Atlanta Hawks: Hawks waive Sy, Wanamaker, Rolle (Update: Benson also released)

Ken I’m sorry you’re being irrational and/or delusional.

Are you really saying our Hawks outside of Horford are anywhere remotely CLOSE to as bad as Bogut’s current or past supporting casts?

After Horford: Joe JOhnson, Josh Smith, Marvin Williams, Jeff Teague, Hinrich, Bibby,
After Bogut: ???

No comparison really.

Hawks give Horford + picks for a linuep of Bogut + Leuer + Smith + Joe + Jeff and an eye on playoffs with no hesitation.

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It looks like another wasted pick by Hawks on Sy, oh well time to move on, but I wonder who is the next two to be cut? Any takers

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KEEP IVAN JOHNSON!!!!!

IF HE GETS CUT WE ARE GONNA RIOT

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@Smith.Leuer.Bogut

Dude, stop it. What is so special about those two (Bogut and Leuer) that you keep making post about that (Where u the one was talking about that trade with Houston a long time ago)

If Al is going to get moved, it is going to be for a star like D12 and nothing else. Besides we got Sund and he isnt going ove the Luxury Tax period.

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Hey Pape Sy for 200.00 hr I can teach you how to shoot a jumpshot. You wanna stick, your going to need my jumpshot! lol

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MC, you closed that last thread down just in time. SOMEONE is off THEIR meds and is close to shutting down the blog again like last year. (Yes I purposely mixed the singular and the plural to represent the multiple personalities).

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Without the iso trade this team does not make the playoffs the last four years..

These bigs we have have been along for the ride including All NBA……real talk..I’m just saying..

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I agree with Truth, Tmac looked really worthless out there.

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Shut it down.. Same script……Yawn…..

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A concentrated season would seem to make carrying the minimum # of players penny-wise and productivity-foolish… our guys are going to hit a wall if Drew is forced to play our guys substantial minutes.

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Keep Johnson, Benson and Stack……….when Hinrich returns, cut another. Simple

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I have to agreed about what Ken says and besides the only person right now I would trade Al Horford for is Dwight Howard (with Lopez hurting his foot, Magic have to look for other trading partners) and that is it.

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mike would you make this trade for Al?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p51gvnVSFKc

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Amnesty Marvin Williams, or is it too late? Mickael Pietrus would be the ideal back-up 2 and 3.
Trade Zsa Zsa and Al Horford ASAP.

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I wouldn’t trade Horford for Jordan. He’s too one dimensional.

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Amnesty Marvin would solve the problem here but that is what they are saving for Johnson. Funny how they give him the massive contract then like a year later they are saving the amnesty for him.

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Co-sign Ra’mon on the Gasol but Id trade him for DeAndre too.

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They may as well cut Sloan too. Nothing special to him.

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Here’s our depth chart

PG – Teague, Pargo, Sloan
SG – Johnson, Green, Hinrich (IR)
SF – Marvin, Tmac, I Johnson
PF – Smith, VladRad
C – Horford, ZaZa, Collins, Benson

I see Stack and Sloan departing. Sloan most likely after Hinrich returns. Stack should be a coach.

I can see why Sy was cut. He’s definitely a raw energy guy we honestly could’ve used, but right now we need honed point guard skills and “shotmakers”! We can afford to hold onto Benson so our draft scouts don’t look anymore stupid than usual…or do they?

Still not sold on Pargo, Green or Sloan myself. I know we’re cheap, but aren’t there any FA guards who’d take the minimum who actually contributed last year on their team?

Ivan may be THE GREAT or THE TERRIBLE, just depends on whether a chance in the NBA and the salary can convince him to settle down and become a tremendous role player. The opportunity is there, maybe it won’t end with us or him giving each other the finger?

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Mike, P. Gasol averages 19 and 10 with 1.6 blocks per game. AND he shoots 5 free throws a game. The Hawks would be better on defense and offense with Gasol. Also, Gasol is only 31 years. And he played in all 82 games last season, so he’s healthy. 4-5 more seasons of 18-10 is quite possible, because he won’t get shorter, and he relies on skills more than athleticism.

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Scratching my head why they kept trying to make Pape Sy a point guard. Still more puzzling is that they are again making this team 2 and 3 heavy in a bad sort of way (not really players who elevate either unit)… They continue to show an aversion to working with the D-League option to actually develop players… I told folks that the new CBA was going to punish poor decision makers… Here’s living proof…

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Mark Gasol would’ve been a nice addition to solve our center woes.

Josh Smith isn’t such a liability at SF if he stays in the post. It’s obvious we don’t have a PF or C who lives in the post so Smith can get inside and exploit mismatches with his physical gifts. For Josh to really thrive in the SF role we need Joe, VladRad, Hinrich, Pargo & Green to get their shots going on the perimeter.

With that said I’m dissappointed that Pargo and Green fill those niches since they’ve never proven themselves to be good shooters or even a 3 pt threat. We deserved more.

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If we cut Ivan can he drop some of his “physicality” and “mentality” on our team before he departs?

We need that fire and energy!

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Too muh worrying. Didn’t yall hear/read Gearon? He said this is the make or break year. Which means, if they don’t get it done, EVERYONE is gone.

So say goodbye to Smith, Horford, Williams, Hinrich, Drew, Sund, Zaza, basically everyone besides Teague is getting traded or amnestied after this season if they fall short. OUT THE DOOR.

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So our for sure on the team guys are:

Al Horford

Smoove

Marvin

JJ

ZaZa

Collins

Teague

VladRad

TMac

Hinrich

So, out of these 6, we’re going to keep 3, maybe more:

Green – According to Drew above, it’s sounds like he’s assumed to be in. That’s why they waived Sy.

Pargo

Stackhouse

Benson

Ivan Johnson

Sloan

I say if LD has his way, the last two will be between Pargo and Sloan at 1 spot, and Ivan Johnson at the other.

Financially, it would be possible to keep Green, Stackhouse, and 2 of the following 3: Ivan Johnson, Benson, and Sloan.

Sloan really looked ok last night. Not a bad 3 PG option at all.

I’m thinking LD wants to keep Stackhouse, just trying to figure out a way to do it.

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Josh Smith in the post? LOLOLOLOLOLOL

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“So say goodbye to Smith, Horford, Williams, Hinrich, Drew, Sund, Zaza, basically everyone besides Teague is getting traded or amnestied after this season if they fall short. OUT THE DOOR”

J. Johnson too. He will get amnestied after this season I bet, no matter how good he plays.

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Re: Al being shipped out……it will NEVER happen…he would to have to just lose his talent overnight for that to happen. We gave him a contract without him challenging the other teams. Stupid is is stupid does, just like Joe and Marvin.
The only sound signing Sund has made is allowing Josh to explore his options. He got his offer and Sund had to match. Its not Sund’s fault that LD sees him as a basket facing 3. Fine, give him some minutes there, but that is far from his strength. I will say his jumper does look better this year at this stage, so I give Josh a pass because no one came in camp in as good a shape as he. Maybe Joe, but he isn’t showing it on the court in numbers yet.

I am confident Sund will have us at the minimum of 13 players, with Sloan as the only one who might bend that rule due to the health of Teague.

Benson can go back overseas for a year, and don’t have Stack just sitting there a la Ken Norman.

Yes, we need better big men talent, but we have enough big men on the bench to get through a 48 minute game. Collins hasn’t done anything but he and Zaza should be able to handle it.

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MattP,

I would have to disagreed about JJ get amnestied next year unless they want to retool the team and have Josh or Al(if he isnt traded) as the center pieces to the new core.

MC, I have a question for you I didnt ask it when you did the interview with Gearon, when he say “Make it or Break it” year, does he means that if team doesnt past the second round this year, the core is getting changed or something else.

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KS – I wouldn’t quite say Pargo is a lock. He is on a non-guaranteed contract. And if keeping Sloan meant being able to keep Stackhouse, I could see LD doing that.

Even though LD hates rookie PG’s, and I could also see him keeping Pargo. Not that Pargo doesn’t deserve to be kept however.

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So Green is in fact fully guaranteed. So two spots left for the Fab 5 of roster invitees…maybe more is ASG rolls out the dough.

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hawks, always trying to put a round object through a square hole these hawks. so much waste. how many of us here have laughed at ld saying pape was a point guard? maybe he can join diaw in finding a role as a point sf? which is more of what he is.

myk bro, ditto on t mac another done that we pay to ride out into the sunset. funny, so many fans got in a uproar of excitement, like he could replace jc1. only thing he is good at is just replacing joe smith’s and etan thomas’ role. i dont even think he brings in winning culture vet leadership as he never won anything and always ended up injured at critical times. he is nothing more than a mini- vince carter.

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So we’re down to these 16 players

THE CORE: Johnson – Smith – Horford

THE CREW: Teague – Marvin – Hinrich – Zaza

THE VETS: McGrady – Radmanovic – Collins

THE GUNNERS: Stackhouse – Pargo – Green

THE YOUNGINS: Ivan – Sloan – Benson

The fact that Stackhouse made it past the 1st cut is a little disturbing. It means that the Hawks are seriously thinking about adding him to this team.

So who do you cut to get to 13? Or do you keep 14 or even 15 for about a month, until we know when Hinrich comes back, and make a cut then?

If I’m the Hawks, I’ll carry 15, and send Benson and Sloan to the D-League. Keep Ivan on the main roster. Cut Stackhouse. After a month, make a final decision who you want to keep on the roster for the rest of the year.

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@ SteveW . . . I wonder what Drew would think about Jordan now, if this was the team. Would he think that he couldn’t play the point? Because that’s exactly what he thought last year.

So we trade him and others for Hinrich, and now Jordan will essentially be Washington’s 6th man, playing PG/SG to replace Wall and Nick Young.

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#Hawks waive Keith Benson. Roster now at reg. season max 15.

Cunningham on Twitter just now.

BOOM.

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Hawks just waived Kieth Benson what the FU%# what are they doing .

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@ryan, It already has come back to haunt us. JC2 would be a good 6th man for us right now because he is cheap. Basically right when he was trade he shines in Washington.

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Wow! just watch Benson sign with another team and come back later on in the years and be the center we need. Benson will be a good center some day, he has everything just needs to bulk up more.

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Hire Scouts who played or play the game.. Then you can weed out the scrubs pretty quickly..

I would never drafted this bust Sy..Dude can shoot????????????????????????WTF????????

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Traded some good players for these draft picks and cut them Hawks have got to be the dumbest team ether that or a big trade coming which doubt will happen .

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Even though Sund has not made a MEANINGFUL move for this team besides maybe the Jamal trade, he must be commended for the player moves recently.

He has gotten rid of GARBAGE:

Pape Sy, Benson, Rolle

He hung onto a solid player:

Ivan Johnson

IDK why Stackhouse is still on the team though. I’d cut him and sign DAN GADZURIC. Gadzuric is a rebounder and I remember him owning us on the glass when on Milwaukee.

Cut Stackhouse, fire one of our scrub assistants, and let him be an assistant under LD

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*didn’t stick around

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To answer, jmillion from the previous blog:

To win a ring, you MUST MUST MUST MUST MUST have an a-hole – someone who gets TECHNICAL FOULS, who commits hard fouls, who talks trash, and is outspoken.

That is something we DO NOT have. The closest thing we have is Smoove and he’s a bit too soft for that.

Players I am thinking of that fit the above criteria:
James Posey, DeShawn Stevenson, Metta World Peace, Rasheed Wallace, Andrew Bynum (maybe), Kobe Bryant, Kevin Garnett, Kendrick Perkins, Jason Terry

Remember when D.Wade hit a big shot in game 2 of the Finals and started show-boating and J.Terry was about to confront him? Who on our team would do that?

That’s an example of what Ivan Johnson would do. I just hope WHEN he plays, he will not be timid and defer to established stars like Joe and Al.

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“IDK why Stackhouse is still on the team though” – Jeje

Leadership/toughness. He’ll get in the faces of some of our best players and get them to focus. Doubt he gets much run once Kirk returns.

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We have gotten rid of the TRASH (Sy, Benson, Rolle). I have said this for weeks. These guys were 3 of the worst ranked players on ESPN. It was unrealistic to expect Sy to play PG, but he is not good enough to be on a playoff roster right now.

We have a VERY SOLID bench, we FINALLY HAVE VETS ON THE ROSTER (wonder what our average age is now).

The next step in the process is: MARVIN ELEVATING HIS GAME, JOSH CUTTING BACK ON JUMPSHOTS BECAUSE TRUST ME HE WILL GO COLD, AND HORFORD ATTACKING THE DAMN HOOP INSTEAD OF JUST TAKING JUMPERS ALL DAY.

My Horford and Smoove expectations don’t seem likely, but we can only hope

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I am trying to figure out why in the H-E-L-L they want to keep Stack for? We need big bodies and you want to waive one of them. I can see why so many ppl is upset at ASG and Sund for.

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Herman Cain

December 23rd, 2011
2:56 pm

“he would to have to just lose his talent overnight for that to happen.” – KevinM

“thanks for clearing that up. Its not every day that you come across talent(12pts and 8.8career number), like that.

That’s very hard to replace.

?”

add:??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

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Keith Benson is worse than Solomon Jones (who wasn’t that bad for us). No thanks.

The TRASH is gone

Now our starters need to STEP IT UP AND OVERACHIEVE FOR ONCE

GOOD JOB SUND. EVEN THOUGH OUR POOR OWNERS CAN’T AFFORD TO GO INTO THE LT (PATHETIC SINCE THEY HAVE THE NEW RESTAURANT), YOU ARE DOING WELL

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If we suffer 1 injury to Z or Collins we are screwed up front. We really need a big. GADZURIC

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I don’t actually know how the D-League works in terms of paying player and how they are associated with the team, but it would ake a lot of sense to waive Benson and Sy to send them to the D-League for the year. Those guys weren’t going to play, which is my main problem. LD and Woody clearly have a problem with letting rookies make mistakes opposed to vets. Tracy and Stack have looked average to bad these last two games, but the organization decided that experience was more important than potential. Hopefully they are right because now they have no real athletes off the bench. What it looks like to me is a version of the old boy network, were you keep your friends around because your comfortable with them.

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STFU

December 23rd, 2011
3:03 pm

“STOP WHINING AND BUY SOME TICKETS SO WE CAN ACTUALLY GO OVER THE LUXURY TAX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”

Your an idiot!!

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Enter your comments here

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When you draft late 2nd rounders, no one is expecting them to be in the league immediately. You are expecting a team to have a team to have some framework for developing those type of players. That is especially true when you’re jettisoning quality high draft picks as the Hawks have… This team is starting to take on the smell of a cheap version of what Orlando did last year… They’ve blown up the back end of the roster (6-14) and not created any real chemistry…

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i saw 2 seconds of the hawks play, and I saw a bearded guy run someone over on the way to the hoop. loved it.

keep ivan johnson

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“LD and Woody clearly have a problem with letting rookies make mistakes opposed to vets. Tracy and Stack have looked average to bad these last two games, but the organization decided that experience was more important than potential.”

The quote that defines Mike Bibby from last year.

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I was certain that Benson considering Atlanta’s lack of size in the paint.

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Do you think with these moves maybe just maybe we could be setting up for D12 i know i could be dreaming here could be a reason for these moves ether there stupid or they have something planed .

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wow. Lmfao

Stackhouse over developing Benson. Ivan Johnson that good eh. Idiots.

“I’m far, far more interested in discussing real Hawks basketball”

50 year tradition of losing and overrating talent, Jon Contract. Trading Dominique. Keeping Marvin Williams for $8 million. wtf?

You compared Bogut and Leuer’s ability to get us to the 2nd round success to Horford’s so which is it?

And Sorry kids, if Horford cant get you Bogut and the 2011 #40 pick, then you sure as hell aren’t “renting” Dwight.

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@ Michael Cunningham…
That is why I asked you last week about the D-League direction and Reno. This team seems to be under some illusion about searching the waiver wire from this point forward for back end talent… If they ever have an injury of any magnitude, they are in for a world of hurt! 10 day contracts are fools gold.

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Thanks MC for a journalist standing up to the peanut gallery for good basketball.

Yo Yo Yo: “Ban this Smith.Leuer.Bogut clown, please.”
MC: Why?
Yo Yo Yo: “Because he doesn;t go with the flow. He says that Jeff Joe and Josh can go further with Bogut+Leuer + Marvin off the bench than just keeping Horford+Marvin.

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I look at the roster and its salaries, and the more I look at it, the more I want Joe out of here first and not Al.
He is killing the bottom line and his pay should be on scale with our other 2 captains.

I think G-Dad was the one who was adamant about moving Joe.

I wanted to blow this thing up last year, and start in 2011 with Josh and Jeff. We would be prepared to be looking at the 2012 draft class.

I like this quote about signing Pargo from hawks.com:

“Jannero also has a good relationship with Joe Johnson who he played with for one year at Arkansas and spent the offseason working out with in Miami.”

So instead of going after Ish Smith, who played with Teague at Wake Forest and who showed flashes in Houston, we are going to add a guy who relates with Joe…….and Ish is more of a PG than Pargo.

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“he didn’t say that specifically but i think that’s a fair interpretation since at this point making the East finals would be the only tangible progress. so if they don’t make it, yes, the core gets broken up according to Gearon.”

Gearon just want this ish sold!!!! And gtf outta here! He know this ish aint gonna make an ECF as presently configured…

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MC, did the ASG provide you a workstation at Philips? Because you deserve it for all the time you have spent there the last 2 weeks.

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I am thinking that too, that the Hawks is going to be sold soon. Besides to be honest, they cant make to the ECF as is, unless they make a major trade at the deadline (like that will happen). At the end, they better not have a major injury this year.

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I don’t get the reason for keeping Sloan and dumping both Benson and Rolle. Unless there is a concern about Teague’s ankle that they haven’t shared. Last year, they stocpiled disposable bigs, now they are looking to do the same at PG. Strange, strange strategy.

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smh people try so hard to be a fan of the hawks

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I thought LD was trying to figure a way to keep Stackhouse.

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@MC,

Any chance the core gets broken up by the trade deadline?

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Well, we all know there is no room on these rosters for guys who only do one thing well. Collins might be the exception here and we are locked in with all-potential Marvin.
So Sy, Rolle, Benson and the rest will have to develop outside the practice court at Philips. Why don’t we have a true NBDL team? Could it be because we aren’t in the skill developing business? I see a junior team as a benefit down the road, like the summer league is supposed to be for newcomers.

There is limits to the ASG’s abilities all the way around.

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LD and all these cats are gone at the end of the season…regardless!!!

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I just hope Al doesn’t go down. ZaZa and Collins can’t do 48 minutes per night for long. ZaZa might could go 30 for a stretch, but I don’t see Collins doing 18 mpg for many games consecutively.

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The Hawks will destroy all who oppose them at a .545 clip.

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this is the Al Harrington Hawks roster…remember that…same feel and look…

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Let’s be realistic. A team with Teague/Pargo/Sloan at the PG is at least survivable until Hinrich returns.

SG – JJ/Green/Stack is not terrible

SF – Marvin/TMac – that’s ok also.

PF – Josh/VladRad/IJohnson – the Beast, The Animal, whatever you want to call him – that’s ok depth also

C – Al/ZaZa/Collins – Not bad

This is the deepest Hawks team I remember, especially if Pargo and TMac do pretty well.

No more silly 7 and 8 man rotations, especially not with this seasons compressed schedule. I think we go a legit 13 deep, even before Hinrich gets back.

Now I hope Larry has learned how to use substitutions, That is the next real question. Most all of these guys can contribute at least a little bit.

We’ll see how Larry uses them.

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Greg – Yep, I’ve said before that the next 2 seasons are really our chance, if we have a chance.

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But these cuts is telling us, that this core is almost to a end and they are going to ride it with veterans to see if they get them over the hump and Stack can be a player-coach for this team as well.

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The successful NBA franchises run on 4g wireless; the Hawks management is using a dial up modem.
The moves to cut rather than develop younger players is a sign of a win know mentality that got the previous HC in trouble and doesn’t bode well for the incumbent. Bibby is the case in point. He saved Woodson’s job with the intial playoff experience-because the team was star struck and followed his lead for a hot minute. But Bibby became the rope that hung both the coach and the team when his age and physical conditioning were exposed.
Bottom line: the team lacks leadership and the coach has to rely once again on some former stars to get the core to play consistently and collaboratively. (Those who fail to heed history are doomed to repeat it)

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AMNESTY GEARON

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They are dangerously thin up front after cutting Benson. I do not see the point of keeping both Pargo and Green on the roster at the expense of Benson (or any other serviceable big man).

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Seriously………….this is the deepest Hawks team in quiet some time.

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Cutting Benson means Horford is basically being told he’s the center. Smoove is PF and Marvin gets handed his starting job with no competition. Core to the absolute CORE! We’re banking on being a fast breaking team which though is exciting, usually fails in the Playoffs due to the slow grinding half court sets. Essentially we’re destined for our same result….AGAIN.

On the positive side this is Marvin’s year to put up or shut up. He’s not an amnesty candidate, but this is his chance to prove himself in time to get a big contract to finish his career or 17th degree.

It all comes down to the guys returning to form and using their experience to finally put it all together. JC1 was a great assett as was Bibby at the time to give us time to grow, but in all honesty they prevented certain players from growing. Look at how Joe, Marvin and Smoove stepped back when JC1 took over the offense? Now that he’s home in the NW it’s time for guys to step up.

Maybe it’ll be a banner year for Horford and Smoove down low? That’s where they need to be. Maybe, just maybe Joe and Marvin can get their stroke honed in and give us the “shotmakers” LD needs to save himself.

Hopefully Teague will stay healthy and Kirk will return soon.

I honestly think ZaZa and Collins will benefit from significant playing time and minutes. They both sulk and get real rusty when LD has too many options and lineups to tweak.

The only silver lining is Sund is forcing us to play the roster they developed or meet the Ultimatum.

Last note…Turn Ivan Viral!

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GrandmasterJeJe,What is solid about our bench?
We have 2 Dinosaurs in T-Mac and Stack..(I do respect these guys career that they’ve had but this is not the team for them.

This is just about the same roster we had last year(for those who will get actual playing time)..

And instead of getting younger with fresh legs to run along with Teague,we’ve gotten old Fred Sanford Legs(RIP) to run..We’ve plain just got older..I see dust flying around Phillips Arena..

This is going to be a shortened but long A** season for the city,the fans,the organization,for the coaches and players too

Are u ready for some below 500 basketball yall?-!!!!!!

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Stackhouse is on the team solely for leadership purposes, since he has nothing left. I am not losing a ton of sleep over keeping him over Sy or Benson, since neither one of them is some major difference maker, but I still question how much effect a locker room leader can really have when he can’t play. Josh Powell was acquired for a similar reason last year and that didn’t work out as expected.

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Our guys probably worshiped Stack and Tmac in their prime. They have the individual accomplishments on their resume which command respect while Josh Powell just has a pube burn from rubbing up on Kobe too close. It’s not the same. I don’t like them in 2 roster spots, but there is a BIG difference between proven vets who were icons when our guys were kids and a jock sniffer.

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3 captains = no real leader, thus the need for babysitters to help LD get a professional message across to the fledgelings.

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I totally get what you’re saying Fundamentals…

My gripe isn’t with what you’re saying. It’s more with the organizational approach.

It’s frustrating. And I’m tired of these clowns.

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Wabe,

I agree, but would contend the talent is there…just no one to force them to play their strengths and role. Instead they play for stats and individual recognition. For example…Josh value’s our opinion over his jumper or lack of more than winning. He proves it every time he hoists another up!

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“GrandmasterJeJe,What is solid about our bench?
We have 2 Dinosaurs in T-Mac and Stack..(I do respect these guys career that they’ve had but this is not the team for them.”

Hinrich (when he returns)
T-Mac
Vlad
ZaZa
Pargo
W. Green

These guys aren’t THAT old. Go look at the Mavs starting lineup from last year or the Celtics roster from last year. Those guys are old as hell.

T-Mac is 32. Vlad is 31. Green is 30. The only OLD player on the team is J-Stack

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I agree JeJe, we’re deeper than we’ve ever been…but we’re honestly all just waiting for our Core to really realize and play their role for the good of the team. If we maximize our talent, we may surprise someone with what we have. Having said that I still think Tmac and Stack are wasted roster spots for real role players.

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Hawks have the oldest team in the league, fact. Saw it on NBATV last night was shocked when I saw it, then I thought about all these old guys we’ve brought in.

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B-Diddy out 4-8 weeks. LOL 8 weeks is like half the season.

Knicks = worst backcourt in NBA. Their only healthy PG is a combo guard LOLOLOL.

And how is Woody so obsessed with Bibby? The guy doesn’t even have limitations on defense. He doesn’t play defense period.

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correction:
The coaching staff knows nothing about developing a player..
The trades and drafts come from Sund,and im beginning to have really have 2nd thoughts on this joker too..

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Sautee . . . JC2 scored 39 points on the Miami Heat. Also had a triple double in a game. Hell, he went for 30 points – 5 asists – 5 boards in a preseason game for us last year.

That’s all you need to know about him. The dude is a legit talent, just a highly inconsistent scorer, similar to Jamal.

He’s a legit scorer with athleticism and playmaking skills.

Don;t act like you don’t know

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4aEC1BAFjU

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“does the team have to advance beyond the 2nd rd, or just do a better job than last yr of challenging for advancement to the Eastern Conference finals?”

Ken, first off great job responding to that d-bag Josh.Bogut.Leuer. Wish he and Truth B. Known would just leave already.

We already have been to the 2nd round 3 years in a row. We took Chicago to 6 games (we BEAT them in game 1). ECF or bust

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Ken . the problem around here is that it was NEVER the coach that was the problem. It’s the players that the organization is bringing in for the coach to choose from. If this team flames out in the 2nd round again, it won’t be Drew’s fault. The fault will have to lie on the front office . . then the players . .then the coach.

And that’s not giving Drew a pass. That’s simply seeing things for what they are. The roster is flawed ( as far as challenging for a championship ), and everybody knows it.

Our only hope is for the players to play at such a high level, that they can overcome their shortcomings.

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I believe JC2 was traded because Sund saw that Drew, like Woodson, had little interest in developing young talent, and would likely continue giving both he and Teague the same treatment Teague experienced for 2yrs from Woodson. They were also desperate to get rid of Bibby, since it had become obvious that Drew would continue starting and playing him heavy mins no matter how much of an OFF and DEF liability he was. It as shame it had to come to that.

While I agree that our problems stem from ASG incompetence, it’s mainly due to the stupid HC decisions they’ve made as much as anything else. After all, it was Woodson’s decision not to draft PGs CP3 or DWilliams, not GM BKnight’s or the ASG’s It was also Drew’s decision to continue starting and playing Bibby heavy mins, ignoring Teague, and cut draft picks Pape Sy and KBenson.

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Ken . . once again . . if Woody had that much power around here, they should’ve fired Billy Knight and made Woody the GM. That’s absolutely crazy to give a coach going into his 2nd year the power to choose which draft pick the team needed . . especially when we had 82 guys who could play SF at that time.

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“They are dangerously thin up front after cutting Benson. I do not see the point of keeping both Pargo and Green on the roster at the expense of Benson (or any other serviceable big man).” – Najeh

Hehe Vegas can’t have JC1 so he gets veteran’s minimum replacements for the inefficient scorer roll. I thought Benson played well enough to keep him on the roster as big man insurance. However, I don’t really see where we are “dangerously thin” on the front line. Here’s our depth chart:

C Al, Zaza, Collins

We have the third team all-NBA center, the best backup center in the NBA and a role player who plays better defense on Dwight Howard than just about anyone in the league.

PF Smoove, (Al in lineups with Zaza or Collins at C), Zaza also backs up PF, Vlad

Smoove, Al and Zaza will share time at PF. Smoove and Al will both make All-Star appearances this year. Zaza is possibly our best +/- player. Vlad is a competent third option.

SF Marvin, (Smoove will share time in big lineups), Ivan Johnson, T-Mac, Vlad

Marvin is healthy, looking decent in preseason, and ready to return to his pre-JC1 15ppg form. Smoove lost 30 lbs and is quicker than he has been in years. Ivan Johnson is a beast and has earned minutes ahead of sign-and-retire T-Mac.

SG Joe, Willie Green, T-Mac, Stack

THIS is the position where we are dangerously thin. I doubt T-Mac can guard any starting 2 guard in the NBA. Willie Green we will see if he has anything left in the tank. Stack is beyond done. Bogans would give us a defensive backup to Joe and probably be as productive offensively as any of these retirees.

PG

Teague, Pargo, Sloan

Also more dangerously thin here than at any front court position until we get a healthy Kirk back. If Kirk returns and is able to play, we suddenly have a very deep and talented back court. Until that happens, we’ve got nothing but marginal players backing up both Joe and Teague.

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Hawks need a veteran Big to start. Heard they may be looking at Krylie Fesenko..

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LOL . . may as well have been 82

Guys who could play SF on the 2005 – 06 Hawks

- Josh Smith
- Donta Smith
- Al Harrington
- Joe Johnson
- Josh Childress

Marvin made 6.

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The Hawks will never get over the playoff hump waiving drafft picks. Keith Benson was a defensive beast at Oakland U. He is athletic and had tremendous upside. Tyson Chandler with a better post game. Should have traded him to the Bobcats or Utah for picks. I hope the Pistons pick him up.

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The Hawks need at least 1 big man that can play.

Is Collins injuried? He has not seen a single minute in exhibition, and Howard will be out of the East by Febuary, against whom Collins earned his keep last season.

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I ain’t mad at SUND and the ASG… because he kept two guys I was very high on…in this kind of A SEASON…I will say SUND and ASG finally made some bold choices. Ivan the Terrible and Sloan…really showed a lot when it counted the most…so I can say, for once I’m in agreement with the choices that was made.

You would like to see if Benson can be added back to the team somehow…however that would be too GOOD to be true…if you are a HAWKS FAN.

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Lol Horford wanted big man help and we just waived all our scrub bigs

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Have to think there are plans in the works for 7″2″ Alexis Ajinca, Francisco Elson, or Fesenko.
Or maybe DJ Mjbenga. Outside chance with PF/C Yi Jianlian. Hawks need 2 bigs to replace
Hilton Armstrong and Etan Thomas

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Trade Horford…

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If they would committ to putting Marvin PERMANTLY on the bench, I would definitely purchase
NBA League pass!!!!

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I am suprised that Stackhouse has lasted this long. Doenst anyone remember Stackhouse last year went to the Heat for a minimum contract and was released shortly thereafter because he couldnt play anymore?. Problem are too penny-wise and pound foolish. I am not saying Benson is some stud but why not put him in the D-league for a year to get better. If the Knicks can get a second round draft pick Landry Fields to be a decent player why cant the Hawks?I know the odds of a second round pick sticking in the NBA is small but sometimes I feel the Hawks do not use all their resources as far as the scouting and developing players goes.

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Northcyde – There is probably some truth in what you said about coaching, even though Drew was horrific in the 2nd part of the season, and a 2nd round team was getting destroyed regularly by record margins.

And Woody had no idea how to change starting lineups, which is one thing LD is good at many times.

But the shame is these guys have never had another Coach the last what, 7 years, other than LD or Woody. So we can say our ceiling is such and such. But until they have played for a “real” Coach, we really don’t know.

I mean, Rick Adelman, or Casey, Jackson, or whoever may have come in and done worse, we don’t know. Or they may have shocked us and taken the team further. But any speculation is just that, speculation.

And I do think Sund has just asquiesced to Woody and LD as to thier preferences for players, under the financial constraints of the organization.

And it was Woody who wanted the ZaZa trade for Brad Miller. Sund was just trying to work with his Head Coach. Glad that one didn’t go through!

And it was LD who refused to play Teague or JC2, so Sund really had no choice when LD wanted veteran PG’s. Not Sund’s fault.

And it was Woody who lobbied for an extension for Bibby, but we all blame Sund.

And I’ve even had people on here say Sund shouldn’t listen to his Coach, but just assemble the team. But he would still be blamed, because the Coach would then blame his poor performance on the GM

And many on this blog would also.

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Woody was and is much better than Drew. aka Woody lite. In fact,he has something the other hawks dont have….. A championship ring. So say what you want. Woody is a champion!

Woody did a very good job with not very much. He played his starters because he had no bench and even his starters were a bunch of rooks. By the time he got them to the next level that sund of a … thought to up grade with Woody lite. I thought Woody had earn a right to spend 2 or 3 years at the next level, and deserving of an extension. But Sund and management felt the need to change, so hey, they made the change, as much as I like Woodson, who may get another ring now that hes on the staff with the Knicks, we moved on and I wont look back.

All that hate for Bibby, when we signed Bibby we needed exactly what he brought, courts smarts and sharp shooting. He helps us and we knew he was in the twilight years of his career, thats why we signed a 3 year deal, figuring to have found the guard of the future by that time. . Now that it over and Bibby is done, I salute him ,he did a great job and if we were back to that time and we had to do it all over again, Id say welcome Bibby. You are a 1sr class man and player.

So hate on Bibby and hate on Woody, haters. These two Guys did their jobs and should be saluted.

Time has moved on, but these guys did there job and took the franchise to the next level, which is all you can ask. Now the question is how do we get to the next level up from there rather than sliding backwards like Sund and Drew have us doing.

FIRE SUND.

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“but I do know that Woody was dead set against drafting DWill orWhy else would he say he didn’t think either would be very successful in the NBA CP3. because of their physical stature, and their lack of a consistent outside shot?”

Who let this guy out?

You dont prove fact by deduction or calling for a conclusion to be enter as fact, further you are entitled to your opinion but not your own facts.

PROVE WOODY SAID THAT CP3 OR D WILLIAM WOULD NOT MAKE IT IN THE PROS, PRODUCE THE LINK OR ARTICLE OR SHUT UP.

Even if he did say it, which he didn’t, it still would not prove he was against them being drafted.

Didnt Truth B Known get on you about putting your foot in your mouth and stupid is as stupid does? There you go again with the foot in the mouth trick.

Prove that Woody said that or admit you are lying.

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“and I’ve seen Woody make it known that he didn’t think much of CP3 or DWill, and we passed on both, despite us desperately needing a PG.”

Prove it mr. foot n mouth. Produce an article, link, recording something to support your claim or just admit you are a liar and go sit in a corner, face the wall and put your foot back in your mouth.

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What idiots.

It’s not that I thought or think Pape Sy is some diamond in the rough.

But there are some serious issues here.

Ok, so you drafted the guy. No harm, no foul. Draft picks go bad all the time. But then you go out of your way to pay for his contract buyout, so you can bring him over here and let him play. Then you don’t play him. And, he doesn’t get to do much in the D-League.

But that’s not all. You mean to tell me Sy was let go because he failed to become a decent NBA PG inside of a single year under “Larry Drew the point guard guru?”

Morons! He never WAS a pg, you should have played him at the 2 or 3 all along!

This is why I generally don’t listen to Drew (and neither do his players). That never made sense. Dude never had the handles to play PG. Just stop spewing what management tells you to say, Larry. They lie all day long, and it only makes you look stupid when you parrot what they say behind closed doors.

Truth is, investing in Sy looks totally dumb because of the way you backed out of it. The ASG and their Pinocchio Sund, at it again.

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But on the subject at hand, if TMac plays decent, and injuries are limited, we do have the deepest Hawks team I can remember since like Antoine Carr and Cliff Levingston, Spud, Battle etc.

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Face it folks…we ain’t gettin no star here in Atlanta!

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SteveW I can agree with you in part and your facts are not misconstrued. Woody was not an X/O’s type coach with the hawks because, as you say, he did not run plays to individual strengths. However, I say that, in part was because of all the inexperience he had with the young guns. His strategy was, (as is often the case) to run and gun to the play offs. The Leagues vets could not keep up with the gazelles of the hawks and we were exciting and shoe ins to make the playoffs. How ever the play offs turns half court and Isolation. What we had in youthful agility we lacked in experience and refined skills (not to leave out no true starting center) and that’s why we keep getting beat. We did not have the refined skill set or the experience of the veterans. There wasn’t much Woody could do to get over the hump. No center, no refined skill set, just raw talent and our only advantage, gazelle like speed was shut down in half court play.

Ok I can see that at that point maybe its time for a change of coaching to get us to the next level but that change should not have been Larry Drew. We can, could and should do better then that.

Once again. Wood did a good job as far as Im concerned he played the hand he was dealt. Chose to run and gun as far as it would take him. He took us from 13 wins to 52 wins. Great Job. Now Who can take us to the next level and wheres that center we still need?

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My favorite story was BK bringing in Randy Foye, Rajon Rondo and Marcus Williams the year after we passed on Deron and CP3.
BK apparently still didn’t think we needed a PG, but he brought them in for a crowd pleaser obviously.
IMO, they decided to go with the guy who was not ranked that high, was projected around 12 or 13 and a guy we never worked out (if I’m wrong about that, someone correct me).
That one draft did it for me in believing in BK and Woody. A total debacle of epic proportions.

ESPN has a Central Division preview and all 30 analysts pick Miami 1st in the Southeast Division…no surprises.

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I have a rather ignorant question. Exactly why, did these nitwits buy this franchise?
Also, the lunacy of Johnson’s contracts is now taking its effect on the future potential of the other players. As I said the day after the contract.

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Big Dog ,

You’re preaching to the choir. I think everybody short of Gearon (yes, even Sund) knew that Larry Drew wasn’t the answer. I personally wanted Dwayne Casey, and knew we wouldn’t get Avery Johnson.

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This is the best bench the Hawks have had in a very long time…

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Big Dog ,

Lol. Watch out, this could lead to a trend…

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atrocities^^^^^

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I said last season, that Billy Knight’s drafting atrocity’s would affect this organization for at least 10 years….sigh…..

And you would be right. What’s scary is that some of us who were here on these blogs before MC came to town, were saying the same thing back in 2005. And then we got to say it again in 2006 when Billy screwed the franchise AGAIN.

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How can some of you tell that a sale is imminent? Is it because we’ll have expirings after the year?

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Those ESPN power rankings are straight up BS. I’m not even biased at all as a Hawks fan.

Milwaukee, Indy, Philly ahead of us? PHILLY?

Denver at 9? They lost like 219348 players this offseason to China.

SMDH @ Marc Stein

Milwaukee is ahead of us? Really? WTF have they accomplished the last 4 seasons?
Philly doesn’t even have an offense. Their best player is incredibly overrated (Iguodala).

Whereas, we are a young core that is a year older, with one of our best benches in years

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Grandmaster JeJe do you think its possible that they can be thinking we are soft defensively where it counts?

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I still feel like the biggest problem for this team is coaching. You can put down the players and their tendencies all you want, but the fact of the matter is that system being used only magnifies the problems.

This jump-shooting parade that Larry Drew calls an offense is a joke at times. I can basically sum it up in the offensive approach/process in a few sentences. A “PG” or Joe will bring the ball up the court and hand it off to Al at the top of the key. All 5 players will then stand around the perimeter, and Al will first look inside for someone to pass to, and then the players will swing the ball back and forth around the perimeter for a while to see if someone is open for a jump shot. If they are, someone will shoot and either make the shot or miss it and it’s one-and-done situation, since everyone will start running back right away. If no one is open, the ball will either stop in Joe’s hand’s and he’ll force up a shot at the end of the clock or it will stop in Smith’s hands and he will try to do something he shouldn’t and likely cause either a turnover or missed shot. The other scenario is that one player will get the ball on the left or right mid-post area, a few steps out of the paint. When that happens, if the player is not doubled, we run an iso play and the rest of the 4 players stand on the perimeter to wait and see what happens. There’s almost zero cuts, screening is only to create jump shots, and when a player has good deep-post position, his teammates fail to deliver the ball or Drew calls out for a different “play”.

Forget about management doing a bad job of bringing in help and improving the roster. At this point, we have to work with what we have, and our coaching staff does a poor job of utilizing the talent we have and evaluating new talent. Instead of trying to develop a system that utilizes the strengths of our players and putting them into positions where they can be most effective, the way someone like Popovich would, Drew throws any and all players into his “system” and if they don’t fit to his liking, the players are traded or cut.

Jordan Crawford was thrown away since Drew and our staff didn’t see his potential and thought he was just a “gunner”, without realizing that he’s only starting his career and could be molded into a pretty effective player. Sy had the physical credentials to be at least a decent NBA player, but instead of trying to develop him, he is cut just because he doesn’t look like he can play the exact position that Drew wants him to play right now. Also, guys who don’t fit the “system” see less and less court time, just because Drew can’t “trust” them, or because they “aren’t working hard enough”. Powell was only signed because Drew liked his jumpshot, and that’s essentially the only reason he saw playing time, since Drew felt like he could fit in to the jump shot parade. Teague, on the other hand, still doesn’t have a reliable jump shot, and since Drew doesn’t want someone to take the ball out of Joe’s hands when it comes to playmaking, Teague was benched for most of the year last year, even though he has some unique abilities which no-one else on the team has.

I’m tired of seeing the way things are being run under Drew. We are stunting the development of our younger players and getting less than we could be getting out of our “core” because we are forcing guys into a system that causes many of them to play to their weaknesses. Also, there’s no equal accountability nor is there a reward/punishment system based upon the way someone produces on the court. Instead, there is unfair criticism and bias and playing time is awarded based upon personal relationships and veteran status, rather than production.

I really feel like guys like Al and Josh could be much more effective and really play their best elsewhere. No one is really being helped by Drew’s system. The only guy that even gets to showcase his best talents is Joe Johnson, and that’s not because of the system, it’s only because the staff trusts him enough to let him take over the game when he chooses to. Putting Jeff Teague on the floor on the offensive end without the ball in his hands takes away his most valuable assests (his driving and penetrating ability) and makes him an inefficient spot-up shooter who defenders will ignore and dare to shoot. Putting Josh on the perimeter causes him to play to his weaknesses and tempts him to simply settle for long jump shots rather than use his superior athleticism to cut to the hoop and score inside. Also, while Al is an exceptional mid-range shooter, you still lose out on his ability by having him wait on the perimeter for a jump shot, since that keeps our best rebounder away from the glass. Marvin Williams looked totally lost last season in Drew’s system, since he never seemed to know when or where he was going to get the ball. Most of the times when he did shoot, he looked surprised to even get a pass and rushed a shot that he would then miss. Marvin didn’t even have a clear role in the offense last season other than to spot up and see if no one else is going to shoot.

It gets worse when you look at the new bench. You are not going to have much success if you are going to live and die by the jumper with a lineup that features Jannero Pargo, Willie Green, today’s T-Mac, Radmanovic, and Zaza. The only reliable shooter in that whole lineup is Radmanovic, and he’s a stretch 4. Also, don’t count on any of those guys cutting to the hoop, especially since Drew’s offense features almost none of that anyway.

What we need is a better coach who knows the strengths of his players and puts them in positions where they can be their most effective. We need someone who also enforces equal accountability and does not simply play favorites and allow certain players to do whatever they want regardless of the results. We also need a staff that knows how to develop young players rather than just throw them out in exchange for veterans who have almost nothing left in the tank.

I know our team has some holes and shortcomings when it comes to personnel, but we should at the very least make the most of what talent we do have, and the staff is not doing an adequate job of that.

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I’ve noticed a vast improvement in JSmoove’s jumpshot. He doesn’t hold it behind his head like he did in the past, and he’s using more wrist and less elbow. I think his outside shooting will improve if he sticks to taking wide open shots. I’ve also noticed that Marvin doesn’t turn to the side as much when he shoots, like he’s done the last 2yrs. He seems to be shooting like he did before his back problems started, only with more range.

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“Grandmaster JeJe do you think its possible that they can be thinking we are soft defensively where it counts?”

No. They just act like Jamal made or broke this team. We will be fine without his non-existent defense. I think we will be better than last season and we have a very solid bench. If Marvin or Smoove take that next step this year, we won’t be that much off from where Chicago is

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Yes Big Dog, two rim protectors at the 4 and 5? What a dream? Plus DeAndre alters a ton of shots that aren’t recorded……He also has a post game that’s improving..

ECF this year or next without a doubt..

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Slimjr to think he was the 34th pick the year after we took Big Al with the 3rd pick. Al Horford reminds me a lot of Big Al Henderson.

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All this talk about Al wanting to play power forward, well he cant as long as Josh is here because Josh is a much better power forward than Al. So why would we start Al at power forward over Josh?

Talk about a dumb move.

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The pick of the litter has to be Ivan Johnson. What is he 29 year old? Hmmm

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“Woody is so good that he just couldn’t get another job as a HC. Billy ain’t got another job….” – Big Ray

Lon Kruger

Terry Stotts

Mike Woodson

Larry Drew

Big Ray let me ask you an honest question. After Larry Drew is let go by the Hawks, do you think he will ever get another head coaching position in the NBA?

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Here ya go Slimjr, no Isaiah here. actually the man is 28…..

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/ivan_johnson/

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My bad you said JR Ryder I was thinking of Isaiah Ryder.

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Rolando,

Pathetic they had Philly ahead of us too.

What exactly do they have going for themselves? Their best player is mad overrated and can’t create offense (Iguodala). Everyone else on the team is good but not great.

SMH

We are 4th seed at worst this year. I really don’t see how we will not be the 3 seed though. NYK’s backcourt is horrible (B-Diddy out 4-8 weeks and probably more given how pathetic his conditioning and health is)- Bibby has back spasms, and Toney isn’t good enough to be a starting PG. Boston should fall off a cliff IMHO now that Perkins is gone. The only team I see improving that much is Indy and they won’t be a top 4 team.

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Ivan is a bonifide scorer! He will be huge down the stretch in those 3rd and 4th quarters helping with the scoring load..In the past our front line could not contribute at times in the 2nd half which lead to NBA record blowouts…

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Grandmaster JeJe

December 23rd, 2011
9:51 pm

I’d be interested to see Jamal’s +/- on the team when he was in with the 1st unit or just some of the subs (no garbage minutes)

**************************

From basketballvalue.com

Jamal’s top 5 units in minutes

http://basketballvalue.com/player.php?year=2010-2011&id=249

1) Bibby – Jamal – JJ – Josh – Al: ( +57 )

2) Jamal – JJ – Marvin – Josh – Al: ( -53 )

3) Jamal – Hinrich – JJ – Josh – Al: ( – 17 )

4) Jamal – Hinrich – JJ – Josh – Zaza: ( +8 )

5) Teague – Jamal – Evans – Powell – Zaza: ( -2 )

If you count all of Jamal’s lineups, we were ( +2 ) for the year when he was in the game

- Johnson ( +86 )

- Smith ( +62 )

- Horford ( +44 )

- Marvin ( – 44 )

- Teague ( – 62 ) . . . but ( +33 ) when he played with JJ – Marvin – Josh – Al . . compared to Jamal’s ( – 53 ) when he played with those same players.

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Honestly, to be kind, our Hawks chicken stuff for brains are the worst drafters ever. We draft Benson this year and he lasts a week. The greatest Joke ever popsy or popsie or poppy seed. Come on Man! The truth is those are two terrible unknown picks the only people who know them is their mama. Hawks you want to build a fan base pick a gosh darned Duke Blue Devil player just for the Hell of it. Jerks

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Pick another unknown from the dark continent and you should be ousted from the NBA. Joe Johnson is paid 10 times too much. Do YOU know what the Hell you are doing,. Casey Stengel said does anybody know how to play this game. Casey would be amazed with the high level of absolute stupidity YOU rocket scientists display. Somebody actually pays YOU idiots real money to be a stooge.

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Merry Christmas to all my friends,
Happy Holidays to you and your families
-&-
A Festivus for the Rest of us !

G-dad

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Merry Christmas Grandad. You are sorely missed.

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G-Dad, give us more than that! Have you reconsidered?

For the guy that hired Bob Weiss, I don’t have a lot of faith in Sund improving our roster during the season barring a major injury on a starter.

Ken S. I had the same opinion on Josh earlier. His shot has improved from last year and looks very precise. For the condition he came in this year, I think he alone wants to show the league he is all-star worthy. I see a big year for him out of all the starters. If he and JT can develop some chemistry, we might get a dose of lob city South.

With the guys we brought into camp, I have to say this is the best we can do given what we have.
Time to knock off NJ a couple of times.

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Only an ANAL MINDED IDIOT, with a lower basketball IQ than a drop of water, would suggest getting rid of a 5yr veteran center, who’s All NBA, and been an Allstar the last 2yrs, just because they think he’s peaked. I’ll take a vet like Horford, and his accomplishments even if he’s peaked, over a raw one dimensional player like DJordan, who will never reach Horfords level of accomplishments, or peak at his level.. Once again, STUPID IS AS STUPID DOES!

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Grandmaster JeJe ,

What are your rankings for the East this year?

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Happy Holidays to G-dad and all of the AWESOME BLOG FOLK ON THIS AWESOME BLOG!!!!!!

Difference of opinions shall be tolerated…..got it…lol

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Najeh,

Three backup combo guards, and only one backup center..

Technically, there are 2 backup centers. Zaza and Twin. Its just that Twin is ineffective against almost every center not named Dwight.

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Mychal Thompson bashes Knicks Stars..

http://www.hoopsworld.com/mychal-thompson-slams-melo-amar%E2%80%99e

I thought I was the only one who noticed.

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Big Dog

December 23rd, 2011
10:13 pm

“but right now, he’s just a very raw physical talent without fundamentals.”

Agreed but Al Horford has peaked after 5 year. DeAndre’s raw talent has a tremendous upside. Coming out of college Al was Dubbed the ” most polished and NBA ready” player in the draft. he hasnt gotten any better in my opinion. His best year in college he was a 12ppg and his pro career ave is 12ppg. He is not doing any thing better since he got here. Hes peaks. DeAndre has only just begun. For my money Im on the bandwagon with the guys who would take DeAndre over Al.

In fact let me ask you a question… do you think the Clippers would make that trade head up DeAndre for Al?

Not straight up..They would probably want a pick also Big Dog?

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It looks like the Hawks have decided to carry 15 instead of 13 on the roster. That means our 15 man roster is set, but who makes the final 12 man roster? I see Zaza, Twin, Radmanovic, TMac and Pargo, because of his DEF, as locks. That leaves 5 players(Johnson, Sloan, Stackhouse, Green) to fight for the remaining 2 active roster spots. I think Green will get one spot because he’s a combo guard, and Johnson should get the other one because we’d only have 3 backups at PG/C if he’s not included.

I think one of the main reasons Pape Sy was waived was due to him not having a guaranteed contract. In fact, I believe that had a lot to do with Rolle and Benson’s release as well. Right now, Pargo, Johnson, sloan, and Stackhouse, are the only ones let who’s contracts aren’t guaranteed.

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Sign all these guy and non above 6′10 SMH

BIG DOG IN THE HOUSE

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Big Dog, my concern is Teague’s durability this season..I hope this guy does not become the next Tyrone Lue?

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One last hoorah for the Core? Get your DVR’s setup..lol

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And when people say “Player A” is better than Horford…it’s not overall.

Its that he’s not a traditional center. Nor a traditional PF. But overall if u get a superstar he’s likely the best fit.

But to get a superstar you need to draft or trade. So its not happening here. At the same time his trade value was once at the point where you could have gotten 1 of the best traditional centers and a 2nd rounder to cover Josh’s weaknesses for Al.

Now his “upside” that Larry Drew said was being a beast at PF is not there. And you’d probably have to give up picks for a traditional center and guy like Leuer.

Mentioning Leuer again because Josh + Marvin + Deandre is not getting it done even if Deandre becomes Dwight 2.0.

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1. MIA
2. CHI
3. ATL
4. ORL
5. NYK
6. BOS
7. IND
8. PHI

IND could be as high as 5 depending on what West does

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Replace PHI with MIL. MIL has always had nice players but get decimated by injuries

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Orlando will have to trade Howard though, unless they want to lose him for nothing. And where the Knicks fall will depend on how Davis’ back is.

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in Today’s NBA your #3 should be a very good scorer and your #5 a defender and post player not a one dimension shooter.. where is the logic?

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MattP,

BDiddy is not returning anytime soon. He will not staynhealthy either. He is not a healthy person.

Not sure why Mo never signed there. I heard NYK offered him 2.5m exception. 2.5 is more than was his annual salary here (7m/3)

Btw. Thanks Northcyde for Jamal breakdown

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On top of that Collins only plays 12mpg on average. Even worse is that he’s perpetually injured. Not one preseason game.When’s the last time he even practiced?

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Rufus1 good find. How the hell did Melo win a Nat. championship? I never ever see him winning a ring

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NBA preview courtesy of cnnsi:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/basketball/nba/12/22/crystal.ball/1.html

You think they even mentioned the Hawks one time? Coach? Players?

We are as insignificant as the marketing director for the Hawks. No vibe, no must-see all-star, no nuttin’!

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Someone was mentioning the Hawks had the oldest team in the league….has anyone looked at Dallas?
They have 8 guys in double figures re: playing years, led by Kidd with 17.
The Hawks have 5 guys in double figures, led by Stack with 16.

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yeah buddy, collins is like the left hander in the bullpen brought in for maybe 40 outs a year against left handed hitters in critical situations. otherwise, he sits.

sorry, i wish i could believe but t mac with 15 years and stack with 17 dont have enough gas in the tank. add “one trick pony” twin, ivan and sloan who play only in very uncertain situations and hinrich out, we are weak and very under sized. no one has mentioned anything really positive about t mac since he got here.

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Najeh,

Nate is an idiot. You don’t get traded and released as many times as he is for no reason.

He is childish & undependable. In a weak organization like the Hawks, he would be all over the place demanding this and that, pouting and generally creating trouble.

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Collins also defends Bogut well.

As a situational post defender, Collins is an invaluable bench player AND is a guy who in theory could have teached Benson the fundamentals of post defense (and eventually the fundamentals of buffet eating).

Now he will have the opportunity to teach the invisible man.

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“He is childish & undependable. In a weak organization like the Hawks, he would be all over the place demanding this and that, pouting and generally creating trouble.”

So what you’re telling me is Stackhouse’s amazing locker room leadership abilities won’t keep him in line?

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Umm, hello fellas. To all whose handles I recognize, Happy Holidays. Doc, I tried to text you at the last number I had for you, but got no response. I’d really like to connect with you if you are interested.

The real question I have is: WHERE THE HECK IS BIG RAY AND THE FAN BLOG??????? IT’S NOT LIKE THE SEASON IS STARTING IN TWO FRIGGIN’ DAYS OR ANYTHING!!!!!! I KNOW I’M OUT OF THE LOOP, BUT UNLESS RAY HAS BAILED AND LEFT THE AJC, AND HIS SUBSTANTIAL PEER/FAN BASE HANGING, WHY IN THE HECK HAS HE NOT BEEN GIVEN ACCESS TO DO HIS “THANG”??

WAZ UP!!!!?????

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The only thing we can add to the team that will help us to win is new ownership. When money is the only factor that is considered then you end up with over the hill players that are just trying to get one more year of NBA money.

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Actually, Josh has the most trade value. He is like Lamar Odom, talented tweener who is better off as a 6th man who can do some of everything, than as a regular starter.

Put him on a contender and they become the team to beat, but keep him as a starter and rely on him to “lead” you anywhere, you’ll never get over the hump.

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“…Coming out of college Al was Dubbed the ” most polished and NBA ready” player in the draft. he hasnt gotten any better in my opinion”

Sorry but that’s a lie. His numbers have improved every season, while Josh’s numbers are basically the same.

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With the Hawks being so thin at center it will likely mean that the 2-foul rule will be in full effect for Al in the first half of games.

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And for the advanced stats:

HORFORD
09 17.0PER, 06.8 Win Shares
10 19.4PER, 10.9 Win Shares
11 20.7PER, 10.1 Win Shares

SMITH
09 17.2PER, 4.9 Win Shares
10 21.0PER, 9.3 Win Shares
11 19.2PER, 6.4 Win Shares

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Marvin will be the healthiest he has been in years after his back surgery this off season. Either he has a break out year, or he is gone.

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I cannot believe we waived Sy and Benson, I like them, they are very good and younger prospects! please bring them back

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HB Ando sighting!!! It’s a Christmas mir-a-cle!!!

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@ HB Ando…
I asked that question as soon the lockout ended. I really haven’t gotten an answer beyond he’s given up the gig…

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Let Stackhouse go now, Stop wasting time he is done.

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Ivan Johnson is ready to help Hawks now, and will. This guy does it all. Also glad to see improvement in Marvin Williams. I had given up on him. We have 66 games to see if he has really woke up. Glad we still have that amnesty waiver in hand.

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How do you draft a guy and just let him go and honestly why did Sy get waived I bet Benson becomes a better player after it’s all said and done just like we’re going to watch Jordan Crawford get better.

Someone said it yesterday, but we let go of some good prospects because we’re in a win now mode I don’t like that.

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[...] The Hawks waived forward Magnum Rolle and guards Pape Sy and Brad Wanamaker today. More cuts are coming later today: The roster now stands at 16, one more than the maximum, and it’s possible Atlanta will carry the minimum 13 players for the regular season. Atlanta Journal-Constitution Atlanta Hawks, Magnum Rolle, Pape Sy, Brad Wanamaker  [...]

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How can anyone listen to those guys on ESPN talk about pro basketball…..they are horrible.

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Summary of my thoughts on this team:

1) BEST bench I’ve seen us have in a longggg time
2) Best TRUE POINT GUARD since Mookie Blaylock
3) NEED a rugged, hard-nosed player who will start altercations, pick up technicals, flagrants (a DeShawn Stevenson, James Posey, Perkins). Hopefully Ivan is t hat guy
4) Marvin NEEDS to step it up this year. 14ppg MINIMUM
5) T-Mac I HOPE is resting up for the season. His lift on some of those jumpers looked awful so that may not be a good sign
6) Smoove and AL: ATTACK THE DAMN BASKET. DON’T SETTLE FOR JUMPERS EVERY SINGLE TIME
7) Joe should be fine (no homo)
Radmanovic = the sleeper on the team. He will have a good time shooting 3s once Teague gets in the lane with ease

3rd seed in the East this year

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My thoughts on this team by the time we hit March everyone will be ready for this team to explode. ASG regardless of what any one thinks is hoping someone a brave soul will come back to buy this team seriously.

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Smith.Leuer.Bogut – you’ve been at it to long bro. You are losing it.

Josh got game player. Like Big Ray says, when its time to rebuild, there’s a very good chance Josh is going to be a part of that mix. This guy is our #1 vote getter for the All Star team and that’s more votes than JJ or Al. Josh sells tickets and judging by his many commercials, Josh sells products and Videos. Josh by far, is the most exciting player on the team. Josh is still up and coming, and unlike Al, Josh hasn’t peaked. Josh is a very rare talent and is on a short list of players to come to the pro ranks as a starter straight out of high school Hes just getting started. That’s why Dwight Howard put him on an another very short list of guys he’d like to play with.

So,

put down the hater-aid and get back in your lane.

Just the facts ma’am.

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“Horford has the most trade value. Yadi yadi yadi Josh is smaller” – Smith.Leuer.Bogut

Here’s a picture of Josh Al and JJ, tell me, How much smaller is Josh, bro?

http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba/2010/04/flight-school/

Just the facts ma’am

He

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‘I would actually like to play with Melo,’ Bryant said. ‘Championships are won on the inside and I’m always thinking about winning the title. I would love to play with Melo because I would know that I have an inside presence. That’s really been the biggest strength with our Lakers team. We have a lot of guys who can play in the post, and that’s how you win championships. I can post, Lamar [Odom] can post, Ron [Artest] can post, Pau [Gasol] can post and Andrew [Bynum] can post. Teams are usually lucky if they have one guy that can control the block. But yeah, I would love to play with Melo”

- Kobe Bryant

think he’d like playing with Horford? nah

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HB,

Welcome back. I think the ajc took away most of the fan blogs.

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Just read that Al Horford is getting married this afternnoon, 12/24/11 to the lovely Amelia Vega, an ex Miss Universe. Civil ceremony at the home of Juan Luis Guerra, in the Dominican Republic. Congrats.

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LOL @ Josh sells tickets. No he doesn’t. Nobody on this team is a box office draw. Hawks ticket sales point this out time and again. If this team only draws big crowds when we play popular teams, that means that the people of ATL aren’t breaking their necks to see the Hawks play the Wizards or Bucks.

Even on road games, fans in other cities aren’t going to games saying . . . “man, I gotta see that Josh Smith play tonight”.

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Al getting married? Congrats to him. Although his choice of female won’t sell well in ATL, with all of the fine Black women in that city. Hope he doesn’t lose some fans once this becomes public and pics of he and his wife hit the major gossip blogs.

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northcyde We agree, a) height wise there is not a significant difference between Josh/Al. b)weight wise there is now a significant difference that did not exist prior to this season, so neither picture has a significant difference.

Smith.Leuer.Bogut – Horford is not a good low post defender. Period. Not because he cant, but because he is unmotivated.

Something I know from my years of ballin, there are certain ‘clicks’ that run the game. If you aint in that click you aint happening. Dominique experienced that during his run where he was constantly shunned and could not get the respect he had earned. I dont think Al horford fits into the “click” mentality well. No player is saying “hey lets go after this guy Al horford”. Like Lebron went after JJ, or like the lakers for Chris Paul. or like the Howard short list with josh on it. No “player” is saying lets go get Al. Why? Can you compete at the highest level if you are soft at the post?

Check out this video and you will get a glimpse of the “click” of today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEQ1cWn_DH0

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Congrats to Al for getting hitched. And Josh Smith is not a box office draw. Fan favorite (via All Star votes) sure.

And I’m tired of hearing about Horford’s “mentality”. When has Horford ever had the tools to get it done defensively? All his “The Mentalist” supporters him shooting jumpers and getting occasional dunks on offense.

Not like he was getting punked on defense by Perkins and the Cs his rookie year, then Kurt Thomas calling him b****.

Horford is not a real C. And the hope was that he’d become a monster against smaller defenders. Not likely. Too mechanical and ineffective.

He reminds me of what Duncan would be like if he was smaller and couldn’t get his own boards.

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FIRE ASG

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If coach want save his job, he must starte Collins at center and move Marvin on bench giving the Hawks a deeper rotataion and more balance attack.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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“Horford is not a real C. And the hope was that he’d become a monster against smaller defenders. Not likely. Too mechanical and ineffective.”

Agreed, Duncan is about done but horford would not be comparative if their ages were the same. Duncan has the right attitude about playing the low post.

“Horford has to step up this year, the last 2 years he been a complete failure and showed no toughness at center in playoffs, the guy continue 2 tell coach to bring in center…”

Darrell at what point does Horford accepts that is his role and what the team is depending on him to do? Im sure he understands that but his continual nagging for a true center and saying that he wants to play the 4 is his way of rejecting the call. To use your words, hes a “failure” because he wont accept the call, step up and own the position. For all that mouth about going to war, where is the fight in Al ?

“Its not the size of the dog in the fight….. Its the size of the fight in the dog.” – T.S.

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Big Ray

How you doing my friend? I like to wish you and your family and the rest of the colorful bloggers and their family a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

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2011 ATLANTA HAWKS

STARTER TEAGUE, JOE, JOSH, HORFORD, COLLINS

BENCH PARGO, TMAC, MARVIN, VLAD, ZAZA

RESERVE IVAN, GREEN

STREET CLOTHES SLOAN

GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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MY BAD STACK MADE THE TEAM TO.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!

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Bluesteel, You mean Smith is the most marketable. O’Brien what was Chris Paul’s Hornets attendance like.

Even with a superstar I suspect they were worse after they became a treadmill team?

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The Heat cut Eddie House. I would rather sign him over Sloan…

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ESPN Preseason rankings for the Hawks;

Jamal C. is gone, Hinrich is hobbled and newcomers like T-Mac were limited to one-year deals in the wake of the team’s collapsed sale. So expect more of the Hawks who went 10-17 after the All-Star break than the team that upset Orlando in Round 1..

They have the hawks at 18th.

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*Atlanta has not ever been a major market draw

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Blue Steel dont be so quick to walk away from your point. If the Hawks were 29th in attendance and moved up during Josh’s tenure to 15th-16th then Id have to say your point is still valid, certainly not dis proven.

Good point.

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Herman they did move up to as high as 18th so yes, under Josh the numbers rose. Thanks for the co-sign

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Welcome back. I think the ajc took away most of the fan blogs.

Correct. All but two of them.

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The real question I have is: WHERE THE HECK IS BIG RAY AND THE FAN BLOG??????? IT’S NOT LIKE THE SEASON IS STARTING IN TWO FRIGGIN’ DAYS OR ANYTHING!!!!!! I KNOW I’M OUT OF THE LOOP, BUT UNLESS RAY HAS BAILED AND LEFT THE AJC, AND HIS SUBSTANTIAL PEER/FAN BASE HANGING, WHY IN THE HECK HAS HE NOT BEEN GIVEN ACCESS TO DO HIS “THANG”??

WAZ UP!!!!?????

Nobody can stay gone THAT long and still get such a reaction. There is only one. Happy Holidays to you, Ando, and yeah….most fan blogs were cut (all but two) by the AJC. So we are all in one place, doing what we do, and what not….

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New Jersey got Mehmet Okur for their 2nd round pick in 2015?

All we do with our second round picks is waive them after we pick them…

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@ Big Ray…
Post at 4:25PM, Co-sign…

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“Hey, why are you accusing Atlanta fans of having the palsy?”

Hummm, I think that would be written “many of the Palsy were in attendance..”

By the way, What ever became of your blog page Big Ray? Is that what you are referencing in say the AJC took away the fan’s blogs?

If that’s true can you explain why?

New Jersey got Mehmet Okur for their 2nd round pick in 2015?

We could have did that.

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ESPN actually has the Hawks in the lottery, 9th in the East. Interesting. But I don’t pay much attention to that. That’s why they play the games.

ATL Hawks the oldest team in the NBA? Even if that’s true, our top 6 are:

Teague – 23 yrs. old

Marvin – 25

Al – 25

Josh – 26

ZaZa – 27

JJ – 30

So we may have surrounded the “core” with some older guys, but the core is still young. Really this year and next we’ll kinda be in our prime. JJ getting a little older, Teague just getting started, but everybody else just peaking.

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From the 2007 – 11 drafts, we have exactly 2 guys on the team: Al Horford, and Jeff Teague.

That’s not the way to build a team.

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Fire the scouts!

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“He averages 10 points in 39 playoff games. 7 points and 4 rebounds at power forward.”

So why are we moving him to power forward?

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New York–Yes, Al Horford said “you take it personally” when someone calls you out in the media the way Amar’e Stoudemire has done twice to Horford this season.

But Horford, not much for hype, says he will make his point tonight at Madison Square Garden against Amar’e’s Knicks.

“He’s a talker. He’s going to talk, you know what I’m saying?” he said at shootaround today. “All I do is bring my game to the court. That’s what I will do tonight.”

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good article by Hummer on LD. LD doesn’t have to worry…he won’t be away from his family long…he’ll be in LA full-time as soon as this 66 game foobar is over. what a team we have assembled this year!!! zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

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I really wish Al had taken the Chris Bosh route in the offseason. CB1, knowing that the Heat lack an impact center, bulked up so he could play the 5 if it came to that. If Al had done that, I think we would be a lot better off.

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Who should go 1st when they start the core meltdown?

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245lbs to 250lbs= 1 Ham sandwich! Yeah! LMAO……..

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edit ^Horford were 260

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The Clippers claimed Chauncey Billups off waivers while also pursuing a trade for Chris Paul.

“My whole thing was if they were pursuing C.P., why would they get in my way?” Billups said. “When they got me, the C.P. trade was off. Then it was back on, off, back on and then, boom, they get C.P. It made me more like, ‘Why would y’all get in my way if that is what you were trying to do?’ ”

In the days since the trade, Billups has calmed down and accepted his role on a new team. Billups has a strong friendship with Paul.

“When you play two point guards like that, you have to somehow use it as an advantage,” Billups said. “Both of us have to run pick-and-rolls, incorporate what’s going on and make teams match up with us because we are going to be small in the backcourt. And I never liked playing [shooting guard], to be honest with you, because the one advantage that I always had was I was bigger and stronger than anyone at [point guard].

“Now I slide down and I’m smaller than everyone at my position. What are we going to do to that even that out? Those are things I talked to [Clippers coach] Vinny [Del Negro] about. We just got to get creative.”

Billups is expected to control the ball a lot when in the game with Paul, which could free up the latter for more scoring opportunities.

“It’s all good,” Billups said. “I’m going to do what I always do: Make the situation better than when I got here.”

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Bosh put on pounds two yrs ago and the complained it made him less effective. I believe Toronto told him to

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Umm, that 2 draft choices in 5 years still on the team is not decieving. Just a fact.

Let’s see, how many draft picks are still on the Sixers? The Thunder? Most every team really. We also didn’t have a pick in 2008.

But we draft Shelden #5
Josh Childress #6
Acie #11
Marvin #2
Solomon Jones #31
Gladyr, Sy, Benson, Stoudamire in the 2nd round

That’s off the top of my head. Pretty bad track record really.

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I think we actually have 5 of our draft picks still on the roster don’t we? Teague, Josh, Al, Marvin, and ZaZa. Didn’t we draft ZaZa/

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Appreciate the shout out doc…just livin’ and lovin’ the semi-retired life and otherwise stayin’ in my lane. Follow all the dialogue flow when I can, and the insights and humanity shared by you and all the others — that is, MOST of the others — for sure enriches this Hawk fan’s bittersweet experience. Have a meaningful Christmas my brother…

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Steve the drafting since BK’s last year hasn’t been that bad, its the player development which has been the real problem. It shouldn’t have taken Hinich getting hurt for Teague to get a real chance at starting. We should still have Jordan C. and a first round draftee on our team right now! Maybe that guy would have made the roster!

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Slimjr

December 24th, 2011
7:55 pm

Truth B. Known

December 24th, 2011
6:22 pm

“He averages 10 points in 39 playoff games. 7 points and 4 rebounds at power forward.”

“So why are we moving him to power forward?”

Hmmmmmmmm……..

Slimjr, Im still trying to” figure that Ch!t out”. The All NBA Al averages 10 ppg in 39 playoff games, which is enough to tell us about how he plays in money time.

All NBA Al has an average of 7 ppg and 4 rbs when playing power forward and yet he constantly nags about playing the 4.

Can you, or anyone tell me how this will make the hawks better? Also tell me WTF happens to Al games in the play offs. I understand that his career average is 12ppg but in the playoffs its only 10?

Geezzz

Can some one help me “figure that Ch!t out” ?

LMAO

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o’b, strictly by the numbers of all star votes josh is clearly hands down our most popular player.

cali og, sounds way good bro.

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O Brien I got to agree with Doc and Blue Steel, The Votes speak for themselves and you really cant find a way to dismiss their importance. The fans voting has Josh over 100k over Al and 50k over JJ and JC. By far, Josh is our most popular player by fan voting.

As for your interpretation of what those number say, well they also say, that from the date that Josh was drafted and upwards there has be an constant growth of fans and by 2007 Smoove had shown his stuff and the fans came to see this highlight reel in the largest growth margin.

When Al came here no body knew what Al would do, and judging by his 10ppg playoff average it ain’t that much, so if the fans did come to see Al, he sure hasn’t given them a reason to stay.

I’m more inclined to believe the All Star voters than your hypothesis. Fan voting for their favorite players is concrete evidence, facts. I see your argument, but that’s all it, is a hypothetical argument based on indirect, inconclusive circumstantial posturing.

Ill stick with the fans voting.

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KWooden – I agree with that.

And BTW to all bloggers – Merry Christmas!!

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JJ – Thanks about ZaZa – couldn’t remember – I knew he was like a 2nd round pick or something.

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About our bench:

You know, Pargo, Green, TMac, Vlad Rad, and ZaZa are about what you want in a 2nd unit – all guys who can play a legit 15mpg or more in some cases.

And I think Ivan, given the chance, can be an absolute animal. I like that pick up.

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Sund said “you don’t trade for superstars; you draft them.”

SMH

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The most honest Power Ranking I have read…

http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-power-rankings-week-zero

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MERRY CHRISTMAS to all of the hawks blog, liar’s table. it is quite a crew that has developed as regulars here since its inception early summer of 2005. there is always room for one more. it is hard to believe it will be going on 7 years, time flies, so use it well. hopefully, we will all “spin on” into a healthy and successful 2012. be well men and women and i hope your dreams about christmas are met with family, friends and those of us here.

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doc, the same back at you.

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@KEN

I agree about with your assessment about Chandler and the Celtics, I don’t think they will be better than the Hawks if Teague 70% of expectations. I was referring to(and I wasn’t clear) his assessment of the Hawks.

I think the ZONE helped Chandler and the Mavs more than people realize, because no one lets a 15mil center just walk. He and the Knicks will find that DEFENSE is a mentality that starts with the head COACH and your BEST players and they lacking in both.

The Celtics are OLD and FATHER TIME is UNDEFEATED.

The forgotten facts about the Hawks… They are in their PRIME and most NBA “CORES” don’t stay together for 6-7 years, so it confuses the NATIONAL media and NBA fans.

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Bibby is hurt already….

@TommyBeer
Tommy Beer
Bibby “probably” won’t play due to back injuries. Billy Walker and Jefferies good to go

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Happy holidays to all on this blog, as i hope you and your family will have a healthy and productive 2012. May God bless you bountifully.

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Melvin Id love for the hawks to pick up Nate Robinson. The guy is a player and can shoot, handle the ball, has speed and understands the game. He’d be a great pick up for the hawks.

Ivan Johnson needs to have a consistent role on the hawks and should get 20-25 minutes a game to have an impact. Play this guy, you wont regret it. His only problem is he get’s into foul trouble, but that’s because he is a no nonsense no BullCh!t defender who will knock you down and not extend a hand to help you up. The Hawks desperately need his bravado. Hopefully it will rub off and the hawks toughen up.

Please cut Stackhouse. The dudes a dinosaur and plays like it. He doesn’t make the hawks any better, actually worse, because he cant defend, and has very very limited offensive ability. The only thing he brings to the table is name recognition. It would be stupid to keep him if your are trying to get better.

Play.

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The Hawks need to sign Nate Robinson who was cut by Oklahoma City!!!!!!

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Believe it northcyde,they’ll say anything. passed on drafting them and trading for them.
Scared money don’t make no money potna

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If Nate is sooo good, why on Earth OKC waived him?

Get real. The guy is trouble: talent? Yes. Actual productivity day in day out? Nope.

The guy is a big kid. Zero focus.

Traded or released so many times and there are still people that don’t see what he is??

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hittman jamillion

December 25th, 2011
12:09 pm

Believe it northcyde,they’ll say anything. passed on drafting them and trading for them.
Scared money don’t make no money potna

****************

That definitely became obvious to me last summer. Gearon and the ASG may talk a good game, but their actions prove that they’re scared to shake things up if need be. They’re happy making $20/hr . . but scared to go for the $40/hr job . . for fear that their pay will drop down to $12/hr.

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It will be interesting to see if teams play zone against the Heat the way Dallas did so successfully. I don’t know if any of you remember, but I said before the season started that their lack of consistent outside shooting would be their major weakness. CBosh is their only consistent outside shooter, which is why they siged MBibby, and why MMiller is so importantant to them. They’re also caught in a quandry when it comes to their PG situation. They were very vulnerable to teams with quick, fast, penetrating PGs. With DWade and LeBron needing the ball in their hands to be effective, having a PG to control the ball and the OFF is a waste.

They need a PG that shoots the 3 like Bibby once did, who also possesses the speed, quickness, and DEF ability of JTeague. It will be interesting to see if Miami is able to have the same, or simular, success as last yr. Teams now have a blueprint on how to slow them down. Attack their PGs and Cs, as well as keep Lebron and Wade out of the lane and turn them into jumpshooters.

RHamilton is a better offensive player than Bogans, but not as good defensively. I don’t think he can be as effective as Bogans at shooting 3s consistently, but his midrange OFF is deadly. The problem is, he can’t create his own shot, and he needs screens and picks to give him enough room to take advantage of his midrange gm. I don’t know how much of an overall upgrade Rip is going to be. Teague, Hinrich, Radmanovic, TMac, and potentially AJohnson, just might give us DEF and offensive firepower to get past the Bulls in a 7gm series.

The combination of Teague and Hinrich would give DRose fits and wear him down on both ends of the court. The combination of IJohnson and JSmith would give Boozer fits as well. And the combination of JJ and Green would be a load for RHamilton. I’m beginning to like the idea of keeping Stackhouse. For yrs we’ve been complaining about JJs passiveness as a leader, Josh’s immaturity, and Marvin lack of aggressiveness. Well, a player like Stackhouse just might be just what is needed to bridge the gap and pull it all together psychologically and emotionally.

While Woodson was too aggressive and in your face, but only when it came to younger players, and LDrew isn’t aggressive enough, Stackhouse might end up being his bridge of communication to the players. If it works, I’m all for it.

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Northcyde ,

Hated for you to come to that realization so forcefully after showing the kind of loyalty the ASG just isn’t deserving of. You have been and are an avid fan….hope you don’t lose that amonst us cynics.

MERRY CHRISTMAS TO EVERYBODY. BE SAFE.

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“Hawks’ core possibly facing final chance to show something” JS

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Happy Holidays to everyone!

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it’s just so good to see NBA basketball again.

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Dallas has no interior defense without Chandler. The way they’re looking now…I don’t know if they can repeat. Nor even make it to the WCF’s.

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Dallas reminds me of the Hawks.. Not much interior defense, just kills a team run at an ECF. Forget Championship. Dallas wont sniff it anymore….

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