Atlanta Hawks: Practice report: Joe Johnson on mend
The Hawks got back to work today and their moods seemed noticeably improved from last week. They had a spirited scrimmage session near the end of practice (Kirk Hinrich, Joe Johnson, Tracy McGrady and Erick Dampier were among those who looked to have more pep).
“I can see our guys needed [the break] not just from a physical standpoint but from a mental standpoint,” Larry Drew said. “It’s good to get away from everybody. I’m sure they were glad to get away from me, and now we will look to finish up the second half of the season.”
Notes
–Joe practiced with soft braces on both knees and said he “feels great” after a “much-needed” physical and mental break. But he stopped short of declaring himself ready to play tomorrow after sitting out two games last week and failing to finish the Bulls game: “I think so. I don’t want to get everybody’s hopes up.” Drew: “Game-time decision. He was moving pretty well.”
–Zaza Pachulia watched the end of practice with a wrap around his left calf. That’s the same calf he hurt during last summer’s European Championships and again while playing club ball in Turkey. Pachulia said he tweaked it during the third quarter of the Orlando game last Thursday. He said he plans to play tomorrow: “It was bothering me a little bit. It looks like it’s not a big deal. I just pulled I guess a little bit. Bad thing was it happened, good thing was that I had four days off.”
–Yesterday Al Horford ditched the sling he’d worn since he had surgery Jan. 17 to repair a torn left pectoral: “It feels a little weird. It’s good to at least have it off. Tomorrow I see the doctor to make sure he fully clears me to start doing rehab. I’ve been doing cardio and stuff pretty consistently and a couple excercises he told me to do. I need him to tell me I can start expanding on my range of motion and then lifting with my legs and building [up] slowly. The most important thing for me is to get the range of motion back.”
–Does Horford think he can return before the end of the season? “I would say after I do [rehab] for two weeks, two weeks from Wednesday, I will be able to get a beter feel for where I’m at. He’s been pretty strict with me not moving my arms in [certain] ways so the muscle can heal. I’m hoping right now I will be back befor ethe end of the season. That’s my exepectation but I want to see how I feel once I start rehab.”
– Drew on the season so far: “Right before the break we were trying to finish up on a strong note. It didn’t go quite as well as we wanted to on the road trip. But given the schedule and the [injury] situation, I was very pleased with the first half of the season. One thing I wanted them to do during the break was get away and clear their heads out and get a chance to rejevunate. It looked like it helped a little bit.”
–Drew on his biggest concern going forward: “Injuries. We’ve been a little banged up. As we move into the second part of the season, the schedule doesn’t get any lighter. We have got to go out for another 10 days. If you are healthy, you give yourself a good chance. When you are a little banged up, a little nicked up, it kind of puts a damper on things. We’re a little short-handed, a little limited. That’s my biggest concern right now. But we will be competitive in every game we play. We will go out and put our best foot forward everry game. We won’t use injury as an excuse because it’s part of the game. We’ve already talked about that as a team.”
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
179 comments Add your comment
Najeh Davenpoop
February 28th, 2012
5:39 pm
They could use Joe against the Warriors. Post up Ellis all day.
pointguardslim
February 28th, 2012
5:43 pm
Ellis will likely be on Marvin Williams if we play the normal small lineup.
Slimjr
February 28th, 2012
5:50 pm
3rd?
honest_abe
February 28th, 2012
5:52 pm
But we will be competitive in every game we play – LD
really?
Slimjr
February 28th, 2012
5:53 pm
GS by 7…
4-9 was my revised prediction for Feb. Just flat out awful!
pointguardslim
February 28th, 2012
5:53 pm
Hey slimjr, I was looking at vids online and look what I found.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaOQDL5mut0
Ask yourself why I fastbreak sucks now keep your eye on MARVIN WILLIAMS as he singlehandedly turns a fast break into a slow break.
Love the guy but that’s an Utter lack of balance.
Cwebb
February 28th, 2012
5:55 pm
«But we will be competitive in every games we play »
Are you kidding me ?
Slimjr
February 28th, 2012
5:59 pm
Grandad (Previous Blog)
February 28th, 2012
3:29 pm
vava
“We should have taken Yi in the 1st round.
Horford is so devoid of skill and heart;
not to mention destitute of any athleticism whatsoever.
that we could have picked him up in the 2nd round.”
Wow, what an incredible astute observation of ALL NBA…Super overrated at 9pts and 7 rebs in 39
playoff games..
Incredibly limited offensive skill set.. Room for improvement? Dont hold your breath due to lack of fluidity….
Ole Hawks Fan
February 28th, 2012
6:02 pm
Joe will never post up. He likes dribbling the ball running down the clock then hoist up a fade away jump shot as the clock expire.
Grandad
February 28th, 2012
6:07 pm
Yeeessssssssss;
and I thought Marvin and especially Shelden were superb
picks as well.
Perhaps this yr we can select a Georgia player;
maybe Dustin Ware to solve our longstanding pg problem.
vava74
February 28th, 2012
6:09 pm
JJ consistently posts up Ellis.
Geemack
February 28th, 2012
6:15 pm
one report have Hawks trading Marvin Williams for Ramon Sessions
Slimjr
February 28th, 2012
6:20 pm
Ryan Braun a player in MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL gets his 50 game suspension for illegal drug use revoked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Are you kidding me? Nope! Must be nice to have those special hook ups? What a travesty?????????? Let one of them Latin players try it again.. Hmmmmmmmmmmm…..
Sautee
February 28th, 2012
6:22 pm
LOL @ slim, not recognizing T-s posing as Grandad.
Sautee
February 28th, 2012
6:24 pm
6:07 post was not Grandad either. Troll alert.
Slimjr
February 28th, 2012
6:25 pm
Plaxico wants to play for the Eagles? The rich get richer?
Ice gets an extension..Oh well, that streak will definitely continue…(0) playoffs wins under Center…..Yawn..
RG3 ran a 4.38, 40..Definite upgrade if the Birds could get him….
Sautee
February 28th, 2012
6:26 pm
The REALLY funny thing is, that though T-s would now make fun of Marvin through Grandad’s name, he actually praised him a good bit a couple of years ago. Seriously.
Slimjr
February 28th, 2012
6:31 pm
I know Derrick Williams is only a Rookie, but I’d much rather have him starting at the “3″ than his distant cousin Marvin Williams for sure…..
Thanks for FYI Sautee..LOL!
pointguardslim
February 28th, 2012
6:35 pm
Larry Drew said. “It’s good to get away from everybody. I’m sure they were glad to get away from me…”
Learn how to run this play more and everyone’ll be happy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yh5xr04VnYI
Slimjr
February 28th, 2012
6:39 pm
That quote from Larry above does not sound like a Head Coach…Sounds more like an Assistant Coach?
Macaroni Tony
February 28th, 2012
6:41 pm
MC is there any truth that the Hawks trying to trade the MW have any truth?
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 28th, 2012
6:52 pm
WE DONT NEED MORE PGS. WE NEED BIGS
IS IT THAT HARD FOR DKBASG TO SEE
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 28th, 2012
6:54 pm
LOL @ Monta on Marvin. Sounds right.
Marvin got shut down by Ridnour, Meeks, and Korver. why not put Monta on him?
Grandad
February 28th, 2012
7:20 pm
Grandad trade of t`day
Horeford to SA spurs fo` Tiagio Spitter.
BIG DOG
February 28th, 2012
7:37 pm
Rumor Kirk to Lakers for a 1st, just dam.
You mean to tell me ASG have thrown in the tower for the season ?
BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE
High-sider
February 28th, 2012
7:40 pm
NBA League Pass [Free Preview Promotion] is running from Feb. 28. – Mar. 04 [2/28 - 3/04]. You can set up your broadband access and watch archived [NBA or Hawks'] games.
pointguardslim
February 28th, 2012
7:40 pm
Horford, Marvin, Kirk,picks
Rondo + Garnett
or
Parker + Duncan
star PG, Joe, Josh, star PF, Pachulia for the rest of this playoff run.
Then sign both Garnett and Duncan for $10 mil annually for 2 years. Now we got all the pieces. We got the size.
Speaking with reporters, Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban didn’t mince words when he was asked whether Dallas can beat the Lakers this season: “Hell yes. That’s it. Hell yes. We’ve got the size now. We’ve got the depth. We’ve got a lot more depth than the Lakers. It’s not even close there.”
Also bring back Keith as a tall PF understudy to extend the window. Then if we dont win it all, THEN blow it up.
BIG DOG
February 28th, 2012
7:42 pm
Share your trade
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=8ydospv
Can the Hawks get Gasol ?
BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE
Najeh Davenpoop
February 28th, 2012
7:44 pm
“Rumor Kirk to Lakers for a 1st, just dam.
You mean to tell me ASG have thrown in the tower for the season ?”
If the Hawks can actually get a 1st rounder for Kirk and don’t do it, that would really be throwing in the towel. In this draft, the Lakers’ pick (which will be in the 20s) will be like a late teens pick in last year’s draft (which is basically what the Hawks threw away in the Kirk deal).
TMACfan
February 28th, 2012
7:49 pm
I like the trade for Pau Gasol, although we would have to include a first round pick.
BIG DOG
February 28th, 2012
7:57 pm
TMACfan yes Marvin, Hinrich, 1st for Gasol, Darius
BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE
pointguardslim
February 28th, 2012
7:58 pm
Kirk is $8 million expiring that can be worked into larger trades.
This following statement makes no sense: “If the Hawks can actually get a 1st rounder for Kirk and don’t do it, that would really be throwing in the towel.”
This draft has gotten closer and players have failed to pan out physically or skillset wise.
Remember the hyped Fab Melo?
Nbadraft.net
NBA Comparison: Dan Gadzuric
#20 2011 was 7′1 PF with perimeter skills. This year its a 6′2 PG without a jumper. Have you actually looked at the prospects in the draft? Maybe we want Tomas Satoransky to be our new Cenk or Sergiy?
Come on Rick Sund. As always youre late to the party
NBA GMs souring on 2012 Draft class
http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/2012/02/nba-draft-nba-gms-souring-on-2012-draft-class/
The Monger
February 28th, 2012
8:02 pm
“We will be competitive in every game we play”
QUOTE OF THE YEAR FROM LD. ROFL…. And “Charlie Sheen will be sober the rest of his life”, “Joe Johnson is the most underpaid athlete in the league” and “Josh Smith needs to shoot more jumpshots”.
Here’s some newsflashes for you Larry, and this is just THIS year….
LOSS at Philly 76-90…. 14 points
LOSS at San Antonio 83-105….22 points
LOSS at home to Memphis 77-96…. 19 points
LOSS at home to Miami 87-107…. 20 points
LOSS at Portland 77-97…. 20 points
LOSS at NY 82-99…. 17 points
And you players and coaches wonder why the entire city of Atlanta shows ZERO support or interest in this ‘team’, let alone attend a game and pay money to see one of the most selfish, premadona-filled, heartless, effortless, non-fundamentally sound “teams” in the league. The SECOND you guys show heart, emotion, and passion for this children’s game is the second you will see me back in attendance at Phillips. The Hawks should be embarrassed to have as much talent and veteran presence as they do, and yet still get blown out 6 times in the first 34 games….
Joe D
February 28th, 2012
8:04 pm
Grandmaster JeJe,
Marvin for Sessions would be great; anything for Marvin would be great! Immediately, Sessions and Kirk become trade pieces for the big the Hawks need desperately! Also, 3 mil plus of cap space.
Hawks make this trade yesterday!!!
KevinM
February 28th, 2012
8:05 pm
We can’t give up this year’s #1, it would have to be a future.
Now we hear that LD acknowledge they are ‘a little banged up and a little limited’, does that open the rumor that Sund will actually do something to get us through the 2nd half?
And on Gasol, it would take Kirk and Josh to get him. Would that be a deal LA would accept?
pointguardslim
February 28th, 2012
8:17 pm
And on Gasol, it would take Kirk and Al to get him. Would that be a deal LA would accept?
Teague+Joe+Josh+Gasol+Zaza
pointguardslim
February 28th, 2012
8:24 pm
Some Atlanta fans my goodness.
next year they dump Troy Murphy and all the Kaponos for Ryan Anderson
competent PG +Kobe Bryant + Josh Smith +Ryan Anderson+ Andrew Bynum
lol
so stupid
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 28th, 2012
8:31 pm
Watch Marvin get shut down/disappear/both tomorrow with Monta Ellis on him
pointguardslim
February 28th, 2012
8:36 pm
Marvin can well go for 30 points (#thingsHawksfanssay). But it will be all off of face up jumpers, he’ll still have the balance of a 2 year old and be detrimental to the running game, etc etc.
Hawks should stick him on David Lee and Smith on the wings early to see if we can toughen him up a bit.
Just Joe
February 28th, 2012
9:08 pm
Hinrich to Lakers for a 1st rd pick.
Marvin to Cleveland for Sessions & Hollins.
2 great moves if Sunday can pull them off.
JaeEvolution
February 28th, 2012
9:20 pm
“Hinrich to Lakers for a 1st rd pick.
Marvin to Cleveland for Sessions & Hollins.
2 great moves if Sunday can pull them off.”
Lakers throw in Ebanks and replace Hollins for Erden you got yourself two pretty good trades.
Hoops
February 28th, 2012
9:42 pm
Just Joe,
If you can make those two trades happen, YOU ARE THE MAN!!!
Grandad
February 28th, 2012
9:51 pm
I see that I`ve been on the board;
makes me wonder what else I`ve been up to ?
Ryan
February 28th, 2012
10:01 pm
Are these “rumors” made up or are they legit?
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 28th, 2012
10:03 pm
Content Reveals Character!
“6:07 post was not Grandad either. Troll alert.” -Sautee-
_______
Ha Ha! Sautee sugar bear … Did you see what the troll was trying to do there? Everybody knows all of my Grand-Daddy’s posts must include every symbol on the qwerty keyboard to be authentic. SMH … Trolls are so stupid.
bullseye
February 28th, 2012
10:03 pm
Yes! Why didnt I think of that….Trade Al and Teague plus a draft pick for D12. Give Hinrich his job back. Create the strongest front line in basketball with Josh and Dwight, have a great back court with JJ and Hinrich. Orlando gets the 2 perpetual excuses on why they did not perform in Teague and Al. teague can blame his third consecutive coach for why he doesnt know how to run an offense or pass the rock and as a bonus When Al disappears in the playoffs he can say its MAGIC…..
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 28th, 2012
10:05 pm
yes, trolls are sooo stupid but none as stupid as I Queen troll and oversized bitch.
Slimjr
February 28th, 2012
10:06 pm
Glad to see Gerald Green back in the NBA playing for the Nets!
This dude is 6′7″ with a 50″ vert and can shoot the ball…Wish him well!
Man in Black
February 28th, 2012
10:10 pm
Marvin has been a goose egg for his last 2 games back from his leave – Rad has been a goose egg in 5 games this season and has had no big games where makes 4 shots in a row – both of those guys shooting has been HORRIBLE – and they along with Horford & a draft pick could get us Howard and we should make the offer!
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 28th, 2012
10:13 pm
Grand Daddy!
Wassup honey bun? FTPB thanks for your response to the Rondo post that Ra’mon had put out there. I would rather the Hawks do something with the Celtics. We need a big and bold trade and not some lame deal with LA to shed salary and get picks. We suck with making draft choices. we don’t have a GM on board to fix this roster. I won’t even pop the lid on the can loaded with fart rocks aka ASKG.
LOL
Melvin
February 28th, 2012
10:15 pm
After watching Kaman play against the Bulls tonight, I wouldn’t mind trading for him even if the Hawks had to include ZaZa…
The sound of silence
February 28th, 2012
10:16 pm
Sautee id like to take credit for the Grandad post, Looks like damn good trolling to me… However I can give credit where its do. Either Grandad said it or another troll besides yourself or drmaryb posted it. Either way my hats of to who ever said it.
Enjoy your evening Sautee
Truthful Thompson
February 28th, 2012
10:35 pm
To me, this has been the most disappointing season for the Hawks since before they made the playoffs in 07-08. The Hawks are basically just beating up on the poor teams in the conference (there are a lot of them this season), and having nice games against Orlando, meanwhile coming up short or being abused by just about any competitive winning team they face. I know this has happened for quite a few years, but at least the Hawks used to actually beat good times and have huge upsets over “contenders” from time to time in the past. We haven’t beat an impressive team since we beat the Bulls early in the season. In fact, our wins over the Bulls and Heat were probably the only impressive wins we’ve had. No Horford, a banged-up JJ, and a shrinking Jeff Teague makes this season look very disappointing to me.
I don’t really enjoy going to the Hawks games to watch Josh chuck up and brick 20 jumpshots, while our role players just keep shooting 3’s until one goes in. Maybe that is interesting to some of you, but it’s not very entertaining to me. Sometimes, it’s more entertaining to root for the other team. I had high hopes for the Hawks this season, but after Horford went down with injury and Teague lost his confidence, this season has been very disappointing.’ Joe looks like he’s starting to battle with Father Time, meanwhile Josh has become a volume shooting big man, kind of like Antwan Jamison is for the Cavs. Our 3 best players are all in bad situations. One is injured, another is declining, and the third is getting out of control thinking he’s some kind of elite scorer. I don’t like what I see with the Hawks right now. I just hope that maybe a personnel change is on the way for the Hawks.
Truthful Thompson
February 28th, 2012
10:36 pm
beat good *teams*
Sautee is Truthful Thompson
February 28th, 2012
10:39 pm
and Illusion
haystacks
February 28th, 2012
10:42 pm
Did yall hear that sorry ass AL hoeford say hes been on the couch for months. No plans to come back this year. Pass the beer please.
haystacks
February 28th, 2012
10:42 pm
Al Hoeford is about the laziest rascal i ever seen.
Truthful Thompson
February 28th, 2012
10:43 pm
I doubt that I’m as optimistic as Sautee lol.
haystacks
February 28th, 2012
10:46 pm
How in the hell do you gets some work out of that varmint?Al Hoeford is about the laziest rascal i ever seen
Truthful Thompson
February 28th, 2012
10:47 pm
Yea, im not me T.s. Im not Sautee.
Truthful Thompson
February 28th, 2012
10:49 pm
“We will be competitive in every game we play”
QUOTE OF THE YEAR FROM LD. ROFL…. And “Charlie Sheen will be sober the rest of his life”, “Joe Johnson is the most underpaid athlete in the league” and “Josh Smith needs to shoot more jumpshots”.
LOL. Best comment of the day. Actually, best comment of the month. This one really made me laugh.
Truthful Thompson
February 28th, 2012
10:53 pm
I don’t know what kind of crush “T.S.” seems to have on Sautee, but trying to pull me into whatever pointless argument you two have going on is not going to help you win that argument. You can impersonate me all you want, but it’s not going to do anything to help your cause.
Truthful Thompson
February 28th, 2012
10:55 pm
I hope T.s learns that Sautee is mine. We are lovers. T.Thompson – heart – Sautee.
ag
February 28th, 2012
10:56 pm
looking at the box score and michael beasley is in the doghouse. i would trade for that crazy kid in a minute for marvin.
Sautee
February 28th, 2012
10:57 pm
Sautee – heart – Truthful Thompson
BFF
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 28th, 2012
10:58 pm
Brook Lopez 38 points tonight! Only 6 boards but I’ll take it.
So glad I signed him right before he returned
FIRE SUND
ARE WE REALLY TRYING TO GET ANOTHER CRAPPY PG?
haystacks
February 28th, 2012
10:59 pm
Yall two weird ass lovers need to get the fck on.
michael beasley
February 28th, 2012
11:01 pm
Yall aint got enough weed for me to come there and sit on the couch like Al “smoke weed everyday” horford.
Grandad
February 28th, 2012
11:05 pm
Ditch~Weed
I appreciate the fact – that you know me well enough -
that I would never try and impersonate you.
-nor-
Am I smart enough to mimick myself. ?
_____________________________________________
As for yourself;
try and behave … I quite enjoy your presence on this here board.
If you keep on gettin` kicked off;
they may suspect me an accomplice and dispose of myself as well.
____________________________________________
I will assist you in exposing the imposter.
Ronjo
February 28th, 2012
11:06 pm
Wow, the blog is kind of dead today. Anyway, nice update, MC. I’m glad to hear that Horford is likely to start rehabbing soon. I wouldn’t expect him to be back by the end of the season. Even if he can return by then, he’ll probably be extremely rusty. It takes time to get your timing and conditioning back up after an injury. His jumpshot will probably be off when he first comes back and I wouldn’t be surprised if he was a bit tentative to re-injure the area for a while. Horford probably won’t be back to playing like himself until at least a couple of weeks after he returns, and by the that time, the Hawks will probably be out of the playoffs. Anyway, it’s still good news that he’s recovering.
As far as Joe, I would give him all the rest he needs to make sure that he doesn’t aggravate his knee and be forced to miss time down the road. It’s not like the Hawks are fighting for playoff positioning right now, anyway. The East is very weak beyond the top 2-3 seeds, and even if the Hawks drop a few games resting players, I don’t see them ever dropping out of the playoff picture in the East. There simply aren’t enough competitive teams to make the Hawks potentially fall out of the playoff picture.
Rest Joe until he’s ready to go and experiment with some different lineups. Of course, I don’t trust L.D. to actually utilize any effective lineups that don’t include his favorite players, but at least we can still get an idea of who can produce offensively with Joe out. We don’t play another winning team until Saturday, either, so it’s not a huge liability to rest Joe in that respect either.
Grandad
February 28th, 2012
11:11 pm
I have watched game film [collegiate] of young D.Morris;
and was not impressed.
On the other hand,
a future [young] trade asset [D.M.] is more value prior to the draft
than Cap`n Kirk’s [useless] expired contract.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 28th, 2012
11:15 pm
Marvin will not hit 10 points with Monta guarding him. Might not break 2 points with the way he’s playing lately.
haystacks
February 28th, 2012
11:17 pm
Well dang, yall, I just can’t figure out why I hate Al Hoeford so dang much. Beats me with a hammer, yall. What do y’all reckon? That conflabbed rascal is just so doggone lazy. I reckon it shouldn’t bother me so much, but there ain’t much for a man and his hound to do on a lonely old farm these days. I reckon all the dang termites in my house might be gittin to my brain. Just ain’t the same here after ole redneck billy passed. I ain’t got no one to talk to now. Ah shucks
TMACfan
February 29th, 2012
12:46 am
How much will it cost to get Michael Beasley?
TMACfan
February 29th, 2012
12:47 am
He is ballin’ out right now versus the Clips
doc
February 29th, 2012
1:36 am
got to laugh at ya slim …. revised? 10-3 to 4-9. heh heh. chief that is serious reality check. warned ya bro.
Big Lou
February 29th, 2012
1:52 am
If P. Gasol is a no go then…
How about Marvin William and Kirk for Matt Barnes? He would add rebounds, snappiness, and consistency to our SF position.
vava74
February 29th, 2012
2:27 am
From NBA.com:
Washington (7-26)
Pace: 96.3 (4), Off: 94.7 (29), Def: 104.8 (25)
A stat: JaVale McGee has the second-lowest raw plus-minus in the league: minus-281. Only Charlotte’s Kemba Walker (minus-323) is lower.
A question: ………
The guy that “everyone” wants around here has the second worst ± of the league and has his team ranking 25th in points allowed.
Blocking shots and playing D are not exactly the same.
Obviously, the other guys also have to contribute, but “raw” does not even start to describe JaVale.
vava74
February 29th, 2012
2:28 am
On the other hand:
New York (17-18)
Pace: 96.4 (2), Off: 97.9 (24), Def: 97.2 (8)
A stat: No team has improved more defensively than the Knicks, who are allowing 9.7 fewer points per 100 possessions than they did last season.
A question: Isn’t Tyson Chandler the Knicks’ most important player?
A combination of Woody and Chandler seems to have made a huge impact on the Knicks.
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
2:36 am
vava dear pumpkin, nice work on the stats research – love that! uggh … what does PACE stand for?
Buddy Grizzard
February 29th, 2012
3:18 am
“This following statement makes no sense: “If the Hawks can actually get a 1st rounder for Kirk and don’t do it, that would really be throwing in the towel.””
Makes perfect sense to me. Kirk has had enough time to get in shape, get his timing back, get his legs under him, etc. What we’re left with is a player who is in Bibby-esque decline. Get anything for him and get Teague back to playing big minutes.
vava74
February 29th, 2012
3:26 am
Pace is – I believe – the number of possessions a team uses per game.
Basically NYK is playing at the second fastest pace in the league (short possessions) behind Denver.
The Hawks are 22nd and free falling, which means that we eat up a lot of clock – should be related to the motion offense and the search for the “open jump shot”.
However, it is also related, IMO, to a derivation of the motion offense which is Marvin not wanting to shoot most of the time and Teague being ordered not to shoot.
It appears that we are a lot worse since February 1st – which could be related to 2 things: tougher schedule which ends up with JJ pounding the rock more – with bad results – and Hinrich on the floor playing at much slower and less aggressive pace than Pargo.
Hawks’ report:
Atlanta (20-14)
Pace: 92.3 (23), Off: 99.6 (18), Def: 97.2 (7)
A stat: The Hawks had the ninth-best offense through Jan. 31, but have the 29th best offense this month, scoring just 93.4 points per 100 possessions.
A question: How the heck do the Hawks keep beating the Magic?
A prediction: The Hawks keep sinking in the Eastern Conference standings, but make the playoffs, thanks to that initial 9-2 stretch after Al Horford got hurt.
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
3:29 am
vava very very nice work. thanks bruh
Dawg
February 29th, 2012
7:40 am
In the HISTORY of the NBA, how many championship teams have succeeded at being a jump shooting team?
O'Brien
February 29th, 2012
7:46 am
FTPB,
Ra’mon,
One trade I was open to last year was Jamal for Dalembert.
Najeh, Melvin,
Stephen Jackson is only shooting 36% from the field, 28% from 3 this year, and he is due to make $10 mil next year. However, if we can get rid of Marvin, I would do that deal (assuming we use Kirk to get another piece).
Stephen Jackson can be traded next year at the deadline if he doesnt work out, whereas we would be stuck with Marvin for an extra year.
Anyways, I see no reason for Rick not to seriously explore trading Hinrich. And I hope LD and Rick are not counting on Al coming back this season (or for the playoffs). The last thing we want is for Al to come back too soon, and possibly get injured again.
However, somebody made a point on another blog, and I think there is some validity to it. When Al got hurt, he was in the post going up against Hibbert. Will that strengthen his desire even more to get away from playing Center full time?
O'Brien
February 29th, 2012
7:52 am
Wilson Chandler has been cleared to return to the NBA. As a SF, he averaged 15 pts, 6 rebs with the Knicks last year. It will be interesting to see who his suitors are, and where he ends up.
Good offensive game from Brook Lopez last night, putting up 38 in a victory at Dallas. But he only had 6 rebs in 38 minutes. Will the Magic hold onto Dwight through the entire year, or trade him at the deadline…
vava74
February 29th, 2012
8:12 am
Thanks for the props but it was simply a rather basic cut n paste job!
Walt Frazier
February 29th, 2012
8:23 am
It’s official: America’s worst sports cities: Atlanta is number 1.
vava74
February 29th, 2012
9:07 am
Chandler will not sign with us, but if he did, I would love it.
I would immediately use the amnesty on Marvin to sign him long term.
Buddy Grizzard
February 29th, 2012
9:10 am
Vava the schedule is a lot easier the rest of the way. I like this habit the Hawks have developed of consistently beating bad teams. In past years the Hawks would beat contenders then turn around and lose to scrubs. I’m also not worried about the blowouts because we did the same thing last year and come playoff time we gave CHI a run for their money.
I don’t know what’s going to happen with Horford but I don’t see the Hawks slipping below 6th, and 3rd may be within our reach.
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
9:26 am
Horford will not be cleared to play this season, period. That was a football injury usually seen on the lines, just brutal. Get Well Soon + Boss!
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
9:29 am
Copied!
Vava! Ha Ha … You copied and pasted some stats I had never seen before. I love empirical data, it’s very helpful to the conversation. (she winks!)
Another GM
February 29th, 2012
9:46 am
The first round pick from the Lakers is crap. If you dont get a top three pick in the draft its just a crap shoot. Hinrich is a proven vet player who has a good BBIQ, which is missing from most of the Hawks players. The biggest problem Atlanta has is no legitimate NBA head coach. The Hawks have a NBDL coach and him being the lowest paid coach in the league speaks volumes. In addition it is really sad that the ASG/Spirit has screwed this franchise up so much that Dwight Howard doesnt even want to play for his home team.
O'Brien
February 29th, 2012
9:55 am
From the ajc.com “Hawks at the break”;
Chemistry: The core group of Hawks players always have seemed to like each other and generally get along. They’ve shown the ability to band together when outsiders doubt them, such as their playoff series victory against Orlando last season or their initial surge in the wake of Horford’s injury.
But when things go bad for the Hawks, they can go really bad. And when that happens, players seem more focused on scowling and fussing at each other than bearing down to get back in games. The bickering bleeds over into their effort and execution...
Getting along when you’re winning is not a good example of chemistry. It is how you work together as a team in times of adversity that defines chemistry (imo). And the Hawks don’t respond well to adversity, and they start pointing fingers, so I would not describe them as having Chemistry (although they do like each other off the court).
Offense: The Hawks rank 18th of 30 teams in points scored per possession (a better measure than points per game because it takes pace into account).
Some slippage was expected since Horford is their most efficient scorer, but the Hawks still have enough offensive talent to score better than that. Drew offers a simple explanation for how the Hawks can improve the offense. “We just have to make shots,” he said. “That’s what it comes down to.”.
But the Hawks might find it easier to score if they were better at generating more efficient shots. According to hoopdata.com, only two teams in the league attempt more long two-point shots per game, and those are the least efficient shots..
LD makes it sound so simple. “We just have to make shots.” Really LD? That’s the best you can come up with it? And once again, LD puts it all on the players. Nothing about what he can do, it’s what the players need to do. Make shots.
For a guy who is supposed to be an offensive coach, I dont think he gets it.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 29th, 2012
9:57 am
“Stephen Jackson is only shooting 36% from the field, 28% from 3 this year, and he is due to make $10 mil next year. However, if we can get rid of Marvin, I would do that deal (assuming we use Kirk to get another piece).”
I really think Stephen Jackson is the kind of player who will play better when he has something to play for. As a starter on a playoff team, I think he is going to give more effort and play better on both ends. Maybe that makes him a jackass, but he would only be a short-term rental here, and since he would get steady minutes and be on a playoff team here, I think the Hawks would get the most out of him. Jackson played fine last year, so it’s not like he’s on some kind of steady decline or something.
He has never been a great shooter from the field, but he has also not been in a truly complementary role in several years, and has spent most of the last five or six years miscast in a primary offensive role. Maybe being the 3rd option on this team will allow him to be more efficient. It’s not like he hasn’t played on winning teams before — he’d be the only Hawk with a ring on his finger if he came here (unless Vlad got a ring for the half a season he played in LA in 2008-09).
The other benefit to trading Marvin and replacing him with Jackson is that Jackson’s contract expires a year earlier, which would give the Hawks more cap space in the summer when they try to re-sign Josh (assuming they haven’t traded him by then). As frustrating as Josh can be at times, it would be incredibly annoying if Marvin’s $8 million was the reason the Hawks had to let Josh walk.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 29th, 2012
9:58 am
“We just have to make shots.” –LD
“Guys just gotta go out and make a play.” –Jim Moron
Sounds awfully familiar.
Just Joe
February 29th, 2012
10:53 am
Obviously, Marvin for Ramon Sessions sounds a lot better than Marvin for Stephen Jackson, but really, either is an upgrade (especially for salary cap management purposes).
As far as the Lakers are concerned. Not sure they can trade their own 1st round pick because Dallas’s pick is top 20 protected, and the Lakers have to have at least one first round pick this year since they were without one last year. So, Dallas’s pick is the trade bait. Top 20 protected until 2017 (I think).
Rod from College Park
February 29th, 2012
11:05 am
“Offense: The Hawks rank 18th of 30 teams in points scored per possession (a better measure than points per game because it takes pace into account).”
Wait until the playoffs. If we make it. We might not get out of the 70’s with this bunch. We need another scorer badly.
“Marvin will not hit 10 points with Monta guarding him. Might not break 2 points with the way he’s playing lately.”
Everyone who has faith in Marvin Williams please watch closely tonight. They will let Monte Ellis, or Steph Curry guard Marvin, and neither one will have to exert themselves at all on the defensive end of the floor. Then the Marvin lovers will talk about how Marvin stepped up because he scored 12 points, not understanding that Marvin should be a mismatch all night long in the post. Marvin, and Joe (if he plays) should live in the post tonight. Knowing the Hawks, we will still be launching long jumpshots, and knowing Marvin has not post up abilities, he will still be standing on the perimeter, passing the ball like its a hot potato.
Melvin
February 29th, 2012
11:17 am
MC,
I noticed that you mention Diamper was at practice. I thought his 2nd 10 day contract has ended. If so, does this mean the Hawks signed him for the reminder of the season? I was thinking they would leave a roster spot open prior to the trade deadline in case of a trade.
bamaboy
February 29th, 2012
11:26 am
100
doc
February 29th, 2012
11:30 am
najeh, if ld cant keep tmac happy why do you think jackson will be happy, here? to that, he has never found a good fit for his ego. he probably needs a bigger stage than the hawks and atlanta to find his meaning.
rod, i heard marvin is being held back by jc1, though he is a continent away.
can we find a coach for marvin to find his dog or is he a puppy for life?
Just Joe
February 29th, 2012
11:39 am
I think Dampier is good through tonight. Decision comes tomorrow, or at the latest, the 2nd of March.
Melvin
February 29th, 2012
11:42 am
doc,
Getting Stephen Jackson has more to do with getting rid of Marvin. Jackson contract expires a year earlier than Marvin’s. At least Jackson is productive where as Marvin just sit and watch while a bench player takes his place in the game.
KevinM
February 29th, 2012
12:02 pm
“Melvin
February 28th, 2012
10:15 pm
After watching Kaman play against the Bulls tonight, I wouldn’t mind trading for him even if the Hawks had to include ZaZa…”
That makes a lot of since and a very good upgrade to the starting 5. We will see more consistency immediately. I like this move and have since NO exiled Kaman.
“Another GM
February 29th, 2012
9:46 am
The first round pick from the Lakers is crap. If you dont get a top three pick in the draft its just a crap shoot.”
A-GM, let me give you a couple of Kirk stats from this year:
33% from 2FG, 24% from 3FG, 57% FT, and 4.9 PPG in 19mpg…only Sund gives up a Top 3 pick for these results. Kirk wasn’t worth 2 #1s in the latter part of the first round last year, but someone had to take on Bibby. On the 2012 draft, I think the first 10 will be very good guys who will contribute immediately in the right environment. The 2nd 10 is a toss-up about who will your team immediately.
Rod from College Park
February 29th, 2012
12:06 pm
O’Brien,
“Stephen Jackson is only shooting 36% from the field, 28% from 3 this year, and he is due to make $10 mil next year. However, if we can get rid of Marvin, I would do that deal (assuming we use Kirk to get another piece).”
Never use a guys stats, and try to determine what that will mean on the Hawks team. Stephen Jackson has never seen the kind of open jumpshots he would get on this Hawks team in his career. That’s why Jamal, and Flip were able to be so successful on this team. Even if his shooting percentage stayed where it was, the threat of him being on the floor, would open up many more looks for Joe. Stephen Jackson’s man would not be able to leave him the way Marvin’s man does. Golden State would not be able to guard Jackson with Monte Ellis, which would force Ellis to guard Joe. It’s not always about stats. On offense, its about posing some sort of threat to score. Plus Jackson is a better defender than Marvin also, along with the contract advantage. I don’t see any way that the Buck’s take back Marvin though. They are aware of how terrible his game is also. There would be no advantage for them to take him.
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
12:10 pm
Captain Jack!
This guy was one of my favorite players here when he played with Al Harrington and Jet Terry. He was the only player that would give me a high five when entering the teams tunnel. I love his heart and his defense is pretty good too. I would prefer Captain Jack over the PG Sessions at this point. We got Pargo and PG is no longer a real need here – just utilize Pargo better coach! Do your damned job man.
Kaman is what this team need, hella … Isn’t he available? We’re not getting D12 so, let’s move on from that dream scenario. At the end of the day, we are the Hawks and we get NOTHING!
TMACfan
February 29th, 2012
12:10 pm
Did any of you guys see Michael Beasley last night? I think we can get him for cheap.
vava74
February 29th, 2012
12:30 pm
TMACfan,
Beasley may be cheap nowadays but not “Marvin-cheap”
STRETCH
February 29th, 2012
12:31 pm
Adrian Wojnarowski: “Boston is very active out there. They’re willing to trade any of that Big Three if they can find a deal that helps them going forward with cap space, with draft picks. Danny Ainge, Doc Rivers have determined internally ‘we’re not contenders, we’re not going to win the championship this year’… And if the right deal comes along for Pierce, Garnett or Ray Allen, they’re gonna move them. NBCSports.com
Heck, go get Pierce!
Rod from College Park
February 29th, 2012
12:34 pm
Stop saying the Hawks don’t need a guy because you think he is a bad guy or will be a problem. We have a team full of nice guys already, and you see where that got us.
KevinM
February 29th, 2012
12:37 pm
DMB, going further with the Jackson or Kaman potential of coming here, I just don’t think Sund has the creativity to get it done. You bring those 2 guys in, we are a threat immediately with or without Al.
IMO, there is nothing better than an expiring Kaman to come in here and get touches and fill a huge void we have here. Jackson may get Josh to get back on the block where he belongs. He isn’t a SF as much as he wants to be.
ASG, if you are serious about any attempt to contend, you get something done that makes an impact. This has to be done in 31 games now…you’ve waited this long after Al went down and think something will drop in your lap…just idiocy.
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
12:40 pm
I still believe the best option is for Sund to get on the phone with Ainge and make some type of deal happen for Rondo or Pierce.
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
12:41 pm
Sekou told me earlier on Twitter, that the Hawks don’t have anything brewing that’s worth repeating out loud. Typical Sund-ASG.
STRETCH
February 29th, 2012
12:46 pm
Thanks Ra’mon.
I was kinda getting my hopes up. Oh well, now i can go to lunch!
Man, sometimes i hate being an Atlanta sports fan but then i look at the Cleveland’s, Cinncinati’s, Minnesota’s, Sacramento’s and Toronto’s (to mention a few) of the league and i dont feel so bad.
O'Brien
February 29th, 2012
1:00 pm
Rod,
Stop saying the Hawks don’t need a guy because you think he is a bad guy or will be a problem. We have a team full of nice guys already, and you see where that got us..
Also, although we have a bunch of nice guys, when things get tough, they start pointing fingers, and bickering (as MC puts it), so I agree with you.
Dont pass on a guy because of character issues, especially if it is only a short term committment. Plus character issues somewhere else doesnt necessarily mean character issues here.
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
1:03 pm
Rod from College Park change your stance to “Golden State would not be able to guard Josh Smith with Monte Ellis, which would force Ellis to guard Joe.”
This above statement suggests that Monta Ellis would have more success defending Joe Johnson than Josh Smith [true].
You’re other statement suggests that Monta Ellis would have more success defending guard Joe Johnson than a geriatric Stephen Jackson [very false].
The Hawks need to conform and realise Josh Smith is the key to the team. And the key matchup that is overlooked around the league as Coach Avery Johnson said is SF.
O'Brien
February 29th, 2012
1:04 pm
Ra’mon,
I dont think the Hawks have enough assets to offer Boston.
I won’t be surprised if the Hawks dont make a move, but I hope Rick is at least working the phones furiously trying to find a deal. Unfortunately, I think all we’ll hear is “we couldnt find a deal that makes sense for us”.
KevinM
February 29th, 2012
1:11 pm
One Hawks’ fan opinion….I am okay with any trade we make as long as it doesn’t involve bringing in another PF and allow Josh to continue to roam the perimeter.
So if you bring in a decent SF, does that finally fix our Josh/perimeter problem and start moving us toward contention? It would be pushing us in the right direction.
Ra’mon, you mean all these rumors here on this blog and Sekou won’t even let us know who’s asking for Stackhouse?
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
1:23 pm
Coachability!
“najeh, if ld cant keep tmac happy why do you think jackson will be happy, here? to that, he has never found a good fit for his ego. ” -doc-
_____________
Hey doc wassup! Honey Waffle … The ability to coach a prima-dona jackass multi-mililonaire is what separates the Phil Jackson’s from Larry Drew. This is even moreso a key to success when you have a role player who believes he is a super star. LOL!
If the coach can’t manage personalities, then put his azz on the recycle curb and get a Real Coach. LOL!
Bring Captain Jack Back! Oh oh … Does that mean we will have four captains now? that is just way too many chiefs!
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
1:27 pm
KevinM what? Josh Smith is currently roaming the perimeter….as the PF. We commonly see Josh Smith getting pushed out by the bigger PFs as far as the 3 point line just to catch the ball.
Commonly outmatched physically.
Lebron James + Chris Bosh. Pretty good.
Shawn Marion + Dirk Nowitzki. Pretty good.
Josh Smith + Kevin Garnett. Pretty good.
Josh Smith + Marvin Williams. Garbage.Same ol tinkering Hawks.
Josh Smith + Steven Jackson. Garbage. Same ol tinkering Hawks.
Delusional to think that Hawks would actually contend with Steven Jackson. Idk anyone except 1st ballot hall of famers who could play the 4 full time and win with the lineups you Hawks fans try to bring to play Josh Smith at the 4.
Name someone who isn’t a hall of famer that could bring that team into contention.
Hawks Fans Math
Jeff Teague
Joe Johnson
Stephen Jackson
Zaza Pachulia
+ Josh Smith = contention
Are we Really that crazy?
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
1:34 pm
Here’s my point: Stephen Jackson would be a perfect fit for this team, coupled with Marvin-Be-Gone!!!!!! Good Fkg Bye Sir! I can’t even watch this buster drag his butt around the court anymore.
Marvin is the equivalent of a “Swifter” dust mop, all he do is wipe up the baller’s sweat in the paint with his back side!
I saw Marvin yesterday, his butt was so big … I thought there was a crowd following him. Bye Bye Birdie!
______
Secondly, go get KAMAN! That is about our speed, moneywise without destroying the core. FK the Lakers for Kirk and a low first round pick … We can use Kirk to get Kaman instead! Where the hella can we find a Real GM! Yeah guys … I’m PO’d.
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
1:40 pm
Teague/Rondo+Joe+Smith+Garnett+(centers Pachulia)
is still the scariest lineup we can manage.
Kaman is not a Power forward so it really doesnt make us bigger unless the depth means we start Ivan now… And idk about that one.
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
1:52 pm
“Kaman is not a Power forward ” -pgs-
__________
And, MJ is not a female. So, what is your point? Are you saying we need another PF to add to the 13 PF’s we already have? (smh) scratching my head – here.
Please correct me if I’m on the tail end of a long conversation?
Sautee
February 29th, 2012
1:56 pm
Ka-Boom!
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
2:00 pm
So, what is your point? Are you saying we need another PF to add to the 13 PF’s we already have? (smh) scratching my head – here.
1st) what 13 PF’s? 2nd) I’m scratching my head. Kaman is owed $14 million.
Who do you want to trade for him and what is the projected lineup?
Andrew Lipham
February 29th, 2012
2:15 pm
Hawks get: Ramon Sessions, Antawn Jamison
Cavs get: Kirk Hinrich, Marvin Williams
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
2:28 pm
O’Brien, the Hawks have Horford, Teague, and Kirk’s contract (remember Boston want’s salary space and young talent). Boston could look at Teague, Horford, and Green (Jeff Green) as a great starting point to a team to go along with over $30 million dollars in ANNUAL (Garnett, Allen, then you add Kirk, and Horford’s contract cheaper than Pierces, and Teague’s cheaper than Rondo) cap space.
I’d rather the Hawks deal with Boston compared to the Lakers, because I honestly think that Kupchak is a better GM than Ainge. And I can’t remember the last time that the Lakers made a bad trade. But I remember the last time Ainge did, lol. Ainge is more likely to trade away talent for talent (remember Jefferson, Perkins, the pick that ended up being Jeff Green). Kupchak trades away garbage pieces for assets and talent.
I really think Ainge would think long and hard about a Horford, Teague, and Kirk for Rondo and Pierce deal. And if the Hawks was able to pull it off, they could then turn and still try to acquire Ramon Sessions for Marvin. With the lineup of Rondo – Joe – Pierce – Josh – Zaza, and a bench of Sessions – Green – TMac – Ivan – Dampier – Collins – Vlad- Stackhouse, the Hawks are better and more balanced than the Bulls in my mind! And they can REALLY compete with the Heat in ECF.
The bold GM’s end up watching their team play in June.
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
2:37 pm
Rondo – Joe – Pierce – Josh – Zaza
that’s a lot of ball handlers and Pierce is getting easier to guard by the moment (he considered coming off the bench iirc) and is still here for 3 years. I’d prefer size + defensive anchor + jumpshooting + expiring contract (ie a mulligan) that KG presents.
Rondo – Joe – Josh – Garnett – Zaza
Both Garnett and Duncan will be available as Free Agents next year.
I’d only move Horford + filler for Garnett AND Rondo or Garnett AND their 1st rounder.
Rusty
February 29th, 2012
2:52 pm
Get rid of LD. He will play MW but will not give TMac a real shot. I would like to see what TMac can do giving him sufficient playing time. He really is not that old. LD is the man trying to ruin JT .
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
2:52 pm
PGS, Boston isn’t about to deal KG’s expiring contract of $20 mil unless they are getting back a top 15 talent in the league, or a top 3 draft pick (like Charlotte or NO). They want cap space. And I’d rather pay Pierce his salary for the next 2 seasons, compared to paying Marvin his. And Pierce is becoming easy to guard as a number 1 option. You bring Pierce in here as the number two or three option depending on the night, you have the same Boston team that won the title. Rondo is better than he was. Joe is better than Ray Allen. Pierce is still Pierce when needed. And Josh is as close as you’re going to get to Garnett on defense and controlling the game as anyone in the league. And Zaza is just as good as Perkins in enforcing the paint (ask Dwight). And please don’t say anything about Pierce’s age. I’d take a 40 year old Pierce over a 25 year old Marvin seven days a week. The Hawks will have a 3 year window to compete with anyone. And be a top defensive team, while doing so. Not to mention they will have their starting unit, so they can keep their draft picks and draft to restock the bench and depth over the next 3 seasons.
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
2:54 pm
PGS, Boston didn’t start winning until Pierce came back and started LEADING that team. Don’t tell me the Hawks couldn’t use him. I’d take Pierce over Bogut, Lueur, and Garnett,
ntrigue
February 29th, 2012
3:15 pm
We don’t need another streak shooter we need someone that can create and go to the basket at sf! Barboso would be good someone that creates and goes to the lane!
DS
February 29th, 2012
3:19 pm
Pointguard slim the trades that work on 2k12 don’t necessarily work in real life buddy (Thabeet/Hill, Bogut/Leuer, KG/Rondo).
terrell
February 29th, 2012
3:19 pm
Joe said “I dont want to get everybody’s hopes up”. Like who? LD maybe? I for one could care less. Its not like we’re world beaters when your out there. smgdh
Melvin
February 29th, 2012
3:24 pm
Interesting scenario for the Magic if the chips fall into place.
http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba2-orlando-the-next-nba-super-team?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=nba2-orlando-the-next-nba-super-team
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
3:34 pm
-breaking news-
‘`Sund is cipping his toe-nails`’
-film at eleven-
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
3:41 pm
* clipping
** If he’s cipping his toe-nils;
I don’t want to know about it ?
KevinM
February 29th, 2012
3:42 pm
Melvin, the ONLY way Orlando can get better is at least 2 years out. I don’t see a powerhouse in the making there….again, I offer you D12 and Josh in the same frontcourt…not a good combo IMO.
G-Dad, you’ve got an inside to this organization that you’re not exposing here! Good work!
I see Leuer and Bogut have made their presence felt again in this blog…is there 2 more overrated names to make a deal for? One is hurt, and one is 4.5 points away from averaging double figures….that doesn’t even match Marvin’s output?
680 the fan spreading Kirk to LA for 1st rounder and a youngster….good research fellas….straigthen ‘em out G-Dad!
terrell
February 29th, 2012
3:44 pm
Marvin reminds me of Cliff levingston when he got old and went to Chicago. All I remember is him standing over there with that towel cheerleading. Luv u Cliff. Just sayin. lol. Btw, anyone remember (1986) when Cliff fouled “in” to a game? Doc got ejected, and the Hawks were down to 4 players.(Nique and Carr were injured)(Hastings, Spud, Willis and Levingston fouled out) Cliff was the last player to foul out, so he had to come back in the game. LMAO
terrell
February 29th, 2012
3:46 pm
I saw Kaman last night too, and saw him taking A LOT of jumpshots. Turned me off right then. lol. Upgrade for sure tho.
terrell
February 29th, 2012
3:48 pm
Agreed Rod. Same with the Birds. Stop looking for choir boys, and get some damn ballers.
terrell
February 29th, 2012
3:53 pm
The ASG shops at Lenox for players(contract wise), and then they turn around and go to Walmart with 1000 + coupons looking for a coach. smmfgdh
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
4:10 pm
——–
* “Boston isn’t about to deal KG’s expiring contract of $20 mil unless they are getting back a top 15 talent in the league, or a top 3 draft pick (like Charlotte or NO).”
Horford isn’t a top 15 talent? Who is then?
They want cap space. And so what is your deal then? Marvin William (albatross) + Hinrich’s expiring for Pierce?
I’d take Pierce as well.
Pointguardslim the trades that work on 2k12 don’t necessarily work in real life buddy (Thabeet/Hill, Bogut/Leuer, KG/Rondo).
Why don’t you tell that to Ra’Mon who never even proposed a trade? How are we supposed to get Rondo and Pierce thats more in tune with real life lol.
WHEN ARE THEY MOVING ?????
February 29th, 2012
4:15 pm
ENOUGH ALREADY !!!! WILL THIS JUNK NOTHING TEAM GET MOVING TO SEATTLE PLEASE !!! WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND GIVES A CRAP ABOUT “PROFESSIONAL” BASKETBALL ? IF YOU DO, GO GET A MENTAL CHECKUP !!!!!
GET OUT OF ATLANTA nba !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
4:25 pm
D12!
Is it just me, or is D12 not drawing as much hoopla as did LBJ & Melo? There just doesn’t seem to be that high level of buzz going on around this guy.
No doubt Dwight is a great player, but I question his heart and maturity level. D12 seems a little childish to me and hasn’t really dominated the east nor the playoffs. He has been surrounded with ample talent to have gone farther IMHO.
terrell
February 29th, 2012
4:28 pm
“little childish” is an understatement. Dwight’s just plain silly.
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
4:28 pm
They will move as soon as YOU leave first. (Pffft)
drmaryb.[*_*].
February 29th, 2012
4:36 pm
“Who do you want to trade for him and what is the projected lineup?” -pgs-
_______________
The original query was: what is your point in saying Kaman is not a PF? I didn’t read the entire blog, so I may be missing something. I don’t care what Kaman costs, we need a damned true center – any team will have to pay for that. Get rid of All these scrubs we got and get us a damned bona-fide BIG MAN. I hope ASKG go into bankruptcy so we can run them outa’ here. I don’t give a rats tail what the cost is! The Hawks as is – SUCK rocks!!!!!!!! That is not my problem to figure out – see SUND!!!!!!!
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
4:45 pm
DrMb, I think D12 has way more heart than Melo. Remember the only season that he had another all star playing with him, Nelson got hurt and missed all of the playoffs except for the Finals. Howard has routinely ran into the Celtics in the 2nd round and were put out by them. And he was put out by the Lakers in the Finals. You pair Howard with a perimeter player who can get 25 points per game, and you will have a team that can go pretty far. I would say Howard is a step below Ewing and right there with Mourning in his prime. Hakeem is the only big man to win without other Hall of Fame talent around him (the season before Clyde came). And I really believe that season was a throw away season because every one was shock MJ retired the first time. But typically bigs need perimeter help to win.
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
4:48 pm
DrMb, also about the maturity, don’t forget Shaq was always MORE immature than Kobe. He was just more skilled offensively than D12. But can you imagine if Shaq was committed to the game and working out in the gym as much as Dwight does? I believe he would still be playing at a high level now and have over 7-8 rings. Offensively he was unstoppable and defensively he never committed to going all out. He never came out on the pick and rolls. But Shaq with Dwight’s work out ethic, would be the best big in the history of the game without question.
O'Brien
February 29th, 2012
4:50 pm
Ra’mon,
Given Horford’s injury, I think his trade value is very low, because he won’t pass a physical. Therefore, I don’t think Boston would trade for him right now.
And despite the many rumors, I have a hard time seeing Boston trading Pierce. He is their captain, and has spent his entire career there. They are already losing $31 mil in salary after this year (Ray Allen and KG), and they are way under the cap next year already ($35 mil). Therefore, I think the only guy they might trade is Rondo.
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
4:51 pm
Kaman trade
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=74ney8j
Hollinger’s Analysis: You have not effected the winning % of this team.
Kaman can score but he takes a lot of shots and is a shodddy help defender.
We don’t need a center just to have one (we have Zaza).
We need to replace Marvin.
Jeff
Joe
Josh
Marvin
Kaman
You still get weak production from Marvin’s forward spot. And people saying Pierce for Marvin + expiring, remember they still want Pierce over Marvin so we’d have to give up a pick to let them further invest in a rebuild. WIth Horford for Rondo they get a young asset that they can trade for further picks or keep for youth and we don’t have to give up our pick.
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
5:07 pm
Horford’s value is as high as it will ever be O’Brien. I said that a year ago and now look what happened. It dropped.
The league saw the play where Horford got injured. Can’t dribble vs Roy Hibbert & can’t finish over him with a tear drop, or a dunk, or a fadeaway. Awkward post player.
The league has finally said, you know what this guy is undersized and he’s average offensively. He is a good passer/defers a lot and rebound and can run and lead the break a bit for a PF/C.
A point forward he’d be a nice role player at PF next to a superstar.
We’re not getting a superstar, ie Durant or Lebron to play the 3. We got Josh Smith at the 3.
So what help does Horford bring to us that isn’t replaceable. His value is not getting bigger at age 25/26.
You think keeping Horford would raise his value? Like it did with Kirk? Or Josh? Or Marvin?
Bottom line is Horford is what he is. A) smart hustle + role player B) big man C) awkward.
Which of that is going to change in the next year? 2, 3, or 4 years of his contract?
That has value on the market and it’s only going down as he ages.
Especially if he A) gets another injury banging inside the paint B) goes off for his standard playoff averages of 9ppg and 10rpg in 40 minutes. He’ll be labeled soft and mediocre.
His value peaked a while ago. Lets not act like Horford is going to become a scorer after 4 years in college, & 4 years in the league.
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
5:14 pm
*edit: by Horford becoming a scorer, I mean lets not assume that hes going to raise his value any more now that its apparently dropped.
I said his game and value peaked early and people said he’s too young to not show anything new.
Overlooking the fact he had a shorter learning curve than most rookies.
Now we’re moving the goal posts and saying Horford’s value has dropped, so its not good to trade him? Ignoring the fact he hasnt improved and isnt as impactful as people thought he was.
What? No one listens. If we had Garnett last year against the Bulls we would have been in the ECF vs Miami. Period.
Garnett can do everything Horford does (even lead breaks) and do it better and more consistently even at this age.
TMACfan
February 29th, 2012
5:20 pm
MAKE A MOVE SUND!
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
5:54 pm
Shaq was not immature !
He was fun-loving.
Shaq was a serious basketball player who worked at his craft
and was professional concerning his approach to the game.
I ever saw shaq quit on his team.
Shaq = one of the best five players of all-time.
* note – he took a lickin` & kept on tickin` ! *[like a good Timex]
Shaq = sense of humor
sense of humor does not equate to immaturity
Sorry; that had to be said.
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
5:55 pm
I *Never saw shaq quit on his team.
Buddy Grizzard
February 29th, 2012
6:03 pm
“Boston could look at Teague, Horford, and Green (Jeff Green) as a great starting point to a team .” – Ra’mon
I look at that as a great starting point to a team as well. So why don’t we dump Marv and Kirk and sign Green as a free agent instead of trading our future for Boston’s dinosaurs who can’t hack it any more, even with their All Star point guard? Teague is a better outside shooter than Rondo… one of Boston’s biggest problems is that teams can ALWAYS clog the lane because who ever is guarding Rondo can sag 5 feet off him… teams encourage Rondo to shoot from the outside the same way they encourage Josh. Rondo the most overrated All Star since Al?
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
6:04 pm
Kobe ……… mature are you serious ………;
have you ever read the court case in Colorado ?
Rape ain’t mature !
Ask his wife how mature he is ?
Does $ million dollar rings buy maturity ?
*[I ain't talkin about NBA Champ rings]
*(rather, husband is a chump ring)
Kobe is a great, great player; let’s end it at that.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 29th, 2012
6:04 pm
“Then the Marvin lovers will talk about how Marvin stepped up because he scored 12 points, not understanding that Marvin should be a mismatch all night long in the post.”
Those are just the Marvin apologists. The Marvin lovers, like Marvin’s grandma, or Antawn from two blogs ago, will say he only scored 12 points because the Hawks didn’t run plays for him.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 29th, 2012
6:06 pm
“if ld cant keep tmac happy why do you think jackson will be happy, here? to that, he has never found a good fit for his ego. he probably needs a bigger stage than the hawks and atlanta to find his meaning.”
I think he will be happy that a) he is starting, and b) he is on a playoff team. He was fairly happy in Charlotte, where even though they were losing, at least he had a starting job and guaranteed minutes. He went to Milwaukee and started pouting because Skiles wouldn’t hand him a starting job.
I think he’s a head case regardless of what kind of stage he’s on, but the main thing is he’d be a short term rental here. I’d get him for the rest of this season, let him increase his trade value, and aggressively shop him over the offseason.
KevinM
February 29th, 2012
6:12 pm
Marvin isn’t a key piece even with Joe and Al out….I believe he is still seen as the 4th/5th option…how sad is that?
We aren’t going to be able to give that albatross contract away. It is as bad as some or Orlando’s contracts.
Kirk, Zaza and Josh are our only values to deal with, but seriously, do you trust Rick Sund getting this right?
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
6:13 pm
Tonite after midnite – Sund … Innovate & innervate / go for it !
Josh Smith to Chicago Bulls + filler Ivan Johnson + 2nd round pick
Hawks get …Joakim Noah + Jimmy Butler
______________________________________________________
Why Not ?
-motivation-
It [perhaps] induces Dwight to wish for a Chi reunion with JS;
plus a super-team = Dwight / Josh / Rose ! ! !
______________________________________________________
Would Thibs go for this ? hmmmmmmmmm ?
Najeh Davenpoop
February 29th, 2012
6:15 pm
I am reluctant to endorse any trade that involves trading for one of Boston’s Big 3. Trading for one of them makes sense for a team that’s a player away from a championship. The Hawks are not that team. Trading Al or Josh for some combination of Pierce, KG, or Ray Allen isn’t going to make this team better than Miami or Chicago.
The one Boston trade that would make sense is if the Hawks packaged Teague and somebody else to get Rondo. Teague is my favorite Hawk, but Rondo is a better player, also pretty young, and locked into a very reasonable deal. To be honest I really have no idea why they are shopping him so hard.
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
6:19 pm
terrell
Kaman may have taken some J’s last eve;
he’s a very good mid-range shooter.
On the other hand – he has a very highly developed low post game.
Perhaps one of the best in the NBA.
Whether or not he utilizes his low post game … is on the HC.
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
6:20 pm
Joe for KG – would Ainge bite ?
Najeh Davenpoop
February 29th, 2012
6:30 pm
Alex Kennedy @AlexKennedyNBA Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
The Los Angeles Lakers have expressed interest in Kirk Hinrich, according to sources. No deal is imminent.
MAKE IT HAPPEN SUND
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
6:31 pm
G-dad’s ~> I`m slingin’ `em right & left
____________________________________________
Boston gets:
Josh; Teague; + *[Cap'n Kirk] -or- *[Marvin] *their choice
ATL gets;
Rondo & Ray Allen
____________________________________________
both work on tr mchn
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
6:35 pm
KG’s a huge expiring. This offseason we got Duncan, we got Dwight, we got Ryan Anderson.
Rondo ($12M)
Joe ($18M)
Josh ($12M)
Anderson ($7.5M aka Marvin money)
Dwight ($18M)
——-
$67.5M
Amnesty Marvin. Reunite the BFFs, PG Rondo, SF Josh, C Dwight
and live with Joe Johnson as your pressure release
for the next few years and Draft wisely.
Where there’s a will there’s a way. This unwillingness to think past Horford is holding us back.
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
6:41 pm
Let `er Rip … Sund !
____________________________________________
LAL gets – Josh Smith; Cap’n Kirk
Hawks get – Pau Gasol; Matt Barnes; + filler [tr ex] + # 1 pick
____________________________________________
doc
February 29th, 2012
6:46 pm
najeh, huge if there to ship a guy like that tor anything of value beyond excess baggage which jackson is, bottom line.
Grandad
February 29th, 2012
6:46 pm
Horford is inj
No one is gonna give full value for Al at this point in time
due to inj; w/o waiting to see the result of his surgical repair.
I do not wish to trade Al;
but if I did, I would meed to exercise patience
in order to get maximum value for an valuable asset.
STRETCH
February 29th, 2012
6:47 pm
Grandad,
Best trade offer i have seen all month and it comes on the last day of the month! LOL! But is it gonna happen? Hope so!
Najeh Davenpoop
February 29th, 2012
6:48 pm
“Rondo ($12M)
Joe ($18M)
Josh ($12M)
Anderson ($7.5M aka Marvin money)
Dwight ($18M)”
This would be the greatest team in Hawks history, but how exactly do you plan on getting Anderson from the Magic and Rondo from the Celtics? If all you’re trading is Teague and Al, one of those teams is getting shafted.
I still find it hard to believe the Celtics actually want to trade Rondo. Considering his contract and his production, he’s one of the best values in the league.
Just Joe
February 29th, 2012
6:55 pm
Sund’s got something up his sleeve if we’re really going to sign Damp for the rest of the season.
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
6:55 pm
Buddy, Jeff Green isn’t a free agent. He’s already signed with the Celtics. He’s injured for the season.
G’dad, when it came to the game and being in shape, Shaq was quite immature. How many interviews did Shaq admit that he normally wouldn’t get into basketball shape until March of the season? And that was why he would often have nagging injuries throughout his control. Its amazing how closely being in the best of shape helps prevent injuries or recover quicker than being in average shape.
And on the personal note, I haven’t followed either of them around. But I do think in court documents Shaq has cheated just as much as Kobe. That is why Shaq IS divorced and paid even more to his ex, than Kobe would have had to if not for the reconciliation. And as far as rape case, I wasn’t there so I don’t know what happened. But there are also rumors of Shaq settling under the table for sexual harassment cases.
Either way, on the court both are great players. And though I believe Shaq is one of the SMARTEST players ever to play the game. But personality wise, I do see a lot of Shaq in Dwight. Dwight just isn’t as talented as Shaq offensively (not even close actually).
pointguardslim
February 29th, 2012
6:55 pm
What do you mean full value for Al?
Last year it was Deron Williams for Al+filler. You think anyone would do that now? Now you’re saying he can’t get Rondo and 35yo KG’s expiring?
Lol you overvalue Horford Grandad. Just like Sund did last year and now Dwight wants to go play with his buddy Deron.
So Horford was really worth Deron Williams and a shot at Dwight Howard? Is that what you are saying?
Or are you saying Horford is injured so he can’t get Rondo+ 35yo Kevin Garnett’s expiring? Either way: Shaking my head.
And then you have the gall to say Josh Smith to LA so the Lakers can get a shot at Dwight and another superteam.
Horford is doing the same thing Marvin is doing. A role player who got far playing with Josh and Joe and is now overvalued.
Ra'mon
February 29th, 2012
6:57 pm
If the Josh was traded to the Lakers, they would become devastating on defense.
Michael Cunningham
February 29th, 2012
7:10 pm
new blog posted. shutting down this thread.