Atlanta Hawks at Warriors: The new guys, plus Rick Sund
San Francisco–Caught up with the Hawks here this morning (tip: never, ever drive in this city) before heading to Oaktown. Here are some quick notes, followed by a Rick Sund Q and A,. . .
- L.D. said Teague will start again tonight along with J.J., Marvin, Josh and Al. Hinrich will play, too. Hinrich and Armstrong met the team here last night. Drew said they put some tape down in the ballroom at the hotel and gave the players a crash course on the team’s concepts.
- Drew expects Hinrich and Teague to push the Hawks to play faster: “We definitely have got to get the ball in to both guys’ hands. I thought Jeff did a good job in Phoenix of keeping the pressure on the defense and pushing it. Kirk has the same ability. He’s not as fast as Jeff but he still pushes the ball at a pace that forces other guys to keep up.”
- Based on his initial impressions of Atlanta’s offense, Hinrich likes what he sees: “We have good players. Just put them in the right positions and play together, and we will be all right. I think the stuff we are going to do fits me and fits our team. The ball moves a lot. We’ve got good players who command double teams. It’s a team system and I’m excited to be a part of it.”
- Drew on Armstrong: “I want a physicality when he’s on the floor. I want defensive rebounding. I want him to be athletic when he’s on the floor.”
- Armstrong: “I just have to be aggressive. I can definitely help the team out with that. Play solid defense, talk, get up and be aggressive and hit the boards. Try to play my game and don’t do anything out of character.”
- Both players said they are happy to leave a loser and join a playoff squad.
Now on to the interview with Sund:
Q. Before the deadline, you said you would only make trades that improve the team and wouldn’t make any lateral moves. In your view, how did this trade make the team better?
“Larry wanted to upgrade the point guard position, particularly defensively, and still try to be able to maintain the shooting that we had with Bibby’s presence out there. We looked at this deal and thought it made some sense. It was tough to let Jordan go in particular. I don’t mind so much the draft pick but we really like Jordan. He’s got a huge upside. It was difficult to get him minutes this year. He’s going to have a fine career. But at the end of the day, like with most teams in transition, you have got to give up a draft pick and/or young player to whet their appetite. So that’s what we did.”
Q. By trading Jordan and your first-round pick in 2011, does it signal a win-now approach as opposed to developing players for the future?
“We also have a pretty young team. We’ve got three starters that started opening night at 24. You still have Jeff in a backup capacity, where he should be a senior in college. He’s young. Then you’ve got a couple of players that are in their prime. Joe is in his prime, and so is Jamal and certainly Hinrich is in his prime. You look at the two teams in the championship last year in final game, of the 10 starters nine where in their 30s.”
Q. How much did uncertainty of labor situation affect your approach to making deals?
“Not a lot because nobody knows what the rules are going to be. To be very honest with you I was really surprised there were as many trades as there were. Somebody mentioned that since the season started there have been 24 trades of various sorts that you would consider semi-significant. You have the big trades like Carmelo; Deron was a huge trade. And there there were other semi-significant trades. That seems like a lot compared to other years. And I thought there wasn’t going to be a lot of trades.”
Q. Now that the smoke has cleared, how do you think your team stacks up in the East?
“We have to see it out. All year we have been basically playing for the fifth, fourth and third hole. And of those three teams, everybody goes through their highs and lows. We have had some highs–January in particular was a good month–and now we are in a slump. Miami had some slumps and then they went on a huge streak, and then they went back to a slump. Chicago seems to be like us last year. They are great at home and they are .500 on the road and so they are sort of where we were at this point last year going forward. You’ve got Boston who have an NBA championship and has three players who are headed to the Hall of Fame. Miami has got two players that have been battling for MVP of the league and three players who have made the All-Pro. Orlando has an MVP candidate this year in Dwight. And you have Chicago who has an MVP this year in Derrick Rose. And then you have Atlanta that has two players that made the All-Star team. I thought it was ironic in LA they interviewed Kobe and he said, ‘Well, I feel like I am playing Boston, Miami and Atlanta [because nine East All-Stars are from those teams]. Also the Knicks are going to be no picnic if you have to play them and Philly can surprise you. It’s up to the players now, I think, on all of the teams. March and April are the home stretch and it’s up to the players and how they are going to respond to it and how they are going to respond in the playoffs. It’s a challenge for us, certainly. It’s as challenge and an opportunity at the same time.”
Deep thoughts
At last check, the (completely unscientific) blog poll asking whether this trade was good or bad for the Hawks was running about 50-50. I haven’t looked at all of your 1,600 or so comments from the last couple of days (thanks much for reading, blog people) but I think I can take a decent stab at the reasoning of the differing perspectives.
I’m guessing most in the “good” camp like the trade because they think the team is better now. Hinrich is a better player than Bibby. He’s a better defender, comparable shooter and should be able to diversify the offense by running pick-and-rolls. JC2 could become a good player but he’s not part of the plans now so off he goes.
I’m guessing most of those in the “bad” camp don’t like the trade because, even if it makes the team better now, it doesn’t improve the Hawks enough to give them a good chance at beating the elite teams in the playoffs. So why make a deal like this while sending away a young player and a pick, sacrificing the future while doubling down on this “core” group that may not take the Hawks where they want to go?
I think the views in both camps are reasonable. I also know that we can’t see the future. The Hawks should be better with Hinrich instead of Bibby, both from tangible and intangible standpoints. I understand if you don’t believe they will be good enough, but let’s see what happens.
Sund said declined to comment on trade scenarios that didn’t happen, including whether he tried to get in on any of the major deals by dangling any players from Atlanta’s “core” group. From what I’m hearing the Hawks did try to get in on some of those discussions but didn’t get very far.
If you are upset the Hawks couldn’t make a splashier deal then realize it takes assets like expiring contracts, productive players with reasonable contracts, young players with potential and draft picks. The Hawks don’t have much of any of those because of decisions made in the past, so those should be the focus of your ire if you don’t like this trade. I can’t speak accurately on what deals they may or may not have offered (or turned down) for their “core” players so it’s hard to evaluate those hypothetical scenarios.
In any event, the Hawks have 25 games against a tough schedule to figure out what they are about. From my perspective, at least, it should be interesting.
Michael Cunningham, Hawks beat
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796 comments Add your comment
O'Brien
February 25th, 2011
8:30 pm
In 5 minutes of PT, Bibby is 0-3 from the field (0-2 from 3). And he has a -10 rating. Ouch.
Flea
February 25th, 2011
8:33 pm
LMAO @ ag.
Flea
February 25th, 2011
8:34 pm
Bibby is done, we all knew it. Thanks for the memories. I think we should resign Priest Lauderdale, Dion Glover, and Roshown Mcloud for the stretch run.
The Truth
February 25th, 2011
8:35 pm
With Hilton career average FT% of 60%, LD needs to be careful putting him in to close out games in the 4th. On paper it could be a liability.
GT Alum
February 25th, 2011
8:37 pm
ag,
Well, American-born since ‘00 limits it. Laettner and Kukoc would be 2 other white guys, but they missed the time frame and wasn’t American, respectively.
Wink
February 25th, 2011
8:40 pm
Dajavu!!! The runner up is now in charge. Look familiar.
Fire Woody promote his assistant Drew. Trade the starter Bibby and promote the under under under study Teague.
If Teague was the answer, then why make trade. Sit Bibby & start Teague, without giving up on Jordan, Mo & a 1st round pick.
Give Hinrick the ball and throw him into the mix right off the top. Your big trade has to be the back up to your under under under study.
Hawks never cease to amaze me….somebody, anybody please buy this team.
Astro Joe
February 25th, 2011
8:41 pm
The very definition of cani-blogging over here.
Astro Joe
February 25th, 2011
8:46 pm
Rememer, that LD’s offense is something like no other team is running. So surely he isn’t going to throw a new PG out there. If he did that, it would look like his offense is as easy to learn as a simplistic iso-based offensive scheme. And since LD has so many convinced that this offense is better (despite scoring fewer points), he should continue with the smoke and mirror tricks. Hinrich may sit until he is finished reading Chapter 87: “How to Forget the Motion Offense in the 4th Quarter”.
Section 303
February 25th, 2011
8:52 pm
ag, if you’re talking about Leon Powe circa ‘07-’08, I’m in. Leon Powe after that season blew out his knee and is not even a shadow of his former self.
I’m actually really enjoying this Wizards/Heat game. Strange seeing Bibby in a Wiz uniform. I still like that guy. Sad to see him go.
Mo Evans, by the way….he’s still Mo Evans. He hit that quick 3. Then, he threw a lazy pass that Wade picked off, took in for a slam, and was fouled by….Mo Evans! Then, as I saw someone already posted, he later fouled Wade and was hit with a T for his complaint.
Jordan Crawford still has not seen the floor.
O'Brien
February 25th, 2011
9:06 pm
Dwight Howard is one technical away from being suspended. How come the Magic didnt get a backup for Dwight at the deadline?
Instead, they trade for Gilbert, who has 3 years, $62 mil left after this year (and fans complain about JJ’s deal). Oh by the way, Gilbert is averaging 8 and 4 since the trade.
Melvin
February 25th, 2011
9:06 pm
Rashard and Bosh combine first half stats. 1-10 fgs, 2pts, 4rebs. 35 mil in salary… SMH
Melvin
February 25th, 2011
9:16 pm
Jordan Crawford is in the game….
cp
February 25th, 2011
9:17 pm
I saw that Jarred Jeffries was waived. He could be a decent pick up. He can guard a few positions. Doesn’t do anything great but he does the dirty work.
Tremaine
February 25th, 2011
9:17 pm
Man, I wish we had a coach like Doc Rivers. We should of hired Mark Jackson.
O'Brien
February 25th, 2011
9:18 pm
cp,
Jeffries all but guaranteed to go back to Knicks.
Melvin,
After going 1-18 last night, Bosh is 2-6 tonight
Melvin
February 25th, 2011
9:22 pm
OB,
Dont forget Bosh has 3rebs ….
Melvin
February 25th, 2011
9:29 pm
Jordan with a 360 behind his head layup for his basket of the night
JeJe
February 25th, 2011
9:30 pm
Rod, I can now post from my apartment. Idk why but it works now.
FIRE SUND.
MC catching a lot of heat here from a few of us, but every comeback he’s had is pretty damn good haha.
Basically if we had a new GM and better ownership no one on here would be as mad HALF the time
JeJe
February 25th, 2011
9:31 pm
Bibby needs to grow up.
He’s just mad he’s not a starter anymore (he shouldn’t have been the last 2 years).
Grow a pair.
Freshfromatl
February 25th, 2011
9:32 pm
Jordan Crawford is going to be a pretty good scorer in this league but he has a looooonnnggg way to go on the defensive end, unless he’s cool with being another “Jamal” Crawford which is what the Wizards announcers called him when he scored on a drive to the hoop.
Freshfromatl
February 25th, 2011
9:33 pm
SMH…at Mo Evans dribbling the ball off his foot out of bounds in cruch time…some things never change.
JeJe
February 25th, 2011
9:35 pm
I wonder if WAS has defensive stopper Mo Evans on LBJ like we always did (instead of Damien)
SMDH
Freshfromatl
February 25th, 2011
9:38 pm
JeJe,
Yep he guarding Bron.
Freshfromatl
February 25th, 2011
9:40 pm
Mike Bibby…
8 mins, 0-4 shooting, 4 assists
Just turned the ball over.
Melvin
February 25th, 2011
9:41 pm
Wizards were down 4pts before Bibby came into the game, now they are down 11pts… Bibby -19…
Melvin
February 25th, 2011
9:43 pm
I bet the Wizards are ready to rescind the trade with the Hawks…LOL.. Suckers..
Mac-Town, Georgia (urban-macon.blogspot.com)
February 25th, 2011
9:44 pm
lmao@Bibby’s team low +/- tonight for the Wizards
SteveW
February 25th, 2011
9:47 pm
MC – I think it was news from other teams people were wanting. The trades were dropping fast and furious. It’s the type thing you would have probably tweeted.
But I think the guys on here wanted you doing a “blue box” with every trade right after it happened and your opinions. Instead we had to follow the twitter of Hoopshype and get the latest news.
I did tell the folks you may be flying
SteveW
February 25th, 2011
9:50 pm
Man, no wonder we’ve been stinking up the joint. Why did LD insist on playing Bibby and Mo’ over Teague and Wilkens? We’re liable to go on a streak now.
I re-emphasize, I expect JJ to have a very good game – like 26 pts on above .500 shooting, unless he’s hurt and not telling anybody again
Freshfromatl
February 25th, 2011
9:50 pm
Jordan Crawford may have a hard time finding minutes in Washington behind Nick Young, John Wall, Bibby, and Mo Evans.
SteveW
February 25th, 2011
9:51 pm
If I were the Wiz, I would play JC2 20+ per night, just to give him experience. Your team is already terrible, might as well play the young guy. At least he’s exciting to watch.
Freshfromatl
February 25th, 2011
9:54 pm
SteveW,
I agree fully with you.
Hell, actually I’m now surprised that we’ve won as many games as we have with starting Bibby and playing Mo so many minutes. Hell, the Hawks instantly improved their roster just by subtracting those two.
Melvin
February 25th, 2011
9:59 pm
Major meltdown happening in Cleveland. They were up double digits now only 2 with 2mins left to play….
bigdave
February 25th, 2011
10:01 pm
slick Rick on Hawks live
O'Brien
February 25th, 2011
10:03 pm
Melvin,
Dont forget Bibby also had 4 assists.
Is it just me, or does Slick Rick like talking about the past?
Freshfromatl
February 25th, 2011
10:04 pm
I’m sorry people. I have to side with Rick Sund on this one (The Hawks were NOT going to be able to get Deron Williams, Raymond Felton or Devin Harris). Rick Sund got it right this time with droping extra baggage and bringing in a strong defender in Kirk Hinrich.
ATL FAN
February 25th, 2011
10:05 pm
Gibson for 3!!!!!!!!!! Knicks have NO defense!!
JeJe
February 25th, 2011
10:06 pm
LOL Sund talking about how he hasn’t seen this many trades before. He forgot to say “in his 31 years”
Tremaine
February 25th, 2011
10:06 pm
God I hate the word “core” now.
O'Brien
February 25th, 2011
10:06 pm
Rick says we havent been in a funk until now. He doesnt call starting off 8-7 a funk?
Freshfromatl
February 25th, 2011
10:08 pm
Lol @ the Knicks.
JeJe
February 25th, 2011
10:09 pm
LOL @ Glenn and the other scrub all nodding and believing everything Sund was saying, then emphasizing CORE
Melvin
February 25th, 2011
10:09 pm
M.L. Car for the Cavs is the most annoying announcer in the business. Good thing these Cavs don’t win alot of games anymore…
ATL FAN
February 25th, 2011
10:11 pm
Carr is hilarious LMAO im so happy the Knicks lost thats what you get Anthony… I hate Carr whenever he’s announcing against the Hawks though, very annoying
Najeh Davenpoop
February 25th, 2011
10:12 pm
MC: if there was anything that surprised me about the coverage of the last couple of days, it was that I learned about the Hinrich trade from 4 or 5 other sources before I heard it from this blog or from @ajchawks. I respect and appreciate not wanting to post unverified information, and I think if you were to do that people would only get more p-ssed off in the end that the Hawks were not able to close the deal on anything. But I won’t pretend it didn’t surprise me a little that your first tweet after the trade was two hours after it was reported, published, etc. on Yahoo, CBS, etc.
Of course, it now appears that Bibby was in the same boat as you.
In any case, I’ve always gotten the impression that you concern yourself more with the day to day goings on of the players on the court, in practice, etc. than you do with the workings of the front office, and you do a fine job of covering that. The day I am dissatisfied with the coverage here is the day I no longer show up — in true Atlanta sports fan style.
JeJe
February 25th, 2011
10:12 pm
Vince Cillini is a joke. What happened to Verrett?
SteveW
February 25th, 2011
10:12 pm
My philosophy on trades, just confirmed on ESPN: Always trade multiple players for one good player. I think we may have just done that with Hinrich – no offense Hilton.
From ESPN:
“PEOPLE WHO FORGET THAT YOU SHOULD ALWAYS TRADE THREE OR FOUR QUARTERS FOR A DOLLAR IN BASKETBALL: F-minus
If you disagree with the previous few paragraphs, you’re bucking five solid decades of NBA history. Since 1965, not one NBA team that traded a package of pieces for a superstar regretted it after the fact. Don’t believe me? Here’s the complete list:
1965: Philly trades Connie Dierking, Paul Neumann, Lee Shaffer and cash to San Francisco for Wilt Chamberlain.
1968: Lakers trade Jerry Chambers, Archie Clark and Darrell Imhoff to Philly for Wilt Chamberlain.
1970: Milwaukee trades Flynn Robinson and Charlie Paulk to Cincinnati for Oscar Robertson.
1975: Lakers trade Elmore Smith, Brian Winters, Dave Meyers and Junior Bridgeman to Milwaukee for Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.
1983: Philly trades Caldwell Jones and Cleveland’s 1983 first-rounder (No. 3, Rodney McCray) to Houston for Moses Malone.
1993: Phoenix trades Jeff Hornacek, Tim Perry and Andrew Lang to Philly for Charles Barkley.
1994: Washington trades Tom Gugliotta, 1996 first-rounder (No. 11, Todd Fuller), 1998 first (No. 13, Keon Clark) and 2000 first (No. 7, Chris Mihm) to Golden State for Chris Webber.
1996: Houston trades Robert Horry, Sam Cassell, Chucky Brown and Mark Bryant to Phoenix for Charles Barkley.
1996: Phoenix trades Michael Finley, Sam Cassell, A.C. Green and a 1998 No. 2 (No. 53, Greg Buckner) to Dallas for Jason Kidd, Tony Dumas and Loren Meyer.
1999: Phoenix trades Danny Manning, Pat Garrity, 2001 first-rounder (No. 18, Jason Collins) and 2002 first (No. 9, Amare Stoudemire) to Orlando for Penny Hardaway.
2004: Houston trades Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley and Kelvin Cato to Orlando for Tracy McGrady, Tyronn Lue, Reece Gaines and Juwan Howard.
2005: New Jersey trades Alonzo Mourning, Eric Williams, Aaron Williams, Philly’s 2005 No. 1 pick (No. 16, Joey Graham) and a 2006 No. 1 (No. 20, Renaldo Balkman) to Toronto for Vince Carter.
2005: Miami trades Lamar Odom, Brian Grant, Caron Butler, a 2006 No. 1 (No. 26, Jordan Farmar) and a 2006 No. 2 (No. 50, Renaldas Seibutis) to the Lakers for Shaquille O’Neal.
2007: Boston trades Al Jefferson, Gerald Green, Theo Ratliff, Ryan Gomes, Sebastian Telfair, a 2009 No. 1 (No. 28, Wayne Ellington) and the rights to Minnesota’s 2009 No. 1 (No. 6, Jonny Flynn) to Minnesota for Kevin Garnett.
2008: Lakers trade Kwame Brown, Jarvaris Crittendon, Aaron McKie, the rights to Marc Gasol, a 2008 No. 1 (No. 28, Donte Greene) and a 2010 No. 1 (No. 28, Greivis Vasquez) to Memphis for Pau Gasol.
That’s 15 trades in all. Eight of them (Wilt, Wilt again, Oscar, Moses, Barkley, Shaq, KG and Gasol) resulted in a championship or a Finals appearance within two seasons. The Lakers ended up winning five titles with Kareem. Houston came within two wins and a Matt Maloney meltdown of making the ‘97 Finals with Barkley. Jersey easily won the Vince trade; same for Houston with T-Mac. Phoenix won the Kidd trade, although Finley had a nice career in Dallas. Washington’s Webber deal could have backfired if any of the picks panned out … but they didn’t. Only Phoenix’s Penny deal failed to work out, but in a strange twist, the Suns got their No. 1 pick back in a subsequent deal and took Stoudemire with it, so
The title of the article is like “Always trade quarters for dollars”. When you trade multiple players for 1 good one, you almost always come out ahead. In today’s NBA, it’s a stars League. Only 5 guys on the court at once. You want the best 5 guys in crunch time.
Glad we got Hinrich, major upgrade over Bibby. And if Teague blossoms, and Wilkens doe’s well, so much the better. We may finally do something.
JeJe
February 25th, 2011
10:13 pm
Cellini
O'Brien
February 25th, 2011
10:13 pm
Ok guys.
1) Who wins (Hawks or GS)?
2) Who is Hawks player of the game?
I think Hawks win, and JJ has a big game. He has averaged 11.3 pts while shooting 39.2 percent over the last six contests. he is way overdue for a breakout.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 25th, 2011
10:14 pm
And it looks like “IBeatTheP***yUp” is going to join the pantheon of Hawks blog legends, along with Sekou and Tyrone’s cousin BooBoo. Maybe he’s just a really dedicated Ying Yang Twins fan.