Atlanta Hawks: Video: Looking ahead
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276 comments Add your comment
vava74
May 19th, 2011
6:50 am
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/splits/_/id/3213/al-horford
KevinM
May 19th, 2011
7:01 am
All stars should compete like all-stars no matter the situation.
Very rarely do you see mediocre numbers from all-stars game after game.
All opponents have to do against us is stop Joe Johnson. He is our driver, and it was so obvious in this year’s playoffs. He attempts so many tough shots, there is no way he can consistently succeed. Deng had him perplexed as much as you will ever see Joe frustrated.
Going forward, Al and Josh cannot carry this team on the inside. These 2 cannot patrol the inside well enough. Personally Al vs Noah seemed like a no-brainer to me, but that didn’t take place…why? Al doesn’t want to deal with the energy Noah brings? Al vs. Boozer? Al doesn’t do perimeter defense well enough.
I am going to seperate it this way; either Joe and Al lead us or we rebuild around Josh and get he and Teague help. We just don’t go forward with those 3 and their salaries will impact the rest of the roster way too severely. Time to bring in MLE guys who are bigger contributors.
All 3 captains still have value in the league; the question is which brings back the biggest benefit?
Sund asks: What’s a MLE? Billy Knight never told me about that option!
O'Brien
May 19th, 2011
7:54 am
I think the Hawks will have to choose between Josh and Al. Next season, we are over the cap already, and have ~$3 mil to fill 4-6 roster slots (assuming we dont go over the luxury tax). Therefore, the best way to improve this team is via trade.
We would like to trade Marvin, but imo, nobody wants him (unless we are taking back another bad contract). With 5 years, $107 mil left, JJ (imo) is almost untradeable (unless we take back another bad contract, or trade him to NJ or Minny and not get equal value in return).
That leaves Josh and Al as our most valuable trade chips. And since they both want to play on the perimeter, I think a change down low is needed. I think ASG should trade one of them (whichever brings the most returns).
If they are unable to find good value for them, here is a thought. If LD can get Josh to cut down on his jumpers, what about starting a front court of Josh/Al/ZaZa? ZaZa tends to play better with extended minutes, and he is willing to bang down low (although his defense is soft at times).
Hank Aaron
May 19th, 2011
8:13 am
@Sautee — re. Allstar selections/All NBA honors
Basketball is won/lost on the court. Not in the opinions of others. This isn’t figure skating.
terrell
May 19th, 2011
8:39 am
HEAT in 6.
MAVS in 5.
terrell
May 19th, 2011
8:50 am
The draftt has always been fixed. Ever since NY got Ewing. Doesnt really matter one way or another imo. Gotta get the fans excited if you want to make $. After all, that’s what it’s all about. Cleveland got shafted by Lebron. Everybody and their Mama shoulda known they’d get #1 next year. Btw, still gotta get it right. Theirs a ton of #1’s, 2’s, and 3’s, who’ve been busts.(Marvin) Or just havent been as good as expected(Al).
KevinM
May 19th, 2011
9:04 am
OB, I disagree JJ is untraceable. Arenas was tradable, anyone is tradable. Willow get an all-star in return? Probably not. I will say he is a key to return more pieces.
Al is at a peak for value IMO. He has a very fair contract.
It jus depends on what is more valuable to get in return. We lose Joe, we lose our main scoring threat. I think if we are looking to contend now, we determine how much Al or Josh can bring us in return.
We need energy off the bench for a scoring punch and we need a defensive big man with some offense. It would be up to Josh and Joe to get us our points when needed most.
Now OB, when you say cut down on Josh’s love for jump shots, do you know he shot 154 3 pointers versus ZERO a year earlier. We have to getmhim off the perimeter period or move him.
I would take a Aldridge for Al/Josh if we can’t get a top draft pick, but that doesn’t fix our need for a bigger defensive presence.
Rick Sund should earn his paycheck this year if he truly wants a contender. The window is not closing yet, and this roster probably has 2-3 years left in it to battle for 2nd tier status.
We just aren’t build for the playoff we have to get through, and I don’t think home court has anything to do with it.
Joe needs to be produce more this year if we don’t make any major moves. Marvin can then get his number of shots back to try and prove himself one more time.
Havent we been down this road before?
joey1
May 19th, 2011
9:36 am
hawk owner are a joke.. they just have money and are too cheap to go into luxury tax to actually make a team that can compete for championships… the hawks have been a top 8 the last 3 years we need a center and to trade marvin williams then this team will succeed..
imagine trading marvin williams and horford for andrew bogut, then sign free agent al thorton to small forward..
starting lineup teague,joe johnson, al thorton, josh smith, andrew bogut
KevinM
May 19th, 2011
9:58 am
Untraceable s/b untradeable…..
JeJe
May 19th, 2011
9:59 am
JAMAL’S ONE RESPONSIBILITY ON THIS TEAM IS TO SCORE THE BASKETBALL AND HE HAD A BAD CHICAGO SERIES
DO NOT RESIGN A ONE-DIMENSIONAL PLAYER WHO CHOKES AGAINST GREAT DEFENSE
O'Brien
May 19th, 2011
9:59 am
KevinM,
imo, JJ is tradeable, if a) We take back another bad contract (like Arenas for Rashard Lewis) or b) If we don’t get equal value in return (like JJ to NJ for Morrrow, filler, and pick).
If we start Teague/Hinrich/JJ, that gives us good defense on the perimeter, so maybe we can get away with starting ZaZa at Center. At PF, we would have Al or Josh (depending on who we trade). And the pieces we get after trading Josh or Al would (hopefully) dramatically upgrade our bench.
JeJe
May 19th, 2011
10:01 am
JAMAL FAILED TO REACH DOUBLE FIGURES 3 OUT OF THE 6 CHICAGO GAMES. 2 OF THE GAMES HE SCORED 11 AND 12 POINTS. I BLAME THIS ON LD FOR NOT MAKING OFFENSIVE ADJUSTMENTS AS WELL AS JAMAL FOR TAKING WILD SHOTS
FIRE LD
KevinM
May 19th, 2011
11:55 am
If we have to make a sacrifice, I lean towards moving captains Al or Josh. Would you be surprised if Sund is intent on keeping Al since he just signed him to a long-term deal?
A move has to be made other than just allowing Jamal to walk. Since the FA period is going to be non-existant until the CBA is resolved, Jamal may be left hanging out there much longer than he wants. This group would shock me if they signed him this late in the process.
I expect very few moves until this CBA is agreed upon.
BILLY KNIGHT
May 19th, 2011
12:55 pm
KevinM the hawks need keep both player Josh, Horford but they need a center.
drmaryb (*_-)
May 19th, 2011
12:58 pm
Move It!
“I expect very few moves until this CBA is agreed upon.”
____________________
Try, none.
BILLY KNIGHT
May 19th, 2011
1:10 pm
A list of centers in free agent market
1.Kwame Brown
2.Tyson Chandler
3.Nene Hilario
4.Yao Ming
5.Samuel Dalembert
6.Kyrylo Fresenko
BILLY KNIGHT
May 19th, 2011
1:12 pm
Kyrylo Fresenko Could be the hawks best option, Kyrylo 7′1 280pounds and is only age 24 from Russia.
BILLY KNIGHT
May 19th, 2011
1:19 pm
Starte Teague, Joe, Josh, Horford, Kyrylo
Bench Hinrich, Damien, Marvin, Wilcox, Zaza
BILLY KNIGHT
May 19th, 2011
1:21 pm
Two free agent the Hawks can sign Chris Wilcox, Kyrylo Fresenko.
JudasOverstreet
May 19th, 2011
1:56 pm
Many fans out there are WONDERING how exactly did the Hawks ADVANCE PAST THE MAGIC when in year past, particularly last year we got CLOBBERED BY THE MAGIC. A lot of folks speculate, but i say that its BELIEF and BELIEF IN YOURSELVES. The Hawks felt that they were the dominant team over the Magic. The Hawks dominated them during the regular season so they felt the matchups were favorable in their favor and that they could exploit the magic and beat them. If you believe something in your mind, that belief will TRANSFORM ITSELF ONTO THE COURT. Pure and simple thats it. When the Hawks began the series with the Bulls, the Hawks were high on belief. The Hawks went up 1-0, eventually tied the series at 2-2, and I think when the Bulls went ahead 3-2, it shattered the fragile belief of the Hawks and it appears to me that the Hawks quit after that. The Hawks never truly believed again that they could get back into the series and beat the Bulls. Of course, they said all the right things, but the body language of the Hawks and the sloppy play with all the turnovers and lathargic play indicated to me that of a DEFEATED CLUB. In reality, the Hawks have better athletes than the Bulls and better personnel. Its just that the Bulls are coached better and thats why we were unable to beat them. If the Hawks could have sustained the belief over the Bulls for just a couple more games, the Hawks would have prevailed in the end. Next year, I hope the Hawks know that they could #1:beat ANYONE in the league and #2:make it to both the ECF and the Finals. Hopefully the Hawks will believe as much because that much is true. When the Hawks are clicking on all cylinders AND everyone on the team is playing up to their potential, the Hawks are one of the ELITE teams in the league, capable of winning a championship. ITS THAT SIMPLE.
terrell
May 19th, 2011
2:51 pm
” I’d take Aldridge for Josh or Al.” lol. Who wouldn’t??
terrell
May 19th, 2011
3:00 pm
How exactly did the Hawks advance past the magic you ask? First of all, the Magic traded away both of their Hawks killas. Next, Horford cant guard Dwight, but Collins can. Finally, starting Collins at center moved Marvin to the bench. SIMPLE.
Al Horford is a tweener
May 19th, 2011
3:01 pm
” I’d take Aldridge for Josh or Al.” lol. Who wouldn’t??
Lamarcus Aldridge is a taller version of Al Jefferson. His defense is probably better at center but is still pretty bad. No thanks.
Bogut+Sanders+Gooden+Salmons for Horford+Williams+Hinrich.
We get 3 bigs; a DPOY type center, a 3 sot blocks per 36 minutes PF who may become a 2 way player with 10 more pounds and a backup in Gooden who is like a 30 yo Taj Gibson.
Salmons can play big point guard next to Joe and punish Rose in the post/iso and draw fouls.
Hopefully we can package Pape Sy and the late second round for Semih Erden.
Sign Al Thornton.
terrell
May 19th, 2011
3:16 pm
If Joe(Roy) went down, do you think Al or Josh could lead us to a top 5 seed out West? I dont.
terrell
May 19th, 2011
3:18 pm
Sorry. I meant a top 6 seed. I still dont.
bigdave
May 19th, 2011
3:20 pm
how much money will Wilson Chandler demand on the market?
terrell
May 19th, 2011
3:23 pm
Nope. But Aldridge he has HEART. Something Al seems to be lacking, as of late..
bigdave
May 19th, 2011
3:24 pm
*would a Wilson Chandler
he’s my prized free agent acquisition.. gritty player. can give you a lot on the offensive end; mid range, 3 ball, post up. plays off the ball well, slashes and finishes. not to mention the ability to guard to successful defend sg,sf, and pf positions.
Grandad
May 19th, 2011
3:24 pm
So Al is soft and all of a sudden Aldridge is a tough guy ?
bigdave
May 19th, 2011
3:26 pm
oh my..
*ability to successfully defend 3 positions..
bigdave
May 19th, 2011
3:28 pm
ha.. scratch that.
pipe dream
dude is going to simply going to demand top dollar as he’s pretty much the best swing man available.. not to mention 23.. oh my Marvin you are trash.
bigdave
May 19th, 2011
3:29 pm
wouldnt surprise me if he ended up at the crib in Chicago and started @ the 2 ..
the way he defends, would fit right in..
Sautee
May 19th, 2011
3:31 pm
Hank Aaron,
about this: “@Sautee — re. Allstar selections/All NBA honors
Basketball is won/lost on the court. Not in the opinions of others. This isn’t figure skating.”
Clever retort, but it’s not at all logical. DHoward lost in the first round. Kobe lost in second round just like Al.
Does that mean they are not worthy of All-NBA? LMFAO!
As I said in my earlier post, believe what you will. It’s my opinion that those honors were not fabricated, but earned. Al certainly did NOTHING in the last quarter of the season and the playoffs to show he was worth those honors, but he earned them nonetheless with his overall play. I do agree with vava that if the voting were taken today the results would likely be different.
But if those honors are so worthless, why does the league put so much stock in them? If winning is everything, then why not just name all the players on the Finals winners as All-NBA?
Daniel
May 19th, 2011
3:33 pm
This is going to be a very interesting off season for the Hawks. We don’t have a CBA, the team might be sold and we need to infuse this team with talent. We can pretty much expect nothing until both a new CBA is reached and the ASG sales the Thrashers (and the Hawks?).
I would offer the opinion that the Hawks have had pretty decent success of late, but the real short coming (besides Marvin/Sheldon picks) has been overvaluing our own talent. see Marvin/Joe contracts. Therefore, NO WAY do you resign Jamaal Crawford to anything more than a MLE (I actually doubt that he will get a much bigger offer somewhere, unless maybe NY again?)
Also, you have to trade Josh Smith, after that last 3 games his value is as high as it will be for quite awhile. We have to risk it moving forward. Would Golden State be willing to part with Steph Curry?
Daniel
May 19th, 2011
3:36 pm
Sautee: to back up your argument. If you just looked at the last series, casual fans would say that Josh Smith is more valuable to the Hawks than Al Horford, but those that really follow this team know that Al has a higher value than what is easily seen, while Josh’s value is less than what is easily seen.
JeJe
May 19th, 2011
3:36 pm
I’m leaving the country for 10 days.
FIRE LD
JeJe
May 19th, 2011
3:37 pm
BUY OUT MARVIN’S CONTRACT
WORST PLAYER IN THE NBA
JeJe
May 19th, 2011
3:41 pm
Pape Sy showed more promise in the final 2 minutes of the ECF, than Marvin did the entire series
DinasaurFenton
May 19th, 2011
3:42 pm
THE MAGIC USED TO KILL THE HAWKS WHEN THEY HAD JEFF PEITRUS AND RASHAD LEWIS AS 3-POINT SHOOTERS. THOSE WERE TWO OF THE MOST DEADLY 3-POINT SHOOTERS THE LEAGUE HAS EVER SEEN. Proof? those 2 guys helped the Magic reach the finals two years ago against the Lakers. The Magic even could have beaten the Lakers because Orlando was up 2-1 in that series. All the Magic had to do was win game 4 and they would have won the NBA Finals. Instead, you all know the story.. The Lakers won 3 straight games to win the series 4-2 and give Phil Jackson the first of two straight titles. EVERYONE KNOWS IN THE FINALS YOU DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO TO GO UP 3-1. ONCE YOU GO UP 3-1 THEN HISTORY IS ON YOUR SIDE. 100% OF THE TEAMS WHO HAVE GONE UP 3-1 IN THE FINALS HAVE GONE ON TO WIN THE NBA TITLE. MY POINT OF THIS STORY IS THAT RASHAD LEWIS AND JEFF PEITRUS MADE THE MAGIC A “FEARED” TEAM AROUND THE LEAGUE. Without those 2 deadly 3-point shooters, the Magic are know a bunch of “CHUMPS” who can be beaten by, you guessed it, THE LOWLY ATLANTA HAWKS. THE MAGIC MANAGEMENT TEAM SHOULD ALL BE FIRED FOR RUINING A CHAMPIONSHIP QUALITY MAGIC TEAM.
ButcherStevenson
May 19th, 2011
3:56 pm
We dont want Ron Artest for Marvin Williams. Ron Artest is a WALKING TIME BOMB ready to explode at a moments notice. You all remember when Artest was with the Indiana Pacers, in a game against the Detroit Pistons, Artest exploded and went after a fan in the stands because that fan accidentally spilled WATER on Artest. Artest got so hot he exploded and the only thing that cooled him off was a 60 game suspension. TO PROVE ARTEST DIDNT LEARN HIS LESSION FROM THAT INCIDENT, Artest grabbed JJ Berrea around the neck and collared him in game 3 in the playoffs THIS YEAR right before the Lakers were eliminated in the playoffs. ARTEST IS HUMAN WASTE AND WE DONT NEED THAT HEADCASE ON OUR SQUAD WHEN WE ARE THIS CLOSE TO WINNING A CHAMPIONSHIP.
Sautee
May 19th, 2011
4:03 pm
Daniel,
If Horford had played well in the playoffs, this wouldn’t even be fodder for discussion. Fan is short for fanatic, and we have lots of those here (including me). Some fans are much more emotional and reactionary than others. Some of those are the ones who LOVED Al after the first Chicago game in the reg. season, and despise him now. Go figure.
As I’ve said before, no one ever said that fanhood was logical.
I get it. Their feelings are hurt. Poor dears. They want Al to be tougher, when they can’t be. Where’s Department of Unintended Irony when we need him?
Daniel
May 19th, 2011
4:16 pm
Sautee- I can’t blame them because I am one too. This team drives us fans crazy. It is sooooo difficult to accurately read them. We all suffer from what I call “the highlight syndrome”. I mean I have found myself agreeing with JEJE sometimes so you know I have lost my mind.
Rod from College Park
May 19th, 2011
4:17 pm
Grandad,
“So Al is soft and all of a sudden Aldridge is a tough guy ?”
This year yes. It depends on your definition of tough. If carrying your team for most of the season, and stepping up battling guys in the post an getting yours in the playoffs makes you tough Aldridge would be that guy.
If shooting all jumpers, and never wanting to guard anybody bigger than him is not soft, I don’t know what is. Aldrige is much better than Josh or Al, but Josh is much more versatile than Aldrige, and he is a better post defender. Al is not better in any facet of the game. I really am starting to see a big comparison in Al and David Lee.
LarryNance
May 19th, 2011
4:25 pm
Al Horford is SOFTER THAN TISSUE PAPER. I cant believe how many times that guy got the ball in his sweet spot (shooting range of 15′ and in) and every time the ball touched Horford’s hand, he kept looking to the left and right and didnt know who to pass the ball to instead of just drilling the ball home into the basket. AL HORFORD FORGOT THAT HE IS A 64% SHOOTER FROM THE FIELD. Had Al shot every single time the ball came to him, the Hawks would have blitzed the Chicago Bulls by 30 points each game and swept them out of the playoffs. Al go home for the summer look in the mirror and I hope that mirror cracks. You are softer than charman bath tissue.
Sautee
May 19th, 2011
4:36 pm
vava,
Allow me to punch holes in this argument regarding Al:
You said: “Even during the regular season he has been showing signs of softness, often shying away from contact against the most physical players in the league.”
“Just go and check his season splits and you will see that.”
“For instance, against:
“DET’s old man Ben Wallace his rebounding average in 4 games (37.8 minutes per) was only 8.5″
OK vava, I’ll show you in just this example, though it would apply to all of them. And some you mentioned had Al rebounding higher that 8.5 per game.
Al averaged 9.3 rebounds per game in the regular season. Had he kept his average for the 4 games, he would have snagged 37.2 rebounds. His “paltry” 8.5 average netted him 34 rebounds.
So because he got 3 fewer rebounds over 4 games, he’s suddenly soft and avoiding contact? Hell, in a sample size that small, that could be just from the Pistons hitting a higher amount of second free throw attempts, which would give him fewer opportunities. I’m not arguing that he didn’t play soft at times this year. I just don’t think those splits you mentioned proved it.
I understand your frustration. Just don’t try to reach to prove he’s soft when the numbers don’t add up. And those numbers proved nothing.
Think about this: Even the 8.5 average that you disparaged as soft was more than “tough guy” Nene averaged for the season.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 19th, 2011
4:39 pm
Why the hell do people on here complain about perimeter D and softness and then turn around and advocate trading the team’s best overall defender for Steph Curry? Makes no sense to me especially since the Hawks already have a very capable young point guard who is as good or better than Curry at everything except shooting.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 19th, 2011
4:43 pm
Chris Bosh is as soft as tissue paper and averaged nearly 11 boards per game last year. Just sayin’. I don’t see how rebounds per game suddenly became a fool proof metric for toughness.
Sautee
May 19th, 2011
4:49 pm
Najeh,
Bingo!
terrell
May 19th, 2011
4:49 pm
I liked the Woody Josh and the Woody Al a whole lot better than I like the LD Josh and the LD Al. BUT AT LEAST JOSH SHOWS UP IN THE PLAYOFFS YEAR AFTER YEAR. Al played like this was his 1st year in the post season. Never played like that under Woodson. Who knows, maybe if Woody plays Collins last year vs Orlando instead of continually trottin out sorry azz Marvin………………………. Albeit Collins was a TAD out of shape, and Orlando was better, but still. All I know is, LD has turned our inside guys into softies. Especially Al.
terrell
May 19th, 2011
4:50 pm
Woody was bad, but LD is worse.