygones. In theory, Pavelec, 22 years of age, is our # 1 goalie for the coming years. As such, we really don’t have room for a $4 million back up, for 2-3 seasons. If we had committed ownership, we’d have just signed Nabakov, if his agent didn’t hang up on our phone calls, and bought him out at 38, 39, or 40 years of age. I’m sure Nabby would have insisted on a “no movement clause,” so that he couldn’t just be stashed in the minors. Atlanta could attempt to waive him, in hopes he other team claimed him off waivers or re-entry waivers at half-price.
When I looked at the UFA goalie crop this year, I had my eye on Marty Biron as something “plausible.” I cast glances at RFA’s Jeff Leslauriers and Josh Harding, as well. As well as Ersberg and Quick, in Los Angeles. But, ultimately, Chris Mason isn’t a bad choice. And if Chris Mason had signed elsewhere, I’d seriously be looking at Jose Theodore and seeing what it would really take to land his contract.
Rawhide
July 26th, 2010
6:33 pm
For those of you hopeing for Alexander Frolov to be signed here, this Scott Burnside tweet may break your hearts…
“New York Rangers and unrestricted free agent Alexander Frolov are nearing a deal. Have to work out term”
World Be Free
July 26th, 2010
6:36 pm
Defense was Ramsay’s strongpoint as a player. I would expect his forwards to be more dedicated in the defensive end of the rink.
As for John Anderson’s style, I will go on record right now and state that Anderson will never get an NHL head coaching job again. Anderson’s game philosphies were minor league, his defensive schemes as a team invited 30+ shots/game. So Anderson meets the same fate at Curt Fraser.
Mason is a good choice.
Brendan
July 26th, 2010
6:38 pm
Really, truly, Atlanta doesn’t have much money tied up in goaltending. God forbid a situation where “he who shall not be mentioned” happened, we still have plenty of money to go get another goalie during the season. Boston would love to be rid of Tim Thomas’ salary, which is a downward sliding pay scale, and so would Chicago like to be rid of Cristobal Huet’s contract. Marty Turco is still un-signed. Vesa Toskala … I don’t think … has re-signed anywhere yet. I could be wrong on that one.
Re: Hedberg, I urged that we move Moose, while he had put up such a *gift* of a season for us. His trade value would never have been higher for us. During the offseason, we speculated a 7th rounder would be all we got for Moose, if we dealt him. Certainly, we would have done better than that at the trade deadline. Then again, what message does that send to the fan base, when the # 1 goalie is traded during a playoff run? Well, it would have told me that we sized up the situation and decided to see what Pavelec could do. And if he couldn’t handle it, we’d have our answer, while salvaging an asset in Hedberg, in a year where 8 teams were competing for 3 open playoff spots. If there were 5 open playoff spots at the deadline, I would have screamed if we moved Hedberg. But eight into three sports isn’t good odds. We rolled the dice. We took our shot. It was what it was.
World Be Free
July 26th, 2010
6:39 pm
The Rangers are going to have to move salary to sign Frolov and resign Staal. Redden to the minors is a must.
World Be Free
July 26th, 2010
6:47 pm
Moose will be a great backup in Jersey
Red Light
July 26th, 2010
6:55 pm
I hope Redden takes Rozsival with him! That would free up $10.5 million in cap space for the Rangers. It’s simply amazing how much money that team has wasted over the years, before and after Sather!
Red Light
July 26th, 2010
6:56 pm
Since Moose will only play at most 22 games and Marty 60, both should be better off this season. And, I don’t think there’s any way that Lou walks away from the Kovy deal. That is the true double-edged sword no matter what direction the arbiter takes it.
Smoothie
July 26th, 2010
7:16 pm
If NYR sign Frolov to a deal, should we entertain slapping an offer sheet on Marc Staal just for grins? Drive up the price at least so they won’t have as much flexibility next year when Dubi or Callahan is due? I can’t remember exactly but I think one may be up for a new deal next year.
World Be Free
July 26th, 2010
8:03 pm
Red Light, Smoothie, it is tough to figure out the Rangers’ philosphies on players, contracts and planning for the future. I like Frolov’s skills and wold like to have him here, but the Rangers are missing a #1 defenseman and 2 quality centers. Frolov does not fill a need for this club, he’s just another piece that will be fit in the wrong place.
Brendan
July 26th, 2010
11:27 pm
If NYR sign Frolov to a deal, should we entertain slapping an offer sheet on Marc Staal just for grins?
And to think, Smoothie, with pick # 8, or #12, Atlanta could have merely SELECTED Marc Staal, free-n-clear. Instead, we passed on Setoguchi, Anze Kopitar, and Marc Staal to get the player we coveted all along, the incomparable Alex Bourret. Has he played an NHL game yet?
Joe Friday
July 26th, 2010
11:40 pm
At least Kracker got my point, a few others had a bad case of the Mondays in the reading comprehension department today…
sisu
July 27th, 2010
12:02 am
I think the shots against seemed to come from lack of the first stop last season, Pavs had some super ball material in his pads the way the rebounds would come out. As long as the defensive presence is there to clear the puck the SA should go down. Hopefully Pavs is one year older and wiser and what is the deal with no goalie coach again?
World Be Free
July 27th, 2010
6:07 am
My biggest concern with shots last season was the high number of shots taken by opposing team’s defenseman from the points. I have no idea where the wingers were last season because they sure were not covering the pointmen.
Moose was not our problem last season, so any change of #1 goaltenders is a calculated gamble. Mason will be an upgrade over Moose, if the team in front of him plays better defense.
kracker
July 27th, 2010
7:49 am
The tweets say the Ice Age bid for the Coyotes is in trouble. Does this mean Winnipeg is back in it for 10-11?
World Be Free
July 27th, 2010
7:57 am
kracker-you have to think so. The situation in Phoenix has to be dealt with at some point, this uncertainty with the franchise cannot go on forever. If Winnipeg is the right location, then the team needs to be transferred sooner than later.
kracker
July 27th, 2010
8:17 am
That would be too bad for the fans there in AZ, what with the team playing pretty good last season. Doesn’t Winnipeg still not have a modern facility or am I wrong about that? Well, if the Yotes move maybe that will get the Canadians off our back for a while, though it will probably have the opposite effect.
Dwayne
July 27th, 2010
8:20 am
Does whiny-peg have ki-o-tees?
glovesave29
July 27th, 2010
8:26 am
Winnipeg built a new arena for the AHL Moose…the MTS Center. They are ready if the Yotes need to move.
Red Light
July 27th, 2010
8:27 am
kracker: Winnipeg’s new arena, the MTS Centre, was built in 2004 and seats just more than 15,000. And Dwayne, according to Manitoba Wildlife, coyotes are abundant there.
kracker
July 27th, 2010
8:46 am
The article I read indicates a mushy situation but they are still working toward the Aug 6 deal date. It sounded to me like the City of Glendale may be posturing in the local press for political reasons.
15K seating, eh? That doesn’t cut them a lot of slack. Won’t they need to sell out most games due to not having a lot of big money corporate sponsors?
World Be Free
July 27th, 2010
9:13 am
I don’t know how Winnipeg can support an NHL team based on today’s salaries. They have a 15,000 seat arena, a small city and outlying area. This isn’t a major metro area like ATL, Denver or Minneapolis-cities that lost their original franchises due to poor management but still have the means to support a team. They will always be on the lower end of the salary cap. I am sure the union will not be very happy about that.
Alan R.
July 27th, 2010
10:00 am
WBF, I actually believe Winnipeg can support a team. It might be a small market, but I think they will do well and draw well, regardless of whether they play in the MTS Center, or a brand new facility (that will probably be built later). Sure, the MTS only seats ~15k people, but I’m sure it’ll sell out every night. Especially since it’ll be the NHL’s return..
World Be Free
July 27th, 2010
10:11 am
Alan-I agree with you, I know the people will come out and support the Yotes, Jets or whatever they are called. The new arena is real nice too, so I know it will be an upgrade over the old barn they played in when they were the Jets.
My concern is with the depth of corporate support in Manitoba for buying boxes and supporting the team financially. The Jets were in trouble for a long time before they went to Phoenix. There was an effort to get a number of companies and investors together to keep the team in Winnipeg. That group never materialized, so you have to wonder how much deep pocket support there is for the team this time around.
Winnipeg is a great hockey town, but we have to make sure it is also a great NHL town based on current financial standards.
kracker
July 27th, 2010
10:18 am
This is great!! Twitter (emphasis mine)
BenThrashers I love that Eric Boulton refers to his new head coach as Mr. Ramsay. That’s respect. http://bit.ly/acP7Ws
Red Light
July 27th, 2010
10:29 am
World: I think you’d have to include at least 15 other locations, which may not be “a great NHL town based on current financial standards.” As Smoothie suggested a long time ago, pro sports as we know it is in serious jeopardy due to the current conditions and securing ample corporate support.
J-man
July 27th, 2010
10:41 am
If at the end of the upcoming season Sopel isn’t hated as much as Todd White is now, I will be absolutely amazed. And I very sincerely hope that this will be his only season as a Thrasher as he is not a long term answer for this team. I’m also not really seeing how this roster is going to get those shots allowed totals down, but we’ll see.
glovesave29
July 27th, 2010
10:57 am
Alan, WBF – Winnipeg FANS will support the team. For a short period of time, so will the local corporations. In the long run, the same issues that plagued the Jets will return. The corporate dollars will dry up. The local market, although a hockey hotbed, is just not large enough to support NHL hockey. I don’t want to see any town become a two-time NHL loser…but if the Canadian Dollar ever goes back down to 70% of the USD as it did in the past – Winnipeg is going to be the first to feel the pinch. The 15,000 seating and the 46 suites are so small for an NHL venue, they are at a disadvantage from day 1. While it will be nice to see a former WHA team back in its original home, I just see long term problems…
I think there was a telling story this summer when international soccer powerhouse FC Barcelona needed a bank loan of E155 million. That team prints money (a la the NY Yankees) and they could not meet payroll. We’ve seen the once strong housing market falter…could sports be next? Have we hit the ceiling with salaries and ticket prices? Is it finally time for the salaries in pro sports more closley mimic the “real” world?
Alan R.
July 27th, 2010
11:31 am
Glovesave – I honestly think if the ‘Peg gets the Jets back, they’ll build a new arena. MTS is a good venue, but it’s not big enough.
glovesave29
July 27th, 2010
11:55 am
Alan – I agree. I think they go back too. I just dont want them to fail again. The components are there to lose them again unless they can attract some serious corporate dollars and keep a good team on the ice. Those are going to be some expensive tickets to offset the lack of seating in the MTS Centre, no one is going to want to keep paying top dollar for bad hockey…even in Winnipeg.
Their opeing night would be one to see…Bobby Hull, Anders Hedberg, Ulf Nilsson, Nik Khabibulin, Keith Tkachuk, Teemu Selanne. Let’s hope they embrace their past better than the Thrashers have done.
Brendan
July 27th, 2010
12:21 pm
Pensfan, and any Penguin fan lurkers, I send you sympathy for your loss this afternoon. http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=328652.
Smoothie
July 27th, 2010
12:21 pm
R/L – thanks for the “stick tap” so to speak. Looks like consumer confidence nose-dived again in the month of June. Don’t see it getting much better without jobs growth, which is basically non-existent. And with the upward pressure of half the GM’s overspending versus the other half who have strict budgets, eventually something’s gotta give. The next round of CBA negotiations should be very interesting to say the least. Hope to hell they can avoid a lockout / strike. A healthier, growing economy would surely help avoid some turmoil in 2012.
Brendan
July 27th, 2010
12:23 pm
Thank link doesn’t seem to be exactly taking you to the story. Here’s the nuts-n-bolts of it.
Pittsburgh, PA (Sports Network) – The Pittsburgh Penguins’ longtime public address announcer John Barbero passed away Monday evening at the age of 65.
Barbero had been battling a brain tumor since February 2009.
Smoothie
July 27th, 2010
12:30 pm
Officially official: Frolov gets $3 M for the one year.
Guess we won’t be taking any chances with mercurial Russians this year.
World Be Free
July 27th, 2010
12:36 pm
I am not certain if they can raise the roof in MTS to add more seats, like they did in Buffalo in 1971.
Glovesave-I totally agree with you statements on Winnipeg support, short and long term. And you brought up another point that is a BIG issue, the value of the Canadian dollar. Fluctuation of the CAD and USD has a much greater impact on Canada compared to the same on the U.S.
R/L-my point about Winnipeg goes beyond current economic conditions. We are all impacted by the economy and the rising cost of sports in general, especially pro sports. If Winnipeg could not survive under the old salary structure, then how can they survive under current salary conditions? Canadian hockey cities do not want to just survive, they want to bring the Cup back to Canada. The hockey natives north of the border get restless a lot faster than U.S. hockey fans. How much more can you squeeze out of small city and under populated province?
Putting the Jets back in Winnipeg is like putting a Ruth’s Chris in Adel, Georgia. Neither will be viable in the long run.
Tom
July 27th, 2010
12:37 pm
So we could have gotten Frolov for 4 million for 1 year? I know we could not have hit the NY Rangers numbers because they will provide more exposure for Frolov, but a million bucks is a million bucks.
I am getting the feeling the Thrashers love affair with Russian players is over.
Smoothie
July 27th, 2010
12:50 pm
Tom, perhaps we’ll sign Ponikarovsky since he’s Ukrainian to go with Kazakh Antropov and Arturs Kulda of Latvian descent. Any Georgians playing NHL hockey??
Red Light
July 27th, 2010
12:50 pm
Matt Moulson has avoided salary arbitration with the New York Islanders, as the club signed the restricted free agent forward to a one-year, $2.45 million contract on Tuesday.
More ominous signs pointing to Ladd, Little and Bergfors contract amounts!
If the Peg arena opened in 2004, there’s no way they’re funding another new arena within the next 15 years unless they discover gold underneath it!
Hildymac
July 27th, 2010
12:53 pm
Thanks for the link, Rawhide! No problem with the mis-attribution there… Tim and Aaron get called Falconer too. It’s just because Matt’s that good at what he does – we take it as a compliment.
Anywho, little late to the party over here, but I posted a write up on Masonry at BWA a while ago (http://www.birdwatchersanonymous.com/2010/7/3/1550551/who-is-this-masked-man-what-chris). Watching him in STL the last two seasons has been fun, especially his 33 starts in a row to get the team to the playoffs in 2009. If he gets on a roll, God help Pavelec, because there is no way that the kid gets a start.
One thing about Mason that was an issue last year – and it wasn’t all on him, either (looking at you, Eric Brewer) – was his soft goal per game. Usually it came in the 3rd period after the Blues had fought back to tie and it killed momentum. Occasionally it would come after a mind-blowing save. It wasn’t a problem per se, but it got frustrating for some of the fans up in St. Louis. Of course, after suffering through the injured/underdeveloped/mis-developed/bad goaltending that the Thrashers have, who the hell cares right now?
Tom
July 27th, 2010
12:53 pm
Smoothie, Another Orange Revolution?
glovesave29
July 27th, 2010
1:05 pm
WBF – the disparity between the CAD and USD hits Canadian markets harder because all NHL contracts are paid in USD. The Canadian teams derive income in CAD, as teams based here do not. Today the exchange rate is $1USD = $0.967CAD…so they are at a 3.4% disadvantage today. Doesnt seem like much…until you look at the NHL salary cap – take 3.4% out of that and you are over TWO MILLION dollars behind the US based teams. Not sure if there is anything that can be done there as currency exchange rates are so fluid. The only thing I can think of is for the NHL to get some exemption from state taxes for players based in Canada (players must pay state taxes to the place where the road team is playing for the time they are in that market – to me that is wrong…I don’t pay out of state taxes when I am on a entire business trip!!!) – perhaps that can make the disparity more palatable – thus allow some chance for success for smaller market Canadian teams.
DWTOO
July 27th, 2010
1:27 pm
Does it appear that there are a lot of disappointed free agents out there? I’m sure Frolov expected better than 1 year 3 mil. And Max and Poni remain unsigned. Would have expected them signed by now.
hip czech
July 27th, 2010
1:41 pm
Substitute the words ‘Kovalchuk’ or ‘Hossa’ for Iginla here:
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=29508
Same with Columbus, substitute Nash for Iginla…Alex Burmistrov get here quick!
Frolov to the Rangers makes no sense, at least he is not overpaid like all the over Rangers.
Frolov would not have been a good fit here, and as much as I might like to see Max back for some offense, somehow I don’t think he is going to fit the Dudley/Ramsey mold either. Neither does Ponikarovski.
GaVaHokie
July 27th, 2010
1:53 pm
It’s almost like a KHL “bluff” game is going on with GM’s and Agents. All these threats of players taking more money to play in the KHL?! Frolov takes a 1 year $3 million offer… ha!
These guys don’t want to play in Russia.
glovesave29
July 27th, 2010
2:11 pm
Another funny entry from Sean…
http://www.downgoesbrown.com/2010/07/tips-for-your-day-with-stanley-cup.html
R. Stroz
July 27th, 2010
2:27 pm
PTI – Mrs. R. Stroz is very appreciative of all the thoughts and prayers.
She was doing better until last night, when she decided to move around a little too much. There are some times in life when you know not to tell someonne “I TOLD YOU SO.” Age and wisdom are a wonderful pairing.
Back on hockey, so Frolov signed a one year deal at 3 million.
Do you what sound an Atlanta Thrasher makes? Yes, you already know.
CHEAP, CHEAP, CHEAP.
R. Stroz
July 27th, 2010
2:29 pm
GaVaHockie – What are you going to do in sixteen years when a young man shows up at your house to take your daughter out wearing a Dale Jr. hat and a UGA shirt?
Buzzeng
July 27th, 2010
2:49 pm
Sorry if this is repeat information, but TSN (www.tsn.ca) did a very nice multi-part series on the viability of adding/moving a team to 4 Canadian markets (Winnipeg, Hamilton, Toronto and Quebec City). The Winnipeg feature does a nice job addressing many of the points in the discussion. FYI
Smoothie
July 27th, 2010
2:49 pm
http://twitter.com/DarrenDreger/
Well, so much for that! Poni is off to L.A.!
Buzilla in CT
July 27th, 2010
2:50 pm
clean a gun, tail’em, make sure large family members are at home to greet the Hillbilly trash taking out sed daughter…stuff like that. That is what I am planning on doing in 16 years when my new daughter “tries” to date…
Alan R.
July 27th, 2010
2:56 pm
Buzzeng: They also took a nice swipe at Atlanta in one of those videos.
GaVaHokie
July 27th, 2010
3:00 pm
Stroz and Buzz… I’ll tell them they surely have the wrong house. Besides, I’m not sure how she’d meet such a person in private school.
Buzilla in CT
July 27th, 2010
3:02 pm
Private school? You hit the lottery since I left?
GaVaHokie
July 27th, 2010
3:03 pm
Ponikarovski signs with LA… good, that ends that.
DWTOO
July 27th, 2010
3:04 pm
R.Sroz – Age and wisdom? Guess you’re one for two? Someone had to take the shot!
DWTOO
July 27th, 2010
3:06 pm
Although disappointed I really didn’t the Thrashers would really sign anyone in FA. Disappointing in that everyone signed, outside of Kovy, was within a reasonable figure – no long term overpaid deals.
Smoothie
July 27th, 2010
3:08 pm
Too bad our beat reporter is on vacay…information vis a vis the Thrashers is quite scarce right now.
Shouldn’t Bergfors and Little have LT deals by now??? Heeeennnnggggghhh?
GaVaHokie
July 27th, 2010
3:09 pm
Home Schooling maybe?
Dandylions
July 27th, 2010
3:58 pm
Now this is funny http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzhkPfZwk20&feature=player_embedded
glovesave29
July 27th, 2010
4:04 pm
Stroz, GaVa…my girls are 7 and 8, and already tell me they have “boyfriends”… with Dad being a Tech fan, and Mom’s a Gator…so no one in a red and black “G” will be anywhere near my house!
Totally up with the private school! Improves many times over their chance of seeing some collegiate scholarship money.
I am worried that the Thrash are hoping on lighting in a bottle happening again with a training camp acquisition that gives us what Afinogenov gave us last season. Get Max back on an affordable contract…sign Stempniak and lets get on the ice NOW!
R. Stroz
July 27th, 2010
4:23 pm
Here’s a triple dog dare for some of guys to offer your spouses for an anniversary/birthday present.
http://halfoffdepot.com/atlanta/
Now, for all of you with daughters, here’s some advice:
Upon some young lad showing up at your door step, try the following:
Young man, I hear there is a young lady down the street whose parents are out of town. I’ve heard a few of the young men around here talk about her generousity. Maybe, you should visit her house instead. Now, if you must proceed to with visiting my house, I’d like to show you my vast gun collection. Afterwards, we can all sit down and watch a movie together. My daughter will be watching the movie from her room and we’ll be watching the movie in the den.
BTW, you point the young lad toward the house where the neighborhood lunatic lives that actually has a gun collection.
Back to hockey, the Thrashers are obviously trying to “get by” on a shoe string budget again. What’s the definition of insanity again?
Joe Friday
July 27th, 2010
4:28 pm
I picked something else up after reading Red Light’s article on Ramsay. This makes it sound to me like our hopes for some of these guys like Frolov et al was in vain and the other spots are going to be taken up by Cormier and mabye some other young players we have in the system, and that’s why they brought Ramsay in:
“Dudley believes coaching has become a more important part of the game than ever because younger players are playing more because entry-level contracts enable teams to stay within NHL mandated salary cap restrictions.”
“The reason Ramsay is here is that he is the best in the business of expediting the process. I don’t know anybody like him in terms of what he has done with some young players,” Dudley said.
GaVaHokie
July 27th, 2010
4:39 pm
I’ll tell him he can date my daughter when UGA wins a National Title… that should take care of him.
glovesave29
July 27th, 2010
4:45 pm
Stroz…I am just going to tell any young man who shows up at my door to get one of my girls that “I am not afraid to go back to prison”.
GaVa – HA! Make sure you qualify the championship must be in football!
JF – got no problem with a good mix of vets and younger players. I think we are lacking in experience, and that could bite us in the butt when the grind of mid-week January / February games is at its greatest.
GaVaHokie
July 27th, 2010
4:49 pm
Joe… absolutely. It makes sense to me. We have so many “fringe” players right now. It would be nice to “expedite” guys like Cormier, Esposito, Kulda, Postma, Machacek, Alberts, Klingberg, etc.
As far as being cheap, we probably didn’t need any more signs beyond getting Fredrik Pettersson, now did we?
Not much room for a FA anyway… someone would have to be moved.
Kane Antro Berg
Ladd Pevs Little
Eager Cormier Buff
Thorsy Slater Boults
Pettersson
White
h
July 27th, 2010
5:21 pm
Max, Stempniak and Guerin are all that are left that are worth pursuing on UFA market (maybe Torres) IMHO. Otherwise, really no upgrades out there if you ask me. I say sign Max darnit. 2 years for $3M-3.5M per. Do it. If Poni gets $3M and Frolov gets $3M, then Max is worth same money. I’d give Stempniak 2 years $4M or even 3 years at that money. I really think we need more fire power. Ladd should bump to 3rd line and Eager should rotate with Thor and Boults.
Smoothie
July 27th, 2010
5:50 pm
Interesting line-up Hokie, hadn’t thought of that gritty 3rd line combo. Slater and Eager could be interchangeable on that line depending on match-ups with Slates playing LW and Thorsy sliding over to C on the 4th between Eager and Boults, who will be eager to pound some face when he does play. Against softer teams, ahem! *cough* Buffalo *cough*, insert the “Fly” on the 3rd with Buff and Patrice and let him skate through legs to loose pucks freed-up by crashing behemoths not afraid of bruising an elbow or shoulder when checking.
Isn’t there another buy-out period in August for Charmin? Perhaps we’ll take the left-overs, a la Guerin or Torres, once we dispose of the tissue paper?
Red Light
July 27th, 2010
6:06 pm
Screw the buyout Smoothie. Send him to the Wolves and you save it all against the cap. Can’t wait to see the Todd White vs. Wade Redden battles in the AHL this year.
How do you think all these veterans and free agents are liking the CBA and cap this summer? A classic case of “be careful what you wish for!”
Smoothie
July 27th, 2010
6:50 pm
R/L – wouldn’t it be nice if we had ownership willing to do that? At least with the B/O option, they save $867 k in actual cash, which could make the difference in signing a Stempniak or Max for one season at $3 M as opposed to $2.25 M.
Then again, that savings might get eaten up by Cormier’s, Machacek’s or Burmistrov’s salary, or perhaps the combo of all 3?
World Be Free
July 27th, 2010
7:06 pm
Ramsay is the best coach we have had in ATL so far. Partly because of who he is, his experiences and also because of his relationship with Dudley. Rammer will not get tossed under the Greyhound bus like Hartley did. Add have Torch here too and I’d say we have one heck of a coaching staff here.
Not concerned about losing Poni; I was very disappointed of his play in Pittsburgh, he failed to take advantage of the opportunity with the Pens-in short, he was a bust. Torres is not an upgrade.
As I have said before-bring back Max because he earned the opportunity.
rob
July 27th, 2010
7:29 pm
As for the daughter dating……..my next house which will be built before my daughter is of dating age….will have a gun rack built just inside the front door, right where the little moron will see it first thing when I open the door. May even have a pistol on my hip for emphasis! Woe to he who makes the mistake of honking a horn in my driveway……as he will leave out alone and with a flat tire for his ignorance….HAHAHA
I have said it before….gonna say it again. I like what we have. Another signing just ties up a prospect they want to play here. I think we have enough options that, if one stumbles, there are a few more waiting. That kind of hunger will motivate the guys to play hard. The only signing I have questioned is Bolts. I don’t see him playing much, will he be a mentor and spark when the team falters kind of player? Teach the young guys, let their heart and energy be focused by the talented teaching/coaching staff we have now…..and bring on Oct already! My one concern to date is the lack of goalie coaching to get Pavs to take the next step……
R. Stroz
July 27th, 2010
7:42 pm
Here’s a plan to keep your daughter’s from dating. Just tell them they can date as soon as Waddell is no longer employed by the ASG or the Thrashers.
World Be Free
July 27th, 2010
9:31 pm
I used to tell guys who wanted to date my daughter that I was an ex-Calfornia Golden Seal-they thought I said ex-Navy SEAL which worked just as well.
Rawhide
July 27th, 2010
10:11 pm
Or…you could just do as I did and just have boys!
Well, this blog has fallen off the table. Time for a new one I guess.