Atlanta Hawks: On playoff seeding
Judging by the persistent questions from Tweeps, it seems there is some confusion about what happens if the No. 5 seed in the East finishes with a better record than the No. 4 seed. This is possible because division winners can finish no worse than No. 4. This season the No. 5 seed could very well have a better record than the Atlantic winner. It’s why the Hawks remain behind the Celtics (and before that, the Sixers) in the standings even though they have the better record, which only adds to the confusion.
I’ve maintained all along that the Hawks would get home-court advantage if that’s the way they finish but the questions persist. So, to put it to rest once and for all, I e-mailed NBA spokesman Tim Frank. His reply:
“Better record always gets home court.”
There it is, plainly stated. The Hawks would get home-court advantage as the No. 5 seed if their record is better than a division winner with a worst record. As it stands now, that means the Hawks would play host to the Celtics in the first round even though the Celtics would have the better seed.
You might ask why reward a division winner the No. 4 seed if it doesn’t get home-court advantage anyway. In practice, it assures that a division winner will face an opponent with no better than the fourth-best record in the conference. Normally that’s not relevant but it can be in a season like this, the best Atlantic teams are bunched together
with so-so records.
Besides, as Josh Smith wryly noted the other day when the topic came up: “They get to hang up a banner.”
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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407 comments Add your comment
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
April 9th, 2012
6:28 pm
FTPB
DawgNole
April 9th, 2012
12:18 am
Don’t need to read the same thing you’ve posted 100 times already or read you and your reach around buddies giving each other a congratulatory yank.
_________________________
Then why do you continue to read it? So you can announce to the blog that you don’t need to? Just follow your own advice and scroll past it. We have no need to know about your needs.
********************
LOL!
OWNED. Good night Grizzard
Buddy Grizzard
April 9th, 2012
6:32 pm
“The playoffs however is when all will be told.”
Amen.
Buddy Grizzard
April 9th, 2012
6:33 pm
Did you say something JeJe? I seem to have scrolled right past it.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
April 9th, 2012
6:38 pm
Yeah I said I was going to comment on your blog which no one comments on. Too bad you didn’t see that message.
Bravesfan79
April 9th, 2012
6:49 pm
My hope is that we get the #3 seed; play Indiana in the first round, then play Miami in the 2nd.
Any word on how Horford is coming along? He would be a bigtime backup for us in the playoffs!
Najeh Davenpoop
April 9th, 2012
6:50 pm
I like the Harrison Barnes-Rudy Gay comparison. Rudy Gay also had questions about his game and his effort coming out of college and put them to rest in the pros. Barnes could be similar in that regard, although he doesn’t create his own shot as well as Gay does.
Slimjr
April 9th, 2012
6:59 pm
“The TMac, LD issues come down to this. TMac feels like there is no reason he should not be getting substantial minutes, behind a guy who is only putting up 9.9ppg,5 rebounds, and 1.2 apg in 26 minutes. Bottom line he is correct. If TMac is given those minutes he produces better numbers all around, and he makes the team better. LD is used to most of these guys, and has no one on the team other than Josh, and TMac who will question his authority. TMac did, and LD has punished him for it, at the expense of the team. Hopefully he will realize that his playmaking ability and his overall game could be a huge asset for this team who has no real playmakers in the playoffs.”
Larry better put his personal issues aside and play this future Hall of Fame player heavy minutes if he wants to possibly go deep in the playoffs.. TMAC has enough left in the tank to make a difference..
Play the MAN LARRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Give him at least 26 minutes a night!!
Slimjr
April 9th, 2012
7:07 pm
lol @ the bleacher report!
List of the 50 top worthless NBA players in the league today..The Hawks have three of them;
VLAD
COLLINS
STACKHOUSE
Great Job Sund!
Mel
April 9th, 2012
7:19 pm
Wow, I would like to chime in on some of this, first off t-Mac was a beast and a half when he was in his prime. Can’t remember too many tha was better if any at all at that’s at any position. He played D, competed every day, could pass, rebounded, scored, he was a leader, the dude could jump out the gym had mad handles, lol it was crazy!!! He had that killer instinct that very few have, like the Jordan’s, kob
The Truth
April 9th, 2012
7:21 pm
“IF!
If anyone needs to practice, it’s “no clue drew”! He needs to practice his coaching. If I were TMac, I would give coach my left sneaker and tell him to do this:” – drmaryb
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DN1qCUndYw
I’m LOL and scratching my head @ your 2:41 pm post. That’s an interesting analogy. It begs the question though of how you acquired (or better yet, make use of) this link.
Freaky, Freaky
That video is worth (@ least) a thousand words
Mel
April 9th, 2012
7:25 pm
Wow, I would like to chime in on some of this, first off t-Mac was a beast and a half when he was in his prime. Can’t remember too many tha was better if any at all at that’s at any position. He played D, competed every day, could pass, rebounded, scored, he was a leader, the dude could jump out the gym had mad handles, lol it was crazy!!! He had that killer instinct that very few have, like the Jordan’s, kobie’s, kemps, Gary Payton’s, I could go on and on. He tried to make u look crazy when he played u. So let’s kill the bad talk about him. And as far as the back injury is concerned do u know how many basketball players suffer from this… It’s crazy superman is going through the same thing right now with his back, hell Larry bird had back problems that ended his career so kill that stuff to about bad workout habits it more to it than that.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
April 9th, 2012
7:26 pm
Amen Slim.
Don’t worry about these haters.
Joe D
April 9th, 2012
7:52 pm
The only way the Hawks will be able to resign Josh and Ivan is to somehow trade Marvin(8 mil per yr with 2 yrs left). Unfortunately, the Hawks will have to package Marvin with a future # 1 pick in order to dump Marvin’s salary.
After next year’s season and if the Hawks don’t won ECF championship then a trade of a core player will be necessary!
Rev in Tampa
April 9th, 2012
8:12 pm
Dang!
Orlando and Indy taking care of business tonight.
Rev in Tampa
April 9th, 2012
8:45 pm
I just don’t think vlad is as bad as everybody says. I’m not saying he is great either. He has hit some big shots this year and at the beginning of the year he played the passing lanes very effectively on defense. He has played poorly of late but shouldn’t be mentioned in the same sentence as Cheeseburger
Najeh Davenpoop
April 9th, 2012
8:48 pm
Orlando waxing Detroit without Dwight Howard. Rodney Stuckey is 1/5 with 2 points. Why the hell can’t they play everyone else like they play against the Hawks?
O'Brien
April 9th, 2012
9:15 pm
AJ,
Although Marvin does not close out many games, there have been many games when he is the game when the other team makes a run. And he is wide open for a shot that can stem the tide. but he bricks it.
The Truth
April 9th, 2012
9:24 pm
“Why the hell can’t they play everyone else like they play against the Hawks?” – Najeh
The 10 million question with the easy answer: Fear Factor
Even though Detroit loss the most recent contest between the Hawks and publicly acknowledged they had no answer for Teague, they still left feeling good about their chances of winning. Regardless of the opponents record, (IMO) this is typical of how teams feeling when they are playing the Hawks.
In their mind, their prospect always look (very) good; seriously even the Bobcats. Some are those scrubs played “all-star like”against the Hawks “on-again-off-again” defense.
The Truth
April 9th, 2012
9:27 pm
^The 10 million dollar question^
Sautee
April 9th, 2012
9:51 pm
“Even though Detroit loss the most recent contest between the Hawks and publicly acknowledged they had no answer for Teague, they still left feeling good about their chances of winning. Regardless of the opponents record, (IMO) this is typical of how teams feeling when they are playing the Hawks.”
IMO, maybe they should look at this:
Hawks record vs. sub-.500 teams: 22-3
Perception is not reality.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
April 9th, 2012
10:21 pm
IMO, maybe they should look at this:
Hawks record vs. sub-.500 teams: 22-3
Perception is not reality.
***
you nees to dig deeper. I assure you not one team in playoff conention is afraid of the Hawks in a series. And many of those games vs abysmal teams were way too close (causing Joe and Josh to play way too many mins)
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
April 9th, 2012
10:32 pm
Just put your best wing on Joe in a series and let Josh take jumpshots
Rod from College Park
April 9th, 2012
10:39 pm
“Just put your best wing on Joe in a series and let Josh take jumpshots.”
That’s about the extent of it.
Slimjr
April 9th, 2012
10:52 pm
“Just put your best wing on Joe in a series and let Josh take jumpshots.”- cosign-
I will just add and benching the future hall fame player TMAC!
C’mon Larry, get over yourself dude…Play the great TMAC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SteveW
April 9th, 2012
11:29 pm
Alot can happen between now and the end of next season. But here is our basic numbers after next season salary cap wise:
We have about $41.5 million committed to just 3 players the next season: JJ, Al, and Marvin (Player Option of 7.5m, I would guess he takes it).
We will also have this season’s 1st round pick, making around 1.5 mill also.
So that’s 43 mill approx. on 4 players.
And we have as Free Agents:
Josh
ZaZa
Teague
And we’ll probably have another 1st pick – another 1.2 mill or so.
So we gotta figure out a way to sign Josh, ZaZa, and Teague for about 23 mill combined that next season. Josh 13.5 mill, ZaZa 6 mill, and Teague 3.5 mill?
That would give us 67.2 mill among 8 players, so the rest would probably be the 2nd round/DLeague types, unless the Luxury Tax line goes up pretty good.
Now this scenario doesn’t even include signing Ivan after this season.
Needless to say, the core has been together quite awhile here. But it looks like changes are coming one way or another.
Next season, at most, is probably our last run with this group of guys.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
April 9th, 2012
11:39 pm
Teague @ 3.5M?????
ROTFLMAOLOLKTDC
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
April 9th, 2012
11:40 pm
Joe really needs to restructure his deal. Gonna be making 24M when he is 34
SteveW
April 9th, 2012
11:42 pm
I know JeJe – I’m trying to get the numbers to work – and they’re not working. Somebody, and I don’t know who is going to be gone after next season – and I hope it’s not Teague, ZaZa, or Josh.
SteveW
April 9th, 2012
11:43 pm
Marvin would be good to ditch if we could find somebody to absorb his contract – but he still has 2 years left after this season. And I doubt we ever amnesty anybody.
SteveW
April 9th, 2012
11:50 pm
JeJe – Also, Teague’s qualifying offer is just under 3.5 mill. I was thinking if we could sign him to like a 3.5, 5.5, 6.5, 7.5 million 4 year deal – That’s 4 years 22 mill. I have no idea really what he would get on the open market as a RFA.
Memphis has 3 guys as RFA’s this off season: Mayo, Speights, and Arthur. They’re at over 62.4 mill for 9 guys next season. They may have a tough time resigning those guys.
SteveW
April 9th, 2012
11:55 pm
But if we are upside down on our cap numbers, and Teague does become a RFA, all somebody has to do is frontload a contract and offer him 7 mill or something his 1st season, and we wouldn’t match it because of the Tax. And the Luxury Tax gets more and more punitive the longer the CBA is in force.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
April 9th, 2012
11:56 pm
Teague will get paid by someone. Maybe a Detroit or NJN if Deron bolts.
Memphis has like 55m locked up on 3 guys, right?
Amazing ZBo returned so soon.
Smoove is goi to demand serious cash.
I agree….this roster will change very soon unless these morons use the “Al was hurt” excuse and keep core one more year.
Is it too much to ask for our 3726 owners to go into LT just a little bit? They keep selling picks but do nothing with payroll.
Please sell the team already.
God.
SteveW
April 10th, 2012
12:03 am
I tell you a deal that would alleviate alot of cap pressure, and maybe at least keep us competitive is Al for Derrick Favors. We would have to take Devin Harris’ expiring next season, and probably have to throw in a 1st pick (maybe not), but that move would help us moving forward cap wise immensely – not next season, actually increase salary a little then. But the next season and moving forward.
And Derrick is a hometown guy, has alot of upside, and maybe likes to bang a little more down low than Al does. Perfect 1st Big off the bench behind Josh and ZaZa.
And a PG rotation of Harris and Teague would be dynamite while it lasted next season.
SteveW
April 10th, 2012
12:14 am
Actually, it’s more like 55 mill on 4 guys for Memphis next season – Gasol, ZBo, Gay and Conley. And they have those 4 guys locked up long term.
They also have Tony Allen for 3.3 mill and Dante Cunningham for about 2.1 mill for next season only.
In 3 years, their Big 4 of Randolph, Gay, Conley, and Gasol will be making 62 mill. That’s before 1st picks or anybody else. But that’s not a bad nucleus if everybody stays healthy.
Buddy Grizzard
April 10th, 2012
12:17 am
“Unfortunately, the Hawks will have to package Marvin with a future # 1 pick in order to dump Marvin’s salary.”
Doubt that, especially if they trade him after next year when he will have an expiring contract. The deal with Ivan is that he will be a restricted free agent subject to the “Gilbert Arenas Rule.” This rule stipulates that no other team can offer him more than the full midlevel exception. So we’re looking at what? $5mil a season for Ivan? That’s a bargain imo. But if we lose Kirk and Marvin, we’re going to need a shooter. And don’t talk to me about Green and Pargo. Those guys are Crawford/Bibby on defense.
SteveW
April 10th, 2012
12:18 am
Miami has about 80 mill committed to 12 players next season. If they don’t win a championship, it looks like just complete incompetence on their part.
SteveW
April 10th, 2012
12:20 am
Buddy G – I don’t know where you got the giving Marvin away with a 1st pick – but maybe I did read that somewhere on this blog. But I don’t know who.
Ivan – I have no idea what it will take to keep him. I keep thinking maybe the vet min. but I’m sure that’s dreaming on my part. Ivan has been stout, I do know that.
FREE IVAN
Buddy Grizzard
April 10th, 2012
12:22 am
“Perfect 1st Big off the bench behind Josh and ZaZa.”
Third team All-NBA center for a backup? And we get to take Raymond Felton’s worthless, coach-killing ass and throw in a first round pick? Pass.
Najeh Davenpoop
April 10th, 2012
12:22 am
If Mike Conley can get $8 million per year, Teague can get at least $6 million per year.
They are going to have to salary dump one of the medium-sized 3 if they want to stay under the cap, and if they are smart it will be Joe who gets dumped, not Josh or Al.
Najeh Davenpoop
April 10th, 2012
12:23 am
If Brandon Bass can get $4 million a year, Ivan can get at least $3 million a year.
Najeh Davenpoop
April 10th, 2012
12:28 am
Al for Favors is not a bad deal at all. Al is a much better offensive player, but on a per minute basis Favors is his equal or better at rebounding and shot blocking, and has the size and wingspan to play C full time (unlike Al who has to slide to the 4 against the likes of Dwight and Bynum). If Favors can develop a reliable mid range jumper, down the road he can provide 75% of Al’s contributions offensively and surpass his contributions defensively.
Seeing as how Favors was the prize of the Deron Williams trade, though, I doubt Utah parts with him, even for Al. More likely they trade Millsap or Jefferson to open up a spot for Favors. Keep in mind they also have Kanter on the bench, so if anything they will be looking to cash in one of their big men to upgrade some other position, maybe point guard.
Najeh Davenpoop
April 10th, 2012
12:29 am
“Just put your best wing on Joe in a series and let Josh take jumpshots”
True, but this becomes much harder to pull off if Joe is playing SG and Josh is playing SF.
PS3
April 10th, 2012
12:41 am
Every coach TMac has had since Orlando have said that TMac has an extremely high basketball IQ. If you run the offense through him, it’s guaranteed easy baskets and good looks for the guys around him. McGrady is one of the best in the league off pick-and-roll possessions and his teammates tend to shoot very high percentages off his passes. He definitely needs to get some decent burn come playoffs.
Here’s what Tom Thibodeau said about TMac earlier this year: “McGrady is a great player, has been a great player in the league for a long time. [He was] derailed some by injury the last couple years, but he’s a complete player. Everyone always talks about his scoring; I think the best part of his game is his decision-making. Great pick-and-roll player, great passer, he’s got the size, he’s got great vision, extremely smart and like I said, the only thing that slowed him down was his injuries. This guy put up huge numbers in the league and there’s nothing he can’t do. He can play defense, he can pass, he can shoot, he can post, he can pick-and-roll.”
SteveW
April 10th, 2012
1:19 am
Buddy G – Who mentioned Raymond Felton? Do the Jazz own the rights to Felton? I may have missed something.
Or you did
northcyde
April 10th, 2012
1:46 am
Jamal isn’t even the best Crawford in the league anymore. Jordan is.
(( standing ovation @ Ra’mon’s rants earlier in this thread. ))
Rusty
April 10th, 2012
1:58 am
LD is a fool for never giving TMac a chance to really show what he has left in the tank.He tried his hardest to give KH the pg position this year.
can't handle the truth
April 10th, 2012
2:10 am
Phyllis Hyman was murdered because she was not as lucrative as she once was – replaced by young upstart diva Whitney Houston. Whitney died “mysteriously” was she became worth more dead than alive – replaced by young upstart diva, Jennifer Hudson. Its a dirty game the industry – it and always what it seem – you might get fool if you are on the outside…
Buddy G
April 10th, 2012
3:19 am
My bad SteveW, I’ve got Raymond Felton on the brain… it’s easy to confuse Felton and Devin Harris in my mind because they’re both huge disappointments (as I see it).
Buddy G
April 10th, 2012
3:24 am
“Favors is his equal or better at rebounding and shot blocking, and has the size and wingspan to play C full time.”
I will definitely check out that April 21st Jazz-Orlando game. I shot footage of Favors for CBS when he was in high school and I didn’t know he was that good of a defender.
Buddy G
April 10th, 2012
3:40 am
Here’s my take on the T-Mac situation. I think he can help the Hawks in the playoffs, but to do so he needs to play consistent minutes for the rest of the regular season. You can bury the guy on the bench the entire season then expect him to come in and set the world on fire in round 1. Got to let the guy get in a rythm.
It appears right now that LD has finally figured out that Collins is a complete waste of space that brings him embarrassment in the coaching fraternity every time he rolls the guy out there. Right now LD is giving Ivan all the backup center minutes, and he has looked good when he plays 20+ minutes.
I would like to see T-Mac integrated into the second unit as the small forward with Marvin at power forward, Ivan at center, Green at 2 guard and Pargo at point. Pargo’s role would be to bring the ball up court, hand off to T-Mac and run off screens to get open for shots. T-Mac should play point-forward with the second unit.
My concern is what happens when Vlad is healthy. Does he immediately resume the roll he had before he got hurt? If he does, the Hawks will be in trouble in the playoffs. I don’t want to see Vlad, Damp, Collins or Stack play another minute unless it is garbage time. The ten-man rotation of the starters plus the second unit I listed above is what LD should limit himself to unless the Hawks play ORL. In that case, see what Collins can do. But you heard it here first, I think Ivan has the strength and mobility to guard Dwight better than Collins.