Atlanta Hawks: Team holds meeting to air issues after loss to Celtics
Vivlamore reporting.
The Hawks, who were supposed to have an off day Sunday, held a workout (for younger players) and video session following last night’s loss to the Celtics. The Hawks held a 19-point second-quarter lead but it was gone after the Celtics outscored them 33-9 in the third quarter.
Following the video session, players and coaches held a meeting to discuss the loss, which is not the first time this season the Hawks have failed to hold a big lead. I spoke to coach Larry Drew following the meeting. Here are a series of quotes from him. I will just let you read what he said in most of it’s entirety.
* “We just watched film today. As painful as it was to watch, it was very, very productive. After we watched, we had some very good dialog amongst the group. I mean really good. I’m a firm believer that things happen for a reason. I wish we could have won the game last night because we played well the first half and then we didn’t play well the second half and came away with a loss. But that brought this meeting today. … The guys had a chance to talk about some things and air some things. It was very productive.”
* “I think we have (an identity). I think what we are struggling with right now are situations that when it gets a little tough mentally we don’t push through it. We don’t push through it. That was a big part of our discussion this morning of dealing with adversity and being able to persevere through adversity. You can’t expect to play well every game. This game is a game of runs. But when you do go through stretches where things aren’t going well you pull together. You don’t fragment. Last night, we fragmented. That was very discouraging. When you fragment, you start looking like a soft team and you start pointing figures and you start making up excuses. We fragmented last night. That is something we talked about today because it’s going to happen again. It’s understanding and it’s learning how to push through it. Those are the situations that make you a better ball club because you know how to handle it. You can deal with it.”
* “Paul Pierce had an interesting quote when asked about the difference between the first half and the second half. They realized that they were fighting each other instead of fighting the opponent. Lo and behold, that’s what we did the second half. We started fighting amongst ourselves instead of the Celtics.”
* “It was everybody, the coaching staff and all the players. We sat and we watched film and we pointed some things out. We pointed individuals out. At the end of the meeting, we had group dialog about certain things: slow starts, slow starts in the third quarter, not coming out with energy at the start of the third quarter. We’ve had issues with those things throughout the season. Last night was really, really glaring. After playing so energized that first half and then coming out in the second half and the energy was sapped from our bodies, particularly when they climbed up in us a little bit. We discussed all of those things. The players had some very interesting things to say and they talked amongst themselves, which is very healthy for a team. They did it in such a way where nobody was degraded. … It was just ‘Let’s talk about this first guys because it’s about the team. It’s team first. This is what we need to do moving from this point forward.’”
* “In the past this type meeting would have resulted in some tempers flaring in there. It was very professional. I’ve got a very mature group. Guys said what they felt. There was no bickering. There were no hard feelings. Everybody was shaking their head in agreement. It was very, very professional. … Sometimes it takes a game like that to humble you a little bit. They voiced their opinions about different things. I was very professional. It was unfortunate that we had take an L to bring us together like that. But like I said, things happen for a reason and maybe that was the reason.”
- Chris Vivlamore
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187 comments Add your comment
W.R. Terrell
January 6th, 2013
6:12 pm
I don’t think Austin Daye would be a cheap upgrade. A lil weight and muscle along with dedication and who knows what the final product would be. I’ve been in favor of that as a trade possibility for awhile. I want the HAWKS to stay away from D.Cousins, head cases will always be head cases.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
January 6th, 2013
6:15 pm
FIRE LD
hot.trod.87
January 6th, 2013
6:15 pm
Pierce abused us under the basket…Korver was a bad matchup. mike Scott didn’t get any playing time. I think we should start Zaza. He started last year when Al was hurt and we posted the 3rd best record in the East 40-26. We have to establish an inside game. Al as center can’t defend the rim and teams are getting whatever they want. Teague’s numbers have.been.dropping since through beginning of December. Asia point guard, he’s responsible for our offense much.like a quarterback . Against Detroit he had 5 points 5 rebounds.Zaza HAS always played against Garnett, why was he out
Duluth Joe
January 6th, 2013
6:25 pm
Why do people blame fans at Phillips last night?
Did any one hear Celtics fans in the first half?
When the fans have no reason to cheer, then they stay quiet. For all of third quarter, we had nothing to cheer about. And Celtics fans watched a come back of epic proportions.
There were certainly a good number of them there (as is normally the case with Celtics in town), but no way they could be louder than Hawks fans if Hawks were semi-competitive..
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
6:26 pm
“Out of 95 offensive play types charted by Synergy, do you know how many official post up plays the Hawks had?
THREE” -northcyde-
So northcyde confirmed the eyeball test..
The Hawks on ran 3 post plays all game?
You post only 3 times, your supposed to lose against teams that can exploit that.
Dismantle this overrated Front Line yesterday…
Cap space mean squat if none of the High profile FA’s want to come here.. Would you?
POST 3X= FAIL
Brian
January 6th, 2013
6:27 pm
Josh Smith is the dominant personality and influence (unfortunately) on this team…as he goes so go the Hawks…the offense runs through him…he has 70 more shot attempts than anyone else….and shares the most turnovers with Teague…Teague is a mirror image of Smith…no one on this roster is strong enough to back JS down or hold him accountable for stupid behavior or lackadaisical play…Drew cannot handle him…he merely puts up with him…we are destined for mediocrity with JS on board!
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
6:27 pm
ONLY*
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
6:32 pm
OB,
I would give the Kings Josh or Al for Cousins and filler then go get a superior wing player for the other who could both post up and shoot…
I highly doubt these amigos two will see an ECF in a Hawks uni..
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
6:33 pm
two amigos*
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
6:45 pm
When was the last time you saw Al or Josh set a solid pick or screen to help free the guards for dribble penetration?
Why does Larry not run more pick and rolls? Hmmmmmm
Tell you why because the two amigos are terrible at finishing around the rim..The finishing Dunks are the exceptions more than the norm…
Neither can finger roll or use glass, which a major disadvantage for a Big in the post..
Nate ArchiBALL
January 6th, 2013
6:47 pm
Northcyde, I like your 5:45 pm post. Glad to see someone else noticed what happened in the second half.
High-sider
January 6th, 2013
6:51 pm
“E” from Riverdale, I hear ya regarding your post @11:02am, 1/6/2013 (FTPB).
I know one thing for sure and that is (the bloggers) W.R. Terrell, keith and Mookie Blaylock hate “the ‘Smoove’s’” (Josh Smith’s) game (with a passion).
Oh yeah, btw, I don’t think “Oh, Danny Boy” (GM Ferry) will re-sign Josh Smith that is unless he (Ferry) is able to sign Dwight Howard. “They” say “the moves” of a GM are (those of) “chess” and not (those of) “checkers.” I proposed a trade the other day between the Hawks and the Jazz.
Hawks get(s) Al Jefferson (C), Derrick Favors (PF/C) and DeMarre Carroll (SF).
Jazz get Al Horford (C/PF), Zaza Pachulia (C) and Anthony Tolliver (PF).
Let’s say the Lakers “fall off” and begin “to tank” in the second half of this regular season and, as a result, miss the postseason. The “dream scenario” for “certain” Hawks fans is that Dwight Howard gets disgusted with “Tinseltown,” Kobe (Bryant), (Coach Mike) D’Antoni and that “crowd” and “wants out of” the Lakers (organization). Now, the Hawks can “come in” with a sign-and-trade offer – Al Jefferson for Dwight Howard. Dwight Howard is back in the A-T-L with his “ace boon coon” (”Smoove” aka Josh Smith); “all’s well (that) ends well.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_XJFp5JXpk
brigadierjerry
January 6th, 2013
6:53 pm
even with what i said earlier in the previous blogs, the east is so bad outside of a few teams, hawks will still staas a top 4 seed maybe slip to 5
Having a player like such as a tyson chandler type would do wonders for this team or someone who whole purpose is to protect the rim and concentrate on rebounds. Unfortunately there isnt anyone that is available that can really do that.
Hawks needs to get a SF that can defend and rebound.
When you have second tier to third tier players, coaching becomes even that more important. Good examples of that are Thibideou since Rose went down and George Karl and Scott Skiles. Even though Hawks have a better team record wise than Skiles and Thibodeou, you can see the game plan that they utilize.
To me it will really come down to how the Hawks fare in the playoffs which will determine LD fate. In a lot of ways this Hawks team is like the movie Groundhog day. Similar issues happened when Woodson was coach although the team was much better overall defensively but the same issues remain with Woodson and LD: lack of in-game adjustments and lack of developing or playing young players.
Josh and Smith are what they are and in a lot of ways I think both have peaked
High-sider
January 6th, 2013
6:54 pm
Here is “the trade” (again).
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=adh5tbu
Grandad
January 6th, 2013
6:54 pm
This A M `s team mtg was bull-shoo-shoo, in my humble opinion.
Rod from College Park
January 6th, 2013
6:55 pm
northcyde,
We rarely agree, but you are correct. Josh is the only guy that tries, or is not scared to fail out of he, Teague and Horford. That is the problem with this team. I am what many call here a Josh fan, but even I know he is not a #1 option. He is a #2 guy offensively at best. The closest we have to a #1 is Lou Williams, and he can be shut down easily, like he was last year in the playoffs. Josh takes dumb shots, and continues to think he is a combination of Magic Johnson and Larry Bird. I continue to wonder why our sets continue to have him standing behind the three point line and getting the ball at the top of the key. Makes no common sense at all. It’s partly Josh’s fault and mostly LD’s fault for running these terrible sets. Josh will continue to take dumb shots, and make boneheaded plays as long as our Coach continues to think he is sone sort of PF/PG/Larry Bird hybrid.
Al Horford is a two time All Star. Not one time, but two time. The guy makes 12 million per year. Excuses being made for him are absurd. He plays SOFT, can’t get his own shot, gets intimidated by bigger guys in the post, and has ZERO effect on the defensive side of the ball. I focus on him because it seems that our coach, and many of the bloggers seem to think he can do no wrong. Even when he has big offensive games, his man defensively usually has a big game also. He is scared to take shots, and him continually passing up shots, is just a bad as Josh taking bad shots.
Jeff Teague simply is not a traditional ball distributing point guard. Not a bad thing, but the problem is that we need a traditional ball distributing point guard to get our guys the ball in the right places, and to prevent Josh from thinking he is the point guard.
brigadierjerry
January 6th, 2013
6:56 pm
Grandad,
Good evening sir. We have seen this story with this Hawks team. What would you do right now considering Hawks have a lot of cap space this summer and I am not sure the major free agents are coming here I think if LD doesnt get to 2nd round LD wont be back. What would you do to make this team better?
High-sider
January 6th, 2013
7:02 pm
Slimjr,
The trio of Josh Smith, DeMarcus Cousins and Dwight Howard is (potentially) an All-Headcase frontcourt. That (trio) could be a heckuva “job” (problem) for even (the late) Sigmund Freud.
Grandad
January 6th, 2013
7:06 pm
Slimjr on Jan 6th, `13 @ 6:45 pm
” When was the last time you saw Al or Josh
set a solid pick or screen to help free the guards
for dribble penetration? ”
Slimmer ::
did you watch the 1st Qtr of the most recent Pistons game ?
The best display of our *new “pick & roll” game
*[which LD institututed from the Israeli coach].
Al is the better screener, always has been.
Josh has never been taught to screen *’`ever`’*
not entirely his fault and he does not like to P&R.
Josh wishes to catch & then dribble …
does not like to catch & react.
Za is our best P&R player !
For obvious reasons Al prefers Pick & Pop.
ATMAN
January 6th, 2013
7:10 pm
Hope LD realizes his lineup needs a shakeup, we get outrebounded every night. Teague dribbles too long, doesn’t know how to “distribute” as Rod said. He gets some assists and he has a nice floater, but not a true PG. No, bangers inside……..like I’ve said before, out of ZaZa, Al, Ivan…..2 out of the 3 should always be in the game.
Rod from College Park
January 6th, 2013
7:15 pm
I have also said that Kyle Korver, as much as many of you try to make him the greatest thing since sliced bread, is a huge defensive liability, and teams in the east, that know his game will exploit that. The Paul Pierce’s, Lebron’s JR Smith’s, Danny Granger’s will destroy him in a playoff situation if he is our starting 3. He should be coming off the bench. He is a great shooter, but that’s it.
ATMAN
January 6th, 2013
7:21 pm
Thought I remember a quote from Josh in off season saying, he was going to be mid range shawty with all these shooters we brought in. Yet, he camps at the 3 point line half the time or more. How can we rebound when our 4 is at the 3 point line and our 3 is KK…….I can out rebound him. If LD can’t adjust to our weaknesses he doesn’t deserve a new contract.
Atlanta Hawks’ meeting signifies unity as they grow as a team | HawksHoop
January 6th, 2013
7:22 pm
[...] to Chris Vivlamore from the AJC, the Atlanta Hawks held a meeting Sunday (originally their off day) to air issues and grievances [...]
Rod from College Park
January 6th, 2013
7:23 pm
“Al is the better screener, always has been.”
He should be, He is an ALL STAR CENTER. Bigger guys are usually better screener’s. Unfortunately he is not a better rim protector, defender, post player, or offensive threat.
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
7:33 pm
Missed the 1st half Grandad.
Got to see the 30 point 3rd quarter swing.. It was a miracle for Boston Fans…lol..
Wonder if anybody saw those 3 post plays according to Synergy? heheheh
prison mike
January 6th, 2013
7:38 pm
The true leader on the court has to come from the point. He yields the most power and responsibility. Teague simply does not know how to run a ball club as of now.
Al and Josh are good role players, even great ones but they need someone to control tempo when things get shaky.
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
7:42 pm
Hs I hear ya…hhahahahaha
I just believe Cousins will mature, heck hes only 22 and is more talented offensively than Josh or Al combined already..You got to roll the dice sometimes..The two Amigos have peaked.. What you have seen is all your gonna get..Its a wrap…
The streak will continue with the two Amigos featured together on this front line…Jettison one…
46
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
7:51 pm
OhOH doc:
Seattle coming to Atlanta..Just the team we did not want to play!!!
darn it!
Disgusted
January 6th, 2013
7:54 pm
Cousins is a risk & has had his share of incidents in his short career.
Do you really want to put the future of the team on a kid with as many charachter flaws as he has had. And its not like the Kings have been close to respectability of any kind since he has been there.
Big time talent but he has taken them nowhere.
I do get why some would want Cousins but be careful what you wish for.
Josh is never going to be what people want him to be — he is just a tad short of All-Star ability. He does not have the shot to carry a team offensively but I want the Hawks future to include Josh.
Future defensive player of the year. He is a 15-16 point guys with the great D and some rebounding abiltiy. Worth keeping even if he is not a number one player.
True Fanhood
January 6th, 2013
8:05 pm
Slimjr
August 28th, 2012
11:21 pm
That Bynum/Collins relationship will be fascinating to watch unfold doc for sure..
I’m going to cheer for all the players. I want this team to reach new heights also..Long over due
———————————————————————————————————-
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
7:42 pm
The two Amigos have peaked.. What you have seen is all your gonna get..Its a wrap…
————————————————————————————————————
Ah yes, true fanhood at it’s worst. Easy to love a front runner, I guess. Harder to stick with your team. Oh, yeah, I forgot, it’s NOT your team.
That’s your loss. Or should I say “lost”?
BravesFan79
January 6th, 2013
8:17 pm
1) Drew waited WAY to late to call a timeout in the 2nd half to calm things down, we could all see it was unraveling quickly… couldnt he?
2) Drew waiting until the game was basically tied and the Celtics had all the momentum to bring back in the Hawks hottest player in Williams. Just dumb.
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2013
8:26 pm
Horford looked bad last night but he didn’t look so soft in the playoffs against the same team about 7 months ago. Yes, he missed free throws but not because he was “:soft”. Yes, he turned the ball over but not because he was “soft”. I recall a 20/10/3 performance in Game 5… not because he was “soft”. Last night? Yeah, I’ll give you that. But I wouldn’t use one game to define Al just like I wouldn’t think Josh would want to be defined based on any single game.
Heaven help this fan base when we applaud when a player tries to morph into a comic book character (or someone from a really bad Kevin Durant movie).
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2013
8:32 pm
W.R. Terrell, Daye would be an inexpensive SF with upside. Inexpensive=cheap. He is a free agent next season and won;t likely get more than $4M/year. Cheap.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2013
8:37 pm
“My question to you is, we needed shooters and a big man when Marvin and Joe was here, where was the front office to provide this?”
How were they supposed to fit those players under the cap when they were paying nearly $30 million combined to Joe and Marvin?
“ATL is a horrible sports town, my question to you Najeh, do you have season tickets and support the team?”
Depends on your definition of “support the team”. I have been to all but one playoff game since 2008. If I had the kind of money to afford season tickets I’d probably have much better things to do than post 50 messages on this blog every game.
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2013
8:38 pm
Raise your hand if you think Horford would have gotten credit for trying had he shot 5-16 last night.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2013
8:39 pm
“I hate to tell you guys this, but Brooklyn isn’t a ‘worse team’ than us.
They have struggled greatly this year adjusting to their new lineup, and they’re still only a whopping one game behind us in the Win Column.”
Maybe. I don’t deny that the Hawks have looked very average for the last three weeks. But the Hawks’ record is still better than Brooklyn’s record, and the Hawks still rank ahead of Brooklyn according to most of the advanced stats people. Maybe Brooklyn finishes better than ATL at the end of the year — that’s what I picked to happen before the season — but right now they are not there yet.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2013
8:42 pm
“But when thinking about the way the Nets’ owner is financially supporting the team, it is hard to see them not making the moves needed to be a top 2-3 team in the conference.”
I’m confident that Prokhorov will do whatever it takes to win. I am much less confident that Billy King can pull off the necessary moves with that roster to make it happen. Have you seen their salary cap? Their top 5 players are locked into long term contracts that make them virtually untradeable for equal value. Even if some superstar becomes available via trade for them, what small market, rebuilding team is going to take on one of those contracts in return? They look pretty locked in to their current team to me.
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2013
8:47 pm
Najeh, the Nets could trade Deron Williams and Lopez tomorrow. Joe and Gerald Wallace are unmovable but more than one team would surely take on a top 10 PG and center for the long-term. From the Hawks perspective, I think they will be find over the next 3 summers, especially if they hand over a percent of the team to Mr. Phil Jackson.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2013
8:47 pm
“So you didn’t want the team to play SOFT, but you didn’t even try to go to a semi-big lineup until the 1:54 mark? And when you DID do it, you bring in Anthony Tolliver? Not even going to ask why the team’s toughest and scariest player was just chewing gum on the bench and not even getting a chance to impact the game at this time. And when you DID decide to put him in the game, he starts to make things happen, but the Hawks were in too much of a hole.”
Co-sign.
“Bottom line is this. If you’re not going to reign in Josh Smith from taking a ton of outside shots and acting like he’s an elite scorer, you may as well play him at SF for significant stretches, let him fire away, and play guys at PF who will REBOUND THE DANG BASKETBALL when he misses shots.”
I agree with you that they should have gone bigger. I don’t necessarily agree that Josh would have jacked up more jumpers at the 3. On the contrary, Josh like the rest of this team is scared of KG and refuses to take him inside. For the last three years (at least), every time KG guards Josh, he plays his left hand and baits him into jacking up jumpers.
If Josh was at the 3, he would have a) been posting up Paul Pierce, a much more favorable matchup, and b) been guarding Pierce on the other end, a much more favorable matchup than Korver on Pierce.
Not to mention, with Zaza on the floor, there’s no way the Hawks get killed on the boards by one of the worst offensive rebounding teams in the league.
I still doubt that this pansy ass, mentally Kleenex team beats the Celtics if LD goes big, but I do think going bigger would have helped.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2013
8:55 pm
“the Nets could trade Deron Williams and Lopez tomorrow. Joe and Gerald Wallace are unmovable but more than one team would surely take on a top 10 PG and center for the long-term”
For equal value or close to it though? With Lopez’s recurring foot problems and Williams’ declining production it’s going to be pretty tough to convince someone to give up other All Star caliber players for them.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2013
9:05 pm
“Raise your hand if you think Horford would have gotten credit for trying had he shot 5-16 last night.”
I would give Al a TON of credit if he’d start consistently taking those mid range jumpers he so often passes up only to lead to Josh jacking up a jumper at the end of the clock. Al is one of the two best players on this team and he’s a better mid range shooter than most big men in this league. The Hawks can do a lot worse on any given possession than an Al mid range jumper.
On a better team, where Al can play the supporting role to which he’s best suited, it makes sense to pass up those shots. On this team, he needs to look for his shot a lot more than he currently does.
Same thing applies to Josh in that he’s best suited to a supporting role, but on this team, he needs to look for his shot (or at least to create good shots for teammates). For better or worse, he does that.
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2013
9:06 pm
Najeh, I think Ferry would trade our expiring contracts for either of them tonight. And the Lakers would send Gasol to them which would take about $20M off the books in 1,5 seasons. They may not get equal value in terms of another youngish top 10 player at his position, but they could make a deal that would allow them to stay at the top of the conference (like getting expiring deals). I still believe in their roster and have ALWAYS doubted Avery’s ability to manage a veteran team.
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2013
9:09 pm
OK, well, maybe I’m the only one who would never give a guy credit for shooting less than 40%. I actually expect that player to start finding other ways to help his team other than keep hoisting up bad shots.
rollo lawson
January 6th, 2013
9:09 pm
A big time trade has to be made. Al Horford, Devin Harris, Kyle Korver, and 1st round draft picks in 2013 and 2014 for Tyreke Evans and Demarcus Cousins.
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2013
9:11 pm
Anyone want a max player who inefficiently scores 18-20 points/game while being an average rebounder and defender at the SF position? Because one may be available in the next few weeks.
Rod from College Park
January 6th, 2013
9:16 pm
“Horford looked bad last night but he didn’t look so soft in the playoffs against the same team about 7 months ago.”
Horford played 2 games last year in the playoffs fresh against guys who had played an entire season. He sure looked soft to me the year before that IN THE PLAYOFFS when Brandon Bass and Ryan Anderson took his lunch and he surely looked EXTRA SOFT against Chicago when Noah and company took his manhood. Sure look SOFT to me.
MattP
January 6th, 2013
9:18 pm
NBA on NBC Boston @NBAonNBCBoston
Sources close to http://nbaonnbc.com confirm that Danny Ainge is working to complete a deal to bring Cousins to Boston, tonight.
Alex Kennedy @AlexKennedyNBA
The Boston Celtics waived Kris Joseph and Jarvis Varnado today. Several league sources believe they’re opening roster spots to make a trade.
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
9:18 pm
“My thing is this though . . . where was AL HORFORD? What did he do to even try to stop or slow down what happened last night? Answer = NOTHING.
He passed up shots. He was late on a few defensive rotations. He didn’t rebound. Basically, he deferred to Josh, Lou, and anybody else. He had absolutely NO IMPACT in that quarter. None. If he is one of the leaders on the Hawks, this cannot happen. Smith tries, but he cannot do it. Horford doesn’t even try ( until Smith is out with an injury ).” -northcyde-
An excellent and probing question northcyde. Have we not seen this b4?
Fascinating…. [Spocks voice]
Rod from College Park
January 6th, 2013
9:20 pm
“Raise your hand if you think Horford would have gotten credit for trying had he shot 5-16 last night.”
Hand Raised. I would much rather him take a wide open mid range jumper or a shot right under the goal than passing the ball to Josh standing at the 3 point line.
Slimjr
January 6th, 2013
9:23 pm
Cousins to Boston? Say it aint SO?
Guess hes good enough for Boston? hmmmm