Atlanta Hawks: Hawks waive Sy, Wanamaker, Rolle (Update: Benson also released)
The Hawks waived forward Magnum Rolle and guards Pape Sy and Brad Wanamaker today. More cuts are coming later today: The roster now stands at 16, one more than the maximum, and it’s possible Atlanta will carry the minimum 13 players for the regular season.
UPDATE: The Hawks waived center Keith Benson, their only draft pick in June. The team plans to carry 15 on the roster to start the season. There are four players on the roster with non-guaranteed deals: Ivan Johnson, Jannero Pargo, Donald Sloan, and Jerry Stackhouse.
The decisions on Rolle and Wanamaker were not unexpected but the Hawks gave up on Sy after investing in him as a long-term prospect. Coach Larry Drew said Sy’s inability to develop as a point guard played a part in the decision.
“We, the coaches and the management, came to an agreement that he’s been a little bit more effective off the ball than at the point,” Drew said. “With that and the acquisition of Willie Green and [having] a number of other guys that are veterans that can play two, he became expendable. We were hoping he would mature and develop but he just seemed more comfortable at that two-guard spot. With that, we made the decision to go in a different direction.”
Sy, a native of France, made his way to the NBA as a a rare unknown prospect–prominent Web sites that track numerous draft-eligible players had no file on Sy before Atlanta selected him in the second of the 2010 draft. Sy had paid his own way to work out for the Hawks, the only team to grant him an audience, and impressed Drew.
The Hawks paid about $125,000 to buy out Sy’s French contract last year and paid him $473,604 in salary in 2010-11. He played a total of 21 minutes for the Hawks last season and spent 23 games with Atlanta’s D-League affiliate.
Sy had a good training camp but Atlanta’s payroll is pushing against the luxury-tax line, leaving little room for carrying players who can’t help the team now. The Hawks added guards Green and Pargo during training camp.
“It was a really tough decision,” Drew said. “There were a lot of things we liked about Pape.”
When the Hawks drafted Benson, they said he was a long-term prospect because he needed to add bulk and strength. But Benson, like Sy, appears to be a victim of Atlanta’s focus on veterans at the expense of carrying prospects who need time to develop. Benson was released by a club team in Italy during the lockout.
Rolle signed with the Hawks near the end of last season and re-joined the team following a stint in South Korea. He came into camp out of shape after he said a right foot injury hampered him from maintaining his conditioning.
Wanamaker, a rookie free agent out of the University of Pittsburgh, struggled during last night’s exhibition victory against Charlotte.
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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771 comments Add your comment
northcyde
December 23rd, 2011
6:27 pm
LOL . . may as well have been 82
Guys who could play SF on the 2005 – 06 Hawks
- Josh Smith
- Donta Smith
- Al Harrington
- Joe Johnson
- Josh Childress
Marvin made 6.
northcyde
December 23rd, 2011
6:33 pm
So Ken . . what you’re saying is that Woody was the GM all along?
He drafted Marvin
He drafted Shelden
He traded for Bibby
Woody made ALL of those moves?
So BK was simply a figurehead GM with no power?
Like I said . . why even have a GM, if the coach is going to have all the power? And to think that one of the reasons why they bypassed on Avery Johnson as successor to Woody, was because Avery wanted more control over personnel decisions.
Sorry Ken . . I’m just not buying the Woody stuff.
Detroit_Southfield Connection
December 23rd, 2011
6:53 pm
The Hawks will never get over the playoff hump waiving drafft picks. Keith Benson was a defensive beast at Oakland U. He is athletic and had tremendous upside. Tyson Chandler with a better post game. Should have traded him to the Bobcats or Utah for picks. I hope the Pistons pick him up.
Rufus1
December 23rd, 2011
7:03 pm
The Defense is coming…
The Hawks held the Bobcats to 75pts…. The Defense is coming.
I saw a team challenging everything at the rim. They were active and out rebounded the Bobcats by 20. How will the Bulls BEAT US if they can’t OUT REBOUND US? Rebounding isn’t about SIZE, it is about MENTALITY.
I see the VISION……BASKETBALL PRESCHOOL is over.
Surround the “CORE” with TOUGH MINDED VETS, who know how to win and are still HUNGRY. This is the BEST team we have had and the DEEPEST…..
GO HAWKS…
PS. The EAST has one DOMINANT center and he doesn’t have enough supporting SIZE to DOMINATE….
Jay Dubu
December 23rd, 2011
7:06 pm
The Hawks need at least 1 big man that can play.
Is Collins injuried? He has not seen a single minute in exhibition, and Howard will be out of the East by Febuary, against whom Collins earned his keep last season.
CSD
December 23rd, 2011
7:06 pm
Maybe with some added minutes Jason Collins will have another career year and give us 6 and 6. Yippy
Mike is Back
December 23rd, 2011
7:15 pm
I ain’t mad at SUND and the ASG… because he kept two guys I was very high on…in this kind of A SEASON…I will say SUND and ASG finally made some bold choices. Ivan the Terrible and Sloan…really showed a lot when it counted the most…so I can say, for once I’m in agreement with the choices that was made.
You would like to see if Benson can be added back to the team somehow…however that would be too GOOD to be true…if you are a HAWKS FAN.
JaeEvolution
December 23rd, 2011
7:20 pm
Rufus we played potentially the worst team in the league…I wouldn’t read too much into it. That squad passes as a D-League team to a casual fan.
Grandmaster JeJe
December 23rd, 2011
7:20 pm
Lol Horford wanted big man help and we just waived all our scrub bigs
ntrigue
December 23rd, 2011
7:23 pm
Another team will pickup POP Sy Benson will head to the D-League
steven A.
December 23rd, 2011
7:28 pm
Have to think there are plans in the works for 7″2″ Alexis Ajinca, Francisco Elson, or Fesenko.
Or maybe DJ Mjbenga. Outside chance with PF/C Yi Jianlian. Hawks need 2 bigs to replace
Hilton Armstrong and Etan Thomas
Big Dog
December 23rd, 2011
7:28 pm
Horford needs to step up and do the job hes capable of and stop asking some one else to. His attitude about the position sucks. He is it. own it. I would never go to war with horford.
yoursporthouse.com
December 23rd, 2011
7:30 pm
Trade Horford…
FreshFromAtl
December 23rd, 2011
7:30 pm
Hawks made the cuts I expected them to make. Might be one of the deepest teams the Hawks have had…
steven A.
December 23rd, 2011
7:30 pm
If they would committ to putting Marvin PERMANTLY on the bench, I would definitely purchase
NBA League pass!!!!
FreshFromAtl
December 23rd, 2011
7:33 pm
Also, if a big goes down…Benson or Rolle will probably be added back to the roster. Neither of those guys are going to catch on with a NBA team so it would be in their best interest to get overseas and work on their skills…
brigadierjerry
December 23rd, 2011
7:33 pm
I am suprised that Stackhouse has lasted this long. Doenst anyone remember Stackhouse last year went to the Heat for a minimum contract and was released shortly thereafter because he couldnt play anymore?. Problem are too penny-wise and pound foolish. I am not saying Benson is some stud but why not put him in the D-league for a year to get better. If the Knicks can get a second round draft pick Landry Fields to be a decent player why cant the Hawks?I know the odds of a second round pick sticking in the NBA is small but sometimes I feel the Hawks do not use all their resources as far as the scouting and developing players goes.
Fundamentals
December 23rd, 2011
7:38 pm
Do we have resources for scouting or developing players? If so, I’ve never seen it since ‘83!
SteveW
December 23rd, 2011
7:43 pm
Northcyde – There is probably some truth in what you said about coaching, even though Drew was horrific in the 2nd part of the season, and a 2nd round team was getting destroyed regularly by record margins.
And Woody had no idea how to change starting lineups, which is one thing LD is good at many times.
But the shame is these guys have never had another Coach the last what, 7 years, other than LD or Woody. So we can say our ceiling is such and such. But until they have played for a “real” Coach, we really don’t know.
I mean, Rick Adelman, or Casey, Jackson, or whoever may have come in and done worse, we don’t know. Or they may have shocked us and taken the team further. But any speculation is just that, speculation.
And I do think Sund has just asquiesced to Woody and LD as to thier preferences for players, under the financial constraints of the organization.
And it was Woody who wanted the ZaZa trade for Brad Miller. Sund was just trying to work with his Head Coach. Glad that one didn’t go through!
And it was LD who refused to play Teague or JC2, so Sund really had no choice when LD wanted veteran PG’s. Not Sund’s fault.
And it was Woody who lobbied for an extension for Bibby, but we all blame Sund.
And I’ve even had people on here say Sund shouldn’t listen to his Coach, but just assemble the team. But he would still be blamed, because the Coach would then blame his poor performance on the GM
And many on this blog would also.
Ken Strickland
December 23rd, 2011
7:48 pm
NORTHCYDE-You’re trying to make it an either or proposition, and it’s not. Woody wasn’t solely responsible for all of those decisions, and neither was management. They were both responsible, but you seem to be trying to dump it all in the laps of one or the other. Neither of us has any inside info on who did what, but I do know that Woody was dead set against drafting DWill or CP3. Why else would he say he didn’t think either would be very successful in the NBA because of their physical stature, and their lack of a consistent outside shot?
The fact you can’t buy the idea of Woody having any meaningful influence or input in the Hawks drafting process doesn’t mean he didn’t. I’m sure there were a series of overrides and compromises in the decision making process, but I doubt if there was only one deciding voice.in all decisions. I’ve seen managment step in and refuse to allow BK to fire Woody, and I’ve seen Woody make it known that he didn’t think much of CP3 or DWill, and we passed on both, despite us desperately needing a PG.
Big Dog
December 23rd, 2011
8:02 pm
Woody was and is much better than Drew. aka Woody lite. In fact,he has something the other hawks dont have….. A championship ring. So say what you want. Woody is a champion!
Woody did a very good job with not very much. He played his starters because he had no bench and even his starters were a bunch of rooks. By the time he got them to the next level that sund of a … thought to up grade with Woody lite. I thought Woody had earn a right to spend 2 or 3 years at the next level, and deserving of an extension. But Sund and management felt the need to change, so hey, they made the change, as much as I like Woodson, who may get another ring now that hes on the staff with the Knicks, we moved on and I wont look back.
All that hate for Bibby, when we signed Bibby we needed exactly what he brought, courts smarts and sharp shooting. He helps us and we knew he was in the twilight years of his career, thats why we signed a 3 year deal, figuring to have found the guard of the future by that time. . Now that it over and Bibby is done, I salute him ,he did a great job and if we were back to that time and we had to do it all over again, Id say welcome Bibby. You are a 1sr class man and player.
So hate on Bibby and hate on Woody, haters. These two Guys did their jobs and should be saluted.
Time has moved on, but these guys did there job and took the franchise to the next level, which is all you can ask. Now the question is how do we get to the next level up from there rather than sliding backwards like Sund and Drew have us doing.
FIRE SUND.
KevinM
December 23rd, 2011
8:04 pm
BK and Woody joined at the hip just like LD and Sund are today.
They are both to blame and if they together they do not progress this year, then the ASG will have to make a decision. And as we know, they’re not very good in that category.
And on the roster, if you aren’t going to play the marginal rooks, then don’t leave them on the bench. Let the vets earn their way and dump them if they don’t produce.
What we’ve been doing isn’t working…..
We have a roster that now ’should’ know how to win games against better competition.
ESPN has a tipoff special on right now talking the best teams this year.
So far, no Hawk talk.
This junk continues until we get rid of this ‘breakfast club’ of owners.
They have no clue what needs to be done to get to the next level. We are in neutral trying to stay afloat as a 4-5 playoff seed.
I think every team in the league has no problem getting us in the playoffs.
Big Dog
December 23rd, 2011
8:12 pm
“but I do know that Woody was dead set against drafting DWill orWhy else would he say he didn’t think either would be very successful in the NBA CP3. because of their physical stature, and their lack of a consistent outside shot?”
Who let this guy out?
You dont prove fact by deduction or calling for a conclusion to be enter as fact, further you are entitled to your opinion but not your own facts.
PROVE WOODY SAID THAT CP3 OR D WILLIAM WOULD NOT MAKE IT IN THE PROS, PRODUCE THE LINK OR ARTICLE OR SHUT UP.
Even if he did say it, which he didn’t, it still would not prove he was against them being drafted.
Didnt Truth B Known get on you about putting your foot in your mouth and stupid is as stupid does? There you go again with the foot in the mouth trick.
Prove that Woody said that or admit you are lying.
Big Dog
December 23rd, 2011
8:15 pm
*Bibby. You are a 1st class man and player.
**Their jobs
Big Dog
December 23rd, 2011
8:21 pm
“and I’ve seen Woody make it known that he didn’t think much of CP3 or DWill, and we passed on both, despite us desperately needing a PG.”
Prove it mr. foot n mouth. Produce an article, link, recording something to support your claim or just admit you are a liar and go sit in a corner, face the wall and put your foot back in your mouth.
SteveW
December 23rd, 2011
8:31 pm
Big Dog – No doubt Bibby was exactly what we needed when we got him. He just went down hill so fast defensively – Wow.
But his court vision and knowing what to do when he got the rock, immediately and anticipating others, remains the best I’ve seen. His athleticism left him, but he had great BB offensive instincts.
And I defended Woody, but if you could combine he and LD you would have an NBA Head Coach. LD knew how to do matchups with the starting lineup, which Woody never could figure out with his available talent.
So with Woody you had an historic playoff blowout series.
And with LD epic regular season blowouts.
After 11 games last year i started telling folks “LD has lost this team”. And he had. They didn’t show up again until the playoffs.
Big Ray
December 23rd, 2011
8:34 pm
What idiots.
It’s not that I thought or think Pape Sy is some diamond in the rough.
But there are some serious issues here.
Ok, so you drafted the guy. No harm, no foul. Draft picks go bad all the time. But then you go out of your way to pay for his contract buyout, so you can bring him over here and let him play. Then you don’t play him. And, he doesn’t get to do much in the D-League.
But that’s not all. You mean to tell me Sy was let go because he failed to become a decent NBA PG inside of a single year under “Larry Drew the point guard guru?”
Morons! He never WAS a pg, you should have played him at the 2 or 3 all along!
This is why I generally don’t listen to Drew (and neither do his players). That never made sense. Dude never had the handles to play PG. Just stop spewing what management tells you to say, Larry. They lie all day long, and it only makes you look stupid when you parrot what they say behind closed doors.
Truth is, investing in Sy looks totally dumb because of the way you backed out of it. The ASG and their Pinocchio Sund, at it again.
SteveW
December 23rd, 2011
8:41 pm
James Altucher says when people with money talk, they are lying. The more money, the bigger the lies. Always.
I’m not sure this is true, but Big Ray’s last post just reminded me of this comment for some reason.
SteveW
December 23rd, 2011
8:43 pm
But on the subject at hand, if TMac plays decent, and injuries are limited, we do have the deepest Hawks team I can remember since like Antoine Carr and Cliff Levingston, Spud, Battle etc.
SteveW
December 23rd, 2011
8:44 pm
But his bench isnt’ that good.
Laughing out Loud
December 23rd, 2011
8:44 pm
Face it folks…we ain’t gettin no star here in Atlanta!
Big Ray
December 23rd, 2011
8:44 pm
Woody was and is much better than Drew. aka Woody lite. In fact,he has something the other hawks dont have….. A championship ring. So say what you want. Woody is a champion!
So does Adam Morrison.
As for Billy Knight, Mike Woodson, and the 2005 draft….it’s still killing us. Bibby was good for us for a while, until two straight head coaches just couldn’t let go of the idea of him as a starter, and pinched the chances of any young pg actually learning and taking over.
So, we suffered badly on defense, and eventually on offense. In the meantime, there are STILL two positions that mean the most in basketball – the Center and the Point Guard. Billy Knight failed to address either one, even the talented Al Horford is a substitution for the prototype, but if you were going to get an undersized guy, there was hardly one better….
Billy failed. And we’re still paying for it. It matters not that 2005 was back when he and Woody were friends and getting along in all things. Fact is, that friendship left later, as Billy tried numerous times to fire Woody. Pick your poison. Both were good for the franchise at times, but neither could stay in order for the franchise to move forward. Both helped, both had their limits.
Woody is so good that he just couldn’t get another job as a HC. Billy ain’t got another job….
Big Dog
December 23rd, 2011
8:47 pm
SteveW I can agree with you in part and your facts are not misconstrued. Woody was not an X/O’s type coach with the hawks because, as you say, he did not run plays to individual strengths. However, I say that, in part was because of all the inexperience he had with the young guns. His strategy was, (as is often the case) to run and gun to the play offs. The Leagues vets could not keep up with the gazelles of the hawks and we were exciting and shoe ins to make the playoffs. How ever the play offs turns half court and Isolation. What we had in youthful agility we lacked in experience and refined skills (not to leave out no true starting center) and that’s why we keep getting beat. We did not have the refined skill set or the experience of the veterans. There wasn’t much Woody could do to get over the hump. No center, no refined skill set, just raw talent and our only advantage, gazelle like speed was shut down in half court play.
Ok I can see that at that point maybe its time for a change of coaching to get us to the next level but that change should not have been Larry Drew. We can, could and should do better then that.
Once again. Wood did a good job as far as Im concerned he played the hand he was dealt. Chose to run and gun as far as it would take him. He took us from 13 wins to 52 wins. Great Job. Now Who can take us to the next level and wheres that center we still need?
Big Ray
December 23rd, 2011
8:47 pm
Steve W ,
Well put on Bibby. There were two other elements he lacked in ATL – a darn good coach (Adelman) and a set of big men who knew what to do with the rock, played disciplined ball, and were potent enough inside that they got him several good looks on the perimeter.
Al Horford and Josh Smith are nothing compared to what Chris Webber and Vlade Divac were….
Horford can’t seem to stay in the paint these days and Josh is as wild as they come. Bibby was in for a culture shock…
And I need not compare Woody/Drew to Adelman. No comparison possible…
KevinM
December 23rd, 2011
8:50 pm
My favorite story was BK bringing in Randy Foye, Rajon Rondo and Marcus Williams the year after we passed on Deron and CP3.
BK apparently still didn’t think we needed a PG, but he brought them in for a crowd pleaser obviously.
IMO, they decided to go with the guy who was not ranked that high, was projected around 12 or 13 and a guy we never worked out (if I’m wrong about that, someone correct me).
That one draft did it for me in believing in BK and Woody. A total debacle of epic proportions.
ESPN has a Central Division preview and all 30 analysts pick Miami 1st in the Southeast Division…no surprises.
Slimjr
December 23rd, 2011
8:50 pm
Hey Big Ray, I heard All NBA got a new turn around fade away 1950’s set shot? Haven’t seen it yet!
lmfao!!!!
Rationale
December 23rd, 2011
8:52 pm
I have a rather ignorant question. Exactly why, did these nitwits buy this franchise?
Also, the lunacy of Johnson’s contracts is now taking its effect on the future potential of the other players. As I said the day after the contract.
Slimjr
December 23rd, 2011
8:56 pm
Big Dog
December 23rd, 2011
8:21 pm
“and I’ve seen Woody make it known that he didn’t think much of CP3 or DWill, and we passed on both, despite us desperately needing a PG.”
“Prove it mr. foot n mouth. Produce an article, link, recording something to support your claim or just admit you are a liar and go sit in a corner, face the wall and put your foot back in your mouth.”
. LMAO!!!!! Who let “BIG DOG” OUT? Awesome!!!!!!!!!!
Big Ray
December 23rd, 2011
8:59 pm
Big Dog ,
You’re preaching to the choir. I think everybody short of Gearon (yes, even Sund) knew that Larry Drew wasn’t the answer. I personally wanted Dwayne Casey, and knew we wouldn’t get Avery Johnson.
Big Dog
December 23rd, 2011
9:00 pm
If im not mistaken this was Woodson 1st head coaching job, and as I said before he was not the X/O’s guy of veteran coaching, but hey, you got to start some where. Do I think he is better today and gained from his experience? For sure. Did he take us higher and accomplish great things ? No Doubt.
Does he wear a championship ring?YEAH. Does that mean anything? Yes he was a part of a team that won the Worlds Championship.
Is he back in coaching? Yes, Will he be a head coach again and show what he gained from his first head coaching Job? Probably.
Does he deserve honor and respect. He does in my book.
No hating here.
Big Ray we agree on something, and since that is rare, I think I better mention it.
The Center and the Point Guard are the two most important positions on the court.
There. We agree, so much for finding common ground.
Back to my side of the fence.
Grandmaster JeJe
December 23rd, 2011
9:00 pm
This is the best bench the Hawks have had in a very long time…
Big Ray
December 23rd, 2011
9:03 pm
Slimjr ,
I’m going to wait and see if Al can return to the guy he was in his first two years in the NBA. If not, I’ll be banging the drum, going up to the trading deadline. I’ll wait and see what he does. What I don’t want to see is another slew of games wherein he fails to rebound and play tough inside for 2-3 quarters.
Having said that, if the guy plays his perimeter game and gives us 17+ points on a higher percentage of shooting while doing it, I can’t complain too much. But we still need him to rebound and play defense. We’ll see what happens.
Thing is, he’s not going to be the lynchpin of a different Hawks team. It’s still going to be Josh Smith, one way or the other. Or so I feel….
Big Ray
December 23rd, 2011
9:04 pm
Big Dog ,
Lol. Watch out, this could lead to a trend…
Slimjr
December 23rd, 2011
9:05 pm
I said last season, that Billy Knight’s drafting atrocity’s would affect this organization for at least 10 years….sigh…..
Slimjr
December 23rd, 2011
9:09 pm
atrocities^^^^^
Slimjr
December 23rd, 2011
9:15 pm
“I’m going to wait and see if Al can return to the guy he was in his first two years in the NBA. If not, I’ll be banging the drum, going up to the trading deadline.”
Better get your drums out and start banging cause this dude is going to try and evolve into a 4…
He was trying to show that yesterday but couldn’t finish those shots on the move.. We will see real soon though..Wont take long now….
Big Ray
December 23rd, 2011
9:19 pm
I said last season, that Billy Knight’s drafting atrocity’s would affect this organization for at least 10 years….sigh…..
And you would be right. What’s scary is that some of us who were here on these blogs before MC came to town, were saying the same thing back in 2005. And then we got to say it again in 2006 when Billy screwed the franchise AGAIN.
Big Ray
December 23rd, 2011
9:22 pm
Slimjr,
Here’s what’s crazy – right now I’d still maintain the argument that there is no Josh vs. Al situation when we’re talking about the PF spot.
But what happens if Horford averages more ppg while trying to play like a stretch 4? What if he goes from being a 13/14 ppg and 9.6 rpg guy to a 17/18 ppg and 8.6 rpg guy? Now we have a controversy, especially if he does it while logging heavy minutes at the 4…or simply by avoiding the paint.
Now you have to trade one or the other for a center.
Grandmaster JeJe
December 23rd, 2011
9:23 pm
How can some of you tell that a sale is imminent? Is it because we’ll have expirings after the year?
Smith.Leuer.Bogut
December 23rd, 2011
9:25 pm
“I’m going to wait and see if Al can return to the guy he was in his first two years in the NBA. ”
What are you guys talking about? He was worse his first two years.
Was he stopping Dwight or Kendrick then? Even then we’d still be starting Marvin.
And to the guy talking of trading Marvin…he’s a bad contract! So he’ll get you another bad contract.
Still cant believe a shooting center, Okur was available. not that I believe the injury prone big would have helped us take the next step. But damn. A 2015 2nd rounder?