Atlanta Hawks: The next step
No, there is nothing new to report on the Hawks and Dwight Howard. As far as I know, nothing has changed since what I wrote two days ago. If I hear anything different, I promise I won’t keep it to myself.
With that out of the way, on to some housekeeping . . . .
Once the trades become official on July 11, and after the Hawks compete an expected buy out of Jordan Farmar, they will have nine players under contract. Draft picks John Jenkins and Mike Scott will make it 11 once they sign their deals. Ivan Johnson will make it 12 if he signs his qualifying offer.
Here are the cap salaries for those 12 players (in millions):
Josh Smith: $13.2
Al Horford: $12.0
Devin Harris: $8.5
Zaza Pachulia: $5.2
Anthony Morrow: $4.0
Johan Petro: $3.5
Jeff Teague: $2.4
Jordan Farmar: $1.5*
John Jenkins: $1.2
Ivan Johnson: $.96+
DeShawn Stevenson: $.852.33^
Jordan Williams: $.76
Mike Scott: $.40
Total: $50.4755.95
*Amount of buyout.
^Cap charge for minimum-salaried veteran with three or more seasons.
(Update: Luke Adams of HoopsRumors.com notes that Chad Ford reports Stevenson’s first-year salary as $2.33 million, not the minimum. And reader Tyler Cromey emailed to point out I left Morrow off the salary list.)
+Amount of qualifying offer extended by Hawks.
According to Larry Coon, the salary-cap level is expected to remain at about $58 million for 2012-13. But that $7.5 2 million or so in cap space is theoretical for the Hawks.
They still would have about $18 million in cap holds because of their free agents. Those holds won’t be released until those players sign a new contract or the Hawks renounce them. Even if the Hawks clear all of those cap holds, they would take a roster charge of $400,000 for having less than 12 players on the roster following Farmar’s buyout.
All of that is a long way of getting to this bottom line: The Hawks can clear up to a maximum of roughly $7.0 1.5 million in cap space. They can then sign free agents using that space and/or the “room” mid-level exception that allows a two-year contract starting at $2.5 million. So that means, theoretically, the Hawks could spend up to about $9.5 8 million on anywhere from two (to get to the roster minimum of 13) to four players (to carry the maximum 15).
(Update: Because their cap space would be less than the amount of their exceptions, the Hawks would be limited to using all or part of the $5 million non-taxpayer mid-level exception; all or part of the $1.96 bi-annual exception; and minimum-salary exceptions to sign from two [to get to the roster minimum of 13] to four [to carry the maximum 15] players.)
(If any of my calculations appear off, blog people, shoot me an email: mcunningham at ajc.com.)
After the Hawks made trades that set them up to have maximum flexibility to make moves in the long term, they still believe they can remain competitive in the short term. It’s not hard to think they can do so with the remaining core of Smith, Horford, Teague, Pachulia plus new additions Morrow and Jenkins.
Once the trades are completed and Farmar is bought out, Atlanta’s depth chart will look something like this (just for example, so please save your outrage if you disagree):
PG: Jeff Teague/Devin Harris
SG: Anthony Morrow/John Jenkins/Devin Harris/DeShawn Stevenson
SF: Josh Smith/Anthony Morrow/DeShawn Stevenson
PF: Josh Smith/Ivan Johnson/Jordan Williams/Mike Scott
C: Al Horford/Zaza Pachulia/Johan Petro
The Hawks could use a starting lineup with Zaza at center and Al and Josh shifting over–Larry Drew said he could envision that alignment even before the trades–but the Hawks clearly need a true wing. They could probably use another center, too, to guard against needing to use Petro or Johnson there for major minutes if Al or Zaza goes down.
I’d expect the Hawks will get serious about free agents once the market shakes out. They’ve expressed interest in Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis but obviously those players will see what the market may bear.
The Celtics already have offered Allen $12 million over two years and he’s set to pick from that offer, the Clippers and the Heat. Lewis says he’s seeking to play for a championship contender.
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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583 comments Add your comment
Slimjr
July 6th, 2012
4:07 pm
[delete] the 1st he^^^^^
Big Ray
July 6th, 2012
4:08 pm
Donte -Nobody said Bass was a better player than Horford -I asked if there was that big of a difference. The answer would be no. A better comparison would be David Lee -who i think is just as good if not slightly better than AL……..
Agreed. Completely.
Slimjr
July 6th, 2012
4:10 pm
Big Dog that was #15 on the Film in the middle who took a step back to allow Rose to Dunk his rebounded jumpshot..
Seen this B4 many times..
#15 is not Captain Kirk..Guess who?
Big Ray
July 6th, 2012
4:10 pm
SteveW ,
Say what you will….I’d bank more on Falcons than Hawks right now. But we shall see. Ferry at least has what it takes to lead from the front office in a way the Hawks have desperately needed for years.
But watch out for the Falcons. May not seem that way because it’s real easy to look at the roster and not see glamorous changes. But there’s more to it than this. Major change in performance coming really soon.
SteveW
July 6th, 2012
4:12 pm
KenS – I’ve read that Josh is recruiting D12 on some reports on the internet also – not going to google them now – gotta run – but they’re there.
SteveW
July 6th, 2012
4:14 pm
Big Ray – I was talking more if we got D12. I’m a big Falcons fan also.
Slimjr
July 6th, 2012
4:16 pm
SteveW, sorry to hear your a large Fal-con fan..
Did you know they have the same problem the Hawks have..Cant beat the winners either?
[4-10] last two years……zzzzzzzzzzz
Big Ray
July 6th, 2012
4:17 pm
Slimjr…..yep, you’re right.
Al never was a shotblocking, paint dominating presence. Not in college, not in the NBA. Where’s the news? BTW, seen Rose do that to a lot of teams.
Back to the point – Al is a PF, not a Center. He’s much better at body-ing up against guys who don’t have significant size advantages over him. Josh is the shotblocker.
But…if you want to see how they work best together, watch this video….Al bodies up on the bigger/stronger Dwight…allowing Smith to come from the weakside.
That’s what folks miss about these two players. Smith is a weak-side shotblocking menace. He isn’t at his best when playing head up against guys who are good at low-post games. He doesn’t weigh enough, isn’t strong enough. Al is a little heavier and stronger, and is better at this, but is doing it as a PF…NOT a Center, which is also why he can’t stop Dwight any day of the week….anyway, watch the video…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7XoQw1OxHI
Big Ray
July 6th, 2012
4:18 pm
SteveW,
Ha…well if we get Dwight, all my bets are off the table, LOL…
terrell
July 6th, 2012
4:18 pm
Wont work BIG DOG. Gotta move either Josh or Al if we get Dwight. That lineup looks similar to NY’s. No lanes for our guards to operate. Look what happened to Lyn when both Melo, and Stoudemire got healthy. He started looking like the guy who’d been cut a zillion times. Dont get me wrong, you can never have too many BIG bodies, I just dont think it’ll work when theyre all on the floor at the same time. Just my opinion of course. If we get D12, I’tll probably be more this anyway.
Teague/Morrow/Turk/Josh/Dwight. No way Dwight comes to Atlanta without a bad contract in the car with him.
THE IMMORTAL...I MUS WRITE
July 6th, 2012
4:18 pm
Whats good Big Ray?
Steve W that about sums it up
terrell
July 6th, 2012
4:19 pm
“more like this anyway”
Big Ray
July 6th, 2012
4:20 pm
slimjr ,
LOL….ur just a hater….but we love ya anyhow…and will make room for you on the bandwagon when the time comes…which will be soon.
Rod from College Park
July 6th, 2012
4:22 pm
“It amazes me just how much you give discredit to fans and players alike for the things that management, coaching, and ownership do. Marvin didn’t pick himself at #2 in 2005. An idiot with an afro did. Horford played his first 2-3 years in this league like a beast unleashed, with fewer shot attempts than Joe, Josh, and even Marvin (who turned down more attempts than most by passing the ball off).”
“Nope, lots more fun to just blame Marvin. That, and it doesn’t require a lot of thought.”
You got the wrong guy. I never supported Woody. Never blamed fans. Just like I don’t think Drew is the man for the job. Marvin on the other hand deserves all the blame he gets. He is a professional basketball player who should be able to knock down wide open shots. His game is worse now, than it was when he entered the league. That has nothing to do with Billy Knight.
” The rest of the time, Chicago left him in single coverage….just like Al.”
The difference is Josh is not an All star, Al is. All stars usually step up and lead their teams in the playoffs. Al did not. I specifically remember Jalen Rose being the only analyst who called Al out about not dominating his man in the playoffs. Al was voted an all star simply because he played center in the east with no other real centers, or ones that could stay healthy. The problem is Al wants to be a PF, and he is no where close to a top 10 PF. Josh is.
“Really? So what you’re saying is that we lost to the Bulls because Horford missed free throws and had turnovers in that game. Based on your continual comments about understanding of the game based on what level you played it….I conclude that this statement is an indicator that you got cut from your high school team….”
No. I’m saying we might have beat the Celtics this year. Reading is fundamental.
“Your statement about “all stars should not be shut down in single coverage” is inane. Al was never named an all-star because of his scoring, and you know it. But you’re right about his need to develop a low post game. Thing is, if he did, would it have mattered? The team won’t listen to the dingbat head coach, and even if they did, his schemes seem less than effective.”
I actually disagree. Al surely was not voted to the All star game for his defense. No way a guy voted to the all star game at the center or power forward position should not be able to dominate Ryan Anderson or Brandon Bass down low. Al should have been a mismatch for either of those guys one on one, but he was not so we lost. Chicago did what they were supposed to do. Double Jamal and Joe. Let Josh shoot jumpers, and close out on Al’s jumpshot. You really don’t even have to guard Marvin. Teague got his simply because his skill set was really unknown. Great coaching. I give credit where credit is due. But think about how that chicago series would change if you could throw the ball to Al in the post, and he could score at will. Changes everything.
Big Ray
July 6th, 2012
4:22 pm
I MUS ,
Just being me….I can talk trash on the blog, gotta keep it professional on the beat…LOL.
You still doing your thing up there in the ATL? I know ya are. Don’t ruin ALL the ladies, playa…well I’m married, so I guess it doesn’t matter to me, LOL
pointguardslim
July 6th, 2012
4:23 pm
“The flurry of action, after years of restraint from the Hawks, has also made a fast impression on Smith, sources said. Smith had been vocal for months about wanting to be dealt, but sources told ESPN.com that the swingman is excited about the direction Ferry has taken things in his brief time in charge.”
richbrave
July 6th, 2012
4:23 pm
HAWKS have some outside presence in JENKINS if he can get open. I guess a catch and shoot guy starting out, but supposedly the best shooter in the draft.
Slimjr
July 6th, 2012
4:23 pm
All at 6″10″ 260 is CENTER!!!!
HE DOES NOT HAVE POWER FORWARD SKILLS!!!!!!
HE has a one handed dribble..Cannot shoot a real jumpshot[technically its a set shot]! Cannot use Glass..Is stiff as a MOFO…Has no real post game what so ever. Has no up and under move..Cannot drop step.Cannot shoot off the dribble. Cannot shoot floaters.Cannot cross-over on his dribble drive..Cannot shoot a turn around jumpshot…This list is getting bigger….
richbrave
July 6th, 2012
4:24 pm
BIG RAY:
Good to see you still holding forth with the HAWKS.
pointguardslim
July 6th, 2012
4:29 pm
Josh Smith is a “top 10″ PF. But he’d be a top 5 SF.
James – Durant – Anthony – Smith – Pierce
Deng – Gay – Granger – Iguodala -
come on man. Am I missing anyone? Put this man’s name on the marquee I want Josh vs Lebron not Josh vs Bosh.
If he’s going to get dominated I want him at least blocking one of Lebron’s drives.
I dont want to see Bosh plopping jumpers all over him and posting him up and dunking on my best player.
I want Josh vs Deng, Rose, and Rip. Not Josh getting dunked on by Boozer and Noah.
Put Joshs name on the marquee and make this a defensive team.
Teague-Morrow/Jenkins – Josh – AL – Brand/Pachulia.Dwight
Rod from College Park
July 6th, 2012
4:29 pm
“rod, sorry that is way too easy a comeback. what i saw and others will probably agree is jj and jamal foolishly penetrated into easily laid traps, not double teams as there are not enough players in a five man game to double two players.”
It’s not easy it’s the truth. Jamal and Joe were not on the floor all the time together. When you don’t have any player movement on offense, it forces your ball handlers to dribble into traps. Especially when you have guys like Marvin and Horford on the floor with no ball handling ability at all, but one dribble, and pass. You need to go back and look at the tape. I have. I pretty sure I am correct. Just like I was about Drew and Woodson.
Hawks Blog Legend Worldwide Clyde
July 6th, 2012
4:29 pm
Slimjr
July 6th, 2012
4:23 pm
All at 6″10″ 260 is CENTER!!!!
HE DOES NOT HAVE POWER FORWARD SKILLS!!!!!!
HE has a one handed dribble..Cannot shoot a real jumpshot[technically its a set shot]! Cannot use Glass..Is stiff as a MOFO…Has no real post game what so ever. Has no up and under move..Cannot drop step.Cannot shoot off the dribble. Cannot shoot floaters.Cannot cross-over on his dribble drive..Cannot shoot a turn around jumpshot…This list is getting bigger….
Are you Talking about Jason Collins?
Mike is Back
July 6th, 2012
4:30 pm
SteveW , I agree with you on Josh and Al…I think both guys will be HUGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
THE IMMORTAL...I MUS WRITE
July 6th, 2012
4:31 pm
Big Ray
July 6th, 2012
3:31 pm
Im a Hawks fan -I want all our guys to play well but if people cant see josh is a superior player to ol jumpshot then they dont know basketball. Put on any playoff game since they have been here- turn down the sound and tell me which player stands out.
That’s strange…I don’t recall anybody saying that Horford is more talented than Josh Smith. What I DO see people saying is that Al has accumulated the accolades, while Josh has not. FACTS can be hard to SWALLOW, no matter how big your open mouth is.
You’re funny man …..The fact is nobody cares about the dam accolades,being an All star by default is like being the worlds tallest midget. Show me when it counts the most……The Playoffs
Go back to pages 7,8,9, U dont “Recall” becuz u didnt read.For the record i would like to keep both but sum feel having Horford here would be better than having Smith (contract situation excluded) which is in a round about way say Horford is better than Josh
pointguardslim
July 6th, 2012
4:32 pm
Al Horford is 6′10 and 250 lbs. To Al’s credit he shot some shots off the dribble in the playoffs. He fell of course but he didn’t get injured. I’ll reserve judgement because his strength at PF is good and makes even Blake Griffin pause.
Reeeelllllaxxxx 
On size and IQ alone Horford is a great PF. And relax slimjr. Lineups change during a game you go big you go small.
pointguardslim
July 6th, 2012
4:36 pm
http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/221995/Hawks_Emerge_As_New_Potential_Spot_For_Dwight_Howard
Slimjr
July 6th, 2012
4:38 pm
Its good to be lucky[ #15 works an East Coast gig!] lol
pointguardslim
July 6th, 2012
4:39 pm
““He came here and he shot the hell out of it,” Atlanta coach Larry Drew said. “He has an NBA skill. He’s a guy that, watching him play and the way teams play him, it’s kind of that J.J. Redick feel. If he’s on the court, you better be with him at all times. It would be great to have a guy like that.”
Jenkins, a 6-foot-4 shooting guard, led all Division I players in effective field-goal percentage last season.
Drew believes the athletically-limited Jenkins has the potential to be an adequate NBA defender.
“I think so,” Drew said. “I think he’s got the package. It’s just the know-how. Knowing personnel, knowing how to defend certain guys, what they like to do. This kid, he’s a smart guy.”
Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/221627/Drew_Sees_Similarities_Between_John_Jenkins_JJ_Redick#ixzz1zsQpooxU
How far back did LD know that Joe and Marvin were out the door? JJ Redick? Does he know we bringing Dwight home to the A?
Rod from College Park
July 6th, 2012
4:42 pm
The other difference is that Al Horford has absolutely, positively no chance of guarding some of the stretch 4’s in the league. Ryan Anderson, Dirk, Lamar Odom, Elton Brands, LAmarcus Aldridge’s will take Al out on the perimeter and destroy him. Josh, not so much.
THE IMMORTAL...I MUS WRITE
July 6th, 2012
4:44 pm
Big Ray Im still in the A Im not leaving for obvious reasons, but I do get to Sav.every now and then to check on moms -…..Like Rico wade said on Outkast’s Players Ball Lp “Its a black mans heaven” Im a one woman man a shapely creature has tamed my primative ways ….I dont know about the marriage thing though lol…Good luck with that.
MsDee
July 6th, 2012
4:44 pm
Not sure if this is old news or not but I will post it anyways.
Louis Williams: Philly, I appreciate you all. Unfortunately I will not be coming back, as an organization they decided to move in a different direction. Twitter
John R. Finger: Sixers source confirms that they will not re-sign Lou Williams Twitter
WOULD LOVE TO BRING ATLANTA BACK HOME..Ferry, lets get Lou Williams and have a family reunion here in Da A. Hopefully Dwight wont be ‘Tardy for the Party’
Big Ray
July 6th, 2012
4:45 pm
The difference is Josh is not an All star, Al is. All stars usually step up and lead their teams in the playoffs. Al did not. I specifically remember Jalen Rose being the only analyst who called Al out about not dominating his man in the playoffs. Al was voted an all star simply because he played center in the east with no other real centers, or ones that could stay healthy. The problem is Al wants to be a PF, and he is no where close to a top 10 PF. Josh is.
Reference comments made by SteveW, who actually answered the first half of the question – “why has Al been an all-star, and Josh has not?”
Marvin on the other hand deserves all the blame he gets. He is a professional basketball player who should be able to knock down wide open shots. His game is worse now, than it was when he entered the league. That has nothing to do with Billy Knight.
Come ON, man! What I’m saying is this – we had NO BUSINESS picking Marvin with superstars in waiting like Deron and CP3…hell, even Rondo….would YOU pick a guy #2 overall when his a$$ wasn’t even good enough to start for his college team? I don’t CARE who was on that team that year, dude was not a STARTER… at least ….and VOILA…it translated to the NBA. Has ANY non-starter in college been picked in the top 5 of the first round of the NBA draft, besides Marvin? I mean damn, even Thabeet’s sorry arse was a starter.
Marvin’s development may be his own fault, but his existence on this team as the highest pick we’ve had in decades and the resulting disappointment attached to that draft position is ALL on BILLY KNIGHT . I’m sure you can agree with that, right? That’s the responsibility of a GM. Sund is worse for re-signing Marvin to that contract.
Here’s the difference in the impact a GM can have – Ferry got rid of Joe and Marvin’s overpaid butts in one stroke.
No. I’m saying we might have beat the Celtics this year. Reading is fundamental.
I disagree. A healthy Al might have made a difference if his head was right. Problem is, he’s been playing like somebody who can’t even get on the court with guys like Garnett….Garnett has his number mentally and otherwise. The series didn’t come down to some Al Horford miscues at the end of one game. It came down to Al and the others (except largely for Josh) being beat…mostly after Mike Gearon’s dumb a$$ fired GArnett up in the media. Then the Celts took over…everywhere…
But think about how that chicago series would change if you could throw the ball to Al in the post, and he could score at will. Changes everything.
Oh, I agree. But that’s never been Al, and I don’t know if it ever will be. He does need, in the worst way, to develop those post moves. But what’s crazier is that Josh already has moves close to the basket…hell, even off the dribble….and he just won’t stick with them. He’s too busy spending more time than he should further away from the basket.
I’m not laying all of that on Josh, though. It just aggravates me to see him shoot less than 50% from the field in the regular season and never really above 40% in the playoffs when I think he could do both that and put up no less than 18 ppg while he’s at it. The only reason why he’s not a 20ppg scorer is because doesn’t have the handles to be a true shot creator and he does so much else.
Still….dude should be the second coming of a Shawn Marion type with better defense and minus the 3 point capability. And an all-star.
But it’s hard to get the all-star nod in a league with a lot of good PFs….but not a lot of good centers.
Like SteveW said, Al got the nod in a league with few good centers, and even fewer in the East. True understanding of how it all works.
What killed me was the year Gerald Wallace tore it up and made the all-star team. Probably the only time he’ll do so. But all I could think was “damn, why can’t Josh do that?”
Michael Cunningham
July 6th, 2012
4:50 pm
new blog posted. shutting down this thread.