Atlanta Hawks: What about Dwight?
Almost immediately after Hawks GM Danny Ferry took what were most definitely not half measures the speculation turned to whether it’s all just a prelude to a trade for Dwight Howard.
All of the usual dots have been connected: Howard wants out of Orlando, Howard is from Atlanta, and he’s boys with Josh Smith. But the one blank I have yet to see filled in is a desire by Howard to play for his hometown franchise over the long term.
In fact, the only thing I’ve ever heard is the opposite. Howard used to regularly attend Dream games at Phillips Arena during summers. Witnesses tell me that Howard would tell anyone who would listen that Philips is supposed to be his house but “they don’t know how to act.” And by “they” he of course means the team’s owners and management.
And then there were Howard’s comments during the 2011 playoffs, when he said he hates losing, “especially to the Hawks.” Asked to elaborate, Howard, annoyed by the question, snapped: “Come on. You know the answer to that.”
The answer is that Howard, like his pal Smith, doesn’t view the Hawks as a serious franchise. Or at least he didn’t back then. Obviously Danny Ferry is trying to change the perception of the Hawks, so maybe Howard (and/or Smith) changes his mind.
There’s been no word that’s happened so far, though. Howard still wants a trade to the Nets, who now are in no hurry to move him.
The Magic and Hawks had trade discussions over the past week involving Howard and I’m sure they are ongoing. But I don’t think Ferry is willing to trade Al Horford and the four years remaining on his reasonable contract for one year of Howard and all the associated drama.
The Hawks had serious trade discussions with Orlando for Howard back in December, the early days of the Dwightmare. Atlanta apparently was willing to make the deal without an assurance that Howard would even opt-in for next season. Horford was the main piece in that proposed deal.
But I don’t see the Hawks as being willing to trade for Howard without a long-term commitment now. That’s especially true if Orlando, as reported, is looking to unload one of its bad contracts as part of any deal for Howard.
The Hawks clearly would do that if Howard declares he’ll sign an extension here. Until that happens I doubt Howard will have a homecoming.
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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1,008 comments Add your comment
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
3:42 pm
LOL @ ESPN and this hot dog eating contest. Got 7 second video intros for each hot dog eating contestant. Gotta be about 30,000 people on Coney Island watching this contest. People everywhere.
Got the grill fired up outside . . . illegally. Damn State of Tennessee has a FIRE BAN on wood and charcoal grills and all outdoor burning. So if I get caught grilling, I could get a $2,500 fine or 11 mo – 29 days in prison.
So I can’t water my grass OR grill out with charcoal either?
Guess I’m going to Jail today then.
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
3:44 pm
Here’s a question then Ray
Who would you trade Josh Smith for?
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
3:45 pm
I mean dang . . if you wouldn’t trade him for the best center in the league on a team that has been seeking a true center since Dikembe left, who would you trade him for?
O'Brien
July 4th, 2012
3:46 pm
Ray,
I would trade Horford, Zaza, Teague and 2 first round picks for Dwight. The problem with waiting until next year is what if he doesn’t sign with us? And James Harden doesn’t sign with us? And CP3 resigns with the Clippers. Then what? We have a boat load of cap space, and nobody to spend it on.
The Mavericks gambled that they could get either Dwight, Deron, or Nash this offseason, and what happened? They have lost out on Deron and Nash so far, and may lose out on Dwight too. And they have one of the best owners in the NBA, a very good coach, and a superstar in Dirk.
If the Hawks wait until next year, we could be left empty handed.
KevinM
July 4th, 2012
3:49 pm
Northcyde: “He was underused by Stan Van Gundy, who falls in love with seeing other guys shoot 3s all day.”
I am total agreement with you. It’s like SVG purposely was not going to let D12 be the reason for their success. There was alot of animosity between the 2. I went to 2 ORL home games and D12 never stood out, and they never went to him on the offensive end on a regular basis either game.
D12 is the face of that arena and it’s going to have a huge hole in the middle of it once the announcement is made.
Astro Joe
July 4th, 2012
3:51 pm
northcyde, I need Dwight to sign an extension. Like i said, he’s like a kid in a candy store with a dollar bill. It takes that kid 2 hours to make a decision. The one and only reason Dwight won;t sign an extension is to keep his options open… to be wined and dined and potentially fall in love with some city, arena, player’s lounge, coaching staff, cheerleading squad, whatever. And I still struggle with the notion that the centerpiece of the franchise can’t even be on the floor if we’re down by a point with <10 seconds left in an elimination game.
Too much risk.
Hoops
July 4th, 2012
3:52 pm
Let the trade for D12 go people. We do not need another max contract unless he will sign an extension with the Hawks. Let’s move on to improving our current team like getting a SF. Spend some money and get Batum and sign McGrady for 1 year for crying out loud!
glw
July 4th, 2012
3:52 pm
@O’Brien
yeah he can only get a 4 yr deal. As who has his bird rights can give 5 yrs. But that is overrated, because all you have to do is give that team a future 1st round pick or a young player to get them to agree to a sign a trade where he can get his 5th year. Lebron and Bosh both got their extra years by doing S&T deals.
steven a smith
July 4th, 2012
3:53 pm
Hoops
July 4th, 2012
3:08 pm
STRETCH,
Don’t forget Jenkins. He’s going to be a playa!!! Dude can score the ball.
Link
“score the ball?” Most overused basketball cliche of the year. THEY SHOOT THE D–N BALL!!!
KevinM
July 4th, 2012
3:56 pm
You have to strike while the iron is hot.
Folks, the iron is hot, D12 is at his lowest value point for the Magic, and you have to take a stab at it and make Henigan tell you no deal.
D12 has what, 5-8 more years left in the league?
This one move puts the Hawks in the national spotlight, and we have a change to turn all the negative results this franchise has endured.
Buddy G
July 4th, 2012
3:57 pm
Astro,
It would take as many as 7 players to agree to sign and trades for Dwight to land in Brooklyn. Lopez already said he doesn’t want to be traded to Orlando and ORL’s gm said he wants players who want to be there. Brooklyn is no longer an option.
As far as Dwight’s behavior being erratic, I think you have your timeline confused. Dwight DID make a decision to give up free agency to placate Orlando’s fans, and was rewarded with SVG’s character assassination. At that point he was done with Orlando. Naturally he explored any avenues to nullify his opt in.
That’s not surprising. What is surprising is that the players union would leak confidential information to further damage Dwight’s rep. He made a decision and got screwed for it. That doesn’t make him erratic. It just show the kind of retribution that’s available to someone like Vander Weide, who married into one of the richest families in America.
Ken Strickland
July 4th, 2012
3:58 pm
HOOPS-That was a trade I suggested before the JJ and Marvin trades, and before Josh had a change of heart about the Hawks not doing enough to try and get better. I read where Josh openly said he was very pleased with the JJ and Marvin trades. Maybe he feelsthe teams development was do to Marvin not doing enough, based on his talents and abilities, and JJ doing too much, based on his talents and abilities.
My feeling is the Hawks shouldn’t trade for Horford, at least not this season. If we do well and progress enough to make the playoffs and be competitive, we would be in an excellent position to resign Josh and sign Howard without any risk of losing him after 1yr. And if we need to clear additional cap space to go after CP3, we could then trade Horford for assets, and/or draft picks, rather giving them up, without giving up Teague.
Hoops
July 4th, 2012
4:00 pm
steven a smith,
I had rather have a player that can score the ball than one that can shoot the ball. Anyone can shoot. I want players that can score!
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
4:00 pm
Ken . . that Magic team regressed because of stupid decisions by the GM. And Stan Van Gundy must take some of the blame as well.
The Magic were rolling right along in the playoffs WITHOUT Jameer Nelson in the 2009 playoffs, until Van Gundy tried to force Nelson back into the lineup. The chemistry that the team had built up with Rafer Alston and Anthony Johnson ( of all people ) was destroyed as soon as Jameer came back, and Stan gave him all of AJs backup PG minutes, along with cutting Rafer’s minutes. They may or may not have beaten the Lakers that year,
It wasn’t Dwight’s fault that those playoff teams couldn’t progress. Vince Carter couldn’t make an open 3 to save his life in the 2010 playoffs. Then the GM panicks, and trades off his perimeter defenders in Barnes and Pietrus, in favor of Richardson and Turkoglu. Then trades Lewis for Gilbert Arenas? How was that Dwight’s fault?
Van Gundy’s system encourages high volume 3 point shooting around Dwight. That system is only good when you have good consistent 3 point shooters. When every shooter around you is a streak shooter, that system will only take you so far. Dwight flat out dominated the Hawks in the 2011 playoffs, but his guys around him couldn’t get it done. That wasnt Dwight’s fault.
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
4:02 pm
They may or may not have beaten the Lakers that year, but Jameer definitely sealed their fate in that series, because he simply wasn’t ready. Stan simply didn’t have the guts to keep him on the bench, and go with the more defensive minded and steady AJ.
Buddy G
July 4th, 2012
4:06 pm
O’Brien co-sign your 3:46 post. I think Harden and CP are happy where they are and you saw the power of bird rights with Deron. Cuban looks like an idiot right now. However I don’t want to gut our roster to bring Dwight unless he AND Josh are committing long term. Otherwise no way I let Horford go.
Make that Change !
July 4th, 2012
4:06 pm
For once the hawks are showing backbone in working to get D12 here. We already know that Horford is an unambitious loser whose purpose is not team oriented but “me” oriented. Him and his dad Tito are more concerned about Al having a long career than whats best for the team.at 6′ 10 1/2 265 lbs and 12,000,000.000 in base salary plus another 3 million in incentives totaling 15,000,000.000 you think Al would own the center position and give his heart and soul to defending the rim instead of this 12pts, 8rbs I want Josh’s position bullcrap.. Hell, we have soldiers who give their lives for less….Happy fourth every one.
Take the chance and upgrade this team to D12 and Josh. Batman and Robin. We already know what you get with Al, not much. We definitely can do no worse with D12. Even if he left and we had to start all over, hell we are doing that now as we break up this stupid, center-less core.
Id rather have lost at love, than not to have lost at All
Ray
July 4th, 2012
4:06 pm
@ Northcyde
Stop trying to trade Josh Smith why trade Smith to Orlando and then end up Dwight signs back with Orlando to play with Josh that’s retarded even you know that.
I wouldn’t trade Josh for anyone right now like I said we got Lucky as hell to even have this guy cause for all the crap they put on Josh again I say we got lucky.
If it’s not for Joe, Josh, and Horford we don’t make back to playoffs back in 2008 just saying.
richbrave
July 4th, 2012
4:06 pm
HAPPY 4th to everyone
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:09 pm
Since trades can’t be finalized until July 11th, is it possible that ATL is waiting until then, and telling Orlando to be patient?
I mean at this point, since nothing can be made official, if we were to come away with a commitment from Dwight and a trade for him, all the Nets have to do is say, “Well, I guess our trade for JJ is off” and walk away.
There is nothing binding at this point. And then there would be no way we could re-sign Smoove, one of the reasons Dwight would want to be here presumably, with JJ, Dwight, and Al on the books. No way. None.
So we may be laying low until the JJ trade is complete. Maybe even a secret verbal with Henigan or something.
Make that Change !
July 4th, 2012
4:09 pm
**Id rather have lost at love, than not to have loved at All
richbrave
July 4th, 2012
4:11 pm
KEN STRICK:
How’s your health. Well I hope.
And what happened to BIG RAY while I was away?
vava74
July 4th, 2012
4:12 pm
Cice twitter pic that MC re-posted!
Mike Scott is enthusiastic!
EmirS.
July 4th, 2012
4:12 pm
Question:
With Joe Johnson gone…who takes the last shot when we’re down 101 – 99 in the 4th quarter with 8 seconds remaining?
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:14 pm
OB – Big Co-sign as well. Been looking over next season’s FA class, and it looks like it may be a repeat of the class when lots of people had money to spend, and the likes of Turkoglo and Villenueva to spend it on.
CP3 is giving signals of staying. Durant said today that Harden will never reach the point of FA – that a deal will be done before then. Ibaka is good – and where was he during the Finals again? I’m not giving that guy max money at all.
So if you whiff on Al Jefferson, well then, you could be in big trouble next season.
Get Dwight if you can – but you may need to lay low now until the JJ trade is complete.
Astro Joe
July 4th, 2012
4:15 pm
Buddy, if Howard did try to fire SVG, that is kind of “snake behavior” to be all smiles up in the coach’s face, being the fun-loving guy who interrupts the interview session all while knowing that you have stabbed the head coach in the back.
It will be interesting to see if Ferry’s definition of a sustainable program means building around Howard and Josh.
Make that Change !
July 4th, 2012
4:16 pm
Yea but if its not for Josh we dont make the playoff last year. Al sat on the sofa stroking ms camel toe, then come back for 2 games to get playoff money. After all that resting he could still only average 15pts over tired guys who had been playing all year. More over Al’s career playoff average is a sorry, weak lazy 11pts per game. And then you idiots ask “why we cant get out of the second round.?”
This team is capable of getting to the playoffs second round with out Al. and It cant get out of the second round with Al, so yea, the Al for Dwight trade is justified!
vava74
July 4th, 2012
4:16 pm
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/36117/mike-scott
His game log reveals that he is a steady guy.
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:17 pm
Emir – Al, Teague, Harris, or Josh right now. Maybe even swing it over to Morrow.
But the moves may not be over.
And if we don’t trade Teague, don’t overlook him in all of this. He’s 24 next season. Look at what Kyle Lowry and Rondo did when they turned 24.
Lowry went from a backup to the All Star game discussion.
And Rondo went from very good to Superstar in the words of LeBron.
Hoops
July 4th, 2012
4:18 pm
EmirS.,
At this point, I don’t know who should take the shot. All I know is, you put Josh Smith’s butt inside so he can rebound the miss!!! You also put your 2nd or 3rd best shooter out of bounds so they will have to guard them. If not, throw back to them for the shot with Josh at high post so he can go hard to the backside to clean up the glass!
Sargeant Shriver
July 4th, 2012
4:18 pm
“you think Al would own the center position and give his heart and soul to defending the rim instead of this 12pts, 8rbs I want Josh’s position bullcrap.. Hell, we have soldiers who give their lives for less…”
This BS made this Army lifer want to puke. You fu_king little creep. Who the fu-k do you think you are making a BS comparison of a mere basketball game to losing a life for your country? Get that bunch of horse manure out of this blog and keep it that way. I’m filing a complaint with the AJC. You show an enormous amount of disrespect to those who have died for their country. Hate on whoever you want, but do not make that kind of statement again. SMGDH.
Ken Strickland
July 4th, 2012
4:19 pm
HOOPS-Excellent idea. There’s no way in hell I’d give up Horford, Teague, a filler and future 1st rd picks for a player with an expiring contract that hasn’t once indicated he wanted to play for us. And if being Josh’s best friend and best man in his wedding, and being from Atlanta, meant so much to Dwight, as some of our more delusional fans have convinced themselves to believe, why hasn’t he included us on his list of teams to be traded to, or indicated his desire to play with Josh in Atlanta?
After all, he’s had plenty of time to do so, since Josh has been on this team his entire career. If we successfully signed CP3, and resigned JTeague, we’d have a talented and deep team.
SF-JSmith
OC-Zaza
PF-AHorford
PG-CPaul
SG-Jenkins
BENCH
IJohnson
Scott
Buddy G
July 4th, 2012
4:23 pm
Josh Robbins:
“But palatable deals with the Hawks and the Lakers, especially, might not be there for the taking.
Consider this: Why would the Hawks agree to send power forward/center Al Horford and point guard Jeff Teague to the Magic for a player who has said he will sign long term only with Brooklyn?
Atlanta should have plenty of cap space in July 2013, when Howard is scheduled to become a free agent. The Hawks might not want to risk losing Horford and Teague now when they could make a bid for Howard 12 months from now.”
Hoops
July 4th, 2012
4:27 pm
I’m with you Ken Strickland. God bless you brother! May God heal your body and soul!
Happy 4th to all of you guys! I’m proud to be an American!
Ray
July 4th, 2012
4:27 pm
I like what someone said earlier it would make sense to wait until July 11th before talking anymore deals cause these two we got now have yet to be finalized.
Also again like others are saying wait till Summer of 2013 when we can make a legit run after Howard without giving up anything except possibly Josh Smith if he doesn’t re-sign with us.
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:30 pm
Dwight, Smoove, Ivan, Morrow, Farmar (since you don’t buy him out if you trade Teague), Harris, Mid Level, Bi Annual, Stevenson as wing D – Get’s you to the ECF and maybe beyond, since that teams strength’s is what has given Miami fits in the big 3 era.
Every nite you walk on the floor, you have the best C in the League, and according to efficiency stats, a what, Top 4-6 PF.
The NBA is all about matchups, and we become a matchup nightmare for the rest of the League.
And the FA’s all of a sudden want to play here.
And we have room to sign 1 more near max FA with that lineup also.
Buddy G
July 4th, 2012
4:32 pm
“Buddy, if Howard did try to fire SVG, that is kind of “snake behavior” to be all smiles up in the coach’s face, being the fun-loving guy who interrupts the interview session all while knowing that you have stabbed the head coach in the back.”
Howard had just signed away his free agency to commit to roll with Stan. Was it unreasonable for him to assume that Stan would keep their differences behind closed door? Once again, if the organization gave Dwight influence over Stan’s job, the MAGIC were wrong for that, not Dwight. It’s not Dwight’s fault that people like Dan Gilbert will compromise their own integrity to try to placate a star player then cry when it doesn’t go their way. As an aside, Danny Ferry’s integrity remained in tact after he walked away from Cleveland over their treatment of Brown.
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:36 pm
I mean the two realistic offers I know of out there for Dwight right now, if Lopez makes Brooklyn off the table (his brother says he may nix a S/T with Orlando) are:
Bynum and MWP
Whatever the Hawks have on the table.
Guys, ya’ll know I like Teague and Horford. I liked JJ for that matter. But I’m a Hawks fan first. I give up whatever to get Dwight right now, if he’s healthy, because I know it’s what’s best for Hawks – not my favorite players or my dislike for Dwight’s antics of the past few months. Primadonna. Can’t stand that stuff.
But he’s our best hope for the future. Getting basically the 2nd best player in the League behind LeBron, whom I can’t stand either – but I’d take him on my team in a nano second.
OK Durant may be second – but you get my point. Team first regardless of our likes, dislikes etc.
Horford is a great guy and leader. Does things the right way. But he’s nowhere close to Dwight’s League. He can’t guard Dwight even a little bit. He can’t even slow him down.
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:38 pm
The Mavs have absolutely nothing to offer Orlando.
Now Houston may…Forgot about them.
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:47 pm
Fastest and 2nd fastest guys ever to reach 1,000 blocks in a career are Smoove and Dwight.
Talk about protecting the rim.
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
4:48 pm
Ray . . . thank you for answering the question.
You wouldn’t trade Josh Smith for ANYONE. That speaks volumes about what you think of Josh Smith. You believe that he’s a good enough player to be the top dog on a EC Finals or NBA Championship caliber team. That’s cool.
I disagree.
I think Horford is more valuable to the Hawks because of the stability of his mindset and the consistency of his game. Horford isn’t good enough to be the lead dog either, so if we had a chance to get a superstar type player, I wouldn’t hesitate to trade for him.
But not you sir. You’re not trading Josh Smith for anybody right now. That says it all.
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:50 pm
Josh and Al do have on court chemistry by the way, if you remember the 1st 11 games this season and then the playoffs. They play well together.
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
4:51 pm
Question:
If Howard doesn’t want to come to the Hawks now, why would he want to come to the Hawks 12 months from now? Because we have the “cap space” to bring him here?
SteveW
July 4th, 2012
4:53 pm
NC – If I knew I was out of the Dwight sweepstakes, I’d trade Josh for a whole bunch of players – even though Josh did take a leap forward in progress this year.
LeBron, Durant, CP3, Rose (if healthy), Dwight, Bynum to name a few.
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
4:57 pm
And the police DID shut my grill down. Told me that if I didn’t stop grilling, that they’d write a “reckless burning” citation, and that I will be forced to go to court , with my fine being set there. Luckily I had most of my stuff done and can finish up these ribs in the oven.
Come to think of it, I haven’t heard a single firecracker or bottle rocket being shot off today by any of the neighborhood kids. Now granted, it is 102 degrees outside, but still.
Jason S
July 4th, 2012
5:03 pm
Under the new CBA, non-bird right max length is 4 years. Bird right max length is 5 years. If I am not mistaken, players involved in sign-and-trades cannot get the extra year (i.e., they can only be signed and traded if they agree to a max length of 4 years). No more Lebron and Bosh-type S&Ts under the new CBA.
Make that Change
July 4th, 2012
5:03 pm
Fake as sargent schitter No base would allow your as near it. In fact the pentagon sent your mother a box of rubbers, so she would not have another f ucked mistake like you.
More?
You mother was given NJP (non judicial punishment fake military man) for failure to complete the abortion at your birth.
Horford is no warrior and you dam sure aint.
Make that Change
July 4th, 2012
5:04 pm
Now Semper Fi Bytcch
northcyde
July 4th, 2012
5:07 pm
SteveW . . that was on-court chemistry with JJ still in the mix. But Smith is the lead dog ( or supposedly the lead dog ) now. He’s going to expect to be the go-to guy at the end of games, taking the big shots for the Hawks.
How is he going to react when plays are drawn up to free up our shooter or even Horford or Teague to take the shot at the end of games? How will he react when Horford makes the All-Star team, and he possibly gets snubbed . . again?
Every time I want to trust Smith and his mindset, he does something to raise questions if he can be trusted as the true leader of this team. Horford is more suited for that “leader” role. We’ll see if they can gel together though.
Make that Change
July 4th, 2012
5:15 pm
“Josh and Al do have on court chemistry by the way, if you remember the 1st 11 games this season and then the playoffs. They play well together.”
You must mean they played card games well together. they sure dont have chemistry and this team plays much better with out Al than with him. In fact Al complaints in the locker room about wanting to play Josh’s position lead to infighting and factionalism. Michael Cunningham wrote about it.
“I think Horford is more valuable to the Hawks because of the stability of his mindset”
Josh carried this team to the playoffs and got us to the second round. The only mind set I see from Al Horford is an unwillingness to Play center and use his 6′ 10 1/2 265lbs to defend the rim. And a constant dripping about wanting to play power forward while being indifferent to the guys rushing to the basket against him.
If you asked me Al attitude is about anything but winning and playing team ball. Josh is far superior in will to win, leadership and team unity than Al, and Josh has the higher basketball IQ.
Al is very selfish, IMO.