Atlanta Hawks: Season Review: Willie Green
Season reviews presented in alphabetical order. Previously: Jason Collins and Erick Dampier.
The fact that Willie Green was an offseason afterthought, signed-and-traded to the Clippers in what amounted to a housekeeping transaction for the Hawks, shouldn’t overshadow the fact that Green probably ranks second to Ivan Johnson among the team’s unexpected surprises in 2011-12.
The Hawks were keen on Green as soon as the free agency period opened but figured he’d be out of their price range. Green thought the same. But then the post-lockout market was harsh for an undersized, 30-year old shooting guard who had put up middling numbers for his career.
“It was a crazy free agency,” Green said at the time of his signing. “There was a lot of scenarios with players going different places and no one knew where they were going to go. It’s a blessing to be here. I’m excited about the opportunity.”
Green made the most of it by turning in a career year with the Hawks. For the first time, Green was a low-usage, high-efficiency scorer. His 1.04 points scored per possession (on 395 possessions used) ranked 24th in the league, according to Synergy Sports Technology.
That was in large part because Green shot 3-pointers at career-high rate and made them a career-high percentage (excluding 2005-06, when he played just 10 games for the Sixers). Green still didn’t draw many fouls but he had a great year at the free-throw line, too, missing just eight of 56 attempts.
Green proved to be a good fit playing off the ball and spotting up for shots in the half court and in transition, or catching and shooting off screens. That role also allowed him to continue to cut his turnover rate and percentage.
Defensively, Green was too slow-footed to handle particularly athletic opponents and too small to fend off stronger players. That’s reflected in his individual numbers: .91 points per possession allowed (276th in the league, according to Synergy) and 15.9 opponent PER at shooting guard. However, Green proved to be a decent team defender when properly deployed as reflected by the efficiency of the top four lineups in which he played.
Green couldn’t carry over his play into the postseason, which made him like pretty much every Hawks reserve. He struggled to create shots, didn’t attempt a free throw in 63 minutes and was a defensive liability.
Overall, Atlanta’s acquisition of Green turned out to be a good, cost-efficient move. In what may be a sign of the new NBA world of fiscal restraint when it comes to role players, Green’s good year apparently didn’t translate into the kind of lucrative contract regularly offered to scorers. According to Hoopsworld’s Eric Pincus Green’s first-year salary with the Clippers is $1.375 million, just a bit more than the league minimum, and the final two years are not guaranteed.
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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191 comments Add your comment
politiconpe
August 24th, 2012
2:22 pm
He served his purpose. The Hawks got everything out of him they could have expected. However, Lou Williams should be a vast improvement.
dirk
August 24th, 2012
2:22 pm
first
SteveW
August 24th, 2012
2:30 pm
Willie did great for what was expected, as did Pargo.
But of course Lou and Devin, and even Morrow are light years ahead of Green, Pargo, and Hinrich.
Hawks Blog Legend Worldwide Clyde
August 24th, 2012
2:31 pm
When you look back Sund was bragging about how deep his bench was last year.
Willie Green
T-mac
Stackhouse
Vlad-Rad
Pargo
Hinrich
Zaza
Big Ivan
SteveW
August 24th, 2012
2:35 pm
About Lou – What I got reading that article about him is; he loves to play basketball. There are quite a few guys, NBA players, who are skilled, who just play for a paycheck. There are other guys who love the game, and it shows.
I think Lou likes what he’s doing, and that’s why he keeps improving
O'Brien
August 24th, 2012
3:09 pm
Green proved to be a good fit playing off the ball and spotting up for shots in the half court and in transition, or catching and shooting off screens..
Is this what John Jenkins’ role will be?
The Truth
August 24th, 2012
3:17 pm
“I can hear the gym getting noisier in the background. I have to ask you about the contract. Some Atlanta fans were almost celebrating the trade, given how much money you make and the salary cap. You dealt with that for years. How do you do it? Just tune it out? Use it as fuel? Just play? Do you care?” – SI.com
“Johnson: You just have to tune it out. We had a great squad there. Unfortunately, we got hit by the injury bug last season, with Al [Horford] getting hurt early in the season. It happens. I can take the criticism, as long as I know I’m giving it everything I have.” – JJ
And that was precisely the problem. Everything JJ had wasn’t good enough for the money he was paid. But in hindsight, Joe took the Hawks places they hadn’t in awhile and for that, he should get credit.
I wish him well, but not at the expense of the Hawks.
Slimjr
August 24th, 2012
3:19 pm
Lou,Devin, and John after game 1 of the preseason will quickly help us forget about Willie…Yes?
No Miami/Hawk comparisons today? Wow…
Slimjr
August 24th, 2012
3:25 pm
Joe was the most talented Hawk in years…Regardless of what Sund paid him…
Thanks for the good memories Joe! Wish you and your family the best..What a class act!
Can this other so called AllStar step up and fill shoes? Hmmmmmmm
Rod from College Park
August 24th, 2012
3:27 pm
“Well, think about this. Lou Williams has never played with an offensive player as good as Josh Smith OR Al Horford. There was a lot of pressure on Williams to score baskets because the 76ers were so offensively challenged.”
Every day I come on this blog I read something thats more funny than the day before. Between Northlied, Ken Strickland, Vava, or Buddy Grizzard, I don’t know who’s funnier. So I guess Allen Iverson is not a better offensive player than Josh Smith or Al Horford? Buddy Grizzard being a writer or journalist or whatever you call yourself, you should do your research before you post things that are so obviously incorrect.
Slimjr
August 24th, 2012
3:52 pm
Is it safe to say pound for pound inch for inch, NBA guards are by far more skilled and talented than the Bigs?
See Hawks…[Jamal and Joe] almost single handily beat Orlando in that 1st round series in 2011.
Without those two..Orlando in 4…Wish them both well..
Lets hope these new guards can keep it up cause the Hawks will only go as far as their guard play takes them..
Just Joe
August 24th, 2012
3:54 pm
Al Horford, Deshawn Stevenson, and Jordan Williams to Orlando for Hedo Turkoglu, Andrew Nicholson, Nikola Vucevic, 2013 2nd rd pick, and the right to swap 1st rd picks in 2013. Turkoglu only guaranteed for $6M next year. Any takers?
Teague / LouWill
Harris / Morrow / Jenkins
Turkoglu / Korver
Smith / Nicholson / Ivan
Pachulia / Vucevic
Astro Joe
August 24th, 2012
3:58 pm
So I guess the trade exception acquired in the Willie trade is for less than $1.3M.
Yeah, Willie was better than I expected, especially at shooting the 3 ball.
Slimjr
August 24th, 2012
4:07 pm
Awesome Just Joe!
We acquire [Andrew Nicholson] a very skilled post up Big who will quickly make us forget about All NBA the second he makes his first post move down on the block! His skills meshing with our guards will be just awesome to watch…He is already more advance in every way offensively compared to All NBA already. In fact it is no contest…For real!
Sam
August 24th, 2012
4:09 pm
I’m a taker if I’m the Hawks, Just Joe. No way the Magic would be interested in that deal.
Grandad
August 24th, 2012
4:15 pm
Why in tarnation are we doin` a season in review;
especially on Willie Green [ who ain`t comin` back];
on the brink 0` September, after all the summer
FA season, monumental trades, Summer Leagues,
are over with and we are eagerly awaiting
Mr Ferry`s next stroke of brilliance;
yet; MC; you ascertain that a seasonal revue, regarding:
Willie Green (of all people) is readable material.
At least it`s a new blog !
BravesFan79
August 24th, 2012
4:47 pm
Your really getting back to these season reviews? lol Who’s next… John Koncack?
O'Brien
August 24th, 2012
4:51 pm
AJ,
Yeah, Willie was better than I expected, especially at shooting the 3 ball..
Willie was better than Willie expected.
MsDee
August 24th, 2012
4:54 pm
from previous blog:
I totally agree, Buddy Grizzard when it comes to Horford getting buckets. Mann oh Mann, folks on here are gonna be truly surprised how well Horford will score the ball this season with JJohnson gone. Horford WILL be the #2 option on the team cause with great passers like Josh AND Harris on this team, Horford WILL finish around the basket, unlike Zaza, tho I like Zaza but mann, he just cant finish. But my boi, Horford can and he WILL avg close to 18-20ppg a game..MARK MY WORDS!! He DOESN’T have to have a post game with excellent passers in Josh and Harris. He’s our CENTER, in case ya didnt know, he doesn’t HAVE to have a post game, just DEFEND and REBOUND!! Yall Horford bashers will be kissing his feet come playoffs time!!
O'Brien
August 24th, 2012
4:54 pm
Slim,
So an NBA rookie who played at St Bonaventure would make us forget about Al, just because his post game “may” be better than Al? Plus just because someone plays a certain way in college does not mean it will automatically translate in the pros.
I think you are getting ahead of yourself.
tony
August 24th, 2012
5:08 pm
Lou William is the kind of player I will pay my money to see. He plays the game the right way. I’m very excited about the upcoming season. Thank you Danny Ferry.
Grandad
August 24th, 2012
5:09 pm
Michael Cunningham:
As you continue your season in revue;
please do not forget *’`Donald Sloan`’*
realizing he only spent a few days with the Hawks.
That was an important five game stretch;
in which young Mr Sloan contributed:
6 pts; 3 fouls; 2 turnovers; 1 steal; 5 assts; &; 5 rebounds
in his 20 min of action.
” Lest we Forget ” …
At the current rate young Donald will be out of the League
before you get around to him.
____________________________________________
Grandad
August 24th, 2012
5:13 pm
MC
I apologize … I did not go to synergy sports tech
and break down D.Sloan`s stat`s even further.
I figured you could bore us with those mind-numbing stats.
Slimjr
August 24th, 2012
5:13 pm
Yea lets hope Al does not initiate contact against Bynum down on the block to create space to get his set shot off..We do not want him injuring the other shoulder….Yawn..
Ohmagawdyes Ohmagawd
August 24th, 2012
5:15 pm
Cannot WAIT for Vladimir Radmanovic’s… CAN NOT WAIT!
Slimjr
August 24th, 2012
5:17 pm
Here ya go. Don’t ya wish we had him on the block?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L66QmiB0xj4
doc
August 24th, 2012
5:40 pm
slimj,
“See Hawks…[Jamal and Joe] almost single handily beat Orlando in that 1st round series in 2011.
Without those two..Orlando in 4…Wish them both well..”
i just went back and looked over the box scores for that series. lets do a little reality check. would you please tell us exactly what you are basing that on? for starters we averaged less than 90 points a game for the series and only went over the century mark in one game and that was also the only time we went over 90 and were only able to score 75 in a loss. you would expect guards to carry us a little further than that.
also, usually guards are about scoring and assists. care to tell me who shot the ball the best in the series and who had the most assists for the hawks? also this was a series that was up to the bigs to stop superman and his posse. that was pretty much done as well not by the two you mentioned. so anyway ill sit back a wait for your reasons to declare them as the reason we beat the magic. this was as good a team effort by the hawks for playing defense, it wasnt a guard series at all so i will wait to see how you came up with your comment.
slimj, maybe you were just getting a bit over sentimental on us and it affected your reasoning. cant wait for your reaction to who had the most assists for the series. heh heh, surpriiise!
Just Joe
August 24th, 2012
6:00 pm
Nicholson in his first summer league game dominated single coverage. 24 & 12 on 50% shooting. He was doubled in every game after. 39 & 22 total the next 4 games with 9 turnovers and 1 assist. He’s got to work on his decision making, but the post skills are there.
steven a smith
August 24th, 2012
6:11 pm
What about Tracy McGrady’s season review? Bart Scott said he “Can’t Wait!”
Astro Joe
August 24th, 2012
6:18 pm
Dodgers are about to trade for every good member of the Red Sox. AMAZING.
steven a smith
August 24th, 2012
6:25 pm
This is a “Basketball Blog” Season Review Willie Green. No football, Baseball, Tennis, cycling, Bowling,,,etc “Get the message”
steven a smith
August 24th, 2012
6:28 pm
“Unless Willie Green is about to do a Deion Sanders and play dual sports, then i think we should stick to “Basketball!”
Sautee
August 24th, 2012
6:33 pm
Just Joe,
I’d do that trade. T-s and slimjr try their best to paint me as a Horford fan, but I’m a Hawks fan, and that trade would help the Hawks.
I’m afraid that Orlando wouldn’t bite, though.
Sautee
August 24th, 2012
6:40 pm
Just Joe,
To be clear, the most important point in that trade is the right to swap picks. Without that, I’d back off.
sam'l
August 24th, 2012
7:24 pm
Something big this way comes. I feel it. Within a week. (trade)
Just Joe
August 24th, 2012
7:50 pm
Quote from Joe Johnson’s interview about Brooklyn’s roster: “I think we have the perfect pieces……I don’t think any of our positions are the same or overlap at all.”
Is this Joe taking a shot at some of the “versatile” rosters he’s been a part of in Atlanta? Do players like that the Hawks have a “regular” and a “big” lineup? Did Joe hate playing along with a couple of guards one minute, and then bringing the ball up the court the next? I guess what I’m asking is, do players prefer defined roles?
Astro Joe
August 24th, 2012
7:57 pm
Just Joe, first, I doubt that he is taking a shot at the Hawks. But my guess is that some players probably prefer the consistency of playing one position. And certainly, having your talent diversified over more than 1-2 “natural” positions, which has been a long problem for our Hawks.
ntrigue
August 24th, 2012
9:26 pm
Can we get a review of at least the Summer League roster and performance of players. No one cares about a review of players last year especially someone no longer on the team! Or at least interview players on the team and find out what they think about the trades we’ve made and our new additions from the draft.
Come on MC!
Ole'
August 24th, 2012
9:28 pm
I really think M. Cunningham is trying to drive down sales of the AJC, This has to be his most boring blog feature to date. Im going over to Bradley’s Damn How did this guy end up with the Hawks? Why didn’t they give him the falcons or braves or something?
Hoops
August 24th, 2012
10:12 pm
September 11 is reight around the corner. Trades are a comin’!
Jimmy Mack
August 24th, 2012
10:21 pm
I am a huge Hawks fan, a former season ticket holder(20 years ago). The blog is the best thing to ever happen for me, I get to read the beat writer views about the Hawks beyond what’s in the paper.
But since Micheal Cunningham replaced Sekou Smith it’s been all down hill. The blogs are useless,
the bloggers attacks each other like school kids, and the bloggers analyze issues like their life depends on it. Cunningham your heart is not in it please move on. And you bloggers with the expert analysis put that effort in job or family life. AFTER ALL IT IS JUST A GAME. PEACE!
Sameba
August 24th, 2012
10:48 pm
Today I watched EuroBasket qualifier game Georgia vs Latvia, and Pachulia was playing for his national team. He got 18 points and 9 rebounds, but played with a caution, at the end got tired (Georgian team played only with 7-8 guys). In the last 2 minutes he got his shot blocked twice and allowed one steal. Thanks to J. Pullen who made a winning shot at the last second…
UGA
August 24th, 2012
11:29 pm
Word is we just signed James Anderson…..
That is what Danny Green posted on his Twitter account.
UGA
August 24th, 2012
11:39 pm
Anderson actually started some for the Spurs early on……….6′6, 215. Probably a good addition. But I would think Pietrus would be a better fit
Sameba
August 24th, 2012
11:45 pm
One more guard… How many guards one can have on the team?
UGA
August 24th, 2012
11:57 pm
http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursnation/2012/08/24/james-anderson-headed-to-atlanta/
Sameba
August 25th, 2012
12:15 am
He cannot be signed, probably he will get into “development” program with newly acquired coach…
ntrigue
August 25th, 2012
12:35 am
He got hurt the yr he was drafted if not for that he would’ve never slid down the spurs depth chart. He a good defender that has a good jumper and can drive and finish at the basket. Good pickup he’s definitly better than Marvin and last but not least he’s a smart player has good basketball iq!
dap01
August 25th, 2012
1:36 am
??????
NUNNA!!
August 25th, 2012
2:58 am
Hey!! Don’t forget dat we have LD as a coach..I like LD but how he works with this years team is whats gonna keep him here next year or get his behind fired. I got a feeling that DF is already thinking about Laimbeer as our next coach..
Good Luck LD
NUNNA!!
August 25th, 2012
3:00 am
Jimmy Mack AKA Sekou Smith
vava74
August 25th, 2012
3:05 am
Just saw an highlight of Anderson: glued to Wade’s chest whilst he tries to shake him with his tricky dribble. JA sticks with him, rises, blocks Wade’s shot AND kept the rock for himself.
His college highlights also him as having a good release from outside (quick and high over his head) and the ability to drive and finish in the paint.
Should be a decent pick up. Pitty that he is only 6′6″ and yet another undersized guy to play SF.
vava74
August 25th, 2012
4:20 am
Rod,
You are soooo funny.
I am sure that you agreed with my post about Lou, PHI and his new role with us but you were unable to say it.
… so you went against Buddy and talked about Iverson?
Lou played his first two years in the league with Iverson an average of 4m47sec in his rookie season and 11.18 in his second season.
I bet they were on the court at the same time less than an average of 1 minute per game.
Then, on his final stint in Philly, Iverson was already kind of washed up… and Lou’s role was to replace Iverson so… your argument that Lou played with a talented player in Iverson seems very weak.
You should also take into consideration that Buddy was probably talking about these past 3 years.
If you argued, as I do, that Iguodala is offensively more talented than Horford (but not by a great margin) and that Brand is offensively more polished than Josh (but since his injury in his last season with the Clips no longer had the legs to produce at a high level), I think would have something.
Buddy Grizzard
August 25th, 2012
5:33 am
Let me sincerely apologize for the fact that my blog posts don’t meet your journalistic standards, Rod, but my point stands. Lou Williams has never played SIGNIFICANT MINUTES with an offensive player in their prime who was better than Al and Josh are presently. If you want to play semantics and feel smart because Lou Williams was once on a team with Allen Iverson, who was once good, then by all means.
The point of my post was that there was nobody on the 76ers who could take the pressure off Williams to score. He was the best offensive player on that team, and opposing defenses payed a lot of attention to him. Allen Iverson didn’t take pressure off Williams, because when they were on the same team there WAS NO PRESSURE on Williams. Josh and Al will take pressure off Williams in a way he has never experienced in his career.
Just Joe
August 25th, 2012
6:17 am
James Anderson is another Marvin Williams. Nice guy that comes off kind of shy in his interviews. Not athletic at all. No ball handling skills. Low basketball IQ. For the most part of his career, more turnovers than assists. He’s a guy you tell to lock down one guy on defense, and go stand in the corner on offense. If you catch the ball, shoot! Hopefully Mr Anderson will have a non-guaranteed deal vs. Marvin’s $8M salary though. He should be competing with Deshawn for a spot. Anderson is the better shooter, but Deshawn is so much more confident and athletic.
prison mike
August 25th, 2012
8:34 am
Yeah but he would be making roughly a million to Ducks 8 mill. This guy has a serious foot injury that still lingers according to SA fans. Take his ass to Dr. Andrews.
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
8:41 am
According to draftexpress Morrow is 6-5.5 w/o shoes and 6-6.5 w/ shoes. At 215-20 he’s probably big enough to play the 3. He’d be a smallish 3, but hey, it’s an imperfect world we live in.
Jimmy Mack
August 25th, 2012
9:49 am
NUNNA!!
My last response to my blog, I just stated true facts. He got a promotion because of his writings.
Section 303
August 25th, 2012
9:51 am
The Truth, I just read your post from yesterday, with the SI/Joe Johnson interview. I agree with you, Joe was great (not good, great) Hawk. And, the Hawks got him at the peak of his ability. NJ won’t see the Joe Johnson we saw from 2006-2010. That was Joe’s prime.
Another thing…the national media just kills me. SI, ESPN, and the rest were lining up to rip the Hawks for Joe Johnson’s contract. Now that he plays in New Jersey, they’re asking him questions like “how did you deal with the fans in Atlanta ripping your contract?”, which seems to imply the fans were wrong to not like the deal Joe signed and that he was some kind of inspiration to be able to perform under the heat.
Section 303
August 25th, 2012
9:52 am
I’m sure you’re all joining me in waiting with baited breath for the Jason Collns and Eric Dampier Season in Review blogs. They’re next!
DS
August 25th, 2012
10:20 am
Danny Green from the spurs tweeted that James Anderson is coming to Atlanta. Does it mean Devin Harris is on his way out? All hail Ferry
vava74
August 25th, 2012
10:32 am
SteveW,
The draftexpress page on Morrow also has in the left side a tweet which says the following:
“Worst NBA defenders vs isolation sets (min 50pos): Mo Williams, Antawn Jamison, Vlad Radmanovic, DJ Augustin, Anthony Morrow,Chase Budinger
2010-03-01 12:20:05
From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com#ixzz24ZHoxydk”
It’s an old tweet but Morrow is probably an horrible defender.
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
10:51 am
Vava – yeh, I saw that tweet. I’ve also been reading an article the Charlotte Observer did on Morrow in early August. He admits when he came in the League, he could play no D. Seemed to indicate he had improved.
And doing some research on Anderson they say since his foot injury, he can play no D either. And he’s shorter than Morrow, weighs less, can’t shoot as well.
What we lack in quality, we certainly make up for in quantity.
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
10:59 am
Vava – Really we’re in kind of a pick your poison mode at SF. Do you play Josh somewhat out of position at the 3? Or do you cobble together some framework of Stevenson, Korver, Morrow, and Anderson and hope for the best?
I’m not sure LD won’t do the 2 starting Lineups thing, a Big and a Small.
Any lineup with Kyle Korver starting is going to be trouble for us. He’s a definite good bench guy, but he can’t handle the starters in the NBA for the most part.
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
11:04 am
Some interesting things about that tweet above with bad defenders:
Coach TT with the Bulls just got Vlad
That Cavs team of a few years ago was trying to win with Jameson and Mo on it
And people were falling all over themselves to get Chase Budinger as a low cost, decent quality SF.
brigadierjerry
August 25th, 2012
11:24 am
Over the years, my take on being a fan has changed. I’m sure it does for a lot of people. What did it for me thirty years ago doesn’t do it for me today. As I get older, I see different things and I see things differently. In my younger days, I probably would feel like I was part of some accomplishment if teams that I root for won a championship. So the end goal was a lot more important. These days, the journey and methodology is probably as rewarding to follow as the end goal. That is why i am looking forward to see how Ferry makes this team grow into a contender or rebuild if necessary. With so many more things competing for my attention, I do look for something compelling to follow.
doc
August 25th, 2012
12:30 pm
slimj still waiting for your rationale.
Sautee
August 25th, 2012
12:33 pm
Best of luck there, doc. He’s a dodge ball champ, that one.
steven a smith
August 25th, 2012
12:41 pm
James Anderson makes great sense. Low risk, high reward kind of a guy. Still in the hunt for a proven defender. When Mickael Petrus was in Orlando, I had a chance to watch most of the Orlando Magic basketball games, and this guy always filled up the stat sheets in limited minutes. He always allowed the game to come to him. I watched him guard Big time “2s” and “3s”, he always held his own on the Defensive side of the Basketball.
steven a smith
August 25th, 2012
12:57 pm
MEHEMET OKUR-If he is healthy, he could provide valuable minutes off the bench. He can stretch the floor on offense!!! Call him up D. Ferry!
the hawks is the word
August 25th, 2012
1:19 pm
@Steven a smith: mehmet okur would be an excellent veteran pickup in case we don’t sign scott or benson, buy minny want’s them too
Astro Joe
August 25th, 2012
1:34 pm
If we’re adding Anderson, Ferry must have a trade lined-up with the stale bags of chips we acquired for Joe Johnson. And just because someone “can play SF” doesn’t mean that person should play SF. It would seem that Hawks fans should understand by now how playing guys out of position generally limits their effectiveness.
steven a smith
August 25th, 2012
2:14 pm
the hawks is the word
August 25th, 2012
1:19 pm
@Steven a smith: mehmet okur would be an excellent veteran pickup in case we don’t sign scott or benson, buy minny want’s them too
Agree;
I watched Benson and Scott play Summer League and they both look like keepers. However, i was not impressed at all with Jordan Williams. Jordan Williams did not show any upside, he needs to go to NBDL or be part of next trade package.
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
2:16 pm
Once again:
What`s the dif between the [2] and the [3] ?
Defensive match-ups … correct.
-okay-
Anderson is not quick enough to defend [2s].
Anderson most likely is human and cannot guard LBJ.
-so-
It is all about match-ups and not the position
we wish to stamp on him.
Let`s call him a punter and forget about it.
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
2:26 pm
Todays -Season in Review- ” Jannero Pargo ”
He came / he turned it over / he went.
-nuff said-
___________________________________________
MC
I took care of that one for you.
No need to research synergysprtstch for material.
steven a smith
August 25th, 2012
2:29 pm
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
2:16 pm
Our real problems are at the “4″ and “5″ spots. Dennis Scott, 3D(NBA TV) suggested during summer league ganes that the Hawks needed to move Al Horford to the “4″ permanently.
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
2:43 pm
AJ – Well, what if we don’t make a deal? Who would you start/backup on the current roster?
And if we do trade Harris, I’m for giving Flynn a shot if he’s still out there.
steven a smith
August 25th, 2012
3:15 pm
Rookie on the Hawks Summer League team displayed “True” point guard skills. Jordan Taylor can play Basketball in the NBA. He should be the 3rd PG on this team. He is too good to let go.
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
3:28 pm
Maybe in the new NBA, they’ve basically got it down to 3 positions:
PG’s/Small G’s – Devin, Teague, Lou
Wings – Anderson, Korver, Morrow, Jenkins, Stevenson
Bigs – Josh, Al, ZaZa, Ivan, Petro, Williams, Scott
With Josh and Scott being able to play some wing also.
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
3:29 pm
Has anyone signed Scott Machado yet ?
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
3:33 pm
Jordan Williams probably has the natural skills to be a poor mans Al Jefferson – but from what I understand he’s his own worst enemy. He doesn’t develop himself enough.
If he’s a real loser, I’d ditch him and keep Benson.
And if Stevenson or Anderson comes in out of shape, I might consider moving 1 of them and keeping Sy – For old times sake.
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
3:34 pm
Grandad – No, but on Hoopshype a couple of weeks ago, they were raving about him
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
3:40 pm
As for who to start ?
I`ve said it before:
” play your best five that play [together] “.
- John Wooden -
*also:
It`s not who starts but who finishes that matters.
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
3:43 pm
SteveW
He [S.Machado] was listed as a SummerLeague all-star.
Personnally, I wish we would have drafted him.
Now, I say, grab him ! (please)
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
3:47 pm
SteveW
J.Wiiliams = no thanks
K.Benson … I was totally unimpressed during SummerLeague.
KB … disappointed might be a better word.
His defense was the area of his game that I was most disappointed;
followed closely with his rebounding or lack thereof.
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
3:49 pm
SteveW
I was equally unimpressed with M.Scott
-or-
should I say; I expected more.
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
3:53 pm
I would prefer to load up with talented guards
-than-
have a bunch of sorry ass Bigs that can`t play.
I realize a team needs size;
-yes-
but, at least by overstocking guards with skill;
then trades become a real possibility.
Melvin
August 25th, 2012
4:03 pm
James Anderson 2010 pre-draft profile…
NBA Comparison: Nick Anderson/Daequan Cook
Strengths: Prolific scoring swingman in a wiry 6-6 frame … Highly efficient offensive game (46% FG for his college career) … Lights out shooter with textbook form and high release … Possesses boundless range with no deterioration in accuracy from distance (38.4%) … Has no conscious, even in the face of repeated misses … Extremely effective in catch-and-shoot situations, with his feet set and ready to fire … Always squares his body to the rim with great balance and elevation on his jumper. Shoots well off the dribble when driving to his left … Likes to take a jump stop just inside the paint for a little right-handed floater. Uses his vertical to quickly elevate over defenders inside. Has the ability to hang and adjust his shot mid-leap … He’s increased his aggression taking the ball to the basket … Attempted 3.2 FT as a freshman, 4.7 as a sophomore and 7.2 through ten game as a junior (86%) … Not afraid to take smaller defenders into the post … Boasts an incredible wingspan … Provides an incredible boost on the boards where he hits the offensive glass hard (5 rpg, 2 offensive) … Has the skill set of a lockdown defender with his lateral quickness, length and dedication to the defensive side of the ball … Was asked to take on an enhanced leadership role by coach Ford, and has responded commendably.
Weaknesses: Lack of ball handling skills really constricts his game … He is not comfortable creating offense for himself or teammates … Appears hesitant with the ball in his hands with a lack of ingenuity … Despite his athletic gifts, does not look “smooth” when forced to make a basketball move … Drives to the basket are predominantly to his left … Unable to change directions with the rock … Dribbles with his head down … Turnovers (2 per game for his career) and offensive fouls have been a problem … Not a particularly adept passer (1.3 ast per game) … His basketball IQ needs work … He’s a natural shooter, but not a natural basketball player … Could certainly stand to add some bulk, which would aid his ball handling woes … Knocked off balance too easily on drives … Despite improved aggression, still spends too much time floating around the perimeter, especially in crunch time. Needs to augment his mid-range game.
Notes: Has some oddball statistical games early in the 2009-2010 season, with a 15 rebound game vs. Seattle and a 5 block game vs. Arkansas-Pine Bluff. Was selected to the USA team at the World University Games where he averaged 7 pts and 2 rebounds in 12 minutes per game.
Astro Joe
August 25th, 2012
4:07 pm
Steve, first, I’m not trading Devin until closer to February (if then). The PG position is far too important to have one guy still in his learning curve (Teague) and projects behind him. I’m looking to trade some of the players acquired from the Nets… pretty much all of whom are expendable the first day they can be moved again.
If the roster does not change (heaven forbid), then let’s aggressively go for the lottery pick and play Josh at SF, Ivan at PF and Horford at C. And Teague and Lou in the backcourt. That should all but guarantee a 35 win season and the excitement of participation in the ping-pong ball lottery.
Astro Joe
August 25th, 2012
4:11 pm
Melvin, I never knew that Anderson was supposed to be an outstanding shooter. I thought he was more of a slasher than shooter. Yep, that’s exactly what we need (if no trade is coming), another guard in the 6′4″-6′7″ range who shoots well.
random
August 25th, 2012
5:16 pm
@steven a smith
Jordan Taylor signed with Virtus Roma some Italian League team.
Slimjr- a.k.a. "Mr DodgeBall King"........
August 25th, 2012
5:21 pm
Hey doc, life kind of got busy for me [ the dodge ball king]! Hey thanks Sautee, me likes! heh, heh, heh..
I should have worded my verbage differently referencing the fantastic guard play from Joe and Jamal against those mean Orlando Magic squads of yesteryear in the 1st rd. of the 2010 playoffs….
They played an intense super critical role in over coming Orlando for the 1st time in years thanks to their fantastic clutch shooting performances in that series..Yes the Bigs played an important role to help keep D12 in check but of course but those two have to be singled out and given game balls…
Thank you Sir… “Nimbers” Shrug…….
Now moving forward I hope these “new” guards can produce the same type of heroic action! Yeah!!!
And for the record: Sautee I was a pretty decent dodge baller…hahahahahahahah.
Slimjr- a.k.a. "Mr DodgeBall King"........
August 25th, 2012
5:22 pm
2011^^^^^
Slimjr....
August 25th, 2012
5:24 pm
“I would prefer to load up with talented guards
-than-
have a bunch of sorry ass Bigs that can`t play.” -Grandad-
I totally agree Sir!
Slimjr....
August 25th, 2012
5:34 pm
“Weaknesses: Lack of ball handling skills really constricts his game … He is not comfortable creating offense for himself or teammates … Appears hesitant with the ball in his hands with a lack of ingenuity … Despite his athletic gifts, does not look “smooth” when forced to make a basketball move “- Melvin-
Man, I read this somewhere before. sounds so familiar? Hmmmmmm
Slimjr
August 25th, 2012
5:58 pm
Falcons won a darn preseason game? Well what do ya know..Did you get a chance to see that beautifully under-thrown 49 yard bomb to Julio. Julio made a All-pro adjustment to go get it and hold on!
Thank you Julio! Gameball to Julio..
Superbowl or Bust, Huh Coach Smith????????????????
ntrigue
August 25th, 2012
6:06 pm
I don’t no what you all were watching during Summer League but Benson was balling. He rebounded good played solid defense including blocking shots and showed he has mid range game and can post up. Im pretty sure Ferry will keep Benson especially if he does good in training camp.
Rod from College Park
August 25th, 2012
6:23 pm
“Well, think about this. Lou Williams has never played with an offensive player as good as Josh Smith OR Al Horford. There was a lot of pressure on Williams to score baskets because the 76ers were so offensively challenged.”
“Rod, but my point stands. Lou Williams has never played SIGNIFICANT MINUTES with an offensive player in their prime who was better than Al and Josh are presently. If you want to play semantics and feel smart because Lou Williams was once on a team with Allen Iverson, who was once good, then by all means.”
Sure look like two different statements to me. Especially when Lou Williams will tell you himself that he learned from and patterns his game after Iverson. Your first statement was not true. Just admit it and move on.
Rod from College Park
August 25th, 2012
6:27 pm
“Then, on his final stint in Philly, Iverson was already kind of washed up… and Lou’s role was to replace Iverson so… your argument that Lou played with a talented player in Iverson seems very weak.
You should also take into consideration that Buddy was probably talking about these past 3 years.”
I don’t make assumptions. If you think Iverson was washed up, that’s your opinion. It still does not change the fact that they played together and Iverson was a better offensive player than Josh or Horford.
Rod from College Park
August 25th, 2012
6:30 pm
“Falcons won a darn preseason game? Well what do ya know..Did you get a chance to see that beautifully under-thrown 49 yard bomb to Julio. Julio made a All-pro adjustment to go get it and hold on!”
Matty Ice- 3 deep passes yesterday, all underthrown. LOL. Wonder what defenses will do against us in the playoffs?
Rod from College Park
August 25th, 2012
6:36 pm
Slimjr,
“They played an intense super critical role in over coming Orlando for the 1st time in years thanks to their fantastic clutch shooting performances in that series..Yes the Bigs played an important role to help keep D12 in check but of course but those two have to be singled out and given game balls…”
You were correct originally Slimjr. Jamal and Joe won that series for us. They were are two leading scorers. Dwight averaged 28 ppg in that series against us. We were able to keep the other guys in check because we stopped doubling. If not for Joe and Jamal, mainly Jamal we lose that series.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFkNk-vs5DI
Rod from College Park
August 25th, 2012
6:44 pm
More highlights to prove your point Slimjr. Another game in that series.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alkaMsE92S0&feature=related
Slimjr
August 25th, 2012
6:49 pm
Rod, this maybe Ice Melts last season with the Fal-cons as the featured starter..He’s got 8x the weapons that MV7 had and is not going to get it done in the playoffs again..Sounds like a broken record?
Took two more sacks from one of the worst teams in the NFL?
Bradley predicts 12-4! Hahahahahahahaha. I told him about those Baths Salts on his blog…..
Last Year Peter King had em winning the SUPER BOWL??????????? Hahahahahah
Oh these poor Fal-con fanatics…Sorry……
Mr Blank is in shop mode for a new stadium. He better be in the same mode for a Starting QB?
steven a smith
August 25th, 2012
6:50 pm
We will miss Joe Johnson and Marvin Williams. NOT!!! That was very “therapeutic”. I truely enjoyed that one. Now i can return to my Fantasy Football Draft. If we could only send a few more “Hawk Scrubs” to Utah, my summer will truely have been Superb.
Slimjr
August 25th, 2012
6:54 pm
“You were correct originally Slimjr. Jamal and Joe won that series for us. They were are two leading scorers. Dwight averaged 28 ppg in that series against us. We were able to keep the other guys in check because we stopped doubling. If not for Joe and Jamal, mainly Jamal we lose that series.” -Rod from CP-
Thanks Rod for the back up.. I’m not looking for a fight with doc.. LOL!
Eyeballs win over “nimbers”..Dang I forgot D12 still put up 28 per night! Wow!
You guys are much better equipped than me.. I’m a lover not a fighter…Hahahahahah…
Slimjr
August 25th, 2012
7:00 pm
Rod, some of those threes should be and ones? The defense is not allowing him to land without contact down low..Darn ref’s!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Slimjr
August 25th, 2012
7:02 pm
I’m convinced that we would have beat Boston in 5 if JC1 was still lighting it up for our Hawks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks Sund!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SteveW
August 25th, 2012
7:04 pm
AJ – Trust me, I’m not advocating trading Devin either – unless Ferry had something he felt would improve the team. I like Devin Harris.
Interesting starting 5 you propose there. I’m not sure how many games that squad would win – 35 sound about right – but you would have 3 guys with a legit shot at a 20+ PER starting, and Teague and Ivan as helpers – we could do worse I’m sure.
Slimjr
August 25th, 2012
7:08 pm
For the right deal I would advocate trading Al. But I want at least a #1-4 pick in next years draft too!
If Rev is right it maybe down hill from here? Hmmmmm
brigadierjerry
August 25th, 2012
7:38 pm
Martell Webster signed with the Wizards? Wow. You know the Hawks get trashed a lot for taking Marvin Williams at #2, but no one ever trashes the Blazers for trading down and picking this bum over the likes of Chris Paul and Deron Williams.
I got to see Webster play for the T-wolves this past year. Other than his hair looking like Coolio’s, there was nothing about Webster that stood out. What a bust. He still has time to become a decent player I suppose, but there is no way the Blazers should ever be able to live down that terrible deal.
KevinM
August 25th, 2012
9:11 pm
James Anderson is part of the SA system and we will see if has an added advantage to earn a roster slot. I always thought we should have drafted him out of OSU, but he really hasn’t been able to do anything to force Pop to play him in the rotation. He played a total of 32 playoff minutes and that was in 8 games.
Its time for him to start making an impact if he wants to stay in the league. Not a bad FT shooter, but you gotta get there plenty of times to make an impact.
Sautee
August 25th, 2012
9:11 pm
hey jerry,
FYI: Webster was picked 6th, so he wasn’t before CP3 or Deron. Still an awful pick, though.
Sautee
August 25th, 2012
9:14 pm
ok jerry, my bad. They traded down.
dap01
August 25th, 2012
9:16 pm
Season review on Willie Green? Seriously?
AG
August 25th, 2012
9:37 pm
I guess MC wrote all those season reviews and will publish them all – even if they print into the season…. or MC just didn’t feel like writing anything and just published something he previously wrote. ESPN had several good articles on the Hawks, one even rated them 2nd in the East. At this stage of the game I certainly prefer better articles on existing players (like the Lou Williams piece or the Devin Harris/Jeff Teague article.)
I agree with Grandad, we can sum up the reviews on Stack, Pargo, TMac and Damp (the other scrubs I think we covered already:
They came/ they played poorly/ Thank goodness they are gone!
brigadierjerry
August 25th, 2012
9:45 pm
Sautee,
No problem sir. I know Hawks get treated badly for that draft but Portland is just as guilty that year as well.
One thing I have noticed the coverage at least national media on the Hawks seem to be getting more favorable. Even the article that predicted Hawks second in the East which I dont think will happen when was the last time you seen an article written about the Hawks like that?
Sautee
August 25th, 2012
9:54 pm
Yeah, Ferry has already begun changing the attitude towards the organization. That won’t last too long, though, unless we win. We probably get a bye from the press until after next summer.
O'Brien
August 25th, 2012
10:05 pm
I’m not as high on Matt Ryan as the organization and the media is. But imo, even if he loses again in the playoffs, who are we going to get to play QB?
We don’t have a high enough draft pick to get a franchise QB, so are we willing to spend a late first round pick on one, and hope he develops? And we don’t have the money in free agency to sign a top level QB either.
If Matt Ryan struggles again in the playoffs, then (imo) the only consequence will be he will sign for less money on his next contract with the Falcons.
Plus Mike Smith will be fired before Matt Ryan is let go, so Smitty is the one on the hot seat this year (imo).
Buddy Grizzard
August 25th, 2012
10:10 pm
“It still does not change the fact that they played together and Iverson was a better offensive player than Josh or Horford.”
They played on the same team when either A. Lou Williams was an unheralded second round pick not getting a lot of minutes or B. Iverson was washed up. Despite playing “on the same team” as Iverson, Lou Williams didn’t spend a lot of time playing “with” Iverson because they play the same position and have the same role.
By the time Williams was drawing the attention of defenses, Iverson was no longer a factor. Lou will ideally play every game this season “with” Josh and Al. Unlike Iverson, Williams will spend a substantial amount of court time with Josh and Al. Sure he got to sit on the bench and study Iverson’s moves and go against him in practice. Occasional garbage time when Philly could afford to have two undersized shooting guards on the court at the same time is not what I had in mind when I said “played with.”
O'Brien
August 25th, 2012
10:16 pm
Jerry, sautee,
Portland gave up the 3rd pick to Utah, but in return they got the #6 pick, the #27 pick, and a 2006 first round pick. So even though the Webster pick was terrible, they did get other assets from Utah. Plus later in the draft, they traded with Denver for Jarret Jack, so they still got a PG.
The Hawks get a hard time for taking Marvin because 1)We had a bunch of wings on the team already 2) We badly needed a PG 3) We gave CP3’s backup huge money to come here (he stayed hurt) and 4)We resigned Marvin for 5 years, $37.5 mil (Webster resigned with Portland for 4 years, $20 mil) and couldn’t get rid of Marvin until now
doc
August 25th, 2012
11:06 pm
slimj you are always a gentleman and accomidating.
anyway al led us in assists in that series, dont choke and kirk had a tremendous series shooting lights out in the clutch when he needed to doing over 50% on both threes and from the field and rang up a few assists himself. i hear some serious coughing now. meanwhile, jj was his ordinary self from the field and three land and josh earned the title osh for his lack of aim for threes missing his j, but guard play it was not based on how few points were scored. again, jamal was awesome but overall it was a very team earned series. dont think it is fair to short change the many individual contributions in that series.
AG
August 25th, 2012
11:29 pm
I read a little earlier as one of the bloggers thinks we have a lottery team. Again – a closer look to compare this year as last year certainly reveals this team is better than last year – even if they do not make a trade for a SF.
PG Teague > Teague Although their are bloggers who believe Harris will start over JT0 – I strongly disagree. This season he will have an opportunity to really be a go to player. He scoring numbers will increase and now when he drives, he will have plenty of knock down shooters who knock down shots.
SG Williams Williams I like the expiring contract and Morrow’s salary. Although Marvin is 4″ taller, the Hawks were 23rd in the league in rebounding. Morrow is a career 2 rebound player – so expect the Hawks to be considerably worse.
PF Smith > Smith Although Josh had a career year, in the six games without Joe, the Hawks were 4-2. Smith games were: 13 pts 7 rbs (loss)
22 pts 12 rbs
24 pts 19 rbs
30 pts 12 rbs
27 pts 9 rbs
23 pts 6 rbs (loss)
With the marketing team preparing a major PR push around the hometown hero, expect Smith to finally reach the 20 ppg. plateau and shoot a higher percentage as now he will be depended upon to camp under the basket.
All-Star Al > All Star ZaZa Oh wait, has ZaZa been voted to, earned, elected or even chosen by coaches to any all-star team in the U.S? Did he even get at least 1 vote in? Even ZaZa’s career average of 7.8 ppg and 7.9 rbs and .5 blocks outshine Al’s career 12/7 high school, college and career average! Certainly my good friends on the blog like steven a smith will tell you our average ‘All-Star’ should be our backup to our non-star ZaZa. I disagree. Al will average more than 15ppg and grab at least 10 rbs. and far outshine the production we got out of center.
The reserves
Harris > Pargo Why even waste time with this comparison?
Jenkins= Greeen I actually liked Green – and if he would have hit that shot in game three, he may still be on this team. I did like what I saw in the Summer Leagues from Jenkins and I think he will be a major contributor off the bench this season..
Korver > TMac Okay in short burst I would prefer TMac. He did every blue moon show he still had it. Yet, Korver will be a little more consistent. He played in 65 games and averaged 8 ppg in 22 minutes off the bench.
Ivan> Ivan In his second NBA stint, I would not be surprised if he started at SF. He averaged 6.4 ppg and 4 rbs in only 56 games and 16 minutes. At 6′8″ 255 – he certainly is big enough to give us some extra help on the boards in the starting lineup.
ZaZa > Collins/Damp The local IHOP’s management team and franchise owners were the only two unhappy about watching these two leave town. I am not the biggest ZaZa fan, but those two combined make ZaZa look like Kareem!
The rest
The garbage guys (Benson, Scott, Stevenson, Petro, WIlliams ) is a little worse than (Vlade Rad, Stack, Damp). Yet, these guys should not impact the game in any way other than injuries
AG
August 25th, 2012
11:42 pm
last post…. a little wife distraction… let do a revision
SG Williams < Johnson Lou is giving up 6" 65 lbs – and was outscored last year 18.8 -14.9. Joe also out rebounded Williams 3.7 to 2.6. The biggest difference is JJ is scheduled to make 19 mil, Williams 5 mil. For that one reason alone – I would prefer Williams. With Hinrich starting at SG, I would give Williams the edge.
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
11:53 pm
ntrigue
I watched every SummerLeague game in it`s entirety.
K.benson played well;
not great, or eben exceptional, but [well] in the 1st game.
Evidently he was out of gas.
He went downhill each game thereafter.
Understanding that his competition was rookies and D-Leaguers;
it was not enough to only play well or [average].
He needed to excell.
Plus, he needed to do so in all five games, not just one.
I`m not trying to contradict your evaluation.
I`m only calling it as I see it.
I wanted to see KB be an assailant of sorts,
both defensively and on the glass.
However, game by game, he became more and more deferential
and apathetic.
ntrigue – Please understand;
I really liked benson coming out of college.
I wanted him on the team last yr as opposed to Collins.
*[and later Dampier]
I was really pullin` for the guy.
I just didn`t see it.
Evenin`,
G-dad
Grandad
August 25th, 2012
11:56 pm
or * [eben]* exceptional,
obviously – should have been … *’`even`’*
AG
August 26th, 2012
12:01 am
I thought he played well. He was dominate and instrumental in the first win. He maybe had one poor game. Other than that, he had a really soft touch. There is an upside with the kid, rather then getting another high-mileage retread.
EmirS.
August 26th, 2012
5:19 am
Really MC…Willie Green?
Moving on….can someone explain to me, in Basketball terms, the Red Sox and Dodgers trade? Like the significance of it and the caliber of the players sent to the two opposing teams. Everyone’s making a big deal out of it but I just plainly don’t understand it. One of the journalist on espn.com called it “something that has never been done before.” That caught my attention. Anyone?
Just Joe
August 26th, 2012
6:15 am
Emir….Boston sent 4 veteran major leaguers (ranging from a solid role player to former MVP candidates) along with $11M in cash to the Dodgers for an avg major league 1st baseman and 4 prospects. What makes it so unique is that the guys Boston sent are scheduled to make over $250M over the next 5 or 6 years.
You can’t really compare it to basketball because baseball has no salary cap (they don’t have to match salaries), but I’ll try. Imagine the Hawks trade off all of their long term contracts this year, and then next summer Boston decides to start over, so they trade Paul Pierce, KG, Bass, and Jason Terry to the Hawks for a 1st rd pick (except double the # of years on each of the Boston guys’ salaries). Same kind of star power. Same kind of age and declining skills. Huge salaries.
Just Joe
August 26th, 2012
6:32 am
Crawford is the guy that makes that deal so unbelievable. Going in to next season, he’ll be roughly 32, coming off of Tommy John surgery, OPS’ing in low .700’s over his two years in Boston while missing 150+ games, and is set to make over $100M in his next 5 seasons.
Gonzalez is a year younger and more productive than Crawford, but he’s due $120M+ over the next 6 years.
Jae Evolution
August 26th, 2012
6:37 am
Didn’t realize this guy James Anderson was so young or was even in the 2010 draft, but Danny makes up for yet another Sund mistake. Back when we shipped out 2 picks in Crawford and our ‘11 pick for…nothing? Now we have a guy who can come in start at SF, SG whatever he does he has the size to play either position can shoot, slash and play D. I think some will be pleased with what James is able to show us in a system that doesn’t limit him to corner three’s.
Just Joe
August 26th, 2012
6:52 am
Spurs are supposedly looking at trading Dejuan Blair & Gary Neal to Houston for Patrick Patterson, but Houston (again supposedly) wants to move Blair to a 3rd team for a draft pick. Hawks have the Willie Green trade exception that could absorb Blair’s salary. Hawks have Houston’s 1st and 2nd rd picks (both protected). Any idea how much longer Blair’s knees will hold up? Anyone willing to give up a pick to find out?
ntrigue
August 26th, 2012
9:08 am
@Grandad
I saw every summer league gm too and I disagree with your observations. I think Benson had only 1 bad gm and that was only on the offensive end otherwise I think he and Jenkins were the best two players by far. Benson earned a chance to show if he can hang with the big boys in training camp. I think he is ready to contribute off the bench now. I’ll post his gm numbers later on.
steven a smith
August 26th, 2012
10:10 am
ntrigue
August 26th, 2012
9:08 am
Agree. keith Benson appears he would be the 2nd best defender if he were on the “Active” Atlanta Hawks Roster. I DVRed several Hawk Summer League games and Benson had better than average instincts.
5th in the East...again
August 26th, 2012
10:45 am
Does the Anderson signing mean Stevenson is out? If so another big trade could be looming.
Ken Strickland
August 26th, 2012
1:43 pm
Willie Green had a career yr with us last yr. And yet, in LWilliams, DHarris, AMorrow, KKorver, and maybe even JJenkins, we have 5 players with the potential to equal or exceed his production if given the mins. Adding center JPetro, and possibility KBenson to go along with Zaza, will definitely increase our overall depth and production at OC, especially our rebounding and DEF ability.
Grandad
August 26th, 2012
2:25 pm
Season in Review … Tracy McGrady:
According to ’synergysprtstech’ he was hurt alot.
-then-
He pissed in LD`s corn flakes,,,,,and that was that.
-oh yeah-
He had that one Big Game vs Miami early on;
and reminded us he once was a great player !
____________________________________________
-coming next-
…Marvin…
-tonite or tomorrow-
Rusty
August 26th, 2012
2:30 pm
I really liked KB in the summer games also Scott. Also thought Jenkens looked terrific.,he should get a lot of minutes.
BIG DOG
August 26th, 2012
2:49 pm
Al Horford for Andrew Nicholas, I BE DAM
What world is earth coming 2.
BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE
BIG DOG
August 26th, 2012
2:53 pm
Dion Glover AVG 22 points in summer league, SMH
BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE
glw
August 26th, 2012
5:17 pm
BIG DOG
August 26th, 2012
2:49 pm
Al Horford for Andrew Nicholas, I BE DAM
What world is earth coming 2.
BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE
******************************************************
I got a good laugh at that too Big Dog, are people that desperate to get rid of Al for a rookie. He might turn out to be good, but he is just as likely to be no more than a journeyman roleplayer. And if the Hawks would do that deal Josh would definitely walk next year.
Astro Joe
August 26th, 2012
5:27 pm
Just Joe, I’d like Blair but not for anything other than a 2nd round pick (and the Willie TE). He has one year left on his contract, so he would be a very good one year rental and may help these 17 guards run if he maintains his usually high rebounding rate.
Just Joe
August 26th, 2012
6:22 pm
AJ…do you think the Hawks are willing to trade picks for role players at this time? I would, but as a fan, I tend to be more short sighted. Does Ferry even care if the roster is out of balance this year, or will he simply hold the best 15 players he can get his hands on (even if 12 are shooting guards)?
Ken Strickland
August 26th, 2012
6:26 pm
All of you HORFORD HATERS were dead wrong when you thought JSmith would walk if we didn’t acquire DHoward. None of you eever thought about what he’d do if we traded AHorford, especially for anyone other than Dwight. Some of you are so damned stupid that you think everyone else shares your stupidity. And you seem to think, in you can call what some of you fools do and say the result of any thought process, that all NBA players should share your stupdity as well.
I guess that’s why you either ignore or admonish all of the NBA players, coaches, and writers who have a completely opposite opinion of Horford, his accomplishments, potential and abilities. You’re too stupid to realize there’s a reason Horford, rather than Josh, has been given the awards and recognition he’s received.
Horford and Josh make a very good tandem. They are both very athletic and play much bigger than their actual height and size. The specific skills and abilities of our new backcourt rotation will make it much easier for them to function around the lane and without the constant threat of double teams and zones.
This whole attitude and fear about our lack of ideal size reminds me of a NCAA title gm between Michigan State and UCLA back before most of you were probably born. Michigan was one of the tallest teams in the nation with 6′7″ SG Cazzie Russel. UCLA starting center was the only player taller than 6′5″.
When asked what they would do against a much taller and bigger oppohent, the UCLA players said they weren’t the ones that had to carry around all of that height and size. Needless to say, UCLA wore them down and won the NCAA title that yr by using superior speed, quickness, and athleticism to compensate for their lack of height and size. The Hawks will use those same attributes, along with excellent long range shooting ability, to have a very good season and playoffs.
Just Joe
August 26th, 2012
6:44 pm
Ken…did Josh sign an extension or something?
coach roy
August 26th, 2012
7:03 pm
sg-sf james anderson out of oaklahoma st. draft class 2010 the number 20 pick in the first round by spurs.
Just Joe
August 26th, 2012
7:11 pm
How in the world will LD manage the minutes of Teague, Harris, Williams, Morrow, Jenkins, Stevenson, Korver, and Anderson….especially when we play the Lakers and Sixers, and Josh plays a lot of SF?
I predict a lot of locker room issues surrounding playing time and shot selection.
KevinM
August 26th, 2012
7:27 pm
Stickland is losing any tact he used to have. The Horford detractors just get under your skin.
And this isn’t college; NO BOYS ALLOWED!
And for those who love Benson thinking he will contribute:
Keith Benson = Solomon Jones V 2.0
Benson isn’t getting us past the 2nd round…..neither is Blair, who isn’t even as good as Big Baby.
steven a smith
August 26th, 2012
7:32 pm
KevinM
August 26th, 2012
7:27 pm
If keith Benson is a “C’ player, Slomomn Jones was an “F” Player. Benson allready ways ahead of solomon Jones.
KevinM
August 26th, 2012
7:36 pm
James Harden scenarios a topic of discussion on cnnsi…includes a sceanrio to the Hawks…sounds like a reach at best…..Lou and multiple picks……
steven a smith
August 26th, 2012
8:13 pm
James Hardin would be “Ok” at 5 year $40mill/per. I would not go over 9 mill/per because of his weaknesses.
steven a smith
August 26th, 2012
8:22 pm
PG-Teague/Lou Williams/Harris
SG-Hardin/John Jenkins/Morrow
SF-Josh Smith/James Anderson/Korver
PF-Al Jefferson/Ivan Johnson
C–MeHemet Oku/rJohan Petro
Dump Zsa Zsa by trading deadline.
glw
August 26th, 2012
9:03 pm
@steven a smith
man you tight with that money. first you said bynum was only worth 4/48 mill
now you say harden is only a 5yr 40 million player. In theory that is their worth probably, but just like Bynum is getting max money, Harden is getting pretty close to max money too.
that 5 yr deal better be in the range of 5yr/65 mill and that might even be a low ball figure.
steven a smith
August 26th, 2012
9:12 pm
glw
August 26th, 2012
9:03 pm
I just don’t see James Hardin as an “Elite” player. I am not sure he can beat double teams or consistently beat his man off the dribble. He is a nice Scorer/jump Shooter.
glw
August 26th, 2012
9:27 pm
he really isnt an elite player as is the no.3 option in OKC, but his situation is so similar to Joe when he was in Phoenix and we overpaid and gave Joe 5/70mill and the same thing will happen this time too. Not sure I am all that crazy about paying that to have him here, but if not, am sure Phoenix, Houston and maybe Dallas might throw that type of money at him. I know Houston and Phoenix are desperate for a No.1 or a wanna be No. 1.
steven a smith
August 26th, 2012
9:45 pm
If Josh Smith signs eleswhere in 2013, I like Taj Gibson to replace him.We could probabaly get him for 1/2 of Josh type money.
steven a smith
August 26th, 2012
9:52 pm
In the 2004
steven a smith
August 26th, 2012
9:55 pm
In the 2004 NBA Draft, we took Josh Childress ahead of Luol Deng and Al Jefferson. Go figure! Imagine if we had Deng at the “3″ right now.
doc
August 26th, 2012
10:32 pm
sweet, chipper just got a standing o in san francisco as he pinch hits in last at bat against the giants. class act by their fans.
Ken Strickland
August 26th, 2012
10:48 pm
KEVINM-Why should I show any tact for a select number of ANAL MINDED MORONS who post under various names? None of these idiots have shown any tact when it comes to posting their HORFORD HATING BS, yet you somehow think they’re deserving of consideration. Where’s the logic?
doc
August 26th, 2012
10:51 pm
nice, say hey kid just took one “bay” his third in three games. i am hoping he is the real deal and has had a huge comeback this year. freeman goes back to back.
SteveW
August 26th, 2012
11:16 pm
Hawks 48 minute ratings – 5.0 being the League average:
PG – Teague/Harris – Teague is approaching being an average starting PG in the League. Harris may be the best backup PG in the League if this is the way it rolls.
Average – 6.5
SG – Lou is good but small – defensive matchup issues. Jenkins is an unknown quantity.
Average – 6.0 – Maybe higher if Jenkins plays well
SF – Just play Morrow, Stevenson, Korver, and Anderson in 12 minute human waves – 1 guy each quarter.
Average – 3.5 – Only because of decent quality depth is it this high.
PF – Josh/Ivan – Josh is a top tier PF. Ivan is a very good backup.
Average – 8.5
C – Horford is good, but undersized and coming off an injury. ZaZa is an average starting C, also coming off an injury.
Average – 8.0
Our average – 31.5
League average – 25.0
We are 21% over League average per position. This would equate to a 49 win season.
With our Big lineup:
PG – Same – 6.5
SG – Morrow/Lou/Jenkins – 6.5 – But may have minute issues like Just Joe said above.
SF – Josh/Korver/Stevenson/Anderson – 8.0 – Not Josh’s natural position – may have minute issues – see above. But deep
PF – Al/Ivan – Al isn’t is good as Josh, but he’s still a very good player – 7.5
C- ZaZa/Petro – ZaZa is an average starting C in the NBA. Petro is probably an average backup. 5.0
Big lineup 48 minute average – 33.5
League average – 25.0
25.4% over League average – should equal 51 or 52 wins.
SteveW
August 26th, 2012
11:25 pm
The small lineup above is actually 32.5 average = 50 wins.
I have no idea how we accomplish those win totals. But we do have some real, quality players.
And worst case scenario next summer – we have 3 guys, Al, Lou, and Jenkins signed for approximately 19 mill.
You could add four 10 mill per year guys, a mid level, and another 1st
Two 18 mill per year guys to that group, and a mid level and another 1st
One 18 mill per year, two 10 mill’s and a midlevel along with another 1st pick.
Al, Lou, and Jenkins at 19 mill per year is not a bad group for the money to build off of.
And yes, I give Harden max money. Got to. Somebody will. But it will be the 3rd tier max, not the top tier max like Kobe, or the 2nd tier max like Joe Johnson. And it will be under the new CBA, so it’s only for 4 years.
And I’d give Taj Gibson 10 mill per for 4 years. He’s probably going to get that in this market. Look what Asik got.
SteveW
August 26th, 2012
11:29 pm
I’m guessing Josh gets that 2nd tier max money – especially if Dallas makes a run for Dwight – Cuban will for sure give it too him. 4 years 74 mill, or around there.
We can offer 5 years at 95 mill, or about 19 mill on average, I think. 1st year is 16.4 mill, and goes up from there, 7.5% raises. I’m doing that from memory, so somebody probably needs to check me on that.
SteveW
August 26th, 2012
11:30 pm
Josh’s non-Bird team can only give 4.5% raises per year.
Melvin
August 27th, 2012
12:37 am
Why would Dallas go after Josh when they already have Dirk at the PF?
Also, how come folks can suggest that CP3 or Dwight would not leave their current teams and money on the table (the 5th year contract option) but would suggest that Josh will leave the Hawks (and his 5th year option) ?
Grandad
August 27th, 2012
12:46 am
Season in Review … Marvin Williams
“Goodbye, Farewell, Amen”
with the tune:
“Suicide is Painless”/ circa 1970 / playing softly in the background
Grandad
August 27th, 2012
12:48 am
Old timers will get the M*A*S*H reference.
Slimjr
August 27th, 2012
7:51 am
Hey doc thanks for the kind words Sir the other day.
Slimjr
August 27th, 2012
8:08 am
Just Joe, keep up the great trade Ideas even if they involve the former Allstar. Your a trail blazer.. The rest of us will catch up? Maybe not? heh heh heh
Use your scroll key for when you see unacceptable child like verbiage being spewed out their hearts..
Works great.
SteveW
August 27th, 2012
8:24 am
Melvin – Only saying Josh will be offered Max money – didn’t say he would take it.
Why would Cuban offer Max money to a 27 year old F, when he has a 35 year old PF, when the 27 year old F happens to be best friends with the FA (Dwight) your trying to build your franchise around?
You tell me.
And Dwight would leave money on the table possibly to be with Mark Cuban – that guy has the $$$$ to take extreme good care of you when your playing days are over.
vava74
August 27th, 2012
8:24 am
This is for Ken’s enjoyment (From Sheridan Hoops and Sheridan himself) – OFF SEASON REPORT CARD:
“ATLANTA HAWKS – When you have gotten rid of the worst contract in the NBA, as Danny Ferry did by trading Joe Johnson to the Brooklyn Nets, you have to be somewhat lauded. Of all the players acquired in that deal, only Anthony Morrow figures to contribute. The moves we liked most were the signings of Lou Williams and the trade for Kyle Korver, and it should be noted that Al Horford may be the best center in the East now that Dwight Howard is gone. (Andrew Bynum might disagree). Ferry could have as much as $30 million in cap space next summer, and he’ll probably get a meeting (at the very least) with Howard after D-12′s contract expires. Al Jefferson would not be a bad fallback. Probably still a middle-of-the-pack team, but possibly better than that with more depth (don’t forget Devin Harris) and more shot opportunities now that Johnson’s 15-20 per night are gone.”
SteveW
August 27th, 2012
8:30 am
And are we sure it’s a done deal that ATL will offer Josh Max money? I know we’ll offer close – I’m not so sure we get back into another max contract so soon after JJ, unless it’s a Dwight or a Chris Paul.
Slimjr
August 27th, 2012
8:33 am
Melvin as a GM, it is your duty to pursue these FA’s even if the world says no way they would leave the teams they have been playing for plus leave [money on the table]. To not even talk with them would be a dereliction of duty imho..
vava74
August 27th, 2012
8:36 am
SteveW,
Howard will not leave LA until he retires or until his value is greatly diminished and LA trades him like they did to Shaq.
LA’s good life, constant party scene, the possibility of furthering his interest in cinema and huge endorsement market will make it so.
Howard does not strike me to be a guy who will think about a move to Dallas as something good.
He does not seem to be the type of guy who will be thinking about moving to a generally quieter place due a post retirement “safe ownership environment”.
doc
August 27th, 2012
9:12 am
slimj, no prob. this isnt a place to be personal or take them that way. we all got ideas so let us hear them unless they are broken records or mantras. then it is vendetta’s in my opinion and beyond the scope of discourse. i enjoy ours and he banter, some dpont take it that way and go beyond civil lines.
so, the reality check is, you can say all the good byes you want. if we were going to go forward there was an albatross around our necks and it was jj’s contract. it enables us to think and dream a bit on our own. without the move we were stuck and going backwards on a slide. i commend df and i look forward to seeing what these guys can do on the court. last years team went far beyond where they should have. i can only hope this team does the same and jeff, josh and al are the leaders i can best hope for them.
Buddy Grizzard
August 27th, 2012
9:14 am
“Also, how come folks can suggest that CP3 or Dwight would not leave their current teams and money on the table (the 5th year contract option) but would suggest that Josh will leave the Hawks (and his 5th year option) ?”
Neither CP3 nor Dwight has expressed any dissatisfaction with their current team. Granted, Dwight just got traded. But in spite of any present positive vibes from Josh, the fact is that he is on the record making a trade request. Sure he says he no longer wants to be traded and he’s excited about the team. Hopefully we won’t be asking ourselves how excited he is next off-season if the Hawks miss the playoffs.
Astro Joe
August 27th, 2012
10:46 am
Just Joe, I would trade a 2nd rounder for a proven rotational player. And in the case of Blair, it doesn’t impact next summer’s cap space. I do think Ferry will use the imminently dispensable players acquired for Joe to blance the roster. If the Anderson signing is true, I’m guessing that he already has a deal in place and is simply waiting for the 60 days to expire when he can deal 1 or more of the former Nets.
Ken Strickland
August 27th, 2012
11:42 am
VALVA74-Thanks for the link, but I had already seen it. I actually agree with the findings. I was hoping Ferry would go after Gee, since his name was prominantly and one we would persue in FA. However, Ferry did mention that he’d also consider someone that he could sign to a vet minimum contract, and it looks like Anderson is that choice.
I know virtually nothing about Anderson, other than he was a 1st rd pick, and it’s believed that his failures with the Spurs might have been due to his inability to adjust to their style of play. Who knows, he just might turn out to be the Spurs version of PG JTeague under Woodson, as well as Drew before Hinrich’s timely, for Teague’s sake, injury.
Anderson does bring considerably more speed, quickness, and athleticism that we got from JJ at SF, and he could be a better rebounder. It certainly wouldn’t take much effort to equal or exceed JJs 3.7RPG. DHarris will replicate JJs assists and definitely exceed Hinrich’s 6.6PPG scoring. That, combined with the return of AHorford, will more than compensate for JJs scoring, assists, and rebounding.
Ferry’s unwillingness to commit to a longterm contract, or one higher than the minimum, demonstrates his desire to go all out in next yrs FA. He obviously doesn’t feel that this yr is all that important as far as wins and losses are concerned. He’s committing to minimum contracts so he can be a major player in next yrs FA, whereas Sund was forced to commit to them out of necessity.
While none of us knows what Ferry’s long term plans for the Hawks might be, it’s obvious that Josh does. And when told what it was, he was inspired enough by what he heard to immediately retract his long standing desire and demand to be traded. We certainly haven’t heard any comments from Josh about our so called undersized team and/or backcourt.
pointguardslim
August 27th, 2012
11:42 am
4 years 74 mill, or around there. ($18.5 mil per year?????? Well they do have Dirk and want Dwight but damn thats a horrible contract without other superstars in tow)
“Why would Dallas go after Josh when they already have Dirk at the PF?”
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=stein_marc&page=carlisleintro-080515
Probably to add athleticism at small forward. Like Carlisle and Cuban tried to do 4 years ago.
U R Blind.
Ken Strickland
August 27th, 2012
11:45 am
That should be “PROMINANTLY MENTIONED” AND “PURSUE”.
Ken Strickland
August 27th, 2012
11:50 am
I’m really looking forward to seeing how LDrew has this team playing uptempo fastbreaking basketball and team DEF. The success of the Hawks will depend on it. And there will be no more excuses, as far as his motion OFF is concerned, since JJ and his halfcourt oriented ball and player movement stopping ISO OFF is no longer be an issue.
MsDee
August 27th, 2012
12:19 pm
KenS,
I do share in your optimistic view of the Hawks this upcoming season. As always, the Hawks out performs what many believes will fail. But would like to ask u a question. If the Hawks do incredibly well this season, maybe finishing as high as 4 in the east, do u think Danny Ferry will still look to get rid of those who helped get us to the 4th place just to get a couple of big time FA next season?
O'Brien
August 27th, 2012
1:13 pm
Melvin,
If Dallas got Dwight, and had the money, they are one team that could get away with Josh playing SF. Dirk is a jump shooter, so that would allow Josh to be in the post more, and although playing SF takes him away from the paint on defense, Dwight would be there to make up for it.
That being said, I don’t think Dallas has the money to go after Dwight and Josh, and Im not sure if they would want Josh at SF.
O'Brien
August 27th, 2012
1:14 pm
I think (when healthy), Bynum is the best center in the East. But I think Al is in the discussion to be in the top 5, especially if he goes back to being boss Al.
Sautee
August 27th, 2012
1:50 pm
O’B,
Co-sign your 1:14 post.
MsDee
August 27th, 2012
2:00 pm
OB,
If Horford goes back to being ‘Boss AL’ and Bynum is the ‘best’ center in the east, then who are 2-4? If Horford goes back to being ‘Boss AL’ and I have great reason to believe he would, than that would make him next best behind Bynum, IMO of course!!
Astro Joe
August 27th, 2012
2:15 pm
Hawks GM Danny Ferry says Spurs free agent James Anderson has been invited to join the team’s veterans camp. Anderson apparently will accept, according to a tweet by former teammate Danny Green. Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Free-agent Anthony Tolliver said he’s intrigued by Atlanta, a team that has great interest in him. “I don’t think they have a guy on their roster with that skill set with shooting and versatility,’’ Tolliver said about being a big man who can step out on the floor. When Tolliver was with Cleveland several years ago, Hawks GM Danny Ferry was the GM there. Tolliver also said he has a “really good relationship’’ with Wes Wilcox, then with Cleveland and now Hawks assistant GM.
Astro Joe
August 27th, 2012
2:19 pm
I’m guessing tha Anderson gets that non-guaranteed deal that Ferry talked about offering a wing a week or so ago. Hard to imagine Tolliver signing if Ivan is on board… but who knows.
Speaking of “Boss Al”, if all around you are players who either can shoot jumpers or want to shoot jumpers, it kind of tempting to follow suit, especially when your boss places such a premium on taking the first good shot 9which is often a jumper).
Astro Joe
August 27th, 2012
2:20 pm
Tolliver doesn’t think we have a big who shoots 20+ footers? I guess he hasn’t watched #5 under LD’s leadership.
Ken Strickland
August 27th, 2012
2:59 pm
MSDEE-Now that’s a doggone good question. By rights, he should be rehired if he once again exceeds expectations with this team. As much as some like to put LD down, he’s done a very good job of exceeding expectations during his tenue as HC. However, Ferry is in a very unusual situation.
Unless he has a definite HC in mind to lead this team according to his expectations, and Drew does well, but not as well as Ferry’s expectations, I can see him not being rehired. Which players will be resigned will depend on who we sign during FA, and how well they fit. I can certainly see Teague and Josh being resigned, but whether we resign Zaza will depend on who we sign in FA.
Bynum is accustomed to competing for NBA titles, and that won’t happen anytime soon if he stays in Philly. They’ve lost way too much talent, with the loss of Iggy, LWilliams and EBrand, to be title contenders. therefore, he might be willing to accept a change.
If Drew and his staff can master implimenting the team DEF concept, along with an uptempo fastbreaking OFF to go along with his MOTION OFF, the Hawks can more than hold their own with the Bulls, 76ers, Knicks, Celtics, Pacers and Nets. Speed, quickness and athleticism kills, and we have more than our share of all 3.
Even though we’ll have some serious 3pt shooters with Morrow, Korver, Jenkins, LWilliams, and DHarris, we’ll also have 3 serious penetrators in JTeague, DHarris, and LWilliams. Add that combination to Josh, Horford, Zaza and Ivan inside, and we’ll be a challenge for any DEF to contend with.
Ken Strickland
August 27th, 2012
4:08 pm
MSDEE-One other thing to consider in regards to your question. DFerry definitely became accustomed to decipline and order in his time with the Spurs. And as we all witnessed during LDrews 2yrs as HC, that wasn’t adhered to here. JJ hijacked the ball and the OFF whenever he chose to do so, and Josh launched illadvised jumpers whenever he decided to do so. Decipline was nonexistent with the Hawks under LDrew.
Even if he leads this team to unexpected success, if Ferry doesn’t see the type of control, order and decipline that he wants to see, LDrew will most likely be let go. You don’t bring head strong and tempermental players like DHoward, ABynum, or AJefferson to a team with a HC that can’t instill a sense of order and decipline.