Atlanta Hawks: Wings are the thing

Uno

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The Hawks will not “splurge” on a free agent this year. Your new SF in ATL will be this guy, who will play on the Haws summer league team.

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Gerald Green…Young,cheap and at times a show shopper.

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Got cut off on the last blog…don’t feel like repeating myself, either.

Northcyde ,

You really think so, or are you being a smarta$$, lol….no really, interested in your thoughts…as always.

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Of the guys listed for small forward, get Matt Barnes. He’s 6′7″, plays tough D, decent shooting % and rebounder. Attitude similar to Ivan Johnson, which is good.

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A CP3, Jenkins, Mayo, Josh, Dwight line up would be a bit nasty.

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Get Mayo

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Still don’t know if Josh will be here after next season if CP3 & D12 don’t come to the ATL.

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Antawn Jamison would be intriguing. We do seem to have an affinity for UNC players. If this is truly a ’stop gap’, get someone that plays tough D away from the basket, with defending Lebron in mind.

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“The Hawks could still be a pretty good team next season but clearly no longer are as attractive to free agents as they were last season, when they could sell the possibility of a strong postseason run.”

Who said that, Mr. Rainy Face? Maybe we could gel with a few new pieces and shock the NBA instead of slitting our wrists in July?

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Pietrus. Not sure he would come here though.

Don’t sleep on my boy Pape Sy though. He’s got a two year deal waiting on him in France, but he’s got a free out if the Hawks offer a guaranteed contract.

Watch Kyle Korver too, if the Bulls let him go.

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Josh ain’t coming back then simple as that.

OJ Mayo is a small forward and Josh Smith isn’t? Courtney Lee? Rashard Lewis is a natural?

Is Smith a natural power forward bringing the ball up averaging 4 assists per game and struggling to score over power forwards outside of jumpshots?

Come on now. Smith is a small forward.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fm9jw1wiZUM

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A few plugs for summer league prospect Jordan Taylor. I saw one report that said he’s the all time NCAA leader in assist to turnover ratio. At the combine, he scored equal or better than Marquis Teague in the agility drill and the 3/4 court sprint. Hawks didn’t work him out, but Ferry and the Spurs did. 14 reps on the bench. 36 inch vertical.

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ugghh, i liked anthony randolph when he was coming into the league aka perry jones 3 body and play style. but he is at best a backup PF and we dont need anymore of those. we need a real SF not a 6′6 SG forced to play SF. we should have included gerald green in that trade with Brooklyn as he seems to be understanding his role in this league better now.
of the SF names MC listed, i could see rashard lewis as a good starting SF for us and maybe grab CJ Miles or matt barnes as backups. i think grant hill just passed his expiration date and antwaan jamison is no SF, id like TMAC back but thats not gona happen.

need to trade devin harris for a SG or SF asap

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I really dont want to see Stevenson in a Hawks uni. Grant Hill isnt a bad option but I think he will go play with Nash. I like Randolph so I hope the Hawks sign him. Maybe T-Mac comes back. I dont think he will get many offers.

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Gerald Green should be the guy you go after. Really not that hard to understand.

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Suckerfree Hibbert will injure you, Perkins will beat you up. Marc Gasol is a big center.

Do you want to put your best talent against the physical goons of the NBA, night in night out? Thats stupid.
Same goes for Josh who gets a balky knee 2 playoffs in a row now. It’s taxing to play guys out of position all season long.

Josh Smith plays as a small forward and plays well then the team becoimes more a defensive team and if the team wins this means Josh Smith is an All Star.

Lets say : 16ppg, 48% FG%, 8rpg, 1.7bpg, 1.3 spg. If we sign Elton to pair with Josh and Horford thats a 46 win team. Book it.

LD has no idea what he’s talking about.

MC, Josh Smith has 3.8 Offensive Win Shares in the last 2 seasons combined. How can you say he’s not a natural SF? When we have been successful and not had a jumbled mess of long 2 point jumpers with it.

IF Smith does not change positions you just went from Joe Johnson to Deshawn Stevenson and no other changes. 1.9 Offensive Wins per season is a massive fail and facade of Josh at the PF.

His defense efficiency has been stellar but there is no reason that should change with added size he has shown to be a shotblocking menace at the wing.

So my question iF Smith isnt the SF now Are the Hawks tanking?
#Hawksbasketball.

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Cautionary tale out of Dallas this year.. we don’t want to bank our future on free agents we don’t have yet.. we won’t be the only team with cap space next summer. These are some crazy line ups yall are throwing out. Go play 2k12 with that speculation.

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I hope it’s only a one year deal for an SF. Would hate to compromise our chances at CP3 or DH12

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JR CRickets! – “Chicken is Chicken … But The Wing is The Thing”

MC!

Imma’ call JR Crickets and turn in your Playa’ Card.

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Agree 100%, Delfino is probably the best option for the best price at this point. T-Mac was too inconsistent last season and we shouldn’t bring him back. Delfino will = Williams but at a much cheaper rate and a much higher work ethic. GO HAWKS!!!

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pointguardslim

July 6th, 2012
5:45 pm

Josh ain’t coming back then simple as that.

OJ Mayo is a small forward and Josh Smith isn’t? Courtney Lee? Rashard Lewis is a natural?

Is Smith a natural power forward bringing the ball up averaging 4 assists per game and struggling to score over power forwards outside of jumpshots?

Come on now. Smith is a small forward.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fm9jw1wiZUM

*****************

The funny thing is that Smith is playing CENTER in that clip. I guess he got matched up on Fields because of an infamous Woody switch. Didn’t help that neither Melo or Amare rotated to help Fields.

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A little over-dramatic stating Horford has “complained” about anything….

Now for those who want OJ Mayo, you might want to do some research on his history of “complaining” and excuse making….not a good guy to have at all….

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@Rod from College Park

Gerald Green should be the guy you go after. Really not that hard to understand
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Thank you..Maybe only you and I know who he is and what he can do.

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Im down for Delfino or Barnes or Randolph…heck anybody but Marvin.

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We are the Hawks…. come off the Sugar High and remember this..

The way we get talent is thru the draft or we trade for them… They don’t choose us. In the trades we pay a higher price because we are the Hawks(Like the 2 1st we gave for Joe or the extra we paid to keep him)

Certain team are requested by players… That isn’t the Hawks
Certain teams are always on the short list for players… That isn’t the Hawks
Certan teams get players to take less to stay… That isn’t the Hawks

Maybe ferry doesn’t know what team he works for, but he will know in time.
Maybe he doesn’t understand our fans base, but he will know in time.

The Lakers wanted Josh, (probably) Teague and the 50mil in Lux tax it would have saved them for Gasol.. Becuase we are the Hawks and they expect us to overpay for talent.

Some are praying for and willing to trade all of our talent(Al and Teague) for a player(D12) that clearly doesn’t want to be a Hawk and could leave the following year…. We would be left with John Jenkins on the roster.

I suported tweaking the roster with a trade or 2…. I hope it works out.I know, that if we don’t trade for D12, he will never come to this team as a free agent…. Especially with Joe gone.

Sugar High

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forgot to add. If we love Ferry so much, let’s hope he has reached out to James Anderson because he would be a nice AFFORDABLE pickup for the team.

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Hawks need a 3 that can defend well, and rebound. Hawks don’t need scoring that much, but defense is a MUST.

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MC – Where is Gerald Green ?

If Hawks are smart bring this guy in ASAP, man he would bring more excitement to this team and also much cheaper tham Mayo.

Mayo wan’t atleast 5mill or more, SMH

Green 3 or 4millat the most plus he bring more energy to this team.

Green, Josh, Teague, would look real good at the High Light Factory.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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The Atlanta Hawks have made two of the best moves of the offseason—offloading their two worst contracts in Joe Johnson’s and Marvin Williams’.

Suddenly, the Hawks have put themselves in a great situation for the future because they do not have any lingering contracts.

In fact, with pieces like Al Horford and Jeff Teague, the Hawks might actually be in the running to trade for one of the most highly coveted players of the past ten years: Dwight Howard.

Before you say that Atlanta is a much smaller market than Dallas or Los Angeles (two of Howard’s more likely destinations at this point), we need to remember that Howard is from Atlanta.

Would D-12 consider a homecoming?

He might not have a choice, considering that the Magic are looking for the best package at this point.

However, Howard would definitely consider his hometown over other locations like Golden State and Houston.

In any case, this is a possible trade that would send Howard to the Hawks:

Orlando Receives: Al Horford, Jeff Teague, Zaza Pachulia and Atlanta 2013 first-round pick
Atlanta Receives: Dwight Howard

At the end of the day, this deal is definitely a win-win for both teams.

For the Magic, they get an All-Star big man in Horford, who will be playing much closer to his former college home of Gainesville, Florida.

If Traded There, Would Dwight Howard Re-Sign with the Hawks?
Yes
79.9%
No
20.1%
Total votes: 707

In addition, Teague is an improving talent, who would be able to start right away for the Magic. Pachulia is put in to match Howard’s huge contract and the first-round pick gives Orlando a chance to get another rebuilding piece.

On the other side, Atlanta, quite frankly, gets their guy. Howard and Smith played in high school together and are very good friends.

The Hawks without Johnson, Horford and Teague will still make the playoffs (likely in the bottom half of the Eastern Conference).

However, building around a core of Howard and Smith will definitely entice free agents to sign with the Hawks, maybe even convincing Chris Paul to join, although this remains a long shot.

In any case, the Atlanta Hawks have played themselves out of a sorry hole that previous management put them in.

While nothing is official and no moves have been made, Atlanta actually played themselves into the championship hunt and possibly into acquiring Howard.

The question is whether they will be able to act on their very flexible future.

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The Nash trade hurt more than helped the Lakers chances for getting D12

http://www.orlandopinstripedpost.com/2012/7/6/3141462/orlando-magic-rumors-dwight-howard-trade-lakers-nets

As the Orlando Magic work to find the best trade possible for All-NBA center Dwight Howard, it’s become clear that if they send him to the New Jersey Nets, it’ll need to be soon. Sam Amick reports that talks between the Magic and Nets have continued, without progressing or regressing, but if the two teams can’t come up with a deal within a week, they’ll table the discussions for later.
The key date is December 15th, which is the earliest teams may trade players signed to new contracts in the 2012 free-agency period.
Amick says Orlando has also discussed a Howard trade with the Atlanta Hawks, Los Angeles Lakers, Dallas Mavericks, and Houston Rockets. The Lakers’ acquisition of future Hall-of-Fame point guard Steve Nash may help convince Howard, who has just one season remaining on his contract, to commit to Los Angeles long-term, which commitment he’s been reluctant to make. However, as Amick notes, the Lakers sent the Phoenix Suns four future Draft picks in the Nash sign-and-trade, weakening their stable of assets.
Crucially, Amick reports Orlando is indeed interested in obtaining multiple first-round picks in any trade involving Howard, even if they are likely to be late first-rounders, as L.A.’s surely would be.

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@Rod. Green should have been included in that trade instead of Stevenson.

tyger are you really stuck on that a regular season game that Teague shot an air ball? Did this dude steal your girl or something? No matter what the topic is you find some way to talk about Teague. Bruh you really need some help. The funny thing is you bring up Harris and saying we beat Boston with him yet Teague had a better playoffs than Harris did this year.

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If Howard wants to play in his hometown, why hasn’t he said . . . “yes, I wouldn’t mind playing in ATL for one year, and see what happens”?

People can talk about Smith and Morrow trying to recruit Howard all the want, ( and I hope they’re successful ). But at the end of the day, this is about what the Magic want in return for Dwight . . and the desires of Dwight for the future.

He’s obviously not “willingly” to invest 5+ years of his prime playing days in Atlanta. So you have to force him here by offering Orlando a package they can’t refuse. Let him play in the city for one year and see if he has a change of thought. If he does, that’s great.

If he doesn’t, you complete the demolition of the Hawks.

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*Think about it, the Hawks have been playing…

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What contender is McGrady capable of starting on Ra’Mon?

This isnt the bottomsfeeder team of the Association kick rocks. Sorry but its over for t-Mac and Cheese.

And saying Josh had the best season of his career is baseless. And the Hawks are playing him out of position.

Josh Smith had only 2 offensive wins last season and same as 2010-11, even though he lost 20 lbs.

Seriously?

His best season was in 2009-2010 when he had 4 Offensive Wins. Those 18ppg were empty because they came on jumpers and he got no easy buckets.

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Word on the playground is that O.J. Mayo wants more than the mid-level exception. Turned down Boston bc that’s all they had to offer. If that’s all we have, we can kiss that possibility good-bye.

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Looks natural to me MC and Ra’Mon.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tIRqlWBvYE

The best play Smith had was dunking on Ibaka and that was after nearly airballing a pop out 3, PF.
That’s not natural. Stop diluting the roster. Josh Smith is not Dwight Howard. You dont put him next to some shooters and hope it sticks.

LD has no idea he’s screwing Josh out of an all star bid.

Josh vs James or Josh vs Bosh
Aim for the stars Atlanta.

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“Hawks need to play morrow at the 2 and josh at 3. you have good help defense with the big lineup, but need to spread floor with shooting for josh and al on inside”

JOSH IS THE STARTING POWERFORWARD FOR THIS TEAM AND ITS THIS TEA,M’S BEST BET TO HAVE JOSH AT THE 4

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PGS, I’ll keep it simple. I disagree.

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pointguardslim – Why LD is so Dum ?

Josh lost 20pounds so he could slide right in at SF and get the drill done.

LD and Woody need to fired have guys playing out of position for the past 7years, JUST DAM

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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Ra’Mon i’ll keep it simple.

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I agree and can prove it. Bloggers would you call this a power forward?

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/video-atlanta-josh-smith-does-terrible-things-serge-180508656.html

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Rim protection? More like escort service? Hmmmmm

Seen this B4? Yes..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=digHHWtFXuE

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Talk About Town – Your vid said sorry not in conclusion, SMH

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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Pretty boy wanted no parts of that dude who is more than a half foot shorter?

Hey Josh go get your boy in here and send that ish back to Chicago…

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Big Ray so I have graduated from Troll to Hater?????????????????????????????????????????

LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

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slimjr – Thats sorry Kirk fault.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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This is how the Boss represents!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KrUUt-izI0

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BIG DOG, we will have to agree to disagree…

I would have benched that ALL NBA PLAYER/ 2 Time ALLStar for that ish!

Take the charge or send that ish back to Atlanta!

Greyhound is ready on the hour cause D12 is coming home!

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Who say Al Horford is soft ?

http://youtu.be/5LOgPURZsn8

Al have heart.

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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another person to consider to bring in for a contract would be forward Devin Ebanks. He’s still underdeveloped offensively, but would be a great utility player to bring off the bench. He and James Anderson would be two guys we could look at and assess their long term potential by signing them to a million-dollar contract (or less) since they each only have two years of experience. Ebanks is an outstanding defender which would help our lineup.
Note: On the link is a recap of trades the Hawks made regarding Jordan Crawford, Damion James and Tibor Pleiss (forgot we actually drafted him)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLYgBCATBnU&feature=related

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Hey dude when your football team goes 4-10 against the winners[last two seasons] its not hating its real “nimbers” stating that the team are pretenders……Especially the one that melts down in the money games…lol

Of course Mr Blank and his boys are doing a great job with their “shell’ game cause it worked on you and many more..But thats okay, you guys will get it in a couple of years….Be patient Grasshopper….

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a second James Anderson snippet

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_nIxpxDDtE

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Najeh with vicious cross-over and step back 3! Did Marv Albert just say: YES?????? [made shot]

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HE may have heart but he does not have game to crack the glass ceiling[ECF/Finals]

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Jamison is not a natural SF any more than Josh is. I don’t want his no defense playing, non-passing ass anyway. Let him go to Charlotte where they actually want him.

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I don’t mind Gerald Green either. I don’t think he’s anywhere close to a sure thing and I have no idea if he can do anything other than score, but at least we know he can score, he’s athletic, and SF is his natural position. Can’t say that about everyone else on the above list.

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Najeh Davenpoop do you see McGrady signing with any other NBA team after the debacle of last season?

He can’t hold his own anymore

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Sorry, forgot to add the link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4Xd0cPTWng&feature=related

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuklWpNBhE0
The Hawks almost beat the Celtics in 2010 with Josh Smith at 250 lbs playing SF.

And Steve Kerr and McHale talking about Josh being long armed? – Josh has the same length as Vince Carter and Paul Pierce. And is a natural shooting the gap

So you trying to tell me what his natural position when the Hawks are always last in rebounding and havent won anything? Its a joke. Theres no reason the Hawks should be this athletic and near last in rebounding.

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Atlanta’s depth chart will look something like this (just for example, so please save your outrage if you disagree):

PG: Jeff Teague/Devin Harris
SG: Anthony Morrow/John Jenkins/Devin Harris/DeShawn Stevenson
SF: Josh Smith/Anthony Morrow/DeShawn Stevenson
PF: Josh Smith/Ivan Johnson/Jordan Williams/Mike Scott
C: Al Horford/Zaza Pachulia/Johan Petro

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Sorry azz Elton Brand? Never liked his game. None of those Dukies work out too well in the NBA. Well perhaps Grant Hill, but thats about it. Bunch of system players. With that being said, I’d take him over Collins in a heartbeat. Depends on how much $ he’s wanting.

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“7 turnovers in the money game from your Allstar center means he was forcing it cause his 1950’s set shot was being contested….”

“Nothing new there……”

Well if it’s nothing new, how come you keep posting it over and over?

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I think T-Mac is a fine bench player if given a consistent role at 15-20 minutes per game, particularly if the bench doesn’t have another player who can pass and create open looks for teammates.

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I want to be an Al Horford defender!

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Saw a clip of Horford playing for the Dominican team today. He looks thinner. Had like 14 pts, 15 rebounds though.

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Yesterday I (and someone before me) suggested Devin Harris for Kevin Martin to temporarily plug the SG hole with an expiring player. Here’s another idea to add to that — Anthony Morrow for Mike Dunleavy. Salaries match, and Dunleavy is expiring and is still a somewhat productive player, even if he is injury prone.

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I saw a film of Al playing center in the 3rd grade. He dominated the 1st graders. Thats the Al Im talking about. I want that Al back. Al was better when he was in the 3rd grade.

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I still like Corey Brewer as a trade target. We should have roughly a $4.5M trade exception to use once Joe’s trade is finalized.

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“wait you cant trade devin harris for like 3 months right?”

You can trade him by himself. Can’t trade him along with someone else.

In addition, teams cannot trade players under the following circumstances:

For two months after receiving the player in trade, if the trade aggregates the player’s salary with the salaries of other players. However, the team is free to trade the player immediately, either by himself or without aggregating his salary with other salaries. This restriction applies only to teams over the salary cap.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm

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And according to the trade machine, at least, Harris can be traded for Martin straight up even though Martin makes $4 million more.

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Tmac had to share minutes with Marvin, joe, vlad (whom ld stupidly fed minutes) and Ivan at SF. Tmac needs to get over it and see the opportunity for minutes at SF on a squad he is already familiar with before he starts over elsewhere.

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I know how T.S. Always yaps about Al’s 12pts and 8 rebounds. Well I actually took Al’s best 3 minutes in which he scored 6pts and had 3 rbs (they were his own misses) and multiplied that across 48 minutes to give a better idea of what Al’s potential is.

I came up with 96pts and 48 rebounds (they were his own misses) per game.

Im expecting Al to have an outbreak year. (the cooties)

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Gerald Green and Pietrus would be a great tandem at the SF position. I agree with O’B, they would come for much less than Marvin would. I will go on record of saying I think this team (with Green and Pietrus added) will compete for a 4-6 playoff spot, long as they stay relatively healthy, for majority of the season. Everyone is overrating the other teams in the east, like they do every year. Teague, Josh, and Al on the floor will still be better than anything else majority of the teams in the east put out there.

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Big Ray, I see LD using a Teague and Harris back court to close a lot of games.

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Ra’mon ,

An interesting idea. Just wondering if LD would turn it into a “pg battle”, ya know?

Here’s the thing – it wouldn’t hurt for Teague to have a little pushing, but I don’t see his development happening. Not like what the Memphis Grizzlies head coach did with his pg. I see LD just giving Teague challenges and then sitting back and saying nothing when Teague overcomes them. He’ll take minutes away and put Kirk in the game, then watch Kirk fail at the pg. I mean…. come on …

Harris/Teague would be one quick backcourt tandem that could give teams fits if utilized at the right times.

But I have a real hard time trusting a coach to do that when he doesn’t even know how to deploy his own bench (T-Mac and Ivan), took way too long to realize that Marvin was better off the bench (seriously? He had been an assistant coach with the Hawks Marvin’s whole career and couldn’t see that THEN?), and couldn’t understand that Kirk Hinrich is way better as an undersized backup SG than he is a starting or even backup pg in most situations.

Don’t trust him at all.

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“Beast Mode” off….catch y’all later…

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With Ray Allen on the Heat, it will be even harder to double LeBron.

Ken S,

If we get Dwight here, other players will take less money to play here too.

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I now hate Ray Allen . . . merc!

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WINGING TO SEATTLE I HOPE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MOVE NOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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@Just Joe

I still like Corey Brewer as a trade target. We should have roughly a $4.5M trade exception to use once Joe’s trade is finalized.
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When Brewer came out of Florida with Horford and Noah I honestly though he was the better all around player.I think he will break out someplace.Good call..

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Is Mike Miller staying? How small will they go? o.O

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ryan,

I wouldn’t even try to mess with the Heat now. I would say Ferry so just start rebuilding a team to compete a few years from now.

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“I wouldn’t even try to mess with the Heat now. I would say Ferry so just start rebuilding a team to compete a few years from now.”

“Matt” P. responding to “Ryan”.

I found that funny. Hawks don’t have the option to “build for later”. Lebron Josh and Al are in their primes.

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From the N.O. paper;

LAS VEGAS – New Orleans Hornets shooting guard Eric Gordon said if the team matches the four-year, $58 million offer sheet he signed this week with the Phoenix Suns, he’ll play in the Crescent City, but he won’t be happy about it.

Is there anything the Hornets could do to change his mind? “I don’t think there is,” Gordon said..

http://www.hoopsworld.com/hawks-zaza-pachulia-off-the-trading-block?/

If New Orleans does not retain Eric Gordon, then they would have lost Gordon and Kaman from the CP3 trade. And if that happens, you can blame David Stern for not letting the other trade go through.

This reminds me of the JJ situation, and the Josh situation. JJ told Phoenix not to match the Hawks offer (although Im not sure if Phoenix really would), so we worked out a SNT.

And Josh was offered by Memphis, and we matched. Josh was not happy that he had to go out and find his money, and Eric Gordon isn’t happy about it either.

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“Yep. Like I said, you’re just a hater. Requires little or no original thought, and is easiest when working from hindsight….LOL is right….I’ll take grasshopper over earthworm” –BRay–

Yea you should know…

Peel back the onion maybe you’ll something…..

Me likes the Grasshopper also…Hahaha

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Bring back Damien Wilkins. You can get him for cheap and I think all he needs is a solid opportunity to prove he’s more than capable. Just my thoughts

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Its looks like the Dwightmare is almost over,

I hope that the Hawks getting him but this is the NBA, he probably going to the Lakers or Nets (as David Stern desire)

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You buy the bullchit,I don’t player….lol

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5 more days[The suspense is growing]..

Can Danny pull off the biggest trade in Hawks history to date?

That is the 64 million dollar question..

And what will it cost the Franchise? Will he have to give up the selected Allstar, mind you not voted in by the public? How many picks? How many years will this Real SuperStar sign for?

This requires tremendous thought and planning far beyond Mr. Know it all Jr…

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I haven’t been this giddy about the offseason since Shaq was trying to decide whether to join the Hawks or Celtics. I hope the Hawks don’t get left standing at the alter alone again.

Although as I try to remember back to that time I’m not really sure the Hawks ever made an offer to Shaq.

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I remember how many on the blog were pointing out that having Shaq on the roster would be good for attendance and revenue for the Hawks even if Shaq rode the bench and was a bad locker room influence. I agreed then and continue to agree.

I don’t care if Dwight is a nightmare and a man-child. He is also the best true center in the league. He will elevate the quality of basketball played by the Hawks. He will elevate the attendance at the games. He will draw the attention of the national media. He will build the fanbase outside of native Atlantans. He will be making money for the Hawks even when he is on vacation. AND aquiring him will go a long ways toward changing the culture of the entire organization.

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The ONLY misgiving that I would have about the Hawks aquiring Howard now is that it would likely give Larry Drew another winning season and another extension on his contract. YUCK!

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big ray, shortly after d will made his decision i too mentioned here the irony that it took so long to make the pairing that could have put us over the top for years. it would have been a true batman and robin show. it will hurt if they seem to have an unmistakable bond from the get go and jj revives his career more as a catch and shoot gunner and crafty defender since his legs arent used up trying to create plays.

i also had a long note crafted, prob along similar lines and for the umpteenth time it got blowed up because MC shut er down while i was composing it.

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[all]^^^^

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If the D12 acquisition never materializes for our Hawks this franchise [may become] basically irrelevant for at least a season..What a tragedy that would be…

The long suffering fans would suffer again…

No news there…

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Houston is open to a sign and trade for Camby. Could Hawks trade Zaza for Camby and one of Houston’s 5 SF’s?

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Would like to see Derrick Williams starting at the 3 spot for the Hawks.. This guy is going to be something…What could we give Minn to show we’re serious?

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Ra’mon,

Camby does not want to come here. He wants to go to the Knicks or Miami (if he doesn’t stay in Houston), but to get more money from those teams, he needs a SNT from Houston. Hawks are not on his list.

And I wouldnt make that move anyway, because Zaza is expiring, and we need the salary cap space next year (for more options).

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KevinM,

Since Orlando resigned Nelson, I don’t know if they would still want Teague, who will be a RFA next year, and might command $5+ mil (imo).

Maybe they would take Al ($12 mil), Zaza ($5.2 mil, expiring), Devin ($8.5 mil expiring), and 2 first round picks for D12 ($19 mil expiring) and J-Rich ($5.8 mil – although his total contract is 3 years, $18.6 mil).

Would you do that deal? And IF they all resigned (assuming Teague $6 mil, Josh $16 mil, Dwight $20 mil), we would still have roughly $10+ mil to spend on upgrading the team.

If they want Teague, we would have Devin Harris as our starter, and just have to hope that he gives us at least his career average of 13 and 5, while shooting a good %.

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Gdad, I have this feeling my gut that D12 maybe headed to the Lakers..

IMHO D12 is a better all around player than Bynum anyway….Would be an upgrade for the Lakers…

“By Alex Groberman, Fri, July 06, 2012

Remember how 24 hours ago, after the Steve Nash trade was confirmed, Los Angeles Lakers management quietly indicated they were content with the team as presently constructed?

Those were good times…

…too bad Lakers management doesn’t actually seem content with the team as presently constructed.

Look, if L.A. makes another move this summer (and that’s a big if), it will be one of two deals: 1.) a trade to acquire Howard or 2.) a trade to get rid of Pau Gasol.

There are really no other potential transactions on the horizon. And, in all honesty, even those two deals are somewhat unlikely now. L.A. hasn’t gotten anything even remotely resembling a fair trade offer for Gasol’s services to this point, and Howard continues to be extremely reluctant about being adorned in purple and gold.

One of those trades could happen at some point, obviously; however, you also have to figure that there is a reason why neither has (yet).

Here is the latest rumor about Howard possibly landing in Tinseltown (via Jackie Pepper by way of ProBasketballTalk):

The Los Angeles Lakers are considering an offer from the Orlando Magic that would send Dwight Howard to L.A. in exchange for Andrew Bynum, a source close to the situation tells PepperOnSports.com.

I know, I know. You’ve heard it all before. Here’s the fun part:

The source says the Lakers have informed one player that he might be part of the package deal and that he could be traded at any moment.

So there you go. It’s not much of a rumor, but it’s what’s out there right now.

Who could this potential player be? Anyone, really.

It probably isn’t Bynum himself because, well, that would be awkward. It could possibly be Metta World Peace, but it’s hard to envision him being able to stay quiet about something like that. It could be one of the auxiliary pieces that would have to accompany Bynum and Peace in order to make the money for a trade work (Josh McRoberts, Christian Eyenga, etc.), but does L.A. brass really care enough about any of those guys to tip their hand on an impending deal?

We’ll find out soon enough, I suppose.”

Yes we all will….

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O’b, I wouldn’t do it either. Just trying to find different options in the quiet days of summer, lol.

G’D, your opposition to want to add a top 5 player to the Hawks line up, is interesting. The last team to win a title without a top 5 player, not named the Detroit Pistons, was who? You’d probably have to go back to Philly’s title, depending on how you ranked Erving during that season. Think about this, Howard CAN NOT make more on his next contract, than what the Hawks were paying Joe Johnson for his annual salary. You do realize that the Hawks were paying Kirk and Marvin a combined $16 million last season to give minimum production at their positions? So quick equation right quick. D12 is taken Joe’s old salary slot. You take Al’s salary spot (because he would be traded) and divide it into three parts of $6 million, $3 million, and $3 million. You add one of those $3 million to Josh’s current salary to bring it up to $15 million in his new contract. And you take the other $3 million and add it to the $16 million you were giving Kirk and Marvin to do nothing, and you now have $19 million dollar slot to pay a superstar in CP3. And you’re left with $6 million more to split between a raise for Teague, and another back up center with Zaza now gone. So you now have 3 highly productive players combining for a salary of less than $55 million. And you have close to $17-19 million left to fill out the roster without even going into luxury tax.

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Ra’mon

Garnett never quit on his teammates … Never !

Are you serious … Paul pierce = questionable basketball IQ ?
Where in the world did you dig that up ?

Listen – I made a few valid points.

If you wish to counter my points – do so.
I was not discussing KG or Paul Pierce.
If you wish to debate those in a comparison and contrast
of competitive nature, basketball IQ, intangibles, leadership,
bein` good teammates, etc, etc, etc. I`ll be happy to do so.
-but-
That was never my point – comparing Josh or Dwight to others.
I was only stating a fact as to how they are.
-plus-
I still think giving up too much through trade is not the way to go.

A greater point that seems to have gone unnoticed;
I think Josh is twice the man that is Dwight.

I would much prefer to stimulate the chemistry
that is already established between two talents that are more diverse
Josh and AL, and let them grow without the impingement of Iso-Joe.
All the while hanging on to Teaguer and Zaza.
Steadily adding components into a champion !

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http://spinoff.comicbookresources.com/2012/07/06/walking-dead-comic-con-poster-boasts-michonne-rick-governor/

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Ra`mon @ 1:44 am

You are makin` my point for me.
-thanks-

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G’dad, Garnett did quit on his teams two seasons in Minnesota! And Garnett for the first 8-9 seasons of his career was anything but clutch. Do you not realize Skip Bayless called Kevin Garnett “Garnott” for a decade? And Garnett used to be my favorite for years, so I used to watch many games of his.

Paul Pierce has had 8 seasons in where he averaged LESS than 1.0 assist more than turnovers. Paul Pierce wasn’t considered a winner. He was considered a chunker who didn’t play defense. If you think at any point of his career, Pierce was a better complete player than what Dwight is, that would be saying a lot about your view of basketball.

I know you weren’t talking about the big three. But what I’m saying is, all of these flaws you say about Dwight, he still manages to produce and lead his teams deep into the playoffs consistently. That is something Garnett, Pierce, and other superstars never did without playing with another superstar or all star.

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G’dad, you said I’m making your point. But you’re missing the point. The point is in each of those cases, the franchise player and superstar was acquired first, and THEN they built around that player. Parker, Bowen and Ginobli came after Duncan. Gasol came after Kobe. As I said when the big three came together, they had less than 7 players on the roster. If you’re rebuilding a house, you have to knock down the posts and walls so you can redo the foundation (super star). So if trading Al, and a back up center or 4th year pg means getting a big piece of that foundation, than you do that. You get me Dwight, Josh, and enough cap room to bring in another all star, and THEN you fill out the roster with what is needed.

Also you said Josh and Dwight game is too similar. But in my opinion, Josh was one of the top three facilitators for others on the team. Dwight can’t do that as well. They both dominate the paint on defense. Josh and Dwight on the defensive boards would lead to 70-80% of the rebounds on defense landing in a Hawks’ player hands. Dwight in the post gives Josh more in rhythm jumpers where his feet is set, compared to so much Iso, And Josh on the block gives Dwight opportunities under the goal from Josh’s running left hook that leads to the opposing center helping out. Josh is a much better passer than Al, and Josh finishes in traffic better than Al. Dwight and Josh would EASILY be the best 4 & 5 combo in the league on offense and defense.

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Ra`mon

You are significantly more qualified than Skip Bayless
to make any basketball assessment you please.
I`ll take your word any day over his.

I am not comparing ability;
any singular member of the Big Three to D.Howard.

I am speaking of Dwight Howard – Period.

I am not casting aspersions upon DH`s talent.
I am saying he has not improved some of his skills:
*free throw shooting … *absence of a go to post move
to name two.
However, `tis intangibles, or lack thereof, that alarm me !

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Okay, I have never been good with aritmatic.

Dwight will make $20+ mil.
Josh will make upwards of $15 mil.

I do not see $40 mil left.

But thank you for explaining it to me.

In 2013 the top unrestricted FA`s are:
Chris Paul – ain`t comin`
Al Jefferson – why
Paul Millsap – Power Forward

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Ramon, I’m on your side of this little debate you have going with Grandad, but quoting Skip Bayless only serves to weaken your argument.

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Rumor: Lakers tell one player he may be traded for Howard

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Anyone whos willing to throw away Horford and Smith i have 2 words for you: Mark Cuban.
The Mavericks have been one of my favorite teams in the west for years now, and instead of building up on a championship roster… they tore down. Sad. Now they will get no big name free agents in the next 2 years, Jason Terry dissed them, and so did Steve Nash and Jason Kidd.
Maybe a few years down the road they will land a big name. But so what, by that time Dirk will be over the hill, and wont be as effective. The Mavericks wont sniff the finals again for a long time. ALL because Cuban was obsessed with the overrated Deron Williams. SAD!

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You don’t construct a team to beat one specific team because you may end up never seeing that team in the playoffs.

You construct a team to beat the league. The only team that the Hawks will undoubtedly without question have to go through is the Miami Heat.

Their center is Joel Anthony and he’s not good. So you build where they are weak (relatively). PG & Center.

Hawks already have an All Star center but if they can get Dwight Howard then you do it because then maybe just maybe CP3 would entertain the Hawks and another Big 3. And then hope and pray your SF and SG can keep up and be at least decent versus LBJ & Wade.

on a side note….Josh Smith to the Olympics!

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Sucker, you make valid points and those types of ‘beat-1-team’ moves have been proven. Ask Danny….he prepped for ORL only to get Boston and CLE was unprepared.
I also have stated you gave to have a strong PG for D12 and Josh. I would like to see if Danny could pry Bledsoe away from the Clips for Zaza and have him either in place to take over the reins or if we have to remove Teague. Bledsoe is extra on the Clips now that they have Billups and JC2. The Clips are thin up front.

Before D12

Josh / Al / Bledsoe / Teague / Stevenson or FA

After

Josh / D12 / Bledsoe /Harris / Stevenson or FA

Our front five has to be rebuilt…..knuckleheads or not, as a pair, they look formidable on paper.

The big question is: will Josh go back to the post like so many of us are clamoring for him to do? Are we still going to be subjected to all those jumpers?

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Question: I see we are interested in A. Randolph.
In his brief career, it seems like his stats (8.5 pts, 5.1 reb, in 17 min.) don’t suggest starting material and appear to be below than Marvin’s career averages.

Are we wooing him to be starting SF and if so, do we expect the “new” offense (minus JJ and with Smoove and Al as the focus) to be more beneficial to his talents such that he will exceed what he has done to date?

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Just joe that lineup you have with Andre Iguodua isnt bad.

I still approve Ferry moving Joe J contract and Marvin. I think Ferry will do the right thing. This year if Dwight isnt attainable then just field a team that doesnt have long term contracts and have a lot of Cap space at the end of the year to make a run if Dwight if stilll unsigned or some other free agents.

I think the big thing is if Dwight signs with another team, will Smith wants to stay and if he bolts do you then just look to move Horford and Teaque and go into another direction rebuild or build around those two and get some free agents not on the level of a Dwight or Chris Paul who I dont think will be coming to Atlanta next year

I think with a few small moves the Hawks can be a playoff team this year as I stated before probably between a six and eight seed. If you look at the landscape NJ replaces Orlando as a playoff team and the only difference i see is Atlanta will be a lower seeded playoff team this year

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Also I think Ivan will come back. I am not sure I see a big market with him elsewhere although with the way teams are giving out contracts it wouldnt suprise me if he gets blown away but i think his past and anger issues will scare off some teams

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I know one thing, if the Hawks trade Al or Josh for Dwight… and he leaves the next summer, the Hawks are going to be BAD for a loonnnggggg time. It will make us crave the Joe Johnson years. And we arent getting Chris Paul. Lets not be the Mavericks and sacrifice everything for a few people who never show up. Only difference is Cuban had a championship roster… making him look even dumber now.

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BravesFan . . . the problem with guys like Morrow, is that they’re too one-dimensional to be a difference maker on a nightly basis. Morrow, like Kyle Korver, are great spot up,. open shot shooters. But are you giving the ball or calling a play for Morrow at the end of a game, in order to keep a lead, tie a game up, or win the game?

I listed yesterday that after Morrow had that 42 point game, he promptly scored 19 points in the next 3 games . . . shooting 7 – 31 FG . . and 2 – 14 from 3 point range.

That’s why he’s Anthony Morrow and not Joe Johnson.

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If to not pour more salt in the wound, or wonder “what if we made the right draft choice in 2005″ . . here is Deron Williams on why he stayed in Brooklyn.

“I actually thought that’s where I was going to go,” he said. “I had the meetings and it kind of changed my mind because once I got out of the meeting with Dallas and saw the way they were going and the team they were putting out there, and I saw that we just made a trade for Joe Johnson and I felt like that team for a longer time would be the better team.

“It was a hard decision. It was my hometown, the team that I grew up watching, would have loved to play for and my family, would have loved for them to see me play,” Williams said, according to the newspaper. “I kind of felt I let the city I’m from down because they wanted me there so bad. It was a really tough decision, but I think it ultimately came down to where I felt I had a better chance to win for a longer period of time.”

************

One man’s “overpaid garbage” is another man’s “overpaid treasure”.

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“If you don’t have the advantage of having that guy’s “Bird Rights” when he becomes an unrestricted free agent, you better be a destination in which a guy believes that he can win ( or at least have some playoff success ).

If you’re not that type of destination, you’re going to be forced to overpay for somebody, or two or 3 players.”- Northcyde

Preach… Unless Teague, Al or Josh become that player, we are still just the Hawks.

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Rufus1 @ 10:36
“Preach… Unless Teague, Al or Josh become that player, we are still just the Hawks.”
EXACTLY!! Teague and Horford are not that type of player. neither is Josh but he is closer than the other two. so I really don’t understand why some don’t want to trade either teague or Horford under any circumstances. I would move both teague and horford in a heart beat for Dwight.

another thing Grandad. how can you be so sure that Chris Paul will not sign with the Hawks next summer?, especially if atlanta already has Dwight in the fold. I bet two weeks ago you also thought there was no way Joe Johnson gets traded because no team would take his huge contract (my self included on that one).

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Typo -I hope we dont get desperate

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THE IMMORTAL…. I agree with you and I disagree with you. I agree with you with the Hawks do not need to get desperate in over reaching in free agents or trades and killing our cap for 2013 unless it is a no brainer type player i.e. Dwight. I would rather play the season out with what we have.
I disagree with you that we shouldn’t trade for Dwight. Horford is a nice player but if he can get you Dwight you absolutely do it.

oh and I like Royce White as well, but what would we offer Houston? he isn’t worth Horford or Smith, now that we now Smith is open to remaining a Hawks. Teague? I wouldn’t do it because we would not have a point guard. well we do have Devin Harris so maybe I would do that…. but would houston?

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The difference though is, now you’re the ’same Hawks (with no superstars)’ with an very realistic possibility of actually landing a guy capable of being on that level.

I heard someone say it, can’t remember who, but he made a great point. The Hawks were stuck – - they were never bad enough to get a good enough draft pick to land a stud in the NBA draft but they were never good enough to get over the hump. So, either you play out the duration of Joe’s contract and remain what you were, or speed up the process (while Horford and Smith are still young and entering their prime years), and look to use that money to get some peices around them.

Point blank. I don’t see how you can argue it was a bad move. You just got rid of one of the worst NBA contracts in history + an irrelevant wing man (duck). You’re loaded with cap space. Even if you don’t land a D12 or CP3, you can still get players that gave you what Joe gave you at a much better rate this time around OR you can get a collection of players that can give you what Joe gave you.

Bottom line, there are possibilities now, whereas there weren’t any for years. We’ve always been adding B-team rated talent to the end of our bench offseason after offseason as if that would get us over the hump, and it never did. Joe wasn’t getting any younger, and our team wasn’t getting any better. It is what it is.

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Interesting article on why Ray Allen left for Miami,

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba–heat-gave-ray-allen-reason-to-again-feel-wanted.html;_ylt=ApWL9kDXpit7xK0fwSlbDegLcykA;_ylu=X3oDMTFoZnA0Y2I3BG1pdANCbG9nIElu

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Why would they trade Joe Johnson, the Hawks where the laughing stock of the League until he brought some respect back. Thy should have tried to add some other players to compliment him. The Hawks will not make Playoffs this year.

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There are some hope here in your line S.A.S, but there are too many holes Al horford is not the center to take you past the Second round and he is only the 2nd best power forward behind Josh Smith, therefore to up grade the center position you will need to move Al horford. I do like the Devin Harris in front of Teague scenario. Teague is not a thinker. hes been around some excellent guard play with Bibby and Johnson, but nothing sank into his head…. May Devin’s wisdom and experience will set an example for teague to think about how to quarterback and distribute the rock. He certainly doesnt have a clue.

Ray Allen to Miami, Wow. Another weapon. Hawks got lots of work to do starting with Getting Josh and D12 together. The rest will fall in place.

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http://blogs.ajc.com/hawks/2012/07/05/atlanta-hawks-the-next-step/

Once the trades are completed and Farmar is bought out, Atlanta’s depth chart will look something like this (just for example, so please save your outrage if you disagree):
PG: Jeff Teague/Devin Harris
SG: Anthony Morrow/John Jenkins/Devin Harris/DeShawn Stevenson
SF: Josh Smith/Anthony Morrow/DeShawn Stevenson
PF: Josh Smith/Ivan Johnson/Jordan Williams/Mike Scott
C: Al Horford/Zaza Pachulia/Johan Petro

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Knowing we had Ferry coming why in the world did we resign LD. Do we trust him to make good decisions with a new bunch of people. This team ran a lousy offense last year,he screwed a
Lot of players like JT,Tmac & ivan,didn’t use KH right, gave him way minutes than he deserved ,let JJ& JS do what ever they wanted,lost the playoffs for the team. What sense did it make to bring him back for a new beginning.

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KevinM

July 7th, 2012
11:54 am

SAS, gotta modify that depth chart…..Josh isn’t playing behind anyone.

Not a bad roster, but we’re still the Hawks trying to get a Top 4 seed.

Not a lot of potential there to see the ECF.

I agree, however, I would love to see Josh Smith come off the bench as a 6th man.. I do not like him in late game situations…

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Whiplash LD did everything in his power to screw JT. He pulled him when he was playing good,he let JJ & JS take over the offense & always gave mixed signals to him about what was his role. He screwed him around when KH was here a guy who no longer was effective as a pg.what will he do with devin Harris here I don’t think the situation Looks good for JT or the hawks.

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Josh Smith … lost the Boston series for this team.

Willful ignorance and insults – 3

your new credibility level is now a 1 (out of a possible ten)

The bright side is this is the beauty of America, even an Idiot has a right to speak his or her lunacy.

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We have enough talent here with the hope of more to come, we don’t have to worry where to use JS ,Al or Zazza they all need to play. A smart coach will use them effectively regardless of what position they are playing. A smart coach would not play the second team all at the same time but would rotate them into the game as needed.

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Now, back to what makes sense:

The Lakers come up a lot in discussions but there are two reasons right now that deal seems a long shot. First, Howard has not said he will commit to staying in L.A. after this season, and the Lakers are not giving up Andrew Bynum and more in hopes they can keep Howard. They don’t need to. With Steve Nash in house they are a threat right now, there is no reason to gamble with Howard on that. Howard would have to commit.

Secondly, why would Orlando trade a temperamental big man in the last year of his contract for Andrew Bynum, a temperamental big man in the last year of his contract? Remember, Bynum is a free agent next summer, too. Unless Bynum is willing to commit to Orlando like Howard is to Los Angeles, this deal isn’t happening.

One interesting note came from Marc Spears of Yahoo who expressed what has started to become clear from the Nets recent moves — they are tired of playing this game with Orlando.

Nets have “30 percent chance” of landing Dwight in trade but likely would turn attention to FAs if it can’t be done in a week, source tells Y!

My guess is that this starts to pick up some steam early next week, but that is just a guess. Orlando could choose to sit on this until Dec. 15 (when players signed this summer can be traded). They are in no rush. They don’t look worse if this drags on a little longer.

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/07/rumors-fly-but-reality-is-dwight-howard-trade-not-imminent/

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** I suggest you guys quit mothering these men and hold them accountable.

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Dream line-up.(Hawks are more likely to trade Al Horford. Personally, neither one of these guys would be untouchable to me. They both have talent, however, each lack “elite or superstar” desire.

PG Devin Harris/Jeff Teague/ Janero Pargo
SG Michael Pietrus/Deshawn Stevenson/Anthony Morrow
SF Josh Smith/Anthony Randolph/Rashard Lewis
PF Pau Gasol/Ivan Johnson/Jordan Williams
C Al Jefferson/Johan Petro/Free agent

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Earlier this week, new GM Rob Hennigan went on and on about how Jameer Nelson andJ.J. Redick are the type of players and people the Magic would like to keep. Then, when asked directly whether he wants Dwight on the team, Hennigan clearly dodged the question.

“We want guys that want to be here,” Hennigan said.”We want guys who are about team, who are committed to something bigger than themselves, who love the game and are hungry for the game and want to represent this organization in a unified fashion. We want guys who are about the right things.”

Hennigan had every chance to say, “We would love to have Dwight Howard on this team.” But not once did he utter anything close.

Unspoken words have never come in more loud and clear.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-07-06/sports/os-mike-bianchi-saturday-circus-0707-20120706_1_dwight-howard-magic-fans-jameer-nelson

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Whiplash

July 7th, 2012
12:38 pm

You are either “Josh Smith” or “Josh Smith’s Jock Strap” Once again, for those of LOW BASKETBALL IQ, Josh Smith is GROSSLEY OVERRATED!!!

He would make a great 6th man of the year!!!

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I wouldnt want LD to be in charge of anyone.

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Rod

-don`t smoke-

[lung disease, non fatal]

That was funny though.

Your a hoot.

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Honestly

July 7th, 2012
12:58 pm

We need a SG ans SF. We should go with the combo of C.J. Miles at SF and either Courtney Lee or O.J. Mayo at SG

I am not fooled. You must be that IDIOT “WHIPLASH” with ideas like this…Child please!!!

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meant ‘Anything else’…

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Chill It’s just for a year. IF we get Dwight next summer, Smoove can move to SF and those guys can come off the bench if they choose to stay in ATL.

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I’d still like to see the hawks sign Camby he may be a little past his prime and provide no offense but he can still rebound and block shots

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I’m on board with Camby too. He led the league in rebounds per 48 minutes last year.

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I also like JR Smith on a 2 year deal only. Hope the GM will give him a look.

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JR is a great player but has a bad attitude. Im not sure if ferry would go for that

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A bench of Janero Pargo, JR Smith, Anthony Randolph, Ivan Johnson, Zsa Zsa, Jordan Williams, Anthony Morrow, Jeff Teague and John Jenkins, not a bad group for 2012-2013.

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Whiplash

July 7th, 2012
1:24 pm
JJ was a great addition to this team and did serve his time here with out issue. I thank him for his service and wish him will. he was and is a star.

This is further “PROOF” that you know Absolutely Nothing about Basketball. Joe Johnson is an OVERHYPED and OVERPAID Scrub, Probably much in the same way you are in whatever you do,
“Wal-mart Greeter or whatever”

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Joe Johnson is an OVERHYPED and OVERPAID Scrub, Who could argue that hes overpaid?

Scrub? I suggest you put the mirror down.

Obviously the Brooklyn Nets thought enough of JJ to go get him and feel he is a key part to an attempt at a championship run, regardless of his contract amount.

Let me guess…even your wife, ( my sympathy to the woman) doesn’t ask you for advice.

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Joe is overpaid, but he is not a scrub. that is ludicrous. I bet by mid-season of 2012-2013 most of you are going to wish we had JJ back.

don’t get me wrong I am glad he was traded, but if we don’t get a Dwight Howard and/or Chris Paul type player this will be a bad trade for the Hawks.

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Looks like Farmer is headed to Turkey

http://www.sportando.net/eng/europe/turkey/40688/anadolu-efes-istanbul-in-advanced-talks-with-jordan-farmar.html

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“But the more pressing concern for the Hawks is signing a small forward after they agreed to trade away Marvin Williams and Joe Johnson” – mc

“The Hawks are interested in free agent forward Anthony Randolph” – mc

“The Hawks are interested in Rashard Lewis and Courtney Lee. They’ve also reportedly inquired about O.J. Mayo” – mc

“The Hawks can offer a contract that starts as high as the non-taxpayer mid-level exception maximum of $5 million” – mc

In retrospect, let’s be clear, removing ourselves from JJ jaw-breaking contract has been unanimous. However, Marvin’s two year remaining contract totaling 16M was not near as toxic with JJ contract removed. Yes his production was marginal given his expectation but if Danny’s replacement wing isn’t matching Marvin total output than this move might have been premature. Believe it or not, in this aggressive market, replacing Marvin overall production may not be so easy. If Danny for example negotiates a 3 yr mid-level deal with the wing replacement player, which will equal Marvin current contract value, expectation must be he (at least) matches Marvin production. Of the wing players the Hawks are pursuing, only OJ Mayo and Rashard Lewis would be considered a scoring upgrade and none of these prospects will be a rebounding upgrade; actually a rebounding downgrade. D Harris might be a slight scoring upgrade from Kirk but at the expense of rebounding drop-off which still may result in game losses. So D Harris impact may not be realized. Furthermore OJ Mayo at 6’-4” is a SG and not SF so why is he even on the list.

If Danny must take a wing downgrade, at least pay less than 16M total dollars. Time will tell if this move pans out. The current perception is Danny angling to participate in the D12 sweepstake so Marvin’s 16M contract would be an accomplishment since cap relief would be the apparent goal. However, if Danny loses-out on D12, his gamble may net him the shorter-end of this part of the stick.

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Joe Johnson is a scrub, but it can be argued about where he stands as far as Shooting Guards as of right now.

We know surely D-wade and Kobe is in front of

@ Steve A Smith

Durant and Paul Pierce play Small Forward that’s their primary position.

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Glad that other Bloggers can see what Joe Johnson truely meant to the Atlanta Hawks Organization.
I am pleased to see him go. And Marvin “no starvin” Williams as well. Danny Ferry played in the National Basketball Association and could truely assess these SCRUBS for what their true value
“was” and “is.” May God Bless Danny Ferry for his Courage..

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steven a. smith,

You left off Scott as well.

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“It was his role to talk those shots and hit or miss thats what he was here for.”

$18M just to talk about shots? Good gig if you can get it.

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Why? So we can stay in mediocrity??

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Ray Allen and Monte Ellis are not better than Joe Johnson. Durant and Pierce are forwards and Harden is close, but not yet better than Joe overall. Harden is more explosive, but Joe has game too and more experience so I give him the edge. And of course, all of this is in my humble opinion.

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Joe is definitely one of the better SGs’ in the league.

The problem is simple though. Joe’s been ‘the man’ on this team since he arrived. When he did arrive, he was surrounded by a bunch of young guys who were always looking to him to get things done. The offense ran through him.

Over the years, we never really saw any evolution in our offensive philsophy. We were still forcefeeding Joe. Even last season when it became increasingly evident that perhaps Josh was the best player/best option on this team, we were still running things through Joe.

The reason being, this team developed habits, and it’s been extremely difficult to stem these habits.

Now with Joe out of the picture, it’ll allow us to move in a different direction as far as our offensive philosophy is concerned. Guys like Josh and Al will be the focal points in the offense. As already mentioned, Joe’s not really a #1 guy, he’d fit better in a situation where he could be the robin to some other guy’s batman.

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“to add what did Paul Peirce do after Antwain Walker left and before he had two sure fire Hall of famers (KG and Allen) as team mates” – myrak43

I’m no PP fan (though I respect his talent), but the year after Antoine, he put up 23.0 ppg, 6.5 reb, and 5.1 ast. So don’t act like he had to have help to produce.

Has any Hawk since Nique had a season that good?

Sure he didn’t have enough help to go far until 07-08, but don’t detract from what he did pretty much single-handedly from 03-07. More than anyone on our roster during that time.

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@toney,

Do you know when LA got Steve Nash they traded away any draft picks with that and if they get Dwight they need to send more draft picks. So Josh isnt going to LA, we are that stupid.

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The problem wasnt really JJ the player, it was those 120 million bones he was getting. And of course he’s a better all around player than Monte, the old Ray Allen, etc……, but theyre not cashing checks like that.

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“Over the years, we never really saw any evolution in our offensive philsophy. We were still forcefeeding Joe. Even last season when it became increasingly evident that perhaps Josh was the best player/best option on this team, we were still running things through Joe. ”

Some of that is due to the fact that LD would draw up a play on the sidelines, and when they got back on the floor, they did what they always do. Maybe, the defense was different, and they went to their comfort zone. Maybe some of the guys (Josh) are going to do what they want to do.

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“think about that. what could JJ have done in Atlanta if he had two sure fire first ballot hall of famers as teammates?”

Or Josh or Al, for that matter. But they weren’t the ones being paid as “the man”.

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Do we still have the rights to Cenk Akyol? LOL .~

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LD: You still here? You need to hurry up and trade Josh so you can leave. You been riding Josh’s jock for far too long. As soon as DF finds the right combo and all is said and done-let’s see if they stick a fork in you, too!

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oh and that one complete player has been JJ
]

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The right choice would be to make a serious offer for Dwight Howard. The Hawks will never get to the NBA Finals or win a championship because they are too cheap and don’t want to spend money. My suggestion, make the trade for Dwight Howard and then offer him a big multi-year deal so he can be in Atlanta long term, but the Hawks won’t do it because it’s too much like right! SMDH

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And I didnt say chasing checks, I said cashing checks.

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I hope Danny can pull off a rim rocker or this team will be irrelevant very soon just like that dirty bird team a couple of blocks away…

Would be no news there….

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terrell my friend. i didn’t say I want Joe back. I said i like the trade. what i did say is if we cannot get a super star type player we will miss joe. and as far as cashing checks. what is wrong with that.

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[avg[per season] if anyone is counting.^^^^^^

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Also, the ownership when over the salary cap, NEVER used the MLE or the Bi-Annual exception on better players, because that would take them well into the Luxury Tax. But that’s part of the deal sometimes, when you want to advance further in the playoffs.

The ASG did a good job in staying under the tax. But they were never committed enough that another decent player added to the team would help this current squad.

And they’re still not going to do it this year, even when they are under the Salary Cap ( which I honestly don’t blame them this year ).

It is what it is. When you let your best player go, and don’t adequately replace his production, you get what you get.

Let’s hope John Jenkins is MUCH BETTER than advertised.

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“The Hawks simply could’ve chosen to swap out pieces of the Core for players close or above their caliber.” – northcyde

So do you not think that Devin Harris is close to or above Marvin’s caliber?

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My plan was simple:

- Trade Josh Smith + Marvin Williams for Pau Gasol + another Laker player to make the numbers work ( maybe PF Josh McRoberts who has a 3.1 mill expiring deal this year )

- Based on the draft picks, this would be the Hawks so far

PG: Teague
G: Jenkins
F: Johnson
PF: Horford – Ivan – Scott – McRoberts
C: Gasol – Zaza

At this point, you’d have 9 players under contract at around 63 m. Add 4 players

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All and Gasol are redundant…Too soft up the middle..

Keep Josh and trade All for Gasol..Obviously dress it up so the Lakers will bite?

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That’s 9 players at 64 million.

Hawks could’ve done one of two things:

- add 4 more cheap players to round out the bench, using the 6.5 mill or so left before they’d reach the Luxury Tax

or

- use the MLE and the Bi-Annual to bring in 2 potential rotational players, then stock the team with cheap talent. Going this route may put the Hawks 1 or 2 million over the Tax. And they would be “going for it” for one year ( at least going for it as well as we could )

But let’s say that by using the full MLE, we got

- OJ Mayo

And by using the Bi-Annual, we got

- Keyon Dooling

And with the 2 remaining spots, we focused on few guys who could play SF and/or a combo guard. Let’s say we go with two vets and 1 young guy:

- Matt Barnes ( vet minimum )
- Damien Wilkins ( vet minimum )
- Jeremy Hazell ( rookie minimum – combo guard )

This would be your Hawks team for 2012 – 13

PG: Teague – Dooling
G: Mayo – Jenkins – Hazell
F: Johnson – Barnes – Wilkins
PF: Horford – Ivan – Scott – McRoberts
C: Gasol – Zaza

Main Rotation would be:

Starters

PG – Teague
G – Johnson ( who would also play a lot of SF )
F – Barnes ( would start but play limited minutes )
PF – Horford
C – Gasol

Bench

6th man – Mayo ( G )
7th man – Zaza ( C )
8th man – Ivan ( F )
9th man – Dooling ( PG )
10th man – Jenkins ( G )

That’s probably about a 73 million dollar team for one year. Hawks could even execute a buyout of McRoberts, to reduce that tax bill. That would be as much of a commitment that I could see the ASG making for a team like this. See if they could get it done for one year. See if the team was balanced out, if they would be better.

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I would be very surprised if Danny Ferry is interested in having Dwight Howard on his team, considering the insane amount of money his next contract is going to require (he ALREADY gets 19 mil a year) AND his bad attitude. He’s just not worth what he’s going to get paid and Ferry has stated that he wants to have a value based team. Just like the Spurs where you spend money but you make sure that you spend it wisely so that you’re rarely regretting contracts down the road.

And I think the same can be said for Josh. I’m expecting them to announce that they’ve traded Josh for several draft picks any day now.

Oh, and anybody wanting Gasol is out of their mind. The guy is 32 and has 2 years left at 19 mil per year. He is not worth that kind of money at this point.

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Al’s contract has 4 years left at 12 mil each year. There’s A LOT of value in that deal. You can’t get his production at that kind of money very often. That’s why I think they have no intention of trading him away.

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“Oh, and anybody wanting Gasol is out of their mind. The guy is 32 and has 2 years left at 19 mil per year. He is not worth that kind of money at this point.”

There are a few intellectuals on this blog that want Gasol, you already know who they are Sir…Their opinions about the matter have been documented over the past several weeks now…

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Sautee is one of the wisest dudes on this blog..But he knows who to annoy and who not too? LMAO!!

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more like smart _____….LOL!

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“Instead, they did what people in their fan base wanted them to do . . get rid of JJ and Marvin, because those were the two most hated Hawks on the team.”

I am 100% sure the fan base’s wishes had absolutely no impact on the decision to trade Joe and Marvin. That decision was made because it was the right decision to give this team a chance to move forward. As long as Joe was getting paid 30% of this team’s total salary, it was going to be impossible for this team to improve.

It’s easy to look at the Nets and say our overpaid garbage is their overpaid treasure, when Joe is going there to be a complementary player to someone better than him. There is no realistic move the Hawks could have made to bring someone in here who is significantly better than Joe and would have allowed him to complement them. This includes the Gasol trade, since Gasol is no better than Joe and nowhere near the same caliber player as Deron at this point in his career.

The Hawks painted themselves in a corner by locking themselves into this core. Getting rid of Joe was a necessary first step.

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Sautee

July 7th, 2012
4:26 pm

“The Hawks simply could’ve chosen to swap out pieces of the Core for players close or above their caliber.” – northcyde

So do you not think that Devin Harris is close to or above Marvin’s caliber?

*******************

Devin Harris is above Marvin’s caliber. That was a damn good trade in my opinion. Here are the Hawks if we do that trade FIRST

PG – Teague
G – Harris
F – Johnson
PF – Smith
C – Horford

That’s a damn good 5 to roll with. Harris would be a lot better option than Jamal Crawford, because Harris can play both the 1 and the 2 effectively. We’d have a big time speed advantage with that lineup as well ( if you know who gave his defensive rebound to one of those 2 guards ).

Teams would be afraid to all out double JJ, because both Harris and Teague could get the ball and immediately attack the paint and either create for themselves, or create for Horford and Smith.

That Devin Harris trade would’ve been big time, if JJ wasn’t moved.

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‘A Day Late and A Dollar Short’

Nice Poster though?

Yea we seen this B4? Yes?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0toy0kh20E

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hey slim, I could link to Al dunkin’ on Duncan, but what’s the point? Every basketball player has been dunked on and most have dunked on somebody else. So what?

You didn’t answer my earlier question. Who had the most first place votes for 2011 NBA All-Defensive Team, Josh or Al?

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Agree with northcyde on us having a better team with Marvin for Harris trade and keeping JJ, I always thought as JJ skills declined he was better suited to play SF, but we had to get rid of JJ’s contract, even if it means we take a (hopefully) temporary step back on talent ..

Both trades were good trades by Ferry….

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Your almost seven feaking two? This can’t happen…Just can’t from your Allstar 4 or 5.. Soft? Yes?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2WVMxvwr7w

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and I too feel we would be in a better position to win if we would have kept JJ and had Harris to take some of the defensive pressure off of him….. but I still like the trade if we go after Howard.

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All that proves is that coaches respect Horford more than Josh. They hate Josh’s offense and begrudgingly vote him for anything. Nothing new.

But Josh Smith had the best defensive wins in the entire NBA last year. A testimony to defensive efficieny (points allowed per possession) No matter what the coaches voted.

I havent scrolled back to look what the actual argument is but citing coach’s pets awards is a horrible argument. Use actual empirical evidence if we;re talking about best defenders.

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pointguardslim

July 7th, 2012
5:23 pm

If Josh Smith is the power forward help off him just enough as to stop penetration AND contest Smith’s jumpers. Ride his hip if he drives.

How many more seasons will Hawks play Josh Smith as their stretch 4?

***************

You’ve watched Josh Smith since he’s come into the league. You honestly think that if he played the 3, that his post up possessions would increase to the point that he’d be known as that kind of player, rather than a player that shot a lot of jumpers?

Will we see a Josh Smith in which 50% of his shots come via cuts and post ups at the basket? Or will we continue to see a guy who will take over 20% of his shots via spot up?

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This team gets swept in the playoffs by at some where between 4 – 6 teams

PG: Teague
G: Jenkins
F: Johnson
PF: Horford – Ivan – Scott – McRoberts
C: Gasol – Zaza

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Josh and Al are both great values in their current contracts. Problem is that Josh’s contract only has a year left and then he’s going to get PAID. At that point, I’m not so sure that he’ll be a great value anymore.

You can win without a true center as long as you have a good point guard (or have Dwayne Wade and Lebron James). So if we go the route of resigning Josh, we will HAVE to get a high caliber point guard (we obviously wouldn’t get a center b/c Josh isn’t a full-time small forward).

But I think we trade Josh and stock up on some picks. We’ve got Al for at least 4 more years and can build a young team around him.

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Myrak 43.. I think Houston would do Royce White for Devin Harris/Draft pick, They need a PG to since Lowry is gone. We would have to take another player to make the numbers work but doable.

Grandad: “Hot Toddy” “Case of Vertigo” Lol Whaaaa? – “Say Jack” “Jive Turkey” “Sucka” and “Disco” are all remnents of the past itz 2012…..Come to the other side.
You said they couldnt be cornerstones and I disagree….

Stephen A Smith… So u want to start Anthony Randolph over Josh Smith i see. SMH

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If Possible bring Jamison and Defino in, they could help the Hawks. I still like former hawk J Childress if we can get him back, he’s a smart basketball player and can play and defend 3 positions PG,SG and Small Forward. J Chidress also runs the open court great and will finish at the rack. Great all around team player.

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This team may not make the playoffs though

PG – Teague
G – Harris
F – Smith
PF – Horford
C – Zaza

I hope they do though. Because if they don’t, that would be a big time indictment on Smith as a guy to build around. Playing him at SF would be a disaster, if he’s also leading the Hawks in shots.

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High-sider is experiencing major technical difficulties.

Jamal Crawford to the Clippers and Joe Johnson to the Nets equals major disaster for the Hawks. The Hawks have to “pure” scorers. Thanks, Danny boy.

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Is a Horford defender a Horford apologist? or Is an Horford apologist a horford defender? When apologizing or defending Al is it necessary to attack hawks 2012 MVP Josh Smith in order to validate the poor performances from Al?

If the Josh and/or Al supporters cant get along on this blog what do you thing is going on in the team that lead MC to write that there was internal strife in the locker room?

This will be a better team when Al is shipped back to Florida. But of course this was a better team when Al was out loafing last year.

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*if the Josh and/or Al supporters cant get along on this blog what do you think is going on with the team

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“My brother isnt soft he more finesse”….Marc Gasol

Blake Griffin ate that mans lunch… Bynums facial expression is priceless.

MACALAEB!!!!!!……….

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[...] Atlanta Hawks ← An Atlanta charter school closes. Short funds, students. Cancel Reply [...]

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Im tired of defending Al. Let some body else do it. Wheres Tito?

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Al and Josh get along just fine. Some of their supporters (on both sides) are stupid enough to believe that you must despise one to like the other. This is of course nonsense. Many of us not only like both players, but believe they could thrive together with the right coach and a system set up to play to their strengths.

For example, a high-low set. Both Josh and Al are good passers. At Florida, Al was very effective lobbing to Noah in a high-low set. But this staff has never tried to play to Josh’s or Al’s strengths on offense. Maybe with the current makeup of the team (if it stays somewhat this way) will lead to the coaching staff actually trying to maximize what Josh and Al are best at.

T-s, just so you will know, I brought up Al’s votes in the All-NBA defensive team NOT to denigrate Josh in any way, but to point out that the coaches of the league thought about equally of their defensive efforts for that year (2011), which is a pat on the back for Al to be there with Josh in the voting. You can disagree, but that’s how I was thinking. FYI.

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I agree that Al was voted by the coaches to be on a list that Josh had made the 1st team on. In fact when Josh was recognize for being the phenomenal talent and defender that he is only D12 was a head of him. A year later Al was given an consolation of an honorable mention. But as for defense Al is not in the same Class as Josh. and no, I dont think those to coexist well although Josh has be accommodating to Al, there is not the same unity of the players when Al is there mouthing off to the press about playing power forward or telling his dad to be his mouth piece to lobby to play center. I also think it angers Josh and the other teammate when Al takes this indifferent attitude about protecting the rim. Al’s lack of defense was the main reason Woodson ran so many switches to help Al out.I got tired of seeing Al out on the perimeter trying to be Al Notwiski. That hurt the hawks.

We do agree on one thing. If 6′ 10 1/4 ” 260lb monster of a man Al Horford would realize that his size is average for the posting and beast up to the position the Hawks would have had better playoff runs. But Al Will never accept the role of rim defender.

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They have to denigrate Al with this nonsense….

They don’t have FACTS on their side(Points, rebounds or accolades) or even the coaches in the NBA… They have nonsense.

Without logic and truth, there is no discussion

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“And I hope he and Horford don’t clash to the point where they’re both seeking control of the team ( which I see coming ).

Josh will not be content being the defensive leader of the team. He wants to be the offensive and defensive leader, even if Horford and possibly even Teague will end up being better offensive players.”

You are not alone in that opinion based on what I continue to read on this blog. Somehow everyone else has these deep psychological insights into Josh and Al’s thinking. I guess they must all go hang out with them in their spare time. Since I have met neither one of them, I can’t weigh in on what will make Josh and Al content or happy or whatever.

“My main point is that the Hawks had options”

Not championship options. As long as they kept Joe, any options they had were limited to treading water at their first- or second-round level.

That is an indictment of Joe’s contract, not Joe the player. There wasn’t any realistic way for them to bring in a superior teammate for him to complement. There certainly wasn’t a way for them to team him with both a superior player (like Deron) and other solid starters (like Gerald Wallace and Brook Lopez).

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How many times do we have to hear the same stuff about Al Horford from the same guy with the 200 different names? Ok, we get it, you dont like Al Horford. Point taken,

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“It looks likes Al lost weight. To play that PF spot. 240 lbs?”

It is impossible for Al to lose weight for the simple reason, that would require hard work and Al is allergic to that.

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“I agree that Al was voted by the coaches to be on a list that Josh had made the 1st team on.”

Actually, neither of them were on the first team in 2011, the year I referred to. Or even on the second team. but in the “others receiving votes” section. Al and Josh are listed with seven votes each. Al had 3 first team votes and Josh had one. I thought Josh should have been higher, but that’s how the coaches saw it. I would have voted Josh to the first team myself.

http://www.examiner.com/article/2011-all-defensive-team-announced

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For blog monster troubles, please consult this comment:

http://blogs.ajc.com/hawks/2012/07/03/atlanta-hawks-what-about-dwight/?cp=12#comment-320998

and get yourself Lazarus Form Recovery so you don’t have to type your entire post again.

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. In fact when Josh was recognize for being the phenomenal talent and defender that he is only D12 was a head of him.

Josh Smith became the first Hawk since 1998-99 (Dikembe Mutombo and Mookie Blaylock) and eighth player in Atlanta team history to earn All-Defensive team honors. He was named to the second team.

The second team nomination is somewhat of a shock, considering the Smith finished second in the Defensive Player of the Year Award voting on April 20.

Nevertheless, Smith had an outstanding season in which he became the youngest player in NBA history to reach 1,000 career blocks, while also reaching the 500 career steals mark.

Smith, whose game is underappreciated in many circles, was the only player in the league to average at least 15 points, 8 rebounds and 4 assists per game.

At 6’9, Smith was the tallest player in the top 12 in steals and the shortest in the top 12 in blocks.

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Sautee

July 7th, 2012
6:52 pm

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I honestly think some of yall need to get laid…just sayin

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ZCautee – shut up.

Northcyde. – I had an epic tome written up.

But keep it simple – Josh Smith at the PF allows Smith to get a jumper at any time. To Coach Larry Drew, who is anemic to invention, this a Goldmine.

But what he doesnt know or choose to ignore is that he’s overmining. Josh is 1.01 points per possesion. Those are empty points. Volume shooting.

Lets move Josh Smith to the wing.

in lieu of Marvin Williams on the fast break you get Josh Smith.
In lieu of Smith playing the trailer bringing the ball up you get Horford and Smith leaking out. Double bonus.

On offense Smith has the offensive board advantage. Let him get points there.
On offense (Drew hates this) Smith cannot take his man off defense so the only alternative in a big lineup is letting Smith post up or Teague penetrate or Horford create.

Drew hates this because Smith is “clumsy” in the post according to ajc report.
Now with Zaza, Horford, Smith then how many screeners and rebounders is that? Let Teague create. Let Morrow and Horford be the kick out shooters.

Its easier to show with video.
Basketball is an either or proposition. Smith is a weak back 2 basket PF – ie he can’t post up PFs – Haslem, Lavoy Allen, and Troy Murphy so he shoots jumpers.
As a wing Smith knows he cant cross over and step back on Kobe Bryant so he posts him up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIepUUANijo&feature=plcp

The problem isn’t the type of shots Smith will get (fast breaks, post ups, cuts, boards) LD the panic artist is skeptical if he can’t win with volume.

To which I counter instead of a wing version of Dwight Howard he’s turning Josh Smith into Antoine Walker. LD’s addiction to Volume Shooting instead of capitalizing on offensive boards and giving Teague a bigger lineup to work with is a travesty.

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I apologize to ZCautee for saying shut up. It was in response for saying Horford isn’t a hardworker.

The guy is a very hard working basketball player. I know Atlanteans are mad that he is getting beat up art center but Come on.

Lets stop scapegoating and put Smith and Al at their most balanced efficient positions. SF and PF.
But I apologize for “shut up”. That was immature of me.

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Steven A Smith sounds about as dumb as the real Steven A Smith….

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pointguardslim I can imagine it has to be frustrating and agonizing having to defend our 6′10″ center, so much so that you resort to anger. Josh is a much better power forward than Al. Al is a much better center then Josh. It doesnt anger me that you are wrong and misguided. Im not going to tell you to get off my dick. Please dont get on it.

A year from now Al will be back in Florida and we will be looking for the trim pieces around Josh and D12. and then perhaps your anger will have sub sided.

Mean while. I accept your apology. Thanks for manning up and offering it.

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donte080, What can you bring to the table. Enlighten us please.

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“It takes a trained eyed to see that”…

LOL…based on some of your posts I’ve read, you think a little too highly of yourself, my man….

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re: donte, what can you bring to the table?

‘The Mass’ sounds about as dumb as Steven A Smith?

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“LOL…based on some of your posts I’ve read, you think a little too highly of yourself, my man….”

Look in your mirror Sir.. Ditto

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“‘The Mass’ sounds about as dumb as Steven A Smith?” –donte080–

quote of the day..dam

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Slimjr

July 7th, 2012
7:29 pm

Thanks for the support.

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“Josh will not be content being the defensive leader of the team. He wants to be the offensive and defensive leader, even if Horford and possibly even Teague will end up being better offensive players.”

I hope Josh is the leader. Al’s post up game is weak so Josh needs to play inside out, take his man inside then kick it out to the best mid-range shooter in the NBA or to a cutting Teague. Then, Josh needs to use his passing skills as he did at the end of the BOS series to set up Horford inside. He needs to let the point guard be the point guards and cut down on his jumpers.

Was Josh’s rivalry issues mostly with Joe, since he was paid more but was a lesser player than Josh? Since he no longer has to compete with Joe for most shot attempts on the team, will he focus on more efficient offense?

Or, at the end of the BOS series, when he got a tech trying to check into the game, and quit on a defensive possession to argue with the refs, did he do this because Al was outshining him? With Joe gone, must Ferry now trade Al as well for Josh to feel respected and give consistent effort? Will Josh “lead” by example or will he “lead” by leading the NBA in long two pointers (attempted, not made) this year? Only Kobe had him beat in attempts last year.

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pointguardslim

July 7th, 2012
7:05 pm

ZCautee – shut up.

Northcyde. – I had an epic tome written up.

But keep it simple – Josh Smith at the PF allows Smith to get a jumper at any time. To Coach Larry Drew, who is anemic to invention, this a Goldmine.

But what he doesnt know or choose to ignore is that he’s overmining. Josh is 1.01 points per possesion. Those are empty points. Volume shooting.

Lets move Josh Smith to the wing.

in lieu of Marvin Williams on the fast break you get Josh Smith.
In lieu of Smith playing the trailer bringing the ball up you get Horford and Smith leaking out. Double bonus.

On offense Smith has the offensive board advantage. Let him get points there.
On offense (Drew hates this) Smith cannot take his man off defense so the only alternative in a big lineup is letting Smith post up or Teague penetrate or Horford create.

Drew hates this because Smith is “clumsy” in the post according to ajc report.
Now with Zaza, Horford, Smith then how many screeners and rebounders is that? Let Teague create. Let Morrow and Horford be the kick out shooters.

Its easier to show with video.
Basketball is an either or proposition. Smith is a weak back 2 basket PF – ie he can’t post up PFs – Haslem, Lavoy Allen, and Troy Murphy so he shoots jumpers.
As a wing Smith knows he cant cross over and step back on Kobe Bryant so he posts him up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIepUUANijo&feature=plcp

The problem isn’t the type of shots Smith will get (fast breaks, post ups, cuts, boards) LD the panic artist is skeptical if he can’t win with volume.

To which I counter instead of a wing version of Dwight Howard he’s turning Josh Smith into Antoine Walker. LD’s addiction to Volume Shooting instead of capitalizing on offensive boards and giving Teague a bigger lineup to work with is a travesty.

*****************************

- I agree that Drew is turning Josh into Antoine Walker. 1,000+ jumpers from 16+ feet in the 2 years that Drew has been coach, is unacceptable.

- I will concede that if Smith played the SF, that probably means less defensive rebounds and more opportunities for him to leak out and score in transition. The problem though, is that he’s pulled away from the lane to get those defensive rebounds and/or disrupt shots. While Horford will contest a driving shot, Zaza isn’t contesting anything. So what we’d gain with Josh in transition, may actually be a detriment on the defensive end.

- I also agree that because he can’t effectively post up decent defending PFs, he’ll settle for the jumper. But he can use his speed off the dribble and to get to the rim more times than not. Work from the high post and take people off the dribble. But he has to be close enough to the rim for this to be effective. He needs to be around the 15 foot range. That way, if they back off of him, he’s basically shooting a standstill free throw, instead of a standstill 20 footer. If they crowd him, go past them.

- I also agree that he needs to score more off of offensive rebounds, ala Shawn Marion in his prime. But you’re talking about a dude whose normally around a 7% offensive rebound percentage. In 2010, when Woody was trying to turn him into more of an interior player, that percentage was 9%.

I pretty much agree with you in the WAY Smith needs to be used. The problem is that Smith doesn’t want to be used like that. Because using him like that turns him into a complimentary option, not the primary option ( unless he becomes a very good post up SF ).

I just think he could play that way more as the PF. He did it in 2010, but Drew has an offense designed for him to take as many jumpers as he likes.

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donte080

July 7th, 2012
7:55 pm

“No other way to say it, Marvin was a disaster.”

No actually Marvin was soild…14 ppg ….he simply did not get the shot attempts and when he did get the touches he delivered….Paul and Williams have never won anything…

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“No actually Marvin was soild”

I didn’t think he was that dirty.

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Sounds great Nets bowing out of the D12 sweepstakes Orlando GM was smart trade Howard for Horford and 2 picks that’s pretty good trade IMO i know he does not want trade in the division but better to get something than letting him walk .

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LOL, Najeh, you beat me to it.

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If we don’t make a major trade…

The truth about each player will be revealed….

Josh supporters think he does NO WRONG and that giving credit to any other players is a “dis” to him.

He(Josh) wasn’t a better offensive player than Joe(He was constantly left OPEN) and he(Josh) was seldom doubled teamed. You DOUBLE team the BEST offensive players and make the rest of the team beat you…. That wasn’t Josh.

Josh main defensive contributions were his shot blocking ability… Other than shot blocking, I don’t remember any game that he shut a players down….But I do remember Bass, Maxiell and Bonner having career games.

I also remember the years Joe had to guard PG’s…. Ask Paul Pierce or DWade about JJ’s defense.

I don’t have any problem with Josh but the disrespect of JJ(6 time Allstar) and AL to on this blog is crazy. I believe that our 6 time Allstar is the best player on our team vs a players who have never made it….but I am the crazy one???

We will miss JJ this year- 10-15 games worse.

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Rufus1

July 7th, 2012
8:56 pm

If we don’t make a major trade…

The truth about each player will be revealed

If we sign JR Smith or OJ Mayo, you will never know “Average Joe” even played for “your Atlanta Hawks”

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haha @ JR Smith as a starter.

Really?

I thought folks said that finding a SG when JJ left would be easy.

As bad as JJ shot in the playoffs vs Boston, here were JR Smith’s playoff numbers vs the Heat

35 minutes a game

12.2 pts
2.6 rebs
2.2 asst

32% FG
18% 3FG ( 5 – 28 shooting )

Surely we can find a more efficient replacement than that, even if he doesn’t give us the explosive production.

Steven A. . . . I thought you knew basketball? Even the REAL Steven A. wouldn’t co-sign that move.

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Josh’s main defensive contribution is being able to move his feet and get into position, his athleticism allows him to guard multiple positions seamlessly.

His shotblocking only accounts for 1-2 shots. Its his ability to cover ground quickly and switch that is what helped him be the #1 defensive Wins accumulated in the NBA’s shortened season.

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steven a smith is super trolling. Trading Smith to the Lakers. Signing JR Smith to a big deal?

keep options open for Dwight OR sign JR Smith to be the 7th shooting guard on the team.

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steven a smith’s clone, Josh is not going anywhere and by the way, Josh was actually the best player on the team last year.

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Slimjr . . you keep saying that, without looking at the other side. Both Al and Gasol are a load to guard on the offensive end. You act like these are two scrub players. They’re not. They represent 2 of the best mid-range shooting big men in the game, along with two of the best rebounding big men in the game.

A lot of you can keep throwing those labels of “soft” around all you want. The fact is that a Gasol – Horford frontline would’ve been a load for teams to handle. Those two are All-Star caliber big men.

In Game 6 in Boston, Josh went 1 – 8 FG in the 2nd half . . JJ goes scoreless in the 4th quarter . . but Al scores 11 points on 5 – 6 FG in the 4th quarter. He did everything but make the critical FT at the very end of the game. The other two guys didn’t do crap.

Please.

Well, now that’s what I call inconvenient fact.

And y’all quit pickin’ on slimjr . Someone who can spell “koolaid” but not “Einstein” in his rebuttals is clearly at a disadvantage….LOL….

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Josh Smith is like Andruw Jones was for the Braves. Would not try to go the other way and lay off the breaking balls. Defensively, his impact on the game was impeccable.

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“His shotblocking only accounts for 1-2 shots. Its his ability to cover ground quickly and switch that is what helped him be the #1 defensive Wins accumulated in the NBA’s shortened season.”-pointguardslim

So what did he do this year that he didn’t in the previous 8 years…. Oh yeah, Jeff Teague wasn’t playing. Do You think it is Just a coincidence?

You Josh fanatics should end all you posts with “All praise due to Josh”, since he is the greatest non-Allstar to ever live and without him we would only win 13 games.

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Big Ray,

Everybody knows Josh’s 1-8 is due to shot selection. The coaches need to bring him out that bad habit. Now if he refuses that guidance, then I say he should be put up on the trading block. But Smith proved last season that he is capable of big totals (20 points, 10 rebounds) over a sustained period. Remember when Horford and Joe were hurt? Josh was getting those numbers. Also, remember: Joe got a lot of his totals because of the high number of minutes he played. Was always top 5 in minutes played.

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No actually Marvin was soild…14 ppg ….he simply did not get the shot attempts and when he did get the touches he delivered….Paul and Williams have never won anything…

2) Paul and Williams have not won anything….except playoff games in the NBA.

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The problem I have with Josh haters, is you treat Josh as if he was the number 2 pick like Marvin. Josh was the 17th overall pick. Yes Josh makes mistakes and takes bad shots. The thing I like is the dude has emotion and nuts to make a play. Understand, having a defensive presence like that is huge. You can tell the difference when he’s out of the game. Teams start going to the hole at will. Horford is too one-dimensional. Those Josh haters, you may get your wish, but don’t say I didn’t warn you when dudes are going to the rack at will on us.

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All Horford has is that pick and slip set shot jumper. He has no post game. If he develops a post game, he will be deadly.

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tjhook ,

Totally agreed. I said on the last blog that I felt the Bulls had not shot at shutting Josh down in the playoffs…but he shut HIMSELF down, which is generally the case. Dude can play as good or as bad as he wants. Who can stop him when he’s on his game? He can score, he can run, he can finish…and damn if he can’t pass!

I wish we had a coach who could help bring him out of his bad habits. But that dude AIN’T Larry Drew. That’s what I know. I got nothin’ but love for Josh…which makes it all the harder to deal with his self-induced mishaps.

I just don’t know if he’ll ever fully get it together. He’s capable of SO much. At some point though, it’s on him. That point is now.

That said, I still think LD doesn’t help him or anybody else on this team. Dude needs to be back on somebody’s bench, seated to the left of a REAL head coach, holding his clipboard.

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