Atlanta Hawks at Bulls: Game Thread
Vivlamore reporting from Chicago.
Tracy McGrady met with Hawks coach Larry Drew and general manager Rick Sund about the forward’s publicly expressed displeasure over a lack of playing time.
Both sides say they are ready to move on.
“We talked,” McGrady said before Monday’s game against the Bulls. “Players get frustrated. I was frustrated. We talked and ironed things out. Now, we move on.”
Drew would not disclose the details of the meeting but said “we addressed the problem.”
After playing just 4:39 during a 97-77 loss to the Blazers Saturday, McGrady told the Atlanta Journal-Constitution: “I’m tired of this [bleep]. You can put that in the paper, I don’t give a [bleep].”
Drew has been mindful of McGrady’s minutes this season. The two-time NBA scoring champion has suffered through injuries, which includes a herniated disk in his back. He suffered back spasms on Jan. 11 and sat out three games.
“I’m sure everybody wants to play,” Drew said. “I want guys who want to play. I don’t want guys content to sit on the bench. But the way it was handled, you don’t handle it that way. We will keep looking at the situation of each game. I’m always looking at matchups. I’m always looking at it if it puts us at an advantage, if it puts us at a disadvantage. My job is to coach this team and I’m going to try to put us in the best position as possible. Sometimes it will jeopardize minutes when guys want to play but that is the way it is.”
Entering Monday’s game, McGrady has played in 26 of 32 games this season with average of 18 minutes. Last season with the Pistons McGrady averaged 23 minutes in 72 games.
“If you don’t feel I can help, come tell me that,” McGrady told the AJC. “He ain’t told me nothing. I just want to help these guys win, man, which I know I can. But, damn, four minutes?”
McGrady did not get a start Monday after Marvin Williams left the team Sunday due to the death of a relative. McGrady usually is the substitute for Williams.
* Drew did not know details of the personal situation or when Williams would return to the team. The Hawks end a five-game road trip against the Knicks on Wednesday.
Willie Green got the start in place of Williams.
“Willie has really been playing well for us,” Drew said. “I think the one thing we will miss about Willie is the punch he provides off the bench. In this situation I will juggle the guys coming off the bench but I just felt from a matchup standpoint he gives us a better chance.”
* The Hawks signed center Erick Dampier to a second 10-day contract Sunday with Jason Collins out up to another month with a torn ligament in his left elbow.
The 15-year veteran has appeared in four games for the Hawks after signing his first 10-day contract on Feb. 9. He has not scored but is averaging 2.5 rebounds, 0.3 assists, 0.3 steals and 0.3 blocks in 6.5 minutes.
* Drew said he expects no issues with Joe Johnson’s left knee. The All-Star wore a soft brace to protect his problematic the knee Saturday, saying he is suffering from tendinitis around the patellar tendon.
“We will keep an eye on it,” Drew said.
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812 comments Add your comment
Runner-
February 20th, 2012
8:26 pm
Seriously? Averaging 4 points in 10 sporadic minutes per game is not bad at all. Give him Teague’s numbers and his stats will be up there with Teague’s… You can’t play down the argument by comparing stats because of the huge minute gap. Teague and Pargo are not similar at all. Teague is a drive it to the hole type guard who rarely passes it into the paint. Pargo is a jump shooter that has decent passing skills.
Rocky
February 20th, 2012
8:27 pm
““TrueHoop is reporting thah Marvin wants to go some place where he can have an increased role offensively? SMDH.”
LOL isn’t he like the third option on the team?
Najeh Davenpoop
February 20th, 2012
8:28 pm
People say “Josh Nowitzki” and “Al Nowitzki” like that’s an insult. I’d trade this entire roster for Nowitzki in his prime.
Antawn
February 20th, 2012
8:28 pm
“TrueHoop is reporting thah Marvin wants to go some place where he can have an increased role offensively? SMDH.”
Can you blame him? If I were Marvin, I would have been asking to be traded ever since Jamal arrived on the team in 2009. People constantly complain about Marvin like he’s supposed to be put up great numbers when he is basically the last option when he is on the floor. Marvin has always had the offensive ability to warrant a bigger role, but he’s never given it, since this team is all about favorites. I can’t believe that Marvin has such a limited role on offense when you consider the make-up of the team. Josh Smith, one of the most inefficient starting big men in the league has been taking close to 20 shots a night while shooting very inefficiently and taking shots that we know he isn’t going to make at a high clip (long jump shots), yet L.D. has no problem with it, but guys like T-Mac can’t see the floor to score points and guys like Marvin barely get the ball on offense.
I really dislike L.D. as a coach and the combination of him being in control on the sidelines and Horford being injured has made this season incredibly disappointing for me. I’m sure I’m not the only one who feels this way. With a depleted team and a poor head coach, I don’t see the Hawks really going to anywhere positive soon.
Anyway, who would want to stay on a team where they are mistreated for no apparent reason? Good for Marvin if he really is looking to go somewhere else and not let his entire career waste away. I’m glad T-Mac spoke out about his lack of playing time too. That’s a good start. Aside from Josh and Joe (L.D.’s favorite players), I don’t see anyone else on the team that would be happy with their current situation, other than maybe guys stackhouse who are getting paid and not having to play much at all.
doc
February 20th, 2012
8:31 pm
the dysfunction begins anew and deeper. it can no longer be contained at the echelon of the basg as it filters down to the team.
when was the last time rick sund said we want to be elite?
doc
February 20th, 2012
8:34 pm
has anyone said to marvin dont shoot when you are open?
or maybe even better, masrvin you are not to get a rebound and certainly not an offensive rebound you could put back for an easy two points using your superior length.
gimme a break, marvin. grow the f*ck up.
Astro Joe
February 20th, 2012
8:35 pm
Broussard’s article mentions “sources” in the Marvin section but says “feeling of some in Atlanta”. Maybe it is just semantics, but one sounds like it could have come from the front office while the other sounds like it could have come from a opinionated blogger.
Honestly, I’m glad to hear that Marvin has possibly reached a point where he is showing some emotion. That is a major break-through.
doc
February 20th, 2012
8:36 pm
have we hitched our selves to the wrong team of horses?
Najeh Davenpoop
February 20th, 2012
8:44 pm
“Marvin has always had the offensive ability to warrant a bigger role”
No he hasn’t.
People who have the offensive ability to warrant a bigger role make layups and don’t get stripped or fall down every other time they get in the lane.
Marvin is at times a good role player. He’s consistently been a good rebounder this year, generally has been a good defender, and has generally been good at knocking down open shots. That doesn’t warrant a bigger role. If it did, some team would have given Shane Battier or Bruce Bowen the license to jack up 20 shots per game by now. Marvin is a less coordinated, poor man’s version of them. He is not and has never been anything close to a go-to offensive option.
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
8:46 pm
Marvin demanding a trade is like a broken spring in a mattress saying its tired of sticking out. We want you to be traded also. The problem is, no one wants you for your price tag.
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
8:51 pm
Marvin layups in traffic always end up in one of two ways : a) a block which leads to a defensive rebound or b) a missed fga which leads to a defensive rebound.
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
8:52 pm
I really believe Marvin has just made every Hawks’ fan optimistic for this season, hoping that he will be dealt.
O'Brien
February 20th, 2012
8:56 pm
Josh Smith had 9 jumpers outside the paint. He missed all 9. Meanwhile, he was 7-12 inside the paint. When will Josh get it????
Good game by Pargo. We didn’t get much from Teague, but then again, he only played 22 minutes. We got nothing from Kirk. He played 30 minutes, went 2-8 from the field, and had some terrible possessions.
If the Lakers dont make a legit trade at the deadline, I hope Rick is ont he phoine with them offering Kirk for their trade exception. How desperate are the Lakers? They worked out Arenas.
The legend continues
February 20th, 2012
9:00 pm
FIRE TEAGUE, FIRE AL HORFORD, FIRE RICK SUND , FIRE LARRY DREW, FIRE ALL THESE STUPID-ASS BLOGGERS.
Big Ray
February 20th, 2012
9:01 pm
Well, I guess my predictions came true. We lost, and Rose was still too much to handle.
That sucks.
I see little has changed:
1) Larry Drew is clueless. Starting Willie Green over T-Mac and then saying you’re going to really miss Willie coming off the bench? Brilliant.
2) Josh Smith doing everything, despite not shooting well.
3) Joe Johnson NOT doing what Josh does for the team. Oh how the times have changed.
4) Somebody explain to me why we keep going perimeter all the time when we need guys who will fight for rebounds and play tough? Ivan Johnson got to play 2 minutes.
5) Jannero Pargo comes of the bench and drops damn near 20 on the Bulls. Gee, maybe he should be playing a tad more. Just a tad.
6) Hinrich still ain’t there. Teague ain’t there, either. Another downer game.
7) Did we miss Marvin? Heh, not really. It would have given Drew another option, and one with size, but two problems: 1. Drew doesn’t know what to do with that anyway, and 2. Marvin doesn’t play his size.
TMACfan
February 20th, 2012
9:04 pm
We like you Chris, but I want me some MC on da blog.
Shoot the messenger
February 20th, 2012
9:07 pm
Teague is just destroying the offensive chemistry of the team, just awful. Night after night of funk, uncut funk, pure stank…
How in the hell would you expect any body to have a chance at winning when your starting point guard finishes with 8pts, 1 ast, 0 rebs? What kind of trick schit is that? WTF? night after night of brainless funk. World’s nastiest poot.
I dont know what you cultist see in this scarecrow but I want my freakin money back. Teague has got to go!
Why dont one you members of the Mediocrity Movement Cult tell me WTF is in your Koolaid. How in the Puck do you guys continue to worship at the feet of Jeff Teague and Al Horford,? Can you at least explain the logic behind the Mediocrity Movement?
Big Ray
February 20th, 2012
9:09 pm
People constantly complain about Marvin like he’s supposed to be put up great numbers when he is basically the last option when he is on the floor. Marvin has always had the offensive ability to warrant a bigger role, but he’s never given it, since this team is all about favorites.
Hmmmm…let me see.
1) #2 pick in the 2005 draft – that might have something to do with expectations, but what do I know?
2) Back in the day when Josh couldn’t do anything more than finish on the fast break, Marvin had plenty of chances. What about when Flip Murray was here? They let Al Harrington go down the road for free, with nothing in return. Why? So Marvin could take his place and be even better.
Don’t give me that BS. Marvin’s had more chances than anybody on this team.
3) Playing favorites….that’s hilarious. Marvin was a higher offensive option during Al Horford’s rookie year in the League. Same thing in Al’s second year. If you don’t believe me, go look at the shot attempts. So don’t tell me he’s the last option on the floor. That’s total BS as well.
If Marvin is the last option NOW, it’s because he has the least heart, the least drive, and the least amount of “IT” that it takes to be a higher volume scorer.
I mean GD, Jeff Teague averages more than he does now, and he’s the smallest guy on the floor, and somebody who didn’t get even get to start until this year, because somebody put a foot in LD’s arse after Teague’s showout in the 2nd round of last year’s playoffs (Hinrich being hurt again also helped).
Marvin wants to move on? Let’s help him out the door so he can go be a wuss elsewhere.
Another GM
February 20th, 2012
9:09 pm
The play of JJ, Teague, and Marvin can be tied directly to your head coach or lack thereof. The wild out of control play of Josh Smith is also tied to your head coach. Hawks fans, there are very very few coaches around the league that would have Josh Smith, you guys have him way overrated.
Eric
February 20th, 2012
9:10 pm
People who have the offensive ability to warrant taking 20 shots a night don’t shoot 29% from 3 point range and 33% from beyond 3 feet of the basket, but that doesn’t seem to stop Josh Smith from leading the team in field goal attempts on an almost nightly basis. Also, keep in mind that Josh is an interior player, meaning that his field goal percentage should be higher than the league average, since big men typically have the highest field goal percentages since they score a good portion of their points near the basket.
On another team with more offensive talent, Marvin shouldn’t be complaining, but on a team like the Hawks which is not full of adept scorers and is injured to begin with, Marvin has a legit beef. Any player has to wonder why he is an afterthought on offense while guys who need 20+ shots to get close to 20 points are the first options. Yes, Marvin is overpaid, but if you are going to overpay him, you might as well use him when your team is depleted to begin with.
With the team in it’s current condition, even Willie Green could argue that he should be the second option on offense.
Big Ray
February 20th, 2012
9:11 pm
O’brien ,
He will never “get it.”
But what should bug you more is that a guy who doesn’t “get it” is handily outplaying a guy who “gets it” and is being paid 20 freakin’ million dollars a year.
E43
February 20th, 2012
9:19 pm
It’s not that complicated. LD’s entire philosophy is built on attacking. Doesn’t matter how many minutes you get. You get minutes based on whether or not your attacking offensively or defensively. There will always be someone on that bench ready to come in and attack. That’s how Teague and Marvin lose their minutes. Teague was 1 of 10 against Portland and kept his minutes just because he was agressive. Teague and Marvin don’t play Mario west like defense or Jamal Crawford like offense. Teague can produce offensively, but his defense is not enough to just give him minutes for the sake of it.
kevkat
February 20th, 2012
9:19 pm
I beg to differ that Joe Johnson “gets it”. The only thing Joe Johnson “gets” is paid. He’s really not concerned about anything else and he didn’t give himself that contract so you can’t blame him. Also it appears L.D. spends more time developing quotes for losses than effective plays for the team. He’s never short on reasons as to why they lose.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 20th, 2012
9:20 pm
“Also, keep in mind that Josh is an interior player, meaning that his field goal percentage should be higher than the league average, since big men typically have the highest field goal percentages since they score a good portion of their points near the basket.
On another team with more offensive talent, Marvin shouldn’t be complaining, but on a team like the Hawks which is not full of adept scorers and is injured to begin with, Marvin has a legit beef. ”
Marvin’s field goal percentage is lower than Josh’s despite the fact that Marvin is also usually wide open for his jumpers, never has to create his own shot, and has never faced a double team in his entire career.
On a team with championship caliber talent, Josh should be the 3rd or 4th option on offense. He’s forced to be the #1 option on this team because Joe is declining and Teague hasn’t yet learned how to finish at the rim consistently.
On a team with championship caliber talent, Marvin should be coming off the bench.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 20th, 2012
9:20 pm
Where is this Broussard ish coming from?
Lol Rod killing it.
Duck doesn’t get shots, but he also cannot finish at the rim period.
Gerald
February 20th, 2012
9:21 pm
It seems like Josh is never going to figure out that he shouldn’t be out there trying to be a scorer. He’s not a scorer. He should leave the scoring to other players, and just try to get his points by running the floor, slashing to to the hoop, and finishing strong at the rim. If Josh really wants to increase his scoring, he should also work on scoring in the post against smaller players. Until he gets a real coach, I don’t think he’ll ever realize this. Josh desperately needs a coach who can designate a role for him.
Also, L.D. needs to go easy on Josh with the minutes. He’s the only versatile big man we have left on the team with Horford injured, and if L.D. keeps riding him for full games, he’s going to be exhausted by the time the playoffs roll around, which will result in even more jump shots from him.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 20th, 2012
9:21 pm
He should be thankful these idiots are paying him 7m+ a year to do the bare minimum
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 20th, 2012
9:23 pm
Package Duck and Kirk for the best possible SF or big
Big Lou
February 20th, 2012
9:25 pm
Anybody else wondering why this team hasn’t fixed the FT shots? It has cost the Hawks a couple games this year and could have helped this game, as well. Does LD even coach? Bueler? Bueler?
Astro Joe
February 20th, 2012
9:25 pm
Joe didn’t play in the 4th quarter due to a bad knee. It would seem unlikely that the knee wasn’t bothering him in any game previous to this one. But $20M annual is supposed to guarantee that dude is never baned up… just ask TMac in the last few seasons with Houston. Actually, don’t ask TMac about that. My bad.
Pargo looked great tonight in the Wille Green role. Overall bad PG play… 4 assists in 23 FGAs. Every man for themselves.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 20th, 2012
9:26 pm
I see the TrueHoop ish now.
Kirk return is partly to blame. Another reason is our schedule sucks and we hardly beat good teams. Another is our coaches and front office are inept and incompetent
Wink
February 20th, 2012
9:26 pm
Get ready for Linsanity! I really like what this guy is doing. The reason I bring this up is because the guy is taking advantage of his opportunity to play. He has a coach that believes in him, keeping in mind he was the 15th man on the bench. They have been waiting on Byron Davis to get healthy.
What’s great about it is the guy plays with Melo,Amare,Chandler and he was buried behind Chauncey, Douglas, Shumpert, & Davis. Since he has taken over at the point, he has scored the most points in February than any player in the NBA. He dropped 38 on the Lakers & Kobe had 28. He quickly gained a mindset of Elite NBA player, while playing with all these Elite players. Even with the major tunrovers they are winning and he is a major factor. His coach believes he can run the offense, like his former point guard, Steve Nash…you got to love the way the guy as stepped into his opportunity…NY is abuzz!
Now we as Atlanta fans want the same buzz, but Joe Johnson refuses to develope the mindset to lead his team and he is a 6 time All Star.
Teague has a commercial on TV talking about he is the Future, but he does not have the confidence to challenge Josh on the shot selections or take Drew’s criticism without it affecting his game…unlike Lin, he does not have the trust of his coach; Teague’s turnover ratio is 10 times better. Teague has a higher impact on games than JJ when he is being aggressive.
We had our version of Linsanity, with Ivan Johnson, but Drew put an end to that high end production with DNP’s and reduced minutes. Now he is messing with Ivan’s aggressiveness.
So I am enjoying the Linsanity, and hopeful Drew sees first hand what happens win you Coach a player up, build their confidence, and allow a player to aspire to be great, and yet humble like Lin.
By the way, if JJ does not play in New York, look for him to skip the All Star game, and Josh will be named as his replacement.
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
9:27 pm
Marvin, Kirk, and next year’s 1st rounder for Paul Pierce. Or
Al Horford,
Jeff Teague,
and Kirk H.
for
Paul Pierce
Rajon Rondo
Big Lou
February 20th, 2012
9:28 pm
I hope this team keeps losing and doesn’t make the playoffs–or gets blow out in it. It would get LD fired, and hopefully TMac will stay and get more minutes. This coach is truly a detriment to this team. This guy is Woody 2.0. Well, at least Woody didn’t allow Josh to shoot jumpers like an idiot.
Astro Joe
February 20th, 2012
9:29 pm
4 assists AND 23 FGAs (between Teague, Pargo & Hinrich). But maybe in this offense, the PG isn’t expected to do anything but take shots. Too bad no one told the captain who expects to see ball movement.
Big Lou
February 20th, 2012
9:30 pm
The only hope the Hawks have against the Knicks is that Carmelo tries to steal Lin’s shine and chucks up 50 shots.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 20th, 2012
9:32 pm
The Knicks are losing big to the Nets at home, right before they play the Hawks.
The Bulls lost big to the Nets at home, right before they played the Hawks.
Portland lost 4 in a row at home, right before they played the Hawks.
The Hawks keep catching these teams bouncing back from bad losses and are not stepping up to the challenge.
Astro Joe
February 20th, 2012
9:32 pm
Anyone think that Joe’s knee was feeling 100% right up until the 4th quarter of this game? Really?
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
9:32 pm
Rondo – Joe – Pierce – Josh – Zaza , is almost as good of a starting lineup as the line up of Boston that won the title (remember Rondo is way better now than he was then). Joe is better than Ray. And Josh is the closest player to KG on the defensive end in the league. And Zaza is just as good as Perkins to me.
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
9:34 pm
AJ, you mean the captain who lead the team in assists for the 3rd game out of the last 4? lol
Tyreke
February 20th, 2012
9:36 pm
LOL. Josh is not “forced” to be the number one option on offense at all. He simply wants to take a lot of shots. He’s always been this way. There are tons of occurrences where Josh has the ball and there is plenty of time left on the clock for him to pass to someone else and he instead decides to launch a long , low-percentage shot. He likes to try and be a “hero”. It’s obvious. Josh thinks that he’s a great player, you can see it in his comments that he has a false sense of entitlement. Look at his comments each time he doesn’t make the all-star team. He acts like he is better than everyone who is selected over him and like he can’t possibly play better than as great as he thinks he’s playing. Josh leading the team in field goal attempts is not due to Joe declining, it’s due to the fact that he wants to shoot the ball and thinks that he’s the best option to score most of the time. Look at how he yells at Teague when he doesn’t get the ball during the games.
By the way, you’ve heard Josh acknowledge his errors or mistakes and say he wants to get better? Think about it. That should tell you something. He thinks he can do no wrong and that he’s some sort of hall-of-fame caliber player.
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
9:37 pm
The Knicks should offer Melo and Tyson to the Magics for Dwight.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 20th, 2012
9:38 pm
Big Lou,
LD and Sund are up after the season. If DASKG resigns these guys I may be done with this team
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
9:39 pm
Tyreke, Josh is the best all around player on this team. And the 2nd best all around player in this division, only to Lebron. And Josh is the only player who hasn’t reached their peak on the team (besides Teague).
Tyreke
February 20th, 2012
9:39 pm
Correction: *HAVE* you heard Josh acknowledge his errors or mistakes and say he wants to get better by correcting those mistakes? Ever?
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 20th, 2012
9:42 pm
Paul Pierce is not going to be traded ever for Al F’ing Horford.
Pierce is one of the GOAT Celtics and probably looks down on ATL anyway
Astro Joe
February 20th, 2012
9:42 pm
Ra’mon, and thank goodness that he (and Joe) are able to set up their teammates. I have no problem running the half-court offense through Josh (like Wooody did in the latter part of his last season here). But a few weeks ago, he was complaining about ball movement, right?
Tyreke
February 20th, 2012
9:44 pm
“Tyreke, Josh is the best all around player on this team. And the 2nd best all around player in this division, only to Lebron. And Josh is the only player who hasn’t reached their peak on the team (besides Teague).”
LMAO 2nd best in the division? Are you kidding me? Wow. I’m just going to end this debate right here. No point in arguing with someone who is so blinded by a personal love of a player that they can’t see the facts. I hope you realize that D-Wade and Dwight Howard are in the same division as the Hawks. Just the fact that you made that comment about Josh being the 2nd best all-around player in the division has caused you to lose all credibility in my book. But hey, we’re all entitled to our opinions. Clearly, you and I don’t share the same opinions on Josh.
Grandmaster JeJe (GM)
February 20th, 2012
9:45 pm
Sund has made TWO trades in 3 years and NONE INVOLVED A PLAYER IN OUR TRUE CORE
Ra'mon
February 20th, 2012
9:46 pm
17 points -11 rebounds – 6 assists- 2.5 blocks -2 steals . Those are Josh’s averages over the last 5 games. And the second best player on the team during that stretch has been who? Zaza? Willie Green? Joe is averaging 12 pts, 3 assists, and 1 reb. And I don’t even believe its Joe fault. I blame ASG and Sund for not getting the guys more help that doesn’t cost vet minimum. The Hawks are the only team in the Eastern conference playoff picture who hasn’t acquired a new STARTING caliber player at any positions in 5 seasons.