Johnson unhappy with limited number of shots

Vivlamore reporting from Philips Arena, the day after the Hawks’ Game 4 loss to the Celtics.

A day later, Joe Johnson was at loss for words about the Hawks’ embarrassing Game 4 loss to the Celtics that has the team on the brink of playoff elimination.

His one-word answer to a question on his number of shot attempts spoke volumes.

Johnson took just eight shots in Sunday’s 101-79 loss to the Celtics, who are up 3-1 in the best-of-seven series heading into Game 5 Tuesday at Philips Arena.

“I don’t think they are doing anything different defensively on me,” Johnson said. “I think it’s just, basically, getting an opportunity to touch the ball. That’s it.”

When asked if he was not happy with his touches, Johnson answered with a simple, but emphatic, “No.”

Here is what some others had to say about Johnson’s lack of shots in Sunday’s game:

Larry Drew: “We run a lot of things through him. He’s got to be more aggressive in working to get his shots and we have to be mindful when he hasn’t had a shot in one or two trips down the floor we’ve got to get him the ball. All the things that we do run, and we do run a lot of things where we do go through him, I give Boston a lot of credit on how they have defended him. Collectively, while they are out there they have to get him the ball more. Just watching the film in flying back last night there were a number of situations where we could have just made one extra pass and the extra pass would have been to him. We’ve just got to be a little bit more mindful to make sure he is getting touches.”

Jeff Teague: “We’ve got him the ball in Game 3. He got a lot of touches. Last night, they took us out of our stuff and made it difficult to get him the ball. We will try to make a conscious effort in Game 5 to get him the ball and make sure he makes plays for us.

“He is our go-to player. Eight shots is not enough, especially in a playoff game for a guy who can play like him. We’ve got to make sure we get him the ball.”

Al Horford: “Joe is our main guy. We go to him. We has to get us going offensively so he needs to go out there and be an enforcer and make his presence felt. I don’t think my shots or Erick Dampier’s shots are affecting him. I think Joe needs to be aggressive. He needs to go out there and score the ball. That’s when we are at our best when he does that.”

This will be the subject of today’s story for the print edition. You can read the entire story online later. However, feel free to leave your comments on Johnson and his thoughts here.

358 comments Add your comment

Ray

May 8th, 2012
8:51 am

Actually I don’t know what the Braves are doing let me be real about that but for GT and Falcons they will try to make the smartest moves to get them to a NC.

Slimjr

May 8th, 2012
8:55 am

Why wait Mr. Blank?

—————————————————–

I like Matt Ryan, just dont like his game..2-3 more years it will take for the Fal-cons to figure out its the QB position that needs upgrading…Hmmmmmmmm

Phil Jackson could not win a SB with this throwback…

Ray

May 8th, 2012
9:02 am

I wish Blank would buy the hawks at least he’d see that this franchise needed a new direction some time ago around the time we got swept by the Cavs.

beijing massage VU

May 8th, 2012
9:05 am

Some of the points you to write this article,I agree, very exciting.

High-sider

May 8th, 2012
9:16 am

“”The reserves have not been a factor in the playoff series with the Celtics through the first four games. It is part of the reason the Hawks find themselves trailing 3-1 in the best-of-seven series.

Marvin Williams, who started Game 3 in the absence of Josh Smith (knee), has made just 5-of-23 shots (.217) in the series. Pargo has made just 6-of-21 shots (.286) and Willie Green has made 6-of-13 shots and only one 3-pointer. Ivan Johnson has converted 5-of-16 shots (.313) and played just 6:26 in Sunday’s Game 4 loss.

The Hawks bench combined to score 17 points in the 83-74 Game 1 win. Reserves scored just 14 in the 87-80 Game 2 loss and 25 in the 90-84 Game 3 loss..” – ajc.com reposted by O’brien

Paging Rod from CP, who predicted all season long that the bench would not be productive in the playoff…” – O’brien

Near the end of my assessment [grading] of the Hawks’ regular season performance, I, High-sider, predicted that the very player [Jamal Crawford] the Hawks might need the most this postseason is the same player that the Hawks “let walk” for nothing. I knew that the non-re-signing of Jamal Crawford would be the undoing of the Hawks in the postseason this year. I will admit, however, that the Hawks’ regular season performance this year far exceeded my expectations. But that’s what happened; the Hawks overachieved in the regular season this year, especially with the Al Horford injury, just like the Hawks underachieved in the regular season last year.

Through the first three playoff games this postseason, the Hawks’ bench [from the article above] has scored a combined total of 56 points. On the other hand, Jamal Crawford, in his first three playoff games in last year’s postseason with the Hawks, scored a combined total of 71 points [off the bench]. In Game 4 of the first round vs. the Celtics, the Hawks’ bench scored a combined total of 46 points but the starters scored a combined total of 33 points. In Game 4 of the first round vs. the Magic, Jamal Crawford scored 25 points [off the bench]. Through the first four playoff games this postseason, the Hawks’ bench has scored a total of 102 points while Jamal Crawford, through his four playoff games last postseason with the Hawks, scored 96 points.

I never understood why Rick Sund [or Rick "Dumb"] didn’t [continue to] “go with what worked” – that is, [to] keep Jamal Crawford as an explosive sixth man and/or complementary [prolific] scorer for the Hawks. Personally, I feel Rick Sund has [or had] an “erection” for Kirk Hinrich and wanted to keep Hinrich over Crawford. Another part of me feels [that] the decision to keep Hinrich [white] over Crawford [black] was a bit racial but that’s my assumption/opinion. Jamal Crawford proved to the Atlanta Hawks franchise that he was a valuable scorer in the regular season and the postseason during his tenure with the Hawks. After this postseason’s [potential] first round exit, maybe, GM Rick Sund and the ASG will see the error[s] of their ways and re-sign Jamal Crawford next regular season. I hope GM Rick Sund and the ASG are not too proud to admit they made a mistake [in not re-signing Jamal Crawford]. Jamal Crawford was a good fit for the [Atlanta] Hawks and the Hawks [franchise] was a good fit for him [Crawford].

Astro Joe

May 8th, 2012
9:21 am

Again, if you’re looking for why the Hawks are down 3-1, I think you have to look at everyone, regardless of income bracket or experience. Bloggers are too quick to take the easy way out and focus on a single issue. I’ve said it for years, this is an ensemble cast… the Hawks typically win on the shoulders of 3-4 players who produce above average results in a given game, not on a single hero who emerges through the cloud of dust like an Avenger. Some of you continue to confuse fiction with reality.

How many times did we watch someone like Willie Green, Ivan, Pargo, Teague or Zaza have a wonderful game to complement Joe and Josh (even TMac had a moment or 3 during the season)? My guess is about 40-something times during the 66 game season. But now, we’re supposed to pretend that when playing the best teams that one guy is supposed to carry the load?

If you’re looking for blame, check out the match-ups across the board and I promise you, you won’t stop at Joe’s feet if you are anything close to being objective about things.

I fully expect the Hawks to blow doors tonight… that is the pattern from the past few years. In fact, I’m already predicting a game 7 defeat at Philips. But the notion that our starting PG is faultless, our new number 1 scoring option should go unscathed and we should expect Joe to morph into something he hasn’t been his entire career makes about as much sense as playing Twin at PG. If you cheered the success of the ensemble during the regular season, how do you turn around and use a single finger to find fault?

And Najeh, try not to read so selectively in the future, or scroll.

CHUCK NORRIS

May 8th, 2012
9:31 am

This season is all but over. So while its interesting to see the comments, its even more intriging to start looking forward to the off-season.

Its really obvious now that after 5 seasons, that “Core” is contaminated and definitly in need of some DECON. And yes, this team is still in desperate need of a SF and REAL CENTER!

These are just some of the FA’s to go after.

Point G
Roddy Beaubois, Dallas Mavericks – $2.2 million – Restricted ($3.3 million Qualifying Offer)
Jarrett Jack, New Orleans Hornets – $5.4 million – Unrestricted

Shooting G
Jimmer Fredette, Sacramento Kings – $2.3 million – Team Option ($2.4 million)
Tony Allen, Memphis Grizzlies – $3.3 million – Unrestricted
Iman Shumpert, New York Knicks – $1.6 million – Team Option ($1.7 million)
J.J. Redick, Orlando Magic – $6.2 million – Unrestricted

Small F
Paul George, Indiana Pacers – $2.6 million – Team Option ($3.3 million)
Derrick Williams, Minnesota Timberwolves – $4.8 million – Team Option ($5.0 million)
Kyle Korver, Chicago Bulls – $5.0 million – Unrestricted
Omri Casspi, Cleveland Cavaliers – $2.3 million – Restricted ($3.3 million)
Luke Babbitt, Portland Trail Blazers – $1.9 million – Team Option ($2.9 million)

Power F
Lamar Odom, Dallas Mavericks – $8.2 million – Unrestricted
Serge Ibaka, Oklahoma City Thunder – $2.2 million – Restricted ($3.2 million Qualifying Offer)
Paul Millsap, Utah Jazz – $8.6 million – Unrestricted
Derrick Favors, Utah Jazz – $4.8 million – Team Option ($6.0 million)
DeJuan Blair, San Antonio Spurs – $1.1 million – Unrestricted

Center
Samuel Dalembert, Houston Rockets – $6.7 million – Unrestricted
Timofey Mozgov, Denver Nuggets – $3.1 million – Unrestricted*
Nikola Pekovic, Minnesota Timberwolves – $4.8 million – Unrestricted*

I think with their current finacial situation, the ASG has to make a decision on keeping either Horford or Josh cause they are stuck with JJ. Thats something the whole league knows. Also, i think this will be Josh’s last season in Atlanta.

How about a lineup for 2013 of:

PG Teague/Pargo
SG JJ/JJ Redick($6.2 million – Unrestricted)/Willie Green
SF Shawn Marion (8.4 million – Early Termination Option ($9.1 million)
Kyle Korver($5.0 million – Unrestricted)
PF Horford/Ibaka($2.2 million – Restricted ($3.2 million Qualifying Offer)
C Samuel Dalembert, ($6.7 million – Unrestricted) or DeMarcus Cousins ($3.9 million – Team Option ($4.9 million) /Zaza/J Collins

My best starting lineup:

PG Jeff T
SG Joe J
SF Marion
PF Horford
C Cousins

Bench:
PG Pargo
SG Reddick
SF Korver
PF Ibaka
C Zaza

Maybe ASG and Sund will finally wake up and get another big and move Al back to where he belongs. That will atleast be a correct step towards getting them out of the first round!

DirtyDawg

May 8th, 2012
9:48 am

Let me see if I’ve got this straight…we’ve got a team – at least those that are supposed to be it’s stars – that are selfish, narcissistic, non-defense-playing, jerks, and the fans are labeled by yet another jerk on ESPN as ‘the worst in the NBA’…and they wonder why?

Fireld!

May 8th, 2012
9:50 am

When ever you compare Jeff Teague’s stats(scoring and assists) to any elite point in the league Drose, Rondo, or even a rubio or Ty Lawson for that matter, the whole offense is ran through those guys. If and when Josh decides to give the ball to Teague the offense calls for him to come up and give the ball to Joe. Put the broke jump shot of Rondo or Rubio in this offense and I guarantee thier assist numbers go down and your overall perception of thier skills. But like I said Coaching makes a world of difference, and the crazy part is outside of mabye Drose and John wall Teague is just as athletic and they have him by four inches.

northcyde

May 8th, 2012
9:52 am

JJ . . all you have to do man is initially trust your mid-range jumper, especially if you have your shot going. Catch the ball, and immediately make your move to shoot the ball. Let that thang FLYYYYYY. And since your floater is normally your best shot, look to shoot that as well.

You can still make all of the correct plays from a passing standpoint, but if you have even a flicker of daylight to shoot your jumper, take the damn shot. No Harlem Globetrotting dribbling needed. Just get the ball and go. But be under control when you do it.

*************************

Drew’s vaunted “pentagle offense” essentially reduced the role of JJ as a scorer. It turned the entire team into a bunch of jumpshooters while spreading the wealth of shots. For a guy making all of that money, there really was no way JJ could put up the type of numbers to justify that salary, unless he shot Reggie Miller like on the limited amount of shots he was taking.

The 15.5 shots per game were the lowest since he’s been in Atlanta. His total shot %, however, was the 2nd highest of his career. And his win score per 48 minute number was the highest of his career. So he had a pretty good year last year. Better than the normal JJ type of year. The only differences were the amount of shots he took.

In the end though, the lack of FT attempts pretty much prevent JJ from being elite and a better scorer. When you look at the FT attempts per game of the guys averaging above JJ’s 18.8 ppg regular season average that also play SG or SF, this is what that looks like:

Lebron: 8.1 fta/gm
Kobe: 7.8
Durant: 7.6
Melo: 6.7
Pierce: 5.6
Ellis: 4.7
Gay: 4.1
Johnson: 3.1

Of the following guys above, JJ is a better FT shooter than everybody but Durant, and shoots the 3 better than ALL of them. But at 3.1 FT attempts per game, the only chance you have to score the basketball, is to put the ball in the hole.

Barkley said something that was right on point after the Boston debacle. When talking about JJ, he said that when Kobe is struggling to score, he goes down on the block and gets physical. And that’s the other thing that JJ himself can do . . go down on the block and start banging.

Most of our frontline isn’t willing to bang on a consistent basis, so JJ may need to do that a lot more. And not a post up from 15 feet away. Establish that post position 10 feet away from the basket, so that he can turn and go straight to the hoop.

While JJ didn’t touch the ball nearly enough in Game 4, JJ’s teammates and coach Drew are right. JJ simply has to be more aggressive in getting his shots. It doesn’t mean trying to constantly drive to the hole. It simply means that if you’re open . . SHOOT THE DAMN BALL.

***************

The fans are funny though. On one hand, they don’t want JJ to be the focal point of the team, and take a “superstar’s volume of shots”. They want him to play good team ball and be 2nd fiddle to Josh.

But when we need somebody to step up, people look for JJ to do it. The 120 million dollar man. And ironically, they want him to play like a superstar. Don’t take a high volume of superstar shots, but play like a superstar.

“Hero ball” is what some of you call it. But that’s exactly what the superstars in this league do . . . play “hero ball”. Bradley or Shultz mentioned that JJ has only broke 30 points only twice in his playoff career ( the epic Game 4 performance vs Boston in 2008 . . and Game 1 last year in Chicago ).

The thing that irks me about JJ at times, is that he’s TOO unselfish. There has been numerous plays in which JJ will be going toward the rim, only to kick it out to a wide open Josh Smith or Marvin Williams

In theory, that IS the right basketball play. But in a game in which neither of those guys aren’t making outside jumpers, the result is going to be a missed jumper. JJ just has to use better judgement in those situations. If you’re hot, don’t pass the ball AT ALL. If one of your teammates are hot, recognize that and get them the ball.

Bottom line JJ . . just take the 20 footer or get in the paint as soon as you touch the ball. Don’t wait for the defense to come to you. Attack BEFORE the double team comes.

O'brien

May 8th, 2012
9:52 am

They are killing JJ on 790 the zone;

They have been talking about playoff scoring/averages. They said of the other 15 teams that made the playoffs this year, 13 of those teams currently has a player averaging more ppg than JJ (based on the scoring average in the playoffs so far – not sure if last night’s games are included).

5 of those teams have 2 players averaging more ppg than Joe.

I havent double checked the numbers, but that is what is being said on 790.

O'brien

May 8th, 2012
9:58 am

Marvin’s reg season avg;

11.5 pts, 5 rebs, 45% FG, 33% from 3, 26 mpg.

Playoff avg;

7 pts, 4 rebs, 38% FG, 25% from 3, 18 mpg.

While making $7.5 mil. Ouch.

Fireld!

May 8th, 2012
10:00 am

When Rondo first got in the league and Doc(genius) put the ball in Rondo’s hands and took it uot of PP’s and many people questioned him. Paul is one of the better one on one player’s in the league, but iso pierce would not win a chip. What in the world would give LD the impression that continuing iso joe will and he is no where near the player pierce is. Even when PP was 3/15 early in the series he was 14/14 from the line. When was the last time Joe(6″8 240) been to the line over 5 times. LD continues to say get him the ball he is our best player, BS! Josh is, but he also has the lowest IQ. HORRIBLE COACHING!

KevinM

May 8th, 2012
10:02 am

What would this blog be like if we were 2-2? We should have closed them out in GM 2 and nobody would be showing so much disdain.
Like JeJe said, this series turned in GM 2 just like last year’s GM 2 against the Bulls. Cautious LD trying to spare his stars some minutes while his stars need to be in there.
If it’s really about matchups, then why doesn’t LD leave his starters in the ENTIRE game? They can rest this summer. As soon as I saw my bench was non-existent, would I keep going back to them? HAIL no!

LD has no feel for this level of basketball and you can see in his record how many times he gets outcoached against teams with talent.

Keep this in mind: In one year, the Celtics Big 3 came together immediately with sprinkled with Rondo were world champs.
This organization? We keep trying to pound on the same formula year after year (see Utah and Malone/Stockton) and we have gotten absolutely nowhere.
This arena should be half empty tonight to show the disdain there is for this currently constructed team. That’s the only way the fans have any voice.

Astro Joe

May 8th, 2012
10:04 am

As much as I’d like to see pat Ewing get a head coaching gig, MJ really needs to show his fanbase some reason to believ in that franchise by hiring a brand named experience head coach (like Nate McMillan) which likely means MJ will be forced to overpay. but he needs to suck it up and do it. Even Laimbeer would be a good pick (IMO).

drmaryb.(*_*).

May 8th, 2012
10:05 am

Captain Speak!

I imagine Al has learned a lot from watching his team mates play this year, as it relates to their nuances. The comment he made about Joe needs to be aggressive and get his shots, not only is bold but, insightful.

Josh has been doing this for a while when asked directly, Josh will say the ball needs to move from side to side. Sometimes Joe listens and, sometimes he doesn’t. Joe needs to really step up and show us his heart for 48 minutes nightly, whether it is on the floor or, the sidelines.

Being a sideline employee at The Atlanta Xplosion Football games, we don’t have the privilege of any replays. Most times, I watch the ball at other times, I watch the lines and don’t see the ball. And, at times I will just watch a specific player that stands out on consecutive plays.

Here’s my point: You can’t see everything at once, when the game is live especially when there are 22 players on the field. It’s really hard to see because the game is so fast. Conversely, in basketball there are only 10 players to decipher however, the game is a lot faster. So, Al has had the option to sit and watch, his vocal input and leadership will make him the one to watch tonight.

I was really nervous, when Ray Allen fouled him hard and up around the shoulders. Al was favoring his left shoulder on Sunday, perhaps he will be more assertive tonight both mentally and physically.

We shall see. Josh too. Joe will be Joe. The X-factor is MVT.

Fireld!

May 8th, 2012
10:06 am

As a matter of fact they were thinking about starting sam cassel over rondo saying rondo had too many deficiencies. But an intelligent coach knew better. But Woody and LD started bibby almost 2 whole seasons over teague and traded a first round pick. Talk about setting the franchise back. And you have people calling out teague. GET A CLUE, AND A COACH!

northcyde

May 8th, 2012
10:08 am

O’brien

May 8th, 2012
7:52 am

Can somebody explain to me what is LD’s infatuation with the bench? The Celtics are winning, but it is not because of their bench play. LD needs to focus on how to get his stars (Josh and JJ) easy shots, and how to get the team to play defense. Stop worrying about bench production.

********************

It is amazing, isn’t it?

He’s continually trying to force production out of this bench, while not realizing that they’re not going up against the other team’s entire 2nd unit for 10 – 15 minutes a game. This is the playoffs, and most teams without a deep bench are shortening their rotation in a big time way.

I still don’t understand why Drew doesn’t stagger the minutes of JJ, Teague, and Smith the way Doc is doing with KG, Rondo, and Pierce. That is fairly easy to do. Why leave this team at a distinct disadvantage in these games, when Doc is keeping 2 of KG, Rondo, Pierce, or Allen in the game at all times?

I highly disagree with the amount of minutes that Jeff Teague is sitting, especially in the 1st half. He’s really been the most consistent offensive player the Hawks have had in this series.

If you’re losing in a game, you’re more than likely to still get production on both ends of the floor, than to bring in Pargo to jack up 3s. Even if he makes them, he might give the points right back on the other end, because he can’t guard Rondo. So if you pull Teague in the 1st quarter, make sure he’s back on the floor to start the 2nd, unless Pargo REALLY has it going, and the Hawks are extending the lead.

KevinM

May 8th, 2012
10:11 am

OB, you know the part of Marvin that frustrates me? He is supposed to be our LBJ matchup, our Pierce stopper. Marvin doesn’t shut down anyone.
Josh has had to move to the SF to make us competitive at that position and that leaves us a huge hole down low.

Collins is a starter in this league? Really? Absolutely is no threat for us.

Teague/Josh/Zaza and dump the rest of this roster and retool. Since Joe and Al are all-stars, go exchange them in for something productive.
And since Sund said Joe will take us as far as we go, then its time to cut ties and get what you can.
We need a new outlook for this team….blow it up!

2 words for this draft: Festus Ezeli…get us a big man we can work with Sund!

drmaryb.(*_*).

May 8th, 2012
10:14 am

OBIE

You’re right, Marvin is a BUSTER! He has to backup to the payment window or, show up with a ski-mask and a ouzi. Either way, Marvin should be ashamed of himself for his performance based pay.

Fireld!

May 8th, 2012
10:23 am

Looking at Joe and Marvin’s performance vs their pay gives a crystal clear picture of the talent evaluater for the Hawks. LORD HELP US!

northcyde

May 8th, 2012
10:29 am

O’brien

May 8th, 2012
9:52 am

They are killing JJ on 790 the zone;

They have been talking about playoff scoring/averages. They said of the other 15 teams that made the playoffs this year, 13 of those teams currently has a player averaging more ppg than JJ (based on the scoring average in the playoffs so far – not sure if last night’s games are included).

5 of those teams have 2 players averaging more ppg than Joe.

I havent double checked the numbers, but that is what is being said on 790.

********************

That doesn’t surprise me of what 790 is doing. And this is exactly what I’m talking about. I bet those guys didn’t spend 10 minutes talking about the Hawks and the Game 3 loss, when JJ scores 29 points and damn near pulled that game out in the end of regulation. But as soon as the Hawks get blown out . . here they come.

And it is correct that 13 of the 15 teams have a guy scoring more points than JJ. Due to the 28 shots he took in Game 3, JJ is averaging 17 shots per game in this series. Here are what the leading scorers on other teams are averaging, from a shot per game perspective:

Kobe: 25.3 FGA
Melo: 23.3
Rose: 23 ( one game )
Dirk: 19.3
Durant: 19.3
Granger: 19.3
Big Baby Davis: 18
Lebron: 18.5
Pierce: 17.5
Johnson: 17
Holiday: 16.5
Paul: 16
Gay: 15.3
Parker: 15.3

So 9 of those 13 scores are taking more shots than JJ. But JJ’s ppg should be higher than 17.8 ppg. No excuse for him shooting 37% FG in this series, mainly because all of those 3s he took in Game 1. And if it’s a mere PPG average that we’re talking about, those 8 shots in Game 4 DID bring his scoring average down.

JJ only had 4 shots at halftime of that game, going 2 – 4

Smith was 2 – 7
Horford was 3 – 6
Teague was 2 – 6

Hawks were around 45% shooting for that half. So offense from a FG% really wasn’t an issue. The problem on offense was the 11 turnovers committed in that half, specifically the 8 in the first quarter. The true problem was the defense, and letting the Celtics shoot 64% FG and score 64 points that half.

When that happens, you’re going to lose 98.4% of the time.

KevinM

May 8th, 2012
10:35 am

Steve Holman did a credible job in Game 4 when he called Marvin out twice in one game. Finally, someone under the Hawks has the tinted glasses off and admits the bust that is one Marvin Williams. He is killing our cap flexibility.
Think about all the min wage vets Sund could get us with Marvin’s contract? Sund told you himself he isn’t bringing in big name FAs.
This GM has limited us so much that he’s not even sure if he wants to come back and clean up the mess he generated. You want 2 examples?

1) Al and Marvin were never given the chance to enter RFA when other teams could have countered with an offer the Hawks would have to match.
What does Sund do? He locks us in for years with no way out. Forget amnesty…this ownership group is too stupid to know how it works.

2) The one guy who had to go get an offer from another team to get us to respond? Josh Smith.

I like the 790 busting they are doing this am. 680 is so biased with GA sports and the NFL draft….

KevinM

May 8th, 2012
10:43 am

Bob Rathburn doing his best to be fair talking about Joe and how he doesn’t see Joe as the issues here. He says the other GMs are the ones telling him Joe is the guy. Doc told us there is no way Joe will beat us.
Bob says its about playoff matchups against the C’s. And our biggest problem is the big man…..someone tell me when this was first mentioned as the problem here? 5 years ago?
I said we lose this series without Zaza and we’re one or 2 games away from ending the season.

Jimmy Crack

May 8th, 2012
10:45 am

Trade everybody except Marvin. He’s just beginning to round into shape.

northcyde

May 8th, 2012
10:49 am

Ray

May 8th, 2012
8:48 am

Forever in a day it will still remain Falcons>Braves> Georgia Tech(not a fan of)>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hawks way back in the back.

Difference between these four teams 3 are willing to make moves necessary to compete for a NC one will tell you we like our core.

I tell you right now if the Falcons fail to even just get a playoff win this year how much you want to bet the GM and Coach Smith are both gone. Maybe even Matt Ryan is gone I like the guy, but after 5 years don’t want to turn into the Cowboys.

*******************

Ray . . the only thing you can accuse this core of, is not pulling off an upset in the playoffs. This is a “good core”, just not a great one.

2008 – lose to Boston . . a 66 win team ( best record in NBA and NBA Champs )

2009 – lose to Cleveland . . a 66 win team ( best record in NBA )

2010 – lose to Orlando . . a 59 win team ( 2nd best record in NBA )

2011 – lose to Chicago . . a 62 win team ( best record in NBA )

The Hawks are losing in the playoffs to powerhouse teams. The Falcons and Braves lose to teams who are inferior to them. The problem with “The Core”, is that they haven’t been able to break through that top 2 ceiling in the East, which would give them a better chance of reaching the EC Finals or NBA Finals. Trying to do that as a 4 or 5 seed is extremely difficult.

What the Falcons have done the past 4 years, is underachieve in a BIG TIME way.

Hawks > Falcons . . . until the Falcons win a playoff game.

And don’t even talk about the college teams. Even when Tech won the ACC, they had to give that title up because of cheating.

And the Bulldogs? Mark Richt may be the most underachieving coach in the country. They FINALLY get to the SEC title game when the entire SEC East is down. No Florida. No Tennessee. South Carolina had to have people get hurt for them to win the division.

Hawks > all those teams

KevinM

May 8th, 2012
10:57 am

northcyde, that excuse that the Hawks have lost to powerhouse teams is factual, but how many years does it take to put together a powerhouse team in the NBA? Should it take 4-5 years?
It didn’t take Chicago or Boston that long based on your example above.
We just don’t know how to put the right pieces together or how to lock in a player that helps us go forward.

Najeh Davenpoop

May 8th, 2012
11:05 am

“The game was nowhere near over yet, and people were booing the Hawks in the 2nd quarter.”

The Hawks had just come off two games that they lost by a total of nearly 50 points. They were down 10 by the end of the 1st quarter and down 19 by halftime. Joe went 3/15 that game. They desered every boo they got. “Nowhere near over yet”? That game, like every other game that series, was over before it started. Atlanta fans may not be loyal but we are smart. We saw the way they opened the game and knew it wasn’t going to be any different.

northcyde

May 8th, 2012
11:05 am

High-sider

May 8th, 2012
9:16 am

Through the first three playoff games this postseason, the Hawks’ bench [from the article above] has scored a combined total of 56 points. On the other hand, Jamal Crawford, in his first three playoff games in last year’s postseason with the Hawks, scored a combined total of 71 points [off the bench]. In Game 4 of the first round vs. the Celtics, the Hawks’ bench scored a combined total of 46 points but the starters scored a combined total of 33 points. In Game 4 of the first round vs. the Magic, Jamal Crawford scored 25 points [off the bench]. Through the first four playoff games this postseason, the Hawks’ bench has scored a total of 102 points while Jamal Crawford, through his four playoff games last postseason with the Hawks, scored 96 points.

**********************************

Damn . . . I’m like a crackhead. I can’t resist this:

Jamal Crawford’s point totals in his last 5 playoff games in Atlanta:

11 pts
7 pts
12 pts
2 pts
8 pts

Total: 40 pts ( 8.0 ppg ) . . 13 – 47 FG ( 27.7% ) . . 2 – 19 3FG ( 10.5% )

If Pargo and Willie Green could go up against Jameer Nelson and JJ Redick, I’m sure they wouldn’t look as sorry as they do right now.

But I digress. Last year only proves why Jamal stays in demand, but also can’t be trusted at the same time. He’s like putting a ring on an ex-hooker. You may THINK that she’s “wifey potential” . . until you catch her turning tricks in the back of YOUR car.

The ultimate “hot and cold” player. Jamal is essentially Superhead. Can’t trust that trick, even if she does have “skills”.

Najeh Davenpoop

May 8th, 2012
11:07 am

“I tell you right now if the Falcons fail to even just get a playoff win this year how much you want to bet the GM and Coach Smith are both gone. Maybe even Matt Ryan is gone I like the guy, but after 5 years don’t want to turn into the Cowboys.”

I will gladly take you up on that bet. In fact I will go a step further and say the Falcons will outright miss the playoffs and Dimitroff, Smith, and Ryan will all be back. The only difference between the Falcons and Hawks is marketing.

Matt

May 8th, 2012
11:08 am

Man, you soooo do not want to hear my response to your petulant little whining Joe. Why don’t you take your “millstone” of a contract and go home?

[...] Joe Johnson wants more touches in the Hawks offense. He only had 8 shots in the Hawks Game 4 loss to Boston, but he had 28 in the Hawks Game 3 loss. I [...]

Najeh Davenpoop

May 8th, 2012
11:10 am

^before someone calls me out on it, meant to say “even if” the Falcons miss the playoffs… can’t make predictions without knowing what the final roster is going to look like after the free agency period gets over.

northcyde

May 8th, 2012
11:31 am

Najeh Davenpoop

May 8th, 2012
11:05 am

“The game was nowhere near over yet, and people were booing the Hawks in the 2nd quarter.”

The Hawks had just come off two games that they lost by a total of nearly 50 points. They were down 10 by the end of the 1st quarter and down 19 by halftime. Joe went 3/15 that game. They desered every boo they got. “Nowhere near over yet”? That game, like every other game that series, was over before it started. Atlanta fans may not be loyal but we are smart. We saw the way they opened the game and knew it wasn’t going to be any different.

***********************

Najeh . . some of those boos actually started in the 1st quarter. We were down 10, and they were booing. At no time did the crowd as a whole try to cheer to get the Hawks back in the game. I guess the crowd knew what was coming.

You may be an advocate of booing, that’s just not my thing. Especially not in the 1st half of a game. The crowd expected the worse, and the Hawks gave it to them.

O'brien

May 8th, 2012
11:41 am

Najeh,

The only difference between the Falcons and Hawks is marketing..

Disagree that marketing is the only difference. Falcons needed a TE, so they traded for Tony Gonzalez. When we needed help in the secondary, they went out and paid big money for a FA (Daunte).

They felt they needed a more explosive offense, so they trade up to get Julio. They needed more of a pass rush, so they went out and got Ray Edwards. This year, they need more secondary help, so they trade for a pro-bowler and SB champion in Asante.

The team underachieved again, and they bring in 2 new co-ordinators, and a new O-Line coach.

The Falcons moves have not worked out, but it is not for lack of trying. They have made big moves. The Hawks, on the other hand, continue to sit on their hand, keep the core players and coaches in place, while bringing in vet-min talent.

Steve Belkin

May 8th, 2012
11:46 am

You gentlemen seem to be missing the big picture. You are insulting a coach who has a .700 winning percentage in two seasons. You are questioning the talent level of the players.
This suggests you have poor observational skills. The central problem with this franchise is based on a laissez-faire leadership culture and an environment that breeds mediocrity.
You could take any of the “Big Four” from this team and place them on another team under good leadership and they would thrive. You could lose one of them and still get the same results. You could add a player like Carmelo Anthony or Chris Bosh and still have the same result.
It is a culture of insincerity. 11 guys picking up a pay check. Joe Johnson doesn’t even like to play basketball. But he shows up and scores 22 points because he knows that is the minimum he has to do in order to get paid.
No one on this team is inspired to play hard for anyone else on the team and no one plays with heart.
The majority of the owners rarely attend games. Ask Larry Drew when was the last time he had dinner with Rutherford Seydel? Ask Josh Smith the names of Beau Turner’s kids. They can’t tell you. They have no compass, no heart, and no inspiration. They are punching a clock, taking their scheduled breaks and waiting for retirement.
So, talk all you want about firing the coach, shuffling the lineup, packing Joe’s bags for him, but all you’re doing is saying “I don’t get it.” There is literally NOTHING that can be done to get this team over the hump. They don’t even know there IS a hump. All they know is that at about 10PM tonight the season will be over, and they can start their vacations. Don’t expect any noise from any players or management or ownership about expectations or change. The most you will get is Josh Smith demanding to be traded. Most of the people posting here won’t be at the game. But the ones who are there will be raining the boos down on the Hawks as if they did something wrong. But the sad truth is that to the man every one of these players did exactly what team ownership demanded of them. They may have asked them to win, but they did everything they could to show them they don’t really care one way or the other.
It’s time for change – from the top. The Hawks need a leader, a face.
It’s no accident that the Mavericks won a championship last year. They don’t necessarily have more talent that the Hawks. But ask Dirt Nowitzki who he enjoys hanging out with when he’s not playing. He has lots of friends here and in Hamburg, but he really enjoys spending time with his buddy Mark Cuban. All of the guys on the team like him and know a lot about him. What do any of you know about Todd Foreman or Bruce Levenson? Could you pick them out of a lineup? I assure you Al Horford knows approximately as much about them as you do.
So, what do we do? We wait for someone who actually has the resources to own a team to come along and buy it. Not a spoiled son-in-law who can cough up points on a loan for a 9% stake. I mean a bona fide owner. Obviously it will not be Stan Kasten. If he could afford to do it, he would have. Instead he has thrown in his lot with ASG West, a consortium of wannabes now posing as the Dodgers’ new ownership group. Time will tell how long that lasts. But I wish Mr. Kasten the best of luck. The city of Atlanta and sports fans everywhere owe him a tremendous amount of respect and gratitude.
There are viable pieces of this puzzle that exist within the organization. Mike Gearon would still make a good GM. Dominique Wilkins is a recognizable face whom the players respect. What Atlanta needs is a legitimate money man. A Shahid Khan or Mikhail Prokhorov or Arthur Blank.
Doc Rivers would make an excellent GM, and since Boston fans have such a short memory, maybe they will let us have him when the Celtics get bounced short of ECF this year.
But the bottom line is the Atlanta Spirit LLC must go – before the Hawks end up in Las Vegas.

Patrick O'Hurley

May 8th, 2012
11:46 am

PooperSCOOPer,

Yeah, the glory days of the EIGHTIES really make me sick, of course I was 10 when they were winning. Now the Celts are an old team that has one young player they can build around, that interestingly enough they want to get rid of. But live in the past, because the slamming noise you are about to hear is the window for this Celtics team to slam shut. You may win this round, but you won’t make it through the next.

O'brien

May 8th, 2012
11:46 am

AJ,

Before hiring a new coach, I think MJ needs to hire a GM, and let him do his job.

MakeItTakeIt

May 8th, 2012
11:49 am

So Joe wants MORE of the offense to go through him so doubling down on him is even MORE effective. Great game plan Joey. Basketball is a TEAM game, what you need is more of your TEAM to step up and make plays. Unless you think you have a 80-90 point game in you there bud, then we can talk.

Bad Refs!

May 8th, 2012
11:50 am

ATL has been hosed by the refs the whole series—they can’t even get one call. With good refs, ATL would be up 3-1.

O'brien

May 8th, 2012
11:50 am

From a Feb 21, 2012 blog by C Viv;

Following Monday’s game, I spoke with Joe Johnson about why the team has a motivation problem and plays with a lack of energy at times. Here are his comments:

“When I look at our team, we are a very talented team, but I [don’t know] whether guys know their roles or not,” Johnson said. “We know the right thing to do. A lot of times we don’t come out and do it. I just think we should all have one agenda, one goal and that is winning the basketball game.

Not who scores what, who does what. I think we are too self conscious about [who is] scoring and the little things that really don’t matter. For us to win the game we have to put all of that to the side and help one another on both ends of the floor. If we don’t do that, we are going to continue to struggle to win games. I think we have to put a lot into perspective about how good we want to be as a team or what direction we are headed in or what are our goals.

Right now I’m not sure if everyone has that one common goal – and that is winning.

“We’ve had spurts where we’ve played great together. The ball movement has been great. We’ve had times when we haven’t been so great. Times we haven’t been so great, we have struggled as a team. I know it’s noticeable. I think we just have to start getting the ball into the right people’s hands who make plays, who score the basketball and make others better. That’s it.”.

Leadership is a big problem on this team. And although there may be times when JJ knows what the problem is, he is our longest tenured captain, and needs to rally the troops. But he doesnt know how.

Instead, what we get is “I dont get all the credit when we win, so why should I get all the blame when we lose”, and “I dont care if the fans show up”.

tom

May 8th, 2012
12:09 pm

i wish the pizza man had bought the hawks

Rod from College Park

May 8th, 2012
12:12 pm

“Jamal Crawford’s point totals in his last 5 playoff games in Atlanta:

11 pts
7 pts
12 pts
2 pts
8 pts

Total: 40 pts ( 8.0 ppg ) . . 13 – 47 FG ( 27.7% ) . . 2 – 19 3FG ( 10.5% )”

Marvin Williams’s point totals in his last 5 playoff games in Atlanta:

0 pts
2 pts
3 pts
3 pts
8 pts

Total: 16 pts ( 3.2 ppg ) . . 5 – 26 FG ( 19.2% ) . . 1 – 5 3FG

Yest you bash one guy, and constantly support the other guy. One guy makes almost double the amount that the other guy requested. One guy has never seen a double team in his life. One guy was the focus point of the best defensive team in the league, even more than the so called best player on the team. One guy is never guarded, can’t dribble more than 3 times in a row, can’t run without falling, and walks like he is 80 years old.

“If Pargo and Willie Green could go up against Jameer Nelson and JJ Redick, I’m sure they wouldn’t look as sorry as they do right now.”

If my aunt was a man, she would be my uncle.

Mike D

May 8th, 2012
12:17 pm

@Shut up Joe you couldnt hold TMac if he had one leg n hand tied behind his back get fareal you’ll out hustle T mac dude this is the NBA! An as far as defense goes I wouldnt play none either if I like T Mac cant get a touch on the offensive end! One thing I know he has played better D than your Superstar superstar whats your name oh yea #Shut the Hell up Joe

Mike D

May 8th, 2012
12:26 pm

AAn please Atl fans get of Jamal Crawford piece a career sixth man would not have made a difference! SOME ON DIS BLOG MUST THINK J.CRAWFORD GOT A S ON HIS CHEST !!!

Hawks Blog Legend Worldwide Clyde

May 8th, 2012
12:36 pm

Hawks Blog Legend Worldwide Clyde

May 8th, 2012
12:39 pm

We need to organize a protest to get the Spirit Group up out of Atlanta. They may be the worst ownership group in Atlanta Sports history.

Rod from College Park

May 8th, 2012
12:41 pm

“AAn please Atl fans get of Jamal Crawford piece a career sixth man would not have made a difference! SOME ON DIS BLOG MUST THINK J.CRAWFORD GOT A S ON HIS CHEST !!!”

Hard to understand what you mean, but Jamal’s S is bigger than Joe’s.

Mike D

May 8th, 2012
12:42 pm

@Worldwide Clyde need to tell these Hawks fans to forget about jamal crawford trash ass career sixth man

Dawg

May 8th, 2012
12:43 pm

Everyone needs to catch up. JC is not Hawks anymore.