Atlanta Hawks: Roster breakdown
Vivlamore reporting from Hawks practice. Here is the roster breakdown story for Tuesday’s print edition of the AJC.
Less than a week remains before NBA rosters must be trimmed to a maximum of 15 players by Monday. The Hawks brought 19 players into training camp and the roster now stands at one over the limit. It is possible the team will go into the regular season with fewer than the maximum, allowing management flexibility to make an early-season trade or signing.
Here is a look at how the roster is shaping up prior to the Nov. 2 regular-season opener.
Roster size
The Hawks will have at least 13 players on their roster. Only 13 will be active for games. They have guaranteed contracts with 11 veterans and first-round draft pick John Jenkins. Second-round pick Mike Scott has a partially guaranteed contract. His contract becomes fully guaranteed if he is still on the roster Jan. 10.
Of keeping all 13 guarantees on the roster head coach Larry Drew said, “That is pretty set.”
Drew said he and general manager Danny Ferry have yet to decide on how many players they will keep.
“For me, and I’ve done it both ways,” Drew said of staying at or below the maximum. “We’ve had 13 and we’ve kept two spots open. I’ve had 14 and we’ve kept one. Or we’ve kept 15 guys. It’s a matter of looking at what we feel is going to be the best for our club. We’ve got some guys in here who are fighting for a roster spot. Guys I really like. After this is all said and done we’ll sit down with management and make a decision.”
Three for one
If the Hawks keep 15 players that leaves Anthony Tolliver, Damion James and James Anderson competing for the two remaining spots. Tolliver (6-foot-8) and James (6-7) give the Hawks options at the forward position. Anderson (6-6) is a guard, a position the Hawks have depth. Defensive ability, and how quickly each learns schemes, may well decide who stays.
Stepping up
James has impressed with his play during exhibition games. He has appeared in five games, including two starts, and has averaged 7.4 points and 7.0 rebounds. He came off the bench in Saturday’s win over Dallas and had 10 points and seven rebounds in less than 17 minutes.
“I think I’ve been doing pretty good the whole preseason,” James said. “I’m going to continue to play the way I play. If you play the way you are supposed to play, good things will happen.”
In six exhibitions, Tolliver has averaged 8.0 points and 3.7 rebounds. Anderson, in five games, has averaged 1.8 points and 0.8 rebounds.
Going small
In the numerous offseason moves made by Ferry, the Hawks became a smaller team than in the recent past. It’s an issue, especially on the defensive end, that the team will have to overcome.
“We might just be a little undersized,” Josh Smith said. “We were undersized before but we are very undersized now. That shouldn’t be an issue. We have a lot of feisty and competitive people on this team who hate to lose. I think that will outweigh the so-called decreases that this team has.”
Guards
The Hawks consider their three speedy guards, all capable of playing the point, an asset. Jeff Teague returns with Devin Harris and Lou Williams added to the mix. Harris and Williams, and perhaps eventually Teague, can also play shooting guard. Each are an option to replace Joe Johnson.
The Hawks added a number of long-range shooters at the position in Kyle Korver, DeShawn Stevenson, Anthony Morrow and Jenkins.
Forwards
Smith will return as the power forward. Ivan Johnson and Scott will be backups. Johnson can play center if pressed into action. Korver and Stevenson may see time at small forward.
“That gives us some flexibility from the standpoint that if we need to adapt and make some minor adjustments with our lineup we have the ability to do that,” Drew said.
Centers
A healthy Al Horford will start at center. He will be backed up by Zaza Pachulia and Johan Petro. There will be times when Drew wants a bigger lineup that Pachulia will play center, Horford power forward and Smith small forward.
Bench
The starting lineup is to be determined at shooting guard and small forward. It appears that Harris and Stevenson will initially fill those positions based on exhibition games. However, Drew stresses no decisions have been made and the lineup likely will change based on matchups.
The coach said he will sit down with each player this week to discuss his role. He wants to avoid any confusion.
“So everybody will be clear,” Drew said. “So there won’t be any guess work about ‘What am I supposed to do? What do you want me to do?’ We’ll eliminate that.”
- Chris Vivlamore
LATEST NEWS
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* Many options at small forward
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310 comments Add your comment
Jerry Glanville
October 22nd, 2012
7:42 pm
@STEVEN A SMITH
I just do not believe we will move ahead of Indiana or Boston because of our poor frontcourt play.
Boston, Indiana, NewYork, and Miami, all have superior frontcourts to ours!!!
get back on your meds. bro. Our center is better than Tyson Chandler, Kevin Garnett, Roy Hibbert, or Chris Bosh. Get a clue steven a. Al is a 2-time nba allstar.
Big Ray
October 22nd, 2012
7:54 pm
stephen a. smith ,
Boston’s frontcourt is unquestionably better than ours because of Garnett and Pierce, two long-time multiple all-star players are stars overall. Both are former superstars and have every single piece of the puzzle in place to STILL beat most frontcourt opponents.
As far as Indiana goes, it’s all about who they have playing SF vs. who WE have at SF. They can go with Paul George or Danny Granger. We could barely match that in the past, definitely can’t do it now.
Otherwise, do you really believe that Hibbert/West > Horford/Smith? I don’t.
Grandad
October 22nd, 2012
7:57 pm
-two items-
(1st) The Lakers were evidently doin` something right in Minny.
Seriously how many of those Chmpnships came in Minny ?
” The mikan era ”
(2nd) For those still pining over Benson;
I just do not see why.
” saying “we already messed up once ”
Benson was not physical enough to be as deficient in skill
as he was – case closed. *[he could block a shot now & then] thats it.
ctrim
October 22nd, 2012
8:03 pm
Benson is still a long term project and we have too many guaranteed contracts on our Team to keep him. Next year could be a different story since I believe we only have Al and Lou signed beyond this year. We have a lot of very talented individuals playing in their last year of a contract – dont underestimate the power of motivation. Anderson is the logical choice to be cut but we’ve seen stranger things before. Trust Ferry will make the right player/coaching changes necessary.
Big Ray
October 22nd, 2012
8:05 pm
get back on your meds. bro. Our center is better than Tyson Chandler, Kevin Garnett, Roy Hibbert, or Chris Bosh. Get a clue steven a. Al is a 2-time nba allstar.
I’d argue that Garnett is better. Even at his age, with the miles he has on his body. He’s still better.
As for everybody else…
Bosh is a stretch 4, can’t play the 5. But if I’m choosing one or the other to be my PF, it’s also gonna depend on what kind of team I have. If you want a defender/help rebounder, go with Horford. If you want a rebounder and reliable scorer, go with Bosh.
If you have a legit “big guy” at center who can hold his own at that spot and doesn’t need to be rotated over to PF so that you can have a bigger lineup….then give me Bosh all day long. He’s a more complete package than Horford on offense…scores inside, scores outside…but you’ll need that defensive stalwart at center because Bosh is a punk for the most part on that side of the ball.
Hibbert…he has the legit size, but again, what’s the makeup of the team. Go back and look at the matchups since Hibbert came into the League. He might have the “right” size, but Horford has eaten his lunch almost every time we’ve played Indy (can’t count last year, Horford was out most of it). It ain’t the center position that helps Indy hurt us. It’s the 2 and 3 spots.
Artman
October 22nd, 2012
8:06 pm
It’s refreshing to read the blog and actually read consistent intelligent posts. It is as if someone who continually makes ignorant posts has not commented yet. Who could that be?
Hawks93
October 22nd, 2012
8:08 pm
GO HAWKS! If you love basketball and Josh Smith then visit my website at http://www.bballfan4life.com
Hawks93
October 22nd, 2012
8:13 pm
We’re going places this year! Josh is a great leader and no with iso Joe gone we can play team basketball. With Josh and Al as the two “bash brothers” down low in the post and all the shooters we have now we can move the rock and get lots of open looks. I believe we are going places this year. And Josh will step up to become the leader he is ment to be
PD
October 22nd, 2012
8:26 pm
Damion James can’t shoot the 3. So there will be no driving lanes for Al and Josh
steven a smith
October 22nd, 2012
8:30 pm
I would love to see the Hawks do someting “un-Hawk like” and go after say Mehemet Okur, 6″11″ 260lbs. If healthy, he can make a difference. 20-25 minutes per night? I would be willing to move Petro or Steveson to make room for this guy.
Grandad
October 22nd, 2012
8:42 pm
Response … from last eve … / -&- / … Slimjr !
Please note that I`m not arguing nor debating Slim.
When I said that LD should hold Josh accountable on defense;
I was not necessarily promoting Josh to play the [3] pos.
As most of you know – I`m `anti-position’ anyway;
when it comes to predetermining [1 - 5].
Offensively, motion / Princeton offense lends itself to this concept.
Defensively, I am even more opposed, due to `match-ups’.
Exp:
LBJ is a [4] … therefore who should guard him ?
Everyone says KKorv cannot, to which I agree.
I might also add … there are not many that *can* guard LBJ.
1st let me speak about Josh as a defender – in honest terms:
Josh for all practical purposes plays zone …..
until the opponent gets to the rim;;
then Josh slides over and attempts to block his shot.
-note-
He is successful at this less than two times per game.
-side note-
Given, he also alters another one or two per game occasionally.
Josh is -not- an above avg on the ball defender;
I would actually say he is below avg.
Off the ball he blcks shots and collects steals by –
*shooting the gaps / *playing the passing lanes [gambling].
Now back to why I made the original statement:
” LD needs to hold Josh accountable defensively “;;
If Josh wishes to be this SuperStar / All-Star that he and others
have sought and predicted, then he Must become an all `round Star.
-Not- just a shot-blkr, but a defensive stopper,
one who can guard LBJ, Melo [a post up small forward], KD & others.
***** multidimensional ***** on defense !
LeBron does it – yes – LeBron cannot foul out.
You are also correct, LD cannot adhere to the inane two foul rule.
Josh can be so much more [on defense].
He can be a game changer.
He can be the pt man when we play pressure (press / trap / zone).
Those are the concepts in which I was speaking.
I don`t even think LD knows what he has in Josh.
-Grandad speaks-
Big Ray
October 22nd, 2012
9:02 pm
I would love to see the Hawks do someting “un-Hawk like” and go after say Mehemet Okur, 6″11″ 260lbs. If healthy, he can make a difference. 20-25 minutes per night? I would be willing to move Petro or Steveson to make room for this guy.
Not knowing how much gas is left in the tank, that might be a solid move.
Okur actually has some defensive capability and can, of course, light it up from the outside. But where is the guy? Last I knew, he wasn’t even in the NBA…might just be a FA.
We could sign him, but I’m betting it’s too late to get any use out of him. That’s how it always goes for us. We sign guys when they’re just about past meaningful contributions….and then we have a head coach that doesn’t know how to use them…
Big Ray
October 22nd, 2012
9:03 pm
Grandad ,
There’s a LOT LD doesn’t know. He does know how to submarine the guy he’s working for (just ask dumba$$ Woody), though. Another reason for Ferry to jettison him after this season.
steven a smith
October 22nd, 2012
9:06 pm
Big Ray
October 22nd, 2012
9:02 pm
Agree. I thought LD under used and mis-used Tracy McGrady and Ivan Johnson, esp Tracy, all season long.
Buddy Grizzard
October 22nd, 2012
9:17 pm
“This statement encompasses everything wrong with judging players solely on stats. I’d rather have Dampier when he’s 60 years old than Petro now.”
Agree with this 100%. If you go back through my blog you will see where I made the statement that based on his PER, Petro was a clear upgrade over Collins and Dampier. All it took was one preseason game to see how bad Petro is compared to those guys. Collins and Damp did their damage on a #5 seed. Petro helped New Jersey miss the playoffs as he tried to replace Brook Lopez.
I will never use PER to make a value judgement on a player again. It also completely over-inflated the value of Willie Green and Jannero Pargo. Never again… I am done with PER. I was wrong to ever make reference to it.
Just Joe
October 22nd, 2012
9:32 pm
Hawks may want to watch Daniel Orton up in OKC. Hawks were high on him in the 2010 draft. He just turned 22, and probably won’t stick with the Thunder. He’s got the Kendrick Perkins build. 6′10″ with broad shoulders and long arms. 7′4.25″ wingspan. 9′2.5″ standing reach. I’d rather work with this kid than waste time with Petro.
Another guy to watch as rosters trim down is Dexter Pittman down in Miami. Damion James’ former teammate at Texas.
doc
October 22nd, 2012
9:32 pm
grandad on the lakers.
mikan was a stud and yes they were strong in minny but the 15/17 was from about 1980. huge numbers there, just huge. i posted the exact resukts last week.
they left minny by mid 60’s is my guess, even before the boston run started. hard to believe the hawks were probably the second best team of the late fifties and sixties but were out done by boston and the russell era. yes auerbach in there but russell got one as a player/head coach, too.
i think i would take chandler over al horford for equal dollars, there are very few better than chandler out there to compete against, so i can be happy with al h.
doc
October 22nd, 2012
9:35 pm
buddy g, i still like the eyeball test first, then data next to look for correlations.
Buddy Grizzard
October 22nd, 2012
9:42 pm
“We have a lot of feisty and competitive people on this team who hate to lose.”
Once again, Smoove cuts to the heart of the matter. Marvin and Joe were not bothered by losing in elimination games. They both looked like they couldn’t wait to go play golf. This is addition by subtraction.
Ken Strickland
October 22nd, 2012
10:08 pm
At this point it looks like Drew will wait until after our final exhibition gm to make his final cut(s) and reveal who will start at SF and SG. I think he and his staff have already made the decision on who will start at SF and SG. It could very well be that his failure to mention James as a potential starter could be an indication that he’s the leading candidate.
That’s what he would do if he’s trying to keep everyone off balance, which he’s definitely been known to do. During this exhibition season, no other SF candidate has given us more of what we need most along our frontline(rebounding and DEF) than Damien James.
Ken Strickland
October 22nd, 2012
10:11 pm
JUST JOE-If we carry fewer than 15 players on our overall roster, it could mean Ferry intends to look at players just like the 2 you’ve mentioned if they are released.
steven a smith
October 22nd, 2012
10:22 pm
In signing a strectch “5″ like Okur. He would could pull the best rebounder/shot blocker on the opposing team out near the three point line consequently opening up more scoring lanes for our slashers. We will have to win using the Dallas Maverick “template” for a championship team!
i_am_soulstar
October 22nd, 2012
10:52 pm
lol @ Mutt Rumney
Big Ray
October 22nd, 2012
11:00 pm
Buddy G ,
LOL….well I see YOU cut right to the heart of the matter as well. I was thinking something VERY similar when I read that statement by Josh. Good stuff, man…
Big Ray
October 22nd, 2012
11:00 pm
If nothing else, the Troll can come up with more names to post under than Dr. Seuss….
Ken Strickland
October 22nd, 2012
11:20 pm
BIG RAY-This/these ANAL(S) definitely doesn’t seem to have any problem coming up with new names, but he definitely has serious problems coming up with an intelligent comment or a different topic. He/she/it obviously thinks that coming up with different names equates to coming up with different comments or topics.
Instead of building more jails and stadiums, we need to build more mental institutions to house some of the more DISTURBED SPORT LOVING ANAL MINDED MORONS that frequent these blogs.
Ken Strickland
October 22nd, 2012
11:35 pm
BUDDY GRIZZARD-Josh’s comments about attitudes just might be the main reason he immediately changed his mind about wanting to be traded after the JJ and Marvin trades. This could be yet another reason this yrs team with be better than any team we’ve had in over a decade.
Big Ray
October 22nd, 2012
11:41 pm
Ken S ,
You made me laugh, I gotta say.
Ken Strickland
October 22nd, 2012
11:50 pm
TT ROMNEY(or whoever your dumbass name is)-Your response to my 11:20pm post shows you definitely identify yourself as one of the ANAL MINDED MORONS that’s in need of being institutionalized.
Rod from College Park
October 22nd, 2012
11:54 pm
“I will never use PER to make a value judgement on a player again. It also completely over-inflated the value of Willie Green and Jannero Pargo. Never again… I am done with PER. I was wrong to ever make reference to it.”
Wonder who told you that PER stuff was nonsense?
Slimjr
October 23rd, 2012
12:00 am
This is what Grandad has been preaching for a while now.. For you Grandad:
Embracing The Positional Revolution
Tom Ley
“This morning, ESPN’s Tom Haberstroh published a piece about the evolution of the Miami Heat, and it looks like this year’s Heat team is not only going to be a frightening opponent for the rest of the NBA, but also incredibly fun to watch. Why? Because the team has finally embraced its versatility and eschewed the idea of traditional positions. From ESPN:
Spoelstra no longer uses positions to designate his players. Instead, he uses initials of players’ names on his diagrams and assigns players to five spots on the floor for his go-to sets: a single man in the post, two in the corners and two in the wings.
In practice this preseason, the Heat will run their sets over and over before Spoelstra shouts “switch up” and the players play their own version of musical chairs, rotating from spot to spot. Wade replaces Bosh in the post, and Bosh goes to the top of the key, where he can take opposing centers off the dribble. Battier heads to the corner while Allen goes to the wing.
Switch up again. James goes to the block and Wade heads to the corner, where he cuts to the rim. Bosh heads to the corner, where he has developed a sharper 3-point shot. Again and again.
Ball handlers. Post guys. Screeners. Perimeter shooters. Cutters. All parts are interchangeable.
This is fantastic news. Abandoning conventional positions is something that’s been talked about by NBA writers for years now, but no team has ever had the collection of players necessary to fully commit to such a free-wheeling philosophy. The Heat, however, have LeBron James. It’s because of his ability to play every spot on the floor at an elite level that other guys can be freed up to play in unconventional ways.
What this means is that we will see a lot fewer Heat lineups featuring the plodding Joel Anthony or half-competent Mario Chalmers, and a lot more that feature the team’s five best players on the court at the same time, running free and playing without limits. Though we can’t help noticing that the switches in ESPN’s theoretical breakdown didn’t include Ray Allen operating down on the block or Udonis Haslem spotting up for a three. Still, we should expect to see a variety of roles within the lineup.
Now, try to imagine Chris Bosh standing at the high post and feeding a posted-up LeBron James, who immediately dishes the ball to a cutting Dwyane Wade, who kicks it out to a wide open Ray Allen, without getting a little giddy.”
An evolution taking place before our very eyes? Hmmmmm
Slimjr
October 23rd, 2012
12:13 am
“The Heat, however, have LeBron James. It’s because of his ability to play every spot on the floor at an elite level that other guys can be freed up to play in unconventional ways”
Lebron is [generational] player.. But we already knew that…
Najeh Davenpoop
October 23rd, 2012
12:31 am
Slimjr beat me to posting that Heat article, but it’s funny how using interchangeable positions is a revolutionary idea now, when we had a guy in the ATL about eight years ago who tried to build the Hawks using that exact same idea.
The most important line from that article is this:
“The Heat, however, have LeBron James.”
When you have talented players, you can do whatever you want and you are going to win games. When your high-drafted, positionally-interchangeable centerpiece is Marvin Williams, things don’t go quite as smoothly.
It’s also worth noting that one of the Heat’s main rivals for a title this year, the Lakers, have built their team entirely using traditional positions.
Slimjr
October 23rd, 2012
12:38 am
Like I said in a previous blog, maybe Billy Knight was a [VISIONARY]?
But Marvin and Sheldon ruined his Genius plans……
doc
October 23rd, 2012
1:05 am
these offenses are similar to the wheel offense run by garland pinholster at oglethorpe university back in the 50’s and 60’s that took then to top four ncaa championship level to lose to the college team of clyde frazier. little guys thrived in it for easy baskets.
gdad you ever here of this offense or try it?
doc
October 23rd, 2012
1:11 am
pretty funny, founf it of course in wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheel_offense
vava74
October 23rd, 2012
3:03 am
If anyone is looking for Okur, they should look in the yellow pages under “taxidermist”.
That guy has been dead for about 3 years now.
vava74
October 23rd, 2012
3:15 am
What the visionary also forgot, along with the fact that Marvin was as useful in an interchangeable positions system as a fork to eat soup is that you also need a quality head coach to implement that…
and Woody did not have – by any stretch of imagination – any skill as an offensive coach, nor accepted input from assistants.
Grandad
October 23rd, 2012
4:12 am
doc
Yes I know all about GPinholster.
I kept up with Oglethorpe as a lad.
I also ran many of his concepts.
I used to run the double cut off the ” Wheel “.
Also worked with a coach once who ran nothing but.
doc – we must talk sometime:
I got stories !
” The Stormy Petrels “
vava74
October 23rd, 2012
5:58 am
Josh:
“We can’t look around that locker room and expect anybody else to take the heat,”
“Anybody that tells you Joe didn’t carry us in those early years is lying. He had to. We were so young and guys were still trying to figure out where they fit. But I think we can all agree that the past few years this team changed, and we changed in ways that made it necessary for some of us to assume leadership roles and become more vocal because that just wasn’t his thing. We’re going to find out what guys are made of now that the pressure is all on us.”
Always frank and being vocal about the obvious lack of vocal leadership from JJ.
EmirS.
October 23rd, 2012
6:14 am
Open invite to Join AJC Hawks Bloggers fantasy basketball on yahoo, presented by Astro.
League ID: 72440
Password: vivlamore
Draft is this Thursday at 9:30 pm. Hurry and join up. Three spots open.
See you there!
Just Joe
October 23rd, 2012
6:22 am
On a “position-less” team aren’t you still “defined” by the position you can defend? You may not be a “5″, but you’re going to defend the biggest guy on the floor. You may not be a PG or “1″, but you’re going to defend the quickest opposing guard that brings the ball up the floor?
Ra'mon
October 23rd, 2012
6:33 am
Vava, no one else (aside from Bibby) would’ve made those comments in the last 4 seasons on the Hawks.
Buddy Grizzard
October 23rd, 2012
6:34 am
“Wonder who told you that PER stuff was nonsense?”
It’s not nonsense but it disproportionately favors inefficient volume shooters and players who put up stats on bad teams.
Ra'mon
October 23rd, 2012
6:34 am
JustJoe, on the Heat, Lebron, Bosh, and Battier EACH can guard 2-5 on just about any play.
Buddy Grizzard
October 23rd, 2012
7:27 am
According to PER, DeShawn Stevenson was one of the very worst players in the NBA last season. He may have had a down year, but this does not account for his defensive impact. I will take him as a starter all day over Willie Green.
JoshFriend
October 23rd, 2012
8:04 am
The Lakers have waived Chris Douglas-Roberts and Pistons waived Terrence Williams. We need a SF and one of these players can filled SF position on our team.
a bird in the hand>2 in the busch.
October 23rd, 2012
8:14 am
dang, the roster broken down already!?
guess i’ll have to read the article now….
find out what the bad news is…sigh…
MsDee
October 23rd, 2012
8:58 am
Damion James @KONJames10
U will bro! Jus a go gettaRT @BBall_4Life_: @KONJames10 yes I have a question, because I have NEVER HEARD OF YOU, are u a rookie?
Am I reading too much into this? Will Damion James make the team base on his twitt??
Just Joe
October 23rd, 2012
8:59 am
Ra’mon…I agree that its pretty easy to mix & switch on what’s known as the 2-4 spots, but to me the type of lineup that’s talked about in that article will have serious trouble defending a “traditional” offense with a “true” PG and “true” C. But we will find out who’s style wins as the Lakers (traditional) and Heat (position-less) seem to be on a collision course with maybe only OKC (hybrid???) standing in the way. Is it easier for a “position-less” team to defend a “traditional” team, or a “traditional” team to defend a “position-less” team?
I’m still more of a traditional guy myself. Give me Chris Paul, Dwight Howard, and a bunch of hustle/role players.