Atlanta Hawks: Rick Sund Q-and-A
More from my interview yesterday with Hawks GM Rick Sund.
MC: What is your evaluation of the season?
Sund: There are two seasons. Once you become a real playoff team, there are two seasons. I thought we had an unbelievably great first season: 40 wins, key people hurt, the players and Larry [Drew] kept their focus. We ended up having the fourth-best record in the East. I thought with all the adversity it was really a great year with the compressed schedule and all the obstacles a team has to climb, which every team has those obstacles. I thought it was good.
The second part of the season is the playoffs and that’s disappointing. I think a great thing when you go through the [exit] interview process you get to talk to the players, and to a man—I still have a couple to do—but to a man they all think we should still be playing. And that’s a good thing. There’s disappointment in their heart. They look [at the playoffs] and feel they are good enough to be playing at the championship level.
MC: When you evaluate the team, are you able to separate out the effects of all the injuries from where you need to get better?
Sund: Two-and-a-half weeks after the season, you are a little bit more pragmatic. The emotions are out of the focus. When you look at it and you have to say, the last four years this team in the Eastern Conference has had the third-or fourth-best record either by the end of the regular season or by getting through the first round and getting to the second round. We’ve had the third- or fourth-best record in the last four years. Our goal is to get into those top two [in the East], because that’s when you have a legitimate shot to get to the finals. That’s that championship level. That’s the NBA’s version of the Final Four. You want to be one of those top two teams playing at the end of May and into June because you’ve got a legitimate shot to win a championship. We’ve fallen short of that. That’s our goal. Having said that, we have to look at our club and say where are the areas we can improve, what can we do without taking a step back. So we will have to explore all opportunities.
MC: The team’s deficiencies were mostly on offense, which came to fruition against the Celtics, a very good defensive team. From a personnel standpoint, how can the team improve offensively?
Sund: Again, you say separate the injuries, you really can’t, because if your key personnel are core members of your club, you are going to miss the points that that person may bring or the rebounds. I think we were one of the better defensive teams in the league, something last season we really wanted to focus on. I think Larry and the team did a great job. Points-wise it was Chicago one, Boston two, Philly three, Miami four, Memphis five, we are sixth. Defending in certain areas [like] field-goal percentage. In all of that, we really improved. I think that was the strength of our team. Now we have got to focus on, can we score a little more. Having said that, our offensive efficiency—which I know you are a big stat guy—was really good in the fourth quarter, particularly the last five minutes of the game. Joe [Johnson] in particular [was good] in crunch time. We were good in the fourth quarter, we were good in overtime games, close games. You are always looking at how you get better. I think some of that will come, if the team is the same, from [Jeff] Teague. Teague is going to continue to get better. He got a lot of easy shots for us in the playoffs for some of our players. Joe really improved his 3-point shooting. Marvin [Williams] shot the 3-pointer pretty good. You are asking me questions that really Larry should answer but I think, overall, the dialogue from the coaching staff and the management last year was [about] defense. We’ve got to focus on that and we can manufacture and we have enough talent to get shots.
MC: Why do you think things like good offensive efficiency in fourth quarter didn’t translate to the playoffs?
Sund: I haven’t really zeroed in on that. I think with the exception of the blowout game, all of the games—and we pretty much dominated Game 1-you take those two games out and the other four games were pretty close and could have gone either way. It was a missed shot here and a missed shot there.
MC: We saw the tension between Joe’s deliberate style that he likes to play and LD’s motion offense, something that he expressed his frustration about at one point. Can that tension be resolved with this personnel?
Sund: That question should be to Coach.
MC: Do you plan to extend a tender to Ivan [Johnson]?
Sund: I’m not going to comment on that right now.
MC: Will you try to sign Josh Smith to an extension?
Sund: I’m not going to get into contract stuff.
MC: Josh had a great year production-wise but–
Sund: I think it was the best year Josh has had, at least in the four years I’ve been here. I’ve said it for the record and I’ll say it again: Irrespective of how the voting came out, he should have been an All-Star. I thought Josh had an absolutely terrific year. He did a great job of making sure, hey, we lost some huge production with [Al] Horford and he picked it up.
MC: But his offensive efficiency fell off, and a large part of that is because he’s taking more shots away from the basket and not shooting–
Sund: You have to ask those questions to Larry.
MC: But from a personnel standpoint, do you think he fits with what Larry is trying to do offensively?
Sund: Yes.
MC: Does that mean the migration away from the basket–
Sund: Those are questions you have to ask Larry. I think he’s an All-Star player. He played a total All-Star caliber play this year. He’s been exceptional in the post. I thought his defense was great. He’s one of the better passing power forwards in the league. I think he had a very good year.
MC: Is it your perception Josh is still happy being here with the Hawks?
Sund: I’m going to have his exit interview sometime this week. But, yeah, when you read the things of him saying . . . He’s such a competitor. I was talking to his dad the other day, and he mentioned we all think we should be playing, and that’s great. And [Josh] is one of them.
MC: Can you discuss tour team salary situation going forward?
Sund: I don’t like to talk about it until we find out what the taxes are and the league does its audit. We are in a situation where we have six guys under contract and we will have to fill in either via trade, first-round pick, second-round pick. How much room [under the tax level] do we have to use the mid-level, the bi-annual. We have all of those exceptions. Its’ too early to say.
MC: Is it possible you may have to build the same way as last year, when you had to find some value with minimum-salaried guys?
Sund: Many of the good teams are going to have to finesse their way around and look at that as an option. If you don’t want to be a perennial taxpayer, you have to look at those options. . . . I thought our team this year had a legitimate chance to get to the one or two spot [in the East]. We ended up with the fourth-best record in the [East] but we thought we could still be playing. I asked ownership if we think we are going to have a chance to make a run at it, we are going to have to dip our toe into and go into the tax and pay a little bit of tax. And they did it with no problem. We are an official taxpayer this year and I thought that was a good move for us given the injuries.
MC: I know you probably haven’t had much chance to study prospects in detail, but do you have an idea of the quality of depth in the draft?
Sund: I’m a real division of labor guy and that’s Dave Pendergraft and Mike McNeive, they focus on that all the time. I am getting more involved. During the year I go out and see some people but really focusing in on the groupings, where we pick at 23 who is going to be there, who do I really need to look at, who do you like in the combines, who do you not like. Chicago [combine] has become a really good tool because it’s basically all interviews for two or three days. That’s turned out to be really more productive than even in the past, when they just play.
MC: Have you gotten a feel from Dave and Mike on what they think about the draft prospects?
Sund: They’ve handled the draft pretty good the last couple of years. We got a good player in Teague and we got a good player in [Jordan] Crawford, which we parlayed into [Kirk] Hinrich. They feel that we will get a quality player at the 23rd pick, or there are quality people there. There are a few people they like that they might want to move down to get. Who knows. It’s way too early to tell. The lottery is tonight and next week is when it really starts to focus.
MC: How do you think that Crawford trade turned out now that Hinrich’s contract is expiring?
Sund: We felt we could make a run last year. Not quite as good as this year [but] we had to get through Orlando. It was the first time in four years we didn’t have home-court advantage and many people picked Orlando to win the conference. And then we took the best team record-wise [the Bulls] where we won the first game and then won another game. Hinrich didn’t play in that [series]. We like to think if Hinrich did play we would have advanced that round. It’s just unfortunate he came in with the injury this year. But I don’t think there’s any question in my mind that we wouldn’t have advanced to the second round last year without Kirk on our team.
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
535 comments Add your comment
Najeh Davenpoop
June 4th, 2012
1:42 am
If Josh is traded for someone who isn’t better than Joe and Al, this is what will happen. Joe will revert to his ball-dominating 2009-10 habits, LD will do nothing to stop it, Teague and Al will continue to not receive nearly enough touches, and when Al does receive post touches, he will not convert them at a high enough rate to justify doubling him and opening up looks for others. The only way this changes is if Al goes to the Hakeem camp and learns how to create shots for himself and others in the post this summer.
Unfortunately, there is no stat that backs this up. Stats are nice when placed in context and used to supplement good observations. They are not the end-all be-all of everything that happens on a basketball court.
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
1:55 am
And this team should be running more pick and roll with Teague + whomever anyway. Let him run it with Horford and see what the results are.
Like I said, in this game Al showed off just about everything he could do, from offense to stellar defense.
And for Rod and High-Sider, I purposely start this video at the 2:02 mark, showing the BEAUTIFUL pick and roll Jamal and Al ran in that game.
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
2:16 am
Najeh Davenpoop
June 4th, 2012
1:42 am
If Josh is traded for someone who isn’t better than Joe and Al, this is what will happen. Joe will revert to his ball-dominating 2009-10 habits, LD will do nothing to stop it, Teague and Al will continue to not receive nearly enough touches, and when Al does receive post touches, he will not convert them at a high enough rate to justify doubling him and opening up looks for others. The only way this changes is if Al goes to the Hakeem camp and learns how to create shots for himself and others in the post this summer.
Unfortunately, there is no stat that backs this up. Stats are nice when placed in context and used to supplement good observations. They are not the end-all be-all of everything that happens on a basketball court.
*****************
Complete BS Najeh.
Because someone on this team would have to elevate their game if a player not of Josh’s caliber came to the Hawks. It’s not like JJ is going to start taking 20 shots a game if Josh wasn’t here. He’s only done that once in his career, when the best offensive person he played with was Tyronn Lue.
If JJ still has Teague and Al Horford beside him, all three of those guys are going to be heavily involved in the offense. Teague and Horford’s contributions will increase, because it would have to.
Unlike 2009 – 10, there would be no Josh Smith and no Jamal Crawford to provide offense, so Teague and Horford would have to do more by default. Marvin as well, if he were still here.
Shots per game in the 2009 – 10 season that you cite
Johnson: 18.2
Crawford: 14
Smith: 12.3
Horford: 10.5
Marvin: 8.2
Shots per game if Josh was replaced by a weaker player, especially if he was weaker offensively
Johnson: 17
Horford: 15
Teague: 12
Marvin: 10
But God forbid that our overpaid SG takes enough shots per game to possibly average 20 ppg again. And if he handled the ball more, maybe he even gets back to 5 assists per game. Nope . . no way would we want him to get more usage again.
Horford and Teague would answer the bell. Teague especially.
I’m surprised you don’t think that Teague as the PG wouldn’t get a chance to shine more without Josh in the mix. The fact that he’d get to bring the ball up the court almost full time, would increase his touches and shots by default.
With the lack of scoring threats on the team, Horford, Teague, and Marvin would have to do more. JJ isn’t going to turn into Kobe, and start jacking up 23 shots per game.
And even if JJ did play more ISO ball while holding the ball, he now has a better option in Al to pass the ball to at the end of the clock, if Al is 18 feet away from the basket playing PF.
Haha @ citing a season about JJ in which he made 3rd team All-NBA by averaging 21 ppg, average almost 5 rebounds and 5 assists, and shot 46% FG and 37% 3FG.
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
2:35 am
Josh Smith posted a 28.4% usage rate last year. JJ was at 24.9%
But you believe that if Josh was gone, and if the Hawks didn’t get a better player/shot creator than JJ or Al here . . that Horford and Teague wouldn’t be much more involved in the offense? Come on Najeh, you can do better than this.
Give Teague the dang ball, and see if he can handle the increased responsibility of running the team more.
Horford has never had a usage rate over 20% in his 5 years in ATL.
Keep JJ’s usage around 25%
Bump Horford up to around the 23% usage range
Increase Teague’s usage to 20 – 22%
Let the GUARDS actually run the offense for once, while the big men play like big men. And if a guy like Horford wants to be a playmaker every once in a while, that’s not a bad thing either.
Once again, you’re acting like Josh Smith was dishing out 6 assists a game last year. He’s a very good passing big man, but it’s not like the Hawks were solely dependent on his playmaking for the offense to function. Like JJ, he shot the ball much more than he found the open man.
High-sider
June 4th, 2012
3:14 am
A Hawks “crunch time” lineup that could’ve beaten the Celtics in the 2012 playoffs:
SG – Jamal Crawford
SG – Joe Johnson
Pnt. Frwd. [Point Forward] – Tracy McGrady
PF – Josh Smith, barring injury or Ivan Johnson, if Jo. Smith is injured
C – Al Horford, barring injury or Zaza Pachulia/Erick Dampier/Jason Collins, if Horford is injured
Grandad
June 4th, 2012
3:55 am
Najeh
” Stats are nice when placed in context
used to supplement good observations.
They are not the end-all be-all
of everything that happens on a basketball court.”
Never have truer words been spoken !
I`ve tried for 3 years to get folks around here to understand
exactly whaat you`re saying.
Not only stats, but positions as well, amongst a slew of other
preconceived notions.
You mentioned ” good observations ” … Excellent point;
A trained eye can spot a basketball player by watching him play.
The measureable help;
but whether or not a kid can play = watch him,
observe him play the game.
One watches Al play basketball;
the same person understands … Al gets it.
Al is a basketball player.
One watches Josh;
1st take = Josh does not get it;
still Josh is a basketball player.
[ignorant coaching aside]
My point don`t try and put labels on kids.
Let `em play.
We worry way too muh about whether or not so & so is a
[3], a[4], or a [5].
If`n you have three good players let `em play … don`t sit one
because of some label [position some man invented
and play a dork because he fits the mold
of some arbitrary position description.
Same with statistics:
we know who can play and who cannot.
We know who the bonehead is and who ain`t.
Same for who ain`t pullin` his wgt.
-or-
who really hustles, plays hard and works for the team;
and who just cashes their check.
We don`t need stats for that.
The same for trades:
I know who has ” True ” return trade value.
I know which kids are most likely to be keepers in the draft.
It`s in the *’`eye`’* of the beholder !
Some of which have been trained.
Sund of which are blind.
____________________________________________
Did I just make a Freudian typo ?
Sugar Ray
June 4th, 2012
4:32 am
Josh defenders can only use the “post moves” argument because that’s all they have. I mean, he trashed the fans (which includes YOU), he’s inefficient yet takes a lot of shots, he whines about Al Star games, he’s clearly losing explosiveness, yet these people believe he is the one to keep around.
Once again, the Hawks offense has been their downfall in every playoff loss and a HUGE reason for that is because their least efficient players are doing all the shooting. I don’t care if they can get their own shot if they are BAD shots clanging off the rim lol. Here’s the bottom line, the people want Josh to stay around because he’s the hometown guy and they like his dunks. That’s it. His basketball IQ is simply not high enough to lead this team anywhere because experienced teams like Boston and Chicago will bait him into his bad habits and his defenders will point the finger at someone else each time.
Notice the same people are trashing efficient players (Ginobilli, Gasol, etc), the players who are playing championship bball and winning rings…. yet you love these ISO heavy players who always have some excuse as to why their teams aren’t meeting expectations. It’s hilarious actually. A few years ago, ASG tied their future to two inefficient players Josh and Joe, just like you fans wanted but now you are complaining about the teams mediocrity? Why? This is what you wanted! Lol
EmirS.
June 4th, 2012
5:42 am
With Josh Smith gone…we are still a 4th – 6th seeded playoff team.
With Al Horford gone…we are still a 4th – 6th seeded playoff team.
IMO, these two players off set each other. Decide who to keep and then get pieces that compliment that player.
Just Joe
June 4th, 2012
7:11 am
Golden State is looking for a SF to add to their starting 5 of Curry, Thompson, ???, Lee, Bogut. They are targeting Iggy, Josh, Granger, and Rudy Gay using the 7th pick plus Richard Jefferson and Dorrell Wright.
I would offer them Joe Johnson and the 43rd pick for A. Biedrins, R. Jefferson, and the 30th & 35th picks.
It would give GS an incredible talented offensive team with the shooting of Curry, Thompson, and Joe surrounding the interior games of Lee and Bogut, plus they keep the 7th pick. They have to make free agent decisions on Bogut and Curry in 2 years, but they would control Thompson and this year’s 7th pick for the life of Joe’s and Lee’s contracts.
Hawks new GM would have his hands full next offseason trying to negotiate out of the $27M in player options to Marvin, Biedrins, and Jefferson. Otherwise, these guys are roster filler, no worse than Collins, Stackhouse, and Vlad.
Hawks would hold the 23rd, 30th, and 35th picks, and would need a lot of guard help.
Teague / ??? / ??? (Sund likes 3 PG’s)
??? / ???
Jefferson / Marvin
Smith / ???
Horford / Pachulia / Biedrins
Just Joe
June 4th, 2012
7:16 am
$27M to Marvin, Jefferson, and Biedrins is a lot of salary for 2013, but we are going to owe Joe, Marvin, and veteran minimum over $30M, as is. Can you get a guy like Jefferson to accept a buyout like Bibby took? Will Marvin take a discount for a new start? Biedrins, you hope can still turn things around enough to be a serviceable 3rd string center.
O'Brien
June 4th, 2012
7:21 am
northcyde,
Give Teague the dang ball, and see if he can handle the increased responsibility of running the team more..
This I agree with. Watching Boston play, it’s amazing how after the defensive rebound, they give the ball up to Rondo or Ray Allen almost every single time. What a concept.
But LD lets Josh run the break time and time again, despite being the “kamikaze” (LD’s quote) that he is.
O'Brien
June 4th, 2012
7:34 am
This past season, Josh had what could be considered a career year, averaged 19 pts, 10 rebs, 4 assists, 2.5 turnovers, and 2 blocks per game, while shooting 46% from the field.
Here is a question for my fellow bloggers.
Assuming Josh is not on the team, and Horford’s usage increases, what kind of numbers do you think Horford could/would put up?
Imo, I think he puts up a double double. 15 pts, 10 rebs, 3 assists, 2 turnovers, and 1 block per game, while shooting 48% (although he is a career 54% shooter from the field).
Buddy Grizzard
June 4th, 2012
7:47 am
“So Josh Smith can take 7 – 8 long range jumpers a game and reach 17 shots a game, but Al couldn’t?”
Al Horford two seasons ago LED THE LEAGUE in shooting percentage on long two’s. Not only COULD HE put up 7-8 long jumpers per game, but if your coach can’t come up with better offensive plays, that’s obviously THE GUY you want taking those shots.
“And this team should be running more pick and roll with Teague + whomever anyway. Let him run it with Horford and see what the results are.”
This is the most fundamental play in NBA basketball. The fact that the Hawks don’t run the pick and roll when you have a point guard with elite quickness who is elite attacking the basket is completely absurd. Yes, Teague’s jumper and passing ability are suspect. But when you’ve got a target like Al Horford who led the league in shooting percentage on long 2’s, that’s a BIG TARGET.
The Hawks’ inability to run the pick and roll is a coaching failure plain and simple. Larry Drew is not capable of teaching the pick and roll any more than he is capable of teaching Jeff Teague pick and roll defense. The two go hand in hand. If he could teach one, he could teach the other. This is why the Hawks don’t run the pick and roll.
Ray
June 4th, 2012
7:51 am
@ O’Brien
Both Josh and Al are almost identical as it stands just Josh is far more athletic is all. Yet Al has the fundamentals down which to me is very good.
I seriously LOL @ High-Sider for even suggesting that a lineup of
Jamal Crawford
Joe Johnson
T-mac
Josh Smith
Al Horford
would have beaten the Celtics this year probably would have been a 4-0 sweep by the celtics okay maybe that’s too far, but first off the only people on that lineup you’ll be able to truly count on is JJ, Josh, and Al.
How many times must it be said that Defense wins championships and every series is like a championship to get to get to the real one in the NBA Finals.
Jamal is a defensive liablity and for the 10-40 points he’d score he’d give up the same amount or more just being on the court.
T-mac is not a starter in my book he’s at best sixth man if someone gets injured sure he does become one, but not right off the bat.
Buddy Grizzard
June 4th, 2012
7:59 am
Najeh you are correct that Horford doesn’t command a double team but I see upside there. I think Josh has plateaued as a player. The fact that Drew hasn’t been able to reach Josh AND THE HAWKS RETAINED DREW means that nobody in the Hawks organization will EVER reach Josh. That ship has sailed. It could not have been more evident in the series against the Celtics that Josh doesn’t want to be a Hawk. Witness all of his bad passes, quitting on plays and the way he made a complete fool of himself trying to push the fast break.
So we know what we’re losing with Josh. Although he only averages 1 block per game more than Horford, the eye test shows me that Josh impacts the game far more by virtue of the intimidation factor. By trading Josh, the Hawks end a long standing redundancy with two big me who like to shoot jump shots. The good news is that Horford SHOULD shoot jump shots. The bad news is that Horford doesn’t intimidate anybody at the rim.
As far as Horford’s ability to set up teammates, Al has a carreer average of 2.4 assists vs. 3.1 for Josh. There’s not a huge difference in passing ability there. Al just needs to develop a go-to move, as you say, and then he can approach Josh’s effectiveness in setting up teammates out of the post. The good news is that I don’t think Al has plateaued as a player and that he WILL develop a post game. Meanwhile I also believe Josh focuses on his outside game because he is trying to preserve his knee. Josh is a ticking time bomb, and as Bret Lagree noted, the team that signs him to a near max contract is going to regret it.
Buddy Grizzard
June 4th, 2012
8:41 am
MC could you please moderate my last comment. Shouldn’t have used two links.
Buddy Grizzard
June 4th, 2012
8:42 am
Nash has said he will listen to any offer. If the Hawks want to counter the perception that they are not committed to pursuing an NBA title, they should at least make a pitch and get themselves mentioned in the Nash recruiting stories this summer.
Astro Joe
June 4th, 2012
9:40 am
Al once took over 13 FGAs/game during an entire month (a decent sample size). He averaged 17/10 and over 3 assists in December, 2010. So yeah, I think that he can deliver more production while still being very efficient (he shot 55% that month).
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/splits/_/id/3213/year/2011/al-horford
Astro Joe
June 4th, 2012
9:45 am
Pick & roll? Pick & roll? We have Professor Drew at the helm. Pick & roll is for high school coaches. Our head coach is running schemes so complex it requires a special camp just to teach the players how it’s done. Pick & roll… you really want to go back to the stone ages when we have a highly sophisticated and special offense that excited this blog community about 2 summers ago. Pick & roll? That is what a head coach uses who doesn’t give a dang about offense. Pick & roll? That’s like asking the guys to wear tight shorts and shoot into a peach basket. Pick & roll? Baby, please.
O'Brien
June 4th, 2012
10:18 am
AJ,
Just watching the teams in the playoffs run it, I can’t understand why we don’t. It reminds me of the previous Falcons OC who never called/ran screens. I don’t get it.
MC,
I assume you will do an interview with LD at some point. Could you ask him how come we don’t run more pick and roll, and how does he feel his motion offense has evolved (since offense has been our biggest issue)?
Astro Joe
June 4th, 2012
10:44 am
OB, other teams run pick & roll because they don’t have an offensive genius like Drew on the sideline. Pick & roll involves a 2-man attack, we have a 5-man attack offense.
Hawks Blog Legend Worldwide Clyde
June 4th, 2012
10:49 am
“Pick & roll? Pick & roll? We have Professor Drew at the helm. Pick & roll is for high school coaches. Our head coach is running schemes so complex it requires a special camp just to teach the players how it’s done.” – Astro Joe
FIRE LD
Rod from College Park
June 4th, 2012
10:51 am
“Al Horford two seasons ago LED THE LEAGUE in shooting percentage on long two’s. Not only COULD HE put up 7-8 long jumpers per game, but if your coach can’t come up with better offensive plays, that’s obviously THE GUY you want taking those shots.”
That’s like saying Marvin Williams is a great shooter because he shoots at a high percentage. If you did not notice, Al led the league in shooting percentage because he was playing center, and guys like Hibbert, Shaq, Lopez, and Bogut would not come out of the paint and defend the 15 foot jump shot in the regular season. He was getting open looks against centers outside of the paint, because of Josh Smith and Joe Johnson. Remember Al does not want to be a center, he wants to be a power forward. Those guys will be able to close out on his jumper, and play his right hand, and his offensive game will be useless. See the Chicago series last year. I am in no way hating on Al. I like him, but right now he has a nice set shot, no left hand, and a very weak post game. Very easy for teams to take him out of the game offensively. Can he work on his game and get better? Yes, but he is very robotic and easy to take out of the game offensively if he became a focal point.
Another thing you need to realize is that no matter what the numbers say, people think twice about driving when Josh is in the paint. They don’t with Horford. Josh affects way more shots than he blocks. Guards go at Horford like he does not even exist. See Brandon Jennings and Jameer Nelson in the playoffs against us. I am in no way saying don’t trade Josh. You better get scoring and defense if you do, because if not the layup line will begin.
Grandad
June 4th, 2012
11:58 am
Yeah;
Al only makes shots when he plays center.
opposing Coaches are stupid and do not match up accordingly.
It`s Rec league,
and the NBA has a match-up at the center circle
before each game to decide who guards who ?
Teams never switch on screens either.
Yeah;
if Horford were playin` the [4] those shots would not go in.
Of course;
he cannot get his own shot anyway;
[so yawl say]
so why does it matter which position he plays ?
Boy oh Boy;
he has no post moves … so he`s not a center,
which yawl say he refuses to play.
He hits outside shots;
but they wouldn`t go in if he were playin` [4] because …
well because a Center ain`t guardin` him !
With Al;
It don`t matter with yawl;
wherever he plays … no matter his production …
someone will have a reason that decries his ability.
Admit it;
he ain`t your boy, he threatens your boy Josh [for some reason]
and you folks are gonna tear him down for that reason.
No logic !
Shameful.
_____________________________________________
If you detected any sarcasm – you may be right.
Dawg
June 4th, 2012
12:03 pm
Other teams are working out players. The Hawks are busy trying to find the least expensive combination of GM and coach.
MC: What has the Hawks organization done to inspire any confidence at all for the fans? The are a 2nd rate organization and that is not even open to debate.
Do you think the heat would have had a broken scoreboard all season? Do you think the Mavericks would have a GM with out the internet?
Rod from College Park
June 4th, 2012
12:24 pm
“Admit it;
he ain`t your boy, he threatens your boy Josh [for some reason]
and you folks are gonna tear him down for that reason.”
Nothing to admit. I want what’s best for the Hawks. Josh should do what’s best for Josh. The facts remain that last year in the playoffs when Al was able to play his coveted PF position against Orlando, and matched up against Noah, Bass and other PF’s in the playoffs his FG% dropped from 55% (great) during the regular season to 42% during the playoffs simply because those teams decided not to leave him open from 15 ft, and his ppg dropped from 15.3 to 11.3 Those are facts. No hate involved at all. He can improve his game, just like Josh has, but at this point he does not have the skills to be a go to guy. If he takes more shots, his effeciency will go down just like every other basketball player. He is not as good as Josh is offensively or defensively period. He has a better jump shot, and plays more under control that’s it.
O'Brien
June 4th, 2012
12:45 pm
From hoopshype;
There is an excitement and buzz around the Sacramento Kings right now following the recent announcement of DeMarcus Cousins making Team USA’s Select Team..
Ra’mon,
I don’t think they will give up on Cousins. Melvin proposed Tyreke Evans and #5 for Al, but I only make that deal if I know that Josh will re-up.
Did anyone see Rondo’s interview at the end of the first half? Doris Burke asked Rondo what Boston is exploiting. His response: “They’re complaining and crying to the referees in transition”. I think Josh is guilty of that at times, so hopefully that will be out of his system for this season.
Ra'mon
June 4th, 2012
12:56 pm
Listen, you guys are talking about can Al produce, but that’s the wrong question. Half of the NBA players can produce with more touches. The question to ask is, can the Hawks win consistently if Al gets more touches and you have no Josh Smith on the court. That is the question. The Hawks posted a better record for when Josh scores 20+ points than even when Joe scores that amount. Why? Because although Josh gets many attempts, he does so while still finding the open man, and keeping teammates involved. So the question is will the Hawks win with Al playing that role. Because greater than just looking at Al replacing Josh’s production, you have to look at Joe’s inability to consistently be the number 1 option on a winning team as well. So now you’re left with the question do you have anyone to consistently be the focal point of the team, without the Hawks missing a top 6 seed of the playoffs for a FULL 82 game season. And without Josh, I don’t believe so. Offensively Gasol could do it. But he’s about the only being even mentioned on this blog who could.
Astro Joe
June 4th, 2012
1:04 pm
Ra’mon, I thought the Hawks were the same before/after the All-Star break. And you may recall that Josh played better after his All-Star selection snub. I think they were +6 wins on both sides of that milestone.
Josh is more of a one-man machine than Al, but that doesn’t mean thet TEAM is better. In fact, I’d argue that Teague would be better with Al than with Josh (if it came down to those two guys), because Al would be more willing to let Teague do crazy things like lead a fast break, develop his facilitiation skills and even use some of his natural scoring skills. I’m fairly sure that when Teague made the childish mistake of not shooting the ball in a game last season (or maybe it was a half, I’m not sure), it was related to Josh making some off-hand comment about the PG needing to pass more.
Josh will always be a better fantasy player than Al, but I;m not sure that Josh is always a better teammate for a team looking to make it to the ECF.
Ra'mon
June 4th, 2012
1:06 pm
O’B, many times Pierce, Allen, and Garnett are guilty of that very same thing, and lets not talk about the Lakers, lol. Cousins doesn’t sell tickets, and I really believe they would think that an all star center would do that in a city that won’t support a new arena. But I think if the Hawks did trade Horford for Tyreke and that pick, I think the Hawks would be able to re-sign Josh. I really believe that would show Josh the Hawks are committed to TRYING different things to win. Josh doesn’t WANT to leave. But he feels he NEEDS to leave to win a title and to be cast in the light of good players of the public.
drmaryb.(*_*).
June 4th, 2012
1:07 pm
Issues!
The iSSUES with this teams composure and dynamics has always been succumbing to ONE constant:
Coaching Prowess. The true concept of team leadership just has not been there. The roles for the players of this team has never been enforced therefore, never realized consistently. I may have personally witnessed five perfectly played games in seven years – imho.
I wont even address the ownership boonked over the 4×4x4 cardboard bargain bin @ the local Dollar Tree Stores, scrounging for all those [ 2 for $1.00 ] player deals.
Pfffttt …
Jody
June 4th, 2012
1:09 pm
What about Josh for Tyreke Evans and the 5th pick?
Buddy Grizzard
June 4th, 2012
1:11 pm
“If you did not notice, Al led the league in shooting percentage because he was playing center, and guys like Hibbert, Shaq, Lopez, and Bogut would not come out of the paint and defend the 15 foot jump shot in the regular season.”
The whole league leaves Josh open. Would you rather have the guy who shoots 37% from outside taking that shot, or the guy who led the league two seasons ago?
Ra'mon
June 4th, 2012
1:15 pm
AJ, in the two games against Boston, Al lead over a total of 6 fast break attempts, AND he brought the ball up even with Teague right there in the HALF COURT sometimes. Al does that just as much as Josh does. And AJ, the Hawks were 23-7 when Josh scores 20+, with three of those losses being under three points (Miami, Det, and Boston).
Astro Joe
June 4th, 2012
1:20 pm
Ra’mon, Josh is playing with an All-Star center and a perennial All-Star wing who are both locked up to long-term contracts. If Josh has an issue with a lack of talent on the roster, hopefully it is related to the non-captains.
Of course, I think his issues are more related to Josh Smith and not his teammates. Issues about contracts, support for All-Star games, post-season accolades, fans that make audible sounds when he shoots jumpers, etc. Again, all issues that are very specific about Josh. IMO, Josh needs a hug, a very public hug from the ASG. I guess that could come in the form of trading away one of more of the captains and declaring him the “King of Philips Arena”.
Ra'mon
June 4th, 2012
1:22 pm
Jody, of course I would do that deal. Of course I would PREFER if it was Joe for Tyreke and the 5th pick. That would be a dream come true, lol. The Kings get a borderline Star.
Astro Joe
June 4th, 2012
1:28 pm
Ra’mon, Al does lead the fast break, but not nearly as often as Josh. While I personally hate the idea, the head coach likes the idea (of a big leading the break). Josh likely commits more TOs than Al when leading the fast break AND (as important) Josh is a top 5 fast break finisher who sub-optimizes the team’s odds of converting the opportunity by not filling the lane. And on this team, Josh is head and shoulders better than anyone at finishing the fast break. Lastly, when Josh runs the break, too often, we see him pass to the wing because he views Joe as a better scoring option in those situations. Joe shooting an open 3 is NEVER as good of an option as Josh filling the lane on a faast break. LD obviously feels differently, but my humble opinion is that Josh leading a fast break becomes a 50/50 proposition, and a fast break should represent better odds than flipping a coin.
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
1:29 pm
Astro Joe
June 4th, 2012
9:40 am
Al once took over 13 FGAs/game during an entire month (a decent sample size). He averaged 17/10 and over 3 assists in December, 2010. So yeah, I think that he can deliver more production while still being very efficient (he shot 55% that month).
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/splits/_/id/3213/year/2011/al-horford
***********************
The interesting thing about that player page, is that it shows Al’s stats when he started at center and when he started at forward. Here are his stats when he started at forward:
15.9 ppg ( on 11.9 shots )
8.6 rebs
3.0 asst
1.0 blks
59% FG
77% FT
One of the reasons why his FG attempts increased that month, was because JJ was out of the lineup for 9 of those games.
To answer O’Brien’s question . . . if Horford got 15 shots a game, like I expect he would in the absence of Josh ( and if a lesser offensive player replaced him ), he’d easily average 18 ppg and shoot 50% FG.
JJ would probably still be the focal point, but Horford would be the undisputed #2 option, that functioned as a #1 at times. Whether people believe or not that he could get it done like a true #1 option isn’t the issue. He’d be USED like he could get it done out of necessity.
The other thing is this. Horford will STILL play center at times. If we have to roll with him and Zaza, Horford will still play center in stretches. And he’d play it more during those times in which Zaza is ineffective or if we’re playing an up tempo team.
Team Al with Gasol, and I could see both guys averaging about 13 – 14 shots a game, while JJ may only be around the 16 shot mark. Offensively, Gasol and Horford would compliment each other very well. And both are good enough on defense to not make the paint a “lay up line”.
Ra'mon
June 4th, 2012
1:29 pm
AJ, two seasons ago Josh played with that and a 6th man of the year. This season Josh only played with an all star who was injured majority of the season. As I said before, Zaza replaced Al in the starting lineup for majority of the season, and the Hawks STILL manage to get the same seed for the playoffs. You say you think Josh just need a hug. But then you were ANAKIN’ JOE for how long? So you saw as well that this team couldn’t win a title or compete for anything. So why is it wrong if Josh sees that this team as constructed can’t compete for an ECF title and a Finals appearance. Josh wants to play with D12, or reportedly goto Boston. In BOTH scenarios, he’s not the Alpha Dog on those teams, yet you say he wants to be “King of Philips Arena”. That doesn’t add up. Josh isn’t asking to go to Charlotte or Cleveland where he can shoot as much as he likes. I love that Josh wants to play basketball in the month of June. And if Josh doesn’t feel like he can do that in Atlanta, he will go somewhere else where he can. I love that about him. I want 12 guys on my team who have that same mentality.
Ra'mon
June 4th, 2012
1:36 pm
Listen, to me there are only 4 guys in the league that I wouldn’t trade (Lebron, Durant, Rose, and Kobe in his prime). So either of the big three for the Hawks can be traded, and should be considered for trades. I’ve posted trade ideas for all three players on this very blog. Actually two weeks ago, I posted a trade proposal of Al AND JOSH to the Kings for Cousins, Thompson, and their pick. I’ve said if Houston would take Josh for Lowery and their picks do it. But I don’t think they will because he’s a free agent coming up.
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
1:45 pm
And this is Pau Gasol vs the Celtics back in February.
Three things stand out in this clip
- the passing
- the offensive rebounding
- the playing 15 feet and in
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
1:46 pm
Let’s try this again.
Gasol vs the Celtics
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
1:47 pm
LOL . . . or we’ll just do it like this and see if it works
Gasol vs the Celtics back in February
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJ-8BOuqJy8
Astro Joe
June 4th, 2012
2:16 pm
Ra’mon, I do not believe this is a top 2 Eastern Conference team. Nor do I believe that Josh wants to win as much as I believe that Josh wants to play with a buddy. I think he needs a hug and has been hearing from Rondo about the love he receives from Boston fans and he is fully aware of the adoration that exists for Howard (although that appears to be waning league-wide). Yes, I do believe that he has a burning desire to win and I admire that passion. I also admire his passion to be great, even if that creates issues. But I don’t believe that he is terribly interested in the Hawks getting better, I think at this point he is mostly interested in improving his own situation (in tis case, mutually exclusive things). If I played for the Hawks and truly wanted to see the team do/get better, I’d “cut the line” to get into Sund’s office for a post-season debrief. I’d provide an opinion on the head coach while the front office is deciding his fate. I’d leak stories about how the ownership should use the MLE. And I would ensure that I know all of my options relative to signing an extension. Instead, Josh is saying that he can’t sign an extension, had not met with Sund as of last week’s MC report and seemingly has one foot out of the arena. I don’t blame Josh for putting Josh first… but don’t expect me to put any single hawk above the team. I’ll be cheering for the Hawks when Josh is bouncing his grandkid on his knee.
Rod from College Park
June 4th, 2012
2:42 pm
“The whole league leaves Josh open. Would you rather have the guy who shoots 37% from outside taking that shot, or the guy who led the league two seasons ago?”
Precisely, they leave him open because they realize that is one of his weaknesses. So now that the league realizes that if you stay up on Horford to prevent the open jump shot, and play his right hand then what will he do? He will do what he did in the playoffs against Chicago unless he improves. Same difference. 42% in the playoffs. Looks kind of like Josh’s #’s huh. LOL
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
2:43 pm
Astro . . exactly.
I personally don’t blame Josh for wanting to leave, if he thinks another situation will be better for him personally. Players do that all the time. Josh is a lightning rod in ATL. He gets a lot of praise when he plays well and the team wins, but a tremendous amount of blame when he’s bad and the team loses. Probably more than he deserves, but like with JJ, that comes with the territory when you’re one of the lead guys on the team.
It’s funny though. Josh is the one expressing that he wants out of ATL, but people are trying to trade away everyone BUT Josh.
northcyde
June 4th, 2012
2:47 pm
Rod from College Park
June 4th, 2012
2:42 pm
“The whole league leaves Josh open. Would you rather have the guy who shoots 37% from outside taking that shot, or the guy who led the league two seasons ago?”
Precisely, they leave him open because they realize that is one of his weaknesses. So now that the league realizes that if you stay up on Horford to prevent the open jump shot, and play his right hand then what will he do? He will do what he did in the playoffs against Chicago unless he improves. Same difference. 42% in the playoffs. Looks kind of like Josh’s #’s huh. LOL
**********************
This is funny coming from you. Because when people bring up Jamal’s 33% FG shooting in the Bulls series, you break your neck trying to cite what he did in the Orlando series. Chicago neutralized Horford, and they damn sure neutralized Jamal.
Just like every team in the league isn’t going to hold Jamal to 33% FG, every team in the league isn’t going to hold Horford to 42% FG shooting. The difference though, is that the 33% Jamal shot is closer to his norm, than 42% is to Horford’s norm.
Increase Horford’s usage, and he probably doesn’t shoot 55%. He’ll be in the 48 – 50% range.
KevinM
June 4th, 2012
2:56 pm
“Buddy Grizzard
June 3rd, 2012
7:51 pm
By the way, anybody read that John Wall wants the Wizards to draft a 2-guard? I guess Adam Morrison 2.0 a.k.a. Jordan Crawford wasn’t the answer after all.”
Buddy, how would JC2 look on this team now? Could his game force Josh back to the block? JC2 very affordable and he fits the style of this offense.
“northcyde, Marvin 14/6 in 35min?”
I gotta ask; if Marvin isn’t worth a 2nd rounder, than why would we play him 35mpg? We must be at a really bad place to give Marvin 35mpg.
Northcyde, great Gasol highlights and he is still Top 20 IMO. But you gotta move Joe for him. No way we can afford 2 19M guys. That weakens our perimeter big time, so add’l changes are critical.
“EmirS.
June 4th, 2012
5:42 am
With Josh Smith gone…we are still a 4th – 6th seeded playoff team.
With Al Horford gone…we are still a 4th – 6th seeded playoff team.
IMO, these two players off set each other. Decide who to keep and then get pieces that compliment that player.”
Makes sense to me Emir….it would be wishful thinking that Sund would take such an agressive step to try and improve this team. My guess is it would have to have money savings or it wouldn’t happen.
My thought: move Josh because its easier to get a cheaper SF than trying to meet his contract demands. I don’t think he settles for an Al Horford contract even as a hometown discount. And if he becomes an all-star elsewhere, I don’t think it will be at SF.
Ra'mon
June 4th, 2012
3:17 pm
Its funny, though asked NUMEROUS times by many different people, Josh has never SAID he wanted out. In the day of so many media outlets, I don’t remember the last guy who wanted to be traded for so long, but done it so quietly. Josh has only said he will not extend yet, and that he’s not been offered an extension thus far.
Buddy Grizzard
June 4th, 2012
3:18 pm
“Buddy, how would JC2 look on this team now? Could his game force Josh back to the block?”
JC2 doesn’t see the floor on a playoff team. That’s why John Wall wants the Wiz to draft a 2 guard… because he wants to go to the playoffs.