Atlanta Hawks: ‘It will get worse from there’ Update: Players, owners to meet
(Update 1:20 a.m. Thursday: No deal was reached. The sides are set to meet at noon Thursday. David Stern said “nothing was worked out today” but that owners would not revert to their “reset” offer. Derek Fisher said he couldn’t say “significant process” was made.)
(UPDATE: Players and owners are set to meet at 1 p.m. today, four hours before the league’s deadline. Adrian Wojnarowski reports that David Stern can make a “very slight budge” on the system issues that players say are unacceptable. The union seems ready to accept a 50-50 BRI split, which would more than cover the owners’ claimed losses of $300 million last season.)
As I traveled around the league during the 2010-11 season, I kept hearing that some owners were willing to lose a season in order to get a more favorable CBA. I didn’t believe it, especially since the season ended up being a success. What good would it do owners to get a better CBA if they damaged their popular product in the process?
But now it appears that’s where we’re at. David Stern has issued what amounts to an ultimatum: If the players don’t take the owners’ latest CBA offer (which they’ve already said is unacceptable) by Wednesday, then things get really ugly.
Last night on SportsCenter, Stern said: “We think that there’s a great offer on the table and what we told the players is it’s getting late. The only rational thing to do is for us to make that deal because given what’s going on in our business and our industry, it will get worse from there.” Meanwhile ESPN’s Chris Broussard reports that at least 15 owners hope the players reject the current offer because they believe it’s too generous.
There are reports that some players want to vote to authorize a vote on union decertification, setting in place a process that could scuttle the season. (Stern dismissed the consequences of the tactic, saying it didn’t work for NFL players.) Other reports say there is a faction of players that wants to hold a vote on the owners’ offer.
Union team reps are meeting in New York today. (Mo was the Hawks’ player rep until he got traded. Then it was Etan, who is a member of the union’s executive committee. Now the union says it’s Zaza, but he’s in Turkey so Al is in New York as Atlanta’s acting rep.)
Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo Sports reports that there’s still a chance the union and Stern could meet before the Wednesday deadline. Kobe says he wants that to happen in order to “save this from spiraling into a nuclear winter.”
Anthony Tolliver, the T-Wolves’ player rep, told the Minneapolis Star-Tribune’s Jerry Zgoda that players are “split” on what to do. He also says there’s an emotional element involved for players:
“As players, we felt like we’ve been taken advantage of. The real reason why guys want to decertify is they felt like the owners really screwed us at the end of the day. I don’t blame them. I feel that, too. At the end of the day, it is what it is. Now we have to decide if this is the best of the worst or if we think we can achieve something better in the courts system.”
Howard Beck of the New York Times has the details on the letter Stern sent to the union outlining both the owners’ latest proposal and what the next proposal would be if the players don’t accept that one by Wednesday. From the players’ perspective, it’s either take the bad offer on the table now or be left with a horrible offer that includes salary rollbacks after that.
In the SC interview, Stern declined to talk about the possibility of canceling the season because he didn’t want to make “empty threats” to players. If the reports about the hardline owners are accurate, then Wednesday’s deadline isn’t an empty threat at all. I never would have believed it would get to this point.
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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246 comments Add your comment
A concerned fan..
November 9th, 2011
6:58 pm
#LETTHENPLAY! #RISEUP!! #RISEUP!!
doc
November 9th, 2011
7:05 pm
vava agreed and suggested it also that to talk of greed sometimes is only envy in disguise. i also feel the pr machine is tough to play for the players and the owners are trying to tell us it is all about making a buck, like you and me, where the players greed gets in the way and competitive balance. let them become completely transparent as the players as we know every salary down to the penny and nothing about the owners. again i reference the owners have 14 billionaires pleading poverty among them. yeah, right.
doc
November 9th, 2011
7:07 pm
rudy, doesnt have a shoulder that we know can last a season in the nba, northcyde. dont go and get damaged goods.
northcyde
November 9th, 2011
7:07 pm
Rudy Gay’s athleticism would definitely sell in Atlanta . . . but it may not make the Hawks a better team unless Teague really developed into a top notch PG. That would be a real athletic squad though. Tony Allen would have to start at the 2 ( or Hinrich ). Rudy would play the 3. Marvin would come off the bench.
Would I do the trade now? Of course not. I would have to see how JJ would play to start the season. But if there were signs that his 3 point shot was still broken, and that he is slowing down a 1/2 step, then I would pull the trigger on a trade like that.
Rudy will be 25 this NBA season, and while he may be near his peak as a player, he’s a very good #2 option who can be a solid #1 at times.
However, it’s a reason why the Grizzlies seem to be a much more balanced team with Rudy out ( even though they still needed him ). It was beacause at the end of games, the ball went to Ze-bo. He basically worked from 18 feet and in and could even get his own rebound if he missed shots. If Memphis can balance out the offense between Zach and Rudy, they’re going to be dangerous next year. But they need to re-sign Gasol as well.
As for JJ on the Griz, that would balance that team out perfectly, and give them a legit scoring option out on the perimeter that can create and make tough shots. It’ll also give them an additional playmaker, which I’m sure Ze-Bo would love. But Memphis is a team that prided itself on depth. And I don’t know if trading JJ for Gay and Allen would be a good move for them either. One injury to JJ could decimate that team, while with a defensive guard like Allen, Memphis survived the Gay injury.
But if JJ did ever get traded from Atlanta, that would be the type of player that I’d trade him for. A high flying slasher/scorer that could electrify the crowd
WHOCARES
November 9th, 2011
7:21 pm
Stay away forever!! No one cares about NBA basketball. Work for a living like normal people do!
northcyde
November 9th, 2011
7:27 pm
That was Rudy’s first time ever getting hurt in 5 seasons though. I’ll chalk that up as a freak accident, than someone who will be injury prone in the future. I would be more concerned about JJ’s elbow than Rudy’s shoulder.
Having said that, I wouldn’t trade JJ for Rudy, until I see if JJ is indeed in decline. If we get the JJ that we saw in the playoffs, I would hold off on a trade like that. Our window of opportunity is about 2 years. Then we’ll have to decide on what we want to do with Josh Smith.
vava74
November 9th, 2011
8:14 pm
“Najeh Davenpoop
November 9th, 2011
2:48 pm
The bigger problem is that in a superstar-driven league, there simply are not enough superstars to make 30 teams competitive even if there was a hard cap. That’s what makes the owners’ position so hypocritical. Even if you had a hard cap, and hypothetically going even further, if they instituted a rule that explicitly limited teams to having one “superstar”, you would still have some teams anchored by LeBron or Kobe and other teams anchored by Tyreke Evans or Danny Granger. And as long as players have the right to free agency, the big market teams are invariably going to be the ones with the better superstars.
The only real, lasting way to make every team competitive in the NBA is to contract about six teams and move as many teams to big markets as possible. Either that, or enforce a height limit of 6′5″.”
Najeh,
I did say that the NBA over-expanded and that the talent was watered down.
And, what you say does not negate the fact that allowing 2 superstars and 1 star team up in one team like in MIA is bad for the talent distribution:
A very good team got really bad (CLE), a mediocre team got really bad (TOR) and an average team got very good, but very unbalanced (MIA).
People say that this season was great, but that is only because DAL won. Everyone likes to see good vanquishing evil, but for me, to have a team like MIA earmarked from day 1 to at least reach the finals is bad. The risk that a crappy team like that would win it was almost unbearable for me.
A league of superstars is also a wrong construction: the NBA rigs the games to give those few superstars an unfair advantage because their product is built around those few names.
The NFL sells due to its competitiveness and the fact that ALL games are meaningful.
Stars matter and some do get a bit of preferential treatment, but with so many guys on the field, its impossible to build a team around a concentration of 3 or 4 stars (or even 5 or 6) since that would not be enough to overcome a talent shortfall in other areas.
Since in the NBA only 5 guys are on court, any concentration of 3 guys of Lebron/Wade/Bosh level is wrong by nature and the system should prevent that.
The NBA sells mostly due to the fact that 6 or 7 talented guys are artificially elevated to godlike status and people concentrate on the wrong aspects of the game. Basketball is beautiful and it was beautiful to watch DAL beat the three stooges, however, it was awfully close, too damn close.
Lebron travels and palms 3 to 5 plays a game. Those 3 to 5 plays a game probably result in 3 to 5 ppg or 1 or 2 apg more as well as in an unfair advantage on how defenders have to react to his play.
Durant gets every single contact called in his favour (he is the new golden boy), so 3 to 4ppg come out of FT that other guys don’t benefit from.
Howard, who is a mediocre basketball player, gets away with at least 6 to 8 fouls a game. If properly officiated, Howard would never last more than 20mpg.
The NBA has to change building a system that allows every team to be – at least in theory – in contention for the title once every 3 to 5 years.
That would allow for lower ranked stars to receive more love and more local appreciation, leveling the perception of star value more evenly.
Z-BO, with some terrific playoff perfomance, almost got MEM in striking distance of the title and immediately his appreciation in MEM rocketed, equalling or surpassing Gay’s star value there.
Being competitive makes that: changes the perception of who is and who is not a true star.
Astro Joe
November 9th, 2011
8:17 pm
northcyde, I would do that trade in a heartbeat, mostly because we need a MAJOR culture change and that (IMO) could only happen if you trade at least 2 of the captains. I said it a few months ago and I still stand by it, dump Joe & Josh and start with a new nucleus. In the midst of the lockout, who brings a basketball game featuring local NBA products to Atlanta? Is it the home-grown product? The guy with the phat contract? Nope, it is the one who was signed as an after-thought after the season started (Damien Wilkins). I have become as apathetic toward those guys as they seem to act toward local fans.
I suddenly find myself hopeful that the lockout will end within the next 18-24 hours. I am very certain that I am only setting myself up for major disappointment… kind of like being a Hawks fan.
doc
November 9th, 2011
8:24 pm
northcyde just saying he may be damaged goods, shoulder injuries are the worst to rehab and stabilize of all the joints.
http://sports.yahoo.com/elite-athlete-workouts/rudy-gay?vid=26425776
nice piece in their on acupuncture, too.
Astro Joe
November 9th, 2011
8:28 pm
I’m a sucker for any news that would validate my optimism.
KBergCBS Ken Berger
In-meeting updates difficult to gage, but person briefed on talks says they are “moving slowly. They’re trying to get something done.”
Astro Joe
November 9th, 2011
8:31 pm
The ASG could promise me a labor deal completed in the next 4 hours and I would believe them, that is how desperate I am for validation of my optimism.
drmaryb.(*_*).
November 9th, 2011
8:31 pm
Boonked Over The Sides!
I guess by now, the eight orangutans have stopped scratching their heads, pointing their fingers at one another and are asking, “What happened?”
It’s like a Jet Li Movie and, everybody was Kung-Fu fighting – them cats was fast as lightning. Which way did Alex go?
Meanwhile, back at The Dollar Tree and, all eight are draped over the side of The 2 for $1.00 Bargin Bin looking for that all elusive Bench to spell the Elite 5.
smh & exhaling. Forget about the CBA, my Hawks got 99 problems and Stern ain’t one.
Najeh Davenpoop
November 9th, 2011
8:53 pm
I would love the Joe for Rudy/Tony Allen trade. Two problems it would pose, though: a) the Hawks would be one of the worst perimeter shooting teams in the league, so they would have to get a 2-guard or SF who can knock down open 3s, and b) I doubt that the Grizzlies make that trade. They may have made a deep playoff run without Rudy but that doesn’t mean they are necessarily a better team without him, and he is certainly younger and more affordable than Joe going forward.
Astro Joe
November 9th, 2011
9:02 pm
sam_amick Sam Amick
Even some agents who don’t necessarily want a deal tonight are of the mind that one will be done. #falsehope
Joe’s contract (and Memphis’ history of frugality) are the main problems I see. Conventional wisdom says that having your 3, 4 & 5 produce most of the offense is not the way to build an offensively balanced team. So I think Memphis would move Gay for an exceptional SG. Gay wouldn’t come to the Hawks as “the answer”, many other moves would be needed, but you have to start somewhere and if you sit and wait for the one trade that would deliver a savior, then you will sit and wait for a long while.
brigadierjerry
November 9th, 2011
9:32 pm
Interesting article on some pro teams that are on the brink of financial disaster. It is a very good read. Includes about 5 NBA teams which are in serious trouble:
http://247wallst.com/2011/11/08/seven-pro-teams-on-the-brink-of-collapse/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+247wallst%2Ftweets+%2824%2F7+Wall+St.+%28Tweets%29%29
Mike is back
November 9th, 2011
9:33 pm
AJ, what’s up man…Hey, I know it’s a lookout but I’m still a little bias…we might want to hang on to Josh…in case the transition to PF for our All American guy doesn’t go as smoothly as we anticipate.
There are more dominate players at PF than Center…we might want to hold on to one of the TOP defensive player in the league…as a backup…just case things goes awry.
I said it once, and I will keep saying it…you don’t get rid of young dynamite players like Josh and Al. They both have sacrificed and played out of position for the good of the team…they are keepers.
Did I mention…I was kind of bias.lol
brigadierjerry
November 9th, 2011
9:44 pm
The hardline owners/teams have been revealed to be: Charlotte, Milwaukee, Minnesota, Atlanta, Portland, Washington, San Antonio, Cleveland, Detroit.
Now, Atlanta is the same team that signed Joe Johnson to a 120 million contract because they were “afraid” he would sign elsewhere. Now, he came out on July 1st and said he wanted to stay in Atlanta. So, why overpay?
Milwaukee signed Salmons to a 40 million contract extension. Then signed Drew Gooden to a 30 million extension and he only played 1 season and they want to get rid of him. So, why sign him?
Portland still wants to extend Oden. Why? He hasn’t played yet and I understand it’s a nice gesture but if you are so concerned with money and losing it and system issues. Why try and overpay for a center who is going to be out for another peroid of time?
The Bobcats traded G-Wallace for nothing. Literally NOTHING. You cannot complain about losing profit and money when you traded your franchise player for 2nd round picks.
Detroit signed Ben Gordan and Charlie V to a 50 million dollar contract each. How did that work out? So, now they want non guaranteed contracts. How about not signing average players to large deals? They want rules to protect themselves instead of using their brains.
If they make a poor signing that seemed like a good idea, they can easily erase it. That isn’t fair at all.
So, again. Who’s fault is it? Not the players.
brigadierjerry
November 9th, 2011
9:55 pm
Best gif i have ever seen which sums up the NBA lockout
http://i39.tinypic.com/2u55q1w.gif
O'Brien
November 9th, 2011
10:46 pm
Joe Pa fired. His legacy is ruined. But he has no one to blame but himself (imo).
O'Brien
November 9th, 2011
10:47 pm
brigadier jerry,
If the hawks owners were that concerned, they should have done a sign and trade of JJ. That way, they save money, but dont let JJ walk away for nothing in return.
Grandad
November 10th, 2011
12:25 am
O’ Brien:
I disagree so strongly about Joe Pa,
that it makes me want to cuss !
Where’s the logic;
*The States Attn dropped the case in ‘98.
*Joe Pa is fired, yet, Sanduskey hasn’t even been convicted.
*USA presumed innocent ’til proven guilty
*Paterno – not the criminal – here.
*when Paterno received info from grad asst;
[Sandusky was no longer under Joe pa's purview]
*Paterno followed chain of command.
*How in hell is Paterno the “bad guy” here.
*Penn State, playin’ – cover their ass
*Paterno fired by same guys who also knew (what he knew).
*Paterno convenient fall guy.
*Sometimes you earn more in life than what Joe Pa just received !
*People coming out of woodwork – where have -they- been ! ?
*Once again; everyone up there knew it … how is Joe Pa the bad guy ?
*Logic does not support this decision … (firing / blaming Paterno)
Grandad supports Joe Paterno to the Max.
Grandad loves the USA & wishes the legal system be allowed to work.
Grandad despises the media and trial by media.
Grandad usually does not speak in the 3rd person.
**editors note:
If Sandusky is found guilty;
put him in the general population [prison],
and whatever becomes of him;
“the punishment will fit the crime”, I would imagine.
B-Grizz
November 10th, 2011
2:51 am
“Again, it was not the player’s fault and to brutally reduce their BRI share does not seem right.” – vava74
Right or wrong has nothing to do with it. The owners are in a better bargaining position so they are grabbing every dollar they can. These players have a limited window to make money. The owners can be fat and old and still make money. I think it’s hilarious how Michael Jordan is now a hardliner and wants the players to give up salary so he can make a profit no matter how many stupid business decisions he makes.
“What is not clear (to me at least) is what is being negotiated to create more parity across the league.” – Astro Joe
What’s being negotiated is taking away the Lakers’ ability to spend twice as much on player salaries (total salaries + luxury tax payments) as teams who don’t pay the luxury tax. See Tyson Chandler’s comments about how he may not be able to re-sign with Dallas under the new CBA.
“The only real, lasting way to make every team competitive in the NBA is to contract about six teams and move as many teams to big markets as possible.” – Najeh
Please also shorten the season.
Buddy G
November 10th, 2011
2:51 am
“I think to get rid of JJ, the Hawks will have to take back a bad contract, like Gilbert Arenas (if the Hawks and Magic could come up with a good combination that works for both teams).” – O’Brien
The only combination that works is Al and Joe for Gilbert and Dwight, but ORL will never willingly trade Dwight to a division rival. Without getting Dwight back, ORL simply doesn’t have any assets. I wouldn’t have said that before they stupidly traded Marcin Gortat. Otis Smith is the WORST executive in basketball. He makes Rick Sund look like Jerry West.
“You cannot complain about losing profit and money when you traded your franchise player for 2nd round picks.” – brigadierjerry
Sure you can! MJ positioning his team for a future #1 overall draft choice so he can make another inspired selection.
bgrizzard
November 10th, 2011
2:54 am
Astute observation from Najeh re: racist bloggers. To vava:
You can say that, but look at how Vin Baker and Shawn Kemp came back from the last lockout. The NBA is unlike any other major sport because it has so few players and stars are at a premium. Eddy Curry could have been a great center if he wasn’t lazy. Sometimes teams are just plain stupid, such as giving a superstar contract to Gilbert Arenas, arguably the worst defender in the NBA (I would argue that Jamal Crawford is just as bad). But sometimes players show just enough to land that superstar deal then quit showing effort.
In MLB, there are a million guys in the minors ready to take your job if you show up out of shape. There aren’t a million guys who could do Eddy Curry’s job. In the NFL, careers are shorter and players are a face mask in the crowd. Nobody pulling an Eddy Curry/Vin Baker/Shawn Kemp there. This phenomenon is unique to the NBA.
vava74
November 10th, 2011
4:37 am
bgrizzard,
Contracts should not be 100% guaranteed.
No one should be obligated to pay Curry his full contract under the circumstances in which he exercises (not exercises) his work related obligations.
He showed enough potential to warrant a fat contract, but he never lived up to it due to his own unwillingness to be professional.
It’s bizarre, to say the least, that in a country where job security does not exist, there is a league where an employer is paying 60 million to a guy who balloons his weight to 400lbs or the remaining of a 100 million contract to a guy who brings a gun to a locker room and gets suspended for a whole season (without pay, but nevertheless).
vava74
November 10th, 2011
7:11 am
On different note (from sports.yahoo.com/nba – ball don’t lie (about former Hawk and All of Famer recently deceased Ed Macauley):
“…
Trading All-Stars Macauley and Cliff Hagan (himself a rugged scoring forward) to the St. Louis Hawks for the rights to move up in the draft to select Russell turned the C’s from a powerhouse offensive outfit into the well-balanced club that revolutionized the pro sport and dominated the league for over a decade. His deal wasn’t exactly Ernie Broglio for Lou Brock, but it wouldn’t be fair to ignore Macauley’s role in history.
…
Boston could never get over the hump, though. And with the introduction of the shot clock in 1954 and a changing landscape, Celtics coach Red Auerbach saw something in San Francisco center Bill Russell as the league readied for the 1956 draft. Racial overtones, though no fault of any of the particulars, also played a part — St. Louis would not be an easy place for an African-American rookie to develop, to put it as mildly as we can without charging the entire community and Hawk franchise with outright racism.”
Even in the era when the Hawks won their only championship and were very competitive, they managed to by make a trade that eventually created, on an opposing franchise, the biggest winning dynasty ever in the NBA and by virtue of that “condemn” the Hawks to its losing matrix.
Also, it ends up being poetic justice that one of the reasons behind the trade – racism – resulted in the above.
O'Brien
November 10th, 2011
7:19 am
Grandad,
Joe Pa is not the bad guy, I agree. But as the Head coach, the leader of men, the face of the university, someone who has always prided himself on doing the right thing……I think he could have/should have done more, instead of just reporting to his superiors what he heard.
You are right in that we don’t have all the facts, and I thought the university would have allowed him to coach the rest of the season. But I’m not surprised they fired him.
vava74
November 10th, 2011
8:15 am
On Joe Pa:
http://msn.foxsports.com/collegefootball/gallery/penn-state-campus-reaction-paterno-firing-110911#photo-title=Storm%20the%20streets&photo=30354174
This is the true mark on how damaged are our (western world) values right now.
IMO, Joe Pa was rightfully fired due to his omission to do what any decent person would have done which is to actively do as much as possible to investigate a situation like this.
We are talking about child abuse. You can’t simply “report to superior offices”.
He basically looked away because an incident could have damaged his programme. For him, like for the fans which rioted following his dismissal, Penn State wins are more important than the children abused.
I am with Whitlock:
http://msn.foxsports.com/collegefootball/story/Jason-Whitlock-Penn-State-sex-scandal-Jerry-Sandusky-blame-Joe-Paterno-Nittany-Lions-110711
vava74
November 10th, 2011
8:20 am
Grandad,
Please note – as you will see from Whitlock’s piece – that there were clearly precedents, dating back to at least 1998 (4 years before).
It’s very difficult for me to imagine that you can closely work with someone for so many years, involved in allegations of this nature whilst having him as your disciple and “heir” and not know more than what came out of Joe Pa’s mouth.
dap01
November 10th, 2011
8:38 am
The owners should keep a hard line and get a deal that helps all teams have a shot but only they can be blamed for giving out contracts that are stupid.
Why did ATL give JJ $25 million more than anyone else could offer? They have just ensured that the Hawks will be average at best until that horrible contract if gone.
doc
November 10th, 2011
9:01 am
vava we dont know sometims exactly what oes onin our own homes sometimes exampleandy reid and hs sons, or in our own organizations like arthur blank on mick vick or our invesments like madoff
or we do onow our president lies and he continues on or there was a plague of pedophiles in the catholic church. much to easy to say joe pa knew more but we know the process didnt work. we do know after the first negative investigationsandusky didnt continue at his job as defensivecoordinator. this is not about joe pa but damage control from thexweak board that let this go. spanier should have bee the fallguy andjoe pa should have beengiven tge vote ofcofidence from the weak board repeating what the mainprosecutor said that joe pa did what he was supposed to within the administrative organization we have asked himto be a part of.
loose cannons lose every time. there was an article yesterday saying a therapist lost her job after going over her bosses heads and reporting she found child porn on his computer. penn state ride joe pa to notoriety evry time they won against nobodies because of his records. nobody would give a damn about happy valley otherwise so they rode the horse. btw players gave himastanding o and students rioted at the true injustice of it all.
doc
November 10th, 2011
9:10 am
of course i politely disagree with o’b and stand with grandad that the administrative process failed the kids not joe pa and he was unjustly dealt with, which only continues their failure. you got to wonder why the guy who witessed this stayed there and never tried to find a job somewhere else since he knew everything done and not done. that would have left me with the creeps.
tough getting it right on an iphone as i cant find the switch that lets me go back over the whole.
doc
November 10th, 2011
9:18 am
yes this was public hanging by the media with classic crowd mentality of knowing what should be done while spewing nothing that approached truth, i.e. one guy saying sandusky shouldnt have been able to continue coaching uh which he wasnt after the first allegation. i have read some real stupid stuff on this matter.
anyway have the owners been completely transparent and opened their books tothe players, medua or fans yet? didnt think so.
now that we have a hanging we can all feel morally better at our justice passed and go on compartmentalizing our lives maybe just as many did in happy valley
Astro Joe
November 10th, 2011
9:33 am
IMO, getting rid of everyone was the right move at Penn State. Folk are focused on Joe Pa but the reality is that they cleaned house from the University President on down. The cover up was most likely a functionof placing the football program ahead of the wel-being of individuals in the community. Allowing the brand name of the program to continue and leave on his terms would have been another indication that the program was bigger than principles. If the head coach was some middling guy (Houston Nutt as an example), this wouldn’t be debated. He would have never had the luxury of deciding his own fate. The University President didn;t get to say when he would leave, not did the AD orhey all needed to get gone sooner than later. anyone else. They all effed up and all are guilty of placing the football program ahead of basic morality. T
Astro Joe
November 10th, 2011
9:40 am
Mike is Back, you do know that in about 16 months, Josh will be signing his THIRD NBA contract. I wonder how much better/more productive a player gets after entering his thrid contract?
Astro Joe
November 10th, 2011
9:48 am
Imagine a scenario where everyone gets fired EXCEPT the head football coach. That would be idiotic. Especially when the cover up was clearly intended to protect the football program. Again, they ALL had to go.
vava74
November 10th, 2011
9:50 am
MC, Blog monster!
Astro Joe
November 10th, 2011
10:06 am
vava, one word that the blog monster loves to devour starts with “r”, has a similar meaning as idiotic, is 10 letters long and rhymes with weetipulust. Try to avoid that word and you may avoid the blog monster.
Najeh Davenpoop
November 10th, 2011
10:59 am
suolucidir
Grandad
November 10th, 2011
11:14 am
Bravo doc – glad we’re back on the same team.
Here’s the deal:
Paterno -DID- his due diligence.
Having been in that same situation;
plus, given his age and perceived senility,
Joe Pa was most likely told:
“don’t talk about it” [legally].
(I’ve been in that exact same place)
Administrators – figuring out how to best cover their ass.
Administrators:
“Don’t rassle with a hawg ’cause you get all muddy;
and besides that, the hawg likes it”
-Don Meyer-
Now Mike McQueary;
The grad asst. who walked in on Sandusky,
[alledgedly sodomizing a 10 yr old boy in the shower]
*did not stop it
*did not rescue the boy
*was 28 years old at the time
*went home and discussed it with his father before doing anything
*then told Joe Pa
*Sandusky was no longer on staff [asst coach]
*Joe Pa – followed chain of command
*Sandusky had already been previously under investigation
I have -Three- questions:
(1) Why the hell is McQueary still on staff / not fired ?
(2) Joe Pa reports it (chain of command),
*[if you have ever worked in education one knows exactly the procedure]
*[legally]
why the hell does a previously investigated sex pred get a pass ?
In other words how or why did it not go up the ladder or where did it stop?
And why?
(3) What happened to the States Attn who is presumed dead ?
[the one who dropped the charges on Sandusky]
Yet – They fired Joe Pa !
The same board who had to have known about the whole sordid mess;
Just as Paterno was supposed to have known !
How do the folks who fired Patero justify firing him,
while not immediately resigning their positions as well.
The whole thing stinks.
They do not want Joe Pa to speak to the press now,
fearing what he may say.
Don’t you reckon he has been told the same for years.
I hope the students take over the campus and demand answers !!!
Grandad
November 10th, 2011
11:16 am
I typed so darn fast – there ain’t no tellin’ what I just said ?
Grandad
November 10th, 2011
12:03 pm
Sandusky was pimpin’ out young boys
-to-
rich donors.
Sickest thing I ever heard of.
He was forced to retire in exchange for a cover up !
Folks this is deeper than poor ol’ Joe Pa.
-&-
Wher’s that missin’ States Attn (presumed dead) ?
whew.
Fed Up
November 10th, 2011
1:23 pm
I am fed up with the pro game. The players and owners can all take a hike as far as I am concerned. It will be tough on all the vendors and workers to lose their jobs. What happned to the top 1%, which these players are in, wanting to give back? Idle talk, cover your own butt, ME, ME. ME.
Fed up I tell Ya, Fed UP!
vava74
November 10th, 2011
1:35 pm
Fed Up,
We are Fed Up of guys like you. Take a hike!
vava74
November 10th, 2011
1:43 pm
Damn blog monster!!! The damn thing must be paedophile as well since it does not allow me to attack Grandad and Paterno on this!
vava74
November 10th, 2011
1:44 pm
Grandad,
not saying that you are a paedophile, simply that you are dead wrong on this one. dead wrong
doc
November 10th, 2011
1:46 pm
vava wrong sandusky was point blank told he was not the heir apparant. he moved on to other work supervised by a board i assume and didnt work for joe pa from 99 on.
guys as a doc in my field dealing with pain and suffering and having spent two years in carng for psychologically hurt individusls this goes on in many disguises within each and every fsmily to some degree wherther it os physical abuse emotionsl abuse or sexusl abuse or alcoholism or drug abuse behind closed doors. much is written about it as the dysfunctional family that touches many not all
maybe most of us. have a new patient today with such a story. dont be blind and realize foks are projecting onto joepa to feel better about their own lives or at least wake up to the fact this is pandemic in our society.
Rev in Tampa
November 10th, 2011
1:52 pm
Hi everyone. I’ve been away far too long and have really missed everyone on the blog. Getting all worked up over the Hawks with the likelihood of no season was just too much of an effort in futility for my consititution. However, I have been checking ESPN hourly for news of a breakthrough today. I WANT BASKETBALL!
Astro Joe
November 10th, 2011
2:37 pm
Rev, I’m with you.
Don King
November 10th, 2011
2:49 pm
Remembering Heavy D