Atlanta Hawks: Danny Ferry looking to trade but avoid the tax
Danny Ferry didn’t make the decisions that led to the Hawks owing $61 million in salaries next season to six veteran players on a team that’s topped out in the second round of the playoffs.
But now that’s he’s Hawks GM, Ferry will have to build a roster for next season without much financial flexibility. And he will have to start doing it pretty much on the fly because the free-agent negotiating period opens Sunday, less than a week after he took the job.
“It’s a crash course, for sure,” Ferry said. “I think we want to make the best decisions possible in the short term. We want to make right decisions, whether it’s a trade, whether it’s free agency. But especially trades.”
The trade market remains the best way for the Hawks to make significant additions to the roster (which of course means they’d also have to make significant subtractions).
They continue to get a lot of calls about Josh Smith but the impetus for pursuing Pau Gasol came from Rick Sund and Ferry so far hasn’t taken that baton. Ferry hasn’t even had a chance to fully assess the roster or meet the players.
Smith has a lot of value as a talented and productive player on a reasonable contract that expires after next season. Al Horford is an attractive piece, too, because he’s an All-Star big man locked up for four years and $48 million. Good luck dealing Joe Johnson with four years and $90 million remaining on his contract.
(Aside: I’ve heard some of my blog people wonder if Ferry will be “allowed” to trade Marvin Williams. Please accept that the Hawks have tried to trade Williams for at least two years and no one is biting. That shouldn’t be hard to do since you don’t want him on your team at his salary, either.)
If the Hawks don’t make a trade, then they’ll have to find some value on the free-agent market and perhaps get some contributions from unheralded rookies.
After signing first-round draft pick John Jenkins, Atlanta will have roughly $62 million in salaries committed to seven players. If second-round pick Mike Scott makes the roster and sticks for the year, that’s another $473,604. Ferry said he hasn’t decided if he will extend a qualifying offer to Ivan Johnson; if the Hawks do so and Johnson ends up playing on that deal, add about $1 million.
That’s about $63.5 million dollars for nine players. The roster minimum is 13 and the maximum is 15. The salary cap next season will be no less than $58 million. The luxury-tax threshold last season was $70.3 million and won’t rise significantly unless the players and league agree on a big increase in projected BRI for next season.
So, basically, the Hawks likely will have somewhere in the neighborhood of $6.5 to $9 million of room below the tax line to sign four to six players. Ferry said he’s authorized to spend into the tax but would like to avoid doing so.
“I want to build a roster that has some flexibility to it,” Ferry said. “Ownership has told me when appropriate, that when going over the tax makes sense as far as making us a better team, that is something we would be allowed to do. I want to use that judiciously, though, when you are given that opportunity to do so.
“In this new CBA, some of the challenges when being over the tax as far as trade restrictions as far as exceptions available to you going forward have changed the spending habits in the NBA. Would I think over the next few years we would go over the tax? I think there is a good chance but, again, I want to do that in a judicious manner.”
Ferry is talking about the more-punitive tax penalties that begin in 2012-13. Teams over the threshold will pay a higher tax; will have a smaller mid-level exception and no bi-annual exception; can’t take as much salary back in trades; and won’t be able to receive a player in a sign-and-trade if they are $4 million or more above the tax level.
Translation for the Hawks: Ferry can use the mid-level and bi-annual exceptions and make the Hawks tax-payers again but he’d better be sure he’s signing players that put the Hawks over the top.
“If the belief was it was going to make us a lot better, those things are on the table whether now or later in the year,” Ferry said. “The dollar amount certainly is a parameter as it relates to the tax. You’d prefer not to go over it. But right time, right trade, right thing [then] ownership, Bruce Levenson, has told me that if it’s appropriate and right and it would really make a difference we would have the ability to do so.
“I want to say with that I don’t think it’s always the right thing to go over the tax because of the rule and because of the way things operate. Most teams are never one player away. I think that’s a mistake sometimes teams make. We are going to look at opportunities and make a decision.”
The opportunities will be there for the Hawks on the trade market. There’s a sense of urgency because free agency opens in a couple days but Ferry said he plans to stay patient.
“Every player we may like, [the process] will take its own pace,” he said. “We will have some control over that but the players will have some control over that, as well. So we are going to make our calls on July 1, we are going to explore every option and hopefully we can make good decisions.
“Honestly, last year–I know I keep crediting Rick–but I thought they did a pretty nice job filling out their roster from where they were. Hopefully we can find avenues to do as well, [and] hopefully even better.”
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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363 comments Add your comment
Tired Tired Tired
June 29th, 2012
9:36 pm
Well duh, how about renegotiating Joe Johnsons contract for the good of the team, and free up money to get new talent. Oh, I forgot, Johnson doesn’t give a rats a$$ about the good of the team. Get out of town losers.
zgoldatl
June 29th, 2012
9:42 pm
Gotta resign ivan. We need a player with a mean streak
tyrone fr aug
June 29th, 2012
9:49 pm
Honestly the biggest prob is Joe’s contract entirely too much for the level he’s playing at. On the other hand Marv just hasn’t proven hesself worthy either. But for all of u tru hawks fans really Josh has came too play last year and did very good and definitly dosn’t deserves not too get a new contract if u signed Joe u might as well pay Josh. Cause we all know he’s (Josh) is a player that just wanna win and ain’t nothing wrong with that. But still good vet out there Allan Iverson
Rufus1
June 29th, 2012
9:50 pm
http://sports.yahoo.com/video/player/nba/NBA_Draft/29773644#nba/NBA_Draft/29837881
bigcalidawg
June 29th, 2012
10:04 pm
We got a new coach for Josh.
Seems like he don’t like the new coach either.
and he’s from Atl?
We need to send him packin.
Problem is, we won’t get value for his ability, as other teams realize they will be inheriting a cancer.
Jae Evolution
June 29th, 2012
10:09 pm
Call up Golden State they expressed interest in Marvin Williams.
Marvin Williams and a 2nd round pick for Dorell Wright and Festus Ezeli…this one probably won’t happen.
Marvin Williams and a 2nd round pick for Andris Biedrins and Draymond Green…more realistic trade scenario.
Dawg
June 29th, 2012
10:24 pm
If Ferry don’t know that he should resign Ivan, he is clueless. Ivan is cheap and he plays backup to 3 positions very good. He is the only tough player on the team. He had heart and again, he is cheap.
Melvin
June 29th, 2012
10:26 pm
Marvin for Devin Harris (1yr/8.5mil)….
Rob
June 29th, 2012
10:30 pm
I like the Marvin for Dev Harris, but I dont know if Utah would bite. They do have Mo Williams now….
Melvin
June 29th, 2012
10:32 pm
Trade Marvin for Devin Harris, sign OJ Mayo, Matt Barnes or Rashard Lewis and Ryan Hollins.
Melvin
June 29th, 2012
10:33 pm
The Book On Perry Jones
Posted by Darnell Mayberry on June 29, 2012M at 2:05 am
News, notes and nuggets from Thursday night’s selection of Perry Jones III.
Thunder general manager Sam Presti: “We didn’t enter this draft thinking that Perry Jones would be there at 28 for us.”
Chalk it up to an alleged knee issue that caused Jones, who shall be referred to as PJ3, to slip. A year ago, he was a projected top 10 pick.
“Perry Jones obviously is an extremely talented individual and somebody that we feel very fortunate to be able to add to our team,” said Presti.
Lots of questions about why PJ3 slipped so far. Those questions were posed to Presti and assistant GM Troy Weaver. And, again, it came back to the knee. “People probably had questions about medicals…I would think that maybe that had something to do with it,” said Weaver. “Maybe people didn’t do their homework as well. I’m not sure. But I would think that the medical had something to do with it because he was projected to be picked higher.”
A little more from Presti: “Sometimes, it’s kind of like a chessboard so to speak. Once things start to happen, there’s a real trickle down effect. Certain teams are locked in on certain players, and certain teams have different needs. And the next thing you know, guys that you don’t anticipate being there start to fall to you. Sometimes, guys that you don’t anticipate being there fall to you and you can’t capitalize. This time, we felt like we could.”
Presti expressed a great deal of confidence in Jones’ knee. He said the team has done a lot of research and “felt very comfortable making this selection at 28.” “We looked at all the information that we had available, and we wouldn’t have selected him unless we felt comfortable with all the information,” Presti said.
Presti declined to say whether PJ3 will require surgery on his knee. But he reiterated that the organization felt comfortable with the alleged issue. “Before I say too much, what I’d like to do is just make sure our group has a chance to see him and get a baseline where he is,” Presti said. “But as I said before, he had an incredible athletic testing performance at the pre-draft combine and has played two seasons at Baylor consistently. But we need to let those guys get a baseline as to where he is and how we can continue to improve him as an athlete.”
Presti was asked whether this selection had any sort of “DeJuan Blair effect,” as in not letting a talent again slip away because of health concerns. Presti, perhaps shockingly, said “I don’t know.” It wasn’t a real ‘I don’t know.’ It felt like much more of an ‘I’m not going to answer that with the truth I don’t know.’
Of course, a question about the James Harden-for-Bradley Beal rumor had to be posed to Presti. And, of course, Presti didn’t give anything remotely close to an answer nor anything remotely as good as “To me, it’s rubbish.” Here’s what Presti said about the rumor that had Thunder heads running wild for 24 hours. “I couldn’t tell you where that stuff starts, because we don’t pay a whole lot of attention to it,” Presti said. “All I can say is it’s that time of year. James Harden is a coveted player. But I don’t think anyone covets him as much as we do. He’s a player that, as we’ve said before, has really grown with this organization and we’re really excited about having him.”
Presti said he attended PJ3′s first college practice. “I remember it sticking out to me the fact that he was a freshman that was out there early before anybody else,” Presti said. “We feel really strongly about his work ethic in combination with a lot of physical gifts that he has.”
Presti said the him and his staff asked PJ3′s college coach, Scott Drew, to sum up PJ3 in three words. They were: “Great teammate, caring and humble.”
I know. That’s four words.
At any rate. “Those are traits that we feel are really important to our program here,” Presti said. “Additionally, we just feel like he blends with us as an organization on and off the floor.”
Jones, according to Presti, is 6-10.25″ without shoes and has 4.5 percent body fat.
Is PJ3 more of a 3 or a 4 at the NBA level? “We won’t pigeonhole him,” said Weaver. “We think he can play anywhere on the front line. He’s a versatile player. The coaches will handle that. But we see his versatility as a strength.”
Now, about PJ3′s propensity for passivity on the court. It might have just been spin, but Weaver and Presti made PJ3′s up-and-downs out to be a positive. “Everybody looks at his talent and says this guy should be dominant,” Weaver said. “But he plays within a teamwork and tries to blend with players and help his team win ballgames.”
More from Weaver: “We’re not that concerned about how assertive he is because he has a tremendous work ethic. He brings his hard hat every day. But he’s just a guy that just tries to fit in and help the team win. I remember people saying that about different players like Tayshaun Prince and stuff like that. But Tayshaun just tried to help his team win and Perry is the same type of guy. He just tries to help his team win.”
Now there’s a comparison, not that Weaver was comparing the two. But if Perry James Jones III is anything, anything at all, like Tayshaun Durell Prince, he won’t just be a steal. He’ll easily be the best pick in the last 10 years.
A quick look at PJ3′s first 15 games this season illustrates how erratic he was. Here are his point totals in those games: 27, 12, 8, 28, 6, 14, 4, 8, 14, 9, 17, 19, 18, 8, 21…The same type of pattern was seen over his final 18 games.
Take a look at PJ3′s numbers from his freshman to his sophomore season. The thing that stands out is he didn’t take a big jump in anything. As a matter of fact, he actually averaged fewer points, blocks and free throw attempts, while shooting a much worse percentage from the field. Weaver again looked at the glass as half full. “His numbers were down, but they won more games,” Weaver said. “So I think he tried to blend more, help his teammates more and understand that coming back, taking more of a leadership role, he had to kind of spread his wings a little more and spread his game out.”
I don’t know what to think about PJ3′s passivity, to be honest. But I know that Presti brought up a great point, one that I think we should all file in the memory bank for two or three years down the line. At some point, it will come into play. “We really see him as a blend player,” Presti said. “We see great value in the fact that he’s incredibly talented, but he’s able to play within a team and understand how he can impact a game. He doesn’t need to be forcing the issue at all times. And with our particular team, we feel like that’s a huge quality that we looked at as a positive for us.” Amen to that. With Harden, Russell Westbrook and Kevin Durant seemingly set to be together for years to come, the Thunder doesn’t need another player who wants and needs the ball. Whenever PJ3 cracks the rotation, it will be a luxury to have a talented big man who can get you 20 one night but also be content with taking a lesser role as a scorer yet still gobble up 10 boards and block four shots the next.
Baylor played a lot of zone, which naturally hides players on defense. But when asked about PJ3′s defensive skills, Weaver spoke highly of him. “I think he rates pretty solid,” Weaver said. “He can defend. He’s long. He can guard multiple positions…I think that his versatility and his length would lend to him being a solid defender here.”
Weaver said PJ3 has shooting range out to the college 3 with consistency.
Can PJ3 provide low-post scoring? That’s, of course, the one thing Thunder heads near and far want most on this team. But as you might expect, Presti shut it down by sidestepping questions about PJ3′s ability to be an effective post scorer. “I think we have to be careful,” Presti said. “I think we have to get him in and kind of see where he is before we try to establish what it is he’s going to give us.”
PJ3 did not come to Oklahoma City for a workout. The Thunder saw him at the pre-draft camp in Chicago.
Presti on what about PJ3 to him has stood out the most over the past two years: “I think humility. I think he’s a very, very humble person.”
Asked about the conversation he had with PJ3 tonight, Presti declined to go into specifics. But he said PJ3 demonstrated his humility. “The first thing he did was thank us for the opportunity,” Presti said. “We’re excited about having somebody like that. He’s our type of person in terms of his approach and his humility.”
Presti said he anticipates PJ3 being with the team for the Orlando Summer League, which runs July 9-13.
With a starting five that is shaping up to include Reggie Jackson, Lazar Hayward, Latavious Williams, PJ3 and Cole Aldrich, the Thunder is quite likely to dominate the Orlando Summer League.
Not really Thunder related, but other notable rookies that could be competing in Orlando are Jared Sullinger and Fab Melo for Boston, Andre Drummond for Detroit, Mo Harkless for Philadelphia and Tyshawn Taylor for Brooklyn.
Taylor will be a great challenge for Jackson. I can’t wait to see that. If both are healthy and competing, it will go down Thursday, July 12 at noon.
I asked Presti about Jeff Green-gate. He declined further comment after NBA commissioner David Stern. But Presti did confirm that it is indeed Charlotte’s 2013 second-round pick that will be sent to Boston. I didn’t ask why it’s that one, which I am now kicking myself for failing to do. I’ll get that answer and get back.
Jones is scheduled to be introduced in OKC in the next couple of days. Nothing’s been set yet, but it seems likely to be Saturday.
Rick James
June 29th, 2012
10:40 pm
It is clear to everbody that nobody in the NBA wants to trade for Marvin Williams?
SteveW
June 29th, 2012
10:48 pm
Mike Scott has some tatt’s if anybody cares. It seems to be important to some on this blog for some reason.
SteveW
June 29th, 2012
10:49 pm
Mike Scott hitting about 17 treys in a row from various points is pretty impressive on his draft workout. Saw the video on youtube.
His J ain’t broke.
Melvin
June 29th, 2012
10:50 pm
Astro,
I like I told you last night, OKC pick PJ3 b/c he was available not just to let him sit on the bench to be develop in practice. If PJ3 pans out, Ibaka or Perkins will hit the road. This is how you keep cap flexibility by having young talent on rookie contracts on your roster and in player rotation.
“Thunder general manager Sam Presti: “We didn’t enter this draft thinking that Perry Jones would be there at 28 for us.”
“Perry Jones obviously is an extremely talented individual and somebody that we feel very fortunate to be able to add to our team,””
Doc,
You mention in the other blog that PJ3 had head/attitude issues. I follow this kid since his senior year in HS and I never heard anyone said he had attitude issues. I always heard that he was a very humble kid. Maybe he could use a stronger motor at times but never a problem child.
“Presti said he attended PJ3′s first college practice. “I remember it sticking out to me the fact that he was a freshman that was out there early before anybody else,” Presti said. “We feel really strongly about his work ethic in combination with a lot of physical gifts that he has.”
Presti said the him and his staff asked PJ3′s college coach, Scott Drew, to sum up PJ3 in three words. They were: “Great teammate, caring and humble.””
SteveW
June 29th, 2012
10:52 pm
Let’s face it – we drafted 2 pretty good kids, that we all hope succeed. Jenkins has no speed, is careless with the BB, will get his pocket picked a ton until he develops some moves.
That being said, he has a crazy good shot from all angles and directions, double teamed or wide open.
Scott can hit the J also. I think I see where this team is headed regardless of who is coach. We are getting some guys that can hit shots. That’s not a bad thing.
Slimjr
June 29th, 2012
11:00 pm
SteveW
June 29th, 2012
10:49 pm
“Mike Scott hitting about 17 treys in a row from various points is pretty impressive on his draft workout. Saw the video on youtube.
His J ain’t broke.” -Yawn-
Beware of the Legend of Marvin Williams..
Hey SteveW, it is alleged that in Marvin’s Pre-draft workouts with the Hawks he never missed a jumper and the rest as they say is history? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Slimjr
June 29th, 2012
11:07 pm
SteveW the NBA have some the worlds best athletes.. Guys at 6′8 and 6′9″ move as quick as 6′2″ guards..
Those uncontested jumpers become contested now..Mike will see defenses he’s never seen in college.. He will not see 3 second windows to get the shot off anymore…
He’ll be lucky to hit 3 out of 17 in this Pro game..
See All Get Real and his 1950’s set shot get shut down in the playoffs time and again because of the terrific closeouts by professional defenders….
The Real cp
June 29th, 2012
11:31 pm
Im still mehh on the draft. Benson will play for the Hawks summer league team.
steven a smith
June 29th, 2012
11:31 pm
Fire Coach Drew! Hire Hall of Famer kareem Abdul Jabar. Bring in “2 free agent centers” one named THABEET. Jabar can teach these “scrubs” how to play the center position…..
doc
June 29th, 2012
11:32 pm
Melvin it is all speculation for sure, however, there is a better reason than his knee unless it is in need of an operation, why he fell so far in the draft where fifteen to twenty teams will be shaking their head for missing. If he needs surgery thennhe wouldnt be a match here for an nba team that has six signed players and very little money tonspend on the other nine. Got it?
The head issue is related to work ethic. That wasnt mentioned in the three words, though those used were very complimentary. We got mature men and I think pj3 still has to grow into a man. You know I hope it happens in okc as I like that program as well. Again, I reiterate we didnt maybe do our home work to know more about the guy in the case he fell and couldnt just walk a limb and pick someone high on the yahoo or espn draft list that was an unknown physically and emotionally.
steven a smith
June 29th, 2012
11:32 pm
The Real cp
June 29th, 2012
11:31 pm
Im still mehh on the draft. Benson will play for the Hawks summer league team.
Benson is a bonafide “SCRUB’ and will never see an NBA basketball court as a player.
terrell
June 29th, 2012
11:33 pm
Bunch of wannabe GM’s dont know a thing about Jenkins or Scott. Yall just mad they passed on “your guy”. lol. Get over it. Same clowns that wanted Whiteside last year. Same clowns that said JC2 would be an allstar. Whateva!!
terrell
June 29th, 2012
11:35 pm
Thabeet?? I’m going to bed.
doc
June 29th, 2012
11:35 pm
You remember greg oden looked pretty good to most though he had obvious body issues going into the draft. It didn’t work out well for Portland.
Speaking of which, both the blazers and the hornets got the bigs and point guards we never did in our building process in one draft. That sucks.
steven a smith
June 29th, 2012
11:35 pm
doc
June 29th, 2012
11:32 pm
Have you been on Snoop Dogs’ touring bus? Can not understand your point…
Grandad
June 29th, 2012
11:35 pm
Slimjr
I don`t know if you saw my post last nite:
-but-
Mike Scott does not have a 1950`s set shot.
Slim;
i watched extensive video last eve and today.
Once again, I cannot believe I didn`t check this guy out beforehand.
i viewed tape of workouts and game tape.
*[not combine tape] …
*(instructional tape where he`s being worked by mentors / skill coaches)
This kid reminds me alot of our guy Andrew Nicholson:
*not as long & rangy
*better ouside stroke / actually beautiful smooth, easy release
*similar post game
*crafty
*high basketball IQ
*very good pick and roll defender
*and he plays his ass off
This was a very good pick !
I think you will like this kid.
Rufus1
June 29th, 2012
11:36 pm
PJIII is mentally soft…
He averaged 17pts a game is High school with that body… Really? This game is played on the court, not with a measuring tape. OKC can take a risk on an athletic scrub like PJII, because if he fails they will blame and not the team…. The Hawks, not so much.
The difference between Mike Scott/John Jenkins vs Marvin…. They were their teams #1 options. The means teams game planned to stop them, but they couldn’t … That matters!!!
TRUTH: Nobody like the way the Spurs win games, because it isn’t pretty.
Ferry is going to build this team as close to the Spurs as possible… Tony Parker is the PG and the ball is always in his hands and the inmates don’t run the asylum.
If Josh stays with the team this year or in the future….. Watch the jumpers come down and he will start giving the ball to Teague, because LD(Backed by the power of his GM) will no longer accept those losing plays by Josh.
We needed a new culture more than a new coach… The Culture is the engine, the Coach is the driver.
doc
June 29th, 2012
11:42 pm
Stephen what exactly did you miss there?
terrell
June 29th, 2012
11:42 pm
We were taking Marvin regardless of if he wa hittng every shot or not at his workout. WOODY DIDNT WANT ROOKIE PG. Hell, Marvin cant even walk straight, and they still took him. Shows how much they DIDNT want Paul or DWill. Stop bringing up the curse of 2005 when talking about Jenkins. Totally different players.
High-sider
June 29th, 2012
11:45 pm
High-sider has had TD’s (technical difficulties) like a big dog this evening.
doc
June 29th, 2012
11:47 pm
Is this better for you?
Melvin, it is all speculation for sure why pj3 fell to 29. However, there is a better reason than his knee, unless it is in need of an operation, why he fell so far in the draft, to where fifteen to twenty teams will be shaking their head for missing on him. If he needs surgery then he wouldnt be a match here as we are an nba team that has six signed players and very little money to spend on the other nine. Got it?
Slimjr
June 29th, 2012
11:47 pm
Okay Grandad, I will take a closer look at this guy..
Macaroni Tony
June 29th, 2012
11:49 pm
I wish Pape Sy can make the team again this time around; I will take him over Kirk.
Rufus1
June 29th, 2012
11:49 pm
LOl… Whitside, Larry Sanders and Derrick Williams..
Imagine if we would have traded Josh for Derrick Williams….. Wow. Some of you have the memories of NBA beat writers… Only remember the good picks.
O'Brien
June 30th, 2012
12:14 am
I like John Jenkins as a shooter, but I think the Hawks should have passed on him. There are always shooters/SGs available for a decent price in free agency. JR Smith, Jamal, OJ Mayo, Jodie Meeks, just to name a few. And who knows who else might become available.
I would have preferred to see the Hawks draft a front court player. PF/C/SF.
Rufus1
June 30th, 2012
12:23 am
????
Has Sund and his staff made a bad pick since they have been here? Sund has made some very, very, very bad center/ upside picks in his career…. Maybe he understand a bad BIG when he sees one.
I think Sund and LD understand shooters.. Green, Pargo, Vlad, JC1, JC2 and Ray Allen…. I think Jenkins is going to be a stud.
Melvin
June 30th, 2012
12:23 am
OB,
Cosign your 12:14 post. If the Hawks wanted to make sure they bring in a rotational player, that’s what Free Agency and trades are for. Shooters like Jenkins are a dime a dozen. And it’s not a guarantee that Jenkins will be NBA rotational player…. I would have prefer to see the Hawks gamble on a frontcourt player like PJ3 or Moultrie
High-sider
June 30th, 2012
12:35 am
@jhan
jhan
June 29th, 2012
5:38 pm
Astro is correct – James & Wade are both clean cut & well spoken athletes. Everyone is sporting tatoos these days so that means nothing. Gentleman or A-hole who cares – its all about what happens on the court.
—————————————————————————————-
jhan, I don’t think you truly realize or understand what hard-core “conservatism” and “traditionalism” represents and entails. LeBron James is tattooed from (damn near) head-to-toe and was born out-of-wedlock to a teenage mother. LBJ also has/had an “estranged” relationship with his father. LBJ is currently unmarried and has two sons that were born out-of-wedlock. D-Wade has gone through a (much-publicized) divorce and was recently caught on camera cursing at and arguing with Coach Spo’ during a timeout of a playoff game vs. the Pacers. D-Wade also has been wearing outlandish and bizarre clothing/attire. Both players (LBJ and D-Wade) are high-profile, super-rich, unmarried, heterosexual, (probably) virile, black male athletes – that alone (in and of itself) turns “off” a lot of conservatives and traditionalists.
Just because many of these (black male) athletes are expressing their “freedoms” and “liberties” doesn’t mean (that) the “conservatives,” “traditionalists,” and “silent majority” like what they (these {professional} athletes) are doing.
doc
June 30th, 2012
1:13 am
high sider, a basic rule in life. 1/3 will like you, 1/3 wont. it is the other 1/3 you have to worry about in almost any high profile existence.
so what is your point? not everyone of color is capable of being seen through this prism of yours? do you really think everyone is going to be accepting or like everything and everybody irrespective of color? you dont seem to be open and loving, so why so intolerant of others? let it go bro. you really are as sad to hear talk on this as some of the rednecks that didnt get civil rights, so stuck in the past and belief systems that i have had to listen to. have you ever looked into integral thinking and memes? maybe you might consider it to enlighten and gain some perspective.
right now you seem as stuck as this perceived enemy you fend off. you are like a quixotic man with a windmill, “the “conservatives,” “traditionalists,” and “silent majority”, in your mind to fight. everything you write about suggests that is all you see. you deserve a day with rush maybe as a desensitization treatment.
you certainly cant love your fellow man so why should these windmills you see to fight everywhere?
Grandad
June 30th, 2012
1:14 am
High-Sider
I`m a traditionalist, a basketball purist;
and when I coached I had alot of old fashioned guidelines.
But what has that got to do with the parents
from which my players came.
How could I judge my players based on their background and upbringing.
I said I was a traditionalist, a purist;
yet I`m not a conservative.
I consider myself a progressive.
Politically – I`m somewhere between a Socialist & a Libertarian.
Have fun trying to figure that one out.
*[politically somewhere between Jesus and Ron Paul]
**I believe in taking care of the poor;
and I also believe America cannot afford to run an Empire.
I was raised pore – that`s poor except worse !
I was raised by a single parent mother.
Father took off when I was a youngster.
Was I destined to be a bad person ?
D.Howard is supposed to be pristine and clean cut;
plus he is a Christian.
He has fathered a child … he is not married;
or at least not to the baby`s mother.
Can he still be a Christian, clean cut, good guy ?
Yes to all – if he chooses.
Are Republicans bad ? Yes
`cause we all are inherently bad.
Can Republicans be good ? of course.
George Bush was a bad President but a good man – I believe.
Nether one bad pres / good man:
has anything to do with skin color.
It is what is in his heart = good man.
It was what was in his mind [or not] = bad Pres.
You once alluded to atrocities that occured on this [our] soil.
The US of A.
What the Europeans did to the American Indians [native Americans]
was an atrocity.
Same for slavery in our country.
I mentioned the Jews and the Holocoust.
Reason:
We are all one people on this planet.
God made all human beings.
We are all in it together.
Love your fellow man and all mankind.
Basketball should remain pure.
Let`s keep it that way !
doc
June 30th, 2012
1:19 am
child bearing in our culture today white, blcak, hispanic or indifferent, etc is not exclusive to the labron’s and wealthy athlete’s either if you are inferring this. the out of wedlock birth is 41%.
source is cdc data.
High-sider
June 30th, 2012
1:23 am
@Grandad
“…In your attempt at racial bigotry;
you have stereotyped black people, white people, heck-fire;
you`ve stereotyped and offended everyone I can think of fella…
Toughness has no skin color, no race, culture, nationality, gender,
particular brand of faith, is neither yankee nor Southern, not young,
old, rich, poor, or anything in between…” -Grandad @7:11pm dated 6/29/2012
Your comment above was in response to my comment @4:49pm dated 6/29/2012 which did not even mention “black,” “white,” or a particular player’s race. Why are you so sensitive and uptight? Bill Laimbeer, Chris “Birdman” Anderson, Jeff Ruland, K. Fesenko, Zaza Pachulia, Brian Cardinal and Joe Klein are some basketball players that I would consider and describe as being “rough,” “rugged,” and “raw.” And guess what, Grandad? All of those (aforementioned) players are white. Yep, that’s right; they (those players) are white (players).
You should know (by now) I have no problems mentioning or discussing race (on this blog). Why are you so upset and angry? I’m the black man; I’m the one who should be angry, mad and bitter as hell (and I am {LOL}). You acted as if I said the American social, political and economic order (system) benefits white people, in general, and white males, in particular, and currently has a pro-white, white-supremacist agenda/policy – and it (the order/system) does.
43 of 44 US Presidents are/were white.
96 of 100 US Senators are white.
361 of 435 US Representatives are white.
Seven of nine US Supreme Court Justices are white.
481 of the Fortune 500 CEO’s are white.
Do you see (racial) (dis)proportionality? Do you see (racial) over-representation/under-representation?
You do the math. You add it up. And now, you book it.
If I’m a bigot, what would you call “the American way of life”?
doc
June 30th, 2012
1:24 am
btw i am truly sorry to hear of your difficulties h-s. i fight with technicals every day and know it is frustrating.
High-sider
June 30th, 2012
1:26 am
High-sider (is) experiencing technical difficulties.
“Somebody put ‘roots’ on me.” Where’s Miss Cleo? (LOL + LMAO)
Grandad
June 30th, 2012
1:30 am
0`B and Melvin
Two point – one for each.
(1) ” R Smith, Jamal, OJ Mayo, Jodie Meek “:
Of this group only Jodie Meeks is a pure shooter.
Smith is a streak shooter, while Mayo is a combo guard
who`s capable of doing much more and will be paid more.
I really think Mayo would be a terrific pick-up & a good match with Teague,
allowing JT to play off the ball some. OJM also is a terrific pick & roll pg.
Back to comparing with JJenkins;
Meeks is the only comparable and Jenkins is cheaper, regardless.
(2) ” Shooters like Jenkins are a dime a dozen ”
Melvin, I hate to disagree, but `elite’ shooters are hard to come by.
JJenkins is an elite shooter !
jhan
June 30th, 2012
1:39 am
H-S. Not sure what your point is. You can’t argue that those two are not well spoken. They have tatoos – who doesn’t these days? Hard core “conservatism” has multiple meanings depending on your social beliefs. You’ll have to expand for me.
High-sider
June 30th, 2012
2:01 am
@doc
doc, thanks for the sympathy regarding the technical difficulties (LOL). Hey, doc, I’ve just gone through years of racial discrimination and hatred in the “professional” workplace. doc, in order for you to find (out) why I am the way that I am, all you (would) need to do is (just) look at the “tag” on the back of my (shirt) collar because it will say/read “Made in America.” Get it, doc (LOL)? My experiences (in America) have made me what I am today. And some cynics would say, “Yeah, it’s (’the experience’) made you bitter.” And I would then respond, “Yeah, it’s (’the experience’) also made me wake up and be conscious (aware).”
Grandad
June 30th, 2012
2:02 am
High-Sider
” it’s a “(conservative) culture change thing”/approach. With the “Danny boy” (Ferry) at the helm, you can expect the Atlanta Hawks (franchise) to become the “Duke Blue Devils” of the NBA. The Atlanta Hawks will look to add players who are supposedly clean cut, upright, wholesome, have a positive image, have very little to no tattoos, have no checkered (chequered) past(s), “good guy” types.”
Once again you are parsing out segments of my post,
and taking what I said out of context.
You and I both know it.
My post crossed color lines, gender lines, socioeconomic lines,
and so on, and so on, and so on.
You, once again, focused in on color, making it as if I,
not you are the one with the bias.
My focus is trying to get you to understand:
” And now these three remain:
faith, hope and love.
But the greatest of these is love ”
- I Corinthians 13:13 -
Here are two tough guys:
Dennis Rodman & Shane Battier
*’`tough in different ways`’*
As opposite as nite is to day.
-Yet both tough-
You were the one who brought up tatoos and the like.
e.g.; Rodman = tough / the analogy was Ivan, I believe.
I`ve coached farm boys who are as tough as nails.
I coached against a bunch of tobacco farmers kids once.
Never could beat that bunch of hard workin` bruisers.
You missed the entire point of my post again.
Tough ain`t what you look like.
You cannot tell good from bad on the outside;
it is what is in one`s heart.
Grandad
June 30th, 2012
2:05 am
should have been
tobacco farmer`s kids
[ `s ]