The Senior Member Of Thrashers Blueline
On July 1 of this year, Garnet Exelby woke up as a member of the Atlanta Thrashers defense. As we all know, he went to sleep that night a Toronto Maple Leaf after playing in 357 games in Atlanta. At the time, that made him the defensive player with the most number of games played as a Thrasher among those who were currently on the roster. But, now that Garnet is no longer with the team, which defender currently on the roster has the most experience playing on Atlanta’s blueline?
Why, with 164 games played, it’s none other than Tobias Enstrom.
Tobias Enstrom has played in 164 with the Atlanta Thrashers (AP photo/Gregory Smith)
In two seasons played, the twenty five year old is yet to miss a start. He has ten goals as well as 60 assists and is a +9 during his career here so far…last season he was a +14.
The second most games played in Thrasher-blue among current defenders is Ron Hainsey, who played in 81 games last season. Third…Boris Valabik with 57 games, followed closely by Nathan Oystrick’s 53 starts with the team. Zach Bogosian has 47 games under his belt here in Thrasherville and then it falls off to Anssi Salmela with nine.
True, Pavel Kubina…traded in exchange for Exelby…does have 746 NHL games to his credit. 552 of those games were with Tampa Bay and the rest with the Leafs. So, clearly he’s the defender with the most overall experience. However, Toby is the one currently on the squad who’s played the most games with this team.
Now…why even make a point of this? Well, I think it says a lot about just how much this blueline has changed over the couple of seasons. Specifically, since the playoff team of 2007.
When the Thrashers ended the 2006-07 season with a 4-2 loss to the New York Rangers in game four of the playoffs…sorry to re-open that old wound…the six defenders that took to the ice for Atlanta were Garnet Exelby, Alexei Zhitnik, Andy Sutton, Nic Havelid, Shane Hnidy and Greg DeVries, who scored a goal that night which actually put Atlanta up 2-1 in the second period.
When the Division Championship banner was raised the next fall, only three of the above-mentioned members of Atlanta’s defense remained…XLB, Zhitnik and Havelid. By the time that season ended, with a 4-1 win over the Bolts, only Havelid and Exelby remained as Zhitnik sat in the press box.
X and Havs started last October…only Garnet finished.
And then, the turnover cycle of the Thrashers defensive corps was then completed on July 1 of this summer with the XLB/Kubina deal…leaving young Toby Enstrom as the “Senior Member of the Thrashers Defensive Corps”.
Its Only Business
Atlanta Hawks beat writer Sekou Smith posted this interview with the Atlanta Spirit’s Michael Gearon, jr regarding this week’s court ruling and the relationship between Steve Belkin, himself and the other six partners.
It’s “business as usual”, the junior Gearon commented. “”Steve has actively participated in meetings that we’ve had, in which our [general managers] have made recommendations and there hasn’t been a situation where there was contention and we did not go in a direction our [general managers] wanted to go.”
Yup…just one big happy family.
Show Me The Money
According to the Falconer, Steve Belkin could be on the hook for $26 million in cash calls…his 30% share that’s been missed during the on-going legal battle between he and the remaining six members of the Atlanta Spirit, L.L.C.
Welcome back, Steve!
Last week I told you all about the Party Bus event on October 24 when San Jose comes to town. There is now a link to TJ’s site which gives contact information so you can procure your discount tickets to that game, get aboard the bus and be eligible for prizes including a ride on the Zamboni during intermission of that game.
So…here is the link. Hope to see ya there!
Also, Mark mentioned us holding a viewing party there for the November 25 game when the Thrashers travel to Detroit. That will be the night before Thanksgiving…so if you’re planning on being in town, mark you calendars and make plans to join the fun there.
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121 comments Add your comment
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
11:05 am
First!
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
11:07 am
Oddly, while not great, that 2007 Defensive Corp looks great on paper compared to the current Corp.
Still, I have no doubt that this years SHOULD be the best in team history.
R. Stroz
August 20th, 2009
11:10 am
THIRD, or BRONZE
R. Stroz
August 20th, 2009
11:25 am
Although this is completely off subject, I thought this article is just too funny based on my favorite pseudonyms namesake.
http://www.accessatlanta.com/celebrities-tv/jethro-might-buy-119955.html?cxntlid=sldr_hm
RS
August 20th, 2009
11:27 am
To expand on that team turnover theme, I’m pretty sure there are only two players left on the Thrashers that played with Dan Snyder…Ilya Kovalchuk and Slava Kozlov.
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
11:31 am
A Beverley Hillbillies Casino?!
And they thought hockey in the South was a stupid idea.
buzilla in CT
August 20th, 2009
11:32 am
2nd…word
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
11:33 am
I have a feeling Enstrom & primarily Bogosian will set all sorts of Thrasher team records for defensemen. Add Postma to that and we are bringing up some great guys.
GVH, do you really think the 2007 unit looks better than this year? I think this is the first time in franchise history that we have a legit top 4 with Enstrom/Bogosian and Hainsey/Kubina.
BT, on your Belkin note, it looks like another NHL owner from the sunbelt is looking at selling one sports franchise to pay for another – http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/stories/081909dnspostars.4012e93.html
Maybe that $26 mil he is on the hook for can convince Stevie B to sell his stake.
Alan
August 20th, 2009
11:33 am
SIXTH
Alan
August 20th, 2009
11:33 am
Hah. An avalanche of comments came forth. That’ll teach me to refresh before being a smartass.
Nikita
August 20th, 2009
12:18 pm
I guess technically Matthieu Schneider looks better than some of the kids we brought in. But we all know how that played out. We could do a lot worse than senior statesman Toby. Someone refresh my memory — what did we do with Oystrick? I think our blueline success is going to depend on a) how the guys we brought in do and b) how Hainsey does — because I’m not happy with his play in the second half at all.
Rawhide
August 20th, 2009
12:27 pm
Nikita – How the heck you been?
As for Oystrick, he signed a 2-year deal and is scheduled to be a UFA in the summer of 2011.
World Be Free
August 20th, 2009
12:31 pm
All I can tell you is that Jethro’s real life old man was one heck of a fighter. see Cinderella Man.
World Be Free
August 20th, 2009
12:33 pm
Back to vets again-not sure wlch provides the veteran “D” depth we need. Maybe look for another vet on a 2-way contract.
Nikita
August 20th, 2009
12:33 pm
Traveling, alas…I may be rooting for the Thrashers from enemy territory next year. But good.
And thanks for the update.
I’m pretty confused on Valabik and Oystrick. Oystrick doesn’t look on paper to be a great choice, but I like the kid. I like his dependability and mental steadiness, and I suspect he’s a late bloomer. Valabik I don’t know about. I know we don’t want to walk away from such a high draft pick, but I don’t think his mental game is good enough. Hopefully I’ll be proven wrong in the next season.
Smoothie
August 20th, 2009
12:33 pm
Hainsey will be fine as he will be playing with a guy in Kubina who meshes better with his style of play. Boris, at times, and XLB certainly were making things quite difficult for Ronsey and I think he got worn down mentally and physically by January. But I thought he played much better in March even with Valabik (Sabres game on 3/14 notwithstanding) in tandem. Valabik finally started to look more decisive and confident in the system by the final 3 weeks of the season.
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
12:45 pm
EOB… I’m just thinking that Havelid-Zhitnik, Sutton-DeVries, Hnidy-Exelby looked like a fairly sturdy defense on paper. Should have performed much better than what it actually did.
Side note: Amazing how you take Zhitnik out, and there’s not a puck-mover in the group.
We’ll have to see how our Top 4 this year perform first, I suppose… again it SHOULD be the best in history, but again, it’s still “on paper”.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR14hsxNbm0&feature=related
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
12:48 pm
Smoothie… there was a pretty remarkable difference in Hainsey’s performance when he had Liles in the World’s this summer. So, I agree, he should mesh well with Kubina.
ranallo10 (in AT)
August 20th, 2009
1:12 pm
“Hicks built that [franchise value of $273 million] after buying the team for $84 million in 1996 by spending money and producing winners.”
There’s a surprise…
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
1:30 pm
Smoothie, I think Hainsey is great when paired with the right guy. His +/- was remarkably different based on who his partner was. As GVH says I think he will be much better with Kubina.
WBF, we will have Hainsey & Kubina who are true vets. We have Enstrom which as shown above is going towards being a good vet. And then there is Bogosian who plays like a long time vet. Compare that to the Blackhawks who going into last year had Campbell (6 full years NHL experience before last season), Barker (2 half seasons NHL experience), Keith (3 years) and Seabrook (3 years) as their top 4 defensemen. They went to the conference finals with those guys. I am more than happy with our top 4 and then you have Salmela/Oystrick/Valabik to fight for the last two spots not to mention Kulda/Postma for call up games. We don’t need another defenseman on this roster. We need a 3rd line LW and a healthy goaltender or Pavelec to play like a pro.
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
1:40 pm
EOB… don’t forget Welch and Vernace.
Good points about the Blackhawks.
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
1:48 pm
FYI… in case no one else noticed… I didn’t… Clay Wilson signed with the Panthers as a UFA.
So, we only got a 6th Round pick for Jason Williams, losing Clay Wilson for nothing… oh well.
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
1:58 pm
And actually, I believe that 6th Round pick ended up being the “conditional” draft pick in the Schneider trade. I don’t see where Atlanta used it, unless we used it to move up or down in the draft.
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
1:59 pm
GVH, I see Welch as a Wolves signing to help that club. I don’t see him competing for a spot here any more that Joel Kiwi did last year. Vernace I see here even less.
I am not worried at all about Clay Wilson leaving. Given Williams left the Blue Jax they lost a pick and Wilson for nothing, right? And with Eaves and Bertuzzi signing in Detroit who’s to say Williams 1 year deal will be extended? Either way he wasn’t working out here so at least we got a pick instead of cutting him outright. Now O’Dell for Christensen might turn out to be a diamond in the rough type of trade.
Chuck Noland
August 20th, 2009
2:06 pm
WILSON!!!!!!
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
2:08 pm
Should have just checked Wikipedia in the first place…
*The San Jose Sharks’ sixth-round pick went to the Chicago Blackhawks as the result of a trade on June 27, 2008 that sent a fifth-round pick in 2010 to the Atlanta Thrashers in exchange for this pick. Atlanta previously acquired this pick as the result of a trade on January 14, 2009 that sent Jason Williams to the Columbus Blue Jackets in exchange for Clay Wilson and this pick.
Columbus previously acquired this pick in a trade on January 29, 2008 that sent Jody Shelley to San Jose for this pick
So, we get a 5th round pick now in 2010… Chicago drafted David Pacan… keep an eye out.
GaVaHokie
August 20th, 2009
2:12 pm
So, Columbus lost Jody Shelley, Clay Wilson, Jason Williams and a Sixth Round pick for nothing… well, a first round sweep in the playoffs, at least.
World Be Free
August 20th, 2009
2:12 pm
Looking for veteran depth-Welch not enough.
Same case as with forwards-we will need the depth in January and February when bodies breakdown.
Like the Hawks “d” alot.
Nikita
August 20th, 2009
2:12 pm
Actually, we need a 4th line. Our 3rd is more or less o.k., and has two of our strongest and most consistent forward-puck movers. While our 4th has three guys who should expect to take their game to the next level or get replaced by the likes of Josh Gratton.
Nikita
August 20th, 2009
2:26 pm
P.S. I like what we have depthwise in forwards. And if we need a 3rd line LW, maybe Sterling?
I hope we get Machacek into a Thrashers uniform. We need his forechecking game.
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
2:33 pm
GVH, I was trying to follow that trail of picks as well but lost it. The most important thing that I got out of all that was that we got Jeremy Morin for Schneider, or in other words, Morin for Ken Klee. I call that a win even if he is a bust.
WBF, who do you want to sign on D and where do you wan to put them on opening night? Our top 4 is set and we have 3 guys fighting for the last 2 spots. We also have some guys in Chicago like Kulda who are waiting for a shot. I just don’t see the need for another signing on D. Who do you get rid of to make room? Who are you expecting us to sign or hoping that we sign?
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
2:34 pm
Nikita, Sterling is not a checker, we need someone to throw their body around for the 3rd line. I am afraid that Sterling is a AAAA player.
Nikita
August 20th, 2009
2:42 pm
Sterling is small, but scrappy. Anyone who’s reasonably competent should do great with Army and Reasoner. Especially someone with a less physical game, but better sniping ability. Who would you slot in?
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
2:45 pm
I would hope we get a Malhotra or Moore to slot in there or perhaps Kane earns that spot as was previously hinted at. Stuart coming back is another option or even Joey Crabb is better than Sterling for that position. We don’t need a sniper on the 3rd line, we need someone who can pot the occasional goal but be real physical against the other team’s top line.
Rawhide
August 20th, 2009
2:45 pm
Gotta agree with EOB on the Sterling issue. he’s been given opportunities and it hasn’t worked out very well. I would rather see Kane, Crabb or Stewart there right now.
My lineup would look like this:
Forwards
Kovy – Peverley – Antropov
Kozlov – White – Little
Kane/Crabb/Stewart – Reasoner – Army
Boulton – Slater – Thorburn
Defense
Hainsey – Kubina
Bogosian – Enstrom
Valabik, Salmela or Oystrik make up 3rd line
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
2:50 pm
BT that’s exactly how I look at the lineup. That 3rd line LW is still open and then 2 out of those bottom 3 defensemen (Salmela & Oystrick the frontrunners with Valabik competing) will make up the 3rd pair.
R. Stroz
August 20th, 2009
3:07 pm
WBF – Max Baer was a great boxer and could have been one of the best boxers ever. Unfortunately for Baer, he was arrogant and failed to train properly. Braddock took advantage of Baer’s failure to train for the fight.
My uncle is a former golder gloves boxer so I’ve heard about every pugilist’s strenghs and weaknesses from Jack Johnson forward.
Anyway, back to hockey, after watching Morin at propspect camp, I couldn’t believe he fell that far into the second round. The guy has a shot which rivals Kovy in velocity. Morin will give a new meaning to capping a guys knee when a d-man is crazy enough to block his shot.
Smitty
August 20th, 2009
3:21 pm
I do not think we need another defenseman. We can use that money to help sign some of the FAs we will have next year. The defenseman we have now should do and there are a couple waiting in the wings in Chicago.
As for the third line LW, why not give Kane a shot. What better guys are there than Reassoner and Army to help him out.
R. Stroz
August 20th, 2009
3:36 pm
Anyone feel like doing some singing?
http://www.nba.com/hawks/gamenight/national_anthem_tryouts_set_081809.html
Hip Czech
August 20th, 2009
3:58 pm
I also don’t see the need for another D ‘depth’ signing. I hate to say it, but I’m comfortable with the roster as it is, there’s a good mix of veterans and youth…and some size for once. A legit top 4 D corp and I’m OK with the top 6 forwards (as long as Todd White can come close to what he did last year)…let training camp begin.
Not that it counts for a whole lot, but where our fantasy hockey league is (CBS Sports) they have a ranking of the top 60 D men…guess which is the only team to have 4 players in the top 60….yep, YOUR ATLANTA THRASHERS.
Glovesave29
August 20th, 2009
4:04 pm
Stroz – how is Morin’s release?
What makes Kovy so deadly is he deadly quick on the shot release. The shot is on its way before the goalie can get set. Shot speed along will not cut it.
dwayne
August 20th, 2009
4:40 pm
BT, like your line up…. except for Doris and Samella, maybe a veteran to play with Samella.
I have a ? for anyone and all.
Blocked Shots. Why does a d-man get credit for a blocked “shot” if, once its blocked, it never makes it to the net? A shot on goal is not rewarded to a player if his shot misses the net, goalie or post.?.?
R. Stroz
August 20th, 2009
4:42 pm
Glovesave29 – Heavy, quick, and accurate.
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
5:01 pm
Smitty, while my first instinct is to shriver at the thought of Kane playing on the 3rd line, isn’t that better than him playing another year of juniors?
Hip Czech, I didn’t even think of going to my fantasy rankings. I am probably not going to play this year but I still have access to the league rankings for the opening draft. We should be the only team with all of our top 4 ranked high.
Dwayne, I don’t understand your question. Someone shot the puck and it was blocked, ergo a “blocked” shot. If it still hit the net then it wouldn’t be that good of a block, would it? Don’t you want your defensemen laying down in front of the shooter to help the goalie? If a puck is consistently not getting to the net because a defenseman is laying down in front of the shooter, isn’t that something worth tracking? Oh yeah, my money is on Oystrick beating out Valabik.
Hip Czech
August 20th, 2009
5:08 pm
EOB, I think the question was – if a shot that hits the post or goes wide of the net does NOT count as a shot on goal, then how can a dman get credit for a blocked shot for that same ’shot’?
I always wondered why a shot that hits the post is NOT counted as a SOG…how much more ‘on goal’ can you get???
Smitty
August 20th, 2009
5:53 pm
EOB Another year of junior for Kane will not help. He needs more of a challenge. I think he has the size and the competetive edge to make the jump. We get to keep him for a few games before the decision to return him to juniors. Give him a shot even if it costs us a few bucks down the road.
Viking
August 20th, 2009
6:07 pm
EOB and Hip Czech, With the risk of sounding stupid – if I am wrong – “blocked shots” are earned when a player is blocking a shot fired by an opposing player and has nothing to do with own shooting ability.
dwayne
August 20th, 2009
6:13 pm
Thank you Hip Czech, maybe the “stat” should be a blocked puck…doesn’t sound right does it. I agree with the “post” comment, maybe the O-fense is trying to be a little finer with their shots. Maybe cause the goalie has been on a hot streak.
IllegalCurve.com » Blog Archive » Hockey Hits: Heatley to talk on Friday, Melnyk doesn’t wait until Friday
August 20th, 2009
6:26 pm
[...] defenseman on Atlanta who has played the most games as a Thrasher is none other than Tobias Enstrom. Well, it’s not like the team’s defense has been anything to write home about over [...]
Glovesave29
August 20th, 2009
6:31 pm
Stroz – can appreciate quick and accurate. But how can you tell it is heavy without being the one being hit by it?
D men tend to have heavier shots because the puck is closer to the back leg and use the middle of the blade when they fire off a slapper from the blue line. They are trying to keep it low and hope for a rebound and/or deflection. Forwards tend to shoot more toward the front leg and use the toe of the blade to get lift, thus even a hard shot tends not to be too “heavy”
dwayne
August 20th, 2009
6:32 pm
If the “puck” is blocked, how does anyone know if it would have been “on net”? hence, a “blocked shot. Maybe it should be called a blocked….nevermind. EOB…Of course I want my D-men to block the puck. Does anyone have an answer to the question? I was just wondering. Didn’t mean to stump the great minds of hockey.
dwayne
August 20th, 2009
6:35 pm
so if D-men fire the puck and its blocked, its a blocked pass, if someone else shoots, its a blocked shot. What if the goalie shoots?
World Be Free
August 20th, 2009
6:41 pm
Stroz-thanks for the boxing info. Cinderella Man was a great movie, showed what Baer and Braddock were like. I miss great boxing, the sort has had it.
EOB-you know my call the past 2+ months has been for vet help. Dennis Seidenberg is an upgrade to any depth we currently have; I’d even take Hank Tallender cause you and I know he’s available.
Moore or Malholtra, take your pick. Let’s get some vets in here. Cowan to Buffalo, looks like the Sabres are doing the same.
World Be Free
August 20th, 2009
6:42 pm
Nikita-you are singing my tune-we need to get Slater outta here!
Glovesave29
August 20th, 2009
6:53 pm
Heatley is breaking his silence tomorrow – i’d love to hear him eat some crow, but I can’t see that happening.
Sens owner Eugene Melnyk and wannabe owner Balsille are fighting it out in the Canadian media, and it is getting dirty. Gotta love it. Jim is an SOB who plays faux patriotism to get the Yotes to move. Is throwing everyone under the bus, and until now, the other participants have been biting their tongues. Now he’s getting his come uppance, and personally, I think he deserves it.
Jose Theodore just lost his two month old son.
dwayne
August 20th, 2009
7:06 pm
Sad news for Jose, couldn’t imagine his pain. Thoughts and prayers are in order. He and his family have mine.
Viking
August 20th, 2009
7:19 pm
Sorry, my previous answer should have been addressed to Dwayne and not to the respondents of his inquiry.
Again, the defenseman will only get credit for his ability to block shots, not for shooting at a player (unless the puck he shot deflects and hits the goalkeeper or scores). But in so, it is recorded as a shot on goal or a goal.
You know it is August when we have nothing better to write about…
R. Stroz
August 20th, 2009
7:59 pm
Glovesave29 – When Morin missed the net, the puck nearly always hit the boards, not the glass, less than a foot off the ice. I was standing behind the net at prospect camp and whenever Morin’s shot hit the boards, his shots sounded as if they were going to “break” the boards.
I didn’t see the position of Morin’s feet in relation to the puck when he shot the puck, however, his shots stayed low.
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
8:00 pm
WBF, if we sign Seidenberg who do you cut off the team and where do you put him in the lineup? Don’t be hating on Slater, he is a 4th liner, what do you expect from a 4th line center? As for Cowan to Buffalo, they just lost Afinogenov, Moore, Peters and haven’t signed Stafford yet. I wouldn’t send up a flare for a guy that has 81 points in over 400 games.
Glovesave29
August 20th, 2009
8:24 pm
Yeah Stroz, those are just some of the things us goalies have to look for.
I hope he has a hard, heavy shot. It certainly makes things harder on the goalie, especially with rebound control. The only way you can tell if a shot is heavy is to take one right in the crest, or make a glove save. Its the same when you catch a baseball, some guys come in quick and light, some rip your damn arm off even though its not coming as fast.
Dwayne
August 20th, 2009
9:07 pm
So, I would guess some agent come up with “my client blocked 83 shots last year, we want 2 million + per year”. Kind of like that “hold” stat that set up men get in Baseball.
The Earl of Bud
August 20th, 2009
10:17 pm
“So, I would guess some agent come up with “my client blocked 83 shots last year, we want 2 million + per year”. Kind of like that “hold” stat that set up men get in Baseball.”
Dwayne, amen to that. I mentioned Jay McKee earlier and he used that stat to get an overinflated contract worth $3-4 mil/year from St. Louis and as it just expired he was picked up by Pit for not even $1 mil/year. They figured out that you need to do more than just block shots. Andy Sutton was a leader in this category but I would guess if anyone here was watching back then they know that he was also very slow footed. Yeah he blocked shots but he sucked otherwise and didn’t use his body.
Someone like Phil Houseley (I know that’s going back but others who know I am a Buffalo guy will understand) is a great example of a shot blocker who can skate quick and puck handle and be the total package. If you get forwards that are willing to do this when shorthanded it means a lot if you can take away those bombs from the point from guys like Chara. It can lead to a very effective PK%. So it is good to know who is willing to do this but they need to get that big contract on more than just blocked shots.
R. Stroz
August 20th, 2009
10:32 pm
It was probably Mandy Sutton’s agent that tried to sell the blocked shot stat as a positive attribute. A pylon can block shots too.
Wouldn’t it be better if the d-man could actually poke check or steal the puck? Too many blocked shots always seemed like a sign that the d-man had no wheels or burst speed.
R. Stroz
August 20th, 2009
10:36 pm
Glovesave29 – I guess you could say a heavy shot is a real pain(double entendre intentional).
Midfield
August 20th, 2009
10:45 pm
Lets’ face it: our biggest question this season is what our goaltending would be like?
World Be Free
August 21st, 2009
8:14 am
EOB-not sure who we would cut from our current roster. But if an upgrade from your current roster is out there, you sign him and worry about who you are going to cut later. Same as when the Bills signed James Lofton who was waved by the Raiders. When there’s a good player available, sign him and then fit him into your lineup. Bertuzzi is another example; you look to upgrade your club whatever way we can.
This is something the Thrashers do not do, because they have this stupid allegiance to a player like Jim Slater who is good for very little. Moore and Malholtra are improvements over Slater, but they sit out there waiting for a call or pondering offers. Sorry, but nw we are going to get back to the Slater arguments.
I have always liked Cowan; he is a good skater and he player physical. Afinogenov and Peters will not be missed; Moore is still left to hang out there. We can all remember Andrew Peters is the player the Sabres drafted with the 2nd round pick they received from the Rangers for Pat LaFontaine. Patty may be my favorite Sabres player ever!
You guys are right on with your assessment of Jay McKee. His greatest asset is shot blocking; other than that’s he’s not much good for anything. McKee rode the wave to get a nice deal from St. Louis. The Blues and their fans couldn’t wait to get ride of him and his wonky body.
Too bad about Jose’s son; such a tragedy.
Glovesave29
August 21st, 2009
8:35 am
Hold on Stroz…lemme go down into the basement and get on the drum kit to give you a rimshot and crash.
ba doom boom – ch!
Problem with Sutton was is that he would commit to the block and take himself out of position. We’d either get a blocked shot or Kari’d be digging it out of his net. I’d prefer (yeah, well – who wouldn’t, I know) a stawart D man who gets a BS when it happens in the regular course of play ala Scott Stevens. I don’t need a stat hound rushing out to block a shot to open up the middle, to collapse and get the BS and screen the goalie or just cause the D to not be able to leave the zone and get worn down chasing the puck around.
GaVaHokie
August 21st, 2009
8:45 am
Heatley is breaking his silence tomorrow
Yep, looking forward to what the hockey diva has to say.
GaVaHokie
August 21st, 2009
8:49 am
Heatley will be accompanied in Kelowna by agent Stacey McAlpine who says we shouldn’t expect his client to shed much light on why the star winger wants out of Ottawa.
Then what the hell is he going to talk about? The new Transformers movie? District 9?
GaVaHokie
August 21st, 2009
9:11 am
Ranallo… sorry, looks like Marcel Goc is off the market… signed with Nashville for the league minimum.
http://capgeek.com/
The Earl of Bud
August 21st, 2009
10:05 am
“Moore and Malholtra are improvements over Slater, but they sit out there waiting for a call or pondering offers.”
WBF this is where I really disagree with you. If you go sign a guy like Moore/Malhotra to play 8-10 minutes a game (that a 4th line center like Jim Slater plays) when they can be a 3rd line guy on every other team in the league, not only is he going to become a lockerroom cancer but good luck trying to find that quality vet depth next offseason. In 2010 when Waddudley approaches a 3rd line guy, he’s gonna say kiss off because of what we did to Malhotra and sticking him on the 4th line just because he is an upgrade over Slater. You can’t take quality depth signings, only give them 8-10 minutes a game when they can be a 3rd liner somewhere else and then expect them to be happy and expect other free agents not to hear the negativity when something like that happens.
On the defensive side, you can’t go sign a top 4 defenseman and stick him on the 3rd pair and have him sit in the press box for x number of games just because he is an upgrade over Boris Valabik. We would p!ss off every possible free agent for a decade if we did that and have a hard time signing guys after that.
The Earl of Bud
August 21st, 2009
10:17 am
WBF, I just went and looked this up to give you an idea of why we can’t replace Jim Slater with Manny Malhotra. Malhotra played 26.5 shifts per game. He also played a key role in certain situations and led the team in faceoffs. Do you honestly think we can go to him and say “Manny, come to Atlanta and you can have Jim Slater’s spot where he played with Eric Boulton and Chris Thorburn for 15.6 shifts per game and you can lead the 4th line” Would that make you sign on the dotted line if you were Manny? Or would that kill us in future recruiting if we demoted a guy like that his first year here?
Alan
August 21st, 2009
10:30 am
This is something the Thrashers do not do, because they have this stupid allegiance to a player like Jim Slater who is good for very little. Moore and Malholtra are improvements over Slater, but they sit out there waiting for a call or pondering offers.
1. If Moore and Malholtra wanted to come here, they would have been signed already.
2. Everyone picks on Slater while not looking at the rest of the fourth line. Boulton is good for the role he fills, but what about Thorburn?
3. When replacing fourth line players like Slater, you do it with another fourth line player, not with a third line player.
4. Slater fills his role on the fourth line nicely. Too many people look at his being drafted at the bottom of the first round and have these high expectations for him. Face it, he performs his role well, he wants to be here, and he’s affordable. Even he realizes that he’s not a scoring line player, so why anyone else can’t seem to figure that one out is far beyond me.
Now, if he was making $3.5m/yr to fill a second line role and still putting up the same numbers he has, then I would agree with you and the rest of you naysayers. He’s not making major bank, though, nor is he playing on the second line. You realistically cannot expect your fourth liner to put up 60-70pts a year, and everyone who references Slater as some sort of bad player has this sort of unrealistic expectation for him.
Sorry, but nw we are going to get back to the Slater arguments.
Yeah, you did re-open that can of worms. I don’t think there were any logical arguments inside, though.
Nikita
August 21st, 2009
10:31 am
I see Slater’s lunch being eaten by an up-and-comer. Obviously you don’t want to burn anyone out by putting them in an inappropriate position on the energy line, but we have a decent number of young kids whose talents run to grinding — and hopefully some of them will steal a spot on the roster.
IMO, the problem with Slater, relative to the rest of his line, is his age and his having whiffed at so many different levels. He’s failed on nearly every line, as well as the PK and PP. Which might be o.k. if we thought he might open up in the system with a little more time. But he’s a bit old to be not making the grade, particularly given the flashes of brilliance that we’ve seen for fleeting moments at various points. For his sake and the team’s, he needs to sent to another organization. Maybe they can develop him — we certainly can’t. Also, the opportunity cost represented by placing Slater in a 4th line role is immense. His skills, properly developed, should put him on a higher, less physical line. But he’s not good enough to play on those, and of course the coach wants to get as much as possible out of him so he’s also taking up considerable space and opportunity on the PK.
As for his linemates…
Eric Boulton fulfills his role well — he’s the only person on the grinder line who is actually talented as a grinder. He also has a not horrible shot, which has actually shown some development in the last year, and decent speed. That said, when his contract is up I hope we have someone better in his place.
And Chris Thorburn…I’m not sure who he has naked photos of, but it’s evident that the coaching staff adores him and is willing to give him more time to develop. And I’m not sure that’s a good gamble, unless he can advance up the chart and make a more consistent contribution. He’s a poor fighter, which it seems the team is working on. He’s a bit lazy, as shown by his ability to sprint and yet his tendency to lope carelessly about the ice. He has a good, multi-level shot, but has trouble getting to employ it. And he’s subpar (though not as subpar as JS) on the PK, when he rarely is deployed there. Unless he gets a better defensive sense, and more ability to move the puck up the ice, I don’t think he’s a great asset. Because the skills he has are undone by his areas of weakness, at least in his current line configuration.
And that’s the problem, actually. We have overhauled much of the team, dropping those elements that didn’t work for those that do. But we still have the same 4th line, which is by no means exemplary. Is that a deficiency on the part of all three members of that line? Possibly not — it could be a cultural issue, where the line still does what it was expected to do years ago. But if we’re going to have a new era, we need to have a new 4th line. The easiest way to get that is to break up the individual members of that line and see who performs.
The Earl of Bud
August 21st, 2009
10:46 am
Alan, agree 99.9%. The only thing is that I don’t think we ever actually pursued Moore the way we made an offer to Malhotra.
“…his having whiffed at so many different levels. He’s failed on nearly every line, as well as the PK and PP.”
Nikita, can you list all the 4th liners in the league that excelled at every other level? Why do you think they play on the 4th line? Every team has them. Should we put Kovalchuk on the 4th line because after all, he has excelled at so many other levels. Sorry but I just gotta disagree here.
Alan & Nikita, I have seen the posts around here putting the blame on getting rid of Boulton or Thorburn and I don’t disagree. My hope last year was that Hoffman was going to beat one of them out. But that never happened. If someone beat out Thorburn or Boulton in camp this year I wouldn’t complain.
World Be Free
August 21st, 2009
11:18 am
You all know I love to stir the pot once in a while! Glad to see all of your hockey pulses are still intact. I thought this blog was getting boring.
I still think Slater is a stiff; Moore-Malholtra, youi never know, I think some players (i.e. Yelle/Goc) are getting desperate for work and their options are running out. We’ll see what comes in the coming week.
GaVaHokie
August 21st, 2009
11:22 am
We’re not offering Malhotra $2 million to replace Slater on the 4th line… let’s face it, that 4th line is a lock.
There’s one position open, and that’s 3rd Line LW… if Malhotra accepts his contract, I think training camp is pretty much over.
Kovy Pevs Antro
Kozy White Little
Manny Reasoner Army
Boulton Slater Thorsy
World Be Free
August 21st, 2009
12:09 pm
GaVa-I agree with your proposal. Manny would be an upgrade to anything we might currently have ont he roster for the spot you have him slotted for.
World Be Free
August 21st, 2009
12:23 pm
And Dany Heatly is about to explain himself. Who cares what this turd has to say. The only thing good about what he has done this summer is that he’s done it to the Ottawa Senators.
Alan and all-I will not argue as to whether Slater is 4th line material. I frankly don’t believe he belongs in the league! If it weren’t for the Thrashers, he would never have been in the league. That’s why I think you could sign a number of players to replace him and see a significant upgrade. Bolts and Thorny are 4th liners, no argument there. Slater should be in the ECHL with the other stiffs.
GaVaHokie
August 21st, 2009
12:23 pm
And I’ll say the easily forgotten Jason Krog will be the press box guy… so easily forgotten, the main Thrashers site doesn’t have him listed on the Roster or in the System.
The Earl of Bud
August 21st, 2009
12:49 pm
GVH I agree with you 100%. MM is the 3rd line LW which is the only opening we have now for forward, defense and goalie. The reason it turned into a Slater debate was on another comment that said Moore/MM is an upgrade over Jim.
However, the longer we go without signing anyone I wonder what will happen first – 1) one of these guys comes to Atlanta or 2) Kane plays 3rd line LW or 3) one of the Wolves gets a callup.
WBF, don’t stir the pot too much today. It is Friday afternoon and I will unload an arsenal of stats for you Slater haters. Jimmy is doing well for the position he was drafted at (LATE first round) and for a 4th line center. But thanks for getting our pulses going. I’m ready to go watch some neighborhood kids play street hockey at this point just to get a fix.
ranallo10 (in AT)
August 21st, 2009
12:52 pm
A few things I wanted to comment about (and I’ll try to stay away from the Slater conversation, which has been repeated ad nauseam):
1 — I’m glad to hear Goc landed on his feet, he’s a lower line guy I appreciate watching. Thanks for the update Hokie.
2 — Dominic Moore is overrated, especially as “quality veteran depth”. There’s a reason he can’t stick on a team, and if it’s not his ability or lack there of it must be his salary expectations. Either he’s an amazing asset everyone has to have, or for some reason the Rangers, Penguings, Predators, Wild, Maple Leafs, and Sabres all “missed” on their opportunity to hang on to him. Didn’t he ask for an exorbitant contract from Toronto (in my opinion anything above $1.5M is exorbitant for him) after having a CAREER season with them, netting 41 points in 64 games (followed by 4 points in 18 GP with Buffalo)? Over-rated.
3 — If Malhotra wanted to sign in Atlanta, he would’ve put the pen to the proposal and left it at that. If I were in the GM position I would not let someone dick around with a contract proposal for weeks, and ultimately that offer would be OFF the table. If he came crawling back I’d say “sorry, you had your chance, good luck in the 2009 season”. It’s ridiculous to allow Malhotra to sign still if Waddell/Dudley truly offered him a contract (this hasn’t been confirmed outside of the rumor mill, to my understanding).
4 — If Malhotra signs with Atlanta he’d be on the third line, I have no doubt in that. I would much rather have a quality shut down center playing on the third line LW (if Reasoner were shifted to left, or if Malhotra simply took faceoffs then scampered on over to the left side of the ice) than I would have a 18 year old unprepared offensively gifted rookie playing in a checker’s role.
ranallo10 (in AT)
August 21st, 2009
12:57 pm
Rawhide must be hungry today because apparently his blog just ate my post.
World Be Free
August 21st, 2009
12:59 pm
Remember EOB, I said before I am not a stas guy because the only stat that matters is wins and loses. I don’t see how Jimmy will contribute to our future wins but I know he’s been here through the losses.
ranallo10 (in AT)
August 21st, 2009
1:08 pm
“I don’t see how Jimmy will contribute to our future wins but I know he’s been here through the losses.”
The same can be said for Kovalchuk, is that really what you want to imply with your above statement?
Nikita
August 21st, 2009
1:17 pm
ranallo, me too. Hungry, hungry bloggos.
Nikita, can you list all the 4th liners in the league that excelled at every other level? Why do you think they play on the 4th line? Every team has them.
You’re missing my point. Slater isn’t meant to be a grinder — he’s there because he has failed to excel at his natural position and team management likes him. Ideally, had his development gone well, he should fill a role similar to that of Pascal Dupuis. He is fast and has great hands….sometimes. He’s middle-sized, a mid-range hitter, and can be smart in his positioning. But he’s not any of these things enough to displace anyone from a top line. And that’s why, when he has failed to crack the top echelon in his more natural positions for many years now, we shouldn’t continue trying to develop him. Send him somewhere where maybe he can be slotted into a line that fits his talents and will give him room to refine his abilities — that place isn’t here.
As for his linemates:
Boulton is a grade-a pure grinder — his background is full of unspectacular, solid performance as a grinder, a fighter, and muscle. His performance is a little above average, and he’s aging, so I would like to see him replaced with a slightly better and younger player. But I do not have any issues with him holding that spot till someone better comes along. In fact, I appreciate that at this point and with his history he is still improving his hands.
Thorburn is somewhere between Slater and Boulton. He’s biggish, but has never filled out. His positioning is decent. He’s a willing but unskilled fighter. He grinds reasonably but not masterfully. And that’s because he’s also not naturally a grinder and will probably never mature into a really great one. What he is is a big kid with mid-range skills — his hands and speed have improved, but they’re flukey and at some point he needs to prove his worth with more and consistent production. But he’s young, is now under management that knows his talents and knows development, and he may still become a worthwhile asset for the team. In the short term he needs to excel in the two roles that are obviously open to him — grinder and 2nd unit PK. In the long term his ideal position would probably be more like checking line part-time enforcer.
Glovesave29
August 21st, 2009
1:18 pm
Problem with Slater is he is a burner on a line with two crashers. It’s just not a great fit. I’d like to see him where he can use his speed to his advantage, not his detriment.
Not to put fear into the populace here, but the upcoming games in Vancouver have me worried. Kovy being sequestered away for 2 plus weeks with the power structure for Russian hockey. I can see them putting on the full court press to get him to return home to the motherland. Kovy is saying all the right things, but he and his wife are both Russian and his parents are still over there…mighty strong draw.
GaVaHokie
August 21st, 2009
1:23 pm
And I’ll say the easily forgotten Jason Krog will be the press box guy… so easily forgotten, the main Thrashers site doesn’t have him listed on the Roster or in the System.
This has been corrected.
Trixie (Rawhide's Secretary)
August 21st, 2009
1:34 pm
Mr. Ranallo – Your 12:52 pm post has been retrieved from Blog Purgatory.
The Earl of Bud
August 21st, 2009
1:55 pm
ranallo10 (in AT), I was talking to some Buffalo folks about the Maybin signing today and they mentioned Cowan. I said that they lost Max, Peters and Moore or which Moore was the only one worth anything but they replied saying they weren’t impressed with Moore. I have no problem if Waddudley pulled an offer off the table to Malhotra if he sat on it this long.
I think it was Anderson who said Kane can kill penalties and play that type of role so I wouldn’t doubt it that he might wind up there. I laughed my arse off last training camp when he said White can produce the way he did so I am not going to doubt him so soon.
As for your line about Kovalchuk, you totally beat me to that.
Nikita, no player is drafted to play the role of grinder or career 4th liner, they just wind up there. Rob Ray scored a goal on his first shot on his first shift in his first NHL game. There were glorious visions of him having an all-star career. He wasn’t drafted to be the enforcer that he was. Slater is even getting in the occasional fight as well.
Glovesave29, thanks for ruining my Friday with that Vancouver theory.
Sadtoseeitthisway
August 21st, 2009
2:28 pm
Opposing teams like to play against a guy who is a sub-par skater. Just because a forward is in the NHL, doesn`t mean he skates as well as everyone else. I give you Thrasher`s example “A”, Chris Thorburn. This guy wobbles when skating. Always a step slow. Gets to the corners a step late, ends up chasing the play back up the ice. A player with these skills should be very close to losing his spot on the roster. Somehow, the Thrashers feel comfortable keeping this guy for more than a look-see. Minor league hockey is full of stiff RW`s who don`t get a call-up who could fill this role. Why is there such a comfort level with this guy?
Sara
August 21st, 2009
3:01 pm
Speaking of that opening on the 3rd line LW, wonder what Perrin’s gonna do? Obviously he’s still around and training with the guys. Poor guy’s had to eat some serious humble pie – requested a trade – twice – got put on waivers at the deadline when every GM and their brother (sometimes literally) is looking for depth heading into the play-offs and yet not one team picked him up on the way down or back up. And here we are nearing the end of August and he doesn’t have a contract. Little overestimation of the self-worth…though as I recall he was a desired commodity the deadline before that. Personally, if he’d embrace his role of 3rd line LW and PKer, I’d take him back.
Either way, nice guy – hope something works out for him.
Midfield
August 21st, 2009
3:18 pm
Glovesave, about the only reason Slava Kozlov has resigned with Atlanta was that the Kozlovs did not move their kids from Atlanta to Dallas – so I heard from a pretty good source. In Kovy’s case, it will be a pretty strong motivation to stay put as well. I don’t see him eager to book his tax exemption into an elementary school somewhere in Magnitogorsk.
lee
August 21st, 2009
3:34 pm
definetly agree. yes kuby is great, he has played quite a long time. but really???? enstrom is better. kuby is not the assist dude or the i am gonna kill u guy. he’s no zdeno chara.
Brendan
August 21st, 2009
3:51 pm
I hope Ottawa’s GM calls Heatley’s bluff. He indicated, at nhl.com, that he was disappointed that his role was diminished in Ottawa. And that’d he’d like to be better utilized. And he said his trade request still stands, but that he’d like to have multiple options, which he claims he’s never had. Heatley also said he submitted a list of teams to which he’d honor a trade. So, when the Oilers extended their offer, Heatley was suprised … because the Oilers weren’t on that list he submitted. Heatley also said that if no trade materialized by something like September 12, he’d honor his contract in Ottawa.
I hope Ottawa plays Heatley 42 minutes a game, until he collapses. What? That’s giving Heatley what he wants, right? And then, when he again asks for a trade, Heatley can be honest about the reason. And the reason is … because he wants to play on a sure-fire Cup contender.
Brendan
August 21st, 2009
3:53 pm
Eric Perrin probably wishes Waddell had traded him to Pittsburgh, instead of Pascal Dupuis. And at that time, February 2008, Atlanta fans were more eager to keep Perrin than Dupuis.
Nikita
August 21st, 2009
4:09 pm
Sara, I have a deep and abiding love for Eric Perrin and hope it works out for him. IMO, the problem with him for most of last year was how he was moved so often and in and out of adverse positions. And then, of course, he became dissatisfied and his attitude sank him. So…I’d love him on the 3rd line at LW. But I doubt it would happen. And in his favor, before the slump his PK numbers were pretty good — afterward they were average. So…I worry a lot about our PK. I’d think it would be worth bringing in someone who has demonstrated an ability to play on it.
I wonder if the Thrash can Jamie Rivers him? Invite him to camp and cut him loose if he doesn’t work. I’m sure it would hurt his pride, but he has to know he’ll have to earn his way back and I don’t know what alternatives he would have in the NHL.
R. Stroz
August 21st, 2009
4:45 pm
I think the Thrashers marketing department should offer a new ticket package this season, named the Pacifier Plan.
The games in the package would include both games against Pittsburgh and whatever team Heatley ends up playing for. Pacifiers could be handed out at the arena entrances as a promotional item.
rightshot
August 21st, 2009
5:20 pm
Just curious about something. For a while now people have been saying Kane should play the 3rd line. Why? Considering how high he was drafted, why put him in a situation with limited ice time and players that, if the hype is true, are not as good as him? I would think he would adjust to the NHL level with more ice time and playing regular shifts with better players.
Along those same lines, just because Slater happened to be drafted in the first round doesn’t mean he will be an all star, (See Stefan). I think he fills his role well and if put on a better line, 2nd or even third, he would produce more. Would it make that big a difference if he were drafted 31st overall?
Rawhide
August 21st, 2009
5:46 pm
rightshot – Good question regarding Kane and the third line. For me, the reason I would place him there…assuming he is on the sqaud opening night…is because I don’t know who I would remove from the top two lines to put him up there.
Kovy? – No way
Antropov? – Nope
Little? – Nah
Peverley? – Not after how he played since we picked him up
White? – I wouldn’t put him on the third line
Kozlov? – Maybe…but then we break up the one line that was consistent last season
I think if Kane does make his way on the team, he could fit in with Reasoner and Army on the 3rd and the Thrasher go with 3 very skilled lines.
Regardless…kinda nice to have this problem, eh?
Oh, and by the way…100th!
Brendan
August 21st, 2009
6:03 pm
In the end, (Head Coach) John Anderson will evaluate young Mr. Kane and decide what is best for him. (Though Don Waddell will certainly have some influence there, too.) Evander Kane just turned EIGHTEEN (18) on August 2nd. There’s no reason to “rush him” into the National Hockey League if he isn’t ready. I wouldn’t consider it a colossal failure if Kane played in Juniors next season. With or without the 9 game audition. But when he makes it to the NHL, he ought to play Top Six forward minutes, which is the role he is expected to play in the future. I can’t imagine that Kane will be a perennial 3rd line player. And if he is, the scouting Dept. of the Atlanta Thrashers and NHL Central Scouting has got some explaining to do. If he does play one season on the third line, it won’t be the end of the Universe as we once knew it. But it isn’t really, truly properly developing the player either. For purely selfish reasons, I’d like Evander Kane to have a real chance to win the Calder Trophy, whenever it is that he DOES make it to the NHL. And he won’t be doing that (winning “Rookie of the Year”) playing 3rd line minutes.
As for Jim Slater, he is what he is. I think he does an adequate job for what his role is. I’m not overly concerned about his cap hit. If he’s sligthly overpaid for his role and position, it’s not really an issue for a team $8-$10 million under the cap. Nor is it particularly an issue for a team that isn’t being projected into the playoffs, much less in Stanley Cup contention. IFFFFF the Atlanta Thrashers were 4:1 or 5:1 odds of winning the Cup, then yessssss … I’d be concerned that Jim Slater is our fourth line center. But we’re nowhere near that position or level of expectation. A fourth line center can be found in the 3rd or 4th round of the draft. Slater was pick #30 of the 1st round, in the 2002 draft. Picks #16-30 are “crapshoot” picks. Picks #31 and beyond are “shots in the dark.” Hockey drafts are far from an exact science. Martin Havlat was selected 26th in his year, and he is/was considered the PRIZE of the 1st round of the 1999 Entry Draft. Sometimes, that’s the way it goes.
ranallo10 (in AT)
August 21st, 2009
6:13 pm
Nikita — I’m surprised on your 360 regarding Thorburn…if I recall correctly you were the primary defender of Thorburn (along with Klee) last year. I recall you stating that he had the talent to be on the top two lines, but wasn’t being given the opportunity. You also mentioned him not being a good fighter because he was miscast into the enforcer roles along the way, but wasn’t a natural fit (as evidenced by his poor fighting ability compared to true enforcers).
Please, correct me if I’m wrong.
Glovesave29
August 21st, 2009
6:33 pm
But Midfield, you are comparing Kozlov – who was likely signing his last contract, to a Kovy – who could play 10 more years. To move this one time is really no big deal, especially since Ilya has never moved teams before. I personally don’t think he would play in Russia, but I am pretty certain that the officals from the KHL would use the occasion of the Vancouver games to put a heckuva lot of pressure on him to return home. What if Russia wins the gold? What if he’s a national hero for scoring the winning goal? Can you not see how they could parlay this into a signing? I just feel we would be best served by having this taken care of prior to the Olympic break. This will also help EOB to save on medications due to the health issues my original question has caused him.
World Be Free
August 21st, 2009
6:50 pm
Ranallo, please, not Slater and Kovy in the same thought. I normally get your point, but not this time.
World Be Free
August 21st, 2009
7:04 pm
So Ranallo, what do you suggest we do at this point, stand pat?
I never touted Moore or Malholtra as impact players, just good, supportive depth like a lot of the other players that I being signed at this pint in the summer. The issue for me is Slater and that fact that both players would be an upgrade compared to Jimmy. Malholtra would come at a higher price and should be on the 3rd line. I really don’t care what his role was or how many shifts he played in Columbus. We look to upgrade our roster or stand pat with what we have.
Moore derailed himself when he overpriced his services to Toronto. He played well for the Leafs, but not well enough for them to pay him $3M/season. Rumors were he was still looking for big dollars this summer – he has Tanguay’s dollar disease.
We have no idea if Manny received an offer from Atlanta. Speculation is the 2 sides did more that talk. Whether Duds/Don still want to entertain his services is another matter.
Nikita
August 21st, 2009
7:16 pm
You’re correct, ranallo. Though I would characterize what I said slightly differently — my opinion was that under the right conditions, which were that he saw substantial development, he could play on a top line. For last year’s team. He didn’t develop, obviously, and I’m very disappointed with that. And I don’t think on this year’s team he’d have a shot above the third. Slater, if he had developed, could play on a top line based on speed. But Thorburn isn’t as fast or as talented in general — I think he needs to be in a slightly less brawly and slightly more nuanced position.
But…Thorburn may still develop somewhat, and his tryouts on higher lines have been relatively brief. I doubt Slater, with more time and more time on higher lines and special teams, will.
Midfield
August 21st, 2009
8:16 pm
Glovesave, Russia winning the gold in the Olympics would be very cool for Kovy, without a doubt. But it would have no bearing on Kovy’s decision where to make his living – I am quite sure of that. In that regard, his family comes first and foremost.
Rawhide
August 21st, 2009
8:33 pm
Brendan – Excellent comments as per usual, professor. I certainly did not intend to give the impression that Kane was a 3rd line player for the future…just if he played this season up here.
Moving forward, looking to next season and beyond…Kozlov is in his last year of his current contract. Should the team decide not to re-sign him, then you have an open slot.
Certainly Kane’s future is as a top-six player…but this season it might just be a stretch for him to play there given his age and the personnel already in place there.
ranallo10 (in AT)
August 21st, 2009
8:34 pm
WBF — I thought it was a silly statement to imply that Slater is evidence of the losses over the years while forgetting that Kovalchuk was on those same lineups. I’m not saying you’re hating on Kovalchuk, I just thought the line was silly.
How I feel about the possibility to upgrade is in line with Brendan’s above post. I think it’s too early to be adding “missing pieces” in quality checking depth, and should focus on solidifying the core of young players — re-signing people like Little, finding complimentary scorers like Antropov, and finding a potential top 2 replacement for Kovalchuk as a CYA if he doesn’t re-sign, someone like Zherdev (even with the baggage).
Once Atlanta is threatening to make the playoffs I’d agree to shift the focus on the checking/shutdown depth, but Atlanta isn’t at that point in my opinion (still a 10 seed at most, as I see it).
The Earl of Bud
August 21st, 2009
8:59 pm
Rightshot, Rawhide, Brendan & anyone else reading, my problem with Kane on the 3rd line is that he is a top 6 talent and not really a checker. The reason I am open to the idea is that he dominated the juniors last year so much that I am open to the chance he get NHL exposure against top talent than go beat up on a bunch of teenagers. Most guys I think should go the Bryan Little route but if Kane can handle it (and it wouldn’t surprise me if he could) then let’s develop him this way. This is an exception to the rule but his talent provides for it to happen.
Can anyone tell me if it was Anderson who said this but I think he referred to him playing shorthanded and that would give him extra minutes. If he played 3rd line this year he can make an easy transition to Kozlov’s spot next year which I think is his to have with this club. And if he is on the team there’s nothing stopping Anderson from giving him some shifts here or there with the top lines occasionally. That would be invaluable.
WBF, I think you just have to realize that Antropov did not upgrade us from Slater, so neither will Malhotra if he signs here.
”This will also help EOB to save on medications due to the health issues my original question has caused him.”
Seriously Glovesave, it is August the league activity is dead and there is not much in hockey to think about. That is not a good time to put an idea like that in my head. I had to save myself by reading some Pat Kane jokes that some folks in Buffalo had.
ranallo10 (in AT)
August 21st, 2009
9:08 pm
I get this feeling sometimes that EOB is from Buffalo…I don’t know why but I can’t shake that odd suspicion.
The Earl of Bud
August 21st, 2009
10:25 pm
ranallo10 (in AT) good one, haha. The Jay McKee and Rob Ray references I made today weren’t as bad as World Be Free’s “James Lofton to the Buffalo Bills” reference, but if only Pam on Weck, Smitty and some of the other WNYers were posting today it would be perfect.
On that note, here’s what the folks back home were saying today:
What’s the difference between Pat Kane and a canoe?
A canoe tips
What’s the difference between a caning and getting Kaned?
A caning just beats you, but if you get Kaned you can get nickeled and dimed to death
R. Stroz
August 21st, 2009
11:23 pm
EOB – You share those jokes with Capt. Caveman.
Brendan
August 22nd, 2009
4:12 am
Rawhide, you know me. I love the PROACTIVE talk. You’ve mentioned Kozlov. Normally, I’d be trumpeting the idea of offering “Top Six” Thrasher forwards some PROACTIVE deal to keep them in place, and to continue the team chemistry, moving forward. But not this time. And no, it’s not just because of his AGE. (He is closer to 40 than 30. But I digress.) If Kozlov is to stayyyy, I jolly well want him to EARRRRRRN his next contract. I want him to play like a player in his CONTRACT YEAR, Jeff Blauser-style. I’ll admit something here. I respect Slava Kozlov. He was arguably “Captain” material. And he’s a premier shootout specialist, to be sure. So I’m a bit frustrated at how to properly couch these upcoming remarks, but here goes. At times, I’ve been flustered watching Kozlov. (Oh here it is! I can hear it now! I’m a rabid RUSSIAN-HATER!!!) There were times when I felt he disappeared. For a while. I found myself thinking, “Hey, where’s Slava Kozlov been tonight? And for that matter, for the past several games.” Be honest now, so did you (bloggers). Most noticeably, Kozlov appeared absent during the 2007 playoffs. That “HBK” line (Hossa, Belanger, Kozlov) didn’t produce well. Even the normally ‘player friendly’ Waddell commented that several key veteran players disappointed him during those playoffs, and in one quote, he mentioned Kozlov, specifically, while DEFENDING Hossa’s lackluster performance. In any event, THAT offseason of 2007, Kozlov trapsed off to Dallas, to interview with the Stars Organization about a UFA contract. Kozlov, I suspect, had ZERO INTENTIONS of actually signing there. It was just a ploy to help Donnie remember when he left his checkbook. To the tune of roughly $3.75 million per season cap hit, I believe. On the one hand, of course Kozlov was FREE TO PURSUE all of his available options. At the best price he could garner. No one can begrudge him that. He’d EARNED THE RIGHT to choose where he plays his hockey, based on his age and tenure in the league. On the other hand, he wanted to stay in Atlanta. He wanted to be a part of the process for the coming years. Point of FACT, he signed a 3-year deal, with a very pronounced NO TRADE CLAUSE. And he got angered at the suggestion that the Thrashers be able to “rent him” or trade him, stating, “I just re-signed here. I don’t want to be traded.” Or words to this effect. Okay, look. That’s his right. If Atlanta didn’t want to agree to the NTC, they didn’t have to offer him that. Or re-sign him. At the price he said he’s worth. But they did. Over. End of story. Bygones. As fans, we’re frustrated, sometimes, by that. We see trade opportunities, like moving an aging vet, for a coveted pick or two, or a prospect, or even a young, nearly equally skilled player. And we want the GM to pull the trigger on the deal. I repeat, “NTC.” If the Thrashers are not within striking distance of the playoffs at the deadline this year, you’ll hear “NTC” mentioned again, in regards to Slava Kozlov. Makes ya want to do cartwheels, doesn’t it?
If this is Slava Kozlov’s LAST SEASON in Atlanta, I’m not going to cry about it. There, I said it. I hope Kozlov has a whiz bang season, hitting all sorts of benchmarks. I hope he has a CAREER BEST type season. And I hope he finds a team willing to sign him in the Summer of 2010. When I see Kozlov, I think Jeff Blauser (Braves Baseball reference). Rightly or wrongly. And there it is. For a team that is building, I think we can find a younger LW to play 2nd line minutes in the 2010-11 season. If Kozzie were WILLING to take a paycut, that might change things, for me. If he were willing to have a diminished role in his final contract, that might change things for me. I doubt Kozlov really wants to sign some 1-year deal in FREE AGENCY. Depending on how long he actually wants to play, that’s how many years he’ll look for, in my opinion, this time around. If he wants to play until he’s 40, that’s what he’ll seek, especially if he has a CAREER YEAR for Atlanta, in 2010.
I wish I could say that I have some supreme confidence in Brett Sterling as the Kozlov replacement, at 2nd line LW, but I don’t. If the top six forwards cannot be found among the crop of Thrasher prospects in the farm system, then there’s always free agency. And clearly, young Citizen Kane will take his place among somewhere among the Top Six forwards. Maybe even top line minutes, at some point. While I don’t like overpaying players, and free agency usually causes that, at least a UFA that comes to Atlanta did so out of his own FREE WILL. Nobody put a gun to Ron Hainsey’s head. Nobody jammed a glock in Todd White’s short ribs, while at the ATM. These players AGREED to 4 and 5 year deals to play here. We’ll find somebody. Maybe not a Tier I guy. But we’ll find somebody willing to come, to play those minutes.
Rawhide
August 22nd, 2009
9:19 am
Brendan – As I have opined before, my belief is that Kozlov will not be re-signed next summer…regardless of how well he may or may not play this season. If the Thrashers are able to re-sign Kovy, then Kozlov’s $3.66 mil will simply e transferred over to the Captain’s ledger. That is how they’ll play for Ilya’s raise.
Then, next season…Kane could slip into Kozlov’s spot as a top-six forward.
LAC
August 22nd, 2009
11:45 am
Rawhide, Off topic here, but your thoughts on this…
Every year we play three Western teams home/home.
Would if be a good idea, or bad, to say once every 5 or 10 years play our nearest neighbor Nashville, 3 home/3 road ? Just think it would be nice to do that, even once, if the teams and the league approve.
Would make some nice CLOSE roadtrips !
Thanks !
Rawhide
August 22nd, 2009
1:43 pm
LAC – Personally, I would love to see that type of scheduling with the Thrashers and Preds. From my home in northern Cobb County, it’s only about a 3-1/2 hour trip.
I also think it would be great to have Nashville a part of the SE Division, making it a true regional division. Washington would have to go to the Atlantic or Northeast…meaning one team would then also have to be moved, so I don’t see it happening unless a team like Florida moved out west.
Even if that did happen, there would be many who would argue that Columbus would come east given the fact that they are in the eastern time zone and Nashville is in the central…lots of logistical issues as you can see working against Nashville and Atlanta being in the same division.
However, back to your point…yes, I would love to see us be able to play them more often.
Brendan
August 22nd, 2009
3:36 pm
Rawhide, that was a good read over at your Hockeybuzz blog. I hope everyone read it. It’s worth revisiting if, like me, you missed it the first time, back in May. Kovalchuk has to get paid. And paid properly. And if Kovy’s contract has to be tacked on to Kovalchuk’s present salary, so be it. Truthfully, Kozlov should be pursuing his options with a team that is closer to winning a Stanley Cup. If he WANTS to stay here, I think that’s great. At a discount and diminished role. Kozlov just isn’t part of Atlanta’s long range future, in my opinion. It would be “nice” if he’d allow Atlanta to trade him at the deadline, if that sort of thing looks like an intelligent move for Atlanta to make, at that juncture in the season. But, again, that’s Slava’s call to make. He does own that NTC. And he doesn’t have to waive it. Mats Sundin didn’t waive it. Toronto fans still haven’t forgiven him for it.
Adam
August 23rd, 2009
10:46 am
I have a feeling that RH is going to have another blog up shortly but I’ll post this anyway.
I hear many people say that going back to juniors is best for Evander Kane. Other than ice time there is really nothing more for him to do there. Given that there are a certain few players that have the skill set and mental toughness at his age to play at the NHL level, even if not at top 6 minutes, wouldn’t it best serve him to start here now? Having full time access to the Thrasher training staff, practicing with the team and the tutelage of not only veteran players but the recent experience on the other younger players like Bogo & Toby are all things he can’t get back in juniors. At game time, again while not top six minutes, playing on the 3rd line and on the 2nd line PP & PK lines will give him the level of experience he can get nowhere else. Hey if he’s not ready after preseason by all means send him back after his 9 regular season games but if he is even remotely ready and barring any other signings I think having him here is the best option for him and the team.
Smitty
August 23rd, 2009
12:14 pm
I agree Adam. In addition they can try to match his line with either one of our top 2 defense pairings while he gets his feet wet. I know that will not always be possible but it is another way of helping him to develop on the NHL level. But I think the most important reasons (pardon the pun) is that he will be skating with Reasoner and Colby. Both are defensive minded players and both are good leaders and examples. Colby can help keep everyone honest if the opposition tries to get out of hand with Kane
Rawhide
August 23rd, 2009
12:27 pm
Adam – Just as you predicted…here it is.