Atlanta Hawks: Second-round sleepers
The reality is that the Hawks face long odds of drafting a player who ends up being a solid bench player, much less a difference-maker, if they stay at No. 48.
Of course that doesn’t mean it’s impossible.
“We get guys that go undrafted and become starters,” said Ryan Blake, the NBA’s co-director or scouting. “[J.J.] Barea, Wes Matthews, Landry Fields–it happens a lot. There is a different philosophy in the second round. You know, maybe a guy can come in and be that shooter. You never know what is going to happen.
“Regardless of what you get, you want to give them the opportunity to make that team. Plus, I think there will be some surprises of guys left going into the second round that might fall into their lap. The old international pick can always be a good thing, too, like Ginobili.”
Blake identified some “under the radar guys” that might fit what the Hawks are looking for:
Vernon Macklin
Diante Garrett
Andrew Goudelock
Ben Hansbrough
Nolan Smith
Josh Harrellson
Brad Wanamaker
Demetri McCamey
Isaiah Thomas
Malcolm Thomas
Iman Shumpert
DeAndre Liggins
Casey Mitchell
E’twaun Moore
Blake said these guys are potential “surprises to be gobbled up if they slip to the second round.”
Jon Leuer
JaJuan Johnson
Charles Jenkins
Un-Smoove sailings?
Adrian Wojnarowski weighed in with the latest Smoove trade speculation. Others have since jumped into the fray.
It’s no secret that Josh is more frustrated than ever with what he perceives to be unfair criticism of his game by media, fans, and even L.D..
Josh’s supporters have long argued that he catches more flak for missing shots than any of his teammates. It’s a fair point, but their pleadings don’t usually acknowledge that it’s not about Josh missing shots as much as it is about him taking more shots that he (historically) hasn’t made. J.J. had an awful season shooting the ball (and took a lot of heat for it) but it’s not as if he has a track record of missing the shots he was taking.
Josh’s supporters counter that because he played more small forward in L.D.’s motion offense he got the ball on the perimeter more by design. L.D. maintained that he called plays for Josh in the post only to see him drift back outside. That’s always hard to figure from an outside’s perspective, but I’d say a better defense of Josh is that L.D. seemingly didn’t say much about the jump shots until they stopped falling.
It’s true the Hawks have gauged trade interest in Smoove, just like they did at the deadline. It makes sense because he’s probably their best chance to get a real player in return (though remember Josh has a trade kicker that’s now valued at about $4 million). None of this means that a deal is imminent or even probable.
The Hawks keep downplaying Smoove’s unhappiness, and he hasn’t asked them for a trade. He’s long been a favorite of ownership, too. I just don’t see the Hawks dumping Smoove in a weak trade just because he feels he’s taking too much blame. He’s too valuable for that.
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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247 comments Add your comment
It was not a bad pick
June 22nd, 2011
4:32 pm
@O’Brien
LOL, MC was not here when Marvin was averaging 14 ppg for 3 years in a row with solid D and rebounding numbers..MC came when Jamal and his 1000 shot attempts entered the picture..ONCE AGAIN, MC is a good BEAT WRITER, but Tom Thibodeau is a GREAT COACH with a couple of rings and was the 2011 coach of the year in the NBA, he say’s Marvin is underated,I think i will respect his opinion over MC anyday, it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out why Marvin production slipped..I am a TRUE HAWKS fan, but i really want Marvin to be traded, just to say I told you so..Even without Marvin on the Hawks, Joe is still going to dribble for 16 seconds and is not going to show up in the playoffs despite his MAX contract, if we keep Josh, he will continue to jack up bad shot after shot at the wrong times and Al will continue to be forced to play center even though he would be a top 5 pf! MARVIN IS NOT THE PROBLEM!
Vol_In_Ohio
June 22nd, 2011
4:35 pm
Is it legit that we could get the #2 for Josh if it was on the table? I think I might take it and Williams would be my selection.
James
June 22nd, 2011
4:38 pm
I read an idea of trading Smith to NJ Nets for Morrow and Farmar, plus.
I like this because:
NJN won’t threaten the Hawks like a trade to Orlando.
It provides depth at PG with Farmar.
Farmar brings championship experience.
Morrow is lights out on 3s.
Smith doesn’t listen to LD and a change is needed.
I don’t like it, because:
Smith brings so much on the boards
It opens up a huge hole underneath.
But:
Presume Jamal bolts. You can use his money to sign a PF/C to eat up the boards and play defense. Chuck Hayes is a FA!
It was not a bad pick
June 22nd, 2011
4:40 pm
@MC
It is easy for a beat writer to take shots at a guy who barely gets 8 shot attempts a game, but what about the guy with the MAX contract who averaged 18ppg in the regular season, and the last two years he gave us 17.9 ppg 38% and then this year 18.8ppg while shooting 43% Are there any teams calling Randy Sund for him?..Who would be easier to trade right now Joe or Marvin?
hawksfancents95
June 22nd, 2011
4:42 pm
her is nbadraft.net #40-60
#40 jon leur-wisconsin 6′11 PF
#41 chandler parsons- florida 6′10 SF
#42 jordan williams-maryland 6′9 PF
#43 travis leslie-georgia 6′4 SG
#44 cory joesph-texas 6′3 PG
#45 rick jackson-syracuse 6′9 PF
#46 andrew goudelock-charleston 6′2 PG
#47 keith benson-oakland 6′11 PF/C
#48 charles jenkins-hofstra 6′3 PG
#49 bojan bogdanovic-croatia 6′7 SG
#50 matthew bryan amaning-washington 6′10 PF
#51 malcolm thomas-san diego state 6′9 PF
#52 xavi radaseda-spain 6′7 SG
#53 etwaun moore-purdue 6′4 PG/SG
#54 greg smith-fresno state 6′9 PF/C
#55 david lighty-ohio state 6′6 SG
#56 willie reed-st.louis 6′9 PF
#57 cam long-george mason 6′4 SG
#58 julyan stone-texas el-paso 6′6 PG
#59 deandre liggins-kentucky 6′6 SG
#60 deangelo casto-washington state 6′8 PF
If leur,parsons,leslie or jordan williams somehow slip we take one of them. leur then parsons then leslie last williams if all 4 available(they won’t be just saying for team needs)
realistically though im looking at Keith benson, etwaun moore, and david lighty. all 3 could get on the court for us in relief minutes(benson would get most minutes)
I wonder if we could trade our 48 and next years 2nd to someone in the early 2nd to get jeremy tyler if he’s still on the board? i see him becoming a deandre jordan, would be nice backcourt in two years if we keep josh and put al at 4 and jeremy tyler can develop into our C
Astro Joe
June 22nd, 2011
4:58 pm
Sund may use Dallas’ championship to start hyping continuity for the sacred core. Meanwhile, that core went through 3 head coaches and eventually learned how to defend. LDhas talked extensively about defense but if Sund/ASG really understaood the value of defense, one would think they would have hired someone with a “defensive coordinator” background. It all stays dysfunctional with this franchise.
Meanwhile, Nolan Smith will be the steal at the end of the 1st round/beginning of the 2nd round. He will fit nicely with a title contender.
IMO, Orlando only wants Josh to motivate Howard to stay. If they thought RandMo or Jarvaris Crit could do the same, they would likely go after them, too.
JoJo the Godfather
June 22nd, 2011
5:08 pm
Dump Joe and Marvin!!!
Cleveland gets Joe Johnson and Marvin Williams.
Detroit gets Antawn Jamison.
Atlanta gets Rip Hamilton, Ben Wallace, Ramon Sessions, and picks 32 and 33.
Rip and Ben help recruit free agent Prince.
Hawks maneuver picks to select center Vucevic from USC.
Teague / Hinrich
Hamilton / Sy
Smith / Prince
Horford / Rolle
Wallace / Pachulia / Vucevic
ctrim
June 22nd, 2011
5:19 pm
Imagine if Josh’s game solely revolved around passing, dunks, shots in the paint, and blocked shots. No dribbling, jumpers or whining. If he would just play within his strengths we wouldn’t be talking about trading him.
KevinM
June 22nd, 2011
5:49 pm
Saw Jason Terry on Cowherd this am and a total winner in my book! He is a kid in the candy shop being the NBA champ! He says he’s getting a ring no matter what Cuban says.
He also is auctioning his shoe from Games 5 & 6 of the Finals for charity….https://www.biddingforgood.com/auction/AuctionHome.action?auctionId=137120809
Jason Terry has had quite a year!
Dept. Of Unintended Irony
June 22nd, 2011
5:51 pm
“Are there any teams calling Randy Sund for him?..”
Are you calling Sund “randy”? In the British way? And how do you know? Wait, take that back. I don’t want to know. Eeewwww.
KevinM
June 22nd, 2011
5:53 pm
it was not a bad pick….no matter what Thibs says, he doesn’t have a underachieving Marvin on his roster. The truth is:
Marvin is not the answer! He isn’t supposed to be the 5th option on this team! He was supposed to be the 5th option at an all-star game!
If you’re picked #2 and especially after working out all the top players in the league, you’re not supposed to make that mistake. If he goes somewhere and performs better, oh well…..we have seen enough of his abilities here.
jason
June 22nd, 2011
6:24 pm
DO U GUYS BELIEVE THIS FROM REALGM.COM????
The sports RX with Shot doctor and David Buffa have saidfrom multiple sources including RealGM that that magic, hawks, and Blazers havecompleted a 3 team trade that is all but announced. They said it will beannounced on draft night tomorrow. The trade deal is:
Orlando gets Josh Smith, Kirk Hinrich
Atlanta gets Ryan Anderson, Andre Miller Chris Duhon, Marcus Camby
Portland gets Jameer Nelson, Daniel Orton
jason
June 22nd, 2011
6:25 pm
SMH !!!!!!!!! THIS IS EVEN WORSE THAN THE PROPOSED TRADE!!!! :’(
Fundamentals
June 22nd, 2011
6:32 pm
Definitely liked the Dallas Orlando option better, but I still don’t see moving Smoove for that is the answer.
Though it is sad his unhappiness shows he’s not mature, he’s not a leader and maybe we should shop him.
Grow up and be a leader. This team desperately needs one.
jason
June 22nd, 2011
6:43 pm
Thats a whole bunch of BS if that trade actually goes down. I know Sund isn’t that dumb.
Section 303
June 22nd, 2011
6:48 pm
jason, are you bullsh#tting us? I actually like that deal, except I like Hinrich and don’t want to give him up. Without looking, I would have to think that Miller’s and Camby’s contracts would be off the books after next season? That would be nice. Hawks have to start clearing space to make moves.
Josh going to Orlando doesn’t scare me. Not my first choice, but the guy is a headcase. He will continue to have the same troubles in Orlando, if not moreso. Van Gundy won’t take his sh#t. Could be fireworks between the two of them.
Grandmaster JeJe
June 22nd, 2011
6:51 pm
LOL @ Big Ray claiming LD is not in a lame duck year.
He has 1 year left
ASG gave Sund 1 more year
You do the math
jason
June 22nd, 2011
6:51 pm
@ Section 303
NOOOOO I AM NOT. SEEING IT FROM REALGM.COM, I certainly hope its not true.
Grandmaster JeJe
June 22nd, 2011
6:53 pm
IF SMOOVE IS TRADED, I BET U ALL HORFORD WILL SUBLIMINALLY CALL HIM OUT DURING TRAINING CAMP, TALKING ABOUT HOW THE MORALE AROUND THE TEAM IS MUCH BETTER
I GUARANTEE ANYONE HERE HORFORD WOULD LOVE TO SEE SMOOVE GO
jason
June 22nd, 2011
6:54 pm
I know sund isnt that dumb so i think that trade is as fake as that fake twitter post by nbasource1
joey1
June 22nd, 2011
6:54 pm
jason,, that would not be a good trade we need to dump marvin plus 2nd round pick to get a mid 1st round pick then sign thad young for the sm position then do a trade for a center but not josh al horford in the trade
jason
June 22nd, 2011
6:55 pm
@ JeJe
WE ARENT GETTING ANY VALUE IN RETURN THATS THE THING IM SCARED ABOUT IF THIS TRADE GOES DOWN.
jason
June 22nd, 2011
6:57 pm
@joey1
Your making no sense…. and yea everyone knows it’s the worst trade in nba history.
JoJo the Godfather
June 22nd, 2011
7:02 pm
Salaries don’t work. If Marvin goes to Portland though, they should.
Wink
June 22nd, 2011
7:03 pm
The real GM trade means we will have a line up of:
Joe Money, Teague?, Mavin, Horford, Camby as our starters
Miller, Pachulia,Anderson, Rolle, Duhon, as primary backups
Sy & Twin & number #48( who gets sent overseas, NBDL, or sold for cash)
hmmm, and Josh stays in our division to play with Howard…sounds like an ASG deal to me. Now we really got nothing for letting JC2,Bibby,Mo, & this year’s 1st go down the drain. We got fleeced and looks like we would get fleeced again if this goes down.
But it is change…..nickels, dimes, pennies!
Najeh Davenpoop
June 22nd, 2011
7:05 pm
My biggest problem with that ATL-POR-ORL three way trade is that the Hawks would be acquiring yet another over the hill veteran point guard to take minutes away from Teague. There is absolutely no excuse for Teague not to be starting next season.
I still haven’t seen a Smoove trade proposal I like. If he goes to Orlando — or really any team with a good coach — he is going to be better than he ever was here. I am not a fan of this line of reasoning that he will never reach his potential here so the Hawks should let him go. If the Hawks’ coaching and management is pathetic enough that they can’t get everything they can out of him, they need new coaching and management, not new players.
jason
June 22nd, 2011
7:07 pm
just doesnt seem right…
Najeh Davenpoop
June 22nd, 2011
7:08 pm
Smoove for Rudy Gay (who supposedly is on the trading block) is a much better trade than anything else I have seen so far. And Memphis is after all the team that signed him to an offer sheet a couple of years ago.
jason
June 22nd, 2011
7:09 pm
@Najeh
Tried that trade on espn trade machine and it said it wouldn’t work…
ryan
June 22nd, 2011
7:10 pm
I think this all rumors there always a lot of chatter on the eve of the draft i don’t see this happening .
JoJo the Godfather
June 22nd, 2011
7:13 pm
You have to remember that Miller’s option can be turned down and save us some salary. I have no use for Duhon though. Take Duhon out. Give me Redick, some draft picks, and the rights to Fran Vasquez, and then maybe if Portland takes Marvin.
Najeh Davenpoop
June 22nd, 2011
7:15 pm
Joe and Al (or Joe and Smoove) for Dwight and Arenas would still make the Hawks better in the short term and long term than any of these Smoove trades.
bigdave
June 22nd, 2011
7:17 pm
please… Josh Smith should die a Hawk.
Grandmaster JeJe
June 22nd, 2011
7:18 pm
ANY TRADE INVOLVING SMOOVE AND JAMEER WOULD BE IDIOTIC. HE HAS 2 YEARS LEFT AND WE HAVE TEAGUE
Grandmaster JeJe
June 22nd, 2011
7:19 pm
SUND HASN’T TRADED ONE TRUE CORE PLAYER DURING HIS “ERA” HERE.
CAN SOMEONE PLEASE EXPLAIN SMOOVE’S 4M TRADE KICKER?
FIRE SUND
tony
June 22nd, 2011
7:30 pm
If Nikola Vucevic-C, JaJuan Johnson-F/C, James Jenkins-PG, Shelvin Mack-PG and Keith Benson-C are all off the board we should take Bojan Bogdanovic-SG. He will be a nice addition if JC doesn’t resign.
THE SLEEPER>>> http://youtu.be/G4HoxQshshQ
Man Man
June 22nd, 2011
7:32 pm
Josh Smith is going to do the Michael Vick to this city man.He is going to go somewhere and thrive and a coach is going to take his talents to a next level and he will be humble and motivated because the miserable hawks traded him.
This is the trade you should want
June 22nd, 2011
7:33 pm
San Antonio sends PG Tony Parker, SF Richard Jefferson and PF/C Matt Bonner to the Atlanta Hawks for PF Al Horford, PF Jeff Teague and SF/PF Marvin Williams. Parker’s ability to crash the hole leaves shot attempts for players like Joe Johnson and Hinrich (also Bonner). Smith is allowed to feed off of Parker’s efforts because Parker will command a double team with his penetration. Joe Johnson now has the luxury of one on one defense.
Richard Jefferson has always been an above the rim trash guy.
The Spurs get a guy who can hit the corner jumper they treasure so much (Williams) as well as a strong defender, Jeff Teague is cheap and athletic – two traits that can help Popovich decide which guard will be better for his offense: Teague or George Hill. Finally, I’m in San Antonio and they have said any trade that includes Jefferson is a good trade, even one involving Parker. The fans here are 50-50 on the trade, mainly because they wonder if the trade means they are not contenders for the championship. I think Horford’s value says they are championship contenders. A potential win-win for each organization.
Grandmaster JeJe
June 22nd, 2011
7:34 pm
CAN’T WE JUST DO MARVIN FOR HAYWOOD STRAIGHT UP? PLEASEEEEEE. NO WAY IT HELPS DALLAS IF THEY RESIGN CARON
DAMNIT WE DONT EVEN NEED R ODRIQUE
JUST GET US HAYWOOD. THE GUY IS A STARTER
jason
June 22nd, 2011
7:46 pm
Marvin for Heywood…. Hell Yeah!
jason
June 22nd, 2011
7:46 pm
Hawks need to trade to get in the lottery..
terrell
June 22nd, 2011
7:49 pm
Heard Denver is interested in Smoove
How bout
Josh, Marvin, 2nd rdr
for
Nene, Wilson Chandler, filler
Teague/Joe/Chandler/Al/Nene
terrell
June 22nd, 2011
7:53 pm
Vol, why would Minnesota want Josh? They’ve got Love at pf. Unless they plan on moving him to sf? Then they’d have to move Beasley.
terrell
June 22nd, 2011
8:02 pm
Najeh, that was before they signed ZBo.
Buddy Grizzard
June 22nd, 2011
8:09 pm
ASG please don’t trade J-BALLS. Trade that gutless, nutless wonder Joe Johnson who has the second worst shooting percentage among active players in close-out playoff games.
Grandmaster JeJe
June 22nd, 2011
8:14 pm
Trade that gutless, nutless wonder Joe Johnson who has the second worst shooting percentage among active players in close-out playoff games
^^Damn I thought he had the worst. Who is worst? LBJ?
Buddy Grizzard
June 22nd, 2011
8:29 pm
Jason Williams I think.
Grandmaster JeJe
June 22nd, 2011
8:34 pm
MC says Horford has superstar potential.
Horford had 7 & 4 in our game 6 loss to Chicago (he played 37 minutes)
yodaddy
June 22nd, 2011
8:35 pm
” DON’T TRADE JOSH WITHIN THE SAME DIVISION!! JOSH FOR WES JOHNSON AND THE #2 PICK TO DRAFT DERRICK WILLIAMS!! LEH GO!”
I actually wouldn’t be opposed to this trade. Actually this is the only thing I’ve heard in the past 3 years regarding trading Josh Smith that makes any sense whatsoever.
What I really love is the #2 Pick and Michael Beasley. Beasley is a scoring machine and the Hawks will feel comfortable letting Jamal walk.
Use the #2 pick on ENES KANTER to play center. Even though I’m not up on the “hawks need a center now!” that would be too good to pass up.
Slide Horford to the 4….Beasley at the 3 with Joe Johnson and Teague and my friends the Hawks have done something significant..
Draft a decent player…sign 2 or 3 key defensive minded free agents….trade Marvin (yeah right) and the Hawks may actually have some intrigue.
Grandmaster JeJe
June 22nd, 2011
8:35 pm
The person who guarded Horford for much of the series was a notoriously awful 6″8 defender with turf toe