Hawks update, heavy on Jason Collins

Greetings, Hawks fans-

Ken Sugiura sitting in again for MC, as he recovers from a lengthy road trip. No charter planes and fancy hotels for MC. (So much as I know, at any rate) He’s a straight road beast.

Anyway, a few tidbits from Hawks practice.

1) Larry Drew said he would probably sit down with Rick Sund Saturday to talk about possible 10-day contract guys. Apparently, El Sund was not feeling well Friday.

2) Marvin Williams came in early for treatment, didn’t practice and was to talk with Drew after practice. I saw Marvin in the locker room after I spoke with Drew but didn’t get to talk with him.

3) Drew positively raved about Jason Collins, which is the focus of the story for Saturday’s paper. I asked Drew if it’s possible the big lineup could become the de facto starting five and he said, “I can certainly see it.” Basically, the pros and cons with the big lineup are better than pros and cons with the heretofore regular lineup. Change may be a-comin’.

4) Drew acknowledged Williams’ previously mentioned less-than-giddy reaction to being dropped out of the starting five. Said Drew, “Anytime a guy goes from a starter and he has to come off the bench, it’s just been my experience most guys are not going to be jumpin for joy about it, but Marvin’s a professional and I’m sure he sees exactly what it is we’re trying to accomplish.” Drew also noted that as a bench guy, he has a chance to be the No. 1 or 2 option on the floor with the backups rather than 4 or 5 with the starters.

5) I thought this was some interesting background, and I apologize if MC’s already mentioned it. Drew said that when he got the job, he sat down and wrote down a list of things he thought would make the team better. First was, as you might guess, an offense in which players would be forced to move the ball rather than playing isolation.

Said Drew, “I also kept saying Al is not a 5. Al is a 4. I wanted to have him playing more 4.” He wasn’t sure if that could happen, though, because he didn’t want to start Zaza Pachulia because he thought he helped the team the most coming off the bench, which left Collins, whom Drew knew from his one year as an assistant with the Nets.

6) A funny Drew observation about the other Hawks big men: “Let’s say they can’t guard Dwight (Howard). They think they can guard him now because of what Jason is doing. He’s going out there and battling and banging. So it’s a little bit of a ripple effect.”

70 comments Add your comment

Rod from College Park

January 7th, 2011
7:37 pm

I’ll tell Marvin, if everyone is scared to. Oh yeah, first.

Boooo!

January 7th, 2011
7:53 pm

YOu tellem Rod! I’ll back you up :-)

O'Brien

January 7th, 2011
7:55 pm

Props to LD for willing to try different combinations.

As for Marvin…would you rather start and be a 5th option, or come off the bench as the 2nd option? And I thought it didn’t matter who started, because it was about who finishes. Oh wait. Marvin is not the finisher either.

And thumbs up to Jason Collins for losing all that weight, and playing well. But thumbs down to Jason Collins for being overweight last year, and not dedicated to losing the weight last season.

doc

January 7th, 2011
8:09 pm

heh heh @ o’b

And I thought it didn’t matter who started, because it was about who finishes. Oh wait. Marvin is not the finisher either.

it bears repeating. i couldnt have said it better.

GT Alum

January 7th, 2011
8:11 pm

Well, and it’s not like Marvin has to look far to see what coming off the bench can do for you. Crawford had his best year last year coming off the bench. It is a lot easier when plays are being run for you.

Chillz seemed like the perfect complimentary guy at that 3 spot because he was willing to make the effort plays and clean up the garbage. Marvin seems to need plays run for him.

Rev in Tampa

January 7th, 2011
8:12 pm

Thanks Ken Sugiura,

Your post gave us plenty of red meat to chew on. Drew’s comments about Al being a 4 and NOT A 5 is especially interesting. SO is he saying that Josh is NOT A 4 but a 3?

Also ‘its not a bad pick’ is finally getting his wish… Marvin is finally a 1st or 2nd option… off the bench.

Its also funny that the other Hawks big men are gaining some swagger by watching Collins take care of business aroung the basket. So Cheeseburger is now a role model.

And what are we to make of Drew sitting down with Sund to discuss 10-day contracts. Does he want Wilkins back even though he was giving him so little playing time while he was with the team. Maybe Drew liked the idea that Wilkins stayed with the team in Utah after they waived him just like he liked the fact the Pape Sy paid his own plane ticket to try out for the Hawks.

ATL FAN

January 7th, 2011
8:13 pm

Why are you mentioning last season O’Brien, the man realized where he was headed so he worked hard! We can go through so many scenarios like that

terrell

January 7th, 2011
8:15 pm

“He wasnt sure it would happen though, because he didnt want to start Zaza Pachulia.” Can you blame him? lol!

terrell

January 7th, 2011
8:25 pm

Is it ok to pray that there’s no power outtages this weekend? No TV, no computer, and low on firewood. Not to mention, icy roads. And I dont need to miss work Sunday night. lol!

terrell

January 7th, 2011
8:37 pm

“So is he saying Josh is a 3, not a 4?” Nope. Everyone and their Mama knows that Al’s natural position is pf. I’m sure Woody knew it too. But like LD said, “he didnt want to start Zaza Pachulia.” and btw, Josh is a hybrid. No real natural positon. Just a ball player.

Rev in Tampa

January 7th, 2011
8:42 pm

terrell,

Here is what Jesus says in John 15:7-8:

“If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you. This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.”

By the way, it will be 68 degrees here in Tampa tomorrow…

tjhook

January 7th, 2011
8:57 pm

Why does it seem Marvin is fairly clueless? He thinks things will never change and when it does he doesn’t respond to the demotion with any desire to take charge of the situation. Man up, Marvin!!

Rev in Tampa

January 7th, 2011
8:59 pm

Pacers beating Spurs by 11 going into the 4th. If they win will they come in with great confidence or will they be tired and flat? Also Sixers are beating Bulls by 14 well into the 4th. Orlando is up by 1 in the 2nd.

Hopefully the Sixers lead will hold up and the Hawks can pull even with them with a win tomorrow night. If Orlando loses tonight Atlanta could be tied for 3rd in the East.

Rev in Tampa

January 7th, 2011
9:00 pm

*pull even with the “Bulls”

mykhalc

January 7th, 2011
9:03 pm

damn!!! Marvin goin’ to the bench FINALLY!!!! i could even become interested again on this mere fact alone!!! then again….!!! prove yourself Drew….make the damn change ALREADY!!!!

Cutty

January 7th, 2011
9:05 pm

Seriously do you guys even look at the games. Marvin has been playing very well lately prior to the injury. I hope that they do move him to the bench so we can watch Josh Smith get taken off the dribble 15 times a night. Josh Smith is is a horrible defender we will regret having him at the 3. Mark my words……..

mykhalc

January 7th, 2011
9:05 pm

@tjhook…Marvin HAS man-ed up!!! that’s ALL he’s got …PERIOD!!!!

beone

January 7th, 2011
9:21 pm

Hawks need to trade Josh S, J Crawford and M Bibby plus scraps for a starter quality PG and a starter quality Center. Of course, it takes two GMs (or more) to make it happen and the guts to pull the trigger. But I can still dream!

darrell starks

January 7th, 2011
9:28 pm

For any one think marvin should starte are 2 be a shame of your self.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!

darrell starks

January 7th, 2011
9:35 pm

Josh is 10time better than marvin at the 3, like i said before no one can guard josh in the paint playing the 3 he could easily score 20point a game if LD RECOGNIZE THAT, josh have been playing 7years at the 4 against guys 2 or 3 inches taller than him, so what do you think he would do against guys 2 or 3 inches smaller than him in the box.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!

Paradise Lost

January 7th, 2011
10:27 pm

Does anyone have a link to the JJ interview on Jim Rome is Burning from today?

Major de`Coverly

January 7th, 2011
10:28 pm

Marvin hass a bad attitude and it is going to get only worse when he finds out he is being shopped around. collins is a good player and zaza.
I wish we could get another one for marvin.

Ramon

January 7th, 2011
10:31 pm

Najeh, I love your comments on the last blog. If the Hawks could acquire Nash, I think that would make Jordan Crawford so valuable off the bench because of the looks he would get.

O'Brien

January 7th, 2011
10:45 pm

If the magic struggle in the playoffs, would they bring jameer and Gilbert back? That’s a lot of money to pay 2 PGs. With jameer being best friends with Dwight, could the Hawks trade for jameer?

With josh and jameer both playing for the hawks, both very good friends with dwight, That would increase the possibility of getting Dwight to come here in 2012. Hawks would have to be very creative though.

Melvin

January 7th, 2011
10:46 pm

Watching the Bucks/Heat game. Bucks up by 4 with 4mins remaining. The Heat players are whining and crying on every play. Very ugly to watch. Those Heat players are a bunch of cry babies…

ant banks

January 7th, 2011
10:54 pm

i am glad that jason collins was professional enuff to lose the weight over the summer, instead of comin’ back bloated.

i also applaud larry drew. he seems to be a people person or motivator, no way woody would have played jason collins. larry drew typically has been goin’ with a 9man rotation.

i like our chances.

O'Brien

January 7th, 2011
11:21 pm

Najeh,

As tempting as a trade for Nash might be, he would add $11.5 mil to our $64 mil payroll next year.

Even with the increased fan attendance, jersey sales, national TV appearances etc, I can’t imagine the ASG would go for that trade (especially with the potential of lower salaries under a new CBA).

waterstim

January 7th, 2011
11:24 pm

COMMENT ABOUT TERRANCE MOORE AND RUMEAL ROBINSON
I so distinctly remember Terrance Moore writing a column about how great Rumeal Robinson was.
How he had scored not so great on his SAT, but was accepted into Michigan anyways and had even taken course work at Harvard. I got one thing to say: 6 1/2 years in prison for the thhug. They should send Terrance to Silicon Valley where they can maybe give him an artificial intelligence implant.

Ramon

January 7th, 2011
11:33 pm

O’Brien, I think the ASG would strongly consider it either way. Nash is still loved in Canada. As businessmen, ASG would be foolish not to see the market potential the Hawks instantly gain in a new continent. At the end of the day it is about the money, and its ok to pay luxury taxes, when you see at the bottom line you’re going to be turning a profit still. Gearon said he would open the wallet for Lebron. Well before Lebron, Nash was the last MVP staple of the league.

Also in the off season, I believe Bibby’s contract will become easier to move because he will be in the last season of that deal. Moving Bibby to a team full of trade exceptions would be quite possible. Also Zaza’s deal would be easier to move. And I believe his services can be replaced for a cheaper price. If the Hawks trade t heir draft pick, that softens how much guaranteed money they have to spend compared to vet minimum contracts. I could even see someone like Grant Hill coming to Atlanta in the off season for pay cut to play with this team.

Also don’t forget with Nash in place, his contract expires right before D12 becomes a free agent. Re-signing Nash for a pay cut, and signing and trading Horford for D12, would make the books look a lot better in 2012. I couldn’t imagine Nash not being better than Bibby is today in 2012. Bibby was never the assist man that Nash is. And we all saw that even Stockton NEVER lost his court vision. And with this deal you are also making yourself attractive for D. Rivers. I actually believe Rivers is the one coach ASG would open the wallet for and do whatever it takes to bring the golden boy home. With Rivers, Nash, Joe, D12, and Josh, this team is more formidable than the Super friends.

Najeh Davenpoop

January 8th, 2011
12:23 am

“As tempting as a trade for Nash might be, he would add $11.5 mil to our $64 mil payroll next year.

Even with the increased fan attendance, jersey sales, national TV appearances etc, I can’t imagine the ASG would go for that trade (especially with the potential of lower salaries under a new CBA).”

If the DASG would pass up a no brainer trade like that because it will add $11.5 million in salary on to next year’s payroll, then I guess we can forget about them extending Jamal, since he will cost at least 75% of that amount to extend per season.

Gearon loves to talk about how the team has been willing to add salary and people should stop calling the DASG cheap. Well, if this trade is more than just a rumor instigated by Tyrone’s cousin BooBoo, it’s time for him to put up or shut up. This trade would elevate the Hawks’ ceiling by at least one playoff round.

Najeh Davenpoop

January 8th, 2011
12:28 am

“And thumbs up to Jason Collins for losing all that weight, and playing well. But thumbs down to Jason Collins for being overweight last year, and not dedicated to losing the weight last season.”

Collins could have showed up looking like Dwight Howard and you know Woody still wouldn’t have played him.

O'Brien

January 8th, 2011
12:35 am

Najeh,

Allegedly, the Hawks offered Shaq the vet min to come play here, despite the fact that if they offered him the MLE, they would have easily made that money back in marketing.

So I can easily see them not giving any thought to trading for Nash if he is available. I also think they will let Crawford walk this offseason.

Ramon,

If the Hawks wanted to trade for Nash, they have options. But in addition to having no confidence in the ASG’s marketing department, I also think Rick will leave the team as is…and let the chips fall where they may in the playoffs.

Ramon

January 8th, 2011
12:43 am

O’brien, I’m sure you’re right. And that is the problem. How could Sund or Gearon not look at the current roster and see that adding Nash makes the team at minimum 5-10 games better than they are now? Nash still plays at a high level against the top young PGs of the game. Nash seems to easily have 4 years left of playing in him.

Hawks Fan In New Orleans

January 8th, 2011
2:15 am

WOW. LD is willing to change the lineup!!! Marvin to the bench as a 6th – 7th man??? This is cause to celebrate. Marvin should thrive in this role and he still gets his 38 million!
Here is Marvin’s theme song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVb2xZn2gqY

Najeh Davenpoop

January 8th, 2011
2:24 am

Hawks Fan In New Orleans

January 8th, 2011
2:31 am

ROFLOL!!!! Duck Tales – that slipped my mind. Perfect.
Hey Najeh. Who knows on the bench he may turn into this guy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=375ENQbru8s

Deadly bench assassin and role player with a chip on his shoulder.

Mido

January 8th, 2011
3:05 am

Kevin Love is Beastin right now. If only we can make him wear a hawks uniform.

{MAC-Town Georgia 478}

January 8th, 2011
3:39 am

The only reason Marvin hasnt produced more is because you guys expect him to play a full game, refreshed, and he has to do so many push ups each Oregon game everytime they score and that offense is explosive. Easy on the Duck.

{MAC-Town Georgia 478}

January 8th, 2011
3:43 am

No problem with the Big lineup, the Hawks are a real PG and increased perimeter defense away from being very dangerous.

Just imagine defensive possessions without guards getting to the basket at will. Imagine a faster PG that doesnt mind driving, putting pressure on the defense and starting off breaks.

I wish Teague could be that guy but I have doubts now.

Atlgent

January 8th, 2011
4:37 am

ROFL @ {MAC-Town Georgia 478} …I am from Mac-town but stay in Atlanta and that reminds me of some crazy things the guys from the East side would say…TOO FUNNY!!!

Najeh Davenpoop

January 8th, 2011
5:17 am

I wonder if Darkwing Duck and Smoove still remember this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbpYEIf3ags

Hawks Fan In New Orleans

January 8th, 2011
6:00 am

DAYUM! Now that’s the Dark Wing Duck I wanna see. WTH happened to that ferocity? He smashed on J Smash.

Hawks Fan In New Orleans

January 8th, 2011
6:01 am

LOL @ {MAC-Town Georgia 478}

{MAC-Town Georgia 478}

January 8th, 2011
6:14 am

ROFL @ {MAC-Town Georgia 478} …I am from Mac-town but stay in Atlanta and that reminds me of some crazy things the guys from the East side would say…TOO FUNNY!!!

…….

thats funny….I’m from the Eastside of Macon….Northeast ‘02 lol

dap01

January 8th, 2011
8:18 am

Nash has a very manageable contract. He would make the team INSTANTLY better. Can you imagine our athletic wings running with a PG that can actually run? If we had Nash we would be only one position from elite status. If we had Nash, Dwight Howard would look on us much more favorable. Nash is a difference maker at PG. The Hawks have pieces to offer. Go get him.

STRETCH

January 8th, 2011
8:28 am

Hawks get Grainger, Solomon Jones and Hawks get Marvin, Mo and ETan

STRETCH

January 8th, 2011
8:29 am

Or should i say, Pacers get Marvin, Mo and Etan!

ILL-Logical

January 8th, 2011
9:46 am

chris

January 8th, 2011
10:02 am

This change makes it worth my time to follow the Hawks again. We already knew what the old configuration could accomplish – 2nd round playoff exit. Another year of experience (or decline in Bibby’s cae) wasn’t going to make a difference. I don’t know if Josh at the 3 will work out, but there is at least some chance that this new lineup can push the Hawks over the top.

O'Brien

January 8th, 2011
10:09 am

With Nash playing point, the pick and roll with horford and Josh would be improved, more lobs for them, and more open jumpers for JJ and horford.

The one concern is Nash was never known for defense and he is 37. Come to think of it, we don’t get much from bibby anyway so Nash can’t be any worse defensively.