Atlanta Hawks: They should shoot more 3s

Somewhere over New Mexico–The Hawks have slipped to 10th in offensive efficiency. I think the most realistic way for them to improve the offense is to attempt more 3-pointers.

The Hawks rank second in 3-point percentage (39.1). They rank 18th in 3-point rate (3-pointers attempted/field goals attempted) and are tied for fourth in the percentage of those 3s that are assisted (91.4).

The Hawks rank 19th in field-goal percentage on attempts from 16 to 23 feet (36.3), 3rd in attempts per game from that distance and 16th in the percentage of long 2s that are assisted. The Hawks rank 22nd in field-goal percentage at the rim (61.5), 13th in attempts per game from that distance, 10th in the percentage of baskets at the rim that are assisted and 13th in free-throw rate.

The Hawks have five players who are shooting better than the league average (34.6 percent) on 3s: Jeff Teague (45.3 percent), Marvin Williams (44.8), Willie Green (42.9), Vladimir Radmanovic (39.7), and Joe Johnson (36.9).

Three of those players are shooting well above their career norms on 3-pointers: Teague (career 36.8 percent), Williams(32.7), and Green (32.8). For two of those players there is a possible explanation for their sudden spike in percentage: Teague worked on his stroke all last summer (plus he’s still only , and Williams’ overall game is better since he had back surgery.

So Teague, Marvin, Green, Vlad Rad and Joe should all put up more 3s. Kirk Hinrich should join them. He’s shooting just 31.8 percent on 3-pointers but that’s with only 22 attempts; his career mark is 38 percent.

Considering both their personnel and their proclivities, it seems to me the easiest simplest way for the Hawks to improve their offensive efficiency is for the right guys to shoot more 3s (especially if they shoot more 3s instead of long 2s). I doubt any of my blog people this group has it in them to score more at the basket, earn more free-throw attempts, collect more offensive rebounds or do anything else that could lead to better offense.

But shooting more 3s? The can do that because they are pretty good at creating open attempts and they have several guys who can make them.

Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat

183 comments Add your comment

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
2:52 pm

1st? Been awhile!

Najeh Davenpoop

February 14th, 2012
2:52 pm

Don’t know about most realistic, but the best way for them to improve offensive efficiency is to get to the line more often. That would involve more post ups, more Teague dribble penetration, more movement off the ball, and less Joe dribbling around on the perimeter.

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
2:52 pm

2nd? Nice………..

Lacsho

February 14th, 2012
2:53 pm

I hope Josh doesn’t read this!!!!!

Najeh Davenpoop

February 14th, 2012
2:55 pm

Threes are fine as long as they are a result of good ball movement and taken in rhythm. The problem with relying on them, just like the problem with relying on long 2 point jumpers, is that if you miss, you’re less likely to get the rebound than if you are taking attempts at the rim.

Melvin

February 14th, 2012
2:55 pm

I would really like the see the Hawks go after JR Smith. Hawks need another score and JR can score from any spot on the floor. He attacks the rim and shoot it from 3. We could put Marvin on the bench, Joe at the 3 and JR at the 2. Hawks have their full MLE they could offer him which is more money than the Clippers or Knicks could offer. Either the Hawks sign him so he could help this team or watch him hurt the Hawks b/c it’s reported that the Magic are looking at him…

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
2:55 pm

pointguardslim- from previous blog!!!!!!!!!!!!

February 14th, 2012
2:36 pm

“Why isn’t Leuer getting more playing time on a bad team? Thats a less snide question and a better one.

He isn’t getting playing time because he’s a bit stiff on defense and a perimeter player on offense.

Ilyasova is a bad shooter and a quicker rebounder and Mbah a Moute is lauded as a stellar defender. Thats what Skiles likes.

But why should that matter. You do realize Marvin Williams is so bad for this teams matchups (teams can just switch length onto our stars AND we are undersized on defense) that at one point
Jason Collins took his spot as a starter last year.

We are a team with an unconventional tweener in Josh so you need to counter that.
You said we need someone to post up and throw ball in and maybe get fouled. I said add a stretch POWER player in Jon Leuer.

Joe Johnson 6′8 sg
Josh Smith 6′8 sf
Jon Leuer 7′0 pf (take Gasol away from basket so Joe+Josh can go to work)

Lets say TShooting% and the eye test are right and Leuer would be a 7′0 Ryan Anderson.
Even if he doesnt post up Gasol, I count 2 other options in posting up Joe Johnson vs SGs smaller than him and posting up Josh Smith against SFs his size or smaller SGs.

Thats 2 post up threats and Leuer is automatic if a switch happens. Look at the plays Marvin gets and cant make…rebounding, too short and passes up corner shots, cant get a clean look off the dribble.

Its dumb to ask why Leuer isnt playing in MIL when we have stars in our system that can milk a Ryan Anderson/Leuer type. AND even Worse is that after Miami its hella obvious WE COULD USE THE SIZE AND THE FUNDAMENTALS SHOOTING.

And Marvin isnt that. And never will be. Rather have Josh Smith vs Artest than Smith throwing hook shots over Gasol. Rather have Joe Johnson bullying Kobe in the post than wrestling with Artest.
Meanwhile Kobe will be busting Joe’s rear on the other end and resting on Marvin.
Its a domino effect. Horrible fundamentals and size disadvantage. I predict a loss and Hawks will be Lambs to the slaughter tonight.”

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
2:56 pm

I’m buying pt.guard slim! Marvin has been a huge disappointment…He came to Atlanta with all this hype from Billy “GTFO” Knight!

His inability to step up and be consistent against the winners is killing this teams chances to excel in the post season..Heck within the next 4 weeks they maybe hovering around the .500 mark for real?

Got to shake this house of cards up…

Joe and Josh need help yesterday, especially on the offensive end. New young blood maybe just what the doctor ordered!

Thanks for your dissertation! It was impeccable as always Sir..Welcome back!

Melvin

February 14th, 2012
2:57 pm

This team shoot too many jumpshots already. Attack the rim please…

MattP

February 14th, 2012
2:57 pm

I think they are already shooting alot around the arc, not all are 3 point attempts. The problem is that they need to have the right guys should at the arc, not Smith. They also need more players attack the rim.

Najeh Davenpoop

February 14th, 2012
2:57 pm

For what it’s worth, basketball-reference.com’s SRS rating thinks the Hawks are better than the Lakers. Until the loss to the Heat on Sunday, Hollinger’s power rankings agreed.

That said I would put the spread for this game at about 25. The Lakers are the biggest matchup nightmare for the Hawks out of any team in the league, in my opinion. If they just post up Gasol and Bynum the entire game they will shoot about 60%, not to mention as long as those two are playing they will out-rebound the Hawks by at least 20.

Melvin

February 14th, 2012
2:59 pm

MC,

Did you mention awhile back that the Hawks would be interested in JR Smith once he availble to be siged? If so, do you know if they are trying to recruit him now?

MattP

February 14th, 2012
2:59 pm

^Right guys shot at the arc

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
2:59 pm

The Hawks actually have a better record then the Lakers at this point in time..Like that really means anything?

I sense another spanking coming late tonight….Sucks to be a Hawks fan….

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
3:03 pm

Eyeball test from a jumpshooter: Marvin takes an additional 1.5-2 sec to size up the rim/ distance to get his shoot off.. Way too slow…He’s almost afraid to miss the shot so he looks scared out there taking them…

cdog

February 14th, 2012
3:03 pm

jeff teague and za za pachulia is killing the hawks. both are losers. i would like to apologize to kirk hinrich.he and jannero pargo should be the two point guard rotations. teague does stupid things on the court.your point should be a coach on the floor to make others better.teague doesn’t have these qualities.pachulia is lazy and can’t play on either end.balls comes by his head and face but he is too lazy to get his hands up to rebound or too slow of foot.he doesn’t move his feet on defense.i have never heard of guarding with elbows and stationery feet. he’s terrible.finally, if josh smith could think he would be on the allstar team.he’s only effective when he’s inside.i would have a rule not to put the ball in his hands unless he is inside.please coach drew, put teague and pachulia on the bench and start playing pargo if you want to go far in the playoffs.

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
3:05 pm

At the college- Pro level you cant hesitate or usually miss the best opportunity to let it rip

jgsbirds

February 14th, 2012
3:07 pm

if i still bet on games–i would bet the ranch on the lakers tonight.

so that probably means the hawks play well.

Michael Cunningham

February 14th, 2012
3:09 pm

@Melvin: “MC, Did you mention awhile back that the Hawks would be interested in JR Smith once he availble to be siged? If so, do you know if they are trying to recruit him now?”

That was before Al’s injury. Since they have so many guards now and it’s past the contract guarantee date, I don’t know if they would still be interested in J.R.”

“This team shoot too many jumpshots already. Attack the rim please…” sounds great. but which do you think is more within the capabilities of this team: attacking the rim, or shooting more 3s?

@MattP: “I think they are already shooting alot around the arc, not all are 3 point attempts.” yeah, that’s the point. more 3s at the percentage they are making them is better than long 2s at the rate they are making them.

MattP

February 14th, 2012
3:12 pm

cdog,

Teague is better than Hinrich right now at point because Hinrich can’t guard fast PG, they blow right past him. Teague doesn’t setup his teammates but he is alot better then Hinrich that can only shoot.at times. Last season we had a bad record when we traded for Hinrich and now this season when Hinrich came back we are starting to look bad. Can you do the math?

Who do you think Drew can give Zaza’s minutes too? We have no one that can play his minutes! Ivan is good at times but has a big size problem.

steve brown

February 14th, 2012
3:13 pm

Watching Hawk players step out of the way as Heat players drove to the hoop was one of the most pathetic things I have ever seen on a basketball court at any level anytime. To talk about anything but their lack of guts, courage and heart is a waste of space. Get me a group of athletes with some pride and respect for the game, nothing else really matters.

Rod from College Park

February 14th, 2012
3:17 pm

Melvin,

You know I agree. This is the Hawks, so what makes common sense won’t happen. This is the thing. If we can’t get a big who is proven, our only other option is to play a perimeter game. Marvin is the worse 3 in the league, so we need to upgrade his position. We really need another guy on the perimeter who can create their own shot, get to the line, and knock down the open shot. JR Smith can do all those things.

Melvin

February 14th, 2012
3:19 pm

MC,

Thanks. I knew that Stackhouse signing was going to come back and haunt us. But seriously, they have a lot of guards but none with the ability of JR. JR is solid starter. They should sign him and waive Stack. And then try to trade Kirk and Marvin..

MattP

February 14th, 2012
3:21 pm

This game is going to be very scary, Bynum and Gosal are going to get just about everything they want down low. Just hope Zaza shows up and Drew plays Dampier more then Ivan this game.

honest_abe

February 14th, 2012
3:21 pm

attacking the rim is a mind set. an attitude. i’ve seen teams that can’t shoot a lick but they made up their mind that they’re going to take it to the rack strong. the hawks are a clumsy finesse team. whenever another team goes on a run nobody can step up draw a foul and get to the line. not even our 100 million dollar man. if the hawks are to improve their efficiency on the offensive end they need an attitude adjustment. it’d also help if teague could run the team like a point instead of always being so damn passive.

Sautee

February 14th, 2012
3:23 pm

ED will need to play a lot of minutes for us to stay with them on the glass. I hope he’s up to it.

Melvin

February 14th, 2012
3:27 pm

Rod,

Agreed with your 3:17 post…

STRETCH

February 14th, 2012
3:28 pm

Melvin,

Even if they did try, he would obviously follow K-Mart to the Clippers. And not may guys want to go to a disfunctional organization like the Hawks.

pointguardslim

February 14th, 2012
3:29 pm

How is Josh Smith supposed to get shot attempts vs 7′1 Gasol? I want to post videos of the hook shots that Smith was taking over Bosh and missing.
Too small and easy contests. I want to post the uncontested layups that made Josh look too small and unathletic. He didnt even jump bcuz there was only chance for a foul.

Steve Smith is the only guy that consistently gives Smith credit and calls him a small forward playing out of position.

Josh Smith should be inside. Blah BLah Blah BLah.

6′8 225 Josh Smith vs 7′1 265 Gasol
or
6′8 225 lb Josh Smith vs 6′7265 Artest

Either way he’s giving up 40 lbs. But at least he isn’t giving up a foot of wingspan and height to a future Hall of Famer.

What a waste of talent.

Slimjr…Its not even Marvin hesitating. He’s too slow to be an elite SF and get those shots off.

We have to go to Josh at SF. He could be a Hall of Fame garbageman type scorer but we as ATL fans need to give up the search for a jump shooting SF.

McGrady played SF with Josh and we were bad on defense. We need Smith at the SF. Remember that block on Dwight Howard? That came from behind at SF. Jason Richardson block to send us into the 2nd round?

Small forward.

We need to get over ourselves and realize that Josh Smith is a SMALL forward. He has little to no power in his frame anymore.

If you want to see some power, get some more size to box out and rebound. And let him run in the backcourt with Jeff and Joe and get in transition.

No more botched Marvin layups. Outside of weight, Marvin has the proportions of pf/center Ike Diogu. He’s never going to be a swift shooter. And he’s not strong or tall enough to play inside.

#1 move to improve the Hawks is move Smith to the 3 and get a stretch 4. Until then enjoy watching Smith try to beat the odds.

The last SMALL Forward Smith’s size who won a championship was Dennis Rodman. And he had Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen on his team.

Let Josh Smith be our Iguodala and make a trade to move him to SF.

Attacking the rim is a mind set. But getting there is another thing.

Smith – too small and even Spencer Hawes can cut off drive.
Marvin – too slow and big man handles. Not concise smooth dribbler.
Johnson- lol. He tries boy he tries. Iso!

pointguardslim (7'0Leuer/6'10 Ry Anderson not 6'8 Marvin)

February 14th, 2012
3:39 pm

Josh Smith might not back down Artest but he’d get a few transition dunks. A few crossovers.

Josh Smith is not getting to the rim vs a big body like Gasol. People dont realize the thing about basketball is….
You can’t JUMP OVER a defender that size. You have to go AROUND them at an ANGLE.

Somebody please tell me how Josh Smith is going to get an angle on Gasol in isolation? LD Better have some crazy offensive sets because Bosh’s length shut Smith down inside.

Bricked hook shot after Bricked hook shot. People told Smith to get inside (against bigger players) but then are mum when he listens to them.

Playing inside vs 7 footers is playing to a strength? I dont see how Smith is getting inside vs Pau Gasol.
Halfcourt inside game was nonexistent for Smith last game and he kept trying. For the Hawks fans who told him to.
Yet his shots were altered and we got routed.

This game should wake up some of the bloggers here.
Bottomline:
Smith is a small forward and needs a STRETCH Power forward if we are to win with him. The PF and C hold position on post defense and when the big man trys to shoot the ball Smith’s help defense at the wing enables him to blindside blocks guys from behind and smaller players on the wing get surprised. Wings like to drive to the basket for easy points. Smith prevents that.

Looking at Smith’s #s he could be a hall of famer on the defensive end but we are wasting his mismatch potential by pairing him with Marvin.

Ra'mon

February 14th, 2012
3:44 pm

The Hawks will win by 9 tonight. Why? Because this is what the Hawks do. They bounce back from losses like that.

Sautee

February 14th, 2012
3:49 pm

“The last SMALL Forward Smith’s size who won a championship was Dennis Rodman. And he had Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen on his team.”

WTF? Shawn Marion, last year? 6′7″, 220

Did you mean Power Forward?

jay

February 14th, 2012
3:52 pm

MC I would pull out my hair if they continue with this jump shooting mess. It’s all good when they are hitting them, but this team can go cold quicker than you can snap your fingers. Then next thing you know they are down by 20. It’d be different if they had a rebounder other than Josh, but they don’t.

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
3:55 pm

pt guard slim is on top of his game!

Just awesome stuff!

Must be a coach or have been one.. His attention to details is second to none!

O'Brien

February 14th, 2012
3:59 pm

Melvin,

I would like to see JR on this team too. But let’s be real. He is not going to accept a pro-rated vet min contract from the Hawks (which the Hawks won’t even offer, because they will not go over the LT).

Players of his ability want (and deserve more $), which the Hawks can’t afford.

And the Clippers are interested in him. JR played with Chauncey and K-Mart in Denver, and has played with CP3 in N.O. Plus with Chauncey out for the year, JR will get major minutes. I think thats where he goes.

Sautee

February 14th, 2012
4:01 pm

O’B,

And if WE had CP3, then we’d have players like that wanting to come here.

Freakin’ Billy Knight. Crap.

O'Brien

February 14th, 2012
4:04 pm

Drafting Marvin over CP3 and Deron AND giving Marvin the contract they did has really limited this team’s options (imo).

As for shooting more 3’s, I agree with turning the long 2’s into 3’s. But if the 3’s are not falling, I dont trust the players to stop shooting them, and go to the rim.

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
4:05 pm

Pt guard slim, using angles, quickness and a deadly j will neutral size every day of the week on the offensive end.. Wish I could show Josh how to do it..I’m left handed like him.

pointguardslim

February 14th, 2012
4:06 pm

The Hawks will win by 9 tonight. Why? Because this is what the Hawks do. They bounce back from losses like that.
—-
Only when the matchups benefit them. Don’t be fooled.

I’m expecting Josh Smith to handle the ball a lot in transition because thats one of his only advantages vs Gasol.
But he cant do that all night. Kobe says games are won in the post. Remember the post up slam on Turkoglu/Anderson.

Josh did not do that to a tall PF/C in Bosh and not to Hawes/Vucevic and not to Elton Brand.
We’ll see what he does against Gasol.
We’ll see what Joe does vs Barnes/Artest.
We’ll see what Marvin does vs Bryant. If he can post up and shoot over him quickly and consistently

McGrady will probably need to step up. Who knows surprise me Hawks.

But long term Smith + Joe need A tall stretch Power player.
—————–

@Sautee
I mistyped. That made little sense how I mistyped it.
“The last SMALL Forward Smith’s size who won a championship at POWER forward was Dennis Rodman.”

Yes its good to bring up Shawn Marion because he’s a limited range “garbageman” scorer and he lost in smallball (Phoenix) and only one when paired with a tall stretch forward in Dirk Nowitzki.

Not saying Leuer is anywhere near Dirk. But neither is Ryan Anderson and look at his Win Shared numbers and Kevin Love’s #s.

We have Josh+Joe to get you open and its just as good as having Dwight to suck in defense and get you open.

Ryan Anderson with Dwight sucking in defense generates wins.
59.4% TS%
4.3% TOV% (he just shoots the 3 or posts up a switch if its there or passes it. everytime)
13% TRB (average)
127 offensive rating, 103 defensive rating (Dwight byproduct)

25.2% Win Shares Per Minute %

Chris Paul is at 27%.

A big man who shoots and does not turn the ball over and rebounds fairly well. Can be just as good as a superstar.

We have our stars in Josh and Joe. We need Leuer to be our Ryan Anderson. And I think Hinrich for Gooden+Leuer would get it done. Marvin to the bench.

anphill2

February 14th, 2012
4:08 pm

More 3’s? With no post game you want us to shoot more 3’s? Cosign najeh…dribble penetration/foul line oppurtunities, are what we need come playoff time. Smith should be able to score against Pau on the block. If he can’t, he would simply be a better version of josh childress, as nothing more than a cleanup guy. If u want to change your offense to better-suit the needs of childress, Brian grants, Ron artests of the world, let me know how that works. Would like to see more of JJ and Duck in the post.

pointguardslim

February 14th, 2012
4:08 pm

Pt guard slim, using angles, quickness and a deadly j will neutral size every day of the week on the offensive end.. Wish I could show Josh how to do it..I’m left handed like him.
—-

How do u use bold on here. Thats the problem with our version of small ball. Josh does not have a “deadly J”!

Put a PF defending on Joe Johnson does he get inside? Nope. Uses his deadly jumper.

Najeh Davenpoop

February 14th, 2012
4:09 pm

I have no problem with Kirk for Gooden and Leuer, but with Bogut out for the season and Milwaukee still very much alive for the 8 seed I have a hard time seeing them part with Gooden for a point guard when Jennings is their best player.

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
4:09 pm

Lakers by 30!

Trojan

February 14th, 2012
4:13 pm

It is sad when the Clippers have a more committed to winning management team than the Hawks.

anphill2

February 14th, 2012
4:15 pm

We have the highest percentage stretch 4 in the league coming back for playoffs. Close your eyes, say potential 3 times and envision Darko Milicic. Good, now we can stop the Leuer conversations.

Slimjr

February 14th, 2012
4:16 pm

Iso might as well callin sick..Matt always locks him down…..Game,set, and match!

Najeh Davenpoop

February 14th, 2012
4:17 pm

Melvin

February 14th, 2012
4:23 pm

OB,

I’m 100% sure but I think the Hawks are already over the luxury cap.

As for JR, it’s being reported that he wants more than the vet min and bi-annual exception along playing time in a starter role is important to him. The Hawks still have their full MLE so they could out bid the Clippers and Knicks who only have bi-annual. ASG has stated they are willing to pay the luxury for the right player, well let’s see them sign JR.

Sautee

February 14th, 2012
4:24 pm

Pointguardslim,

If Leuer is such a “stretch 4″, then why has he only attempted FIVE 3 point shots out of 122 total attempts?

And with that small of a sample, why are you convinced he will thrive?

And if the 3 is a strength of his, why isn’t Skiles using him that way?

pointguardslim

February 14th, 2012
4:26 pm

WOW? Milwaukee is still in the hunt for the 8th… give it a month.

“Clippers have a more committed to winning management team than the Hawks.”

from 2009: “Dunleavy believes that Griffin has the tools to play anywhere from center to small forward for the club.

During his workout with the Clippers on Saturday, Griffin showed off his ball-handling skills by drilling two and three basketballs at the same time — “something you probably don’t see too often from a 6-10 guy,” Dunleavy said.”

Josh Smith 6′8 225
Blake Griffin 6′10 250

Something wrong with that picture in my opinion. Josh drops near triple doubles and monster on the wing.

SI Scout -”An opposing team’s scout sizes up the Hawks”
“For them ever to be a championship team — not just a playoff team ———-You shift Josh Smith to small forward and bring Marvin Williams off the bench. But until they go in that direction, they’ll be the best 6-foot-8 team in the league with too many forwards on the roster.”

October 22, 2008

But Sund re-signed Marvin Williams. Rereading Mark Bradley interview with him…What a joke.