Atlanta Hawks: Summer roster set

“Buddy, is that the same Kanter that half of the blog wanted to trade Josh for?”

That’s the guy!

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No David Lighty.

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thanks for the post MC.
Keith Benson time!!!
id like to see what Jordan Taylor is able to do as well.
are these summer league games on NBATV?

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We’re changing MC’s name to “Blog-a-minute Cunningham”.

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In the spirit of the 2012 Olympics, do I get a bronze medal? Win, Place, Show. Am I the “Show” in this [horse] race?

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Pape Sy are you serious? I hope he paid his T&L again.

Oh well, I guess we need bodies at every position.

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That crew can beat the Bobcats!!

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Pale Sy is actually one of the more promising players on this roster. Really like his game.

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Lightly averaged 10ppg in Italy and looked very unathletic on the highlights I saw.

I don’t think he is physically gifted enough to play in the NBA.

And what the hell is Brad turnover machine Wannamaker back on our summer league roster?

He proved to be atrocious in preseason last year.

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The Hawks lost their 2 best wing defenders… Papa Sy has a very good chance to make this team… If his 3pt shooting is real at 38%…

Yeah, where is Eric Griffin?…. We have a need for a small forward.

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[light] ^^^^ okay purist…

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Sure, fill out a couple of roster spots on the cheap, but if we really need a good wing, let’s make a play at Raja Bell….

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If Ferry is starting a development program, I’d expect to see a couple of these names (beyond Jenkins and Scott) as our 13th and 14th players on the roster.

I’d love to see Kito stick. If / when he fills out, he could be useful.

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Well at least Larry will have a roster full of Jump shooters.. Maybe they can shoot their way into a playoff slot?

Keep the streak alive of consecutive playoff appearances? Good marketing strategy! Yea that’s the ticket! Hmmm..

“Shoot the Jumper! Shoot it” Dave Chappelle

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“14 in a row should be their goal”…..Hey it worked for the Braves?

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Horrible summer league roster…Bunch of SCRUBS…

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Stern is going to make it happen. It’s New York baby!

Two power house NBA teams in New York? Ratings through the roof! Yes Hawk Fans time to pack up and move own……

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Najeh Davenpoop

July 9th, 2012
6:43 pm

From 2 blogs ago

“If we are out of the Howard sweepstakes, Danny has to trade Josh immediately.”

I agree. The whole point of salary dumping Joe and Marvin is to get a superstar who will take this team farther than Joe took them. Holding serve with Teague/Josh/Al doesn’t get you any closer to doing that. If they can’t bring Dwight here, they need to start going after lottery picks. Trade Josh for someone’s unprotected first rounder and tank for a year.

This guy stole “MY PLAN” for the Atlanta Hawks. Best and quickest way to improve and compete for a championship.

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With that said, for now, they still need to do what it takes to get Dwight here for a year and convince him to stay, even if he doesn’t immediately sign an extension.

Chris Paul Says He Will Play Out Season and Then Review His “Options”

Players’ minds can be changed pretty easily. Deron Williams wasn’t exactly thrilled about being dealt to New Jersey when that trade went down, and Dwight has been even more fickle than him. Bring Dwight here to play with Josh for a year and then throw max contracts at the two of them and CP3 next summer.

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Teague is the only keeper right now on this team. After watching Al Scrub it up for the Domminican Republic National Team, I would seriously consider trading him for a wing player or draft picks..
Maybe he would be my amnesty player!!! Al was not the BEST player on his national team GIRLS…

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I’m not sure the C’s haven’t accepted Rondo’s personality and made him the conerstone… think the Rondo market has closed for good. I’m hoping the Westbrook/Durant dynamic turns south and we know how Presti feels about picks.. Westbrook needs his own club.. if Rondo is out of the question, Westbrook is box office talent.

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Everyone involved except the Nets is a f-cking moron if this Dwight to the Nets trade goes through.

The Magic are morons because they are getting nowhere close to the best possible deal if the best player they get in return is Brook Lopez’s Angel Soft ass.

The Hawks and every other team that can put together a decent trade offer are f-cking morons because no matter how much Dwight has a hard on for Brooklyn, he can’t sign there as an unrestricted free agent next year because they will be capped out. It doesn’t matter whether that’s the only place he says he will sign an extension. If they don’t trade for him, he can’t play there, period.

If a team like the Hawks steps in and trades Al + Devin Harris + their two 2013 first rounders for Dwight and Jason Richardson (which is a better deal than what the Magic are slated to get from the Nets), the Hawks won’t be competing with the Nets to sign Dwight. They will only be competing with teams that have cap room, and this doesn’t include Brooklyn, the Knicks, the Lakers, the Clippers, or any other big market team. In other words, they can paint Dwight into a corner by trading for him.

Unless Dwight is willing to sign at the mid level to play in Brooklyn, he can talk all he wants about how much he loves to play there and it means jack sh-t. If the Hawks trade for him, in all likelihood he will sign an extension here.

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After reviewing the play, the Clippers may not have the cap room to make a play for Dwight next summer but they can pretty easily create enough cap room. Still, though, this idea that Dwight will find a way to play in Brooklyn even if they don’t trade for him is false. Brooklyn will be paying over $50 million to Deron, Joe, Gerald Wallace, and Teletovic alone next year. They won’t have anywhere near enough cap space to sign Dwight as an unrestricted free agent.

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You’re wildly confused, whey would a team get Josh’s bird rights and not us. Ferry has a list of free agents he’ll go after this time next year. We won’t be the only team with money but easily the best foundation along with Cleveland.

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FTPB

” No one is going to pay to see this team as constructed in Atlanta. Get past this Dwight thing and make some moves Mr. Ferry. Dwight nor CP3 is signing with us next year, no matter how much cap room we have. Make some moves. Should have made sure we got Marshawn Brooks.”

Nobody is going to pay to see Marshon Brooks either. People will pay to see superstars. If Dwight and CP3 don’t come here, blow this thing up and tank.

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Do we dare offer Kaman a 4 year deal starting at 7 million. I mean why not he fits a need and Zaza is free agent next year.

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Derick Caracter is a beast only reason Lakers let him go is because he had offseason arrest. If he has his act togethher he will be a steal. Jeremy Hazell will give us an additional scorer/knockdown jump shooter with our reserves. I expect Pap to be picked due to his versatility and abilty to play SF with good perimeter D. If Benson has become stronger he should earn a spot as well we’ve been lacking another shot blocker since Solo left to help when Josh is out of the game. Both draft picks should stick this year Mike Scott is simliar to Al who plays inside and out he just has a better inside game than Al he will be our Taj Gibson type player off the bench. Jordan Williams can help too. I think with these additions our overall team will be way deeper than last yr we will have several shooters and more quality frontcourt depth.

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Marcus Camby is a Knick. Tyson Chandler’s backup.

I don’t think his impact matched his stats even when he was good, but strictly as a backup he is a good pickup.

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WTF still no Gladyr? I hope Sy has developed because we need his size right now on the wing. Are any of these forwards listed small forward?

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“@Rod from CP – “Your post should read he is an all star because he is not at his natural position. He would have no chance being an all star playing the 4. He was an all star because he was listed as a center.””

Too bad for the Hawks to win they need another center and move Josh and Horford up a position.
But are Atlanta fans able to swallow their pride for a chance at the gold?
Stacking By Position
Teague + Harris – - – - – 18 ppg combined
Morrow + Jenkins – - — – 18 ppg combined
Josh (16)+ Randolph (4) – - – - – 20ppg
Horford + Mike Scott + Ivan – - – 20ppg
Zaza, Dalembert– – – 14ppg combined

That’s a Rick Carlisle, Larry Brown, Doug Collins type lineup. With Smith’s blocks and assists he becomes Iguodala-2.0.
Do you want to go for the title?

As long as you stack the big men – and go for defense then the Hawks should have no problem winning 50 games.

More likely the Hawks try to reinvent the wheel – playing Smith as a OF (offensive forward) and Horford as a OC (offensive center)

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Right now here’s our roster:

Al / Josh / Teague / Zaza / Harris
Stevenson / Morrow / Williams (we always have to have a frickin’ Williams or 2) / Petro

That leaves, what 4 slots to get to 13?

So we have:

Johnson / Jenkins / Scott as the most obvious locks.

Does that leave one spot open for the rest of the summer roster?

Yep, I can see LD’s pet project Sy making this roster and not helping much. We’re going to find a way to ‘Mario West’ him. Shades of Woody?

The odds are bad for the rest of this roster. This roster not near as interesting as it could be if we had moved a couple more vets.

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Good stuff JJ, but you gotta think that if Lopez is ending up with a max contract, guess who else is going to expect a max deal? He’ll take the chance by being a FA and let the bidding begin.
Right now, Josh has no reason to come back and give a ‘hometown’ discount. You’re seeing a guy who is not necessarily healthy (Lopez) rumored to be getting a max deal.
So much for common sense down in Orlando.

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“you gotta think that if Lopez is ending up with a max contract, guess who else is going to expect a max deal? He’ll take the chance by being a FA and let the bidding begin.
Right now, Josh has no reason to come back and give a ‘hometown’ discount. You’re seeing a guy who is not necessarily healthy (Lopez) rumored to be getting a max deal.”

This is a good point. If Lopez is a max player it completely skews the market for all big men. Not only are Josh and Al also max players, but even the Bargnanis of the league have a good case for max money.

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Lopez is getting that premium that all guys with the label “5″ or “center” get, plus he’s the key to the Dwight Howard trade. Ilyasova is a decent “comp” for Josh too. He got 5 & $45M.

Don’t you know the other Lopez brother is saying “What about me? I’m 7′ too.”

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Hawks went from too many to not enough wings.
go figure.

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Nothing about this roster excites me….

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If I was Danny…I would not pressure Josh to sign…CUZ then you look desperate…stick with your plan…let the drama play out with Dwight and be ready to pounce!!

The core needed to be broke up…and you got rid the two worst contracts of that group…The Hawks just mortgage the future on JJ…don’t do it again…just for one season with D12…there are couple of decent Vet FAs that can help our cause…take the time and do it right!!

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The whole point of salary dumping Joe and Marvin is to get a superstar who will take this team farther than Joe took them. Holding serve with Teague/Josh/Al doesn’t get you any closer to doing that. If they can’t bring Dwight here, they need to start going after lottery picks. Trade Josh for someone’s unprotected first rounder and tank for a year.

Quite the valid point…

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I wish that Danny Ferry was the GM of this Blog, so consequently, he could trade away some of these SCRUB BLOGGERS..ie…Davenpoop, Slimjim, and Grandmaster Idiot

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I like the idea of Kris “Kardashian” Humphries at the 4 for Atlanta., only if we get a #1 draft pick…

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I wish that Danny Ferry was the GM of this Blog, so consequently, he could trade away some of these SCRUB BLOGGERS..ie…Davenpoop, Slimjim, and Grandmaster Idiot

I disagree, sir. You may not like the varying opinions, and in some cases I completely understand (and agree) with that sentiment. However, I feel that Najeh Davenpoop ALWAYS presents clear, concise, intelligent opinions…regardless of whether or I agree with them or not, and does not deserve to be categorized so.

Of course, you may detest that opinion by me as well, but such is life….

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Well, I’m confused. If the Magic are willing to sign and trade Dwight this year, why wouldn’t they do it next year (to the Nets)? Moreover, the Magic want to MOVE ON and who can blame them. They blew up the old arena, the GM, the head coach so why not the pouting superstar who doesn’t want to be there? Maybe they feel like if they can’t go further than the 1st round (afterlosing in consecutive seasons), then they should get on with the rebuilding and not wait a full year to get an extra nickel or dime.

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The Brilliant Steven A Smith blog of the day; “I wish that Danny Ferry was the GM of this Blog, so consequently, he could trade away some of these SCRUB BLOGGERS..ie…Davenpoop, Slimjim, and Grandmaster Idiot”..

More like constipated…..

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“Put 4 years $60M on the table and see what Josh wants to do. No signature….then see how bad Houston wants to make a trade.”

I like your thinking Just Joe. Especially if Dwight goes to Brooklyn, Josh knows he will never be on the same team as Dwight. No further consideration for keeping his options open.

“Ilyasova is a decent “comp” for Josh too. He got 5 & $45M.”

You’re kidding right?

“If he doesn’t stick around, guess what we have? No Dwight, no Al, no Josh.”

One of the NBA writers tweated last night (I forget which) that a Hawks front office source INSISTS that they have NEVER offered Teague and Al for trade for ANYBODY, Dwight Howard included. Ferry is just waiting for this trade with the Nets to either go through or fall apart. Lakers may not be an option. Orlando may end up doing business with the Hawks because Al Horford is not a head case. When the Nets and Lakers are out of the running, the Magic will have to do business with Ferry and there will be no discussion of the Hawks taking on bad contracts. Ferry didn’t do all this work to clear cap space to turn around and fill it with Hedo.

Also, I hope everybody is paying attention to Houston’s roster because a bunch of those players could end up on the Hawks. When the Dwight deal finally goes down, Houston will have all these assets and nothing to show for it. They’ll be looking to deal, and Josh Smith is the best player they could hope to obtain. Josh is also better than the other 17 power forwards on their roster, so some of those would be coming here.

Houston also has 7 players with non guaranteed contracts. Houston also has NO point guard, having traded away Lowery and lost out on Dragic. Devin Harris was obtained to get out of Marvin’s last two years and obtain an expiring deal to flip. I don’t believe he was brought here to compete with Teague for a job. Houston seems the most logical landing place for Harris.

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Petro is probably the worst player in this league, next to Scalabrine.

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will the EVOLUTION be televised?

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Buddy Grizzard

July 9th, 2012
6:00 pm

No David Lighty

What’s the fascination with this guy “Lighty” This guy is a bonafide SCRUB. He is a career D-League
Bum. I am not attempting to be harsh, just “brutally honest”

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Celtics/Thunder summer game is on NBATV right now…

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We arent getting Dwight or CP3

LOL @ anyone who thinks that. And I would never pay the max for CP3’s fat injury-prone azz

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Najeh,

I don’t think Orlando wants to trade Howard to the Hawks because we play in the same division.

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O’b, you’re correct on a few points. I’m just mainly trying to get the Hawks to have a top three in THIS upcoming draft.

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steven a smith ,

I understand. I think some folks find it more entertaining to just be “haters.” That, and it really does require less thought. Instead of making solid cases for their opinions, they make quips, bad jokes, and the like. So I can understand your annoyance…

It’s all good.

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@Steven Do you know how good defensively David Lighty is? The guy is a lock down defender, and he won’t let you score very easily. And the fact that he is a good face up shooter? Not a scrub, not at all.

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SMH

July 9th, 2012
9:51 pm

@Steven Do you know how good defensively David Lighty is? The guy is a lock down defender, and he won’t let you score very easily. And the fact that he is a good face up shooter? Not a scrub, not at all.

Ok, dude sounds a lot like say, “Bruce Bowen” NBA 1st team defense several times? Do you kind of get my point???

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Tyronn Lue is coahing against Mark Bryant in the Summer League. That says all that you need to know about the Sumer League… those guys don’t even get to sit at the “adult table” during regular NBA games… Lue is usually sitting next to one of those NBA Wives on the 2nd row who isn’t actually married to anyone and has more real hair on her face than she has on her head. It would be akin to us having Nick Van Exel coach the Summer League Hawks.

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Josh’s comps are all All-Stars.

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Buddy, you’re kidding, right? Summer League? Does this mean that if Jenkins scores a whopping 17 in his first SL game, that you will change your mind?

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Understand this BUDDY GIZZARD, summer league means exactly that, “summer league!!!

Buddy Grizzard

July 9th, 2012
9:53 pm

Here’s the guy we passed on to draft another Jannero Pargo:

http://blog.newsok.com/thunderrumblings/2012/07/09/perry-jones-impresses-in-summer-league-debut/

Summer league= sub-standard talent

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IM SOOOO EXCITED ABOUT NEXT YEAR!! re sign Josh hold on to $$$$ for flexibilitg goin forward. We WILL make the playoffs with current roster. Future is bright

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Astro Joe, no, because I expect Jenkins to score 17 a game in Summer League. I don’t expect him to be able to get his shot off in a regulation NBA game. Perry Jones will be a complimentary player on championship teams in OKC. Jenkins’ ceiling is Anthony Morrow.

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FWIW, Josh played in 94% of the Hawks regular season games (not 96%).

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On the other hand, Bynum has only played in 54% of the Lakers regular season games in his 7 seasons. If I was him, I would be asking for an extension (or a trade + extension), because who knows if he will last 50 games this season.

And would you give someone as injury prone as him $18 mil per year? Tough call.

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Astro pickin’ fights again….LOL….

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Buddy,

Some picks you can’t evaluate within 2 weeks. Remember how Chauncey Billups was somewhat a scrub for his first, what 5-6 years? Ultimately, he proved worthy of the 3rd overall pick, but who da thunk it the first few years?

I’m not saying Jenkins will (or will not) be a worthy pick. But I’ll enjoy finding out, which I would irrespective of who the pick was. I just think it’s awfully early to give up on a pick, when we haven’t seen him in NBA competition.

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Buddy, I’m endorsing Jenkins over PJ3, absolutely. The only way I would change my mind if if Ferry decides to go back to the 13 win Hawks squad… in that case, having an assortment of athletic guys with high school level basketball skills would be the better way to go. In that case, we should trade Josh Smith for Hassan Whiteside and Al Horford for Javale McGee.

But mostly, I think your campaign to denigrate Jenkins because the Hawks GM didn’t choose Ezeli is pretty silly. Jenkins didn’t choose himself, so I don’t get why the anger needs to be directed at the player. It feels a little childish to me.

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Astro,

If PJ3 had suck in his summer league debut, we know you would use that info as an indictment against him…

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Big Ray, dude is attacking Jenkins mostly because Ferry (or Sund or Pendergraft or someone) didn’t draft his guy. It would be one thing to trash Jenkins because he played in a sub-standard conference, had no discernable NBA skill or had played a few exhibition games and looked like Pape Sy meets Adam Morrison. But none of that is true. Jenkins led the SEC in scoring 2 years. He may not become the next Ben Gordon… but it makes no sense to project PJ3 as a contributor on a champoionship team and then project Pargo on Jenkins. About as much objectivity as you get from O’Reilly or Olbermann. Don’t you need data before making an evaluation?

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Draft picks are all a roll of the dice and it doesn’,t matter which sport it is. You, me or the experts can’t predict who’ll be a bust or a boom. Thats the beauty of the draft. Tom Brady 6th round and Marvin Williams 1st round. And the beat goes on.

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Melvin, you know that is a BOLD FACE LIE. I’m one of the guys who historically challenges SAMPLE SIZE on this blog. I think people who use a sample of one to evaluate anything are dumb as dirt. People who focus on small sample sizes are trying to exploit data to make a point. Who is the one who often talks about Josh in the context of 500+ NBA games? Recognize that? It comes from someone who believes in a worthwhile sample size.

Melvin, when was the last time I mentioned Flip=-Flops game performances? Never…

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Based on a sample of one, Tony Delk is among the better scorers in NBA history. Gimme a break!

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Once again i have to address the “lack of basketball intelligence” on this Blog..
CP3 is worth the MAX and then some!!!
***

yeah he was jusr spectacular in that Spurs series

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Knicks have at least two rim defenders..

The Hawks have one part time[Josh] when he slides down in the post to help [Al the escort].

Leaning towards letting Josh play out this season..

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“Najeh Davenpoop
July 9th, 2012
7:15 pm

FTPB

“What was the lockout for? Seem like the league is becoming more unbalance than before…”

Haha. Did anyone actually believe that Stern gives two sh-ts about competitive balance? The lockout was all about billionaire owners deciding that millionaire players were making too much money. It was a money grab, period.”

And a little bonus of more “profit sharing” in the guise of this thing called a “tax”. Doesnt tax sound more ominous than pröfit sharing which is what it really is where the rich only get richer, add more payroll if they want, then sare their kitty or the risk they take to keep their capacity as they stay competitive further into the playoffs.

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PJ3 was not my guy. I wanted Evan Fournier but he was gone by the time we picked. I wasn’t big on Sullinger but certainly would have taken him if he had dropped two more picks. Never imagined PJ3 would be available so never really thought about him.

A bunch of teams were obviously scared off by what were planted media stories about Sullinger’s and PJ3’s health. Qui Bono? Who benefits? Obviously, the teams that took those players. The Hawks were suckered by the press once before… when they believed the hype about a non-starter from North Carolina. Once again, I think it’s going to cost this franchise. If that makes me childish, so be it. I definitely would have taken Ezeli or Taylor over Jenkins. So I’ll check back with you in a few years to compare notes, Astro. Maybe I will have grown up by then.

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Festus Ezelli and Jeffrey Taylor will both prove to be bonafide scrubs, PERIOD!!! Evan “the frenchman” will also be a career D-Leaguer!!!!

Buddy=Low BB IQ

Buddy must be from North georgia.

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Buddy, we all had our preferred picks (I wanted Jeff Taylor initially and Moultrie once he dropped). But I won’t belittle Jenkins as a volume shooting, Pargo type just to make a point. But maybe I just prefer to be more logical and less emotional about the whole draft thing. If you want to claim that Jenkins has cooties while sipping on red Kool-Aid, well, have at it.

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Feel free to throw cheap shots while I sleep.

Time to count John Jenkins 3s and Josh Smith fastbreak turnovers while I fall sleep.

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Slimjr, this one’s for you. 6-0 point guard Bo McCaleb dunks on All-NBA!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxx4K6sY-as

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“If you want to claim that Jenkins has cooties while sipping on red Kool-Aid, well, have at it.”

Nice straw man. Actually, we seem to have a difference of opinion about what constitutes NBA skill. You say PJ3’s skills are high school level. I say Jenkins has no NBA skill other than shooting, which he won’t be able to do against NBA defense because he’s unathletic. Can’t wait to watch them both all season and compare notes with you.

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Players have way more incentive to stay with current team. 4 years 58 million is nothing. It actually guarantees less movement until some team is made example of and paying heavy taxes. We offer Josh 5 years 78 million and keep it moving.

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Aj many felt chandler transformed the mavs and was the final singular cog that put them over the top to win the championship. Words of players not my own but i watched closely when he sent chandler packing to disrupt team chemistry with interest. Theybreally sucked and any fool who thought an historically unstable odum would save the day was a big fool.

I also observe sample sizes and rarely make hot headed comments without some substance preferring to let it play out a bit. The loss of chandler was a profound loss to cuban and a huge benefit to woody who always lacked a defensive big here. He will help amare and melo in a huge way.

Chandler is a quiet difference maker that doesnt need publicity to be happy. That in itselfp is a huge commodity to be treasured in this time and day. One you should be praising as well given your own tendancies.

Not sure your of what you disagree with other than to disagree and be in a fighting mood tonight.. Heh heh

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Buddy sorry, i think perry jones being rude to melo will be a routine thing at any level for melo. Solo impressed me more than that guy. To say pj took advantage of him as a qulifying statement that pj belongs in the nba is hilarious. Melo if ever wont be significant for three to four years down the road. If he were an eight footer with his game he might be good but there are high schoolers right now who could give him fits.

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“Lue is usually sitting next to one of those NBA Wives on the 2nd row who isn’t actually married to anyone and has more real hair on her face than she has on her head.”

LMAO

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Blow it up, start from scratch….IN FERRY I TRUST

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He’ll also be feeding those two Allstars too [Melo and Amare']? Dam

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Najeh Davenpoop – Hawks are still a good team.

1. Joe dribbling the ball 18 seconds of 24 second shot clock.

2. Marvin rank at bottom for SF, Josh will be 10 times better than Marvin at SF.

Hawks will be even better with out no show Joe and duck walk Marvin.
More ball movement now.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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I guess some who decried the likes of jj and marvin who now see what it looks like without them are going to have sellers remorse. Silly.

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The Knicks are becoming the Denver Nuggets of the East! They have to win now!

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[...] Atlanta Hawks ← NBA 11-12: Oklahoma City Thunder @ Atlanta Hawks – 03.03.2012 – Atlanta Video Cancel Reply [...]

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Oddly enough the guy you trash most often fits the mold of the team player chandler is. You know the day in and day out team guy who really doesnt create drama? Yeah, slim none other than al horford. Sad you cant see it as you are missing a guy with many tools but not one over powering that makes others around him better. For every mis speak of horford, there have been fifteen to twenty for jj and josh, still there is that contingent that cant see some of thevspecial qualities that got him elected to the status of an all star. He was also the third highest paid player for the hawks which to me speaks to what a players expectations should be not a popularity contest.

Really josh and jj should have been hands down the better performers based on pay scale and al was right there among them as the leading rebounder though paid less than josh and jj not even in the discussion in his category, Still folks trash he guy. Sad really for them, such value ignored and derided.

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Look you can say all you want about Horford being a scrub and such but the guy is playing out of position for the Hawks and him coming back in the Boston series is why it went as far as it did.

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Najeh, don’t forget also the Spurs got their first ring with TWO number 1 overall picks on their roster.

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“Why do people keep forgetting that the Spurs are built around a #1 overall pick who became the greatest PF of all time as well as two other likely Hall of Famers? That team is not a bunch of Joe Johnsons and Josh Smiths, you know.”-Najeh

Thank God, someone had to say it.

The Spurs have had DRobinson and Duncan… Now they have done a great job creating a culture and maintaining that culture but great players are hard to get…. Without a Little luck.

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“If Orlando is 100% convinced that Dwight won’t stay, they are right to blow up their roster. The problem with the Nets deal on the table is that it is nowhere near the best value they can get for Dwight.”

If Orlando believes lotto picks is their claim to fame instead of quality players, it’s their prerogative. Since they are in the same the division as the Hawks, I truly hope they screw it up. I’m much more interested in the Hawks.

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Rev, in the old days of the blog we had a blogger by the name of manny t, sorely missed i might add. He coined summer as the time of “canniblogging” as we go after each other. Heh heh a perfect description.

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doc,

“those were the days”

I am fairly new around here (a semi-veteran only), but still caught MannyT’s sniper remarks!

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yes, they were vava. manny t was among the best here ever, so clever.

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@ Buddy Grizzard x 2
Point 1 – Been on the HOU tip since the JJ trade; they have an Amazon.com warehouse full of Forwards/F-Cs. Can’t pay ‘em all or fit them under the roster. From reading an NBA.com article, HOU GM Daryl Morey is the NBA equivalent of Billy Beane (OAK Athletics infamous GM who relied on metrics to build teams). So be it, but one thing he can’t do is fit 10 frontcourt players on a 15-man roster and no PG/SG to speak of.

Point 2 – Doesn’t matter if Jenkins is better or worse than PJ3 now …… we drafted who we drafted. *shrug* Unless we do a trade or some 5-7 year down the line/full circle thing where PJ3 comes to us as a FA, it is what it is. Any spilled milk can be handled by “super-duper-quicker-picker upper”.

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Josh Smith and Petro to Houston for Kevin Martin, Royce White, Jerome Jordan, take the protection off the pick we have of theirs, and Toronto’s pick.

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I have no idea if we can get all of that for Josh, but no long term contracts, two future probable lottery picks (Houston and Toronto) plus the 14th pick in this year’s draft (White), and a young shot-blocking project (Jordan) would be a very good return.

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NEJAH DAVENPOOP-You’ve really been pushing this get Dwight at all cost of blow the team up agenda. If fans won’t pay to see a team that’s capable of making the playoffs, featuring a 2 time Allstar and All NBA OC/PF(Horford), an All Star caliber PF(JSmith), a young, quick, fast, athletic, up and coming PG(Teague), and one of the NBAs most productive backup centers(ZPachulia) and PFs(IJohnson), what makes you think fans will spend money to see a bunch of draft picks lose?

The Nets are in he process of blowing up their roster to get what they want, and it still won’t make them into a championship caliber team. All they will have is a starting 4 of DHoward, GWallace, JJohnson, and DWilliams. They’ve already traded 5 of their bench players to us for JJ, and they’ll have to trade MBrooks, KHumphries, SWilliams, and at least 1 other player, to get Howard.

They’ll be filling out the bulk of their roster with minimum contract vets just like we had to do. No team that I know of has ever won an NBA title with a starting 5, no matter how good they are, and no bench to speak of. The NBA season is a marathon, not a sprint, and their extremely talented starting 4 won’t be able to carry them for an entire regular season.

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doc, thats a better analogy comparing these Knicks to the Dallas Finals team…

Maybe a stretch to compare All’s game to Chandlers game? One is Offensive minded[Allstar Al], the other one is Defensive minded and focused on grabbing boards. Chandler is more gifted at closing in on an aggressive player attacking the paint and either blocking the shot or changing it[intimidation]..

But yes they are both true professionals. Agree.

Ask yourself this question, swap Chandler for All on that Championship Dallas team. Does Dallas still get it done? Hmmmm

Labron did not want any part of the paint with Chandler roaming it in the Finals two years ago..

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slimj, i wasnt implying that al was the same type of physical player as chandler knowing their skill set is different. chandler is more a defensive specialist who scores well when the ball is delivered where he neds it. al has a more balanced game though not one area of greatness, still a very worthy player. my particular take is they are both team oriented players without drama and come to play every day and takes responsibility for what he does on the court at all times. that is as far as the comparison is going and teams need those types of players and leaders.

it is absurd to even go there on asking if al could have made the difference as chandler did in dallas that year as i doubt it and not part of my argument nor does it defile al to say so. i also maybe think no one including bynum or any center short of d12 if he took the correct role could have done as well as chandler for the mavs as chandler did that year. that was a major point i was making.

cuban made a huge mistake and may have sent the heart of his team packing for the shot at getting someone else. i mean, jessica alba looks nice but i aint got no chance of getting my hands on her, therefore, i better appreciate what i have and not make a premature trade at getting a long shot for what i have is already a winner.

buddy g, you may change your tune if we go on a few six game losing streaks this year. heh heh there may be the same contingent yelling for change all of a sudden crying out in pain and bit dogs at what change has to include. perseverance will be tested this year.

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Wow man people really upset all of a sudden we got rid of Joe and Marvin are y’all serious?

Sometimes you got to take a step back when you’re moving foward or you could be like Portland and us remain mediocre your entire lives.

I’m not hitting the panic button I wanted Joe and Marvin gone and Danny Ferry came in and did that within a 48 hour period.

Like I said he’s waiting for the right time he’s done way too many deals already.

As it stands we’re a lock at the PG spot with Teague/Harris/Pargo
We’re shaky at SG and SF that’s about it.

As it stands Teague, ???, Josh Smith, Al Horford, Zaza is a nice lineup depending on who we get at SG.

At back ups is where we will have problems I know, but the season hasn’t started yet so I’m going to wait and see what Ferry got in store for us.

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Comparing Dallas to NY all because of one player (Chandler)? Nah, man.

As Doc said, Dallas is coached by a superior, top tier guy in Rick Carlisle. We already know what Woody is capable of (not the same level…by a long stretch). Also consider that Chandler was a defensive anchor for a team that already knew something about defense.

In New York, Chandler is just about the only guy PLAYING defense. Everybody else (Stoudamire included) has his thump up his a$$ on defense, the great Carmelo Anthony being one of the worst offenders. Let’s see just how good of a defensive coach Woody is now . And we already know he’s less of an offensive mind than D’Antoni is…..again, by a long stretch. Speaking of which, ISO-Carmelo is way better than ISO-Joe, but ISO doesn’t win games like that these days, otherwise the Knicks would have made a lot more noise in the playoffs. Instead, they were shown to be the explosive/implosive a$$ clowns that they are. I feel that the exodus of D’Antoni from NY is just another pic in the slideshow of ineptitude that is Knicks front office/ownership mismanagement. But I digress….

I say Chandler will be a rock in a maelstrom….unfortunately for him, the team won’t survive the storm unless they chip in on defense.

A shot-blocking pivot is great to have when he’s not the only guy doing his job on defense. Imagine how well he’d fit in ATL. The Hawks would do well with a guy like this, regardless of whether it was Horford or Smith manning the 4 spot, because both are good team defenders, and despite his detractors, Al is actually a good man defender. What he isn’t, is a shot-blocker by trade, though he does block some shots. One reason Horford doesn’t get blocks on guys going to the basket is he doesn’t often leave his man. One reason why Josh usually gets blocks on guys going to the basket is because he usually DOES leave his man. It’s called weak-side defense, and there is none in the league better at it than Smith.

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Big Ray, remember that game against the Celtics way back in May? Horford went for something like 19/10 with 3 blocks? Or maybe I am misremembering.

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Anyone watch that Sumer League game with Detroit and Utah? Austin Daye needs to hang out with me for a week. Dude is woefully skinny. he makes Kevin Durant look like Mel Burpin’ Turpin. He scored one basket because the defender couldn’t find him, they just saw the ball bouncing by itself.

Seriously, Pistons did themselves a favor by dumping Ben Gordon. Brandon Knight looks ready for prime time. I saw that Ben Wallace will return for his 27th year… if he can get Drummond to work hard, they could have a very nice core with Knight, Monroe and Drummond.

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doc, just asking not arguing..LOL! Chandler is neither a 2 time Allstar nor All NBA. But has huge impacts on games and series as we saw in Dallas.. I hope we get to see it again…

And BTW Mr. vava74 I am a NBA fan first. I just happened to be introduced to the Pro game by watching the Knicks growing up Sir.. Thank you..

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And yes Al should leave his man and go block the dam shot..He is playing an anchor position down on the block.He is the proverbial last line of defense? No?

Whatever……..

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Mark Cuban gave Brendan Haywood 6 years, $55 mil back in 2010. Ouch. And then he lets Chandler go? Terrible move on his part (imo). I understand letting JJ Barrea, (and even Terry) and Stevenson go, but I would have amnestied Haywood, and kept Chandler.

If Dwight became a free agent, Mavs could have worked on a SNT with Orlando, giving them Chandler. And keep in mind Miami has a weakness at center, so a guy like Chandler would go a long way, plus with Dirk playing outside the paint, Chandler is a good compliment.

But Cuban put all his eggs in Deron/Dwight basket. And so far, it hasn’t worked out. On a similar note, I don’t think Ferry is putting all his eggs in the Dwight basket.

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“All has a tough time judging closing speed and angles…Just brutal to watch..”

“Cant teach that stuff. Either ya got it or you don’t…He does not..”

And then….

And yes Al should leave his man and go block the dam shot..He is playing an anchor position down on the block.He is the proverbial last line of defense? No?

Ok. I’ll admit to confusion. So Al should go do something he’s absolutely horrible at, according to you. I can see it now. He leaves his man to incorrectly judge closing speed while taking a horrible angle….and either misses making the block or manages to foul his opponent….and either the opponent makes two free throws, or the guy Al was guarding gets the ball and scores.

Perfect “no win” situation. That damn Al. He just can’t do anything right.

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Don’t get mad, Slimster. It’s just a discussion.

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I have a plan gentleman:

Let’s trade Josh for Noah, sign Corey Brewer and fetch Taurean Green from Armenia or whatever place he is playing at (even at international level as a naturalized citizen)…

Hire Billy Donovan and… And who was the 5th wheel on that second championship?

Let’s reunite the Gators under a Hawks uniform.

At least it would attract a lot of attention and maybe Horford would find his lost dog…

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“Perfect “no win” situation. That damn Al. He just can’t do anything right.”

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Oh you got jokes too. Bad ones? Hahaha..Join the club….

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This is how our interior defense works, when guys are doing their part:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7XoQw1OxHI

Notice Al has a body on the bigger/stronger Dwight, not giving him a clear path to the basket, and keeping him rougly 4-5 feet from the rim. Does that stop Dwight? No. What it does, is make him turn and face the basket to try and get his shot off, and because he was meeting resistance while going to the hole, he leaves space for Josh to come over and attack the shot from the weak side (Dwight never saw him coming), which he does better than anybody in the NBA.

Al is the body/man defender. Josh is the shot-blocker. End of story.

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No fuss hear..The guy is overrated that is all.

AJ your Nets went to two consecutive Championships with Scott at the helm..Man that guy is so underrated..Then he was fired a year later and they have sucked wind ever since..Until now? Maybe?

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“And yes Al should leave his man and go block the dam shot..He is playing an anchor position down on the block.He is the proverbial last line of defense? No?”

“Whatever……..” – slimjr

Wait, didn’t you JUST say that he lacks those skills?

“Cant teach that stuff. Either ya got it or you don’t…He does not..” – slimjr

It comes down to this slim: Al gives good effort on the court. His skill set is what it is. But if you are of the opinion that he doesn’t have what it takes to block shots, then why do you keep expecting him to do it?

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Yay! Big Lineup Recognition from Big Ray!

Josh Smith was at small forward, left his man from 10 feet away, to help block the shot from the wing position! That is hall of fame stuff.

And yes Al is that tall. Because that was Josh Powell absorbing contact and risking fouls on Dwight Howard.
Horford is the one getting pushed under the basket by the 6′10, 230 Ryan Anderson.

Don’t you love it?
———–
This is how our interior defense works, when guys are in [the right position] and can single cover rather than scrambling to cover up being undersized:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7XoQw1OxHI

Notice Al has a body on the similar Ryan Anderson. Powell is not giving Dwight, a clear path to the basket, and keeping him rougly 4-5 feet from the rim. Does that stop Dwight? No. What it does, is make him turn and face the basket to try and get his shot off, and because he was meeting resistance while going to the hole, he leaves space for Josh to come over and attack the shot from the weak side (Dwight never saw him coming), which he does better than anybody in the NBA.

Al IS A great player but he needs help and is undersized. Josh is a shot-blocker, no matter if its SF or PF 400-lb gorilla status). End of story.

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Just Joe on the big lineup bandwagon!
—-
The Orlando Magic scored 532 points in 6 Playoff games against the 2011 Hawks.
That’s 88 ppg.

Teague / Harris / Taylor
Morrow / Stevenson / Jenkins
Smith / Pietrus / Sy
Horford / Johnson / Scott
Pachulia / Butch / Williams

Slimjr let’s tone it down a bit. As long as we play big, we will dominate defense and pump in points with Morrow and Jenkins.

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Nornally I am against selfishness and greed, but I’m pulling for Kris Humphries to hold out for a max, multi-year deal. I hope he prices himself out of what Cleveland or Charlotte is willing to give him. Still no deal so hope continues to shine.

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To Mr Cunningham.
I’m mad the only endorsement for a roster change I can recall from you was shooting more 3s. Really? You don’t just shoot them, you post someone up, or if the Hawks, Joe dribble till someones open. And no championship team doubles Josh Smith on a big man, they let him shoot over tall defenders because he misses against the height of a Troy Murphy, Lavoy Allen, Udonis, and strength of a Brandon Bass, why double a post player who cant post up?

Time to endorse starting Zaza, and doubling down on quality centers on the roster, Petro aint gonna cut it. Damn it I wanted Ezeli, Oden better be healthy next year or you’re looking at Dalembert and Blair (both of them together with Zaza would actually be a monster bang for your buck haul, for $6 mil a year, and enhance Josh and Al’s traits)

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Are we building this team for next year’s playoffs or are we building for long term? Last time we had a smidgeon of success, we re-upped Bibby, Marvin, and Zaza in the same offseason. Where did that take us?

The only starter on this team who had to go get his own contract was Josh. Are you telling me that we are going to reward him by offering 5/45 or 5/60? Some of the thoughts here……

IMO, 2 things need to happen: Since there is no decision on lameduck coach LD (who apparently will get his last year in), you have to look at the roster as presently constructed. You have one year with these guys in the playoffs…..you also end up with contract issues with Josh, Zaza (again), and Teague. The trouble we ran into before was overpaying. For our current guys, we shouldn’t have to overpay.

If Josh isn’t an all-star this year, no way he gets more than Al, coaches vote or not. Last year was Josh’s all-star attempt…it didn’t happen, and he has missed the window now.

Sounds like we’re trying to compete for one more year, which as currently constructed isn’t beating teams over .500.
So as presently constructed, we have Josh at the SF. Why are we discussing the need for a SF? A backup, yes, but not a starter.
Of the 3 in the big lineup, you know Zaza is going to go up against D12, Lopez, Bynum. What we need is another C should Zaza not be durable enough.

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So now there’s rumors Hawks are back in the mix for Howard. Sources seem sketchy though (don’t want to be identified).

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Just Joe, Orlando would be nuts to pass up on 2time Allstar and All NBA Al Horford. Trade an Allstar big for an Allstar big? Duh…

Danny aint fooling nobody.You know he put Horford on the table along with others with expiring contracts, and draft picks. Plus the Hawks can afford to take back a toxic contract or two with the Cleared Cap space…

Hey, wash the Limo and gas it up….Zoom, Zoom…

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Keeping what we know about the Hawks:

We don’t have a #1 elite player. That #1 is not going to come here unless he has the pieces in place to compete. That is the harder way to build a championship contender, but that is what Miami did.

Brooklyn currently has a 2 and a 3 correct? They have to have that #1 to contend. If not, they may be in the playoff mix.

Is Melo a #1? Who is Boston’s #1? Garnett, Pierce or Rondo?

LAL has arguably 3 #1s…can they beat OKC, who arguably have 3 #1s. I know if Harden were here, he would be considered our #1 and that would be a reach.

You have to have at least 1 to even get consideration. We need a go-to guy. Joe wasn’t that guy, so we have to go get one, and it will have to be the draft IMO.

So, whether Josh stays or goes, or Al gets moved, you have to get into the lottery to go try and get a #1. What would Charlotte offer for Al or Josh? They are a prime candidate since they have next year’s #1 available.

Gotta go top 5 lottery to go get our #1 moving forward. Pick your teams in contention for those 5 slots next year.

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BLOG QUESTION:

If you were the GM of one of two brand new franchises conducting an expansion draft and All-NBA Al and Brook Lopez were the best two players available for the first pick, who would be your pick?

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Slimjr,

Don’t place me on the Al Horford is great band wagon.

I coined the “Diaper Al” moniker over which I have an international TM registration (I will let you use it for 1 cent per post , which, given your fixation, should render me a million buck by the end of the summer B-) )

That does not mean that I don’t consider Al a good player, even a very good one, unfortunately, without his dog, he is perfectly expendable to me.

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So like it matters?

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Slimjr
July 10th, 2012
12:18 pm
If I had the chance to draft Andrew Nicholson or Al.. Guess I would pull a Billy Knight and go against the mainstream [Al fans]……I’m just saying..

We will be here to check how this will pan out for you…

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Oh thats right vava74, you use to piss off Grandad with that term to no end!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! hahahaha

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hey vava74 I’m still waiting on Derrick Williams to pan out..Got my fingers crossed he does not make me look like Billy..This GM gig is a tough one…lol

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“Horford is a solid player but during playoffs became M I A we all no that,”

Thanks for proving one of my points darrell Starks…

By the way “John Starks” with the Knicks had a big dog in him? Yes? But he single handily shot the Knicks out of game 7 1995 Championship against Houston..Oh that hurt!

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O’b i was stunned that Cuban let Chandler go and not keep any rights to him. He was the glue guy. Was amazed he didnt pull the plug on hey-man and absorb his contract. Cuban was dreaming big possibly stil on a championship high.

AJ basically Cuban gambled and lost. Still I go back to the original premise. In one decade he has had his hands on two players on either side of the ball that plied their trade almost better than anyone else in the game at what i consider the two most important jobs for either the offense in a point guard and defense in a true center and gave them away. Not many owners get to do that and possibly get away with it. Money matters, eh? And that is all i thought i was saying.

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Slimjr – John Starks my cousin.

GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Well Slim, each clanking sound from Starks’ 15 or so consecutive misses were celestial chords to me

Now, a few years apart, I feel a bit bad for him. Such an improbable story would have been for a guy like him winning the championship and having a major role in it…

Well, the harsh reality is that his dog was probably a tad too big.

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Is that right darrell??????

It truly is a small world? Huh?Your cousin is one of my all time favorites!!!

That poster baseline lefthanded Dunk over Jordan and Horace Grant is a top 10 for ever! Hahahah

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O’B, I think that lineup doesn’t bring us closer to an ECF, because that is not a finished project. But guess what you’d still have the SAME amount going into free agency next season to add two more big pieces to Josh and Love while keeping Teague as your point guard. And you can also build your depth chart the way you desire. Add CP3 and Bynum to that roster and see what you get (dreaming I know). Or you have the cap room to take a chance on Greg Oden to see if he’s healthy enough to be a backup C.

The point is Josh and Love would be more interchangeable than Josh and Al. Don’t you see the new bill board when you close your eyes? Josh Love as one name, lol.

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Thus why the Hawks will remain in play for Dwight Howard until Orlando’s doctors sign off on Brook’s bad foot.

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If Hawks are interested in winning Dwight sweepstakes, they really should win.
-John Hollinger

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Big men with feet problems? AND, to give the guy a max deal?

The overpaying continues after Joe Johnson huh?

Looking at our deals, you can’t give Josh a max deal and have Al remain on the roster. It’s an either-or to me.

Josh at PF or Al at PF…somethings gotta give here.

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Al averages about 5X the number of rebounds as Lopez… easy call.

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The only way I would welcome a Dwight Howard trade was if he agreed to an extension and offered Al and Devin Harris + whatever first rounders. Teague isn’t going anywhere. Its still a better deal then whatever the Nets were going to offer.

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What happened to Daniel Orton, big dude from Kentucky who rarely played in college? I didn’t see him playing for Orlando’s summer league team and he clearly needs all the development possible. Did they already cut him loose? I think the Sund-led draft team previously had interest in that guy.

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If its true that we are back in the runnings for Dwight then I say, GO FOR IT!! (Teague and Horford for Howard (no extension)) I have 8 top reasons why we should take that gamble.

1) We would have the bird rights to sign him long term with max $$
2) Without a trade, Brooklin Nets WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO AFFORD DWIGHT even if he takes HUGE pay cut. (Its not worth it Dwight esp this being your last big contract and all)
3) Will be playing along side best friend Josh Smith (plus Smith has one whole season to woo him to stay long term)
4) Will have his parents and grandmother (who he often talks about) to be able to see every home game right from backyard. (Mother is another person who could woo her son to stay long term since she could be able to see her baby during every home game)
5) One reason Dwight wants Brooklyn is to be in mist of music guru JayZ and Beyonce, well we have our own music makers in Jermaine Dupre/Jeezy/TI and many others..HECK, THIS IS ATLANTA!
6) Another reason Dwight wants Brooklyn is movie options being in NewYork and all, BUT again we have TYLER PERRY HERE IN THE ATL. All u need is to make a phone call and Tyler Perry would add ya to his many scripts, DWIGHT!
7) Saying points 5 & 6, Dwight face would be planted on every BILLBOARD thru out downtown ATLANTA and surrounding cities IN HIS HOMETOWN!!

AND LAST BUT NOT LEAST..THE BIGGEST REASON TO GAMBLE ON DWIGHT WOULD BE…

WE WILL HAVE THE CHANCE TO LAND CP3 HERE IN THE ‘A’ SINCE HE WOULD BE A FREE AGENT. HE WOULD THEN BE ANOTHER VOICE IN DWIGHT’S HEAR TO WOO HIM TO STAY CAUSE HE WOULD BE JOINING HIM ON THE HAWKS..

OUR BIG 3 WOULD THEN BE DWIGHT/JOSH/CP3…WOWOWOWOWOWOW!!

What do u guys think about that? If you were Danny Ferry and based on these top 8 points, would u take that gamble???

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“Just Joe, ESPN is just reporting Orlando is now talking to other Teams again? Hmmmmm”

“Good job Sir!”

the rest of the story…”The Atlanta Hawks are one of the teams but “not the best option,” the source said.”

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Why does everyone want to throw all of our eggs into one basket, in hopes of getting Dwight Howard? I believe Ferry should go a cheaper route and see what the Nuggets would take in a sign-and-trade for JaVele McGee. That man is a athletic beast and a true 7-footer! maybe we give them Harris and our first round. Then we still have the finances to bring in Mayo and Randolph. A front court of McGee, Horford, and a patroling Smoove would be just as defensively sound and athletic without Howard. Then maybe Talk Lou Williams into being our sixth man. Donte Greene could be a diamond in the rough as well, not bad having a 6′11 athletic SF.

Roster:
C- McGee/ ZaZa/ Petro
PF- Horfrd/ Randolph
SF- Smith/ Morrow/ Greene
SG- Mayo/ Jenkins
PG- Teague/ Williams

Reserves = Stevenson, Sy, Scott

What yall think?

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@Bossmann

So with that lineup, do you think that fans will come to the arena to look at this team play or would you like to see Josh and Dwight together?

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Like I said a few days ago, why would Kris Humphries give up the opportunity for more than one year of job security and why would Lopez negotiate down from the max deal and lose out on $20 million just to placate Howard and the Nets. There are too many if/ands/but’s in the Nets deal for them to pull this off. The funny thing is that if the Howard just let his contract expire he’d be with the Nets and if the Net’s had not agreed to trade for Joe they’d get Howard. Ironic and very funny. I understand the Net’s perspective though, had they not signed Joe they might have lost Deron.

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@WojYahooNBA

Cleveland is out as a third-team trade partner in a possible Orlando-Brooklyn deal for Dwight Howard, sources tell Y! Sports.

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MsDee, so Dwight is supposed to choose between Jay-Z and Beyonce or Tyler Perry and Madea? Hello Brooklyn Bridge!

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Someone make this clear for me. Can the Nets sign D12 even though it would take them waaaay over the salary cap? Is that not possible or does it just mean luxury tax would have to be paid? I know basically nothing about the CBA…

If Dwight can’t re-sign with the Nets, then ATL would be a prime destination for him in 2013. We could offer a max contract and put him with Horford (as PF) and Smith (as SF). That would be a dominating frontcourt. Horford will be making $12 million, Smith would probably want $12-15 million, and Howard would be getting $20 million.Total, that would be $47 million (assuming Josh goes for $15 million a year). There would be enough money to give Teague a raise ($3 million a year) and the rest could be spent on a decent bench. My hope is that Jenkins could move into the starting role at SG, so no money would have to be spent there. Welp, that is basically my plan. I have no idea if it is even possible, but it sounds right to me. If Prokhorov (that Russian guy who owns the Nets) is willing to go way over the salary cap and pay the luxury tax to sign Howard, then this whole plan tanks. This is probably the best case scenario since I don’t see the Hawks being able to get the Big 3 of Smith, CP3 and D12 (it would almost definitely put them over the salary cap and I doubt ASG wants to pay tax).

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Buddy Grizz- id take Brook Lopez, hes a legit 7foot C and he is offensively skilled, he shoots 80%ish from the line and when healthy is capable of being a top 5 C.(those r extremely hard to come by)

When are we going to trade Devin Harris? i am sorely misunderstanding any point to keep him as a backup or a possible start at the 2. we NEED Kevin Martin so bad, with Kmart at SG we are a 4-6 seed, and if we meet boston again we NEED to beat them, they are our curse, if we beat BOS that whole team gets dismantled in the next off-season.
Jeff Teague Kevin Martin Josh Smith Al Horford Zaza Pachullia starters. let Al get his wish at the 4 and tell josh to come in at 230-240lb range and play SF and some PF. Lets see if all-nba al is capable of being an all-star at the 4 like he/some of yall want.

Najeh Dav- i liked your post about trapping in dwight with brooklyn being unflexible salary wise next year but dwight is already disgruntled and if we trap him imagine how much of a pain in the a he will be, on the bright side he might force GM DF to fire LD and that could open up my plan of a tandom coach unpresidented in the NBA Mike D’antoni (O cord)and Nate McMillian (d cord).

We are not getting Dwight or CP3 next year, with that said im still completley happy with our moves so far. we need to stockpile 1st rounders, especially CHAR,SAC,PHOX,ORL they will be the worst teams next year(so far). Or go the route of acquiring some all-star type talents to complement josh/al.

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I’ve followed this blog for quite some time and am torn on the whole Dwight ordeal, but I have come to the realization that we need to go for it. I think most everyone can agree on the fact that Horford is better than Lopez…so I think most everyone can agree that we can offer a better package than the Nets. I know that Dwight has stated that he’ll only sign an extension with the Nets, but my gut tells me that we are the only other team (outside of maybe the Lakers, who appear to be out) that can change his mind. The reasons have been stated by other bloggers (hometown, playing with friends, spotlight, etc). If Howard goes to Brooklyn, then it’s just going to be more of the same. Free Agents will only go to Miami, New York, and now Brooklyn. No one will come here without Howard, and even if they do that still leaves the fact that Miami, Brooklyn, and NY will all have at least 2 more all-stars on their teams than us.

It disgusts me how the NBA is now, where superstars run the league and demand trades etc. But it doesn’t seem like this is going to change anytime soon, so if we want to compete for more than homecourt advantage, we need to go all in.

PS: Kinda funny that Danny Ferry could very well play a vital part in building the big 3 for the Nets. D-Will stated he was thinking Dallas until the Joe trade and now he has the ability to keep Howard from going to the Nets, but probably won’t pull the trigger. Hope he’s getting some sort of cut from Jay-Z.

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Kevin, thanks.

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Astro Joe, believe it or not but I could actually see Dwight in a Madea movie. EASILY!! TOO FUNNY!!

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People need to stop crying about the Big 3 concept. This isn’t something new. The only difference today is that free agency and superstar players are dictating where they want to play, as opposed to teams drafting and trading for players to form that “Big 3″.

Dallas did this restructure all wrong. They had assembled a team around a superstar that had top notch role players that played that role at the highest level. No way do you break that up until they prove they couldn’t repeat.

Why Cuban didn’t simply bite the bullet and amnesty Haywood to re-sign Chandler, I don’t know. He has the money. Just admit that your team made a mistake and take the hit. Now, they almost have to force feed Haywood into the lineup, just to justify keeping him.

Dallas lineup

PG: Beubois
G: V. Carter
F: S. Marion
PF: D. Nowitzki
C: B. Haywood

Only other guys under contract are Dominique Jones and Brandan Wright. They even traded their draft pick ( Tyler Zeller ) for a later round pick ( Jared Cunningham ) and some 2nd round picks.

Carlisle will have to get production out of at least 2 of those guys, in order for the Mavs to even be competitive. Knowing Cuban though, he’ll grossly overpay for an OJ Mayo or somebody.

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@MC

Heard Farmar was set to join Hawks summer league team once the trade was official, but I thought the Hawks planned to let Farmar go. I am confused …

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Not offering up significant talent in order to retain Howard, falls back into the same trap that we’ve been in for the past few years. We’d be hanging onto borderline star players, in hopes that they could either develop into stars themselves, or gel by playing together.

It would be very interesting if we had JJ, if the Magic would jump at a JJ + Horford + 1st round pick ( 2014 ) for a Dwight + Turkoglu swap. JJ + Horford would’ve at least kept the Magic relevant, while they re-tooled for the future.

PG – Nelson
G – Richardson
F – Johnson
PF – Nicholson ( rookie 1st round pick )
C – Horford

Nowhere near a championship team, but definitely a playoff team. They’d flirt with the Luxury Tax for one more year, before getting a little relief. This would be the Hawks

PG – Teague
G – Jenkins ( rookie 1st round pick )
F – Turkoglu
PF – Smith
C – Howard

or for you big lineup fans . . .

PG – Teague
G – Jenkins
F – Smith
PF – Howard
C – Zaza

But ol well.

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And for the record, I despise Turkoglu, and would rather see Josh Smith shooting jumpers in that big lineup, than to see Hedo as the starter.

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4get peaheaded Dwight. Move on.

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People crying for a guy that actually had his offensive game slowed down by a cheeseburger.(Collins). Dude aint Shaq or Kareem.

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I don’t know what Dwight’s motive’s are, but he’s determined to go to a bigger market than Atlanta, Houston, or Dallas. If he goes to LA, he knows he won’t be the top dog with Kobe there. If traded to the Hawks, he’s not going to resign no matter what. So you who keep begging for us to trade for Howard no matter what can just give it a rest. Hell, the Hawks have yet to persuade JSmith to sign an extension, so how can anyone expect us to convince Howard.

Even without JJ and Marvin, our roster certainly isn’t devoid of quality talent. A starting lineup of
SF-JSmith,
OC-ZPachulia,
PF-AHorford,
SG-DHarris,
PG-JTeague,
and a bench comprised of
PG-JPargo, (DHarris)
SG-AMorrow, Jenkins
SF-ARandolph, (AMorrow)
PF-IJohnson, Scott, LWilliams
OC-Petro(AHorford)
This would definitely be a playoff caliber team with a frontline that definitely wouldn’t get dominated on the boards on either end on the court. We use the ample cap space we’ll have to add a few talented quality FAs, and we become an even better team.

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And I still say that any deal that Orlando wants, you don’t necessarily turn them down. If the move is to send Teague + Horford OR Smith to the Magic + 1st round pick . . for Howard + Turkoglu . . you almost have to do it. Because either way, it’s going to create a big time buzz in Atlanta and elevate the Hawks tremendously

PG: Harris
G: Jenkins
F: Turkoglu
PF: Smith
C: Howard

or

PG: Harris
G: Jenkins
F: Turkoglu
PF: Horford
C: Howard

This probably goes all against Ferry’s plan, as he probably never envisioned Dwight Howard possibly being available to them. I think he did the JJ salary dump to do just that, dump salary. I don’t think there was any plan to bring in a big time free agent THIS YEAR.

But now that everything seems to be closing off for the Magic, as far as legit trade partners, the Hawks need to simply pull the trigger on this. Orlando may have reservations on Josh Smith re-signing if he’s traded to them, so send Horford to Orlando . . along with Teague . . and one or two 1st round picks.

Offer that to the Magic, and see if they turn it down.

Meanwhile, we’d be in the catbird seat to re-sign BOTH Howard and Smith at the end of the year. Even if both walk, the complete dismantling of this team would be complete, and you could sell off Howard and Smith for multiple draft picks, with teams vying to get them to sign a 5 year contract. Something they can only do by executing a sign and trade with us.

Let’s see if Ferry is too stubborn to deviate from his “plan”, and simply bring in a superstar for one year.

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northcyde,

I would say any deal that the Hawks are willing to offer the Magic will not include Josh if you consider MC report the Ferry is trying to convince Josh on the short and long term plans of the Hawks. I think it’s obvious that Ferry is trying to keep Josh long term.

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Portland should throw a monkey wrench into this Howard saga by offer Lopez an offer. That would make the Nets match their offer and possibly killed Howard chances of going to the Nets….

Maybe someone should tell Cuban to do it. He may jump at the chance spoiled the Nets dreams of a big 3…..

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Michael Cunningham ‏@ajchawks
‪#Hawks‬ sign 1st round draft pick John Jenkins.

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“if we meet boston again we NEED to beat them”

I don’t know if the Heat will be able to beat the Celtics next year.

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Ken S,

If traded to the Hawks, he’s not going to resign no matter what..

Maybe so. BUT…If the Hawks have his bird rights, and he chooses to sign outright with another team, then he can only get a 4 year contract, whereas the Hawks could offer him a 5th year, worth $20+ mil. Would Dwight Howard really leave $20+ mil on the table?

Also:
1) How many teams have the available cap space next off-season to give Dwight a max contract?
2) Of those teams, how many of them would be on Dwight’s wish list?

Therefore, even if he doesn’t want to stay with the Hawks, his best option may be for the Hawks to do a sign and trade deal. And if so, we could sign and trade him to the Nets, and recoup some of the talent (especially multiple first round picks) we gave up to get him.

Plus we would be under the cap, so we don’t have to take back equal salary from the Nets (which Orlando has to do). IMO, its a win win. We would have one year to convince him and Josh to resign. And if they dont, we would get at least 2 first round picks for Dwight, and another first round pick for Josh if he chooses to leave as well.

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O’Brian,

THAT. WAS. JUST. BRILLANT!

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Glenn,

Humphries (27 yrs old):

2010-2011: 10 pts, 11 rebs
2011-2012: 14 pts, 11 rebs

Ryan Anderson (24 years old):
2010-2011: 11 pts, 6 rebs
2011-2012: 16 pts, 7 rebs

If Anderson gets 4 years, $34-$36 mil, then why would Humphries not get at least 3 years, in the $24 – $30 mil range?

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Kris Humphries will get a new contract just not from Cleveland . Kris Humphries will get a contract just not in a S&A scenerio . Meaning no one will give a pick & sign him to a new contract . I’m sure Brooklyn will once they are done pursuing Dwight . I think Clevelands desire was to get Humphries & package him as trade bait . Maybe for Bynum after his comment about being interested in signing with Cleveland next season . His agent was looking for four years but would take three from Brooklyn .

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Bulls didn’t pick up Ronnie Brewers option, he instantly shoots to #1 guy we need to sign as a SG/SF. Came from a system where defense was rewarded and he supplied a good amount of it, also a good slasher and athlete to pair with our numerous shooters.

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Keep in mind Humps numbers came on a lottery team, Ryan Anderson’s on a playoff team.

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John Shurna was a solid player at Northwestern. He averaged 20 PPG and shot 44% from behind the arc. He reminds me of a Steve Nowak

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OBRIEN-Dwight doesn’t care about any Bird rights. He wants to go to a big market team where he can be a big fish in a bigger pond, and get endorsements and bigger recognition to satisfy his big ego. He’d be guaranteed the ability to make up for the extra yrs salary he’d give up under the Bird Rights through endorsements. MJordan made far more money from endorsements than he was ever paid by the Bulls.

The same held true for KBryant, until his little indiscretion cost him a number of his major endorsements. I think Dwight is looking more towards potential endorsement income than any max salary he can get from a team. Endorsements were the reason the Bulls were able to grossly underpay MJordan and sign all of those stars.

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I’ve wanted Ronnie Brewer every since he was a free agent. The Hawks need to move to attempt to sign him. A three year deal would pretty decent for Brewer. He would be less than half the price of Marvin, a better defender, and well coached. Imagine if the Hawks signed Brewer and Pietrus to man the SF position.

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Melvin, other than the possibility that he met with Josh first, we don’t know that Ferry said anything to Josh that he wouldn’t have said to Al, Ivan or Zaza. If we go strictly on what MC reported, it didn’t sound like he was trying to “convince” as much as explain. It could have been as simple as “I hope to make moves this summer (short term) to create flexibility to re-load the roster next summer (long term) into one that can contend. But the plan is not to build a roster from the ground up like the team did around 2004″.

MC’s blog said:

Word is Smith, whose contract expires after next season, expressed his concerns about the team’s direction in a recent meeting with Ferry. The Hawks GM in turn told Smith his short- and long-term visions for making the team a contender.

If Ferry is gearing up for next summer (which has been my opinion since he traded Joe) and is willing to play this season out with LD, Josh & Zaza on their last contractual year… I kind of doubt that he will feel compelled not to trade someone now for an asset he wants long-term. In this case, the difference from being a 42 win team and a 32 win team in ‘12-13 is essentially immaterial.

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Lou Williams to sign with Hawks.

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Source?

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Wow great move Lou is a great scorer off the bench, does this mean Devin is trade bait now?

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So why wouldn’t Orlando keep Howard until next year? Wouldn’t they get more value next year than this year? If they trade him next year, Howard is likely getting 4 years which means the receiving team is getting a long-term deal. Wouldn’t that cost more in compensation than potentially trading him as a rental player to a team this year? A S&T maxes out at 4 years… so D12 would lose that 5th year if Orlando simply decides that the current offers are insufficient. Howard could just leave and come to the Hawks or Mavs (2 teams that we know will have cap space) and leave Orlando with nothing… that would be the risk. All the reasons trading for him now would create an advantage for us, are replicated for the Magic. As are the risks… we’re not on his list and neither are the Magic. They just have to hold their nose and deal with the potential drama for 82 games. But so would any other team not named the Nets.

IMO, Orlando will deal him to Houston. They have the draft picks and the ability to absorb a bad contract. I previously read that the Orlando GM was always hopeful to trade him to the Western Conference. Would he go from that to trade him within the division?

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As much i like D12 no way you trade Horford and Teague for him unless agreed to and sign trade of 5 years.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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They are getting ready to move Teague……

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Lou is a pg….not sg

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I don’t give a doggone if the Magic/Nets trade falls through or not. GM Danny Ferry isn’t dumb enough to trade for DHoward without him 1st committing to a long term contract, period.

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Nice pick up on Lou. Rumors are Portland is interested in Zaza, I wonder what they are offering.

We know now that Roy Hibbert won’t be coming to Portland, and that could leave the Trail Blazers in a rough place as far as the center position goes.

Jason Quick of The Oregonian tweets that Portland GM Neil Olshey was clear on Monday that he doesn’t see anything left on the free agent market worth pursuing.

JaVale McGee (restricted free agent) and Chris Kaman (unrestricted free agent) don’t look to be options, which means that the team will have to pursue trades in order to find a veteran who can compliment rookie 7-footer Meyers Leonard at the five next season.

According to Quick, two possibilities could be Atlanta’s Zaza Pachulia and Houston’s Patrick Patterson. The 6-foot-9, 235-pound Patterson isn’t a true center, however, and we have to think he’d be undersized if asked to play there.

- Joe Kaiser

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Lou is NOT a PG… but I don’t see how they could play Teague & Lou at the same time. Or even Devin & Lou (for that matter).

As long as LD resists playing Lou at PG (and his contract is reasonable), I like this signing.

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Lou Williams pickup might be the move before the Dwight move. Harris or Teague may be on the way out.

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This tell me Teague will be traded along with Horford.

D12 IS close friends with Morrow, Josh, Lou William.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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According to Bucher, other possible trade partners include the Hawks — a team that has cleared tons of cap space

That’s true NEXT summer, this summer, we are a hair under the salary cap… not “a ton”. Lou must have gotten some or all of the MLE.

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Rod, yeah, at half the cost as when Jamal was here.

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@Astro – well we would send the same salary to Orlando so in a sense we cleared the cap space with joe and Marvin leaving thus having pieces to give to Orlando that will fall off their books next year.

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I just read on ESPN,com where Louis Williams has been signed to a multiyear deal by the Hawks.

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Rod, I never had a problem with JC’s play. I had a problem with paying JC the $10 million he was making at the time. I’m thinking Lou’s contract will be around $6-8 million according to what Stephen A. Smith said just yesterday.

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With signing Lou William it all make sense now for Teague and Horford to be traded for D12.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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@Rod

Atleast this Crawford can actually play some defense.

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The Pride of South Gwinnett High School is coming home!

Now to get the Pride of SW Atlanta Christian Academy to join him……

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Great pickup. Ferry continues to get shti done.

Another move is definitely coming. No way the Hawks carry three starting-quality PG’s.

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“@Rod

Atleast this Crawford can actually play some defense.”

Hate to inform you of this, but Lou does not play defense either. He is a scorer. There are many guys like that in the NBA. See Jason Terry, Ray Allen, Jamal Crawford, Lou Williams, James Harden, Manu Ginobli……….

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BIG DOG,

I know you like CP#, but he is not coming to ATL. Dwight is the big Fish. If he comes, we don’t need CP3.

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http://www.vladtv.com/blog/60788/carmelo-chris-paul-party-with-ludacris-in-atlanta

This when the Rumor started, plus he have always love Atlanta and was hoping to live here one day.

My in side sources have told me CP3 will be living here so why not play here it all make sense.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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Wouldn’t trade for Howard, if it means Teague & Horford. Howard is coming off of back sugery, and Orlando seem to be asking for the world.

What will be different for Howard in Atlanata, if Teague and Al are traded, from what it was in Orlando the past 2 years?

As has been stated, WIlliams is a SG with PG size, and is not a big assist player. Teague, Joe, and Josh, all averaged more assist than Williams last season.

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Rod from CP – Your my Boy but are you saying the Hawks shouldn’t sign CP3 in 2013 ?

CP3 and D William and Rose are top PG in the league.

CP3, Josh, D12

Would be the best team in the East and would bring home a championship.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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By knowing what the Magic were willing to take from the Nets for Dwight, it ought to make the negotiations very simple and straightforward – especially if it is a two-team deal. GET IT DONE QUICKLY, DANNY!!!!!

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Hawks just agreed to terms w/ Lou Williams. Hell of a scorer, not much of a defender though.

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Agree Rev! The blue print is set.. Danny will pounce!

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If there is no more trades, Lou will be coming off the bench.

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Magic have reopened trade talks with teams other than the Nets, according to Ric Bucher of ESPN.com. Bucher reports that the Hawks are of the teams the Magic are talking with.

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With Jeff Teague, Devin Harris, and Lou Williams on the roster, you’ve got to think another trade is already in the works.

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Lou is not going started at SG the guy is only 6′1, this move is and indication Teague will be traded along with Horford for D12.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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With Lou on board as a viable and competent option to close games (infinitely better than Howard or Josh) I am now neutral on acquiring D12.

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The Hawks could be tough next year, with or without Dwight. Essentially, last year’s team has traded Joe Johnson and Marvin Williams for Al Horford, Lou Williams, DeShawn Stevenson, Anthony Morrow and Devin Harris. That’s not a bad swap.

Ferry has done a brilliant job of keeping a competitive core intact while still positioning himself for a potentially huge move.

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HAWKS SIGN LOU WILLIAMS TO MULTI-YEAR DEAL!!!

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I wonder what the contract’s worth. I guess we’ll know by tomorrow. Lou’s 25 and averaged almost 15 ppg last season, so I’m expecting he gets 4 yrs/26-30 mil.

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With the Magic resigning their PG, I think they’d prefer the expriing contract of Harris. I hope that’s the case.

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Seeing Jeff Teague’s tweets back and forth with Lou are making me cringe. If Teague gets moved it will come as a shock to him.

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“Rod from Cp ….What you know about that Dungeon Family ……..Classic Days …. Elevators playin in the background”

Grew up and went to scholl with most of them cats. Those were the days.

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Lou was always lighting up the Hawks, glad he is on the squad. DF is behind the scenes puttin in work. Somebody send him to Magic City

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Seeing Jeff Teague’s tweets back and forth with Lou are making me cringe. If Teague gets moved it will come as a shock to him.

Might be Harris.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URR7ISvrkgA&feature=player_detailpage

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AJ has upgraded to neutral. We just need one or two more moves, to get him over to the dark side. ALL-IN for D12.

But we sure do have a lot of guards. Teague, devin Harris, Stevenson, Jenkins, Morrow, and now Lou Williams. Ferry must have other moves in mind.

Ken S,

Atlanta may not be the market LA, Chicago and NY is. But it is a big market none the less. And if the hawks win, the endorsements will come. Lebron was playing in Cleveland, but that didnt stop the endorsements. Kevin Duran plays in OKC, but he will still get his endorsements.

And you are missing my point. Even if we lose Dwight next offseason, we can sign and trade him to the Nets, who will be over the cap. Therefore, we can get 2 first round draft picks from the nets, which would replace the 2 we give to Orlando.

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Something else that makes Atlanta more attractive than Orlando the last 2 years. We have salary cap space, and no bad contracts anymore. Orlando has/had terrible contracts (Turk, J-Rich, Gilbert Arenas). Therefore, even after re-signing josh and Dwight, we would have salary cap space to add another high level FA.

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I would love to see Lou start with Teague. A lot of match up problems. We need to sign Rashard Lewis to balance out that small backcourt.

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Anyone see Rob Hennigan on the sidelines of the SL games? He has his Blackberry in hand and smiling away.
Is it possible the offers are getting sweeter than that disaster of a deal Cleveland involved themselves with?

No way I give a max to Lopez to come to ORL who didn’t want to leave Brooklyn. Al is a better option based on costs alone.

The Lou deal tells you we no longer need JRich, QRich or Richie Rich.
We just need to solidify our frontcourt now.

And Rashard Lewis is taking his talents to the Miami bench!

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boy,
Mark Bradley would be torn between a conniption and an indelible smile if only one member of the “Core” remains after 2 weeks of the Danny Ferry era.

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Louis Williams costs less than half of Joe, gets buckets like Joe, and brings his suprstar friends to Philips unlike Joe. Great move.

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i_am_soulstar
July 10th, 2012
6:25 pm

I saw those tweets and was thinking something very similar. But like Rod from CP mentioned, hopefully, it would be Harris.

————————-

Maybe I missed them, but what did you find so odd about them?

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“Astro Joe

July 10th, 2012
6:32 pm
OB, I think Jenkins will go with Horford and Teague and filler”

Then they’ll have 2 JJ Redicks in Orlando!

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O’B,
isn’t some of ORL’s leverage (borderline poison pill) for those teams who wants D12 so badly is to find a willing partner to push off the existing bad contracts of J. Richardson and Turkalou?
Somebody on here probably has crunched the nos. if we take on Dwight + J-Rich + Hedu.

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anybody have a link to the best forwards still out there?

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