Atlanta Hawks: Clippers 89, Hawks 76
Vivlamore reporting from Los Angeles.
Lob City turned into Turnover City for the Hawks.
Atlanta committed a season-high 22 turnovers, 10 in the fourth quarter, en route to an 89-76 loss to the Los Angeles Clippers Sunday at a sold old Staples Center. Many of those turnovers led to uncontested layups as the Clippers went on a 26-5 run between the third and fourth quarters. Devin Harris hit a 3-pointer late in the third to put the Hawks up by one point, 60-59. Then 10:24 later, the Hawks trailed by 20 points, 85-65.
Hawks coach Larry Drew said his team lost its composure.
“I thought our guys followed our game plan for two and a half quarters,” Drew said. “Midway into that third quarter, it’s like we totally forgot what had put us in the position we were in. As I told them, on the road we have to be consistent, we have to be on the mark with all of our coverages.
“We knew coming into this building we knew one of the things we needed to do was take away momentum plays. We did that for the most part, but late in that third quarter we totally abandoned what was good for us for two and half quarters.”
The Hawks had just seven points and nine turnovers in the first 8:39 of the fourth quarter.
“Fourth quarter was a disaster,” Zaza Pachulia said. “It was full of mistakes. It’s sad that you are playing so well for three quarters and one quarter you throw it all away in the ocean. This should be a good example for our team.”
The Hawks (2-3) lost their second straight game and the first on a four-game West Coast road trip. Josh Smith led the Hawks with 13 points, but they came on 6-of-14 shooting. He missed all four free-throw attempts. For the season, Smith is 26-for- 66 (.394) from the field and 2-for-14 (.143) from the free-throw line.
Al Horford and Lou Williams each added 11 points for the Hawks.
“Those guy played the passing lanes,” Smith said. “They are a gambling team. Give credit to them, the plays they gambled on they succeeded. That kind of gave them momentum in that fourth quarter which hurt us.”
The Clippers (5-2), winners of three straight, placed six players in double-figure scoring. Blake Griffin had 16 points followed by Chris Paul (15), Caron Butler (13), Eric Bledsoe (12), Jamal Crawford (11) and Matt Barnes (10).
Free throws were hardly an issue for just Smith against the Clippers. The Hawks combined to shoot 7-for-16 from the line. In fact, the Hawks had two more 3-pointers than free throws. On the season, the Hawks are shooting 54-for-81 (.667).
“We couldn’t make a free throw,” Drew said. “You have to make free throws on the road. That’s the bottom line. .. You have to step up, concentrate and knock it down.”
For the first time this season the Hawks’ bench failed to outscore their opponent’s bench. The Clippers’ reserves held a 35-32 advantage.
The Hawks did manage to hold the Clippers under 100 points, snapping their streak of six games to start the season over the century mark.
The Clippers got physical with the Hawks late in the game and it had an impact, according to Drew.
“We got sped up with the pressure and then we let the officiating bother us a little bit,” Drew said. “As I told them, we can’t play any road game with the mindset that during that game there are going to be calls that they might not like. That cannot affect their play. Tonight, we let some calls get us a little out of character. You can’t play like that on the road. You have to be solid. You have to be focused. We lost focus at the end of the third quarter.”
The Hawks road trip continues against Portland Monday night.
Notes
* Rookies John Jenkins and Mike Scott made their season debut. They entered the game with 3:21 remaining after the Clippers took a 20-point lead. Jenkins made 2-of-4 shots to finish with four points. Scott missed both his shots.
* Guard DeShawn Stevenson did not play. The veteran was held out because the Hawks play again Monday and the plan is not to play him in back-to-back games.
* The Hawks started their big lineup of Jeff Teague, Kyle Kover, Smith, Horford and Pachulia. It was the first time the team duplicated a starting lineup this season.
* Center Johan Petro was inactive for the fifth straight game.
* The sellout was the 55th straight for the Clippers. The Staples Center also hosted a Lakers game later in the evening.
LATEST NEWS
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* Lessons to be learned in technical fouls
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184 comments Add your comment
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:33 pm
That a-hole LD Again plays JT 27 min to Harris 26 min. LD keeps trying to screw JT at the expense of the hawks. He doesn’t play Morrow what the heck is going on. When he takes JT out we start losing.ZaaZa is a poor first string starter.another loss credited to LD.
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:36 pm
Was trading Marvin for Harris really a good trade for us? I am beginning to wonder.
Spartacus
November 11th, 2012
8:39 pm
I am amazed at how many posts on this blog think that Josh is a better overall player than Al. Yes, Josh has more talent than Al, but lacks focus, commitment and overall intelligence. The only time Josh plays hard is when he is actually making shots. He turns the ball over consistently (through poor shots that are either air balls or nowhere close to going in) and then yells at the refs for not getting calls on stupid plays. One prime example is when he actually drove in the lane near the end of the game, had the ball stolen, complained to the refs while Teague went back and contested the lay up and the trailing player made the bucket. At the beginning of the play, Josh was actually ahead of the trailing player, but quit on the play! This is what separates Al from Josh. He may not have the natural talent, but more than makes up for it through his workmanlike approach to the game. He rarely takes a bad shot and makes his teammates better as he continually hustles and tries to make up for Josh’s brain lapses throughout the game. Anyone who can’t see this just doesn’t understand the team concept to basketball. You could build a perennial winner with Teague and Al running the pick and roll and surrounded them with shooters and a big like ZaZa who will do the dirty work. The OKC game was a great example of what this would look like. Good ball movement with smart efficient players making the right play. Al showed what he could do without Josh screwing up the whole flow of the game with his poor decision making. I say trade Josh now and watch the Hawks take off, and more importantly, watch Al’s game rise to another level!
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:44 pm
We lost this game with JT sitting on the bench.Ferry can you see that Lad is like a cancer to this teamEnter your comments here
Slimjr
November 11th, 2012
8:44 pm
Brian Shaw would have been an excellent upgrade @ the HC position..Looks like Phill Jackson is taking him back to Hollywood along with Scottie Pippen!
Larry Drew= round peg/square hole
Grandad clock= T-25
2-6
Slimjr
November 11th, 2012
8:46 pm
Guess Mike Brown aka [WoodyLite Jr] maybe next up?
2-6
Woody 22-6
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:49 pm
LD really suxs.
Hawks Blog Legend Worldwide Clyde
November 11th, 2012
8:49 pm
LD is LD why should we expect anything different. He plays people based on favortism rather than results.
Morrow should be starting point blank. Devin Harris and Korver are goodbench players right now. Tolliver ain’t gonna cut it either.
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:51 pm
Grandpa what turned you all on LD this season,I thought he was lousy last season also
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:53 pm
I think JT needs to leave next year & become a star some where else.
steve brown
November 11th, 2012
8:55 pm
Joe Johnson was no leader yet compared to Josh Smith as the heir apparent leader JJ looks like General Patton.
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:55 pm
Love Ivan,he should find another team to play on next year.
steve brown
November 11th, 2012
8:56 pm
Trade Josh now please.
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:57 pm
Has Harris lost his game?
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
8:59 pm
LD should be giving Scott & Jenkins a chance to play this season.
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November 11th, 2012
8:59 pm
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Rusty
November 11th, 2012
9:02 pm
Age Gap get the hell out of here.
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
9:04 pm
Give a lot of credit to LD for this game.
Slimjr
November 11th, 2012
9:07 pm
Missed the game Live[well not really]. Apparently I missed a YAWN…
I have the game recorded in HD..Looks like this one will get the delete button engagement. I betcha those bigs would love to hit the delete button on their game right about now? LOL!
Combine for a -27..Absolutely pathetic…..
PLAYOFFS?
cp
November 11th, 2012
9:10 pm
I didn’t get to see the game but from reading the blog looks like I didn’t miss much. Looks like LD went all LD on us and Josh is still allowed to do as he pleases.
sameba
November 11th, 2012
9:14 pm
In the meantime, Grizzlies are dismantling Heat, and R. Gay is the man!
ag
November 11th, 2012
9:14 pm
I have posted before, what do we have to lose with Jenkins starting? He is more athletic than Korver and bigger than Devin. Bring Lou off the bench with Morrow. Harris needs to be nailed to the pine. I would sit Tolliver with him. If we are going to have a big lineup, we need another big to back up ZaZa.
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
9:15 pm
JT is averaging 16.3 PTs a game [28 minutes] damn LD let him play.
Who Me?
November 11th, 2012
9:17 pm
The LAMEness jumped off the court tonight. Another coaching gem from LD and stellar play from Josh Smith. Clearly LD can’t coach him up, Ferry needs to step in and read Josh the riot act. OR trade him while we can. And tell me again why isn’t Brian Shaw the HC here now??
Who Me?
November 11th, 2012
9:18 pm
CV – like your blog brother but seriously, someone needs to proof this thing before it goes up on the web.
Rod from College Park
November 11th, 2012
9:31 pm
” One prime example is when he actually drove in the lane near the end of the game, had the ball stolen, complained to the refs while Teague went back and contested the lay up and the trailing player made the bucket. At the beginning of the play, Josh was actually ahead of the trailing player, but quit on the play! This is what separates Al from Josh.”
So obviously you did not watch the game. You must not have seen the play when Al got his pocket picked by Blake Griffin, and did not even bother trying to get back to prevent the dunk Guess that play went unseen. He was not arguing with the refs, so what was his excuse?
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
9:41 pm
LD says we went out of game plan in the third of course he had second string in huge periods of the third & forth quarters.
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
9:42 pm
I can’t stand to watch LD coach this team,a big mistake to keep him coach.
Rusty
November 11th, 2012
9:45 pm
Listening to LD post game interview makes me want to puke.
sameba
November 11th, 2012
9:46 pm
The only reason to keep LD is to go stright to the lottery. I can guess, that would decrease value of many of our players, so Ferry can resign some of them easily. Then he can get any FA available on the market.
sameba
November 11th, 2012
9:49 pm
^straight
Jae Evolution
November 11th, 2012
9:51 pm
*Logical Harmless Suggestions*
Josh, Korver and a pick for Drummond, Villanueva and a protected pick
Josh for Batum, Barton and a pick
Josh for Gortat and Beasley
Josh and Morrow for W. Chandler, Faried and Mozgov/Koufos
Josh and Petro for Cousins and Salmons.
And most all of those could easily have Horford swapped into them.
O'Brien
November 11th, 2012
9:59 pm
Rod,
Say what you want about Horford, but this is supposed to be Josh’s team now. He is our best player on offense and defense (imo).
For the season, Smith is 26-for- 66 (.394) from the field and 2-for-14 (.143) from the free-throw line..
And he is 1-7 from 3. We need more from him. He has really struggled the last 2 games, but didnt LD also start him at SF in those games?
I think LD needs to stop worrying about us matching up with other teams, and focus on letting them match up with us. Start Al at Center, and Josh at PF. That is their best positions.
O'Brien
November 11th, 2012
10:01 pm
FTPB,
Player A: shoots 32% from the field, and 30% (7-23) from 3.
Player B: shoots 62% from the field, 100% (3-3) from 3.
Logic would suggest more PT for player B, right?
More evidence?
Player A: Scored 35 points in 136 minutes (.257 pts per minute played)
Player B: Scored 22 points in 29 minutes (.759 pts per min played)
Player A? Korver. B? Morrow.
Clyde,
Can we get some free Morrow T-shirts?
C-Viv,
Can I dare you to ask LD why Morrow isn’t getting more PT? How about a double dare? Dude has 3 DNPCD. Or is it still too early?
Runner-
November 11th, 2012
10:02 pm
“I think LD needs to stop worrying about us matching up with other teams, and focus on letting them match up with us.”
BOOM, nailed it. Let other teams worry about who gonna guard Josh, not the other way around!!
Runner-
November 11th, 2012
10:03 pm
By the way, why the hell does LD care about keeping DeShawn fresh? It’s not like we’re gonna resign him after the season, wear his ass out this season and who gives a sh*t about what happens to him afterwards
jim
November 11th, 2012
10:40 pm
i can’t stand another day of josh and his horrible shooting. can we trade him now P L E A S E !!!!!!
Rod from College Park
November 11th, 2012
10:41 pm
“I think LD needs to stop worrying about us matching up with other teams, and focus on letting them match up with us. Start Al at Center, and Josh at PF. That is their best positions.
Iv’e always said that. Josh should be at PF. Really does not matter. Neither guy is good enough to be the man. The All Star does not play like one.
Fire that Moron
November 11th, 2012
10:45 pm
I have seen some terrible coaches in my lifetime but LD is thew absolute worse.
FREE MORROW AND JEFF TEAGUE
27 min for Teague is a disgrace with the way he is playing.
Morrow scores 20 off the bench and then gets a DNP-CD? I dont even know what to say about that
Korver please go back to Chicago and Harris go back to Utah,
This team has plenty of talent and can win games but not with Drew coaching this team.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
November 11th, 2012
11:03 pm
Was so encouraged thru 1st half of Miami game
WHERE THE HELL IS MORROW
JOSH, MAKE A DAMN FT
FIRE LD
Section 303
November 11th, 2012
11:05 pm
Josh was brutal today. More bad shot attempts and his failure to make FT’s is just a killer. Plus, he just gave up on plays late. Not good signs today.
This is a big year for him. Contract year, “his team”, he gets announced last in the starting lineup….time for him to step up. Today was a big step back for him.
I’m not sure where I stand on Josh. His numbers (even today) always look solid. But, when you watch, you see a different story. He will cost a fortune to re-sign…have my doubts on him being worth the price. Sometimes I think he is what I’ve always kind of felt he was…million dollar talent, with a ten-cent head.
Section 303
November 11th, 2012
11:09 pm
Positives today…I love the way Teague is playing right now. I thought he was good, again, today. If he keeps shooting the ball well, especially from 3, he is going to be a force.
I thought Jenkins looked like a strong player today. I know the game was in garbage time when he came in, but he looked like he belonged on the floor. Doubt he gets any meaningful minutes this year, though.
Korver was OK…..I seem to either love or hate that guy, so far. If his shots aren’t falling, not sure what he contributes.
Don’t see the Hawks getting a win in Portland. Maybe can get wins @ GS and @ Kings?
hawksordie
November 11th, 2012
11:17 pm
this drew guy is buschwah he SUXXXX ITS TERRIBLE HE HAS TOOLS IN THE TOOLBOX AND WILLNOT UTILIZE THEM WATUP WIT THAT
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
November 11th, 2012
11:19 pm
what’s up with DeShawn not playing b2bs? Is it his knees?
Cosign 303
hawksordie
November 11th, 2012
11:20 pm
furthermore whyyyy isnt he playing morrow and jenkins they are weapons real weapons …snipers to he exact so i bet ANY other coach would give them a shot …he is lame as f€££k im clueless for real
hawksordie
November 11th, 2012
11:24 pm
we actually had the heat beat were up ten on pacers early although we came back to win and were up 5or 7 on clippers in front sellout crowd had the players and crowd quiet then lame duck ld HAD TO SWITCH OUR WINNING COMBO UP ….Really !?!?!! wowwww
Najeh Davenpoop
November 11th, 2012
11:33 pm
I didn’t pay a ton of attention to this game (was watching 3 football games at the same time) but I am increasingly unimpressed with Devin Harris. There is no reason why he should be playing the same number of minutes as Teague. Give Teague his 30 minutes per game and let Morrow take some minutes from Harris and Korver.
Jenkins looked pretty decent in garbage time.
I can live with Josh jacking up a few bad jumpers per game, but this free throw nonsense needs to stop right now. He simply cannot be an effective offensive player if he is going to be this bad at the line.
northcyde
November 11th, 2012
11:35 pm
The lineup is just too out of balance. Guys that should be playing, can’t get in the game. And guy that are playing, aren’t getting enough playing time to impact the game on a nightly basis.
And C-Viv reported that LD doesn’t want to play Stevenson on back-to-back games?
But I thought we played Friday night?
Friday night + Sunday afternoon = back to back
That’s that Larry Drew math right there. I hate to bash that dude so much, but his rotations are baffling.
Rod from College Park
November 11th, 2012
11:44 pm
“That’s that Larry Drew math right there. I hate to bash that dude so much, but his rotations are baffling.”
We never agree, but we agree here. LD’s rotations are beyond confusing.
sameba
November 11th, 2012
11:51 pm
People are talking so much about LD’s substitutions…
But, the main thing is what is the system that team plays…
Do Hawks have any direction? Any chemistry?
I got impression that the team does not know what to do on offense so far…
i_am_soulstar
November 11th, 2012
11:53 pm
Bad coaching. How Morrow scores 17 last game, and doesn’t see the floor this time is amazing to me. How Teague stays on the bench while that run goes down is amazing to me.
sameba
November 11th, 2012
11:53 pm
When there is no movement and chemistry on the offense, even if you have LBJ in the Hawks uniform he would have very big trouble I believe…
Spartacus
November 11th, 2012
11:55 pm
“So obviously you did not watch the game. You must not have seen the play when Al got his pocket picked by Blake Griffin, and did not even bother trying to get back to prevent the dunk Guess that play went unseen. He was not arguing with the refs, so what was his excuse?”
I did not watch all of the game, so I did miss that play, but the point I was trying to make is that in every game I watch, I see Josh complaining, playing lazy defense, shooting the team out of games and playing completely undisciplined ball. Today was just another example of his play taking the team from being competitive with a chance to win to fumbling away possession after possession through bad shots and turnovers. He is a complete moron that thinks more highly of his abilities than he should. Al rarely displays that type of selfish play. You can make excuses all you want for Josh, but there has been absolutely no growth in his ability to play according to his strengths over the past 5 years. There is a reason why the players and coaches have picked Al for the all-star game, and it’s because of the way he plays the game, both intelligently and with his hustle. Josh takes the air out of his teammates with his continuous poor decisions, Al sets them up for succes by setting picks, hustling, and playing within himself. Everyone around that league knows this, which is why you see Josh left open time and again to take those ill-advised jumpers.
High-sider
November 11th, 2012
11:55 pm
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November 11th, 2012
8:59 pm
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northcyde
November 11th, 2012
11:57 pm
Josh is basically aiming his FTs. All of those days practicing 20 foot and 3 point jumpers should’ve been spent practicing FTs. That way, when he does get fouled, he could knock down 70% – 75% of his attempts.
As for the rest of the lineup, it’s almost like Drew is still conducting preseason experiments with this team. We have too many marginal shooters for a guy like Jenkins to not get his chance to produce, just like all of the other “shooters”.
Or maybe the plan is to play some of these guys to increase their trade value.
Who knows?
sameba
November 11th, 2012
11:58 pm
Look what happened today with the HEAT. Basketball is a team game, and the winner is the best team!
EmirS.
November 12th, 2012
12:13 am
Korver, 30 minutes this game?
Somethings wrong. You are telling me that Korver is playing good enough basketball to be in their almost as twice as long as Louis Williams? Korver is a three point specialist…..that’s it. I don’t understand this.
There’s just so many things to comment on. But it’s a continuous thing. Things that have been mentioned for the past 3 years. Nothing has changed. Even though we may be rebuilding, we are not this bad. We are playing horrible basketball.
Rusty
November 12th, 2012
12:13 am
Larry is so incompetent it’s getting hard to watch the hawks.besides from having no idea how to use his players his offense is a choke
sameba
November 12th, 2012
12:15 am
LD is very busy with his so called matchups, but he appears to be forgetting building Hawks’ new identity.
MattP
November 12th, 2012
12:17 am
northcyde,
Hawks have a game tomorrow, so Drew wants to save Stevenson for that game.
The DNP-Back-to-Back is the same thing he did to tmac, and tmac got pissed about it. That tells you this Drew’s idea of saving the guys that can get hurt easily.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
12:21 am
” I see Josh complaining, playing lazy defense, shooting the team out of games and playing completely undisciplined ball. Today was just another example of his play taking the team from being competitive with a chance to win to fumbling away possession after possession through bad shots and turnovers.”
So did Josh Smith lose this game for us? From what I saw, the game was getting out of reach before Josh started being the bad Josh. You stated you did not watch all of the game, so what are you basing your statements on. I personally rarely see any player hustling more of the defensive end of the court on this team more than Josh. Maybe Zaza.
” There is a reason why the players and coaches have picked Al for the all-star game, and it’s because of the way he plays the game, both intelligently and with his hustle.”
Incorrect. That actual reason that he was selected was because he was listed as a center in a conference with no centers except for Dwight Howard.
sameba
November 12th, 2012
12:21 am
I saw a very nice team play just once this season – against OKC. In this game we saw many bad shots, some bad substitutions. However, Hawks had a very nice fluid game. I was hoping our Hawks has finally found its face, but then all this got lost…
Ken Strickland
November 12th, 2012
12:23 am
SPARTACUS-You obviously don’t know you can’t say anything negative about Josh or ROD FROM CP will go nuts and defend him to the end, because to him Josh can do absolutely no wrong. The turnovers, missed shots, the repeated launching of illadvised jumpshots, arguing with the refs and losing focus, trying to play PG by running the break rather than giving it to the PG and filling the lane, and trying to force too many shots, are never ever his fault.
He also feels the same way about Jamal Crawford. He’s taken player worship to an entirely different level. And if you don’t see his chosen player through his delusional eyes, he accuses you of having the same affliction over any other player you might mention. It’s truly weird.
I’m still sick of LDrew. He’s decided he’s going to sink or swim with certain players no matter what, whether they’re providing what’s needed most or producing consistently or not. I remember how under Woodson whenever ALaw or JTeague would have a good gm, Woody would always follow it up with a DNP CD, just like Drew has done with Morrow.
It’s like he’s afraid Morrow will upstage Korver and force him to make a change if he gives him an honest chance. It’s the same BS we saw him do with Teague and Bibby. What’s the deal with Petro? We haven’t heard a thing about his status, or when or if he’ll be able to play.
DeShawn Stevenson Won't Play Back To Back Games | Beyond The Buzzer | Your #1 Off The Court Source
November 12th, 2012
12:24 am
[...] because the Hawks play again Monday and the plan is not to play him in back-to-back games. – Atlanta Journal-Constitution Share post above:FacebookTwitterRedditTumblrEmailRelated [...]
Rusty
November 12th, 2012
1:01 am
There is no justification for all of the stupid things LD does.
Ken Strickland
November 12th, 2012
1:13 am
Here’s one of the main reasons we’re losing and why I’m holding LDrew responsible.
KKorver/AMorrow
MPG 24/14.5, FG% 32.5/61.5, FT% 40/100, 3PT% 30/100, RPG 3.3/1, APG 1.0/0, SPG 1/1.5, TO .75/0, PPG 7/11.
ATolliver/IJohnson
MPG 16.5/8.7, FG% 26.3/66.7, FT% 0/.33, 3P% 30/0, RPG 2.5/3, APG .3/0, SPG .8/.3, BPG .8./.3, TO 1.7/1.3, PPG 3.3/5.7.
For whatever reason, known only to LDrew, he insists on consistently giving the most mins to the least productive among the players he has to choose from. I wonder how long we’ll have to wait before we see another JJenkins sighting? Jenkins earned 2 FT makes while Korver made 1 technical foul, scored 6pts to Korver’s 7, and did it all in just over 5mins compared to over 24Mins for Korver.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
1:30 am
“SPARTACUS-You obviously don’t know you can’t say anything negative about Josh or ROD FROM CP will go nuts and defend him to the end, because to him Josh can do absolutely no wrong.”
Josh did not play well. He actually has not played well at all this year. I have no problem saying that. Al did not play well either. I will ask you Ken, was Josh the reason we lost this game, as the poster suggested? Jamal is balling. He deserves to be talked about. Especially when it proves me correct again against guys who have been wrong more times than right.
cp
November 12th, 2012
1:31 am
LD was doing the same things last year. Guys who should be playing are glued to the bench and guys who should be on the bench are playing. Guy has a great game then gets a DNP and the rotations are still baffling. We need to get a real coach in here.
darrell starks
November 12th, 2012
1:38 am
Im starting to believe that Josh is sorry, there is nothing wrong with Josh at SF problem is he hate working the post so he settle for jumpers in the second half.
LD try to implement for Josh to stay in the post but for some strange reason by the second half he is jacking up jumshots, iF Josh continue to play SF from out side of the arch then the big lineup is useless, because there is no advantage on offensive side, but defensively Josh at SF will make this team better defensively, but allround Josh must play in the paint.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Spartacus
November 12th, 2012
1:44 am
Rod from CP
“I personally rarely see any player hustling more of the defensive end of the court on this team more than Josh. Maybe Zaza.”
Now I know you’ve got your nose so far up Josh’s butt that you can’t see how awful everything on the court flows with him in the game.
“You stated you did not watch all of the game, so what are you basing your statements on.”
I based my statements on being a huge Hawks fan back from the mid 80’s until this day. I watch every game I get a chance to, and my statements aren’t just about today’s game, but the pattern I have observed in Josh’s game since he came into the league. Like I said, I think Josh is an extremely talented player who has absolutely no clue how to play the game and make others better and tries to do too much every time LD tries to run the offense through him. If he would stay on the block, he could dominate most games, but he refuses to play to his strengths, and therefore hurts the team with his selfish decision making. What’s the definition of insanity? Josh Smith (and I don’t mean that as a compliment!)
darrell starks
November 12th, 2012
1:49 am
Why didn’t Morrow Play ? do he have a virus of something.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!
Najeh Davenpoop
November 12th, 2012
2:03 am
Josh in this game: 5/11 in the paint, 1/3 from 3, 0/0 from mid-range.
http://www.peachtreehoops.com/2012/11/11/3632718/hawks-vs-clippers-final-score#126843915
hawksordie
November 12th, 2012
3:30 am
why dont we play teague jenkins morrow scott and al horford as starters ..dont work first dead ball we swap a couple players worth a shot
Rusty
November 12th, 2012
3:47 am
LD will never run this team right,we are doomed.
Just Joe
November 12th, 2012
6:13 am
Didn’t watch the game (football), but for the 3rd game in a row, this comment (from article above) made me believe that these Hawks are still the same old “nice guy” we’ve been watching for years:
The Clippers got physical with the Hawks late in the game and it had an impact, according to Drew.
“We got sped up with the pressure and then we let the officiating bother us a little bit,” Drew said. “As I told them, we can’t play any road game with the mindset that during that game there are going to be calls that they might not like. That cannot affect their play. Tonight, we let some calls get us a little out of character. You can’t play like that on the road. You have to be solid. You have to be focused. We lost focus at the end of the third quarter.”
Just Joe
November 12th, 2012
6:17 am
LD has all these offensive weopons, and he still has us as the 22nd best offense in the league.
ag
November 12th, 2012
7:17 am
Is LD giving Harris minutes so they can shop him? Is LD intentionally holding JT0 back this year becasue it is a contract year?
I did notice both Al and Josh not get back on defense after they made turnovers. That is a coaching problem (NEVER GIVE UP ON ANY PLAY)!! JT0 went to contest the shot (he is great at blocking shots from behind), but CP3 dished on an man going down the lane.
I saw an interesting stat. JT0 was one of 5 players who lead their team in pts and assists. Even though he left with -7, each time he left the game, the Hawks were only down 2 points.
ag
November 12th, 2012
7:38 am
We really need to stop all this Al/Josh bashing. Yes, both should be playing much better. I do see a little growth in Josh posting smaller players, and I agree Horford should be more aggressive with his shots.
I would blame coaching. I actually watched the game again and noticed – nobody cutting to the basket. We don’t have a play that we run pick n roll (except of ZaZa)- it is pick n pop!
Also, the players who are playing the best are getting the least minutes. Why is JT0 the first sub? Why is Korver starting? Why is Morrow getting DNP’s?
If Jenkins is also a one trick pony (I think he is more athletic than Korver and a better ball handler, why not give him run?
Chris Vivlamore
November 12th, 2012
8:12 am
ag: I appreciate your comments/concerns but trust me, I ask the tough questions. I have questioned Drew on starting Korver despite his early struggles. I have questioned Drew about his guard rotation. I questioned Drew about his job following the Mike Brown firing. I will question Drew later today about Morrow not getting in against the Clippers (can’t ask it all at once and I was concentrating on Sunday’s fourth-quarter issues, turnovers and poor shooting. Keep the comments coming but let’s not get carried away with the notion I don’t ask tough questions.
Booker.T
November 12th, 2012
8:30 am
Josh Smith- leaders or captains lead by example. Theirs “no excuse” for quittin on the play and not hustlin back on def on turnovers that u just commited.
Larry Drew- i still cant believe that you are gettin pay to coach a NBA team.Playin Kover over Morrow righ not is clueless.Playin Tolliver over Ivan is just senseless. And not playin Jeff More than 30 minutes a game is just stupid.
Mr. Ferry-its time to make more changes.
keith
November 12th, 2012
8:32 am
Chris Vivlamore
November 12th, 2012
8:48 am
northcyde: Sunday plus Monday equals back-to-back games.
Any update on Yohan Petro? Will he ever get into the rotation?
AZ
November 12th, 2012
8:36 am
I wouldn’t allow Larry Drew to coach a middle school basketball team.
The fact that management and Ferry resigned him in the off season shows how incompetent they truly are. Fire LD and I wish the owners would sell the team to someone who isn’t completely incompetent. How these morons ever became rich enough to own 2 professional sports franchise is one of life’s greatest mysteries.
ag
November 12th, 2012
8:37 am
Questions for a couple of players:
Al Horford
“Without Joe on the team, many people expect you to take a leadership role on the team – especially in scoring. In all three losses, you took 10 or fewer shots. What adjustments will you make to get more shots?” (If he tries those political correct answers, ask questions about offensive rebounding or cutting to the basket).
Josh
“You were very excited coming into this season. You said you were especially please with our outside shooters and called yourself a Mid Range Shawty. Have you changed you opinion of the team?” TRANSLATION, STOP TAKING ALL THOSE DAMN 3 PT SHOTS!
ag
November 12th, 2012
8:42 am
CV – I appreciate you even answering blogs! I do know because of the content of our blogs you do ask many questions but some of those questions you have asked maybe have not been communicated. Those canned “matchup” responses should require follow ups. I am certainly not an Editor and you by far have been great – you are just the closest many of us will ever get to Larry Drew.
Chris Vivlamore
November 12th, 2012
8:48 am
northcyde: Sunday plus Monday equals back-to-back games.
Najeh Davenpoop
November 12th, 2012
8:49 am
“Any update on Yohan Petro? Will he ever get into the rotation?”
Please God no. LD can’t even find minutes for Ivan over Tolliver; the last thing he needs is another useless big man to take away Ivan’s minutes.
LeftyLeach
November 12th, 2012
8:56 am
Ah, Mr. Efficient/ J Smoove.. Hi Potential, low IQ ?? Hoisting 3’s like he’s Reggie Miller, BUT can’t even make free throws? Pouts & whines like a 12 year old? Wonder why he’s not an AllStar? Answer’s pretty clear !
NORRIS CHUCK
November 12th, 2012
8:56 am
UNTIL THEY GET RID OF LARRY DREW AND JOSH, THE HAWKS ARE GOING NOWHERE!
vava74
November 12th, 2012
8:57 am
No Coaching. Pure and simple.
The rest is landscape.
There are no defined roles, all this tinkering with line ups, etc…
Every single time we play a C which any size, LD will cater to Horford and plug Zaza in and shift everyone down.
If you are going to play Josh at the SF you would need to instate a system whereby he would get all touches down low, backing down the SF in ISO plays.
But that is incompatible with the Princeton offense which is based on perimeter ball rotation, so when you play the Princeton offense with Josh at the SF slot, you will see him less and less in the paint and more and more doing what he should not do.
Stop protecting Al from “bigger Centers” because that will cause negative results down stream on both the SF and PF slots.
Where is that incredible PF which Horford is supposed to be? Griffin can’t defend a cardboard figure and Horford did not make a dent.
Play guys where they are known to produce with any consistency:
Josh at the PF slot where he has a speed and athleticism advantage
Al at the C slot where he has a speed and athleticism advantage
Zaza as the paint’s energy guy/bruiser off the bench.
And stop messing with Teague and Ivan and give them the majority of the minutes at the PG and reserve PF slots.
Harris should be strictly used as backup PG (10/14 minutes) and rotate the shooters (Korver/Morrow at the SF and Lou/Jenkins) depending on who is hot.
Use Stephenson as the designated defender (SG/SF) and Tolliver as the end of bench reserve as stop gap player depending on injuries/production/fouls.
It’s not rocket science but for LD is way beyond his reach.
Najeh Davenpoop
November 12th, 2012
9:00 am
In fairness to the Hawks, the Clippers are a very good and very deep team this year. A road loss to them isn’t embarrassing.
In other news, Lakers hire head coach Mike D’Antoni.
ag
November 12th, 2012
9:02 am
Chris V… I know you are the beat writer and you have to have a good rapport with the team and the staff, but you need to ask some tough questions.
“Kyle Korver has started only 10 games since ‘06-07. Does he really give the Hawks the best chance to win?”
“Most starting PG’s in the league are playing 35-42 minutes per game. Jeff was leading the team in scoring in assists. Why is he the first substition, or (more politically correct), do you plan on increasing his minutes?”
“Anthony Morrow has played very well- especially against the Heat. Did he get hurt in the 4th quarter against the Heat?” (If the answer is no) “Why didn’t Morrow play in that big 4th quarter, or even get a DNP against the Clippers?”
I have a lot more and I know you can’t ask him all the questions we want answered, but that certainly is a start.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
9:11 am
“I did notice both Al and Josh not get back on defense after they made turnovers. That is a coaching problem (NEVER GIVE UP ON ANY PLAY)!!”
Thank you. Somebody who actually watched the game, and does not just make emotional comments because they dislike a player.
Ken Strickland
November 12th, 2012
9:14 am
ROD FROM CP-I’m with you on the bashing of LD, but he’s really brought it on himself with his TOO MUCH LIKE MIKE WOODSON approach. Why is is so doggone important to them to play an over the hill or under performing vet over a rookie or less experienced player?
Where did they get this idea that experience will trump talent and/or potential no matter what? When you look at the lack of consistency and/or production we’re getting from Tolliver, Korver, and Stevenson, we certainly wouldn’t suffer any loss of production or consistency by playing Tolliver, Jenkins, Scott or Ivan.
At the end of the last blog of the production between Ivan and Tolliver, and Korver and Morrow. The results were truly revealing. Drew has consistently chosen to give considerably more mins to noticeably inconsistent and less productive veteran players like Korver, Stevenson, and Tolliver. He’s also chosen to all but ignore less experienced, but considerably more productive players like Morrow and IJohnson.
JJenkins can play, but Drew isn’t about to give another rookie a chance to force him into changing his VETERAN PREFERENCE rotation. Once again we’re seeing the JTeague vs MBibby protection plan at work.
Najeh Davenpoop
November 12th, 2012
9:17 am
Not playing Jenkins is more defensible than not playing Teague in 2010-11. Jenkins is a shooter who is stuck behind two veterans who have established themselves as premier shooters in the league. Teague was stuck behind a guy who was a turnstile on defense and as one-dimensional as could be on offense, a guy who had seen every aspect of his game erode away. There is a huge difference. I’d be a lot more p-ssed about Jenkins not playing if either Korver or Morrow was not on the roster.
vava74
November 12th, 2012
9:17 am
Ken,
Woody had many defects as a Head Coach but at least he:
- was consistent with his rotations and with the roles he had for his players;
- instilled a degree of accountability which made Josh play his best season close to the basket without shooting long jumpers and 3 pointers;
LD thinks he can tinker with the line up and play according to match ups and he ends up creating a huge mess.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
9:21 am
“I based my statements on being a huge Hawks fan back from the mid 80’s until this day. I watch every game I get a chance to, and my statements aren’t just about today’s game, but the pattern I have observed in Josh’s game since he came into the league. Like I said, I think Josh is an extremely talented player who has absolutely no clue how to play the game and make others better and tries to do too much every time LD tries to run the offense through him. If he would stay on the block, he could dominate most games, but he refuses to play to his strengths, and therefore hurts the team with his selfish decision making. What’s the definition of insanity? Josh Smith (and I don’t mean that as a compliment!)”
So then please explain what player was responsible for us getting to the playoffs last year in the same spot we always are in and making guys like Willie Green and Pargo have some of the best years of their career. Was it Al Horford? Maybe it was Marvin Williams. Have you considered that maybe, just maybe, Josh does not stay on the block because his coach does not call plays that keep him there? Has that thought ever crossed your mind. Have you considered that maybe, just maybe, Josh and Al continue to bring the ball up the court because the coach tells them to? Have you considered that maybe, just maybe that the offense keeps being run thru Josh because when Teague looks at LD every play, he calls that play? Have those thoughts ever crossed your mind?
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
9:25 am
Look like great effort to me. All star defense at it’s finest.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beMVVzJYIbo
ag
November 12th, 2012
9:28 am
AZ – the last thing Sund did was give LD a 1-year extension. Considering they knew (ownership) Sund was leaving, that was very dumb.. instead of letting new GM pick his guy.
I am not a big LD fan, but last year he would sometimes correct his mistakes along the way. He did play Ivan a little more last night.
keith
November 12th, 2012
9:33 am
Would like to see Petro get into the rotation. Hard to imagine that he could be much worse than our frontline.
ntrigue
November 12th, 2012
9:33 am
Fire Coach Drew he will never get it right!
ntrigue
November 12th, 2012
9:35 am
Go get sloan or Brian Shaw
keith
November 12th, 2012
9:39 am
Kind of wish we had hired Mike D’Antonni as our coach. I believe he can not only guide the ship, but build it as well. Our coach needs to “benchmark”, moving forward. If he does not want to end up like Iron Mike Brown, he needs to settle on a rotation, and stick with it!
Smokey
November 12th, 2012
9:41 am
MattP
November 12th, 2012
12:17 am
The DNP-Back-to-Back is the same thing he did to tmac, and tmac got pissed about it. That tells you this Drew’s idea of saving the guys that can get hurt easily.
__________________________________________________________________________________
Yeah that stuff with tmac was wack, although everyone knows he has issues getting hurt.
What is the story with morrow? Can we get more info on his condition? If he is not hurt then I cant see how he can justify some resting theory, while playing Harris who is older and injury prone.
vava74
November 12th, 2012
9:45 am
The Stephenson back-to-back protection is supposed to allow him to play tonight,
LD at his finest: he saves Stephenson’s legs against the best of the two opponents of a back to back
This guy is f….g hilarious.
vava74
November 12th, 2012
9:47 am
keith,
If you really want to see Petro on the floor, please make sure that you have a paper bag or a bucket near you. You will need it to puke into it.
vava74
November 12th, 2012
9:48 am
Rod,
That was All-Star Al with his PF defense.
Al is faster than most centers BUT slower than most PF and people don’t want to see that.
Un-be-lie-va-ble.
kwooden1
November 12th, 2012
9:55 am
Rod didn’t see this game, but I will watch it later, but clearly Josh has had a poor start to the season. I think you have overstated Josh’s lack of knowledge of the game, his problem has always been his very inconsistent shooting. As a player he can’t get to elite level without being able to make 17-18 footers and to his credit he isn’t scared of taking them, he’s just unable to make them consistently. His inconsistent free-throw shooting is another example. I think though that Josh will turn his season around because right now he’s just trying to hard. (at least that’s what I saw in the Miami game) #1 thing Josh needs to do is not settle for open jumpshots and drive to the basket. I’ve seen that he gets himself in a much better rhythm when he drives right to left and makes some jump hooks.
Oveall though we should lose to Miami and the Clippers, they are better than us.
GO HAWKS!
ag
November 12th, 2012
10:03 am
Actually Keith, Petro is very bad!
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
10:16 am
Spartacus
November 11th, 2012
8:39 pm
I COULDNT HAVE SAID IT BETTER MYSELF!! U WERE RIGHT ON POINT!!!!!
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
10:18 am
“In fairness to the Hawks, the Clippers are a very good and very deep team this year. A road loss to them isn’t embarrassing.
A very good team who’s leading scorer is who?
ag
November 12th, 2012
10:22 am
The overall problem is not that we lost to the Clipper ans the Heat – certainly nothing to be ashamed of. It is the way we lost. We clearly in both games, and even thoush the score does not show it, this was a very hard fought battle. A couple of turning points…
1. Korver is one of the first staters to close the game. He was checking Jamal Crawford.
2. After scoring two 3 pointers in the third, JT0 goes out for D Harris. The Hawks were down by 2 points. He was the last starter to return and the Hawks were down 12. (Similar to the Miama and Indiana game.)
3. Josh and Al made turnovers and did not run down the court to contest dunks. One, JT0 contested an easy layup by CP3, but earned an assist from Barnes.
4. The 4th quarter got out of hand within 4 minutes. On the floor were Tolliver, Korver, Harris, Ivan, Josh.
vava74
November 12th, 2012
10:50 am
I haven’t been online too much but people harping on Josh and making excuses for Horford are waaaaaay wrong.
Apart from the OKC game, where has Horford been during crunch time?
There is no doubt that Josh played poorly against MIA but in the 4th quarter, apart from the missed free throws – which is inexcusable – Josh posted the following (in 10 minutes):
2/3FG, 3 rebounds, 2 steals, 1 block
Horford (in 12 minutes)?
1/4FG, 2 rebounds, 1 assist
As for last night, everyone played like cr@p in the 4th, Horford included in the minutes he was on the floor.
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
10:51 am
Mike Bresnahan: Source: Mike D’Antoni will be the next coach of the Lakers. Not Phil Jackson. Twitter @Mike_Bresnahan
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
10:58 am
Agree kwooden Josh is trying to do too much. I have always said Josh nor Al are not #1 options, because their offensive games are flawed. Josh is simply trying to do too much, and needs to get back to easy shots. The problem is that without Joe, there is nobody else on the floor to take the pressure off of him. Everyone else, Teague and Horford pass up too many open shots, and still defer to Josh for whatever reason. Joe in all of his flaws commanded attention which opened the floor up for other players. Jamal did that as well. Nobody on this roster does that except maybe Lou Williams when he is hot.
Rusty
November 12th, 2012
11:06 am
How could LarryDrew be around bAsketball almost all of his life & have such a poor feel for the game.it almost seems like he wants us to fail.Why is he just so stuborn that he consistently pulls JT out of the game,plays his favorites & is so stupid & unfair.His Princeton offense is a big joke.
Rusty
November 12th, 2012
11:09 am
Every time LD brings Lou in the game he also brings in Harris regardless of the circumstances.Josh play is on LD.
Slap Dog Hoops
November 12th, 2012
11:23 am
I had an inkling that the Hawks would fall to better teams such as the Clippers. The fact is that their two top players would be third or fourth option on other NBA teams.
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
11:56 am
Out of all but 5 games we have placed so far, we have had only 1 easy, smoove, flow of a game that we won against the W Conf Champs, OKC, and it was WON w/o Josh Smith!!
According to vava74, “Apart from the OKC game, where has Horford been during crunch time?” Great question, by the way, but lets flip that to say, “Apart from the other 4 games WITH Josh Smith, how was Horford during crunch time w/o Josh Smith?”
Danny Ferry SHOULD do 1 or 2 things. Since its still very early in the season, I say cut Drew since 9 times out of 10, he WONT be returning as the Hawks head coach next season anyways and allow a head coach with a decent to great resume (Jerry Sloan) come in to see what he could do with “Josh Smith and the new-crew Hawks” hoping that this new coach (Jerry Sloan) can control Josh to the point that he can indeed because an AllStar and lead this team pass the 2nd round in the playoffs. If the new coach (Jerry Sloan) cant control Josh, Danny THEN should definitely look to trade Josh b4 the trade deadline and maybe try and trade him to a sorry team to get their top lottery pick considering the fact that the team will STILL be sorry cause Josh would be added to an already sorry team making our chances for a lottery pick greater!! If the owner of the already sorry team wont take a chance on Josh and losing their opportunity for a lottery pick (smart choice by-the-way), I say, just make the trade that was suggested by Jae Evolution with “Josh and Morrow for W. Chandler, Faried and Mozgov/Koufos”.
I would take my chances with the Horford that played W/O Josh than the Horford that plays WITH Josh..ANYDAY!!
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
12:14 pm
In last night’s game, Horford may have had 1 or 2 nice productive moves in the post vs Josh’s 5 or 6 unproductive moves in the post cause he neither scored nor drew a foul on his plays. Now granted, against Indiana, those moves worked but when they arent, go to someone else’s who is working, COACH LARRY DREW!!
ag
November 12th, 2012
12:18 pm
Funny how this blog is split between Josh and Al. I tend to agree with most people, neither one of them are superstars. They both when they play their games can be very good players. Josh should be a 20/10 guy. Al should be a 18/10 guy. Anything less, there is a problem.
Al has one of the best jumpers in the game, and he is very athletic. He has very soft hands. I love his pick and roll game (even though we don’t see it) because he finishes very well. His main problem is he is not assertive enough.
Josh has the biggest heart on the team and actually has a tatoo of a Hawk over his heart or arm… He is still very athletic and has some really good post moves. He can be a terror on defense and can actually take over a game. Yet, he can shoot you out of a game, although his jumper is butter when it it on, the question is “when”. He certainly tries to hard on the offensive end and sometimes does not flow within the game. His problem is being to assertive.
Again, the Hawks problems, and I said it last year, coaching each player up. ALthough this is the NBA – neither one of these guys have “Kobe” power. ESPN will not blink twice if Josh is sitting on the bench for not following instructions.
My biggest concern is Josh is playing for a contract. They way he is playing now, a max deal is far out of reach.
Harpie
November 12th, 2012
12:22 pm
SCREW DREW!!!!!!
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
12:27 pm
“I would take my chances with the Horford that played W/O Josh than the Horford that plays WITH Josh..ANYDAY!!”
That is why there will never be any women presidents or women gm’s. You would make your decision based on one game, as opposed to a whole year. Talk about emotion. LOL
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
12:53 pm
Yea Rod, whatever!! If u can only take that 1 statement I made vs the rest than..well…ummm,..shoot, I have no comment!!
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
12:54 pm
I still proved my point about Josh..I will STILL keep AL!!
vava74
November 12th, 2012
12:54 pm
MsDee,
I agree with your proposal of getting a real coach on board to determine what can be done out of BOTH Josh and Al.
I have no problem with that since i have been advocating Drew’s dismissal for loooooong and that would be the best way to determine what to do with this roster.
Like this, its like testing a car using a blind driver.
57 STATES
November 12th, 2012
12:59 pm
make me wonder what the million dollar Osh has been doing all summer.
sure hasn’t been practicing free throws or dribbling or learning leadership skills enough to make a difference.
KCG
November 12th, 2012
1:06 pm
There was a difference between the Horford no hustle play and Josh’s no hustle play. When Blake stole the pass coming to Al there was no way Al could have caught up with the most atletic man in the game with a running head start to contest the shot. On Josh’s turnover he was already in front of the trailing Clipper’s player and the guy with the ball had another Hawks player with him to contest the shot. Guys miss contested layups all the time so Josh could have been there to pick up the rebound. Blake Griffin was not going to miss a break away lay up with no one in front of him to contest it. Al’s no hustle was understandable in my opinion Josh’s not so much.
O'Brien
November 12th, 2012
1:22 pm
Josh and Al both have their issues, but as Hawks fans, we should not be choosing between them. The bigger issue to me is LD and his rotations.
Morrow was on fire early against Miami, and then LD does not play him in the 4thQ. In 5 games, Morrow has 3 DNPCD, and has played 29 minutes. Korver is struggling, and has played 136 minutes.
And LD can’t find more minutes for Ivan? Ivan has played 40 minutes thos season, Tolliver has played 83 minutes. Also, he plays Josh at SF, and Al at PF, which is not heir best position.
keith
November 12th, 2012
1:27 pm
Coach Drew has been a career assistant coach, suffice it to say that he has been a career assistant for a reason. He is the Dave Campo of the NBA?(Longtime Dallas Cowboy Assistant who flopped as a head coach.)
ag
November 12th, 2012
1:40 pm
As much as I don’t like LD, I cannot say he flopped. The alternative is on the bench with Bob Weiss. That is the flop! If we get another coach, go get Sloan. With Sloan, he will mold this team. Don’t remember Karl taking any 3’s. PF’s will be posted near the basket.
prison mike
November 12th, 2012
1:41 pm
Horford plays defense like a WNBA center. He consistently allows players easy access to the rim without contesting or fouling.
He’s getting abused by all the 4s we faced. He’s gotten by on guarding centers with little offensive game. Be careful what you wish for because Shareef was the best offensive 4 the Hawks have had in the past 20 years however his game was negated by the opposition.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
2:32 pm
“There was a difference between the Horford no hustle play and Josh’s no hustle play.”
No there was not. He got his pocket picked and literally stood there and did not even attempt to get back. Josh in that same situation would have run back and tried to block the dunk. I have seen that on numerous occasions.
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
2:46 pm
OB,
“Josh and Al both have their issues, but as Hawks fans, we should not be choosing between them.”
Yes we should be choosing between the 2 cause 1 of those guys makes decisions that causes the rest of the players on the court confused and out of place while the other one plays within his game and puts us in a better situation to win winnable games.
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
2:50 pm
Both the Heat AND Clippers games were very winnable games!! In my opinion, of course, we could have won both games without Josh’s play if the game would have been played the way we won it against OKC and only if we had played it the very same way..with Horford demanding the ball like he did and with Teague’s play in that game as well..NO DOUBT ABOUT IT!!
Mike is Back
November 12th, 2012
2:54 pm
I missed the clips game…but I recorded it…something tell me as a huge Josh fan…to just hit the dang delete button and move on.lol
Najeh, I was thinking the same thing about DHarris…dude has been average at best thus far…I guess after the Thunder game…LD thought dude was money.
The last time I seen Josh play…he was pressing really hard…sound like LD let play some SF…hmmmmmmm.lol
ANY, GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The Truth
November 12th, 2012
2:56 pm
As I said some blogs ago, LD will get no sympathy from Hawksville if he continues his insanity approach of making bad coaching decisions that have apparently lead to a bridge nowhere.
Chemistry Issues
You would think after a summer league, camp, pre-season and 5 regular season games; LD would have a better idea about his players. What each player strengths and weaknesses are when they are match with different team mates. From these latest two loses, rule number #1:
Never start the 4tth quarter with Lou Williams as PG with Devin Harris as the SG.
Rule #2:
Never forget Rule #1
Since Lou has publicly said his preference was playing “off the ball” or SG (in his case), why is LD not listening or seeing the obvious? As a PG, Lou is TO prone as the Clippers and Miami exploited. In the 4th quarter those TO will kill any momentum as was the case in the last 2 games. Devin is at his best as a facilitating PG who is mostly a subpar and certainly not elite jump-shooter, so why is he a SG in the 4th quarter at a crucial time when the team needs to make a come-from-behind-run also the case in the last two games.
LD does not reward performance instead he rewards roles he cast on his players. Regardless of how well players like Morrow or Ivan or even Jenkins perform, LD will keep them in a “cast straight jacket”. Certainly, Morrow and Ivan should get more minutes while the poorer performers should get less. If he continues to have a tight rotation consisting of with players that aren’t gelling together, his losses will mount and Danny will have an easier case to fire him.
FACTS
November 12th, 2012
3:06 pm
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
12:27 pm
“I would take my chances with the Horford that played W/O Josh than the Horford that plays WITH Josh..ANYDAY!!”
That is why there will never be any women presidents or women gm’s. You would make your decision based on one game, as opposed to a whole year. Talk about emotion. LOL
___________________________________________________________________________
Speaking of women being emotional, like riding the stones of Josh just because he’s a native Atlanta – College Park guy is any better. If he couldn’t dunk and wasn’t from College Park, you’d say he was trash.
FACTS
November 12th, 2012
3:09 pm
Yes, when Josh Smith screws up he always hustles back on defense. He NEVER turns to the ref first and cries before he decided to get back on defense. No, that never happens.
FOH
Baby
November 12th, 2012
3:11 pm
Does anyone feel like LD’s only game plan going into a game is to match people up on defense? Where is our offensive idenity?
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
3:24 pm
FACTS,
If Josh never hustles as some people say and you obvouisly feel, then how does he have almost 1500 blocks for his career. One of the youngest and smallest guys to accomplish that. He obviosly did not get them guarding his man, because many here will say he is an average man to man defender, so where did all the blocks come from? Go to you tube and look at any of the Josh Smith highlight videos and I can with a lot of certainty promise you that a lot of his defensive highlights will be him blocking shots from behind or covering for team mates who play lazy soft defense.
FACTS
November 12th, 2012
3:28 pm
Josh Smith and Al Horford are not superstars!!!
For every play you guys claim Al is timid, there is another play where Josh tries to do too much and costs the team. So it cancels it other out.
The Hawks wont survive with both, but at least Al plays within his game instead of trying to be a superman, when in reality he’s more like one of Captain Planet’s planeteers (Josh Smith).
Grandad
November 12th, 2012
3:31 pm
The Hawks mailed it in.
I was gonna do the same but then I finally read the article.
My coaching instincts kicked in [LD pissed me off] one in the same.
I cannot imagine, being his asst, and having to sit beside him
while he would c o n t i n u o u s l y dumbfound the snot oughta me.
My 1st take on the Hawks and the turnovers are:
They Are Not Fundamentally Sound !
-note- with example:
For those who think I am not balanced in my critique;
Al;
simply did not meeet his pass once – defender shot the gap -
steal / turnover … easily remedied … practice / repition !
It has nothing to do with forgetting the game-plan
or losing composure. -quoth LD-
“We are what we repeatedly do” … -Aristotle-
So evidently that concept wasn`t invented yesterday.
_____________________________________________
And besides that – ” They mailed it in ” `G-Dad
_____________________________________________
Rusty
Trading Marv was still “all ” good.
Somethin` tells me were showcasing DHarris for a trade.
_____________________________________________
25 to go
Rusty
November 12th, 2012
3:34 pm
The hawks offense runs best with JT at pg,not with Harris or Williams at pg.it seems often that the offense is running tru Josh. LD’s Princeton offense looks very shoddy.
The Truth
November 12th, 2012
3:41 pm
“Hawks Josh Smith and Lou Williams sick. Status undetermined for tonight’s game vs. Blazers. #ATLHawks” – CViv
LOL, Sick because how they perform?
“Likely Hawks lineup vs, Blazers. Teague, Korver, Stevenson, Smith/Tolliver, Horford. #ATLHawks” – CViv
Same old Sh!t
Grandad
November 12th, 2012
3:41 pm
There is no dif in a No Hustle play.
I missed a portion of the game.
* [two mormons came to my door - no punchline]
Al`s No Hustle play was inexcusable.
* [I did not see Josh`s]
amidst all the others distributed equally between teammates [`ALL]
I never gave JJohnson a break for not hustling; [which he Never did]
nor will I for Al.
Josh neither gets a pass for going balls to the wall half the time,
while pouting, whining, and bitching the other half.
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
3:46 pm
If my “basketball prayers” are answered and we get Jerry Sloan, trust me, Josh would not be the 1st opt. It would be Horford cause Sloan will make Horford his Karl Malone. With Horford’s deadly jumper and productive post moves, it would be easy to create the pick and role for Teague and Horford from the Coach of Pick and Roles himself, Coach Jerry Sloan!! Oh Mr Ferry, could u make that call to Coach Sloan ASAP!!!!
Slimjr
November 12th, 2012
3:50 pm
Who’s going to guard the Allstar LaMarcus Aldridge tonight at the 4? Get you Popcorn ready!
OH THE HUMANITY….
Slimjr
November 12th, 2012
4:00 pm
We luv ya MsDee:
11pts on 10 shots…Hmmmmmmm
She said What???????????????
Al compares to Karl Malone, one of the Greatest Power Forwards to ever lace up his shoes with over 36,400 points scored in his career in the NBA?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE
Try another one, would ya? If any coach could turn Al into their version of Karl Malone he would not be coaching in the NBA cause he could probably turn water into wine! LMAO!!!!!!!
prison mike
November 12th, 2012
4:01 pm
Horf is going to get smoked by LA. Ain’t no way around it.
prison mike
November 12th, 2012
4:04 pm
Portland -3 points, locked that in. Get it before it balloons.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
4:11 pm
“Al`s No Hustle play was inexcusable.
* [I did not see Josh`s]
amidst all the others distributed equally between teammates [`ALL]”
Glad to know that you can be fair Grandad, unlike others here.
Grandad
November 12th, 2012
4:13 pm
While it`s relevant:
when BGriff stole that pass … Al should have chased him down
and snot-knocked him into the cheap seats.
*[pay back]
The Truth
November 12th, 2012
4:14 pm
I’m noticing how undisciplined Lou has been playing since being a Hawk vs. at Philly. Like Josh, LD will just let Lou launch repeatedly bad shots without any consequences something Doug Collins would never allow. Just because they have been labeled the “the star players” shouldn’t mean they are immune to being chastised by their coach.
If LD doesn’t address the players’ bad behaviors, there will be no improvements only more of the same; like poor FT%, TOs and other missed opportunities.
Grandad
November 12th, 2012
4:15 pm
Thanks Rod
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
4:15 pm
“Try another one, would ya? If any coach could turn Al into their version of Karl Malone he would not be coaching in the NBA cause he could probably turn water into wine! LMAO!!!!!!!”
Karl Malone is a 25 and 10 guy for his career ,and never backed down from anyone. Al well ….. LOL
HawkEye
November 12th, 2012
4:16 pm
At this point, it is getting harder and harder to say that LD will make it through the rest of the season. I know Danny Ferry does not want to fire LD in the middle of the season, but if this trend of inconsistent (and in some cases consistent) coaching continues, he may be left with no other choice. However, the only ways I see LD being fired is if 1) the Hawks accumulate multiple losing streaks this season or 2) a huge flare up with him and the team or a player occurs that Danny discovers.
About this whole Josh and Al thing, they both have their flaws, but when they both play the right way they make this team a lot better.
One thing that bothers me about Al is his lack of aggression on a daily basis and that he does not demand the ball enough. I think they need to involve Al more in the beginning of games and establish him on the low block. He may not realize it (or if he does like it), but he actually plays better at center. His ability to knock down that jumper keeps his defender honest and can create offensive rebounding opportunities by drawing the center out on the perimeter.
Josh is going to take those jumpers and to his credit, he does not miss all the time. What bothers me about Josh is not only his free throw shooting (which I hope will get better) but also that he often times takes too many of those jumpshots (esp. when they are not falling). I don’t know who I fault more for this. Is LD purposefully putting Josh out on the perimeter or is Josh purposefully drifting out there. If anyone is to blame IMO it would have to be LD. If you are going to play Josh at SF, then run plays where his is posting up his (usually smaller) defender. Also, I think not having Joe here makes Josh think that he must carry the offensive load which might account for why he takes so many shots a game.
A couple of other thought:
*Do the Hawks have a DLeague affiliate team? If so, can we send Jenkins and Scott so they can develop?
*Morrow’s DNP-CD after he scored 17 points in the Miami game is another reason I think LD will not last this season. I’m sure his reasoning for this would be “match-ups”.
*Harris, Korver, and Tolliver are still getting too many minutes. Veteran preference is killing the Hawks.
*Teague needs to play more in the 4th quarter.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
4:22 pm
“I’m noticing how undisciplined Lou has been playing since being a Hawk vs. at Philly. Like Josh, LD will just let Lou launch repeatedly bad shots without any consequences something Doug Collins would never allow. Just because they have been labeled the “the star players” shouldn’t mean they are immune to being chastised by their coach.”
That’s the point I have been making even since backing up Jamal for the last couple of years. With th offense we run Jamal and Lou’s job is to come in a score at all cost. It does not matter to the coach if they are taking bad shots, they are to come off the bench, and get up as many shots as they can. You can’t blame the player, if the coach is directing him to shoot. Similar to Josh our sets always have Horford and Josh standing on the perimeter with no movement. LD tells Josh to shoot those jumpers if he is open, and we all know he will always be open. We start the games off going to Josh on the block, and after the second quarter, youu never see that play again. the team reverts back to what they know.
Slimjr
November 12th, 2012
4:27 pm
LaMarcus Aldridge:
OH THE HUMANITY!
Slimjr
November 12th, 2012
4:30 pm
This guy is an assistant trying to play Head Coach and just like Wade Phillips [NFL]it does not work for some..Go back and do what you do best: assist. Ummmmmmmmm
round peg / square hole
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
4:42 pm
Ok Mr. Slimjr,
The reason that Malone is “one of the Greatest Power Forwards to ever lace up his shoes with over 36,400 points scored in his career in the NBA”, and to Rod from CP, the reason that Malone has been “a 25 and 10 guy for his career” is because Karl Malone has had a COACH FROM THE BEGINNING OF HIS CAREER (unlike Horford who has had umm Woodson and umm what Drew right??)who KNEW how to make and put him into many situations to score the ball effectively WITHOUT allowing anyone else to create mishaps along the way, someone lets say, like a ummm a Josh Smith cause TRUST ME, if Josh was the age that he is today BACK THEN on Utah’s team, Josh’s BUTT WOULD BE BURIED ON THE BENCH FO SHO!! He would be getting the Morrow treatment right about now!
Poor Horford has had to have a very steady career thus far with coaches like Woodson and Drew to STILL become a 2TIME ALLSTAR!! Now image Horford STARTING his career with umm, lets say a Jerry Sloan from the beginning………………ummmmmmmmmmmm, WOW, lets just leave IT at THAT!!
The Truth
November 12th, 2012
4:42 pm
“With th offense we run Jamal and Lou’s job is to come in a score at all cost”
So true Rod, LD must have learned that trick from his former HC Woody because he deployed Flip Murray the same way.
cp
November 12th, 2012
4:43 pm
They should beat the Blazers but it all depends on what LD does with the minutes tonight. Guys who aren’t producing need to be sitting. Guys who are playing well need to play more minutes. Its as simple as that but for some reason this escapes LD.
The Teague vs Lillard matchup will be entertaining to see only if LD lets the dude play more than 26 minutes. Lillard was being compared to Teague when coming out of college. He has been a lot better than I thought he would be.
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
4:45 pm
HawkEye,
“Also, I think not having Joe here makes Josh think that he must carry the offensive load which might account for why he takes so many shots a game.”
What!! Josh has been doing that every since he has put on a Hawks jersey!! Has NOTHING to do with JJ being gone.
Rusty
November 12th, 2012
4:47 pm
Ferry can’t.really evaluate this team or players as long as LD has control.
Jay Dubu
November 12th, 2012
4:49 pm
Harris is playing as he always has. Don’t expect anything different the rest of the season. Just count on him not being here next season. That was the straw that stirred the Marvin trade for Harris. Marvin has another year on his contract after this year, and Harris only has this year.
Goood trade for money reasons. Now the GM has to find a player worthy of earning that 8+ mil next year.
MsDee
November 12th, 2012
4:50 pm
Rusty,
“Ferry can’t.really evaluate this team or players as long as LD has control.”
Well, if thats the case, Ferry should just fire Drew now so he can BEGIN to evaluate the team properly. Problem solved there!
Slimjr
November 12th, 2012
4:51 pm
Hey Rod check out the Highlites on NBA.com..
Rudy Gay: one on one against Lebron at the top of the key dribbles with his left crosses over behind his back as he drives, Labron reaches for air as he tries to steal the dribble, Rudy takes two steps and elevates in the paint with a GIGANTIC TOMAHAWK DUNK!!! The Miami bigs wanted no part of that poster! LOL!
This dude is 6′9″ with two guard ability at the three, but Billy Knight wanted no part of it..
Enamored with the Stiff, SHELL HEAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!@#$%^&*()
Jay Dubu
November 12th, 2012
4:58 pm
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but, both Josh and Al are overpaid for what they bring to the table. But that seems to be par for the course in the NBA.
The two of them are making ~43% of the Hawks payroll, and neither sells any additional tickets.
When a player causes fannies to be in the seats, they can are worth as much as they can get. That is why when certain teams / players come are on the schedule for the Highlight Factory, the ticket prices are raised, and their jerseys are in the fan shop.
EmirS.
November 12th, 2012
5:10 pm
Mike Brown could not help Lebron win a ring in Cleveland. He (Mike brown) did reach the Finals once. Coach Brown was not able to navigate a Kobe/Gasol/Bynum team to the Finals last year and had a VERY poor start with a Kobe/Gasol/Howard/Nash team going only 1-4. With Nash being out two of those games. Interm GM, Bernie Bickerstaff, has the team 2-0 already. I’m sure we are all in agreement that Mike Brown is a MASSIVE upgrade over Larry Drew.
Now, question:
With all that in mind, as we are rebuilding is Mike Brown a possible fit to rebuild this Hawks team around as far as coaching wise?
Just Joe
November 12th, 2012
5:18 pm
Josh and Lou sick tonight. Not sure if either will play yet.
mp
November 12th, 2012
5:26 pm
You seen this discussion thread on Reddit?
http://www.reddit.com/r/AtlantaHawks/comments/12ybm5/taking_stock/
Couple of things there got my attention…
hot.trod.87
November 12th, 2012
5:26 pm
For the first time this season the Hawks’ bench failed to outscore their opponent’s bench. The Clippers’ reserves held a 35-32 advantage…. No Desean Stevenson or Morrow. Jenkins in too late. relied too much on Harris. Guard DeShawn Stevenson did not play. The veteran was held out because the Hawks play again Monday and the plan is not to play him in back-to-back games…..losing perimeter defenders in Joe & Marvin has put a lot of defensive pressure on our guys guarding in the paint, I’d like to give Mike Scott some burn because he can play some defense…That besides Stevenson….Teague still gets caught in screens Anthony morrow and Lou should play a lot in the 4th. Jenkins should get good pt in the 2nd/3rd since he’s a rookie….Rotate Al and Josh…never sit out BOTH Stevenson & Morrow…someone has to rotate Al &Josh in and out. Petro really needs to bring his butt back.
hot.trod.87
November 12th, 2012
5:27 pm
Hard losing when you outrebound the Clippers 41-38. Have 1 less assist than them. Lead in blocked shots 9-6 & free throws 16-8. League had 8 points & 6 assists..Zaza had 5 points 6 rebounds…Coach Drew put a DNP by Stevenson & Morrow…Smith, Lou, & Horford were the only ones in double figure. Not Zaza, Teague or Korver of the starters. DNP Morrow & Stevenson. rookies in too late??Devin Harris played 25 minutes for 5 points & 4 rebounds…. Jenkins played 4 minutes with 6 points & 2 rebounds.
Slimjr
November 12th, 2012
5:27 pm
Ans:
Woody>WoodyLite>WoodyLite Jr[ aka, MIKE Brown]
Coach Brown went [1-12] [ including the preseason] [kick rocks Coach]!
hot.trod.87
November 12th, 2012
5:28 pm
Ms. Dee doesn’t know what she’s talking about
mp
November 12th, 2012
5:29 pm
Also, CV, you’re doing a tremendous job here. Keep up the good work.
And to my fellow commenters… Take a breath, guys. You’re going to hurt yourselves jerking your knees this hard. Season’s still young, and it’s going to take a good month or two before the Hawks are comfortable with all their new guys and how they fit into the system. Just relax and enjoy.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
5:33 pm
“Ms. Dee doesn’t know what she’s talking about”
That’s already been proven. She is here for laughs.
Rod from College Park
November 12th, 2012
5:35 pm
Slimjr,
I would take Rudy Gay over Al and maybe Josh straight up right now. He’s got game.
Slimjr
November 12th, 2012
5:39 pm
Yes Sir. I concur one hundred percent.
hot.trod.87
November 12th, 2012
5:41 pm
I said Drew would lower the value of Lou and look at him using Lou for something other than what he is
sameba
November 12th, 2012
5:43 pm
”
While it`s relevant:
when BGriff stole that pass … Al should have chased him down
and snot-knocked him into the cheap seats.
*[pay back] ”
Grandad, I always greatly enjoy your posts, but did not expect that you were that great !!
Totally agree – Al should start to be the man, or he will not be very successful…
hot.trod.87
November 12th, 2012
5:56 pm
What if Al made those free throws against Boston in Game 6 last year when Boston was up by 2 with a little over 2 seconds to go???
hot.trod.87
November 12th, 2012
5:57 pm
Rod,
I wouldn’t take Rudy Gay because he’s playing with Zebo and Marc Gasol… I’d take Josh with Al & Dwight over that matchup any day
hot.trod.87
November 12th, 2012
5:58 pm
Put Rudy Gay in the Hawks system he’s be as confused as Josh and Al, because Larry Drew is the coach