Atlanta Hawks: Hawks 104, Raptors 101

first

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Our defense was almost as bad as the officiating.

We probably gave up 30 lay ups on defense and settled for 30 three-point attempts. In total, we turned the ball over about 15 times, were on the bad side of some questionable calls and still found a way to get a win on the road.

Overall, I think Coach Drew did a solid job, but would of liked to see us play some zone to counter the penetration that Toronto was getting all night. Barbosa and Calderon had a field day, and nobody inside offered any resistance.

Smoove is a black hole on offense. He is not MJ and any time he gets the ball the possession ends in a turnover or a bad shot. Hopefully, when Marvin coming back will help in this regard.

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did raptors lose this game or did the hawks get lucky? i think it was a litte of both. i will take the win, but damn i wish we had played better.

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WOW, the Clippers are putting a whipping on the Heat..MANN, if the Heat lose as bad as the Cavs lost to the Lakers, I SURE HOPE ONE OF THE CAVS WRITE LEBRON RIGHT BACK ON TWITTER HOW ‘GOD DONT LIKE UGLY EITHER!!’

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Dont look now, but the Hawks are tied for the 3rd seed.

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MsDee this is a Hawks blog, not a Heat, Cavs, or Lebron blog. Please just come out and support on Chik Fila Family Night. That would 4 drinks, 4 hotdogs, and 4 popcorns for the entire family. Come out and watch this UNDER RATED ELITE team that will win 50 games and HOPE FOR A SHOT TO GET TO THE SECOND ROUND SO THAT WE CAN WIN ONE GAME AND NOT BE SWEPT.

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Thanks Terrell finally a fan that appreciate the fact that we are moving up in the standings. Terrell knows we are CHAMPIONSHIP CALIBER team. One of our goals is to get HOME COURT advantage in the FIRST ROUND.

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Scoop you don’t know what you are talking about when it comes to Josh Smith. He has great POTENTIAL when it comes to his offensive play. He is showing that he is one of the best PURE SHOOTERS in the game. He also has GREAT BALL HANDLING ABILITY and can complement him enough on his GREAT PASSING. Scoop, I don’t know what game you are watching, but Josh is a truly a RAW TALENT that has POLISHED his skills.

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Ant Banks what are you talking about? We have a PROVEN VETERAN point guard who is GREAT DEFENDER in Mike Bibby. Are you serious Ant. We’re trying to work on an 5 YEAR extension on Bibby. As you can see, he still has the LEGS to START and play at least 40 minutes.

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Ok Rick Sund, give it a break.

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@ATL FAN
This is no laughing matter. This team gets no respect and most Atlanta fans need to realize that maybe their STANDARDS are TOO HIGH. Remember ATL FAN it TAKES TIME and we are still LEARNING HOW TO WIN. We just want you to see our POTENTIAL. That is why we brought in Larry Drew. It’s not because he came CHEAP, but we know that he has a PHIL JACKSONESQUE offensive mind. Can’t you see how his offense has TRANSFORMED Josh into a GREAT JUMPSHOOTER.

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Terrell I was just complementing you on your high standards in regards to this team. You know that Rome wasn’t built in a day. We thank you for your support.

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Mister Scoop sir how can you say josh is a black hole because he is the best passer on the team and he very unselfish also. I like leon barbosa
and wish he could play for the hawks. could he be a point gard.

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Chris Bosh was just posted up on Baron Davis and shot a turnaround fadeaway brick. If there is a more overrated player in the league, I don’t know who it is.

With that said, the Clippers are guaranteed to blow this game.

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RICK SUND:
Since you have so much time on your hands go find us a real color commentator to replace Dominique. I dont know which person is more annoying listening to him during the games or listening to your pathetic excuses as to why our team is supposedly so great!

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We need to give Jamal a new contract point blank.

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@RMS

I am only over player personnel, not commentators. As far as the POTENTIAL that this team has, we brought back Joe at a REASONABLE rate because he is a CENTERPIECE for a CHAMPIONSHIP TEAM. Nobody else in league has a better RUNNER or FLOATER shot in the league. He is one of the GREAT NON FREE THROW shooting scorers in the league. Remember RMS, we are still YOUNG and are still LEARNING. We are just going through GROWING PAINS that most teams deal with before becoming a champion. When Marvin REACHES his POTENTIAL and UPSIDE, he will be the ROBIN to Joe who is our BATMAN. With Josh and PHENOMENAL play, we are sure to beat a MIAMI HEAT or BOSTON CELTIC team. We have DEPTH with Teague, Jamal, and the Zaza “THE ENFORCER” Just wait RMS, all we need to do is IMPROVE every year.

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ICE COLD, you are right on point. We should just STAY THE COURSE with this team. I am glad that you have bought into our plan for WINNING A CHAMPIONSHIP. Like you said, just as long as we have the CHEMISTRY ADVANTAGE. Why be like Orlando who just traded players on their team. We could have done that because we do have one SUPERSTAR which is JOE JOHNSON, but we realized that this team at some point can GO ALL THE WAY. I disagree that we need to trade Marvin. With his AGGRESSIVE play, we are sure to be a THREAT to anyone who faces us.

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@RMS

Your STANDARDS are just TOO HIGH. We are looking to see you this week for CHik Fila Family Night. Remember RMS that is 4 drinks, 4 popcorns, and 4 Sodas for the entire family. Marvin should be back by Saturday. Thanks for you support.

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LMAO @ RICK SUCK!! You are too much for me man, good nite!!

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Good Nite to you sir and remember RMS, it’s all about UPSIDE!

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MsDee,

To add the Heat lost, look as if Lebron tweak his ankle. I wouldn’t be surprise if he missed some gametime once that ankle tighten up over night….

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“Rick Sund” = lowered expectations

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Wins like this mean nothing. It’s really simple people. What are most of our expectations or wishes? That the Hawks can compete with the elites of the East at a level where they could potentially win a series against them. Correct? It’s pretty much a given that we are going to the playoffs, so individual W/L dont mean much to me. When I watch the Hawks play, I look for 2 things.

Number 1: Does this game show me something that encourages me to believe that we can compete with and beat the elite in the east.

Number 2: Does this game show me something that makes me believe that we still are not there yet.

Despite the win, this is a Number 2 in my book.

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can someone give me any hope why we are not pretty much a sixth seed for the next few years? the bulls are now way ahead of us in every part of the equation and the knicks are right there. both of those teams are definitely on the upswing while we are at best on a plateau.
seriously… somebody give me some hope.

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Great night for the Hawks. We won, while Chicago, Orlando and Miami all lost.

I think once Jamal accepted the fact that Rick would not mention the word “extension” to him, he decided he would let his game do the talking. He has been on fire.

ASG said they would go into luxury tax for the right player. If Jamal continues to play well, AND he plays well in the playoffs, shouldn’t the ASG go into luxury tax for him?

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Great game by Jamal, and Joe Max….We won, so i will try not to be negative, but Josh at the sf makes me sick….I am sick of Drew playing guys out of position…When we get healthy, we should start Marvin at the sf, Al at the pf, Collins at c…JOSH SMITH IS NOT A SF…

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[...] Atlanta Journal Constitution [...]

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O’Brien, the way I see it, if you only have two players who are close to All Stars (Josh and Al) and both are young enough to get better (some part of Josh’s game has improved annually), you trade neither of them, unless you’re getting back an All Star PG (All Star Centers are overrated now. I struggle seeing the Hawks having a better record with Lopez or Bogut in place of Josh or Al). I actually believe Marvin can be traded for Camby, if Marvin is ever healthy long enough. And Bibby’s expiring deal will be a better trade asset. Why give another team a bargain, when Josh is your best bargain?

Do you think Minny would give up Flynn for Teague, a 1st round pick, and Josh Powell?

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Does anyone know where Damin James the Hawks first round draft choice of 2010 is ?

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Trade Marvin Williams for Chris Kaman straight up. That dude can play.

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“If you are going to play no defense and get into an freewheeling shootout like the Hawks did in the first half, it’s good to have Jamal on your side. I thought he was going to provide the answer to Jason Walker’s poll at Peachtree Hoops after just one day.”

I was thinking the same thing after the first half MC. I was like damn, Jason Walker definitely talked this up. Nobody at the bar knew what I was talking about, but I’m glad someone felt me somewhere in ATL.

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When will LD wake up and understand that defense interior in the paint is what make the hawks good point blank period, collins have 2 starte every game, if collins starte this game they easily blow out the raptors but yet for some strange reason he continue 2 make dum decision and not starte him.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!

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@ Ramon,

I agree about not trading our best players. But I don’t think the ASG is willing to spend the money to keep everybody AND upgrade the team. Time will tell.

In the meantime, I don’t think anybody else has enough trade value to bring us back an impact big or an impact PG.

@ it was not a bad pick,

You said “The Hawks have tried to move Josh before…They found no takers.”.

Can you post an article or link where that was written? Because I think if the Hawks wanted to move Josh, they would have lots of options.

I do think Josh is a better PF than he is SF, and playing SF takes away some of his defensive impact.

However, I also think Marvin is the third best SF on this team (behind JJ and Josh).

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I did a little research on DHarris, and I’ve come to the conclusion that I’d much rather have him than everyone’s beloved SNash, and here’s why:

1-27 yr old DHarris is 10yrs younger than SNash, which makes him a far better investment for our future.
2-MBIBBY—MPG-29.9 PPG-10.1 APG–4.0 SPG–.62
SNASH—- 32.6 17.1 10.7 .63
DHARRIS– 31.7 16.5 7.0 1.03
3-DHarris has shot more FT’s(211) than SNash and MBibby combined(146+37=183). That tells me he’s penetrating and drawing a lot more fouls, and getting to the FT line more as a result. Drawing more fouls on the opositions frontline definitely benefits our frontline, and the team overall. He also creates almost as many steals as Bibby and Nash combined(1.03-.62+.63=1.25). There’s absolutely no doubt that DHarris plays better DEF than Bibby or Nash, both of whom are proven DEF liabilities.

There are 2 ways we can approach a trade for DHarris.

1-Bibby($5.56M, MEvans($2.5M)
2-Evan(2.5M)s, Teague($1.177M), TE($3.6M)

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The Hawks cannot use their TPE on Harris.

Besides I don’t think NJ will trade Harris, unless it is for some blockbuster trade that brings a superstar to NJ.

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The Suns are probably getting ready to free up some cap space. The Hawks should pursue this trade:

Suns get-Jamal Crawford, Teague, and Mo Evans (all have expiring contracts that would free up 14.7M)

Hawks get-Nash and Dudley

When you first look @ this trade, you might say why would the Suns do this? They free up 14.7M to go after Chris Paul.

There are going to be several trades that are made this year before the trade deadline because there are several teams that are not playing as well as they were expected @ the beginning of the season. The Suns are one of them.

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I looked at Devin Harris career stats and his age. He is 28 years old and has been in the NBA 6 years and has played in 444 games. That ’s an average of 74 games/year. IDK where he lost most of his time to injury, if it was all in one or two years? Total games missed is 48 in 6 years.

His Career / Current Stats are solid, but not earth shattering:

PPG 13.2 / 16.3
APG. 4.9 / 7.0
RBG. 2.9/ 2.5

The last three games look great
NJ – PHX Devin’s Line was 15/11 in a Loss
NJ – Bulls Devin’s Line was 13/17 in a Win. (Pts/assts)

I pulled all those #’s from memory and may be off a little, but you gét the gist.
Can Devin help this team? Sure
Can Devin take us where we want to go? IDK

It all depends on how much we have to give up to get him and will that cost hurt/help this team. Boy, I sure wouldn’t want to be a GM – that’s a very tough job, IMO.

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Last night’s win-qnd it goes in the books as a win- was an example of the good and bad aspects of the Hawk’s relience on their front court.

When Jamal was hot the rest of the team stood around and stared and didn’t play good defense. When he went chilly, Joe tried to pick up the slack with a great deal less success. But the rest of the team was out of sync. while Bibby’s clutch three pointer put the dagger in the Raptor’s coffin; the team defense in the last few minutes kept the Hawk’s in the game.

The point is that against the better teams the Hawks must present a balanced attack and some sustained defense in order to maximize their chances of winning.
Hope eveyone survived Snow Jam 2011!

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JJ is more valuable than Jamal, bigger, more consistent (when healthy) better defender. 4 time all-star, all NBA.

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Drmaryb, I agree on DHarris…It would definitely depend on the cost…I’ve never been big on stats…I agree stats are a good indicator…but that’s only half of the picture for me…I also look at style of play…does this guy style of play fit your system…in DHarris case…I think it does…so if NJ is actually shopping dude around…WE NEED TO SEE WHATZUP!!!

However, this is not a guy…I would go over board for…AJ is putting this guy on the trading block for a second time…first in Dallas and now in NJ…that tells me…NJ could be looking to move this guy regardless of whether they acquire Melo…I would love to have him as a Hawk…if we could get him at a reasonable price.

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THE ONLY RESON TEAGUE WAS -7 WAS BECAUSE OF ZAZA, JAMAL, AND THEIR POOR DEFENSE!

Teague scored four points in the first half and managed the game well while he was in there. Conversely, in the second half when the starters fouled up the game LD didn’t give Bibby the leash like he SHOULD HAVE.
Aside from those 2 3-pointers in the fourth, BIBBY WAS HORRIBLE. He’s the only PG in the NBA with worse defense than Calderon.

Yes it was a cute little heroic moment for Bibby, but we will get burned in the playoffs if he plays like that. I’m PRAYING for that New Jersey deal to go through so that we can have a shot at swapping Bibby for Devin Harris. He’s only 28 and he’s 6′3 200. He’s been to the finals and plays exellent D. He averaging like 16 and 7 right now. He can shoot and run the break well and we all know what kind of pressure he puts on a defense.

If were going to take a step forward this season WE NEED A NEW POINT GUARD. We actually need JEFF TEAGUE more than many people would like to admit. Everytime he attacked last night he got to the line. If LD keeps him in the game consistantly and allows Teague to do that, WE WONT NEED TO BE BAILED OUT BY STREAKY SHOOTERS JAMAL AND BIBBY.

Players like Harris and Teague may not the great shooter that Bibby is but with their ability to consistantly penetrate the defense THEY WILL NEVER COMPLETELY DISSAPEAR BECAUSE OF A COLD JUMPSHOT LIKE BIBBY WHO IS ABSOLUTELY USELESS WHEN HE’S OFF. Also, the offense will not be limited because our PG has to PICK UP HIS DRIBBLE JUST PAST HALF COURT AND COST US A TUNOVER BECAUSE HE CANNOT ADEQUATELY HANDLE THE BALL FOR A STARTING PG GETTING PAID (or stealing…whichever you perfer) SIX MILLION DOLLARS A SEASON.

I hope Rick Sund can see through the smokescreen and good vibrations from Bibbys nice little Jumpshot there at the end and realize that WE WILL NOT GET OUT OF THE SECOND ROUND WITH BIBBY AS OUR STARTING POINT GUARD. WE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE WON THAT GAME WITHOUT THE NEED FOR HEROICS AT THE END IF WE HAD A PG WHO COULD CONSISTANTLY SCORE THROUGHT A GAME AND NOT JUST LUCKILY GET HOT DURING THE LAST THREE MINUTES OF THE 4TH QUATER

That is all.

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GIVE JAMAL HIS MONEY!

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*Isn’t that right Stevie Wonder?

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Scoop,

about this: “Smoove is a black hole on offense. He is not MJ and any time he gets the ball the possession ends in a turnover or a bad shot. ”

ANY TIME, Scoop? ANY TIME?

That’s just a bit too hyperbolic to let slide. You mean he NEVER hits a shot? He NEVER has assists?

If you want to argue against Josh’s faults at least keep it real enough to be believable. Or say that it it your opinion. Either way, you need to keep it real.

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POR FAVOR RENUEVEN YA A JAMAL,ES UNA GOZADA VERLE JUGAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Wathching ex-Hawk Antoine Walker here in NBA-TV. I don’t see anything we haven’t seen before….3 point shot attempts….he doesn’t look like he could help anyone.
Anyone see this link showing the Hawks are 2nd in D-League callups? Well, they are modeling themselves after the Spurs, who are #1 in callups? http://hoopshype.com/dleague.htm

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sam’l,

We are not Jamal bandwagoners. The main reason why people have suggested trade him is because he was the most attractive asset that could be used to strenghten other areas (Center or PG).

Best case scenario would be to resign Jamal, and use the MLE and the TPE to get PG and frontcourt help. But thats alot of extra salary for the ASG.

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O’Brien
“However, I also think Marvin is the third best SF on this team (behind JJ and Josh).”

I am glad to see that someone is finally seeing that Joe is not true sg..He is a sf..I would not say that Josh is better than Marvin at sf..Last night was perfect example…His shot is just not there…

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THE BLOG MONSTER HAS CEASED WITH ITS EVILNESS. THANKS, MC.

LOL @ BIBBY DOING NOTHING ALL GAME THEN HITTING 1 BIG SHOT.

I WAS WONDERING WHY HE WAS IN THE WHOLE 4TH

JAMAL IS THE REAL DEAL

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What im thinking is,

Josh Smith and Jeff Teague to the Lakers, for Shannon Brown, Andrew Bynum, and Matt Barnes

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Our schedule from Feb 16 – March 18 is f’ing brutal.

Easiest team I see is @ GSW (where we lost last year) or vs. Knicks

We gotta keep beating these weaker teams

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THE TRUTH-You’re correct, no PF can completely shutdown an elite PG throughout an entire gm. But that’s not the point. Our PG should at least be good enough defensively to contain PG’s that aren’t considered elite. How many times do we play teams with elite PG’s like CPaul, DWilliams, DRose, SNash, CBillups, RRondo etc?

With Bibby, there have been too many gms where average PG’s have elite performances against us. His DEF liabilities create pressure and unnecessory fouls on our frontline, as they must keep one eye on their man and the other on the lane and Bibby’s man.

We might not be able to acquire a PG with the DEF ability to stop elite PG’s, but we can and should get one that can keep average PG’s from consistently having elite performances against us.

Did anyone else notice Teague waving for the ball when they were trying to double Jamal? I saw it happen 3 times. Some of you need to get over Bibby making that clutch shot. Maybe if he had played better DEF and contributed more OFF earlier, his last min dramatics would have been unnecessary.

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Ken Strickland

I like the Devin Harris breakdown. He would be an ideal PG for this team. Good trade info as well.

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NBA At 2: Nash And The Hawks?

By: Bill Ingram Last Updated: 1/6/11 1:06 PM ET | 8540 times read

Adjust font size:One of the hot topics around the NBA this week has been whether or not the Phoenix Suns will trade All-Star point guard Steve Nash as the next phase in their ongoing effort to dump salary. Of course, everyone’s favorite game then becomes determining where Steve Nash might land. The New York Knicks have been a favorite guess, and it’s easy to see. After all, Nash would be reunited with his former head coach in Mike D’Antoni and his former pick-and-roll partner in Amar’e Stoudemire. The Knicks, however, don’t have the most attractive pieces to offer in trade and they don’t even have a particular need with Raymond Felton playing at an All-Star level.

There is a team, however, that desperately needs Nash’s services. It’s one of the teams that rose to an elite level in the Eastern Conference prior to letting their head coach go and making no major upgrades over the offseason. As the Miami HEAT, Boston Celtics, Chicago Bulls and Orlando Magic have worked tirelessly to improve their rosters, the Hawks have elected to basically stand pat, and as a result they’re quickly losing ground in their conference. HOOPSWORLD’s Lang Greene believes Nash is the answer for the Hawks, and even see a path of acquisition for Atlanta:

Atlanta has never been the first choice destination of marquee players looking to change addresses, but the Hawks franchise could offer a future Hall of Famer like Steve Nash a legitimate chance to add a NBA title to his already sparkling resume.

A couple of key facts are often overlooked when analyzing the current state of the Hawks. The first is that the franchise features three All-Star caliber players in Joe Johnson, Al Horford and Josh Smith. The frontcourt tandem of Horford and Smith are 24 and 25, respectively, and both have yet to reach their physical primes. Secondly, for all the criticism Johnson receives for his $124 million deal, the fact remains that he’s the third-best shooting guard in the NBA right now behind Kobe Bryant and Dwyane Wade. The deal that Johnson signed will ultimately become an anchor to the salary cap as he hits the age most players decline rapidly (2014-16), but right now his presence on the roster is a favorable one.

The widely accepted roster move theory that would push the Hawks into title contention is the acquisition of a true starting center so that Horford can play his natural power forward position. But Horford has excelled as an undersized center, earning his first All-Star appearance last season, and while he struggles defensively against bigger guys in the post his speed and versatility makes him a very tough assignment on the other end of the floor.

The true need for the Hawks is a floor general. The Hawks have been seeking a game changing point guard since passing over Chris Paul, Deron Williams and to a lesser extend Raymond Felton in the 2005 draft for Marvin Williams. We all witnessed the chemistry that Nash and Amar’e Stoudemire demonstrated in Phoenix for years, can you imagine Nash in the open court with Horford and Smith filling the lanes?

On the surface, the Hawks can’t offer much in talent in return for Nash. The Hawks have shopped Williams but have found no takers, plus the Suns already possess a plethora of wing players. But the Hawks do have the expiring contract of Jamal Crawford, which basically matches what Nash is on the books for this year.

At first glance most would laugh at the suggestion of a Nash for Crawford (and a first round pick) swap straight up. However, the Suns have some real big decisions to make. Is it time to blow it up and start over? If so, acquiring Crawford’s expiring deal along with the recently acquired Vince Carter’s near $19 million non-guaranteed contract next season and Phoenix would then possess $30 million in freed of cap room – which would be plenty of flexibility to start the rebuilding process.

The Hawks should aggressively pursue Nash if he became available, but not at the expense of Horford, Smith or Johnson. But if the team can acquire him for a package with Crawford (straight up), or Marvin Williams, Jordan Crawford (and Mike Bibby) for example then executive vice president and general manager Rick Sund should pick up the phone and work some Magic.
The Phoenix Suns do, indeed, seem intent on blowing it up and starting over. If that weren’t the plan, they never would have let Amar’e Stoudemire walk away, not on the heels of the team’s unlikely appearance in the Western Conference Finals. Now, with the conference finals ever-shrinking in the rear-view mirror, it’s time to set Nash free . . .and the Atlanta Hawks not only have a need, but also a shot at making the Finals with Nash at the helm.

Read more NBA news and insight: http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=18398#ixzz1AwqOxM2X

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Hoopsworld Article..wtf????

” the Hawks have elected to basically stand pat, and as a result they’re quickly losing ground in their conference.”

When did the start losing ground…before or after we beat the Magic twice.

When our best players missed 9 games and was hurt at the start of the season?

When the SMOY missed 5-6 games with back problems?

When are starting SF got hurt and is hurt again?

With all that has happened we are still 26-14 and 3rd in the conference.

I wish these writers wuld write about what has happened….. and not what they want to happen!

I heard Mchale say the Bulls were and elite team…They are 6-11 against teams above .500 and 8-10 on the road…Really????

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Scoop it is crazy after a bad game u smoove haters come out.

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The only way to afford Nash or Harris, and keep Jamal, is by trading Marvin and Bibby. And that may not be enough to keep Jamal. Depends on the FA market.

Booo – Co-sign about Teague. Bibby put the dagger in the coffin last night (great line ‘Nique!), but didn’t do much else.

But I’ve been pushing Teague to get more time than Bibby at PG, but I have realized that Bibby is not a PG. He is a hybrid shooter, intelligent, no mistakes guy, but he is a not a PG in the traditional sense of the word.

Teague, Harris, Nash etc., Now those are PG’s. In LD’s offense, I think having that pure spot up shooter is important, and we just try to cover for Bibby on D. Just my thoughts.

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Trade

Jamal for Devin Harris and Morrow is the only trade the Hawks Might accept…

LD gets a PG and a shooter.

The nuggets want

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GeeMack

Right? That would really motivate Melo to sign that extension in NJ.
He would just say, “to die for!” to play with Marvin and Teague!

SMH!

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http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4heuuje and a first round pick to the suns

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The Truth: We passed on Shaq because he destroys the locker room. He cannot hurt a veteran locker room like the Celtics but he destroyed the Suns. Who doesn’t love the personality of Shaq?The issue for us is we have a solid team that lacks a true leader. Hopefully Al turns into that guy at some point in the future…

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The Hawks should offer Evans, Bibby, and Zaza for Nash and Dudley. Evans has an expiring contract, Bibby can help Dragic come along this season, and Zaza gives them some muscle inside.

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Trade Mo Evans’ expiring contract to Detroit for Ben Wallace, who’s under contract through the end of next season. If Rip’s out and Prince is expiring, Big Ben will not want to stick around. In the rumored deal, they’ll get Petro to take his place.

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“I did a little research on DHarris, and I’ve come to the conclusion that I’d much rather have him than everyone’s beloved SNash, and here’s why:”

Harris may have the edge when it comes to age, but stats don’t mean a whole lot when it comes to the point guard position. Stephon Marbury had excellent stats his whole career, but he did relatively little to make the game easier for his teammates, which is the primary job of a point guard. Nash does this better than all but maybe five players in the history of the league. And for as talented as Harris appears to be, and as good as he is in fantasy basketball, somehow his presence has never translated into sustained success for his teams.

I’d rather have Nash for two or three years, before Joe begins to decline, than Harris for five or six years when he may or may not actually do anything to improve the games of his teammates.

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And more importantly, we are talking about making a mid-season trade here, which means whoever the Hawks bring in will have to get used to playing with his new teammates on the fly, without the benefit of training camp or preseason. I trust Nash to be able to do this — especially in light of the fact that he used to be Joe’s teammate — much more than Devin Harris.

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“Scoop it is crazy after a bad game u smoove haters come out.”

Seriously. It’s not just after bad games either. Good games, bad games, it doesn’t matter… for some reason the Hawks’ best defensive player and most willing passer has this legion of haters.

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KenS

Nice job with those ‘Nimbers’ re: a trade that would facilitate NJ, IF they are looking to clear cap space.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but, I think N-Cyde explained that the TPE we got from The Childress trade can only be applied to the Hawks books for an incoming player to our team. This TPE is not transferable/tradeable to another teams books and must be used within 1year of receiving it.

So, based on that, IDK if our TPE would benefit The Nets bottom line.
Besides that, I liked your second option as well.

I agree with Najeh’s assessment of Devin’s skills/talents. I never heard anyone say he was a special player. The 2nd/3rd Tier PG’s are a plenty and collectively have won nothing.

Telfair / Marbury / Andre Miller / Shaun Livingston / Baron Davis / Stevie Francis / and it just don’t stop! Give me Nash and I’ll do a Back – Flip! I’d trade the whole bench with 5 teams involved to make that happen!

Where is Billy Knight when you need a complex deal done to unload dead weight?
He is a Genius at that!

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Brandon Roy to have surgery on BOTH knees. Wow!

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Are the Hawks are contender or pretender?

Answer:

I really like the Hawks but they are pretenders until they find a way to address some obvious flaws.

Mike Bibby is no longer a starter in the NBA. He would do the Hawks and himself a world of good to be a bench player at this stage, but the Hawks do not have a PG worthy of starting in the NBA. They must make a move to find one.

Marvin Williams must come off the bench when returning. You can actually see the upside of Williams as a bench player subbing for both the SF and PF positions being that Powell has fell from the rotation.

Collins or some other true C must start every game for the Hawks and Horford is not a true C. If Collins is not worthy of starting every game it is quite obvious that they need to make a move for a C.

In conclusion the Hawks are a pretender until this is there lineup:

Starters

NEW PG
Joe
Smoove
Al
NEW C

Bench

PG Bibby
SG Jamal
SF Marvin
PF Marvin
C Collins/Zaza

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Guys that should be on the block:

Teague,Jordan, Zaza, Mo, and Marvin

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Steve Nash is the most overrated player in the history of basketball. They guy has more MVP’s than Kobe and has never won anything worth noting not even in the Olympics. We already have Bibby and Crawford who are bad defenders, Nash is not the answer you morons

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Do we really have a lot to give another team if we don’t touch a member of the core? We would only end up with a player a team is salary dumping, a la JC1.
Nice to know there are so many who can come up with the perfect player…problem is, Sund thinks we have what we need.

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superiorblogman, I think you mean guys that should be in the D-League. lol!

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Orlando plays Oklahoma City and Miami plays Denver. Both teams are playing back to back on the road in western time zones. And LeBron has a bad ankle. So the Hawks could wake up tomorrow all alone in second place in the Southeast, just 3.5 games behind first.

JeJe pointed out that the Hawks schedule is going to be very difficult in February so this post is really just a feel-good post for the moment. But it is better than being all alone in third place in the southeast, five games behind Miami.

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How does everyone like the scoring balance this is showing?
18.8 – Joe
16.6 – JC1
16.1/9.7 – Al
15.8/8.7 – Smoove -improved his FT% to 72%….solid improvement.
11.0 – Marvin
10.0 – Bibby – that’s 88.3 of the 97.9 game average….

If we move Marvin/JC1, can we really make up for their scoring? Not sure I see Bibby as a benefit coming off the bench here….to move him would be a huge bonus!

There’s your core!

The Celts top 6? 84.8….wow, Rondo is shooing 43.5FT%..really? worse than Shaq!

The Magic’s new lineup? 88.5

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My starting lineup when Mavin gets back.

PG – Bibby
SG – Jamal
SF – Joe
PF – Jsmoove
C – Horford

Bench – Marvin, Teague, Mo Evans, Zaza, Collins, Jordan Crawford, Powell

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Ken
As much as I have criticized Bibby for his sub-par defense over the years, I would be a hypocrite to defend him now so you are preaching to the choir when you call him out. But to repeatedly suggest that Bibby is the one straw that’s breaking the Hawks back is unfair. Bibby is averaging 30 min per game this season. He is not the only Hawk PG that is yielding points to the opposition. Our overall poor defense is to the credit of the entire team. I saw lapses from Al, Josh Crawford and JJ (just to name a few). Even LD publicly stated during press conference that his team may have played their worse defense so far this season in that game. During the game, I thought LD was reprimanding Al giving Zaza expanded minutes trying to guard Bargnani who also was unstoppable at times. As previously mention, Barbosa took no prisoners slicing and dicing every Hawk player that tried to guard him. Sure we could use an upgrade at the PG position but you and I both know that is unlikely to happen at least this season despite all these crazy trade ideas being offered on this blog. Every team has strengths and weaknesses and yes Bibby defense has routinely been a punching bag in Hawksville. But playing defense has more to do with effort however and to Bibby’s credit; he has improved defensively over previously years as a Hawk. Any defense improvement we get from Bibby should be praised since it rarely happens. However, what about the other problems with this team? I also see more chemistry issue equally troubling for the Hawks from a playoff prospective as those observations must be made as well. There is a reason why LD is constantly tinkering with his lineup and it is not just because of injuries. LD is searching and trying to get the most out of the hand that has been dealt to him.

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“Steve Nash is the most overrated player in the history of basketball. They guy has more MVP’s than Kobe and has never won anything worth noting not even in the Olympics. We already have Bibby and Crawford who are bad defenders, Nash is not the answer you morons”

No, the moron is the one who thinks that MVP is for the “best player”. Nash was arguably the most valuable to the Suns those two years than any other single player in the league was to their team. Obviously so, according to those who voted.

MVP doesn’t mean “most skilled”.

And I’m not one pushing for a trade for Nash, but I greatly respect what the cat has done without major skills other than his cleverness.

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The Hawks have a really good team this season. Are they good enough to win it all? I don’t think so. Could they trade for one or two players that would make them championship contenders? I think they are that close. Who are those players and who do we trade that will make the trades happen without hurting the Hawks chemistry?

I think we have to keep these players-JJ, JC1, Horford, & Josh. Everyone else could be traded for the right player IMHO. The key to any trade that the Hawks might make is getting players that can contribute while adding to the team chemistry. Steve Nash and Tyson Chandler or E. Okafor are possible players that could put the Hawks over the top.

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Joe should play more like Durant. An inch of daylight, and you shoot the ball. No holding or pounding the ball. Trust your jumper when you get open.

How old is Durant again? He is going bald already! Soon he is gonna shave his head bald like MJ.

Even though Hawks won a tough one last night, some fans still complaining. Wow! Only in Atlanta. Bibby had a bad game, but still hit the game winner. Yet folks still rip him up, forgetting so quickly that Hawks didn’t start to win until Mike came aboard. Such short memories.

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“With DHarris, he would be the one required to make major adjustments or changes. With SNash, we’d have to ditch our entire OFF system, since he hasn’t functioned in a structured OFF system in yrs. That means everyone would have to adjust to him. ”

What makes you think so? The Hawks supposedly run a motion offense. Nash is, if not the most unselfish player in the league, at least near the top of that list, so it’s not hard to imagine he would fit in just fine in an offense that emphasizes ball movement and sharing. I also take issue with the idea that Phoenix’s offense isn’t structured — they have always been about running the high pick and roll and kicking out to perimeter shooters. An unstructured offense is what Woody ran last year, where everyone stands around doing random sh-t. That’s exactly the opposite of what Phoenix does. “Uptempo” and “unstructured” are two entirely different things.

If anything, a PG like Harris whose strength is getting to the foul line is likely to need the ball in his hands more, which would be a problem on a team that already has a high usage player like Joe Johnson. Nash is posting a career high usage rate this year, mostly because the rest of his team is horrendous, but even his usage rate this year is less than Harris’ usage rate for any of the past three seasons.

“I noticed you didn’t mention the big advantage DHarris has over SNash when it comes to DEF. Which one do you think would have a greater impact on our greatest problem, PERIMETER DEF? ”

It’s worth noting that at least according to basketball-reference’s Defensive Rating stat, which attempts to estimate how many points a player gives up per possession, Harris is actually a slightly worse defender than Bibby, and has been for the last three years. I’ve expressed my skepticism about this stat before, so take it with a grain of salt if you want, but I have noticed that this stat generally matches up with what I see when I try to compare players to each other. I’m a little surprised that Harris is rated so poorly, but I don’t get to watch him play other teams, so there you go. Of course, both Bibby and Harris have better ratings than Nash, but the fact that Harris probably wouldn’t have any positive effect on the Hawks’ perimeter D makes him a much less attractive trade option.

“Why totally ignore the teams future, it’s DEF, and it’s salary limitations, just to potentially pickup an additional 3.7APG, .6PPG, .9RPG, and a PG you’re obviously a big fan of? If Nash conforms to our OFF system, you can expect most of his numbers to decrease.”

Of course Nash’s numbers will go down on a team where he is surrounded with better teammates and is required to score less. But I’m not drafting Nash in fantasy — I’m talking about trading for him in real life. LeBron James and Dwyane Wade are both putting up lower numbers this year than last year, but clearly they have not become worse players, and clearly the Heat are playing well. The same thing would happen with Nash in a Hawks uniform. Nash’s numbers would go down, but his track record clearly indicates that his presence would cause the Hawks to become a better — and in my opinion, an elite — offensive team.

As far as the Hawks’ future: we are not in rebuilding mode anymore. The minute the Hawks signed Joe to a max deal, knowing very well that Joe was likely to decline over the last two or three seasons of that deal, the Hawks exited rebuilding mode and went into win-now mode. Joe realistically has probably three or four more seasons left at this level of production before he starts to decline. The Hawks need to do everything they can to maximize that opportunity. Nash has an expiring contract this year at $11 million per year (which is very reasonable for his production), and at his age if the Hawks extended him for one more year with a team option for a second year I doubt he would find many better offers on the open market. Keeping him at that salary for three years is perfectly reasonable from a salary cap perspective.

I understand your questions about perimeter D, but the PGs out there who would be significant improvements over Bibby in that area are generally going to be downgrades offensively. It’s not like Russell Westbrook and Rajon Rondo, players who would help in both areas, are available via trade. In light of that fact, if the Hawks can’t make a trade to turn a weakness into a strength, a trade like this to turn a strength into an area of dominance is an equally good option.

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Between Devin Harris, Mike Bibby, and Steve Nash this season, Harris has the highest usage rate, worst true shooting percentage and effective field goal percentage, and worst offensive rating of the three. Bibby has the best defensive rating of the three. Take offensive and defensive rating with a grain of salt, but still, you could make a solid case that Harris not only would have no effect on the Hawks’ defense but would actually make the Hawks’ offense worse, whereas Nash would almost certainly make the Hawks’ offense better even if the Hawks’ perimeter D continues to suffer with him.

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Anyway, none of this matters, since we like our core. Right Rick Sund?

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No trade, of course, is going to take place unless the Hawks are willing to deal Jamal. Nobody is going to trade for the overpaid duo of Marvin and Zaza, especially not a team like Detroit which is entering the Melo talks solely for the purpose of unloading their own bad contracts.

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And if I’m the Nuggets, I’m not sure I don’t take Chandler, Gallineri, and Landry with some picks for ‘Melo. Put them on the floor with Lawson and Nene, that’s not a terrible young starting 5. And surely somebody will be desperate enough for J R Smith and Harrington to take them off your hands.

Not bad if ‘Melo won’t sign with the Nets.

The Knicks are back in the ‘Melo picture BTW, with Mayo in the mix also.

And OKC is beating the Magic late….go Thunder!!!!!!

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3rd seed I should say…

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Westbrook with another triple double, and 32 points.

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Oh no! Thunder can’t close the game out!

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The only reason the Magic are in the game is because Dwight has made 15-18 FT’s. Unheard of for Dwight.

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Orlando down by 3 with 3 seconds left. I think Orlando will lose, which means the hawks will jump over them in the East.

Durant is a beast already, and he is so young too. Wow. With Portland’s luck, he’s pronanly glad that the Blazers did not take him. otherwise, he might have been injured.

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*probably glad the Blazers didnt take him.

SteveW,

I wonder if the thought process is Teague has a higher ceiling (in terms of potential) than Maynor.

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Thunder hangs on by 1 – way to go Thunder!!!

Dwight made 17 of 20 FT’s, or it’s not that close…

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Based on the money, this Nash trade idea stinks on too many levels

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O’Brien – No doubt that Teague has a higher upside, but it seems we prefer safe at that position (Bibby, Maynor) rather than pizzaz (Teague). I don’t though. I think one day we’ll look back and say Teague was a steal at #19, I’m just not sure LD sees it that way.

Just guessing, but I think the only reason Teague saw daylight with the Raptors is because Sund told LD that Gearon Jr. was not happy with Teague’s lack of playing time. But again, that’s just a guess on my part.

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If the Hawks could acquire a PG, my first choice would be Hinrich and then Harris. Hinrich is a better defender, passer and shooter than Harris however Harris is the better athlete and penetrator. Either one would suit me and would be a upgrade over the current Hawks PG…. Calderon would be my third choice.

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If I were the Hawks, I would just say Teague is the starter the next 10 games, and rest Bibby a little bit, and see what happens. If he bombs in a game, we just bring Jamal or Bibby off the bench, and Teague is still getting experience starting.

And the next time we go big, start ZaZa instead of Collins (the next 3 times) and see what happens…

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“I’ve heard the Suns are trying to dump Childress’ contract also in any Nash deal however. That would free up 3 mill to keep Jamal however…”

NBA rules prevent a team from acquiring a player for one year after they trade them, which means the Hawks can’t trade for Childress until July.

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Glad to hear Josh is a huge Birds fan…I JUST REALIZED…I want be able to see the Birds either.
TOO BAD…Ernie Johnson Jr…doesn’t have the Back Bone to speak up for Hawks.

During Ernie Johnson Jr illustrious career AT TNT…You would never know he had any ties to the ATL…save for the BRAVE…YET HE HAS WON ALL THESE AWARDS COVERING BASKETBALL…Go figure.

I say Dude pedigree suspect…Cuz if he loves basketball as much as he proclaim…How TF…can he disown his home team…I HAVE NO RESPECT FOR THAT DUDE.

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NAJEH-you’re right on both accounts. SNash is definitely one of the most unselfish players in NBA history, but his unselfishness has been the result of him constantly dominating the ball and the OFF. And it really doesn’t matter, since neither is likely to end up here. We’re still a young team, and we don’t need to place our present or future in the hands of a 37yr old PG that plays absolutely not DEF whatsoever, even if he is a future HOFer.

When it comes to PPG, APG, SPG, TOPG and overall DEF, can you honestly say that SNash is head and shoulders better than DHarris. DHarris has room for improvement, but we’re seeing the best of SNash at this point. The Hawks have proven to be a very good outside scoring team, which we relied on the last 2yrs. What we’ve lacked offensively is a PG that can penetrate and dish, finish, and/or draw fouls. There’s no doubt SNash can do those things well, but he doesn’t draw fouls as well as DHarris.

DHarris does everything SNash does, and one very important thing he Nash doesn’t do, which you refuse to even address, and that’s PLAY DEFENSE. Before the season began, I recall you making an issue of Teague’s turnover rate, compared to Bibby’s, as well as the importance of DEF. But now you’re willing to throw all of that out of the window for the sake of having a 37yr old SNash, whose TO rate is close to Bibby’s and Teague’s combined, and whose DEF is actually worse than Bibby’s.

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KenS, I will disagree with you on one thing, and perhaps the most important thing. The best thing that Nash does that Harris doesn’t or hasn’t, is LEAD! Nash comes to the Hawks and instantly becomes the on court leader. Nash instantly becomes the leader in playoff basketball games played on the team. Do you realize Josh Smith, Joe, and Al have each played more playoff games than Harris has? Nash makes everyone game come easier. And due to injuries in the past, Nash may have more game left in his body than Harris does.

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“one very important thing he Nash doesn’t do, which you refuse to even address, and that’s PLAY DEFENSE. ”

I did address this. Defensive ratings: Bibby 109, Harris 111, Nash 116. All three of them are bad at defense.

“Before the season began, I recall you making an issue of Teague’s turnover rate, compared to Bibby’s, as well as the importance of DEF. But now you’re willing to throw all of that out of the window for the sake of having a 37yr old SNash, whose TO rate is close to Bibby’s and Teague’s combined, and whose DEF is actually worse than Bibby’s.”

I don’t remember this exactly, but if anything, I probably pointed it out to indicate that Teague was improving and deserves more minutes. I have never disputed that Nash is bad defensively. My point is that Nash is so good offensively at the PG position that he would lift the Hawks from being a good offensive team to an elite offensive team, and his impact on the Hawks’ already poor perimeter defense wouldn’t be nearly bad enough to cancel out the advantage he provides offensively.

Comparing players solely based on stats without taking into account their team situation and role doesn’t make much sense.

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Guess who’s now 2nd in the Southeastern Division, and tied with the Bulls for 3nd in the Eastern Conference?

RA’MON-I’m looking more at the Hawks future, especially at PG, and SNash isn’t the answer. I’m also concerned about rectifying our poor perimeter DEF, and again, SNash isn’t the answer. SNash has definitely proven to be a leader, but he can’t lead anyone anywhere DEFENSIVELY.

SNash is certainly not a long term solution for the Hawks at PG, and it’s not a given he’d be a short team solution either. You can’t deny that overall, DHarris is producing as well as SNash. And it’s not inconceivable that he could improve his overall production if he was surrounded by the superior talent of the Hawks.

Why am I still the only one in this discussion about SNash vs DHarris who’s willing to acknowledge or address the issue of DEFENSE, or the lack thereof, when it comes to SNash? WE DON’T NEED ANYMORE DEF LIABILITIES AT PG.

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KenS, I can’t say Harris is producing as well as Nash is. Nash is averaging 3 assists more a game than Harris. Nash is shooting .80 better from the field than Nash (there’s a huge difference between .436 and .510). Harris has attempted more field goals, yet Nash has made more. This season, the talent level of the Suns have not been drastically better than the talent level of the Nets. Lopez, and Humphries would both start if they were on the Suns.

I am a huge defensive guy. Yet, I realize the steals statistic is a very misleading statistic. For instance, Iverson was never a great defender, but was always in the top 3-5 of steal leaders in the league. Steals can be evidence of playing the passing lanes (not straight up one on one defense) or it could be just opportunistic turnovers by the opposition. Yet I do know, I’d take that extra 3 assists over that 1 steal any day of the week from the PG. Nash play making ability may be the best defensive option. The way he fines alleys for his passes will often times lead to Josh, Joe, and Al going to the free throw line, and having opposing team in foul trouble early. With Nash, I realistically see Josh, Joe, and Al each averaging 2-4 points more a game, just based off of having to do less with the ball when they receive the pass.

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“Why am I still the only one in this discussion about SNash vs DHarris who’s willing to acknowledge or address the issue of DEFENSE, or the lack thereof, when it comes to SNash? WE DON’T NEED ANYMORE DEF LIABILITIES AT PG.”

Why are you ignoring the fact that Harris is also a poor perimeter defender?

This is from before the start of this season:

http://nbaplaybook.com/2010/08/10/can-he-bounce-back-devin-harris/#more-4576

Devin Harris has already been a poor defender since joining the Nets in New Jersey, but Nets’ fans and their coaching staff were willing to live with the inefficiency when he is being productive on the offensive end. However, when he struggles on offense (which is what happened this year), his defensive lapses become much more of a glaring problem. The strange thing about Devin’s defensive struggles is that he has all the skills to be a good defender. He’s quick, long, and has good foot speed, but he is just lazy in his technique. Instead of using his feet to beat offensive players, he reaches and goes in for steals way too much, this gets him caught flat-footed and is what gets him beat by slower points:

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**Nash is shooting .80 better from the field than Nash** I mean than Harris. Sorry

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You guys have to see this!!! Tweeted by Sekou:

http://dimemag.com/2011/01/dime-exclusive-josh-can%E2%80%99t-dunk/

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Then yall act like dude got rondo d. Get real

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Miami and Dallas….It is hard playing without your best player…Lol

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To all these undercover Suns fans impersonating as Hawks Fans to sell the 37 year old Nash, I say keep trying but remember, we are on to you.

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we’re not getting nash

we need bibby to be our d fish

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Ken . . . Devin Harris is at best a C+ defender. You talk him up like he’s 3rd team all-defense.

Acquiring Nash is a no-brainer, if we could get him.

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[...] Atlanta Journal Constitution [...]

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MARVIN, TEAGE AND 1ST FOR DEVIN DO IT SUND.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!

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I clicked on the link to the Toronto Raptors Morning Coffee, but it simply confirmed what we already know… That Canadians are whiners, eh

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Mike, I agree, the first option should be to keep Jamal (and attempt to move Marvin and pieces for Nash).

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O’Brien, I wonder why the Magic haven’t seriously looked at a possible deal for someone like Camby. Could you imagine having Camby coming off the bench behind Bass and D12?

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In looking at the PGs we think are available, I bring in Chauncey and his skillset because you know the rebuilding is going to happen in Denver with that mgmt group totally turned over this year, a la Phoenix.

Suns lose Amare, they have no shot at the Lakers.
Nuggest lose Carmelo, they have no shot at the Lakers.

Now anyone, tell me, what this fan base would do if we brought in Billups or Melo? This town would buy in big time….all games are a must see, the buzz would be here and put pressure on the Magic, Celtics and the Heatles to play their A game against us.

You get me either one of these guys, make them the floor leader, and the rest of the balanced scoring Hawk attack moves forward. And I dont’ care who you move to get them. My only exception at this point might be Al.

SteveW, good stuff on the scheduling…..and Ken, the Hawks should be up around 2nd or 3rd at this juncture. Their schedule has been so favorable. The 2nd half could bring some bumps but I expect guys to step up for each other going forward.

LD has done a favorable job with the core. I would just like the core to be extended a bit with a top flight floor leader, if there is such a player available at this juncture.

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Let me close this enjoyable discussion, at least for me, over SNash vs DHarris by saying, I’D MUCH RATHER HAVE SNASH AS OUR STARTING PG THAN MBIBBY.

Did you see that beat down of Miami last night? Like us, they’re vulnerable to teams with quick, fast, athletic PG’s, except they are usually able to overcome it, most of the time, and we aren’t.

MC-When is Marvin coming back? We need him back(no pun intended)and productive for the difficult upcoming stetch run. With the team doing so well in his absence, I’m wondering if he won’t wait until after the All Star break to return. He’ll need time and practice to get his legs and timing back.

We can talk trade scenarios all we want, but with the team playing so well, I seriously doubt if the Hawks will make a trade, unless it’s a minor one involving MEvans, or maybe even JTeague. I think the contract issue between Jamal and the Hawks boil down to him wanting an extension before a CBA agreement is reached, and the Hawks not wanting to make a committment until after a CBA agreement is reached.

They both want to get it done, it’s just the timing of the matter that’s a problem.

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some folks are concerned about nash’s age, 37, i would be too except for one fact. dude is an avid soccer player!! after the season is over, he goes back home and plays soccer. do you know what kinda shape you have to be in to play soccer? i would take a 37 year old pg, who is an avid soccer player over a 32 pg who doesn’t play pg.

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mc,
in your analysis of the players thru midseason, i see that horford’s numbers have increased since he has moved to the 4. it is funny that sund considers him and 5 and the coach and the player say that he is optimum at the 4.

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Oh and add Bibby to that list!! I would rather give up Bibby than Teague but IF they want Teague instead, Heck, MAKE IT HAPPEN THAN SUND!!

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Any Chance we can move up the 7pm start to 4pm or earlier? We’ve got Falcons to watch too!

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Well, naw let me change my mind on Teague. I dont think its smart to give away Teague’s speed and aggression for a 37 yr old, non-playing DEF PG. We need Teague to stay and learn OFF from Nash. Bibby, Marvin, TPE and both draft picks for Nash..TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT!!

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Some of Y’all need a crash course in D-Harris-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOsRE9Xewk4

He is a destructive offensive force that causes Bigs nightmares.

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Rick Kamla posted a video on Nash’s destination, he said “The Mavericks and the Hawks are the top two destinations for Nash.”

So for all of you saying that there is no chance, an NBA analyst himself said we are top 2 on the list.

Now he said the trades we could offer would be either Marvin and Mo for Nash or JC1 for Nash straight up. He also said as currently constructed we have no chance to get out of the playoffs against a Boston, Miami, Orlando, or Chicago team.

Before anyone says why don’t we just do the deal? This is all speculation Phoenix has to want to trade Nash and that may be hard for them to realize so whether Nash gets traded…who knows, but we are apparently high on the list.

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” but we are apparently high on the list.”
____________________________

The only list that matters is The Suns and THe Hawks!
If, Wajornowski isn’t saying it? It’s just a speculative rumor.

Sure, of the near Elite Teams, The Hawks are in dire need of a true PG, anybody with a pulse can see that – EXCEPT Sund. My emotions can’t get up for any Hawks Talk re: ant trades, I’ll believe it when I see it! Until then?

I’m like The Boss, “I’ll go to war with what I’ve got.”

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Thanks for the link Jae.

6 years later, we are still looking for a long term PG, but yet “it was not a bad pick” said he would still take Marvin even if Hawks got to do-over the draft. SMH.

Hawks have taken care of business against bad teams. So although the schedule gets tougher, I am looking forward to playing the better teams.

And with most of those games at home, I hope fans will go out and support the Hawks.

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Omg. I LOVE JOE JOHNSON. SCREW YOU GUYS. GO HAWKS. NO MORE TRADING PLEASE. BTW MIKE BIBBY DID A GREAT JOB LAST NIGHT. XOXO.

P.S.
GO HAWKS♥♥♥♥

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Just be glad we’re actually being named in trade rumors for once. That don’t happen often. I don’t want 1/2 the deals to come to fruition, but it’s nice to know your GM has you in the mix for opportunities. Anything can happen between now and Feb.

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The Hawks have replaced Orlando at #2 in the division, and are tied with the Bulls for 3rd in the Eastern Conference. They now have a chance to prove whether they’re an elite team by how well they navigate the difficult parts of the remainder of this month’s and next month’s schedule. We have 12 gms in FEB, with only 4 at home and 7 consecutive rd gms.

I hope everyone holds up and gives us consistent production, especially Bibby.

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“With Dwight playing so many minutes, I think Orlando will make another move before the deadline to bring in a backup center. Plus with Dwight’s technicals on the rise, he might eventually have to miss a game. ”

I think so too, but I wonder who would be available to them and who they would be willing to trade. I’ve heard some of the ESPN NBA people speculating that Jameer Nelson may be their odd man out, which would really surprise me.

Good point about Dwight and the technicals. If those carry over to the postseason, they could loom even larger.

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Najeh,

Do the techs carry into the postseason or do players get a new set? Thought maybe they get like 6 for the playoffs?

Dwight will be screwed in a 7 game series vs. [Perkins], Shaq, and KG. They’ll mess with his head – no homo

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I think I mentioned Nash only lived in South Africa for 18 months. He was born in South Africa. He is from South Africa. He may have later moved to Canada. But when people ask me where I’m from, I usually reference where I’m born.

And Jesus was from Bethlehem on His mother’s side, and from Heaven on His Father’s side. Seems like just a difference in terminology to me.

But Nash is from (was born in) South Africa.

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O’Brien – I don’t want to do any trade in conference. I don’t want Etan helping Dwight/Bass/Anderson.

And I don’t want Mo’ guarding JJ or Jamal. Not a good trade, but I wouldn’t mind having Duhon. But I would only trade Bibby for him, and I’m not sure Duhon gives you anything that Bibby doesn’t already.

Devin Harris and Steve Nash are huge upgrades on Bibby. Chris Duhon not so much.

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JeJe – I would think that the East would carry 5 G’s, and JJ can play some 3 as well. I think JJ makes the All Star team, but I could be wrong. He is definitely the 2nd best SG in the Eastern Conference, behind DWade, and deserves the All Star team, no question.

And Rondo seems to have missed as many or more games that JJ. Haven’t checked, but it seems that way.

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SteveW,

Fair enough, but personally, when someone asks me where I’m from, I give my answer as “The North Georgia Mountains” where I have lived for the last 29 years. I do NOT say “Cardiac Hill” (Piedmont Hospital), or even Atlanta because my parents didn’t even live in Fulton County when I was born.

So does ‘Nique know that he’s not from Washington, North Carolina?

And do you have a source for the “from Bethlehem on his mother’s side”?

I haven’t heard that one, though I’m no Biblical scholar.

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“His West reserves are very solid, but dude has RAYMOND FELTON and Rondo as reserve guards OVER Joe. ”

I can understand Rondo, because his assist numbers have been insane and he’s probably the league’s best defensive point guard. But Felton over Joe is a joke. The Knicks get such an insane amount of media coverage for being a team with even less of a shot at a title than the Hawks.

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the ESPN “Image of the Black Athlete” is good programing.. tune in..

i see that the Hawks Arthur Triche is present..

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“They could trade Duhon too. What u think? Mo Evans and etan for duhon?”

I wouldn’t be losing any sleep over losing Mo and Etan, but I’m not a huge Duhon fan either. I would hope they can get someone a little better than him if they are going to make a trade.

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This is my trade proposal and I’m sticking to it:

Suns get-Teague, Evans, Powell, and Marvin

Hawks get-Nash and Dudley

Teague, Evans, and Powell all have expiring contracts. The Suns want cap space for flexibility to improve their team. Marvin just needs a change IMHO. This works for them.

The Hawks finally get their PG in Nash. Dudley gives them another 3 PT. threat.

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Ant Banks

What happened to John Wall? What’s the knock on his game? He any good?

Sautee

You up 575 N? I lived in Blue Ridge and Ellijay and worked in Murphy, NC on Wednesdays for 2 years from 200d to 2007. I did my Internship up there, I worked with a very successful doctor up there who had 3 practice locations.

Those were some of the best years in my recent past. Great lifestyle, I miss it a lot. Are you near there? Canton? I’m jealous.
_________________________

I don’t like Duhon at all. I wish we could get Teague going, he does need some burn, his problem is he was drafted by a very good, winning team. It’s hard to develop someone who should have stayed in school to work on his body and game for another year or two. Teague chose money over his game development. Too many kids ruin their own careers by showing up not ready, that’s on them. This is a Grown Man’s Business and make no mistake about it:

The NBA is a Business!

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Would anyone consider trading for Rodney Stuckey 6′3 pg from (DET) and moving Bibby to the bench (Keeping him with his shoot off the bench is an asset) a move like this give you a soild pg (remeber the Mookie Blaylock trade)Teague is not a go getta his over thinking when playing. this trade also would free up your most important player (Joe) from guarding these quicker pg every nite. * Side note I Love what Josh Smith could be for this team and its simple SELF CONTROL ( Shot selection, Energy, and get back to the Defense from years past) Mr.Smith you could put this team over the hump with a lil more HEART

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How the hell do you bloggers think that jc1 isn’t worth 9 mill after what we gave jj,mb,zazza or me. Get real . We would be crazy to let him go. He is a better offensive player than jj who holds on to the ball way to much & takes to many shotsbto get his 20

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Mary Ellen,

Get my number from you know who and call me sometime. I’ll catch you up on the mountains.

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All of this talk about trades gets me a bit disappointed, considering I doubt that the Hawks’ management will be bold enough to make any moves. Hopefully, they prove me wrong, but if any trade does happen for the Hawks before the deadline, it will most likely be a the 11th hour. That’s the way ASG operates.

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Chemistry killer Shaq has 21/5 and 5 blocks against the Bobcats. Come on Zaza, can you match that in a week?

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Chosen,

I like Stuckey. I was for the Hawks drafting him, but it didn’t happen.

superiorblogman,

I like your trade pairs. I wish the ASG would do something to give the Hawks a real shot @ a championship! Enough of the holding pat already!!!

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Whoever said that Rose can’t shoot is looking at old news. He’s shooting 37.4% from 3 point range.

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I havent confirmed the source, but from my online readings, the players start over (as far as technicals are concerned) in the playoffs.

However, they are only allowed 6 technicals in each series. After the 7th technical, they miss a game. And if they get 2 more technicals, they miss another game.

The technical counts start over in each series.

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“I could be wrong, but I still think the Bulls are legit and the Knicks are not. Unless the Knicks get ‘Melo, I think they fade in the 2nd half of the season.”

I agree, and even with Melo I don’t think the Knicks are legit. The difference is D. The Suns never got to the Finals because they didn’t play D, and the Knicks are going to be the same as long as D’Antoni is there. The Bulls on the other hand have one dominant defensive player (Noah) who makes everyone else on the team better defensively. Not to mention, if the Knicks trade for Melo they will have eight D-Leaguers in the rotation aside from Melo, Felton, and Amare. The Bulls’ backcourt depth isn’t all that, but they have good bench players up front.

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I just love how all these articles I keep reading seem to think it’s so “clear” that the Bulls are elite and a step ahead of the Hawks.

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Sautee

I will call you know who and get your number. Would love to meet you and the beautiful wife I keep hearing about.

I we don’t extend Jamal? Then what? Jamal just fits this team perfectly, I thought he had finally found a home, apparently so did he. There are a lot of other players on this team, not named Jamal that needs to get gone!

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That hectic schedule that the Hawks played at the beginning of the season has spoiled me. This has been too long between games. And now, tonight, the Hawks and Falcons play at the same time.

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The Hawks will be 2.5 games out of first place in the much vaunted Southeast Division after tonight.

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@ ESPN Hawks-Rockets Preview

Could somebody please write something positive about the Hawks…..

The article on NBA.com talked about passing on CP3 and Dwilliams, but never mentioned those PG’s haven’t won anything. The Hawks are just as good as their teams with the route we have taken.

Some people on this blog take pleasure in those articles, because they disrespect Marvin….But the real key to this teams winS is JOE……………. Ask Dallas and Miami how hard it is to win without your best player.

People please stop acting like if we drafted CP3 we would would be the same team minus Marvin……WE WOULD JUST BE THE HORNETS…24-16

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Rev
“And after taking care of business against Sacramento on Monday”

Not a given

You should know better; Given the Hawks jump shooting style of play and soft defense, any likely outcome is possible in these upcoming games. It all depends on whose hot, whose not, and/or the willingness of the players to play defense the entire game. Lately, it seems the Hawks winning trend is because of “The Difference”, Jamal Crawford has decided to just play ball regardless of his uncertain future.

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ant banks,

about this:

mc,
“in your analysis of the players thru midseason, i see that horford’s numbers have increased since he has moved to the 4. it is funny that sund considers him and 5 and the coach and the player say that he is optimum at the 4.”

A few things, ant:

First, Horford has not “moved” to the 4. Here’s part of a post by niremetal on Big Ray’s blog:

someone posted:”Al Horford has played far more power forward this year than center,”

Actually, while Al has spent way more time at PF this year than in past years, he still has played well over twice as many minutes at C as he has at PF:
http://www.82games.com/1011/10ATL12.HTM

Well over twice the minutes at center, ant. That does NOT seem to indicate that he has “moved” to PF, does it?

And why is it that you don’t laud coach AND player for their flexibility? Horford clearly said in the off season that the Hawks have mismatches in quickness against most teams when he plays the 5 and Josh the 4. He understands that even though he has the body of a 4, that the Hawks have advantages with him playing the 5.

Yes, he admits that he is physically better suited to the 4, as does LD, but he has NOT complained about playing the 5, other than to ask for more help down low (which Collins has provided).

Ant, remember that Horford made the freakin’ All-Star game as a center last year. I can see why the hawks see him as a valid center. Even if it’s not his “optimal” position. And about his numbers being up, well I think even had he played all his minutes at center, his numbers would be up because he worked on his jumper and increased his shooting %.

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SteveW,

I looked at the biblical references you gave, and saw nothing about the origins of Mary’s family. Maybe Rev in Tampa could help.

Rev (if you read this) do you know where the Virgin Mary’s family lived?

Steve, I’m not interested in a biblical argument, so you don’t have to respond. Just letting you know that I couldn’t find the answers I wanted in those verses.

Selah

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“People please stop acting like if we drafted CP3 we would would be the same team minus Marvin……WE WOULD JUST BE THE HORNETS…24-16″

Uh… no. The Hawks plus CP3 minus Marvin would be at worst the 3rd best team in the conference.

Doesn’t matter, though, since if the Hawks had drafted CP3 they wouldn’t have been in the position to draft Horford, and this team would look very different at the PF and C positions.

Don’t blame CP3 for his team being mismanaged. He’s just one of the many superstars throughout the history of sports who got screwed by bad management.

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Sautee,

I don’t have a Bible in front of me at the moment, but Matthew chapter 1 traces Christ’s ancestry back to King David through HIS FATHER, and not through His mother. Joseph and Mary went back to Bethlehem to report for the census because of Joseph, not Mary.

There is a passage, however, in Luke 2 where Mary visits Elizabeth (the mother of John the Baptist) and it is specifically stated that they are related as sisters (I can’t remember whether they are sister-in-laws off the top of my head).

I am shooting from the hip on this so I’ll check it out a little later.

However, while stating that the ancestry of Christ is traced from Joseph, the Bible is clear that Joseph was not Christ’s biological father. Jesus Christ is “the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made; who for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the Virgin Mary,…”

I think that SteveW is eager to safe-guard divinity Christ. And it very well could be SteveW is correct in his assertion about Mary. It is certainly possible that Mary and Joseph were closely related kind of like Franklin & Elanor Roosevelt. They tended to marry within their ‘clans” (for lack of better word) in the Ancient Near East.

I studiously try to keep theology off the blog, but when asked I am always eager. I love my Savior infinitely more than my beloved Hawks and would much rather talk about Him. If you are interested, I will post a couple of links to my church website that lists what I believe and a blog I started about a month ago:

http://www.wpcbrandon.org/what-we-believe-1

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Jae Evolution asked:

“Jae Evolution

Just looked at the All-star voting for East Guards….and Joe isn’t even on the top 10 list, did I miss something?”
_____________________________

Yes! Those are fans voting for their home team guys.
Hawks Fans don’t like their core and therefore do not vote.

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How good is this blog? You can get an education about the NBA and The Bible at the same time.

As for the Hawks, people still have to keep in mind that we’ve played an extremely soft schedule over the past 3 weeks or so. We’re doing a great job in taking care of business in these games, no doubt about it. And our best win came @ Utah.

But after Monday, we’re going to get a decent look at how we stand amongst the top teams in the league for about a 2 week stretch.

Road games: Miami, Milwaukee, Charlotte, Dallas
Home games: New Orleans, New York

If we’re on the way to becoming “elie”, I’d expect us to go 4 – 2 at the minimum. Anything less, and there may stll be questions about this team vs good squads.

Charlotte and Milwaukee aren’t necessarily “good”, but those are places where we’ve had trouble winning in the recent past.

The other 4 teams are part of the hoopdata.com 12 team “NBA SUPERLEAGUE”, in which they track how the 12 best teams in the league ( back in late December ) are playing against each other.

The Hawks are 4 – 9 in the “superleague” . . good for last place.

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“Aaron Brooks does not start for The Rockets this year, he has been benched in favor of Collins?”

Kyle Lowry. Brooks didn’t get benched for him; he got injured and Lowry took his spot. Brooks is still playing his way back into game shape.

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Najeh

I agree with your post at 3:41pm…CP3= no Boss….that is what I ment when I said we would be the Hornets. WE ARE THE 3RD BEST IN THE EAST.

Northcyde

We will go atleast 4-2.

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From Hoopshype…

Atlanta Hawks (26-14)

Quiet as kept, the Hawks are once again on pace for a 50-win season and their fourth consecutive playoff appearance. The difference is how the club has managed to maintain their winning ways. Atlanta is under the leadership of a rookie head coach and has successfully implemented a brand new offensive scheme. The Hawks have also survived the early season injury bug. Last season the Hawks’ top six players missed a total of 14 games. Through 39 games this season those same players have combined to miss 24 contests as Joe Johnson, Marvin Williams and Jamal Crawford have all battled through an assortment of ailments.

The most notable trade asset for the Hawks is Crawford, the reigning Sixth Man of the Year. It is a widely known fact that Crawford wants to remain in Atlanta as his career winds down but the franchise recently invested over $180 million to Johnson and Al Horford, putting his future with the squad in limbo.

The team has attempted to find a taker for Williams’ contract in the past to no avail, but losing him without receiving a serviceable small forward in return would weaken the team since there is currently no depth at the position. Veteran guard Mike Bibby is enjoying a career resurgence shooting 49 percent from three-point range this season, but is clearly past his prime so this may be the ideal time to receive some value in return.

Notable Trade Chips: Jamal Crawford (1 year, $10.1 million), Mike Bibby (2 years, $11.8 million), Marvin Williams (4 years, $30 million), Maurice Evans (1 year, $2.5 million).

Salary Cap situation: $12 million over the salary cap and $1.1 million under the luxury tax

Trade Exceptions: $3.6 million (J. Childress)

Read more NBA news and insight: http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=18456#ixzz1B9NFTXVF

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REV FROM TAMPA/SAUTEE-I don’t want to step on anyones toes, or create any controversy, but the oldest recorded Christ figure in history was the Egyptian Christ HERU, or HORUS(Greek name). He has been documented to be over 4100yrs older than JESUS. Also, their lives, deeds, and words spoken are virtually identical, including his virgin birth, and being the only begotten son(sun)of God. JUST FOOD FOR THOUGHT.

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I’m looking on atdhe.net and it looks like the Thrashers play tonight too, although they are on the road.

So it begs the question… which number will be higher, the combined TV audience of the Hawks and Thrashers, or the crowd in the Georgia Dome?

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